IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-01-11
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03:22:43 <supermop_home> maybe I should have taken supermop_zuHause
03:24:07 <supermop_home> the pipe separator does look nice
03:27:43 <supermop_home> walked past a yard of Long Island Railroad switches on fire last night
03:28:27 <Eddi|zuHause> that does not sound healthy
03:29:22 <supermop_home> someone had posted an image of it in forums recently I recall
03:29:46 <supermop_home> was a freezing cold night with a lot of snow on the ground
03:48:33 <supermop_home> eddi, did ddr produce any cars other than trabbi for export?
03:49:23 <supermop_home> I was surprised athe the vareity of eastern bloc cars in Havana (thought it would all be Ladas...) but I saw no trabbis
03:50:24 <Eddi|zuHause> there were basically two east german cars, Trabant and Wartburg
03:50:57 <supermop_home> ooh, we never heard about wartburg in german class
03:51:18 <supermop_home> if I saw any of those in cuba I did not recognize them
03:51:25 <Eddi|zuHause> Trabant was the cheapest one, Wartburg was a bit more expensive
03:52:28 <supermop_home> some of these 50s wartburgs look really nice
03:52:57 <supermop_home> I like this green pickup:
03:53:44 <Eddi|zuHause> no idea if you could actually get that, looks customized
03:55:01 <supermop_home> the wrap over window on this is really nice, and the 2nd-tone stripe is nice, not in the typical shape that all other mid-50s two tone cars had
03:55:29 <Eddi|zuHause> the sad thing about east german cars was that the production line basically froze in the 60s. they designed new models each year, but they never went into production
03:55:41 <supermop_home> I did see a hacked together lada limousine with 6 doors
03:55:55 <Eddi|zuHause> until it was too late, and the factories could not survive the currency shock of the 90s
03:56:42 <supermop_home> Eddi|zuHause yeah bummer, I was wondering why the soviet bloc as a whole didn't aim to sell east german cars for export
03:57:16 <supermop_home> it seems like they could have been sucessful in the non-aligned world or even parts of the west
03:57:36 <Eddi|zuHause> that probably would have meant it would have been even more impossible to get a car in the east
03:58:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean, you had like 18 years waiting time towards the end, so some people enlisted their newborn kids, so they could have a car at their 18th birthday
03:59:06 <supermop_home> I also dont know enough about how the car factories were set up to understand how any profit from export would be distributed
03:59:28 <Eddi|zuHause> loads of things were produced for export
03:59:35 <supermop_home> but it seems if there was an export market, it would have been more palatable to raise the quota?
04:00:02 <Eddi|zuHause> like, ikea stuff and so on
04:01:02 <supermop_home> Eddi|zuHause yeah that's why I was so confused - it seemed to me that DDR would have been well situated to produce various consumer and specialist goods for export within and outside eastern bloc, so why not with cars
04:01:48 <supermop_home> and why could you buy a lada in the us back then but not an east german car
04:04:30 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't really know a lot about economy, but within the eastern bloc there were often dedicated production roles, so only one country was allowed to build trams and stuff
04:04:40 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe only one country was allowed to export cars
04:05:16 <supermop_home> you mentioned once that all the computers came from Russia?
04:05:33 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think i said that
04:06:14 <Eddi|zuHause> i might have said that i have leftovers from a crate where a (giant) computer was delivered to our university
04:11:38 <supermop_home> damn google photos thinks all these cortados are lattes
04:12:31 <supermop_home> it made a bunch of automatic albums categorized by the subject of the photo,
04:12:57 <supermop_home> but it has a bunch of pictures of a river as an album called lakes
04:13:17 <supermop_home> a picture of a cocktail as 'beer'
04:13:49 <supermop_home> and a picture of a subway entrance as a 'skyscraper'
04:14:48 <supermop_home> also a picture of a coffee in the 'trains' album
04:20:17 <supermop_home> would you recommend buying TF or civ 6?
