IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-07-16
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09:24:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i still can't make windows boot from the usb drive...
09:25:07 <andythenorth> did anyone finish Iron Horse 2 yet?
09:26:20 * andythenorth must pixels then
09:27:10 <nakki> dude expects an answer within a minute
09:27:48 <Eddi|zuHause> uhm... if that wasn't a rhethorical question, then i don't know anymore
09:35:47 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] auge8472 commented on pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjXNP
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10:00:23 <peter1138> So making my ride 48 minutes instead of 45 minutes reduces the amount of energy expended by a third.
10:01:23 <peter1138> Oh, 48 minutes instead of 42 minutes, oops.
10:25:39 <Eddi|zuHause> sounds like there's an optimization task between those
10:26:37 <andythenorth> I have been experimenting riding my bike with the power off
10:26:40 <andythenorth> it's a bit of a dog
10:27:47 <peter1138> If I ride with the power off I can only go down hill.
10:28:59 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, yeah I should aim for 45 tomorrow and see what difference that makes ;)
10:31:00 <LordAro> peter1138: it is sometimes disappointing how little difference "putting the hammer down" makes
10:31:07 <peter1138> I can expend less energy by taking the 12km route instead of the 22km route.
10:31:32 <LordAro> my route varies by 3 minutes at most
10:31:36 <peter1138> LordAro, that was quite a big difference, I think.
10:32:17 <LordAro> certainly don't get to work any quicker anyway, as i just end up standing around trying to cool down
10:32:18 <peter1138> Ah, I see what you mean, different perspective.
10:32:28 <peter1138> Tons more energy for marginal gains.
10:32:51 <peter1138> I like expending energy, means I can eat more ;)
10:33:43 <LordAro> i have to wait until i stop sweating
10:34:03 <LordAro> but faster is more fun :)
10:35:04 <peter1138> Best to save faster for the weekend rides though :-)
10:35:21 <peter1138> Oh lord, there's 16 Greggs doughnuts in the kitchen.
10:35:30 <peter1138> Quite large things.
10:36:59 <peter1138> Fairly sure one of them would wipe out my morning commute, heh.
10:41:15 <peter1138> Eh, about half of it, it turns out.
10:50:56 <peter1138> I think three would be too many :p
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10:52:11 <Eddi|zuHause> that means you can eat two? :p
10:52:46 <peter1138> I might get told off :p
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11:18:19 <LordAro> peter1138: only if you're caught
11:18:44 <peter1138> I got told off a few months ago for eating all the cake...
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12:50:50 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] planetmaker commented on pull request #7654: Change: Update for French town name "Beaujolais" https://git.io/fjXpD
13:14:54 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7654: Change: Update for French town name "Beaujolais" https://git.io/fjXhL
13:18:13 <reldred> I should really learn how to write C
13:19:17 * reldred proceeds to instead binge vidyagame
13:50:35 * andythenorth can't unsee the offset failure in Iron Horse
13:50:40 <andythenorth> thanks peter1138 :P
13:51:53 <reldred> ahhhh, it's fun getting other road traffic in openttd, that towncars script is fun.
13:52:23 <andythenorth> now I have to figure out why
13:52:29 <andythenorth> I aligned the sprites with the bounding box :P
13:53:10 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] planetmaker commented on pull request #7654: Change: Update for French town name "Beaujolais" https://git.io/fjXh5
13:53:42 <reldred> oh rip me indeed, bringing that high speed urban electric line up has now generated so much more traffic to go up the damn mountain
13:54:03 <andythenorth> oic, the bounding boxes don't align with the sprites :)
13:54:10 * andythenorth checking base set trains
13:55:21 <reldred> I'm really enjoying iron horse btw andythenorth, those little doors open/close anims on the pax/mail carriages bring a smile to my face
13:55:30 <andythenorth> good, effort pays off then :)
13:55:42 <andythenorth> this BB issue explains why the Horse sprites jump as trains go round corners
13:56:52 <reldred> Normally you'd have to put a gun to my head to get me off of NARS
13:58:20 <andythenorth> oh the / angle doesn't have this problem
13:58:22 <peter1138> Hmm, nearly 1pm. I reckon that's my lunch time, then.
13:58:28 <andythenorth> yes lunch is happening now
13:58:33 <nakki> went to an italian for lunch, was good
13:59:20 <peter1138> I have, um... a salad I prepared earlier. Again.
14:10:00 <andythenorth> I might have salad
14:22:59 <peter1138> With tubular pasta and cheese?
14:24:02 <andythenorth> not many vitamins in tubes
14:29:40 <andythenorth> it's interesting the in-game sprite aligner supports sub-pixel alignment
14:30:12 <andythenorth> 4 increments per on-screen pixel
14:30:59 <andythenorth> to make use of the numbers displayed, have to divide by 4
14:37:23 <andythenorth> offsets fixed :D
15:24:11 <peter1138> Well, if you were drawing 4x sprites you'd be using the numbers as displayed, no?
