IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2015-11-06
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00:40:13 <greeter> that looks like a puzzle of some sort
00:45:23 <Wolf01> it is, at least the code part...
00:45:31 <greeter> oh? you're coding this?
00:46:58 <greeter> sweet. what language?
00:52:19 <glx> and the icon looks like it's MFC
00:54:28 <Wolf01> i'm learning some basic things and i plan to switch to unity in future
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01:04:42 <drac_boy> so I thought the tram idea seem like a good one for mixed town/country rails then I realized I didn't think of one silly snag...the doors are often only on one side so...oh well scratch that idea :-> (at least I'm still doing a little bit of work at times on my computer grf pixels so ehh)
01:04:48 <drac_boy> hi wolf and greeter, hows you two?
01:05:07 <greeter> i'm doing alright. you?
01:07:29 * drac_boy throws a pillow at greeter then
01:07:47 <greeter> hmm? what was that for?
01:10:26 <drac_boy> who said sleeping was boring? but nevermind that anyhow
01:10:34 <drac_boy> what you doing atm yourself greeter?
01:10:50 <greeter> i'm working on a scenario that i hope to publish to the openttd forums at some point
01:17:16 <greeter> i guess. could have done a better job cropping the height map i used, which itself wasn't all that great to begin with. meh
01:19:22 <greeter> basically i decided it would be easier if i just made everything flat, and add hills as necessary lol
01:20:46 <greeter> it's sub arctic so hills are the only ways to get forests. oh well
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01:23:21 <drac_boy> funny re you mentioning arctic...I may have to buy a bit of modeller's snow later :->
01:33:39 <greeter> that looks very realistic
01:34:53 <greeter> hmm, i just googled a place name i want to add to the scenario, and apparently the postal code there starts with B0T, wonder how many B0Ts will wind up playing the scenario
01:38:27 <drac_boy> heh well its a real model locomotive .. not the often-usual cheap usa plastic ones
01:38:38 <drac_boy> greeter..heh I dunno :)
01:39:42 <greeter> there seemed to be something about it which indicated to me that it was a higher quality than most models. knowing nothing about models or trains though i really couldn't say what tipped me off though
01:42:42 <drac_boy> almost no detail and hey wheres the handrails at all
01:43:46 <greeter> even i can tell there's a definite difference
01:45:15 <drac_boy> a lot of them come 'factory' but sometimes you can buy ones that are already painted for you too (weathering usually still has to be done by the customers themself tho)
01:45:24 <drac_boy> these brass stuff cost big $ tho
01:47:24 <FLHerne> You Americans have it much harder with all those fiddly pipes
01:47:41 <FLHerne> British locos tend to have them all hidden away
01:48:01 <Eddi|zuHause> german locos have all that stuff visible
01:48:06 <greeter> i don't know much about trains like i say. not my stock and trade
01:49:27 <greeter> i might be the guy someday who wires the train for electricity, but that'd be all i'd have to do with it
01:49:53 <drac_boy> flherne..its actually easier on the contrast...
01:50:22 <FLHerne> drac_boy: That brass model looks a *** to paint though
01:50:23 <drac_boy> the 3-cylinder steam that alco built .. some railroads managed to rebuilt them into 2-cylinder outside the depression year due to the frequent mechanical access issues with the center cylinder
01:50:39 <drac_boy> ah..model painting..yeah...I agree with that :-s
01:51:28 <drac_boy> btw a few railroads did try rebuild wreck-damaged locomotives into "british style" but more than often they were scrapped before WWII or got rebuilt with more conventional pumps/etc on the sides
01:51:53 <drac_boy> one of the main problem with the 'british style' was lack of running boards
01:53:22 <drac_boy> eddi I dunno if its just me or not but there was something I still wonder about german steam locomotives....in runby photos they almost always seem to be pouring steam out of the cylinder bottom cocks nonstop
01:53:34 <drac_boy> let me see if I can find one example again now
01:54:25 <greeter> sometimes real places are a lousy basis for a scenario lol
01:54:49 <Eddi|zuHause> i have not understood any of those words.
01:56:26 <greeter> i have plenty of towns but, as in the place this is based off of, they tend to be highly concentrated in some areas and totally absent from others
02:01:33 <greeter> hmm, and sometimes i'm missing info too. the last population figures i can find from this town come from the 1931 census, sure it'll be fine if the info is only 84 years out of date :-P
02:03:47 <greeter> with any luck this scenario won't be horribly panned by critics lol
02:05:10 <drac_boy> say greeter I was thinking about the german photos I found then realized I may know something a bit different for you ... you want see a steam locomotive that has smoke coming "from somewhere else other than near the front of boilertop"? :)
02:07:19 <greeter> hmm, i somehow like the look of that train better
02:07:24 <drac_boy> it was a modest feedwater preheat system (using exhaust's heat) .. worked well on some locomotives and netted no gains on other (such as the britian 9F's that were modified with these)
02:07:42 <drac_boy> thats why the smoke is off the side near cab instead of at front
02:08:48 <drac_boy> a bit too much smoke in front of the engineer/driver there tho heheh
02:09:49 <drac_boy> looks like a big can slapped onto the side :)
02:10:08 <drac_boy> and I guess the piston-to-preheater piping is more visible too
02:12:22 <greeter> looks really old. any chance that was taken in pennsylvania?
