IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-05-22
⏴ go to previous day
00:27:30 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd
01:01:02 *** Smedles has joined #openttd
01:01:45 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd
02:16:50 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd
02:54:53 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd
03:18:56 <Hazzard> Is there a way to send commands to an OpenTTD *client* ?
03:19:19 <Hazzard> I assumed that running it from command line would let me run commands from there but it seems that is not the case
03:27:20 <Eddi|zuHause> what kind of command?
03:28:07 <Eddi|zuHause> you open the ingame console with the key left of 1
03:28:41 <Eddi|zuHause> running from command line only helps if you convert the openttd.exe to a console app
03:29:20 <Hazzard> I used xvfb to run it without an interface :0
03:29:45 <Hazzard> definitely not intended way to play
03:30:02 <Hazzard> but I am trying to write some automatic integration tests
03:30:09 <Eddi|zuHause> i've still no clue what you're trying to do
03:35:55 <Hazzard> I'm basically trying to run an openttd client headless, like you would run a server headless
03:35:56 <Hazzard> I'm guessing its not possible
03:37:19 <Eddi|zuHause> Hazzard: you might want to check the regression test?
03:38:00 <Eddi|zuHause> or the "-v null:ticks=1000" option
03:43:28 <Hazzard> Eddi|zuHause: Where can I find the regression tests?
03:43:39 <Eddi|zuHause> "make regression"
04:16:06 <glx> regression test is just an AI
04:18:45 <Hazzard> guess its not possilbe without custom build
04:40:49 <Corns[m]> Yeah the github repo has the latest changelog
06:59:44 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
07:13:42 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd
08:17:01 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd
08:28:20 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
09:29:29 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison opened issue #7600: Stack buffer over-read in ReadRawLanguageStrings https://git.io/fj4P1
10:05:28 <Hazzard> Is there the intention to have linux binaries included in the nightly releases?
10:06:10 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
10:44:10 <LordAro> Hazzard: as soon as someone solves the issue of compatibility
10:44:28 <LordAro> previous generic linux binaries barely worked on any distro other than ubuntu
10:44:38 <planetmaker> in other words: someone [TM] "just" needs to create an appropriate docker container
10:44:40 <LordAro> and were barely downloaded anyway
10:44:48 <LordAro> hence why they've been dropped for now
10:44:50 <planetmaker> but... yes, it would be very nice
10:45:09 <LordAro> something involving a centos6 container + static build would likely do the job
10:45:21 <planetmaker> uhm... rather centos7 ?
10:45:31 <LordAro> centos6 is still in support :)
10:45:44 <planetmaker> yes... but setting up a new container... I'd rather choose 7
10:45:59 <LordAro> could go back as far as centos5, given RH5 is just about still in support if you pay them enough :p
10:46:03 <planetmaker> </bike shedding xxl>
10:46:15 <LordAro> there are existing docker containers for them, no setup required
10:49:58 <planetmaker> well, still, for building OpenTTD. But probably one can look at other openttd build containers for reference
10:53:00 <peter1138> Generic static binary might be more useful.
10:53:22 <peter1138> Although, that'd get somewhat large quite quickly.
10:53:37 <planetmaker> peter1138, I think that is what was being meant
10:53:53 <planetmaker> but it needs some system they're built on
10:56:08 <LordAro> a "generic binary" has to be static, the dependencies just wouldn't work otherwise
10:56:33 <LordAro> but even a static binary is usually dynamically linked to libc, so you need maximum compatibility for that
10:57:25 <peter1138> You were talking about Centos or some other rubbish.
10:58:01 <peter1138> Sensibly, you'd use a Debian container to make a static binary.
10:58:19 <LordAro> yes, because that's typically the oldest linux distro that peoplr are likely to still be using
10:58:30 <peter1138> Everyone running Centos seems to have issues upgrading from one release to another :p
10:58:47 <LordAro> a similarly ancient debian distro would work as well
10:58:51 <peter1138> LordAro, that too, but being static it doesn't matter.
