IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-09-16
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00:32:56 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: automatic road upgrade should be in the town growth algorithm, probably
00:33:39 <Wolf01> Not really growth, but a parallel one
00:33:59 <Wolf01> And it should call roadworks, just to be evil :>
00:34:03 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: in each growth cycle, town has chance (1 in X) to upgrade the town center tile. and whenever the town growth algorithm goes from an upgraded road tile to an unupgraded one, it has chance (1 in X) to upgrade that tile
00:34:45 <Eddi|zuHause> that way, you slowly upgrade the roads from the town center outwards
00:35:00 <Eddi|zuHause> and you have a chance to tweak X
00:35:45 <Eddi|zuHause> and road repair could also trigger an upgrade
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01:35:58 <supermop_home> is transport fever worth getting?
01:37:00 <Wolf01> Yes, and no, depends on your expectations
01:37:17 <supermop_home> can I use it to collect trams?
01:37:36 <Wolf01> There are some trams yes
01:37:48 <supermop_home> can I add more trams?
01:37:58 <supermop_home> and do i need steam to play it?
01:38:14 <Wolf01> Mmmh, I think there is a non-steam version
01:42:21 <supermop_home> no Japanese trams
01:42:49 <supermop_home> "kiha58 is the Japanese diesel multiple unit"
01:42:58 <supermop_home> hopefully not the only one?
01:44:26 <Wolf01> Try their forum, if you know german...
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01:49:34 <Eddi|zuHause> they're from switzerland, they know almost all languages :p
01:50:14 <Wolf01> The problem is when you don't know the other languages :P
01:50:32 <supermop_home> how do you guys use this game?
01:51:09 <supermop_home> is it practical to play around with pointwork/junctions, like a complex model railroad?
01:51:33 <supermop_home> or is it more like a prettier game with a different idea for cargo dist
01:51:37 <Wolf01> It improved greatly since the release, now it's playable
01:52:28 <Wolf01> I mostly do point to point, because industries follow the common market rules of demand and offer
01:52:31 <Eddi|zuHause> complex junctions were always a bit fiddly, but i haven't played with the latest changes
01:53:49 <Eddi|zuHause> but it was definitely a huge step up from train fever
01:54:45 <Wolf01> Cdist is also well done, transfer happen automagically and most things are automated wrt OTTD
01:55:56 <Wolf01> They removed the ability to connect stations like it's on OTTD and train fever, but doing so a station can transfer to any other different station in the catchement area
01:57:25 <Wolf01> And since the last update you can see through tunnel entrances :D
02:00:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure building bridges is still as fiddly as before
02:00:43 <Eddi|zuHause> especially double track bridges which are not rectangular to the thing they bridge over
02:01:06 <Wolf01> Nah, it's difficult to fail to build multi track bridges
02:02:22 <Wolf01> The problem might come when you need to build a road tunnel under a track embankment
02:03:16 <Wolf01> In fact modders fixed this with pre-made stuff
02:03:36 <supermop_home> is their shunting?
02:04:06 <supermop_home> all the screeshots make it look like big stations and yards in the middle of empty greeen pastures
02:04:51 <supermop_home> how is this land valuable enough to need a train station but no one wants to build or even farm there
02:05:12 <supermop_home> and apparently it can't support anything more than some short grass
02:06:01 <Wolf01> You prefer a carpet of forests like OTTD?
02:06:37 <supermop_home> well maybe just not everything looks like Kazakhstan
02:07:28 <supermop_home> here in the us land that is neither arid nor farmed actually still is pretty heavily forested
02:07:34 <supermop_home> even in the eastern us
02:08:14 <supermop_home> grass really only grows in people's yards or out on the praries
02:08:30 <Wolf01> You will find easily that clearing some trees will need a bank loan in TF
02:08:50 <supermop_home> in new york if a plot stays empty more than a year it starts to get tree saplings
02:10:41 <Wolf01> Oh, and no scenario editor, but you can load heightmaps
02:11:15 <supermop_home> an Oahu or izu oshima would be fun
02:11:28 <supermop_home> maybe a seto sea
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03:50:42 <supermop_home> I wish there was a command to run the river generator again in SE
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08:32:59 <Alberth> looks like the wrong solution, imho
08:38:46 <andythenorth> you don’t like the behaviour?
08:38:50 <andythenorth> or the implementation?