02:13:57 <drac_boy> nope .. across usa but mainly around mid-west ... Southern Pacific apparently had issues with long tunnels sitting on grade so since they were oil-fired anyway the solution was to simply turn the locomotive itself around and run it cabforward (hence the official nickname for them being that)
02:14:31 <drac_boy> doubleheading still meant the second crew got a lot of carbon into their face .. but ehh I dunno about the truth behind cab conditions tho
02:16:32 <drac_boy> anyhow I'm going for a bit now...have fun with your scenario map allright? :)
02:33:57 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm afraid i have no clue about that part of steam engine technology
02:34:23 <greeter> hmm well you're a step ahead of me then probably :-P
02:34:37 <greeter> course i'm of the opinion that all trains should be electric :-P
03:22:45 <Eddi|zuHause> you're in luck then, germany has had extensive electric networks for over a century now
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04:47:52 <greeter> wish we could say that here in canada
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05:47:55 <greeter> ok maybe this map is too big. in real life it takes 2 hours to drive between these two cities at 110 kilometers per hour. it took a train at 88 almost 6 months :-S
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06:01:42 <Supercheese> Time... is an illusion. Especially in OTTD
06:02:03 <Supercheese> Does anybody really know what time it is? / Does anybody really care?
06:03:10 <greeter> still in real life, i could walk that distance in 18 days just by traveling at 10 kilometers per day, so it's throwing me off for scenario testing :-S
06:04:17 <greeter> maybe my scenario is a bad idea
06:09:34 <Supercheese> your scenario is probably fine; just ignore all timescales and have fun with it
06:11:33 <greeter> hmm, i'm trying to. testing is brutal though. i can't seem to get a start with it at all
06:11:46 <greeter> but maybe it's just me. i'm trying to start with trains but i'm more used to starting with ships
06:14:30 <greeter> only other thing i can think of is that i was too realistic in this. it's one of the poorest parts of canada. maybe the scenario is extra tough because making a living in real life is extra tough :-P
06:45:13 <greeter> finally figured out where to start. hmm, maybe i should post it to the forums now and ask something like "where on earth did i screw up so badly?"
06:49:49 <greeter> really? hmm, maybe so
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09:27:01 <MeSaber> good morning openttd nerds =)
09:27:35 <MeSaber> lulz hi master nerd st2 :D
09:28:07 <MeSaber> waking up and doing the standard openttd routine
09:28:16 <MeSaber> build a train, crash it, go back to sleep :D
09:28:45 <ST2> that's a way of starting a day ^^
09:29:39 <MeSaber> it gets you going knowing ure still alive though pepz died on that train and you didnt :D
09:29:49 <MeSaber> making you feel special
09:30:51 <ST2> dnt mind, MeSaber tests some stuff in ttd to see if will work on rl :P
09:31:18 <MeSaber> in real life i dont sit in trains
09:31:30 <MeSaber> knowing how badly someone could pilot em from my url experience :D
09:32:03 <ST2> can be a "MeSaber"'s driving it
09:32:32 <MeSaber> ive thought of being a loco driver but i would just play openttd meanwhile driving and that would result in troubles i guess
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09:53:03 <Wolf01> i can't understand why "simple x tutorial"s don't take in account you know little to nothing about "x"
09:56:10 <MeSaber> what tutorial would that be wolf01
10:01:00 <Alberth> simple rocket-to-the-moon tutorial
10:01:48 <Alberth> but, quite likely, the tutorial wouldn't be simple anymore if they would explain all about x?
10:03:24 <Alberth> ie they aim for a quick and simple "it works" rather than actually understanding what you're doing :)
10:05:00 <Wolf01> if the tutorial starts with "download cs-sdl and add the following namespaces on the top of your code" without telling you you need to copy the dlls to your working folder (as you won't find anything in the references)
10:11:13 <Alberth> that would be in a simple how-to-add-to-my-compiler tutorial?
10:12:16 <Wolf01> since everything i used since now must be added in a different way, i expect they to say how to add their stuff to your project
10:13:45 <Wolf01> if they don't want to provide the headers or the dllimports, at least leave a link to documentation
10:14:14 <Wolf01> how can i know the method names and their parameters?