10:58:57 <LordAro> but that would be out of support, technically speaking
11:03:55 <dwfreed> you could go the factorio route, and make centos 6 users have to set up glibc 2.18 in an alternate root :)
11:07:44 <peter1138> That's somewhat missing the point.
11:09:44 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
11:18:11 <dwfreed> you're still going to have versioned symbols linked from libc, unless you go full static (which is just crazy); the reality is that not many people are going to run openttd on centos of any version (if anything, they'd be using a relatively modern fedora), so building on something like debian jessie would be sensible, and you can static everything except libc (or the other libs listed in PEP 571 linked,
11:18:11 <dwfreed> because their ABIs never change)
11:22:27 <peter1138> Debian is the only way to do it.
11:22:33 <peter1138> Because other distros just suck :p
11:31:06 <LordAro> if we're not going for maximum compatibility, there's no need for "generic" binaries at all
11:31:21 <LordAro> might as well just have lots of debian containers
11:33:03 <LordAro> whole point is moot until someone actually does something anyway
11:33:33 <LordAro> and i do have an irritatingly high amount of experience with getting things to build with centos5...
11:37:51 <peter1138> Besides, you can do it with railtype compatibility, anyway.
11:38:47 <peter1138> If only those train designers knew... no need to design complicated bogies, just set a flag on your railtype...
11:43:26 <Eddi|zuHause> "This item does not ship to Germany - Mainland."
11:45:26 <debdog> heh, Soylent, that's somewhat macabre
11:46:54 <Eddi|zuHause> i heard about them a few years ago
11:47:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i wonder if they had to license the name
11:49:06 <Eddi|zuHause> from the author?
11:49:20 <peter1138> If you don't know the name, then I guess the link doesn't mean much :p
12:03:33 <andythenorth> if I can figure out 3 or 4 things I have NFI about, then newgrf publishing is 'fixed'
12:04:37 <andythenorth> AWS and Azure stuff mostly, maybe a bit of git :P
12:08:49 <planetmaker> I just saw that github is offering beta-access to github package registry... not exactly sure what it does... but maybe that's a thing, too
12:15:30 <LordAro> "And it supports familiar package management tools: JavaScript (npm), Java (Maven), Ruby (RubyGems), .NET (NuGet), and Docker images, with more to come. "
12:15:37 <LordAro> useful for docker, probably not much else
12:26:19 <andythenorth> so I have an Azure build pipeline that works fine for FIRS
12:26:30 <andythenorth> and I have the start of a deploy pipeline, that pushes to AWS
12:27:19 <andythenorth> I need the deploy pipeline to grab a json or xml listing from S3, and parse it into a classic html 'directory listing' page of links to different FIRS versions
12:27:37 <andythenorth> I also need to figure out how to put the version number into the deployed artifacts
12:27:44 <andythenorth> and how to differentiate tag / nightly / push
12:27:52 <andythenorth> or just tag / push
12:28:50 <andythenorth> Azure can run all kinds of things in the pipeline, like python scripts or whatever
12:29:06 <andythenorth> and I have given it a service connection to AWS, which can be given permission to enumerate bucket contents
12:29:21 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't see much of a need for nightly if you have push
12:30:22 <andythenorth> outdated concept imho, from when builds were very slow
12:31:35 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it has some use if you want to reach a slightly larger audience and have much movement in a day
12:32:22 <Eddi|zuHause> so the testers can better agree on a common version if there is a nightly
12:36:25 <andythenorth> there's a few initial blockers
12:36:40 <andythenorth> like, there's an Azure plugin for running a python script
12:36:56 <andythenorth> but I have no idea how to get the python script to Azure, unless it can be found in the repo
12:37:03 * andythenorth could just try :P
12:37:30 <andythenorth> and variables can be passed along the pipeline between tasks, but it's kind of opaque
12:48:37 <planetmaker> <Eddi|zuHause> i don't see much of a need for nightly if you have push <-- very much indeed
12:49:38 * andythenorth should write YAML instead of the using the Azure drag-drop UI
12:49:44 <andythenorth> it would be more easily shared
12:50:02 <andythenorth> wondering if we should have a Coop Azure account though,
12:51:25 <planetmaker> I'd not be unwilling to have