04:23:46 <Eddi|zuHause> wait till civ6 is 50% or 75% off
04:26:37 <supermop_home> any particular reason to get it on steam versus just buying it on the website?
04:27:21 <Eddi|zuHause> ... if you want valve to get 30% of your money...
04:28:07 <Eddi|zuHause> (disclaimer: i don't know the actual value)
04:28:59 <supermop_home> hmm. what is steam workshop?
04:29:24 <Eddi|zuHause> place where people can publish mods
04:29:26 <supermop_home> if i can avoid steam annoying me by running all the time that's a positive in my book
04:29:48 <Eddi|zuHause> i think you need to activate it on steam regardless
04:32:31 <Eddi|zuHause> and if your only problem with steam is that it annoys you during the game, just disable the overlay
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15:21:14 <crem_> Indeed, decent morning.
15:28:04 <supermop> here it is warm and sunny compared to yesterday, so i'll count it as good
15:38:37 <Eddi|zuHause> here is grey and snowing
15:39:58 <Alkel_U3> here it's also gray but at least not -20 °C anymore
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17:47:14 <Lejving> anyone got any docks eyecandy they can share?
17:49:01 <Lejving> oh good I added isr/dwe objects to the map heh
17:51:06 <supermop> regular isr has a nice ship depot with no roof
17:51:32 <Lejving> ah crap can't change newgrf now it's on openttdcoop
17:51:44 <Lejving> gonna have to remember that for next time
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19:53:29 <supermop> bastardizing firs bits for depots
19:57:51 <supermop> i hope that s bend was built just for picturesque-ness
19:58:14 <V453000> andythenorth: gold ships?
19:58:36 <V453000> it's missing just slug bits
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19:58:52 <V453000> small tanker is pure art
19:59:27 <V453000> really nice shits overall
20:00:38 <andythenorth> I could make more like small tanker
20:00:46 <andythenorth> I could randomly composite bits of ships
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20:03:12 <supermop> random ships each play through
20:04:46 <Maraxus> anyone here have experience in solving "your computer is too slow to keep up with the server" problems?
20:05:14 <andythenorth> in my limited experience, it was the connection, not the computer
20:07:31 <V453000> I like the stripes on edibles tanker and fridge
20:07:34 <Maraxus> so dl speed/ping/some other thing?
20:07:52 <V453000> andythenorth: if the game has 3000 trains ... :)
20:09:33 <andythenorth> V453000: :o who’d do that?
20:09:59 <Maraxus> we would - we had a game with 5k trains
20:14:21 <frosch123> bandwidth is only relevant when joining a game
20:15:03 <V453000> that's the case I think
20:15:10 <Maraxus> how much do you need in general terms to join a game?
20:15:31 <frosch123> a bit more than the server :)
20:16:19 <frosch123> if you mean bandwidth for joining: that is actually also only relevant if the game is not paused for joining clients
20:17:14 <ephja> hills. hills everywhere :p
20:17:18 <andythenorth> in my case, I needed a connection that stayed up :P
20:18:29 <Maraxus> it is paused and I have no problem downloading the map, but moving around on the map is a slideshow until it disconnects
20:19:38 <Maraxus> so i5 2.4 ghz not enough?
20:20:24 <frosch123> or get a slower server :)
20:20:29 <frosch123> clients wait for the server
20:20:35 <frosch123> the server does not wait for clients
20:21:18 <frosch123> anyway, you should also check whether it's the game simulation or the drawing that takes the cpui
20:21:50 <frosch123> e.g. resize the game window to something considerably smaller
20:22:08 <frosch123> or try the other 8bpp/32bpp options
20:22:09 <V453000> u haz 32bpp or 8bpp on?
20:23:02 <andythenorth> I should just keep it
20:23:22 <andythenorth> Maraxus: disabled ‘full animation’?