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08:44:21 <Alberth> the implementation; the RMB handling for tooltip is now overridable without any notice that it happens when you adjust tooltips
08:45:11 <andythenorth> what was the previous behaviour for RMB?
08:45:34 <Alberth> tooltips and moving main display, I think
08:46:03 <Alberth> the latter is fine, as main display and windows don't interfere
08:46:04 <andythenorth> I don’t get a tooltip on RMB, but nvm
08:46:25 <Alberth> default is some hoover time-out, nowadays
08:46:32 <andythenorth> oh I have to set default to 0 for RMB tips
08:47:02 <Alberth> yes, except now it may not actually work, instead you close the window
08:47:16 <Alberth> very nice if you except a tooltip window to pop up :p
08:48:07 <Alberth> code tries closing first :p
08:48:27 <andythenorth> yeah there’s no connection between the two settings
08:48:46 <andythenorth> so the tooltip setting can be made to lie
08:49:48 <Alberth> code-style is also broken with the "{" at the start of a new line, but that's minor
08:50:51 <Alberth> first hunk in windows.cpp
08:53:04 <Alberth> I wondered if we can fix the bridge gui
08:53:39 <Alberth> if you have a selected two tiles, the bridge build window pops up, but if you click a bridge without having enough money, it just closes
08:53:44 <andythenorth> what broken it? o_O
08:54:08 <Alberth> it likely always was broken, but most of the time you have enough cash :p
08:55:04 <Alberth> perhaps the money amounts should be painted red if there is not enough money
08:55:19 <Alberth> but that needs dynamic update, which is not so nice
08:56:30 <andythenorth> I get a message “Can’t build bridge here…Not enough cash - requires £3,609”
08:57:44 <Alberth> :O may have missed that
09:00:14 <andythenorth> easiest kind of bug report :)
09:04:15 <Alberth> I now have a coal mine at the top of a mountain, mountains contain gold :p
09:04:36 <Alberth> much easier than some processing factory though, as the heavy stuff goes down only
09:06:31 <andythenorth> mines at the top of mountains are best
09:07:00 <andythenorth> they are electric trains…they generate power when breaking IRL
09:07:03 <andythenorth> the game should model that
09:07:20 <andythenorth> other trains on same track go faster
09:07:29 <Alberth> don't see all the sparks? :p
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10:37:10 <andythenorth> not all integer lengths can be met for all generations of train, but most
10:43:18 <andythenorth> I have a few ideas, but not sure what direction to take
10:44:08 <andythenorth> - restaurant cars / observation cars: boost payment
10:44:12 <andythenorth> but might be blah
10:45:04 <andythenorth> the idea is that it sacrifices per-tile capacity for more money
10:45:14 <andythenorth> but economic games like that are usually boring
10:45:20 <Alberth> could be nice for tycoons too, but they don't pay for traveling :p
10:46:04 <andythenorth> I think it’s probably ‘no’
10:46:11 <Alberth> you'd need to sanitize openttd economically first, imho
10:46:50 <Alberth> but it's doubtful you should continue to call it openttd then, imho
10:47:14 <andythenorth> I think it might work fine, it’s just a payment curve modifier
10:48:12 <Alberth> oh, your change. Yeah sure, but "payment boost" isn't useful at all in the game
10:50:28 <Alberth> doesn't need to stop you from some making variations in wagons though :)
10:51:29 <andythenorth> the other idea I have is already in Hog and Sam
10:51:36 <andythenorth> two classes of pax
10:51:47 <andythenorth> - fast loading, higher decay curve
10:51:57 <andythenorth> - slow loading, reduced decay curve
10:52:09 <andythenorth> slow double-decker bus vs. faster coach
10:52:25 <andythenorth> local ferry vs. passenger liner
10:52:33 <andythenorth> can’t figure out how to do it in trains yet though
10:52:43 <andythenorth> seems to need 3 more pax coaches I guess
10:53:37 <Alberth> or at least something with "fast" paint :p
10:54:05 <andythenorth> ‘Suburban Passenger Car’, ‘Express Passenger Car’?
