IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2024-07-31
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02:26:00 <silent_tempest> andriydohniak: You should be able to find it by looking at the commits in PR. src/graph_gui.c:74
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04:40:47 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
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07:06:12 <kuhnovic> This ain't Age of Empires 😉
07:24:01 <andythenorth> I thought of making campaigns before
07:24:09 <andythenorth> but it's dauntingly hard
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10:13:27 <pickpacket> andythenorth: what would a campaign entail?
11:01:22 <FLHerne> Gamescripts can provide 'campaign'-like gameplay
11:02:16 <FLHerne> I presume mostly "you must connect X to Y or do this or that" like a more rigid version of contracts
11:04:39 <FLHerne> player discoverability of GSes seems to be awful anecdotally
11:04:56 <FLHerne> hm, the survey says a whole 8.5% of hours played are with GS, that's higher than I thought
11:05:45 <FLHerne> tangential idea: monthly 'game setup of the month'
11:05:50 <peter1138> Things like Renewed Village Growth seem quite popular.
11:06:35 <FLHerne> include (optionally any of) GS, grfs, AIs, mapgen settings, custom per-game settings
11:07:02 <FLHerne> have a vote like the release titlescreens
11:08:09 <FLHerne> it would be a way to expose players to a variety of addon content without throwing them instantly into the huge pile of random content that a newbie has no way to decide between
11:08:43 <FLHerne> button for it in the new game dialog or something
11:10:30 <FLHerne> it could come with a "how to play" writeup on the website
11:11:02 <FLHerne> for things with non-obvious mechanics/strategy
11:13:01 <Ox7C5_> I'd enjoy a "setup of the {period}" kinda thing. I've played 100s of hours vanilla since the day of the original TTD
11:13:32 <Ox7C5_> Starting with GS and GRFs was a little daunting, but with a "collection" of sorts, it might open the horizon a little
11:14:27 <Ox7C5_> Instead of trying random modded servers and be hit with 1.4GB of downloads, only to discover there are no known elements left, as they've been modded away
11:15:37 <FLHerne> I suppose that idea is almost a scenario but minus the map
11:15:45 <FLHerne> but I think the effect would be different
11:19:08 <andythenorth> pickpacket: gamescript
11:19:21 <andythenorth> the template would be Railroad Tycoon 1, 2 or 3
11:19:33 <andythenorth> there are various scenarios / campaigns
11:25:24 <pickpacket> andythenorth: yeah, but what would the GS *do*. I don't know anything about the Railroad Tycoon games
11:30:30 <andythenorth> like 'connect 3 cities' or 'build coast to coast'
11:30:37 <andythenorth> or 'transport 90000 tons of coal'
11:30:44 <andythenorth> or 'have average speed above 90mph'
11:30:52 <andythenorth> or 'company value at least $400m'
12:26:07 <wensimehrp> I'm not very sure if https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/12880 is the right approach. Var0x6B is a (reletively) new variable, and I think not many NewGRFs have used it yet. Maybe it is better to remove the NewGRF id check in var6B instead of adding a new variable 6C?
12:27:35 <andythenorth> arbitrary extensible vehicle props?
12:28:10 <andythenorth> with some kind of predicate for walking the consist and counting values, or doing boolean logic on runs of vehicles
13:16:03 <peter1139> wensimehrp, imho removing the GRF ID check makes the variable useless for its normal use.
13:16:50 <peter1139> And I don't think your var 6C is very workable either, as it will be affected by other GRFs not just the two you care about.
13:17:46 <wensimehrp> There are ways to read nearby tiles' grfid
13:18:54 <wensimehrp> True that station tiles would read the wrong ID but there are checks authors can use to prevent that
13:19:38 <wensimehrp> Like nearby_tile_grfid or nearby_tile_same_grf
13:19:51 <wensimehrp> assuming using NML
13:28:12 <gwyd4016> I think changing the way var 6B would be a bad idea, since it may impact the way existing NewGRFs work
13:28:41 <gwyd4016> Combining 6A and a new 6C could work well; check for IDs in known "friendly" sets beyond the current NewGRF
13:29:17 <gwyd4016> There's a lot of station NewGRFs that are over multiple parts due to the 256 tile limit per GRF, so allowing operation between files is probably not a bad idea
13:30:41 <wensimehrp> Even if the check in var6B is removed, it can be easily achieved by checking using other variables, var68 for instance
13:31:27 <gwyd4016> peter1139: I do like this a lot, using tile types that are fixed from the moment of construction saves a lot of ongoing and repeated calculations
13:32:54 <wensimehrp> gwyd4016: Yeah, checking for in a friendly grf list is exactly the way 6c should be used.
13:32:55 <gwyd4016> I feel like its purely theoretical, but going through a long and protracted VarAct2 chain on every draw cycle feels redundant and wasteful, whereas just checking var40 once for each tile feels much nicer
13:33:46 <wensimehrp> gwyd4016: 🤣 65536 now
14:50:25 <johnfranklin> > Issue: one palette in MagicaVoxel has at most 255 color indexes. That means for a 32bpp set, we might need multiple palettes. Then it is a problem how to assign the voxel models to the correct palette using something "intelligent, optimised and automatic" when rendering in Makefile process. What I thought of is such a draft. But I don't know if there is better solution to face more complex
14:50:25 <johnfranklin> situation, for example, if there are many "special palettes". Because the Makefile is generally not changed by adding something "mechanical".
