IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2021-03-28
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03:02:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] pro452 opened pull request #8901: Fix #8565: Stopped road vehicle displays a speed different than 0 https://git.io/JYZcF
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06:07:40 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] perezdidac updated pull request #43: Add: pass upload date to OpenTTD client https://git.io/JYOJd
06:29:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] perezdidac updated pull request #43: Add: pass upload date to OpenTTD client https://git.io/JYOJd
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06:34:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] perezdidac opened pull request #8902: Feature: show upload date in the network content window https://git.io/JYZyX
06:41:00 <didac> since strncpy is disallowed, how can I substring a char string?
06:42:04 * andythenorth hates clock changes
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08:40:34 <andythenorth> I tried colouring cargos
08:40:43 <andythenorth> I'd have to sort out contrast on white
08:42:18 <Wolf01> I'm not totally convinced about the cargo box names
08:43:36 <Wolf01> No, they really break the flow... maybe is the shape, probably the old ellipse shape was less misleading
08:44:12 <Wolf01> Try the ellipse with coloured background?
08:45:30 <andythenorth> I'll try coloured
08:45:34 <andythenorth> I think it will be mad
08:46:32 <Wolf01> And what if you remove the arrow pointing towards the ellipses?
08:47:47 <Wolf01> It could be misleading on alcohol and goods, but it would look like a name on the arrow then
08:51:57 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #8901: Fix #8565: Stopped road vehicle displays a speed different than 0 https://git.io/JYZ7U
08:52:20 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro merged pull request #8893: Fix #8886: Don't try to resolve folders within tars named '.' https://git.io/JYtXE
08:52:23 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro closed issue #8886: Changelog button crashes the game if NewGRF contains relative folder https://git.io/Jmjo9
09:01:37 <andythenorth> as usual with graphviz I can very nearly make it nice
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09:14:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 opened issue #8903: Unable to sort BaNaNaS content in-game by upload date yet https://git.io/JYZ7b
09:14:23 <michi_cc> Hmm, somebody in China (or Taiwan) seems to be running an OpenTTD tournament. Server list has e.g. "7组 资格赛 2021 9' LMC" (Group 7 Qualifiers 2021 9'LMC ) with quite some players.
09:17:07 <andythenorth> ^ Wolf01 force-refresh to clear cached styles
09:17:14 <andythenorth> not convinced it's good, but eh
09:18:47 <michi_cc> Needs some white text on the dark ellipses.
09:19:24 <andythenorth> yeah, I either need a manual colour table
09:19:34 <andythenorth> or I need a contrast / darkness measuring algorithm
09:25:53 <andythenorth> bit stark, but very contrast
09:27:32 <andythenorth> it's red-green colour blind fail anyway
09:27:53 <andythenorth> not sure primary vs secondary is most interesting information on the cargoflow
09:40:02 <Wolf01> Yeah, it looks better with the arrows and cargo names now, minimalist is too much minimalist :P
09:44:21 <andythenorth> might work if colours were tuned?
09:47:14 <Wolf01> It would be cool with industries thumbnails indeed, but yes, too much work with graphviz
09:47:34 <andythenorth> it would be really hard to ever fit into the browser viewport
09:47:38 <andythenorth> for e.g. steeltown
10:03:58 <LordAro> no james, that's not how issues work
10:04:28 <Wolf01> andythenorth supercool
10:04:36 <andythenorth> not for the bigger economies though
10:04:46 <andythenorth> for the small ones, pretty neat
10:05:44 <Wolf01> Did you consider to split the single chains for better view?
10:06:29 <andythenorth> not sure how it could be done
10:06:35 <andythenorth> it's probably possible, but eh
10:12:18 <TrueBrain> wtf is #8903 for ticket?!
