IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2020-08-25
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01:56:13 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai
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15:23:56 <andythenorth> there's no 'best' imho, all have their charm
15:27:34 <Timberwolf> I should fix whatever the hell happened to the wheels though :p
15:37:19 <FLHerne> Timberwolf: I was going to ask, that looks reall weird
15:38:04 <FLHerne> I think UKRS2/3 have the shape most nearly right
15:39:02 <FLHerne> It's very clearly a Jubilee, whereas the others look a bit off to me
15:39:30 <Timberwolf> I think it's because the early steamer sprites have secondary company colour for the wheels which doesn't really work. I changed it on later sprites but never went back and fixed it. (Also 2cc -> non2cc transitions tend to generate stray pixels)
15:39:32 <FLHerne> But on the UKRS2 one the details don't stick out enough, and UKRS3 is cheating through high resolution :p
15:41:06 <FLHerne> Timberwolf: Possibly the wheels don't help, but on yours the loco looks extremely undersized compared to the tender?
15:41:17 <FLHerne> And it doesn't really capture the taper boiler
15:42:35 <FLHerne> Which makes it look more like a Patriot or unrebuilt Royal Scot, sans smoke deflectors
15:43:52 <FLHerne> The details are the nicest of the lot though
15:44:46 <FLHerne> UKRS3 has this really bright/high-contrast lighting, which I don't like
15:44:48 <Timberwolf> Yes, it could do with a revisit. I've definitely improved between starting the set and now :)(
15:45:53 <Timberwolf> Biggest difference is Road Vehicles horses vs. Trains horses.
15:46:12 <Timberwolf> RV horses look like cigars and move like someone cheating at QWOP.
15:47:28 <FLHerne> I can hardly complain, my few attempts at pixels have all been pretty hopeless
15:49:41 <Timberwolf> I find this sort of feedback useful. e.g. I've never liked those tenders, but couldn't figure out exactly why until someone else mentions the obvious thing that it's too big. :)
15:54:19 <Timberwolf> Everything I do in the pixel realm is utterly hopeless. I tried to fix something simple on Tracks by correcting the rendered output rather than the input or the process, I changed about 8 pixels total and managed to make an enormous mess which wouldn't tile in the slightest.
15:55:50 <FLHerne> In general, the loco just doesn't reflect the 'bigness' of a Jub. The boiler is pretty close to the loading gauge -- e.g. the firebox front should be the same height as the cab roof, and the dome higher still
15:56:35 <FLHerne> Also, that rearward slope on the firebox of Stanier boilers is very distinctive
15:57:46 <Timberwolf> All more for the roster :)
15:58:22 <FLHerne> The smaller, parallel boiler and square firebox look a lot more like the pixels you have
15:58:29 <Timberwolf> What was Pikka's concept that any set only needed 10 different locos for maximum playability again? ;)
15:59:28 <andythenorth> didn't work imho
15:59:59 <FLHerne> It would make sense for planes, and maybe even road vehicles or ships
16:00:12 <FLHerne> But too many people use OpenTTD as a train simulator :p
16:00:36 <Timberwolf> Yes, I'm definitely a "model railway" player.
16:00:41 <andythenorth> the funny thing is that it's not always about drawing what is there
16:00:56 <andythenorth> I actually got taught that 25 years ago about model trains
16:01:11 <andythenorth> an obsession with exact scale and fidelity doesn't always create the best impression
16:01:27 <Timberwolf> Certainly not at OpenTTD scales!
16:02:10 <Timberwolf> I think that's one of the things it took me a while to figure out, it's better to caricature a few distinctive things than try to capture all the detail evenly.
16:03:42 <andythenorth> took me years tbh
16:04:18 <andythenorth> it really helps having built a lot of lego
16:08:00 <Timberwolf> It seems like there was a golden era for pixel art, between the introduction of Deluxe Paint and the availability of affordable scanners.
16:08:55 <andythenorth> I missed out on lots of those
16:09:00 <Timberwolf> Although some of the EGA Sierra stuff is quite impressive considering it was their own vector graphics tool.
