IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-11-05
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00:26:38 <marijnvdwerf> TrueBrain: I was researching DOS reverse engineering, and found OpenDune. Do you have any info/posts on how the emu-assembly was dumped?
00:30:34 <Eddi|zuHause> wasn't alberth involved with that?
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09:24:54 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7767: Large numbers of trains and signals cause low FPS https://git.io/Je8mF
09:29:18 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7825: Fix #7783, #7816: SDL2: Fix various issues with keyboard input https://git.io/Je29Q
09:32:24 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh commented on pull request #111: Add: MSVC pdb to file description list https://git.io/Je295
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09:56:15 <planetmaker> salut dihedral :)
09:56:48 <planetmaker> (and everyone else ofc, too :D )
10:40:38 <dihedral> Hey planetmaker, how are you?
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11:47:28 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] BlackPlague666 commented on issue #7767: Large numbers of trains and signals cause low FPS https://git.io/Je8mF
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13:54:26 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7767: Large numbers of trains and signals cause low FPS https://git.io/Je8mF
14:07:22 * andythenorth is curious about lunch
14:19:25 <peter1138> I'm in the process of consider what to have for dinner tonight.
14:19:30 <peter1138> (I'll be eating out)
14:27:34 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7376: More than max_no_competitors could be created in network games https://git.io/fjvY8
14:28:56 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #7376: More than max_no_competitors could be created in network games https://git.io/fjvY8
14:49:03 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on issue #7767: Large numbers of trains and signals cause low FPS https://git.io/Je8mF
15:04:46 <Samu> because it has been fixed
15:15:07 <Samu> lol, unidentified developer... just set preferences to allow execution of those apps
15:15:46 <Samu> it's like windows on openttd
15:20:31 <Samu> mac users are seriously... stupid
15:20:46 <Samu> oh well, i better shut up, reading that extra note is too cringeworthy
15:23:30 <andythenorth> I don't think mac users are more or less stupid than the other operating systes
15:23:47 <andythenorth> I think the stupid levels out
15:29:34 <LordAro> aren't the actual windows releases signed?
15:29:46 <LordAro> rather than nightlies/stuff you compiled yourself
15:29:53 <LordAro> which avoids the "Run anyway" issue
15:31:14 <planetmaker> I'm tempted to answer like "will you donate costs of a developer account to OpenTTD?"
15:31:41 <planetmaker> but that is actually the wrong answer.
15:32:41 <LordAro> also made the title better
15:34:58 <Samu> openttd is a virus because it lacks a signature
15:35:00 <planetmaker> The real problem really is getting the legal entity required for that action
15:35:09 <Samu> the false sense of security
15:35:15 <planetmaker> and we don't want it bound onto a personal account
15:35:37 <LordAro> Samu: of course, but in general every little helps
15:35:37 <planetmaker> you say it, samu :| But... people like false sense of security
15:35:45 <LordAro> it's exceedingly rare that you get "signed" viruses
15:35:55 <LordAro> especially for Apple devices
15:36:13 <LordAro> mostly they just rely on people to just click the "Run anyway" button ;)
15:38:27 <andythenorth> I've updated the ticket a bit more
15:38:44 <andythenorth> most real Mac malware does not rely on 'Run anyway'
15:38:51 <andythenorth> the common cases are
15:38:55 <andythenorth> - fake Flash installers
15:39:20 <andythenorth> - scamware like Mackeeper, i.e. genuine looking software, which may even be Apple authorised, but is malware
15:39:30 <Eddi|zuHause> <LordAro> it's exceedingly rare that you get "signed" viruses <-- i'm fairly sure those appeared about 3 seconds after they introduced signing
15:39:33 <andythenorth> - poisoned binaries of genuine apps, sometimes even signed
15:40:33 <andythenorth> and for the record, historically Gatekeeper is not a false sense of security, it's a plausible defense-in-depth against unwanted binaries being executed
15:40:49 <andythenorth> Apple may currently be destroying that via some odd choices
15:41:50 <andythenorth> that's still a theoretical vector
15:42:30 <planetmaker> yes. works on all platforms, though :)
15:42:52 <planetmaker> sell security. Deliver spyware :)
15:43:22 <andythenorth> then phone people up, and say they have a virus
15:43:31 <andythenorth> I just got asked for $2500 in BTC
15:43:40 <andythenorth> apparently someone has video of me naked, due to malware
15:43:46 <andythenorth> and I shouldn't be telling anyone
15:43:57 <andythenorth> or they'll reveal it to my friends and family
15:43:58 <planetmaker> oh, I got those e-mails on info openttd.org
15:44:07 <planetmaker> I wonder whom they meant :P
15:44:13 <andythenorth> they're quite funny, except when they're not :P
15:44:41 <planetmaker> the most cunning actually are those which use login + passwords from previous hacks, like on adobe
15:44:55 <planetmaker> telling you that they hacked the associated e-mail account to do the same shit
15:45:19 <planetmaker> good, if you are 100% sure to never have used the same passwords in your associated e-mail account :D
15:46:34 <planetmaker> of course the from-address forged to your own to make it more credible
15:46:58 <planetmaker> That I did read twice :)
15:48:43 <planetmaker> On-topic of developer account though: I think it's virtually impossible to register a dev account which is non-personal if you have no legal entity
15:48:51 <planetmaker> and best have a US-based one
15:49:59 <planetmaker> that is a lot to organize
15:51:56 <Samu> peter1138, can you take a look at #7822
15:52:54 <planetmaker> andythenorth, amy -> may? :)
15:54:29 <Samu> the underlying problem is not the cache itself, because the issue is also present on NPF.