10:13:03 <TrueBrain> future-feature-requests :D
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10:27:38 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain commented on pull request #43: Add: pass upload date to OpenTTD client https://git.io/JYZFB
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10:48:09 <LordAro> TrueBrain: kill it, imo
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11:19:43 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #8903: Unable to sort BaNaNaS content in-game by upload date yet https://git.io/JYZ7b
11:19:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #8903: Unable to sort BaNaNaS content in-game by upload date yet https://git.io/JYZ7b
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11:36:14 <frosch123> maybe add some colored frame around the pictures
11:36:43 <frosch123> so the arrows do not just connect to some greyish box
11:37:10 <frosch123> also allows showing primary/black-hole again
11:38:21 <frosch123> i think i already wanted to add pictures in the original version, but did not get it to work :)
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11:50:50 <frosch123> oh, you added colors to the arrows
11:51:28 <frosch123> well, except the black text on black background :p
11:53:47 <frosch123> i prefer boxes for the industries, the text-only in the minimalist version is harder to read
12:08:43 <andythenorth> I need to tune a set of colours for the arrows
12:09:43 <andythenorth> hmm, industry images....make it harder to see flow when designing it
12:09:50 <andythenorth> maybe I provide a toggle
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12:10:29 <andythenorth> it's probably unhealthy anyway, allowing graphviz dot rules to influence cargo in/out so much
12:11:00 <andythenorth> there are a few cases in Steeltown where cargos should loop back to bulk terminal, but I won't do it because the bulk terminal is low rank node
12:11:13 <andythenorth> and linking back from high rank nodes makes a mess
12:11:57 <andythenorth> hmm sizing industries might be a bit interesting
12:12:11 <andythenorth> images currently scale to box size I think
12:12:45 <andythenorth> nope, all same image size, seems fine
12:18:09 <andythenorth> wish I could control the headport / tailport better
12:18:15 <andythenorth> I can set 8 compass directions
12:18:31 <andythenorth> but I can't say 'any where on eastern side'
12:25:27 <andythenorth> hmm removing headclip is interesting
12:42:38 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on issue #8900: GCC11 complains a lot about -Wmismatched-new-delete https://git.io/JYGSx
12:56:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro opened pull request #8904: Fix #8803: Automatically removing signals on rail construction would … https://git.io/JYnTt
13:12:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8902: Feature: show upload date in the network content window https://git.io/JYnk7
13:18:52 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8468: Fix #8316: Make sort industries by production and transported with a cargo filter possible https://git.io/JYnIn
13:22:12 <frosch123> firs: 4571 switches, 2 random_switches :)
13:26:14 <Eddi|zuHause> on CETS, that figure is something like 13k vs 36
13:28:06 <Eddi|zuHause> although that comparison isn't quite fair, as a lot of the vehicles that could use random_switch aren't really implemented
13:37:29 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8468: Fix #8316: Make sort industries by production and transported with a cargo filter possible https://git.io/JYnt3
13:55:29 <andythenorth> why do I need random_switch in FIRS?
13:55:33 <andythenorth> I can probably remove it
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14:03:12 <Wuzzy> What is REPO_ORIGIN for in OpenMSX/OpenSFX/OpenGFX?
14:07:13 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rpwjanzen updated pull request #8894: Replace IConsolePrint*(F)( calls with specific console level calls https://git.io/JYqiY
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14:31:35 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rpwjanzen updated pull request #8894: Replace IConsolePrint*(F)( calls with specific console level calls https://git.io/JYqiY
14:36:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rpwjanzen updated pull request #8894: Replace IConsolePrint*(F)( calls with specific console level calls https://git.io/JYqiY
14:39:43 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Wuzzy2 opened issue #8905: Text characters in minimap key sometimes touch each other https://git.io/JYnc0
14:40:43 <Wuzzy> huh. SimpleAI v14 suddenly starts crashing in 2d7b34bc68f7fb0e707129e4d97383b18f1da55e
14:41:03 <Wuzzy> Was an incompability added to the AI API recently?
14:41:44 <Wuzzy> SimpleAI v14 *never* crashed on me before, until I upgraded to the aforementioned OpenTTD commit...
14:43:39 <Wuzzy> I am not sure if this is SimpleAI's fault or not... Any idea?
14:48:23 <glx> missing compatibility script, should be included in openttd
14:51:22 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rpwjanzen commented on pull request #8894: Replace IConsolePrint*(F)( calls with specific console level calls https://git.io/JYnlg
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14:59:16 <Wuzzy> hmm, compability script? Do i have to manually install it or something? I compiled openttd by hand
14:59:45 <glx> compatibility scripts are in source_root/bin
15:00:13 <glx> but I don't see any changes in them, so I'll try the AI to get more info
15:00:53 <Wuzzy> thanks for looking into it
15:02:50 <glx> really looks like missing (or fail to load) compat script
15:03:27 <glx> what's your OS and how are you starting openttd ?
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15:07:11 <Wuzzy> GNU/Linux, and I use a hand-compiled version. I did mkdir build; cd build; cmake ..; make; ./openttd
15:08:27 <glx> ok that's the issue, try cd bin; ../build/openttd
15:09:18 <Wuzzy> i just did what the COMPILING file told me. 🙁
15:09:46 <Wuzzy> oh wait, thats about launching...
15:10:45 <Wuzzy> ok, trying that one out now, and maybe i get a crash this time =)
15:11:36 <Wuzzy> frosch123: is there a way i can check in openttd whether the compat script is active? is there a console command or something?