15:24:13 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it's a bit of a hack to support 4x view
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15:45:21 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM updated pull request #7608: Codechange: Performance improvement in k-d tree FindNearest() https://git.io/fjBpv
16:01:27 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM commented on pull request #7608: Codechange: Performance improvement in k-d tree FindNearest() https://git.io/fj1vU
16:21:26 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 opened issue #7656: Bridge remove cost does not take into account road/tram/rail remove cost. https://git.io/fj1vu
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19:21:09 <Beerbelott> Wouldn't it be an idea to release versions though (a) torrent(s)?
19:21:47 <Beerbelott> Might help offload the Web server for delivery, if that's seen as useful
19:22:25 <nielsm> the downloads are served via CDN
19:23:17 <nielsm> I don't know the numbers, but I'd like to believe the bandwidth costs for download delivery are insignificantly small
19:26:07 <Beerbelott> OK then. I was prone to ask "why not" ;)
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19:28:42 <nielsm> you can look up the transfer costs for Amazon S3, the average size of a download, and take some guesses at number of monthly downloads and see how much it adds up to
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19:58:04 <Eddi|zuHause> nielsm: there was a patch that could display two highlights per tile (inner and outer frame) in different colours
19:58:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i believe it also added more colours
20:24:27 <andythenorth> there's something like that in JGR
20:25:50 <frosch123> at some point icons are better
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20:37:39 <andythenorth> or blitz daily missions?
20:38:29 <frosch123> do you like trains?
20:44:42 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #7025: Add #6887: Option to show zone inside local authority boundary of towns https://git.io/fj1kp
20:48:39 <andythenorth> blitz daily mission is 10 wins in light tanks
20:48:43 <andythenorth> I hate light tanks
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22:31:43 <andythenorth> vehicles cargo is a bit unusual
22:31:58 <andythenorth> for cargo sprites
22:57:02 <nielsm> okay so it's an exploit with share buying/selling and sending money to other companies
22:58:05 <nielsm> something that would get you banned on any multiplayer server with active admins, pointless in singleplayer (you can just cheat), and how many multiplayer servers even have share buying/selling enabled?
22:59:10 <andythenorth> he probably lives nnear me somewhere
22:59:19 <andythenorth> it's a yogscast thing
23:01:52 <nielsm> the best way I can think of to fix this would be to make share trading work based on fixed assets only and not cash
23:04:11 <michi_cc> stock exchange being an exploit? Just declare it a real world feature :p
23:18:17 <Beerbelott> The only way to address stock manipulation in games centered around a financial system (like Capitalism Lab) was to detect/forbig specific move based on conditions...
23:18:40 <Beerbelott> ie a proper stock market + policies implementation
23:19:03 <nielsm> yeah, something like you can only sell shares back to the public if the public actually would want to buy them
23:19:14 <nielsm> i.e. the company would have to be more than a shell
23:19:19 <Beerbelott> also forbiding in-house trading
23:19:35 <nielsm> and its valuation must match its performance
23:20:18 <Beerbelott> and proper stock valuation, with smoothness over time?
23:20:41 <Beerbelott> We are entering complex new mechanisms + policies here
23:21:02 <Beerbelott> QUite interesting, but I guess it basically means impacting the economy one way or the other :D
23:21:15 <Beerbelott> Sth seen as on a side-track risk becoming central
23:21:32 <LordAro> could just remove it entirely
23:21:46 <nielsm> you'd have to do things like sending money to companies is not possible, but instead you'd have to make it an investment
23:21:54 <Beerbelott> If you make a Capitalism Lab + OpenTTD crossover, I take it! I'm 100% for! But... feasible? :D
23:22:15 <nielsm> yeah I think the share buying mechanism is originally meant more as a way to get rid of bad AI companies
23:22:21 <Beerbelott> LordAro: Well, as stated before it's not active by default in configuration, hence not in multiplayer
23:22:45 <Beerbelott> Hence, multiplayer servers won't be impacted unles the feature is explicitely activated
23:22:54 <Beerbelott> and in solo, there are cheats already
23:23:31 <Beerbelott> nielsm pointed that out
23:24:07 <nielsm> full RRT2 economy with players and companies separated, companies are founded with investment capital and/or bonds
23:24:12 <Beerbelott> It might be seen as annoying, but in the end who cares? If you wanna have plenty of money... good for you... that's not where the fun is?
23:24:31 <nielsm> and you can get more funding by selling more bonds or trying to offer more shares for sale
23:24:34 <Beerbelott> On servers where it is active and value/monye matters, I suppose moderation has to be there to make sure people don't troll already
23:25:11 <Beerbelott> there are tons of ways to be 1st already... by trolling others
23:25:51 <Beerbelott> It's kinda painless money-generating too, as money comes fro mthin air
23:26:26 <Beerbelott> Even if you use another company to generate money, if you make sure leaving it in the state you found it (w/ same sum in bank account=, you gave yourself some money, hindered no-one... so business as usual?
23:26:56 <Beerbelott> You got yourself some money, which is not where the fun lies. Yes, you can build... but I guess you'll get bored of it if you relaly wanna play
23:27:30 <Beerbelott> I don't see this thing as being that big, from server moderation point of view, as longs as there are no serious leaderboards involved
23:29:24 <nielsm> leave it be, servers should be running with shares trading disabled
23:30:27 <nielsm> and I should have gone to bed an hour ago
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