10:54:15 <andythenorth> or maybe just ‘Passenger Car’, ‘Express Passenger Car'
10:55:04 <Alberth> sounds fine, else you're moving towards specific train types quite quickly, probably
10:59:23 <andythenorth> currently the set design is mixed up with the code
10:59:34 <andythenorth> I can only have one pax coach per generation, unless I subclass
10:59:55 <andythenorth> can’t figure out if the code is just wrong, or if it’s telling me to keep things simple
11:01:05 <Eddi|zuHause> the code is probably overly specific
11:01:36 <andythenorth> the limitation is purely the naming of pngs
11:01:42 <andythenorth> which are generated
11:01:56 <Eddi|zuHause> not necessarily "wrong", but it might show an implementation-decision was taken too early in the design process
11:02:11 <andythenorth> it’s for an outdated design of the set
11:02:28 <andythenorth> there’s simply no extra property to distinguish 2 wagons of same type in same generation
11:02:37 <Eddi|zuHause> that happens with "organic" design processes
11:02:38 <andythenorth> but wtf, why do you need 2 at once, same?
11:02:53 <andythenorth> isn’t the code showing the way here?
11:03:25 <Eddi|zuHause> well, why worry about a limitation if you don't have the desire to overcome it?
11:03:25 <andythenorth> the only reason I’m adding 6/8 and 8/8 long coaches in same generation is so you can more often make integer-length trains
11:04:59 <andythenorth> V453000: 7 year old has just discovered fatal flaw in Steeltown
11:05:53 <Eddi|zuHause> the junkyard doesn't have a press?
11:07:06 <andythenorth> vehicles go to supply yard
11:07:15 <andythenorth> supplies -> [long chain] -> more vehicles
11:07:26 <andythenorth> there’s no exit from the loop
11:08:10 <Eddi|zuHause> that's how consumerism workds :p
11:08:11 <Alberth> welcome to the world economy :p
11:08:23 <andythenorth> it is quite neat :P
11:09:03 <Eddi|zuHause> that's how economy bubbles form that blow up every now and then
11:10:13 <Eddi|zuHause> because you store more and more "economical energy" in this "long chain", which will eventually collapse under the pressure
11:10:44 <Alberth> some sneaky back-arrows here and there :)
11:11:50 <andythenorth> I’m playing a Steeltown game currently
11:11:58 <Eddi|zuHause> after a week being sick, now i have to try whether i'm well enough to partake in weekend activities
11:12:04 <andythenorth> noticeable that I don’t deliver Vehicles to Supply Yard, even though I have them nearby
11:13:29 <Alberth> too many transports that you can do :p
11:13:57 <Alberth> at least I never fully connect everything
11:15:37 <Alberth> not even all industries are served :p
11:16:30 <andythenorth> I usually get one big chain connected, then stop playing
11:17:36 <Alberth> previous game ended when I needed to re-organize my entire network to connect additional industries :)
11:18:35 <Alberth> annoying as the game had put all these town in the way :p
11:18:44 <Alberth> maybe I should play with less cities
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11:45:31 <andythenorth> maybe ‘passenger car’ and ‘special passenger car’
11:45:46 <andythenorth> special ones get random sprites: buffet car, observation car etc
11:59:11 <andythenorth> might be more fun
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11:59:46 <andythenorth> the coach/bus, ferry/ship thing works because they look totally different, not because of the rational economic choice
12:00:19 <andythenorth> but ‘local’ and ‘long distance’ pax coaches would look about same
12:00:32 <andythenorth> whereas special types add eye candy
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12:31:40 <andythenorth> just 9 pax and mail cars, from 1870-2020
12:33:35 <Alberth> I don't play that long :p
12:34:04 <andythenorth> but I use ‘vehicles never expire'
12:34:23 <andythenorth> don’t want to spam the buy menu with old trains
12:34:32 <Alberth> I think it's switched on currently, not sure
12:34:49 <Alberth> just hide the old stuff :)
12:50:43 <andythenorth> does ‘parcels car’ translate ok?