15:58:08 <Samu> the vehicle basically "re-enters the same tile" every tick, asking for pathfinder directions
15:58:32 <Samu> the cache doesn't handle vehicles moving into the same tile
15:58:59 <Samu> so, I'm unsure about my fix
16:10:01 <planetmaker> the assembly was held about 3 times... and then abandoned :D
16:12:45 <planetmaker> it was officially an "e.V" (registered club) according to Swiss law..
16:14:07 <Eddi|zuHause> no freedom for her
16:15:30 <andythenorth> I am waiting for a consensus before contacting any of the free software foundations
16:15:42 <andythenorth> I hate emailing and crap, so not doing all that, then getting shot down
16:15:50 <andythenorth> I'd rather be making newgrfs but eh :)
16:22:40 <planetmaker> making an association to which like "we" become members is not terribly hard. Making it such that it's a charity might prove interesting challange, but likely is feasible, too. But requires renewal. And indeed careful accounting etc
16:23:04 <SpComb> but if you enroll, then you can integrate with Siri, Apple Pay, and iCloud
16:23:33 <planetmaker> you want to continue playing? Donate now or your save option will be disabled :P
16:32:15 <dihedral> donate to server owner in order to join?
16:33:22 <dihedral> 1 eur per game + 5 eur for 1.000.000 <currency here>. loans are disabled
16:34:36 <planetmaker> looking at you, dihedral , you are a founding member there, too :P
16:34:47 <dihedral> and I was proud of it
16:35:09 <dihedral> ... with the right people
16:46:15 <Samu> wanna know if ryzen is faster than intel
16:46:27 <Samu> in this particular savegame
16:46:51 <dihedral> and you will get good comparable data how?
16:47:42 <dihedral> so you want to eye-ball any data you get and use your gut feeling
16:52:21 <SpComb> an opportunity to show off my overclocked i5-9600K that I upgraded to to get Factorio UPS back to playable levels?
16:52:36 <andythenorth> I should buy a new computer for OpenTTD
16:52:52 <andythenorth> 20fps on an empty map is not ideal
16:53:29 <Samu> that savegame is exposing a bug that eats cpu
16:53:31 <Eddi|zuHause> throw out the mac, immediate upgrade
16:53:39 <Samu> i wanna know which cpu does better
16:53:42 <andythenorth> is it known whether Windows works?
16:54:02 <Eddi|zuHause> windows updates may brick your bios
16:54:14 <andythenorth> but I have an Apple device, so I'm used to that
16:54:16 <_dp_> its it normal that save bugs out after a while ?
16:54:51 <Samu> you get 34 fps? man, my cpu is so old
16:55:08 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, single core speed hasn't increased in like 5 years
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16:55:41 <Samu> so instead of fps, tell me the average road vehicle ticks
16:55:47 <andythenorth> "mine is only 2.8Ghz though, there must be faster"
16:55:49 <planetmaker> nominal clock speed. Actually it did increase - slightly
16:56:05 <andythenorth> I think one of my upgrades actually got slower
16:56:34 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, processor speed is probably not your current limiting factor
16:58:08 <andythenorth> I know, but it's so much fun to talk about :P
16:58:19 <andythenorth> it has charts and stuff!
16:59:08 <andythenorth> the top single core score is 2000, and I have 1069
16:59:20 <andythenorth> so if I buy a new computer, I'll get 30fps?
16:59:41 <andythenorth> I currently get ~22fps, so 100% faster = 30fps, right?
16:59:43 <andythenorth> that's how it works
16:59:49 <planetmaker> 33 if you buy good enough :)
16:59:59 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 33.3333333333
17:01:28 <andythenorth> the puzzling thing is that currently I have managed to trick OpenTTD that I have upgraded my CPU
17:01:34 <andythenorth> it's back at 33-34fps
17:02:03 <planetmaker> zoom-out has your fps drop
17:02:14 <andythenorth> zoom out how far? o_O
17:02:21 <_dp_> that save is not stable, it gets faster from time to time
17:02:33 <planetmaker> so as server-owner you should always save your savegame with zoom-in so that slower computers can join for longer
17:02:45 <planetmaker> when uploading saves to server
17:02:47 <andythenorth> eh, how is the save not stable?