16:09:24 <Timberwolf> (There are a couple of YouTube videos of SCI rendering slowed down so you can see each individual line and flood fill)
16:09:46 <andythenorth> not pixels, but the Doom white paper is brilliant
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16:36:46 <supermop_Home> did anyone else watch the making of video that came on the myst cd-rom about as often as they played myst?
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17:09:43 <Gustavo6046> a plane crashed... in the main menu
17:09:47 <Gustavo6046> and when I checked, there it is
17:10:44 <LordAro> on the 1.10 titlegame? i think that's known :)
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17:44:36 <Gustavo6046> yeah, I think it is!
17:44:40 <Gustavo6046> it's funny LordAro, I like it :D
17:44:47 <Gustavo6046> like an easter egg
17:45:29 <nielsm> weird things happening in the title game should actually be a feature
17:45:43 <nielsm> like a funky coloured train passing through every 30 minutes
17:46:26 <nielsm> a gigantic fleet of ships appearing
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18:34:53 <FLHerne> Gustavo6046: There was at least one titlegame with a level crossing that routinely smashed road vehicles
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18:42:12 <Gustavo6046> I didn't even know road vehicles could crash into each other
18:42:18 <Gustavo6046> (or well I mean they never did to me for some reason)
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19:11:19 <Gustavo6046> Maybe they do in a version
19:11:25 <Gustavo6046> or maybe a setting... idk ! aa lol
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19:23:56 <FLHerne> Gustavo6046: They don't, but trains squash them
19:25:09 <TrueBrain> why are you on the forums?
19:25:29 <TrueBrain> we talked about this ....
19:26:43 <TrueBrain> I think the last comment is a valid suggestion for the 1st of April btw .. just rename "day" into "hour", so new engine is introduced in hour 2030, etc :)
19:26:46 <TrueBrain> NOTHING changes, but .. :P
19:27:50 <FLHerne> andythenorth: We should do 0.5.3 now [finally] :p
19:27:58 <andythenorth> TrueBrain is there internet beyond forums?
19:28:11 <andythenorth> ebay, Youtube, tt-forums
19:28:17 <andythenorth> those are my internet
19:28:52 <andythenorth> magic release then
19:29:39 <andythenorth> one day those readme credits might be accurate :)
19:29:59 * andythenorth has done enough yak-shaving though, I only came to paint mining trucks :P
19:30:09 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Unless we want to wait for parameters?
19:30:32 <andythenorth> I have no idea about the install cycle / hassle for the users
19:30:34 <FLHerne> Is there anything actually wrong with them atm?
19:30:44 <andythenorth> releasing is cheap, I'd favour release often
19:30:48 <andythenorth> users will find the bugs
19:31:01 <andythenorth> but if upgrading is a drama for them, maybe less often
19:31:56 <FLHerne> glx: ^ why aren't parameters merged yet? :p
19:32:29 <TrueBrain> talking about reviews ... so many open PRs :P
19:33:01 <andythenorth> truebrain is that a statement of pure fact, or judgement, or opportunity? o_O
19:33:20 <TrueBrain> I still have to fix a few, more an observation :)
19:34:55 <TrueBrain> glx: you read the news Docker is going to charge for image pulls?
19:35:15 <glx> I saw your discussion yesterday
19:35:52 <TrueBrain> it is on pull of the metadata, it seems .. which is even worse
19:35:58 <TrueBrain> so how far are you with the GitHub Actions migration? :D
19:36:12 <FLHerne> glx: It looks like most (all) of the feedback from last review is resolved, yes?
19:36:38 <glx> not really touched the github actions stuff for a long time
19:37:51 <TrueBrain> someone needs to fix this, or order an account on Docker Hub before the 1st of November
19:38:00 <TrueBrain> it is REALLY unlikely I will be that person, to be clear ;)
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19:47:32 <TrueBrain> biggest thing to do seems the linux docker images for the CF :)
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20:14:06 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] FLHerne requested changes for pull request #155: Add: Support for parameters in switches https://git.io/JUUy8
20:20:08 <andythenorth> windy wind is windy
20:23:08 <TrueBrain> keep it there, would you?