12:50:49 * andythenorth is going to split mail cars
12:51:36 <andythenorth> parcels car -> mail, express freight
12:51:48 <andythenorth> armoured car -> mail, valuables, diamonds, gold, explosives
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12:56:01 <Alberth> explosives shouldn't be locked up :p
12:56:33 <Alberth> they get stored in houses where the roof gets easily blown away, just in case
13:41:22 <Alberth> not sure how that counts as armoured, but fair enough :)
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13:59:01 <Wolf01> Ok, I'm awake now, breakfast, shower, sleepflix again
14:06:24 <frosch123> is probably a beer trail
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14:20:15 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, might be a sign of illness or other impairment
15:32:16 <supermop_home> rivers are so tedious
15:32:40 <supermop_home> load a height map - too tall/bumpy/noisey to work at 512x512
15:33:06 <supermop_home> try again on 1024x1024, still too bumpy, too many dead valleys
15:34:10 <supermop_home> try again at 2048x2048, now at least there is some room in valleys, but they are still pockmarked with little pits and dead ends, so the rivers only flow in short little stints
15:34:18 <Wolf01> Does the max map height influence the heightmap outcome?
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15:34:41 <supermop_home> then the map is so big it takes forever to fix all the rivers and valleys
15:34:47 <supermop_home> then there is no time to play
15:35:23 <supermop_home> Wolf01 I'm down to max height 20, on a 2048^2 map that was designed for 1024
15:35:58 <supermop_home> the steep hills and lack of flat land would be ok - its the bumpiness/noisiness that is the problem
15:36:32 <supermop_home> even flat land has tons of 1-2 tile bumps and holes
15:36:33 <Wolf01> I always load the heightmaps in SE and work a lot on them for this exact reason
15:36:55 <supermop_home> but I'm not even making a scenario
15:37:14 <supermop_home> just wanted a quick map with interesting islands and mountains
15:37:26 <supermop_home> I didn't even really think about newgrfs
15:37:54 <supermop_home> I wish the se could re-run river generation after ive smoothed out vallies
15:38:16 <Eddi|zuHause> need a river generator that works out the small bumps
15:38:19 <supermop_home> or I wish there was an option to smooth things out a bit
15:38:48 <supermop_home> even just 'silt up the valley floor a bit'
15:38:58 <Wolf01> <supermop_home> I didn't even really think about newgrfs <- and that's the reason which make me trash the scenario and close the game after 2 hours of work
15:39:29 <supermop_home> raise valley floors one level so river can flow and maybe leave room for a road or rail
15:40:01 <Wolf01> Mmmh, more scenario tools, we have "plant random trees" we might have "make a random river" too
15:40:22 <Wolf01> Give me one or two years
15:40:27 <supermop_home> even with the bad current river generator that would help
15:40:43 <supermop_home> drawing river by hand is hard to make it look good
15:41:39 <Alberth> write a unbump routine :p
15:42:45 <Wolf01> IIRC Eddi told me he likes a tool to make rivers where you set the spring and the mouth, and it pathfinds the river, maybe a bit more realistic which even change in size while reaching the mouth
15:44:32 <milek7_> there wasn't some tool for importing riviers from GIS data?
15:50:49 <supermop_home> I should put transmitters on all the ridgelines so I can at least divide the map into basins and fix them one at a time
15:51:12 <supermop_home> Wolf01 i saw that, looks good
16:24:08 <peter1138> Bah, my train keeps emergency stopping :(
16:24:13 <peter1138> Maybe I'm missing a signal.
16:28:18 <supermop_home> yellow signal patch?
16:46:50 <peter1138> Nah, Train Simulator $current_year
16:47:28 <Eddi|zuHause> dead man switch?
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17:04:07 <__ln__> speaking of Train Simulator $current_year... the only(?) game controller it supports is the Xbox 360 controller, but the Xbox 360 controller is pretty awful for controlling things in TS. or am i just using it wrong?
17:04:48 <milek7_> i think any game controller is awful for controlling trains ;d
17:07:12 <Wolf01> Just don't use a steering wheel :D
17:07:48 <__ln__> those would be pretty cool, but are they supported by TS?
17:09:05 <Wolf01> The raildriver one says that is compatible with TS2017
17:09:44 <Wolf01> And almost every version of Trainz but TANE
17:23:00 <peter1138> __ln__, yeah, that's pretty stupid.
17:23:51 <peter1138> Just tried OpenRails as well. It's quite bad :(
17:25:47 <Wolf01> BTW it's a PITA to have 2 (or even more) controllers because some games support only a specific one... And I thought XBox One controller was compatible with games which supported the 360 one, but no...
17:29:59 <Wolf01> Anyway, I'm going out to shop for food and eat, BBL
17:44:35 <peter1138> There's a load of games that throw a wobbly with the steering wheel controller plugged in.
17:45:00 <peter1138> They expect unused controllers to centre, which doesn't happen for pedals.