15:11:36 <glx> I guess I should fix #8618, should not be too hard ;)
15:12:08 <glx> compatibility script is loaded on AI start if needed, and a message is shown in AI window
15:13:14 <Wuzzy> 1.2 API compability in effect!
15:14:16 <Wuzzy> so is #8618 still legit?
15:14:47 <glx> yes fixing #8618 will ease everyone's life :)
15:16:13 <glx> the only not affected are MSVC with Ninja
15:17:20 <Wuzzy> yeah i agree it makes sense that a hand-compiled version of OpenTTD loads the compat script without needing to start it in an "awkward" way. 🙂
15:20:40 <andythenorth> frosch123 Wolf01 ^
15:29:14 <frosch123> that looks almost professional :)
15:29:44 <frosch123> the location of the arrows is still weird to me
15:31:39 <Wolf01> andythenorth really cool now
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15:35:42 <andythenorth> frosch123 too much space after the head arrow?
15:35:53 <andythenorth> or you mean where they try to align to (which port)
15:36:14 <Eddi|zuHause> worst one is the "livestock" blob, where the arrow blends into the blob itself
15:37:35 <andythenorth> I'll remove the spaces before the head arrow
15:40:42 <frosch123> andythenorth: they are now always on the industry side
15:40:55 <frosch123> especially when zooming out, i do not know in what direction they go
15:41:13 <frosch123> if the arrow is always at the end, i know the that thick end is the direction :p
15:43:17 <Eddi|zuHause> now it's also easier to see which ones are backwards
15:44:03 <andythenorth> I have bigger arrows locally
15:44:27 <Eddi|zuHause> size isn't really that important
15:45:47 <andythenorth> I wish I could consolidate selected edges
15:46:03 <andythenorth> "Tropic Basic" Food is quite bad (the orange arrows)
15:46:30 <Eddi|zuHause> there's an issue with white text on bright background, especially with tiny fonts
15:46:36 <andythenorth> I need new colours
15:46:45 <andythenorth> these are the cargo colours used in game per cargo
15:47:09 <andythenorth> not sure how many colours are needed
15:47:33 <andythenorth> it's not a requirement to keep them same as used in-game? yes/no?
15:48:26 <Eddi|zuHause> there's 2 ways to adjust: 1) tune them to be darker, or 2) make a threshhold where you switch from white text to dark text
15:50:46 <andythenorth> there's probably an algorithm that can measure the relative contrast given an rgb value
15:53:01 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure it's a) not complicated, and b) someone has done it before
15:55:51 <_dp_> yeah, openttd already has some text color autodetection
15:57:06 <Wolf01> andythenorth what about polylines and thicker lines?
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16:01:22 <Wolf01> I don't remember a lot of graphviz, I used it like 8 years ago for UML diagrams, and I always used bezier curves too, but I've seen 2-segment polylines too, or I might confuse it with wordart :P
16:05:13 <Eddi|zuHause> problem with making the text darker is that it removes the distinction *-supplies now have
16:05:13 <Wolf01> Ok splines=ortho but on the example the result is hideous :P
16:09:28 <Eddi|zuHause> the tropic food lines are the prime example why graphviz is bad, at some point you have to do tiny tweaks which are obvious but too difficult to implement
16:18:10 <frosch123> lol, the arrow heads are not even on the lines
16:18:36 <Wolf01> Looks better with the new boxes layout
16:19:20 <andythenorth> ortho struggle bus
16:20:53 <andythenorth> ortho is good for small graphs
16:20:55 <Wolf01> Hmmm, better than bezier but not convinced
16:20:58 <andythenorth> but steeltown it's awful
16:21:06 <frosch123> the beziers are weird, the polyline are weird differently :)
16:21:29 <frosch123> ortho is broken for me, is it just me?
16:24:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #8906: Change: [CMake] Copy AI/GS compatibility files to build dir https://git.io/JYnSB
16:24:53 <andythenorth> frosch123 ortho sort of works for me
16:25:04 <andythenorth> arrows are correct, but sometimes the overlaps are bad
16:25:42 <andythenorth> I think it's 51:49 polyline:bezier for me
16:33:21 <frosch123> andythenorth: https://tools-unite.com/tools/random-picker-wheel?names=polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,bezier,polyline,polyline <- is that useful for firs design?