12:53:57 <andythenorth> it would be really nice to have (1) a plan for coop infra (keep / upgrade / migrate elsewhere) (2) a clear idea of what needs done to make the next major nml release :)
12:54:09 <andythenorth> maybe we need a trello or something :P
12:55:18 <planetmaker> NML builds on current devzone jenkins right now
12:56:31 <andythenorth> building for NML is probably fine
12:56:38 <andythenorth> we probably can't drop the .exe any time soonn
12:56:52 <andythenorth> we need to get NRT support and other missing spec features applied
12:57:06 <andythenorth> summmer project :P
13:00:11 <andythenorth> coop infra, I am kind of blind to what does what :)
13:12:20 <planetmaker> well... repo hosting, issue tracking, artefact building, artefact storage, translation service... are the important parts for NewGRF authors
13:12:30 <planetmaker> and about each is on a separate VM
13:12:57 <planetmaker> oh... and there's a separate database VM
13:13:42 <planetmaker> and a proxy which handles them being on one
13:23:05 <andythenorth> are any of them more of concern or interest than others?
13:23:09 <andythenorth> or is it all pretty even?
13:51:14 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd
13:52:38 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd
14:05:17 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that escalated from "embrace" to "extend" within 1 tweet...
14:05:26 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm scared of microsoft
14:18:14 <Xaroth> ms isn't extending python
14:18:35 <Xaroth> they are pointing to the official python release from the python team
14:19:16 <Xaroth> so it's more a goodwill gesture towards the boatload of python developers who prefer linux because it comes shipped with python in most cases
14:20:52 <Eddi|zuHause> Xaroth: so what is that second tweet?
14:21:12 <Eddi|zuHause> if that's not "extend" then i don't know
14:21:21 <Xaroth> about python on the windows store?
14:21:40 <dwfreed> the one about making a python package that allows access to all of Windows Runtime
14:22:04 <dwfreed> so apparently microsoft can't make software anymore
14:24:48 <Xaroth> that's been around for a while
14:27:12 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7596: Add:Three currencies: NTD, CNY, HKD https://git.io/fj4S7
14:28:03 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i mean the windows runtime module
14:28:52 <dwfreed> xlang has been around for a while, but the current winrt module is new
14:34:07 <Xaroth> but that's just xlang bindings over winrt
14:34:15 <Xaroth> instead of having to use other very obscure methods
14:54:05 *** techmagus has joined #openttd
15:38:01 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd
15:38:01 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir
16:53:37 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd
17:05:14 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd
17:21:28 *** WWacko1976-work has quit IRC
17:42:06 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd
17:55:14 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
18:08:09 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
19:33:11 *** Phoenix has joined #openttd
19:39:11 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
19:52:27 *** guysmiley222 has joined #openttd
19:54:00 *** Progman has joined #openttd
20:09:08 <Wolf01> Hmmm, is it possible to set steam to always download the updates as soon as they appear instead of schedule them at 4:00AM?
20:10:50 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd
20:12:06 <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't found it...
20:13:02 <Eddi|zuHause> i have an update scheduled for 6AM
20:19:50 <Arveen> hmm, there is an option to restrict downloads between X and Y
20:20:05 <Eddi|zuHause> how would that help anyone?
20:20:09 <Arveen> i didn't change it and it's not set
20:20:24 <Arveen> well maybe it's set for him ?
20:27:54 <Eddi|zuHause> unlikely, as that's the first place you would look...
20:28:59 <Eddi|zuHause> i've checked the setting multiple times, it's never set. yet i've never seen an update that was scheduled less than 12 hours ahead
20:29:04 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
20:41:24 *** gelignite has joined #openttd
21:00:36 <andythenorth> I knew I'd forgotten something :)
21:00:43 <andythenorth> eints -> GH projects is unsolved
21:02:06 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd
21:02:56 <frosch123> it works for ottd :p
21:04:14 <andythenorth> send me your newslettter :)
21:04:47 <andythenorth> did you just teach it to commit to git?