17:56:26 <milek7_> peter1138: for free train simulator maybe try eu07
17:56:58 <milek7_> but it's not very intuitive to use ;d
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18:37:12 <andythenorth> Mail Car, Parcels Car, or Express Car?
19:06:51 <supermop_home> express isn't clear to non-rail people
19:07:02 <supermop_home> sounds like a passenger car for fast trains
19:07:20 <supermop_home> mail car is most tt-ish but idk
19:09:40 <andythenorth> I am adding an Armoured Car as well
19:09:51 <andythenorth> which refits mail, valuables, gold, diamonds etc
19:10:01 <andythenorth> original game has Mail Car
19:10:05 <andythenorth> or Mail Van rather :P
19:11:09 <andythenorth> probably stick with Mail Car in that case
19:11:18 <andythenorth> it carries loads of other stuff too though
19:12:11 <andythenorth> supermop: given these 3, which 2 do I pick, and which is the Mail Car, and which is Armoured Car?
19:13:35 <supermop_home> I love the utility van but it looks like something off a work train
19:13:54 <supermop_home> blue is armoured, IC livery is mail
19:14:48 <supermop_home> fewer windows is more sensible than a bunch of windows with grills
19:14:59 <supermop_home> bags of money don't care about the view
19:16:09 <supermop_home> forget the utility van
19:16:13 <andythenorth> so mail matches coach livery, armoured is solid CC?
19:16:27 <supermop_home> could be either
19:16:47 <supermop_home> in game mail gets color same as passenger,
19:16:47 <andythenorth> mail has windows, armoured doesn’t?
19:17:02 <andythenorth> any windows at all?
19:17:14 <supermop_home> or maybe one window, to see if it's ok to open the door?
19:17:34 <supermop_home> mail has indows because guys are in there sorting (in the old days)
19:18:14 <supermop_home> how do you feel about magic
19:18:20 <andythenorth> I wondered about adding a travelling post office coach
19:18:25 <andythenorth> and boosting mail payment :P
19:18:41 <supermop_home> whereby mail and armoured are freight colored unless in a rake with passengers
19:18:49 <andythenorth> yeah I could do that
19:18:56 <supermop_home> in which case they get livery similar to passengers
19:19:09 <andythenorth> I am nowhere near implementing that right now
19:19:18 <andythenorth> currently drawing the – views for the whole set
19:19:24 <andythenorth> and getting lengths right
19:19:31 <andythenorth> then I have to fill all the other views in ;P
19:19:54 <supermop_home> always found it odd that you set wagon colors based on what kind of locomotive they have rather than other way around
19:19:59 <supermop_home> in vanilla game
19:20:46 <supermop_home> I get that you might want more old timey colors on coaches behind a steam engine
19:21:00 * andythenorth thinks that colours per vehicle group would not actually be insane
19:21:09 <supermop_home> but I find i more often want freight locomotives colored differently
19:21:10 <andythenorth> nor is it going to cause many code dramas
19:21:20 <supermop_home> yeah i think just no one bothered yet
19:21:25 <supermop_home> i think lomo had it
19:21:47 <supermop_home> rct let you color roller coaster trains individually
19:22:27 <andythenorth> so…I have added ‘Special Passenger Cars’ which take up more space per passenger, but pay more
19:22:40 <andythenorth> and show sprites for buffet, sleeper, observation etc
19:22:47 <andythenorth> I could add ‘Special Mail Cars’ also
19:22:53 <supermop_home> but yeah, would be fun to set mail wagons to be red, then my floss 47 or whatever is red when pulling them
19:23:05 <supermop_home> without needing crazy livery magic
19:23:18 <andythenorth> colours UI is bonkers
19:24:02 <supermop_home> i feel like the strongest reason to not have 3cc is that selecting a 3rd color in the current ui would be miserable
19:24:26 <andythenorth> also lack of palette :D
19:30:05 <frosch123> andythenorth: no lack of palette
19:30:55 <andythenorth> there are loads of rarely-used colours for vehicles
19:31:01 <andythenorth> but I use them for PIL recolour ;)
19:32:40 <frosch123> i wouldn't even bother putting that in known_bugs.txt
19:33:10 <andythenorth> it’s totally accurate
19:33:23 <andythenorth> both the report, and the feature :)
19:33:24 <frosch123> if you can find a only mildly offensive reason to close it, go ahead :)
19:37:02 * andythenorth stuck on mail cars now
19:41:42 <frosch123> special cargo class for cargo that can be loaded/unloaded without stopping
19:42:02 <andythenorth> and some kind of magic station
19:46:14 <frosch123> nah, station is hardly visible
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19:49:05 * andythenorth needs a bear for coding
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21:33:59 <Wolf01> Back and stuffed with food
21:36:56 * andythenorth obsessing about trains
21:40:20 <Eddi|zuHause> what else is new?
