IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-11-07
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00:02:03 <Samu> STR_CONFIG_SETTING_LARGE_AIRPLANE_ON_SMALL_AIRPORT_HELPTEXT :When disabled, large aeroplanes do not land, can't be ordered and are not available for purchase on airports with short runways
00:02:15 <Samu> is this good english enough?
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00:10:11 <Samu> are u good at english? :o
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00:30:28 <ToffeeYogurtPots> Samu: well I am English so...
00:31:08 <Samu> cool i was asking if this is good english:
00:31:09 <Samu> STR_CONFIG_SETTING_LARGE_AIRPLANE_ON_SMALL_AIRPORT_HELPTEXT :When disabled, large aeroplanes do not land, can't be ordered and are not available for purchase on airports with short runways
00:32:00 <juzza1> Samu: how about "Allow large airplanes to use airports with short runways" and you invert the logic of the setting
00:32:15 <Samu> STR_CONFIG_SETTING_LARGE_AIRPLANE_ON_SMALL_AIRPORT :Allow large aeroplanes on small airports: {STRING2}
00:33:12 <Samu> with short runways vs small airports
00:33:50 <Samu> game code is a bit ambiguous regarding this, at least the comments
00:34:45 <Samu> comments tell about fast airplanes trying to go on airports with short runways, but i've also read other comments about large airplanes on small airports, in reality, they mean the same
00:35:38 <Samu> large airplanes with short runways seems to be the exact wording for this
00:37:03 <Samu> Allow large airplanes or aeroplanes?
00:38:23 <Samu> the setting is not just the ability of them landing on them, there's also their availability on hangars
00:38:50 <ToffeeYogurtPots> Samu: Aeroplanes seems correct but I'm not sure why. Maybe the spelling is different in the US to UK
00:39:46 <Samu> on the left, hangar of airport with short runway, on the middle, hangar of airport with big runway, on the right, hangar of helicopter station
00:41:18 <Samu> "to use airports with short runways" or "on airports with short runways"? which one is better to describe that behaviour?
00:42:24 <ToffeeYogurtPots> Samu: Just checked, both airplane and aeroplane are correct. I'd use "to use airports with short runways".
00:43:59 <ToffeeYogurtPots> Samu: No problem, English is a weird language.
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02:53:40 <ST2> supermop: still about the oilfields
02:53:54 <ST2> had you measure an idea on it?
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07:47:49 <PressureLine> I just cannot get the amount of industries on a map right
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08:23:57 <PressureLine> Setting: Industry Density: Set how many industries should be generated ***and what level should be maintained during the game***
08:25:44 <PressureLine> if I set to LOW during world generation, but as soon as the game starts go to VERY LOW, industries will shut down, and there will be no corresponding new industry built until the 'very low' level is reached?
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16:56:31 <Samu> i got a fix, but i know u guys always find troubles with my fixes
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17:28:17 <Samu> STR_ERROR_CAN_T_COPY_SHARE_ORDER
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19:23:06 <Samu> i have no idea how twitter worls
19:23:52 <Samu> i see a bunch of comments, but it doesn't appear they're answers to each other, I don't get it
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19:42:27 <Wolf01> Holy shit the IDE I use is MSAccess on steroids
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19:44:21 <Wolf01> It's a cross breed between access, vba, mysql, and gamemaker all thrown over VS2008
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20:41:32 <Samu> i found a bug when reviewing vehicle orders
20:44:25 <Samu> it's about displaying the message "aircraft has in its orders an airport whose runway is too short"
20:44:48 <Samu> if there is only 1 airport that fits that criteria, the message shows up fine
20:45:05 <Samu> it shows another message
20:46:01 <Samu> has an invalid station in its orders
20:46:38 <Samu> (message == INVALID_STRING_ID || message == STR_NEWS_PLANE_USES_TOO_SHORT_RUNWAY)
20:49:35 <Wolf01> Stop annoying peter plz
20:54:02 <andythenorth> stop annoying Wolf01 :)
20:55:35 <Wolf01> I think that if there are 2 short airports the double message is right, but it should tell which order (airport name)
20:56:06 <Wolf01> You have the airport, add a param to the string with the name
20:57:02 <Wolf01> I want roadtypes too :(
20:59:33 <frosch123> road slugs are way more complicated
21:00:49 <andythenorth> ButButButGroundTypes
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21:03:46 <andythenorth> Can I rename it Steeltown Rocks?
