IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2016-11-30
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00:00:29 <Wolf01> And you might be able to to VR too
00:03:18 <supermop> not an option on this site, so i'd have to buy elsewhere and deal with on board graphics until it arrives
00:03:39 <Wolf01> It's about 1/3 of the launch price
00:05:50 <Wolf01> On amazon is still about at 1/2
00:06:07 <Wolf01> Bot on third party sites you can find some interesting deals
00:06:56 <supermop> what the hell is a fase hdd bracket
00:07:33 <supermop> on an old desktop i just had a 3.5" hdd sitting loose inside a 5.25" bay
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00:58:21 <Eddi|zuHause> ghandi with nukes is pretty much a "it's not a bug, it's a feature"...
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01:30:14 <goodger> well they've pushed out five games with it included, so one can assume it's now intentional
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02:43:08 <goodger> was a bug in the original caused by an integer underflow iirc, and since then it's been intentional
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03:09:16 <Eddi|zuHause> it's technically still an overflow, even if it goes below 0
03:09:45 <Eddi|zuHause> underflow happens with floating point operations where values near 0 get treated as exactly 0
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13:00:32 <goodger> 'Ship 4 is lost' --- lies
13:01:43 <Eddi|zuHause> if you get "ship is lost" messages, you might want to change the pathfinder settings
13:02:54 <andythenorth> I need 150t ships
13:02:59 <andythenorth> I have 100t or 240t
13:03:08 <andythenorth> this is why ships are lame
13:03:58 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that's a problem
13:04:29 <andythenorth> with trains, you add wagons
13:04:39 <andythenorth> with RVs, 30t-40t is the correct size, and you just add more
13:05:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that's why i suggested ships with n*sqrt(2) size steps
13:06:49 <Eddi|zuHause> so k is fixed an n travels from 1..inf
13:07:09 <Eddi|zuHause> e.g. k=100 will give you 100t, 140t, 200t, ...
13:07:14 <V453000> so like 1, 1.41, 2, 2.8 ... ?
13:08:02 <andythenorth> the downside, it’s much work to make a 100t ship visually distinct from a 140t ship
13:08:09 <andythenorth> whilst still being clearly of same ‘type'
13:08:21 <Eddi|zuHause> just add pixels?
13:08:32 <Eddi|zuHause> make it a few pixels longer
13:18:07 <andythenorth> it will clip in depots
13:47:00 <Wolf01> Nice, other 2 games for free.. not new but remastered editions
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15:21:33 <andythenorth> something should be done :P
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17:37:10 <andythenorth> it is plausible that an industry tile check could pathfind to the map edge?
17:37:16 <andythenorth> in a reasonable time?
17:39:57 * andythenorth is trying to get a map where port-type industries are not trapped in enclosed seas
17:40:06 <andythenorth> generated about 50 maps so far
17:46:00 <Alberth> how do you do pathfinding in a newgrf?
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17:49:22 <andythenorth> this would be handled by openttd, it’s a variable
17:49:50 <andythenorth> for my case bool result would suffice, although they usually return a number (distance, count, whatever)
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18:04:10 <Alberth> worst case is a 4096^2 map, where the industry is in the center of the map, with water everywhere
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18:05:02 <andythenorth> probably pathological :P
18:09:20 <andythenorth> I probably just have to keep generating maps :P
18:10:36 <Alberth> dig a canal to fix the problem :p
18:11:11 <supermop_> ANDY DOESNT WANT INLANF BULK TERMINALS?
18:11:39 <andythenorth> maybe we could adjust map gen :P
18:11:45 <andythenorth> to not generate enclosed seas
18:12:03 <andythenorth> all tiles of height 0 must be contiguous
18:12:23 <SpComb^> yes, and there should be lakes at heights > 0
18:12:49 <andythenorth> $someone should fix map gen
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18:38:26 <andythenorth> Steeltown economy is a total PITA :D
18:38:32 <andythenorth> everything is connected
18:41:08 <supermop_> trump one bc of broken industry chains?
18:44:42 <andythenorth> to get ensp I need about 9 inputs
18:45:15 <andythenorth> this is by design, but it’s very different to ‘basic’ games I’ve been playing
18:45:49 <supermop_> well there is scope for something between 'basic' and 'extreme'
18:47:16 <supermop_> tons of supplies flowing out of ports makes basic economies a bit too easy to have gung ho everywhere
18:47:30 <supermop_> beyond what even IH can easily carry
18:48:05 <supermop_> s i usually make the gung ho level produce a bit less
18:53:27 <andythenorth> it’s pretty alpah though
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18:57:32 <andythenorth> that’s tropic :P
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19:27:41 <andythenorth> need a new climate
19:28:18 <supermop_> joshua tree caifornia
19:29:06 <supermop_> are you going to patch game to allow that?