14:50:25 <johnfranklin> SPECIAL_PALETTE_VOX ?= # to be determined in another included file
14:50:25 <johnfranklin> SPECIAL_PALETTE ?= # to be determined in another included file
14:50:26 <johnfranklin> for all i in gfx/*; for all j in $(SPECIAL_PALETTE_VOX); ifeq(i, j); then $(PALETTE) = $(SPECIAL_PALETTE); fi; done; done
14:53:07 <andythenorth> lunch was these, count 1 (packet)
14:53:33 <johnfranklin> I cannot stand only that for lunch
15:05:12 <locosage> johnfranklin: dunno how gorender does it but vox file contains its own palette that can be read and used
15:20:21 <_glx_> 32bpp should not need palette at all
15:21:30 <johnfranklin> It is the palette for gorender and magicavoxel, not for grf coding
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17:50:09 <andythenorth> peter1139: do you feel jailed by github?
17:50:16 <andythenorth> "asking for a friend"
17:59:21 <dwfreed> the reality is that everybody's on github, and in gaming, everyone's on discord
17:59:44 <dwfreed> you can make much better communities if you meet people where they're at
17:59:47 <gwyd4016> Wait til they find out our MP servers are hosted via AWS
18:13:30 <andythenorth> such gilded jails
18:22:51 <gwyd4016> It's just a case of purity vs pragmatism
19:16:04 <_glx_> MP servers are not hosted on AWS, only the coordinator
19:33:31 <FLHerne> but the actual page renders as completely blank for me
19:45:12 <andythenorth> feel like we saw this once before
20:02:40 <andythenorth> powerline ethernet eh
20:03:08 <andythenorth> not real ethernet
20:10:34 <audigex> andythenorth: I love powerline ethernet
20:10:34 <audigex> Got wired Cat6 in my new house but my old house I used powerline for like 10 years no problems
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20:37:51 <andythenorth> powerline seems fine, significantly lower transmission rate (Mbps) than my 802.11ac, but more stable
20:38:17 <andythenorth> and gets the xbox, wii, apple TV, sky box off the 802 network
20:39:00 <andythenorth> I have cat 5e in my house, but one of the links has never worked
20:39:23 <andythenorth> break in the wire somewhere
20:56:59 <goddess_ishtar> dwfreed: I'd quite like to move to Revolt, but at the end of the day I'm on Discord because all my friends are on Discord and I want to talk to people more than I want to use FOSS products for the sake of it
20:57:54 <goddess_ishtar> okay well in fairness, Discord is getting really annoying with the Nitro pushing, but I can't use Revolt if there's nobody to talk to on it
21:08:03 <audigex> andythenorth: Yeah I find it's very much either "works great and is very reliable" or "is basically useless" depending on your home wiring
21:08:03 <audigex> Admittedly at this point the "1000Mbps" grade powerline can't actually keep up with my fibre-to-the-premises internet, whereas previously it could - but most connections in the home don't need Gigabit anyway yet and I normally reckon on about 1/4 the advertised speed so 250-500Mbps is still plenty for most use cases for now
21:08:03 <audigex> Thinking about it I actually do have powerline in this house still, right in this room with me... rather than run a cable from my primary desk (Cat6 back to the router), I have a powerline link from this desk to my work desk behind me (where my work laptop, Mac Mini, and several other "tinkering" machines sit), so even in a brand new house with ethernet runs there's still a use for it
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22:06:36 <peter1138> You just need a point-to-point microwave link for thst
22:21:23 <_jgr_> I've got an optical fiber run along the skirting board and up the stairs. Not very elegant, but the results are good.
22:23:37 <_jgr_> Trying to thread stuff through walls, even alongside existing cables/paths, was just a nightmare. I soon gave up on that
22:25:35 <peter1138> 100gbit CRS520 next...
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22:38:13 <sono3304> _jgr_: i have optic fiber all the way to a box on my wall then copper wire to the BT router. tut.
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23:10:27 <reldred> peter1138: God I want a pair of them. Would make good little budget mlag spine switches
23:12:01 <reldred> audigex: Chances are it’s your router that can’t handle the gigabit throughput. I see it all the time in my day job, gigabit WAN, gigabit LAN, router/firewall that can do 450mbps at best depending on firewall rule complexity.
23:17:00 <dwfreed> or even just a lack of proper NAT offloading
23:21:43 <reldred> depends on the firewall device, you don't always get the option to do that
23:24:36 <peter1138> The curse of advanced features that require software fallback.
23:29:21 <audigex> reldred: My router can easily handle 10Gbit (SFP+) from the internet and more than that on LAN - my home network equipment is Ubiquiti kit WAY beyond what I actually need 😂
23:29:21 <audigex> I’m just talking about the fact that “1000Mbps” powerline is really more like 100-300 Mbps real world
23:38:35 <reldred> Lmao, Ubiquiti has pathetic throughput capacity compared to competing products. What model Ubiquiti gateway do you have?
23:38:55 <reldred> Some of the new new stuff like the Dream Machine will do a gigabit
23:39:59 <reldred> Ubiquiti at this point may as well be the Apple of networking vendors. Okay not quite, they’d have to be Meraki priced to really fit the bill but anyway.
23:42:07 <audigex> Dream Machine Pro Max. It claims 3.5Gbps although my connection maxes at 1 and I’ve never really tested it hard on LAN stuff
23:43:42 <audigex> It’s way overkill but I got a discount through work and wanted the dual NVR because it’s cheaper than any other of their routers plus an NVR with redundant storage
23:55:18 <reldred> Yeah that should do it, the specs on the dream machine as well are for the IDS/IPS/packet inspection throughput as well, with those turned off and straight firewall+nat it's even quicker.
23:55:46 <reldred> Some of the older Ubi gateways can't actually do 1gbps throughput and it catches out so many engineers.
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