21:03:49 <andythenorth> probably makes no sense :P
21:04:05 <andythenorth> Steeltown seems ok now, at least not crap
21:04:53 <frosch123> does that mean no more changes till end of week?
21:04:58 <frosch123> or just till tomorrow?
21:06:46 <andythenorth> I have a few more doubts
21:06:53 <andythenorth> but I need to finish play-testing
21:07:09 <andythenorth> I think it's at a point where more changes are potato/potato
21:10:41 <frosch123> what economy would feature potatoes?
21:12:48 <Wolf01> I was thinking about a spooky world in place of toyland
21:13:17 <frosch123> pumpkin + knife -> goods
21:13:35 <frosch123> pumpkin may be a visually interesting cargo
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21:20:38 <andythenorth> potatoes are Idaho :P
21:20:59 * andythenorth sticking firmly to RL
21:22:40 <frosch123> andythenorth: btw. increasing limit for industry output cargos seems to be kind of easy
21:22:47 <frosch123> way easier than amount of input cargos
21:28:26 <frosch123> that's the question :)
21:28:47 <frosch123> it's not worth the effort to implement if it won't be used
21:29:38 <andythenorth> working within the constraints forces choices
21:29:38 <andythenorth> but sometimes the imbalance of 3 in, 2 out makes cargo chains...hard
21:29:38 <andythenorth> also does it look like it was ever a design choice?
21:29:38 * andythenorth suspects CS added 2 outputs for farms, and it has been that way ever since
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21:30:37 <andythenorth> on a purely selfish level
21:30:51 <andythenorth> if there's 3 outputs, I'll to rework *everything* in FIRS 4 :P
21:31:14 <andythenorth> what does V453000 think? o_O
21:32:14 <frosch123> i think all yeti industries only have one output
21:32:41 <frosch123> it has sets of industries which accept the same thing and produce different thigns
21:33:29 <frosch123> no idea wheather that is part of the concept
21:35:11 <andythenorth> I could likely patch FIRS so docs show 3 outputs
21:35:18 * andythenorth might try in a bit
21:41:16 <andythenorth> primarilly it would help the port-type industries
21:45:26 <andythenorth> ha also it would really mess up building stations
21:46:04 <andythenorth> 1 pickup per cargo (to avoid flickering station sprites)
21:46:22 <andythenorth> and each pickup serves max 2 routes, because cargodist
21:47:29 <andythenorth> even with TL 5 that's a lot of stations to fit around an industry :D
22:07:17 <frosch123> why? one or two platforms per cargo are enough
22:07:58 <frosch123> i mean number of platforms depends on total cargo amount
22:08:07 <frosch123> hardly on how many different cargo types there are
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22:12:16 <andythenorth> 3 platforms = 3 stations
22:12:29 <andythenorth> 3 output cargos = 3 stations :P :)
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22:13:06 <andythenorth> and each station can only serve 2 routes
22:13:29 <frosch123> also, if ratios of output cargos are fixed, it actually makes sense to run mixed trains
22:15:12 <andythenorth> assuming similar destinations?
22:15:32 <andythenorth> mixed cargo pickup causes the flickering cargo-graphics at stations :)
22:16:29 <frosch123> huh? how does mixing cargo affect the flickering?
22:17:15 <andythenorth> e.g. station has goods and supplies waiting
22:17:21 <andythenorth> sometimes more of one than other
22:17:26 <andythenorth> so all tiles change cargo sprite
22:17:30 <frosch123> [22:15] <andythenorth> assuming similar destinations? <- it's enough to pass target 1 on the way to target 2
22:17:54 <frosch123> andythenorth: you mean if tiles can display multiple cargos?
22:18:29 <frosch123> ach, we should probably fix the station cargo display somewhen
22:19:20 <andythenorth> I've tried to think of a way before :)
22:19:28 <andythenorth> round-robin tiles or something
22:19:34 <andythenorth> I'm sure Eddi|zuHause has a suggestion or two
22:19:44 <andythenorth> I just accepted it as an artefact of the game tbh :)
22:20:28 <andythenorth> not everything needs fixed :)
22:21:05 <Eddi|zuHause> hare-niemeyer :p
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22:30:11 <V453000> andythenorth: I haz opinions?
22:30:36 <frosch123> V453000: are industries with more than 2 output cargos interesting?