19:29:44 <andythenorth> it could be done with a base set I guess
19:29:56 <andythenorth> would need a new snow transition tile
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19:42:42 <supermop_> then your desert would need to be grass
20:03:37 <andythenorth> such industries need drawing
20:03:50 <andythenorth> basic oxygen plant, galvanising plant, slag grinding mill
20:03:56 <andythenorth> electric arc furnace
20:04:36 <andythenorth> shipyard, ore terminal
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20:10:11 <andythenorth> so much newgrf to do :P
20:12:04 <supermop_> The terracotta block and shading makes it looks somehow too british?
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20:20:11 <frosch123> i like the cement plant
20:21:17 <frosch123> also, apparently i never played basic temperate
20:21:30 <andythenorth> basic temperate is probably the nicest
20:21:40 <andythenorth> it’s like an upgraded default game
20:21:59 <frosch123> i know for sure that i never played extreme, but some of the industries that only appear in basic temperate look very unfamilar to me :)
20:24:20 <andythenorth> hmm, I could automate the industry graphics
20:24:31 <andythenorth> I could write a sprite-comping routine in PIL
20:24:43 <andythenorth> someone will now post the XKCD
20:36:40 <frosch123> i think we discussed automating them before
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20:36:52 <frosch123> do you still have the white.grf?
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20:52:04 <andythenorth> ach, ship capacities
20:52:25 * andythenorth considers a ‘load factor’ refit option +/-25%
20:52:32 <andythenorth> even though subtypes suck
21:02:47 <andythenorth> ach station refits can’t handle subtypes :P
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21:03:32 <andythenorth> shame, I already had an implementation for ship refittable capacity
21:03:39 <andythenorth> but I never use depot refit
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21:16:01 <Eddi|zuHause> just add a parameter to disable size refits, for people who want to use depot refits
21:16:38 <Eddi|zuHause> and depot refits should work, as long as all cargos have the same subtypes with the same name in the same order
21:20:29 <andythenorth> it’s station refits that aren’t supported
21:20:43 <andythenorth> they simply have no UI for subtypes
21:21:09 <supermop_> FULL SCREEN ORDERS GUI
21:22:41 <andythenorth> station refit defaults to first subtype
21:22:53 <Eddi|zuHause> uhm, that sounds wrong
21:23:27 <Eddi|zuHause> it should keep the subtype, like all the other features
21:23:57 <andythenorth> and what’s the default subtype of a vehicle? o_O
21:24:04 <andythenorth> …the first one :)
21:24:31 <Eddi|zuHause> well, you can change the default in the depot, and if you clone, it should also keep the subtype...
21:24:43 <andythenorth> but that’s not how I play, so eh :P
21:24:49 <andythenorth> I never use depot refit, it’s a waste of time
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21:25:35 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_: for the gui, it's an unsolvable problem, because more than one vehicle type can share orders, and they might not all have the same subtype, and you can autoreplace and stuff, which would also invalidate the order
21:25:56 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i think you're having too specific of a use case in mind
21:26:51 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: of course, you could try to implement refitting direcly from the purchase menu ("there's a patch for that")
21:27:12 <supermop_> what is the use case here anyway
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21:28:42 <andythenorth> should I get a more vague use case? :P
21:28:55 <andythenorth> that sounds like a successful strategy ;)
21:29:55 <andythenorth> the deficiency I see is that station refit is crippled :)
21:30:00 <andythenorth> ok, so it’s already broken anyway
21:30:11 <andythenorth> but what’s the rationale for crippling it as well?
21:30:52 <andythenorth> I’ll ignore the silent breaking of orders, because eh, it’s not important :)
21:38:42 <andythenorth> maybe I could patch the station refit
21:40:36 <andythenorth> maybe I could have a nap :)
21:48:22 <__ln__> does "Abendkasse" have anything to do with Abend per se?
21:48:39 <andythenorth> Alberth: sleep-patching? o_O
21:48:55 <Alberth> dreaming about patching, perhaps :)
21:49:32 <Alberth> sleep-patching seems quite difficult to me
21:49:58 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: it's generally assumed that concerts are in the evening, and the "abendkasse" thus is the place where you buy tickets directly before the concert
21:51:15 <Alberth> so, the answer is "yes" :p
21:51:32 <__ln__> looking at tickets to something that starts at 11am, and Abendkasse in that context sounded a bit weird
21:56:10 <Eddi|zuHause> the answer is "yes, but nobody cared about the exceptions enough to change it"
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22:45:12 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: like the exception that buses don't actually run on tracks (bahn)
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22:46:05 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: well, you have a "Busbahnhof", but no "Busbahn" actually goes there...
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