20:23:13 <TrueBrain> expected to make an appearance here tomorrow :P
20:26:07 <TrueBrain> GitHub knows the Squirrel language, lol
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21:01:58 <andythenorth> FLHerne make a release I reckon
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21:46:37 <FLHerne> andythenorth: You've been using parameters in Horse for a while, haven't you?
21:47:07 <FLHerne> If it hasn't blown up yet, I feel like it's worth getting that reviewed/merged
21:56:00 <andythenorth> FLHerne been using it for ages
22:22:58 <Timberwolf> Something along those lines, hopefully.
22:24:42 <Timberwolf> I've not done anything in NFO before, it's taking a bit of time to get my head round it.
22:28:51 <FLHerne> Timberwolf: Argh, that was quick
22:29:12 <FLHerne> I was about to say, did Andy screenshot the wrong loco, this Jubilee looks much better
22:29:21 <FLHerne> But no, you went and redrew it
22:29:33 <FLHerne> I think this is my new favourite trainset :D
22:29:43 <Timberwolf> I can't handle that kind of pressure.
22:30:10 <Timberwolf> I think I should just delete everything except the horses and the Cycloped.
22:31:59 <FLHerne> Suggestion: maybe remove the tender lining from the 8F?
22:32:20 <Timberwolf> Yeah, I'm not that keen on it myself.
22:32:21 <FLHerne> It would be prototypical, and make it more distinguishable from the Black 5
22:34:42 <FLHerne> What's the purpose of the MU length limit?
22:35:17 <Timberwolf> For people who want the full length APT and Eurostar consists, which are a bit mad at OpenTTD scale.
22:36:22 <FLHerne> Well, more "why is there a limit in the first place?"
22:37:02 <FLHerne> Trains longer than 6 tiles certainly aren't unusual in most gameplay
22:37:16 <Timberwolf> I only allow MUs to be built in their prototypical consists (e.g. a class 455 is four cars), but for some of the longer ones that felt a bit unreasonable.
22:37:26 <Timberwolf> I think a proper APT-P is 14 tiles or something.
22:39:36 <FLHerne> How about things like the DMUs where they prototypically come in multiple lengths?
22:39:53 <Timberwolf> I ended up just picking one at random :)
22:45:49 <Gustavo6046> I'm murdering the competitor's drivers
22:46:53 <Gustavo6046> this is the 2nd car in this same road that serial killer has victimized to datre
22:47:08 <Gustavo6046> looking up for many more!
22:47:20 <Gustavo6046> what was the top hat guy from the Thomas the Tank Engine series called again? Topham or something?
22:47:57 <Eddi|zuHause> congrats, you found a feature that i abused 25 years ago :p
22:48:22 <Gustavo6046> Eddi|zuHause: whaa
22:48:24 <Gustavo6046> I knew about blocking the road
22:48:30 <Gustavo6046> but not straight out murdering the bastards
22:48:33 <Gustavo6046> andythenorth: ah ok
22:48:48 <Gustavo6046> besides I wasn't born 25 years ago, just 17 years ago
22:48:49 <Timberwolf> OpenTTD fixed some of the best ones.
22:49:16 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, you used to be able to put a depot on the back of a competitor station and crash their trains waiting in the station :)
22:49:19 <Timberwolf> Anyone else use the "hang on a minute, wrong company" thing where you could build a depot on the end of a competitor's station and the tra...
22:50:01 <Timberwolf> A fast train would get about half a tile before turning around, which is enough to wreck things.
22:50:21 <Eddi|zuHause> i definitely used that, but the AI didn't remove their track with no trains, so it would have been better to let them run with a deficit
22:50:25 <Timberwolf> There was also some variant where you could make a competitor's signal block become occupied, although it's been long enough I forget the details.
22:53:25 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, same as with the crash, just you build the train when nobody is waiting in the station, and stop it there
23:03:07 <andythenorth> ok sleeping time
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23:37:29 <Gustavo6046> Does the road pathfinder take traffic into account?
23:37:42 <Gustavo6046> I want to give them more lanes so they don't get stuck in traffic so often.
23:37:52 <FLHerne> Gustavo6046: To an extent
23:37:58 <Gustavo6046> But almost always a road winds up being used far less
23:38:04 <Gustavo6046> so it's generally kinda pointless
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