IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-10-11
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00:20:13 <supermop> hmm if i have random or time dependent liveries, should they show up in the buy menu, or be a surprise?
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01:15:40 <ST2> this isn't the correct channel
01:17:26 <Smash_> omg never mind it worked hahahahahha
01:17:42 <Smash_> talking to you had the magic touch
01:18:03 <ST2> yeah, some women say the same ^^
01:18:54 <Smash_> ok I'm going to go see if i can still play haha
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14:47:29 <fkinglag> I am having trouble hosting
14:47:37 <fkinglag> canyone help me with this?
14:47:39 <fkinglag> dbg: [net] [udp] sendto([master.openttd.org]:3978 (IPv6)) failed with: 101
14:47:52 <fkinglag> I have everything port forwarded and have tried a different port too
14:49:09 <crem> errno 101 is "network is unreachable"
14:50:33 <crem> Which operating system do you use?
14:51:05 <crem> does "ping6 master.openttd.org" work?
14:51:09 <fkinglag> xubuntu 16.10 methinks
14:51:36 <fkinglag> connect: Network is unreachable
14:51:48 <crem> So, something with your ipv6 network settings.
14:52:27 <fkinglag> I don't use ipv6 knowingly :/
14:54:17 <crem> I think it's half-set up. So openttd thinks that ipv6 is installed while in reality it's not.
14:55:00 <crem> I don't know if it's possible to force openttd to use ipv4. But if you don't have actual ipv6 network, it's probably easier to disable ipv6 somewhere in network settings.
14:55:38 <peter1139> Yeah, you've got a global address configured somewhere but no routing.
14:56:10 <peter1139> Could be some VPN client doing something wrong.
14:57:24 <crem> it seems that it should not be a problem, as it tries ipv4 in the next line if it couldn't do with ipv6.
14:59:59 <fkinglag> yeah I see similar lines in my terminal
15:00:16 <fkinglag> it still didn't work for when I tried hosting and advertising
15:00:28 <fkinglag> tried directly connecting with IP from outside my network too
15:00:36 <fkinglag> no luck with another user
15:00:48 <fkinglag> no firewall, just SPI firewall from ddwrt router
15:00:53 <crem> Directly connecting from the game?
15:01:21 <fkinglag> I mean, my problem is hosting from my client
15:01:58 <crem> You did set up the UDP port forwarding, right?
15:02:43 <fkinglag> have tried using a different port too
15:04:14 <crem> I suspect it's still not.
15:07:00 <fkinglag> how weird, maybe I should reboot my router, a port is open that I added and the others for openttd are closed
15:11:28 <Wolf01> I have to reboot my router every time I change a rule, or wait some minutes
15:12:19 <fkinglag> it works for a different port I have open for incoming connections
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17:14:34 <supermop> i spent all last night drawing extra tram liveries instead of tramway locomotives
17:14:59 <Wolf01> And what did you learn from this?
17:15:24 <Alberth> still not enough locomotives, I'd guess :)
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17:20:41 <supermop> instead of ever releasing a 1.0 i will just draw tiny trams forever
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17:54:14 <supermop> .9.0 will have 100 different tram liveries but just plain white cubes for the locomotives
17:55:04 <supermop> actually i might end up with like 56 liveries
17:55:27 <supermop> 7 generations, 8 per generation
17:56:09 <supermop> some of those are just solid color though
17:56:10 <Wolf01> Make the graffitti version and you will end up with 112 of them
18:00:25 <supermop> if i can get an extra slot in the sprite stack, the graffiti can be composited on randomly as function of time since last service
18:00:51 <supermop> and melt your computer if you have 1000 old trams driving around
18:17:22 <supermop> actually i think i am going to need to write a complex switch for these liveries
18:17:45 <supermop> some of them are more modern than the tram in question, like for older trams that get re painted
18:18:34 <supermop> so obviously trams should be built with livery dependent on year, but also there should be some chance of them getting a new livery later
18:19:17 <supermop> but i don't want all trams to necessarily get a new livery, because it would be nice if a couple older ones were still driving around
18:20:07 <supermop> so i think i will need to figure out how trigger things work, so that when a tram enters a depot or whatever, it has some chance of getting a new livery
18:20:56 <supermop> also, easter egg liveries should stay forever if you get one
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18:23:17 <Samu> how do I extract a .grf file?