21:05:31 <frosch123> i was working on adding login-via-gh, and actually got quite far, but was distracted when it came to building a test environment
21:06:04 <frosch123> eints could already commit to git on devzone
21:06:41 <frosch123> but on ottd it now has dorpsgek's api key to push
21:07:11 <frosch123> i am not sure how eints should actually work with gh
21:07:21 <frosch123> in can either push directly, or it could create PRs
21:07:44 <frosch123> when people login via gh, it could also create personalised commits, instead of committing as "eints"
21:08:59 <frosch123> but well, i think login-via-gh is the most important issue
21:09:23 <frosch123> no more translator@ mails or redmine groups
21:09:55 <andythenorth> that would be good
21:10:07 <andythenorth> I'm potato / potato on PRs or not
21:10:25 <andythenorth> I get a lot translation merge commits from hg, ammler would be sad with me
21:10:59 <andythenorth> PRs seems a bit more controlled, but in practice I'm probably just going to hit approve without reading the whole diff
21:11:28 <frosch123> it's more about how to give eints access
21:11:52 <frosch123> would there be a eints gh user, which creates PRs, or would you grant them push rights, or something
21:12:17 <andythenorth> I'd rather have PRs personally
21:12:28 <andythenorth> maybe that's tinfoil
21:12:53 <andythenorth> anything having creds to modify stuff that arrives on my laptop scares me
21:13:03 <andythenorth> super tinfoil :P
21:15:19 *** Thedarkb has joined #openttd
21:19:02 <michi_cc> Hmm, who broke DorpsGek_II? It's not announcing stuff.
21:19:52 <michi_cc> Or maybe more like: who broke GitHub/Azure? CI hasn't started either.
21:21:52 <LordAro> github then, probably
21:26:00 <glx> maybe it's because no build happened since last translator commits, 3 days ago
21:33:11 <michi_cc> Has peter closed his Azure auto-reload browser window?
21:38:07 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc opened pull request #7601: Fix #7600: Don't read uninitialised memory when parsing GS language files https://git.io/fj4xL
21:39:54 <michi_cc> You're very quick today, DorpsGek_II :p
22:43:54 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
22:44:19 *** Progman has joined #openttd
22:45:04 <frosch123> yeah, australia is missing
22:45:04 <Eddi|zuHause> it's obviously recorded after ESC, as they make a reference to the winners
22:45:17 <frosch123> how would i know who won?
22:45:39 <supermop_work> anyone know anyone in latin america who can make a few hundred ceramic donkey drinking vessels?
22:46:01 <supermop_work> this is a question just posed in the oddest office-wide email ive yet received here
22:46:19 <Eddi|zuHause> where do you get so many ceramic donkeys from that they need so many drinking vessels?
22:47:52 <supermop_work> just one of the many mysteries raised by this request eddi
22:47:53 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 approved pull request #7601: Fix #7600: Don't read uninitialised memory when parsing GS language files https://git.io/fj4hT
22:49:21 <Eddi|zuHause> however, the biggest is that it's not like "latin america" is a narrow enough area to justify local sourcing, so might as well look at global shipping?
22:52:39 <frosch123> hmm, i had too much contact with eu4, i always think armenia is next to turkey
22:53:42 <frosch123> armenia is actually next to turkey :p
22:53:51 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i was about to say that
22:54:01 <Eddi|zuHause> you're mixing up armenia and albania
22:55:17 <Eddi|zuHause> well, and to make it more complicated, there's an east armenia and west armenia, with the territory of west armenia actually located within modern day turkey
22:55:40 <frosch123> don't forget iberia
22:56:38 <Eddi|zuHause> (that's the area with the controversial topic of armenian genocide)
22:59:09 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, that's a few centuries earlier than EU4 :p
23:08:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't really looked at that game
continue to next day ⏵