16:34:07 <andythenorth> we should use that in the livestream
16:38:57 <andythenorth> think this is as good as it's going to get for layout
16:39:01 * andythenorth needs to fix colours
16:39:42 <andythenorth> I suspect I could do more manual tuning of dot/graphviz using groups and weightings
16:39:48 <andythenorth> but I can't bothered
17:01:22 <andythenorth> still not sure which is better
17:04:38 <andythenorth> I think Steeltown is qualitatively worse
17:04:44 <andythenorth> in the new version
17:12:17 <frosch123> the new version has more space vertically
17:12:27 <frosch123> it's better suited to print in A0 and to put on a wall :p
17:13:07 <frosch123> maybe you can sell high quality prints :p
17:21:50 <andythenorth> less visual weight on industries
17:26:11 <andythenorth> now I need to subgraph town industries and have them drawn in a box
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17:44:06 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] perezdidac commented on issue #8903: Unable to sort BaNaNaS content in-game by upload date yet https://git.io/JYZ7b
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17:46:38 <glx> Wuzzy: character issues are with opengfx I guess
17:47:04 <Wuzzy> hmmm, kinda. this is also about spacing between lines
17:47:20 <glx> opengfx chars are too tall
17:47:44 <Wuzzy> this is about the small font, its already very small. why not give it a little bit more space to breathe?
17:48:05 <Wuzzy> i dont think you could make the opengfx small font even smaller. its tiny
17:48:49 <frosch123> it's probably easier to trash all sprite fonts, and always use real fonts
17:49:49 <Wuzzy> i like the pixel font tho
17:50:00 <glx> all spacing are based on original sprites
17:50:28 * andythenorth would like to vote for never touching the original spritefont ever
17:50:31 <glx> (or dynamic when using real font)
17:53:19 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
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18:00:16 * LordAro likes the spritefont too
18:00:35 <LordAro> though turning it into an actual font and bundling it might be the better way to go
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18:04:21 <andythenorth> 'some copyright issues'
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18:07:10 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] perezdidac commented on pull request #8902: Feature: show upload date in the network content window https://git.io/JYcTD
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18:20:23 <andythenorth> I'm going to do that differently I think
18:20:31 <andythenorth> I make town a node I think, not a subgraph
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19:03:20 <andythenorth> trying to tweak graphviz dot manually is oof
19:04:37 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #8906: Change: [CMake] Copy AI/GS compatibility files to build dir https://git.io/JYcG8
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19:07:02 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] LordAro commented on pull request #43: Add: pass upload date to OpenTTD client https://git.io/JYcGF
19:12:57 <TrueBrain> LordAro: smart idea. We already have gamedate which we can send over the wire
19:13:16 <TrueBrain> And does all the leapyear shit
19:13:32 <TrueBrain> Can't login to GitHub to write that :p
19:18:07 <_dp_> yeah, I asked the same thing on discord
19:18:25 <_dp_> savegame format is different from a general purpose one though as it involves file sorting
19:23:31 <glx> LordAro: I don't understand your question about installer targets
19:26:14 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/bananas-server] TrueBrain commented on pull request #43: Add: pass upload date to OpenTTD client https://git.io/JYccX
19:26:30 <TrueBrain> Ha, found a way to login on mobile
19:26:51 <TrueBrain> FF doesn't support security keys on mobile, so it took a bit of effort :D
19:27:14 <TrueBrain> Haven't installed it no .. might be a good alternative :D
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19:37:28 * andythenorth considers trying neato not dot for FIRS
19:37:34 <andythenorth> not sure how to change the layout model though
19:55:20 <andythenorth> fundamentally the graph is just too wide
19:55:32 <andythenorth> so the font size is reduced
20:05:36 * andythenorth discovers samerank for dot
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20:20:39 <andythenorth> ha ha so graphviz dot is somewhat controllable :D
20:20:47 * andythenorth found the magic handles
20:21:30 <Wolf01> Why do food and alcohol have double arrows for towns?
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20:26:10 <frosch123> the tooltip tells you
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21:13:02 <andythenorth> becauseI haven't consolidated them yet :P
21:13:08 <andythenorth> I need to resolve duplicates
21:13:28 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler commented on pull request #8904: Fix #8803: Automatically removing signals on rail construction would … https://git.io/JYcVK
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22:21:18 <andythenorth> I can force it to group more items on same rank, so the graph is narrower
22:21:26 <andythenorth> which increases font size etc
22:28:20 <andythenorth> if I try and tidy up too much with groupings, graphviz can't do its job properly
22:28:28 <andythenorth> so it's not as neat as I'd like
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23:33:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rpwjanzen commented on issue #7957: Add a flag to read banned users from a defined file instead of from openttd.cfg https://git.io/JvqkN
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23:54:28 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LC-Zorg commented on issue #8905: Text characters in minimap key sometimes touch each other https://git.io/JYnc0
continue to next day ⏵