18:26:08 <Alberth> but you can convert to NFO using grfcodec
18:26:20 <Alberth> not that it will be readable or so
18:26:43 <Alberth> unless you like hexadecimal numbers
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18:30:10 <LordAro> Alberth: i mean, who doesn't?
18:33:52 <Alberth> something like that indeed
18:34:39 <Alberth> LordAro: as a replacement for a textual keyword? I don't
18:37:29 <Samu> i got a .nfo file indeed, how do i change some vehicle properties? I wanna remove the running cost of wagons of this grf
18:42:33 <Alberth> find the number that represents the running cost property of the wagons
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19:01:52 <Samu> i replace 30 4C 00 00 into 00 00 00 00 ?
19:05:40 <Cubey> In particular "the value here is a pointer into TTD's memory where the actual amount is stored"
19:07:23 <Alberth> sounds like an index, does that make sense?
19:16:52 <Samu> all wagons were 36 4C 00 00
19:33:22 <Samu> 259 * 101 00 00 28 01 00 00 00 00 2A E7 3C 0A 00 02 14 03 23 04 46 05 00 06 0F 07 05 09 38 00 0B C8 00 16 14 24 00 1F 1A 17 14 0D 18 21 05 22 14 19 00 0E 30 4C 00 00 12 FD 13 00 14 00 15 00 08 00 18 00 1A 80 1B 00 00 1C 00 1D 00 00 00 00 1E 91 20 00 23 00 25 00 26 14 27 1A 28 00 00 29 00 00 2B B9 00 2C 00 2D 00
19:34:19 <Samu> how do i change running cost factor? it's 0D?
19:34:36 <Samu> whoever did this grf made costs too high, i wanna lower a bit
19:35:10 <Wolf01> Make an extension instead of changing a grf?
20:16:23 <Samu> there is a shift being applied
20:16:39 <Samu> it inflates costs, bah... :(
20:18:07 <Samu> that's the value i was looking for
20:23:45 <Samu> I'm reviewing one of my patches, that modifies wagon running costs based on train length
20:23:57 <Samu> and I'm altering the formula a little bit
20:24:37 <Samu> trying to make the cost exponentially
20:25:13 <Samu> the more wagons the train has, the more its running costs increase, per added wagon
20:25:24 <Wolf01> Make it so it multiplies the base cost by its position in the consist
20:26:10 <Samu> i'm not using the position, i'm using vehicle length
20:27:29 <Samu> i think the formula i got right now is the right approach
20:28:13 <Samu> calculating individual running cost for each part is still tricky
20:28:34 <Samu> i can only display this information on the train detail tab
20:29:38 <Samu> i was now using a newgrf with wagons of different lenghts, to see if I could get the correct running costs for each of them in that window
20:30:37 <Samu> and I think I'm missing something... that shift = 3... skewed my calcs
20:30:46 <Samu> I was expecting a shift = 0
20:37:34 <Samu> all wagons have the price mysteriously inflated because of that shift
20:53:13 <supermop> ok liveries for 6th gen trams all drawn... now to i redraw the 5th generation, or finally draw locomotives
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20:54:47 <Wolf01> Don't! Just continue with liveries :P
20:58:01 <supermop> if i draw the locomotives, then i can spend another week just drawing locomotive liveries
20:58:57 <supermop> i wonder if the tramway trains should be all just plain open wagons that refit to anything
20:59:14 <supermop> or if there should be separate flats, tanks, boxcars, hoppers
21:00:59 <supermop> vehicle list gets way too long with this grf already
21:01:54 <supermop> also it seems stupid to buy like '0-4-0 steam engine with hoppers'
21:02:09 <supermop> '0-4-0 steam engine with flatcars'
21:02:25 <supermop> 'steeple cab electric with tankers'
21:02:55 <Wolf01> We need combinable trams like trains
21:03:01 <supermop> but a tram that refits from boxcars to tankers would really bother me
21:03:08 <supermop> yes pls patch it in Wolf01
21:03:41 <supermop> like the tram runs from the docks to the factory with tank cars, and back with box cars
21:03:51 <supermop> where are all the empty cars piling up!