10:16:12 <Alberth> seems quite tricky indeed
10:17:08 <Wolf01> i can't even install the sdl2 from the packet manager, i'm using a too recent version of .net framework -.-
10:17:30 <Wolf01> i should migrate to unity right now
10:19:32 <Wolf01> bah, the one who could help me with unity doesn't come until evening, and this evening i'm busy
11:01:14 <Wolf01> finding a tutorial for sdl for .net 4.5
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13:11:54 <Eddi|zuHause> i totally hate tutorials that leave out essential steps like that
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13:57:26 <ychaouche> Can't find gameplay PDF (or user manual). Any hints ?
13:59:37 <Eddi|zuHause> or there's a tutorial in downloadable content
14:00:46 <Wolf01> ok, right now i have 10 dumb AI tanks roaming in the map, collisions work almost as expected, FPS seem stable, memory is stable... time to switch to a better graphics system, maybe DX11 as i can't find decent SDL tutorials
14:03:26 <ychaouche> Eddi|zuHause: I am reading the tutorial, had no luck finding how do I mass clone whole group ?
14:03:34 <ychaouche> then get rid of old group
14:03:53 <Eddi|zuHause> not sure what you mean
14:03:57 <ychaouche> what I'm doing now is sending all vehicles to depot, then clone one by one then sell old vehicles
14:04:30 <ychaouche> when vehicles get old, I want to mass replace them.
14:05:06 <ychaouche> I also want new vehicles to have exactly the same instructions as the ones they're replacing.
14:05:51 <ychaouche> Eddi|zuHause: that's when a new bus type arrives
14:05:58 <ychaouche> but suppose I want same buses.
14:07:03 * ychaouche checks what version of openttd he has
14:07:37 <Eddi|zuHause> that is really really ancient
14:08:10 <ychaouche> so this kind of setting is to be done in a configuration file ?
14:08:31 <Eddi|zuHause> it should be in the "advanced" settings
14:09:47 <Alberth> but not in basic category(?)
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14:13:34 <ychaouche> Found the autorenew feature in the advanced menu in the startup screen
14:13:37 <ychaouche> thanks Eddi|zuHause
14:13:47 <ychaouche> I'll try to build the latest version of openttd
14:14:46 <Eddi|zuHause> note that changing it in the startup screen will not affect your savegame, you have to change it after loading the savegame as well (in the wrench menu)
14:15:37 <ychaouche> ah thanks for the heads up
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15:29:20 <Wolf01> tutorials like this are shit, as you can't even start
15:29:38 <Alberth> ie the canvas you draw on
15:29:57 <Wolf01> yes it is, until now i used the form
15:30:28 <Alberth> you can vote on helpfulness :p
15:31:35 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: if "Device" is a data type, there's bound to be documentation about it
15:32:34 <Wolf01> but it's not so helpful
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15:34:13 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: that is the constructor, not the data type
15:35:03 <Wolf01> maybe i'm not using the right project type, so why not tell me which one to use? if not MFC maybe it could be MPF
15:38:27 <Wolf01> there isn't that class on my referenced assembly, they were just "pick one of the versions" (i chose the last one), now i added everything i found from the first one and "oh, there is it" so it's version specific
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15:40:03 <Wolf01> now i added direct3d, directsound, directdraw, directinput all by hand, because "just add the single directx.dll" doesn't seem to work
15:40:42 <Wolf01> and every folder has different dlls inside
15:41:09 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe you didn't install the directx SDK properly?
15:41:21 <Wolf01> so it's a game of "get your version straight"
15:42:01 <Wolf01> yes i did, but with 12 directx folders with just different build number, which is the right one?
15:42:29 <Wolf01> it's not the last, so it must be the first
15:43:18 <Wolf01> tutorials that thinks you start to develop with a fresh and clean pc, so only their thing is installed
15:43:23 <Eddi|zuHause> that doesn't make any sense
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16:29:48 <Wolf01> nice, as soon as i import the directx namespace, my application stops working
16:30:50 <Eddi|zuHause> have you considered starting from a clean slate (like a vm), and follow the tutorial by the letter?
16:31:17 <Wolf01> the tutorial starts but shows nothing
16:31:58 <Wolf01> in my application i imported the namespaces and put just the Device device = null; in the global variables and stops working
16:34:42 <Eddi|zuHause> then you possibly shadowed another "device" variable, that was necessary
16:35:25 <Wolf01> it should tell me, as it always does when it happens
16:39:00 <Wolf01> also removing the variable and the namespaces doesn't work, the application is broken... luckily i have a backup of the sources
16:41:36 <Wolf01> as i'm just experimenting, a .zip backup is enough, when i'll start to get more serious i'll restart from scratch with version control too
16:47:23 <Wolf01> the tutorial from the SDK crashes directly
16:50:53 <Alberth> it's called directx for a reason :p
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18:45:21 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27437 trunk/src/lang/spanish.txt (2015-11-06 18:45:09 +0100 )
18:45:22 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:23 <DorpsGek> spanish - 3 changes by SilverSurferZzZ
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21:16:05 * drac_boy gives greeter more pixelated groundtiles to play with? :)
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