22:30:45 <V453000> I think it could be, definitely yes
22:30:54 <frosch123> yeti seems to always have one
22:31:05 <V453000> depends on parameters
22:31:12 <V453000> with tired yetis it's almost always 2
22:31:38 <V453000> I think there was a point when the 2 was a real limiter on something
22:31:54 <V453000> some worker yard concept with tired yetis or something, can't remember exactly
22:32:23 <V453000> but overall being able to define 3 cargoes I think could lead to some interesting points
22:32:29 <frosch123> anyway, origin was: input cargo limit is hard; output cargo limit can be lifted
22:34:32 <V453000> having to deliver more things can easily be forced by making an industry chain from one to another basically :)
22:35:01 <V453000> I guess getting more products kind of as well
22:35:52 <frosch123> 1) single industry servicing more cargos has different space restrictions
22:36:11 <frosch123> 2) single industry producing multiple things controls the ratio of the produced cargos
22:36:25 <V453000> yeah of course, not exactly the same
22:36:41 <frosch123> while stockpiles are considered bad, there are no ratios for input cargos
22:37:57 <V453000> I might have even had some YETI plan which required more extra industries because I could only have 2 cargoes per industry
22:38:00 <V453000> would have to revisit
22:38:32 <V453000> basically I think I wanted some things to produce recyclables as a side product
22:38:48 <V453000> and mos of them already have cargo + tired yetis
22:39:13 <V453000> btw can the industry production mechanism be non-linear?
22:39:36 <frosch123> you can already define whatever function you like
22:39:46 <V453000> aka if I would have 1 YETI mine, it would produce less in total than 2 YETI mines, assuming I deliver same amount of supplies to them in total/
22:39:51 <V453000> right, is what I thought
22:43:25 <frosch123> also, since andy wasn't aware either; industries within a town can communicate with each other
22:45:10 <frosch123> industries could improve production if a higher percentage of industries are serviced in a town
22:46:23 <frosch123> supermop: yeti's worker-mechanic is essentially power, just with gameplay-impact by having to transport it
22:46:47 <frosch123> V453000: was implemented years ago, was never used
22:47:02 <frosch123> then was forgotten :)
22:48:27 <V453000> well for now I will try to focus myself on trains
22:48:35 <V453000> but one day YETI2 is definitely a good idea
22:49:04 <V453000> the whole 128frame animation of YETI is a really dumb concept, and being more modular like FIRS is simply superior, too
22:49:29 <V453000> there could be some base with unique shapes, but most of it should the industries should be modular
22:49:31 <frosch123> i am currently trying to hack a draft version for long vehicles, to check at which length it gets really silly and broken in curves and on hills
22:49:58 <V453000> I basically procrastinated on train set by making PURR in the last week ._.
22:50:14 <frosch123> if a vehicle is longer than a /\ hill, the vehicle will essentially go through the hill
22:51:28 <frosch123> also vehicle scaling will be even more broken
22:51:52 <V453000> you mean the distortion at vertical and side views?
22:51:55 <frosch123> vehicles become shorter in sharp turns
22:52:31 <frosch123> the vehicle ends follow the curves, but the connecting vehicle is the bird-distance between ends
22:52:55 <frosch123> so the more you complete a circle in the curve, the shorter the vehicle gets
22:53:16 <frosch123> it's the most extreme for road vehicle
22:53:27 <frosch123> when they reverse the articulated parts pass each other next to each other
22:53:47 <frosch123> so the vehicle shortens from any length to the distance between drive lanes :p
22:54:44 <V453000> sounds pretty fucked up
22:54:49 <V453000> curious to see that :D
22:55:16 <V453000> REVERSER SLUG: Vehicle reverses inside of the rail back and forth in a spiral.
22:56:19 <frosch123> as long as you don't reverse by turning it inside-out
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22:58:06 <frosch123> be careful with higher dimensions, round things become spiky
22:58:31 <V453000> Hi I am a reverser slug, my name is Spike
23:10:21 <supermop> is there a fst way to un-vignette an image in photoshop?
23:11:15 <frosch123> no idea what that means, sounds like auto-crop
23:16:26 <andythenorth> frosch123: 3 output cargos can always be done....later, eh? :)
23:17:08 <andythenorth> presumably there's a lot of of newgrf patching?
23:19:29 <supermop> depending on lens you use, espesically in old cameras, the edges of the photo are darker than the center. PS and other programs let you add this artificially, for like portraits
23:19:43 <supermop> but what i want is the opposite, to even out the brightness
23:21:29 <andythenorth> hmm mostly industry vars, only cb 37 and cb 14C
23:22:27 <andythenorth> but quite a number of vars
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