21:04:23 <__ln__> Wolf01: "Altitudes are given in Parisian feet (1 Par. ft. = 1 1/15 Engl. ft.)" i like your guidebook already
21:04:55 <Wolf01> I would patch to make trains as consists so andy could make the ones he want us to use with the length he wants and the wagon he wants :P
21:05:40 <supermop> i'd then have a use for all the various length tram segments i drew
21:06:11 <supermop> make the articulated trams like the sh 125,
21:06:33 <supermop> you buy the ends and then car stick various length segments in there
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21:34:52 <OpenTTDNewbie> Hello, I'am wondering if someone here might be able to help me? I'am trying to setup a train to pick up two different goods form one station. The problem is that when loading the first cargo it is spread to all the wagons leaving no empty wagons to refit to the second cargo. So instead of filling from front to back the train is filling all wagons at the same time.
21:36:21 <Alberth> not possible in the general sense
21:36:57 <Alberth> you could use wagons that don't refit
21:37:41 <OpenTTDNewbie> NO way to make the train not fill the wagons simultainiousley.
21:38:45 <Alberth> only by having less of that cargo waiting, afaik
21:39:26 <Alberth> openttd isn't very good with guessing how you want your cargo loaded
21:39:39 <Alberth> unless you have 1 cargo in the entire train
21:40:03 <Alberth> which is also what is being done traditionally
21:40:37 <OpenTTDNewbie> OK. thank you. Will try to figure out a way to get some wagons that cant be re fittetd to both cargos
21:40:57 <Alberth> get a different trainset mostly
21:41:11 <Alberth> eg default set, or nuts
21:41:40 <Alberth> maybe others exist, don't know
21:41:47 <Alberth> I consider most sets unusable
21:42:02 <Wolf01> You can refit by hand the part of the train which needs to pickup the second cargo
21:42:58 <Alberth> OpenTTDNewbie: when loading the first cargo it is spread to all the wagons leaving no empty wagons to refit to the second cargo <-- that's refitting at the station, right?
21:43:02 <glx> hmm disable gradual loading I think
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21:46:26 <OpenTTDNewbie> Using FIRS. What i'am trying to do is with NARS boxcars. Drop off farming equipment, refit to building materials, go to next satation, pickup buildingmats, refit to packiging, pick up packinging
21:47:44 <OpenTTDNewbie> but since buildingmats and packiging both fit into boxcars all the cars get filled with minimal amounts of building material not leaving any empty cars to refit to packiging
21:50:53 <Wolf01> Refit at stations only works on the entire consist, I tried the same and I was lucky because every odd travel it loaded with the other product
21:54:58 <Wolf01> With road vehicles this is not a problem, they will be loaded randomly with one or another cargo
21:55:14 <Wolf01> But a train is a train :P
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22:11:32 <OpenTTDNewbie> More questions. Is there a calculator or something to help with selecting an engine for a train? I'am having a hard time figuring out what engine i need for what trains
22:14:27 <Cubey> There probably is, but I have never found something like that to be necessary
22:15:14 <Cubey> There aren't that many engines in most sets, just pick the speed you want (e.g. the speedlimit if your wagons), sort the engine list by max speed, and then choose from among the options with your target speed
22:19:13 <OpenTTDNewbie> I think my biggest problem is playing with 4x cargo weight...
22:19:42 <Cubey> You might need to double up your engines then
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22:32:38 <supermop> look at tractive effort
22:40:17 <supermop> i discovered that i had not done liveries for 7th generation parcel trams
22:47:57 <Samu> is that considered exponential?
22:49:28 <Samu> uint ind_cost = (total_len / VEHICLE_LENGTH) * cal_cost * ind_len / (divisor * 2);
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22:54:24 <Samu> previously it was this: uint ind_cost = cal_cost * ind_len / divisor;
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23:43:19 <Samu> 4346496000 - is this number above UINT_MAX or MAX_UINT
23:45:00 <Samu> UINT_MAX: Maximum value for a variable of type unsigned int. 4294967295 (0xffffffff)
23:45:08 <Samu> crap it is, omg... what can i do?
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