20:27:07 <andythenorth> spanner / wrench / gear icon on main toolbar
20:27:38 <andythenorth> V453000: how about a complete baseset + grfs in false colour? o_O
20:28:09 <frosch123> basesets cannot enforce the violet smallmap schema
20:28:47 <Maraxus> full animation/detail are off
20:29:29 <frosch123> save the game locally, load it as singleplayer, stop all vehicles and check whether that makes a difference :)
20:46:00 <V453000> hm I have like 1 fps as well
20:46:08 <V453000> something is very wtf
20:46:43 <frosch123> did you setup silly orders again? :)
20:47:16 <V453000> I've never seen this amount of lag
20:48:11 <V453000> and it's not just spikes
20:48:29 <V453000> constant 1fps slideshow like maraxus says
20:48:35 <V453000> I remain connected, ok :D
20:48:58 <V453000> trying to disable 32bpp and shit
20:53:06 <V453000> some people on our server actually don't have problems
20:54:45 <V453000> in singleplayer I am kind of ok
20:55:54 <V453000> threads 0 and 2 are kind of busy but not 100% maxed
20:57:05 <Maraxus> runs fine in singleplayer for me
21:00:41 <frosch123> is it the public server?
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21:02:31 <frosch123> server is at 51% cpu
21:04:40 <andythenorth> Wolf01: seen the towtruck prelim image?
21:05:03 <frosch123> load some tanks onto the tanker
21:05:52 <andythenorth> frosch123: liquid tanks, or blowing things up tanks?
21:08:36 <andythenorth> Wolf01: see the teddy bear? o_O
21:08:56 <Wolf01> I hope it will make to the final version :D
21:13:09 <andythenorth> looks military, even if it’s azure blue :P
21:17:14 * andythenorth should add tow trucks to hog :P
21:21:20 <supermop> slugs were too much for andy
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21:30:29 <Wolf01> The transmitters seem to be really a problem
21:37:11 <andythenorth> and whether python is fast enough :P
21:41:25 <andythenorth> that game ran on a ~5 MIPS ARM 2 chip
21:42:51 <andythenorth> my laptop kicks around about 100k MIPS
21:42:56 <andythenorth> but python is slow eh? o_O
21:48:43 <frosch123> V453000: since when do you run logic trains at 2000 kmh?
21:48:59 <andythenorth> oh he wrote the same first program I did
21:50:33 <SpComb> andythenorth: what FPS does that run at, it doesn't look like 60fps :P
21:51:35 <frosch123> V453000: on third though, i think it's indeed just cpu power
21:52:00 <SpComb> I would guess that to be feasible in Python, especially if you're able to offload a reasonable amount of the pixel-pushing to pygame
21:52:14 <SpComb> like rendering individual sprites with some 3D transformations
21:52:48 <SpComb> ofc if you go into some kind of Python+OpenGL then even more so
21:54:53 <SpComb> wow, the pygame.org experience is really weird.. they have like three different web pages in one
21:56:53 <andythenorth> that game just ran on the CPU
21:57:21 * andythenorth wonders how hard it can be :P
21:57:53 <andythenorth> not sure how python draws to the screen though
21:58:49 <andythenorth> because I only currently know python
21:59:13 <andythenorth> I suspect it can’t be done
21:59:22 <SpComb> andythenorth: pygame can handle the actual pixel-pushing outside of Python
21:59:45 <andythenorth> an 8MHz CPU drawing directly to the screen buffer is probably faster than python on an i7 via everything my OS puts in between python and the screen :P
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22:03:29 <SpComb> need some 3D transform matrices
22:07:03 <andythenorth> I should probably do a polygon drawing tutorial :P
22:14:37 <andythenorth> it’s a lot of stuff :)
22:15:14 <andythenorth> oh it’s plastering bitmaps onto surfaces?
22:20:16 <V453000> frosch123: 2000kmh has been the standard speed for logic trains for us since we used them pretty much
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22:39:34 <ephja> is there a wiki article counter somewhere?
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23:01:11 <Eddi|zuHause> what would be the point of such a counter?
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23:01:35 <supermop> maybe it's a physical counter, like a help desk
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