17:02:58 <Samu> just when the vehicles are all stuck
17:02:59 <andythenorth> you mean OpenTTD frame rate arbitrarily changes?
17:03:51 * andythenorth will screen record video next time the fps shows arbitrary odd behaviour
17:04:21 <andythenorth> the performance is really bizarre
17:04:32 <andythenorth> and it's apparently independent of processes on my system
17:05:07 <andythenorth> like, right now I have 34fps, in power saving mode, with an antivirus scan of my entire HD running and pegging all of 1 core
17:05:15 <_dp_> you can check vehicles in the bottom corner, when they unstuck fps raises
17:05:25 <andythenorth> oh and I have full animation on
17:05:44 <andythenorth> other times, full animation off, system idle, plugged into mains (increases single core speed), 16fps
17:24:18 <Samu> right side is with the tentative fix applied
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18:50:21 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro commented on pull request #111: Add: MSVC pdb to file description list https://git.io/Je2jo
18:50:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/nml] matthijskooijman commented on pull request #54: Fix #39: Add compatibility with >=pillow-7.0.0 https://git.io/Je2jK
18:51:05 <milek7> but actually I don't know what this traffic..jam? is meant to test ;P
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19:19:55 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison updated pull request #7825: Fix #7783, #7816: SDL2: Fix various issues with keyboard input https://git.io/Je2wr
19:33:13 <Samu> milek7, is that a ryzen cpu?
19:33:43 <milek7> AMD Ryzen 5 3600 6-Core Processor
19:34:07 <Samu> now I need an intel cpu benhchmarked
19:35:20 <Samu> some core i-something 6000 or higher series
19:35:33 <Samu> cus they're all the same architecture
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19:37:49 <DorpsGek> Samu: 0.322605721393
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20:24:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #111: Add: MSVC pdb to file description list https://git.io/JeaJZ
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21:25:30 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #111: Add: 'Developer Files' section on download pages https://git.io/JeaUI
21:27:03 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] glx22 commented on pull request #111: Add: 'Developer Files' section on download pages https://git.io/JeaUm
21:27:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #111: Add: 'Developer Files' section on download pages https://git.io/JeaUY
21:28:21 <glx> was easy, once I managed to run jekyll locally :)
21:28:32 <TrueBrain> :D That was the point of using Jekyll ;)
21:28:48 <glx> I forgot the idea to use the VM, not enough RAM :)
21:29:31 <glx> Jekyll on windows needs extra stuff in the gemfile
21:29:31 <TrueBrain> awh, I see I missed another Dutch person :P
21:29:43 <TrueBrain> well .. I was asleep at that time, so what-ever :D
21:29:58 <TrueBrain> glx: I am not surprised, for some reason :P
21:31:16 <glx> oh I also needed to copy the ua-parser.js over the link
21:31:51 <glx> I tried using a symlink but ruby didn't liked
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21:34:38 <TrueBrain> and LordAro, it is glx that was part of OpenDUNE ;)
21:35:10 <glx> but you did the JIT decompiler
21:36:07 <TrueBrain> yeah, but Eddi|zuHause was confusing you with Alberth, something that is unacceptable :P
21:39:52 <Eddi|zuHause> huh? i did certainly not do that
21:43:40 <Xaroth> 00:30 <Eddi|zuHause> wasn't alberth involved with that?
21:43:59 <Eddi|zuHause> well, Alberth was certainly involved with the OpenDune project...
21:46:36 <TrueBrain> as that means he should link his email
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21:46:51 <Eddi|zuHause> "The OpenDUNE team (in alphabetical order):
21:46:53 <Eddi|zuHause> Albert Hofkamp (Alberth) - Refactoring Dude"
21:48:15 <TrueBrain> so slap him next time to link his email!
21:49:16 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: Alberth was last seen in #openttd 15 weeks, 0 days, 2 hours, 28 minutes, and 3 seconds ago: <Alberth> andy: I bisected the build-train bug back to d54b6ac09b6fe88c09f7886739fe9c05f16b8222 (feb 28th)
21:52:16 <andythenorth> Alberth has retired :)
21:52:31 <andythenorth> from ottd, dunno about odune
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23:17:26 <Samu> what plans do you have for my start_date related PRs?
23:19:35 <Samu> #7661 versus #7515 + #7486
23:29:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh commented on pull request #111: Add: 'Developer Files' section on download pages https://git.io/JeaI4
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