21:44:06 <andythenorth> obsessing about ships?
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21:48:17 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: ‘special’ mail cars. Yes | No | Maybe
21:48:48 <andythenorth> some kind of payment bonus, and some shinier sprites
21:48:58 <andythenorth> at the cost of lower-capacity-per-unit-length
21:49:06 * andythenorth thinks it’s a daft idea
21:50:34 <y2000rtc> andythenorth: I tried to find some solution for my goal to have the same design of rails with different speed but I wasn't succes. Horrible to don't know how to do it.
21:51:01 <y2000rtc> How I can see you are only one of you to helping to each other. :)
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22:01:04 <Eddi|zuHause> just wanted to answer
22:01:48 <andythenorth> flappy connection :)
22:02:12 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think it's a feature you can easily leave out and nobody would ever think "i miss this feature"
22:03:00 <andythenorth> there has to be one of those per big release
22:03:07 <andythenorth> otherwise there’s nothing to regret
22:03:13 <andythenorth> not sure this is the right feature though
22:05:21 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean, even dining cars are there mostly for the emotional attachment and roleplaying part of the game, their overall gameplay effect is probably negligible
22:05:36 <Eddi|zuHause> like varying running cost depending on speed/acceleration
22:06:47 * andythenorth ignores the idea for now then
22:07:13 <andythenorth> it adds zero to gameplay, and sprites could be randomised for post office cars and so on
22:07:14 <Eddi|zuHause> "Architect and city planner Albert Speer jr. died aged 83"
22:07:59 <Eddi|zuHause> would this be newsworthy if it weren't for his father's involvement in the nazi government?
22:08:14 <andythenorth> the name is distinctive
22:08:22 <andythenorth> on a slow news day…it might
22:09:06 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it's not like there's the most boring election campaign ever going on...
22:09:22 <Eddi|zuHause> also some nonsense about boris johnson
22:09:45 <Eddi|zuHause> something political about syria
22:10:05 <Eddi|zuHause> and some sportsball
22:10:09 <andythenorth> ok so my mail car problem is just semantics now then
22:10:38 <Eddi|zuHause> sounds like a slow news day
22:10:38 <andythenorth> I want two options, one of which is more restrictively refittable
22:11:07 <andythenorth> one is mail, valuables-type cargos, express cargos
22:11:19 <andythenorth> the other is just mail and valuables-type cargos, and looks more secure
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22:11:55 <Eddi|zuHause> that distinction is probably useless
22:12:02 <andythenorth> it’s mostly for eye candy reasons
22:12:11 <andythenorth> nearly all IH wagons are for eye candy
22:12:46 <Eddi|zuHause> rather make a mail/express wagon and the other one valuables only
22:14:09 <Eddi|zuHause> i wonder if these catalans actually follow through on the referendum this time
22:15:40 <Eddi|zuHause> the catalans want to run a referendum about the independence, and the spanish government doesn't let them
22:16:49 <Eddi|zuHause> they tried one last year, but also the government prevented it, so they just had an "inofficial" vote
22:17:04 <andythenorth> I wanted to make them different types of wagon, instead of variants of same type
22:17:11 <NGC3982> doesnt calataonian conflicts have some history?
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22:17:39 <NGC3982> afaik that independence thing goes back to the 1400's or something like that.
22:18:25 <Eddi|zuHause> something like that, yes
22:19:34 <Eddi|zuHause> there was a marriage between the queen of castille and the king of aragon, or something, which formed the spain that we know today
22:19:34 <andythenorth> so Parcels Car (no windows) or Armoured Car (looks secure) or Secure Mail Car (which was a real thing in UK)
22:28:06 <andythenorth> Road Hog has Courier Trucks, which are like armoured mail trucks, but also carry other express cargos
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continue to next day ⏵
