IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2015-04-29
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01:07:34 <kamnet> People who are too afraid to download from the Internet, but not too afraid to order online from Amazon?
01:11:36 <FLHerne> Doing that might get someone to ask awkward questions about the origins of early OTTD?
01:13:21 <FLHerne> OTOH, if anyone cared they'd probably have cared before now
01:19:26 <Supercheese> Herr Sawyer himself seems pretty chill about OTTD
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01:52:11 <kamnet> I don't know about chill, but at least sees there's nothing to be gained by attempting to squash it.
02:01:47 <Supercheese> Forecast: Cloudy with a chance of pineapples
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05:20:54 <Flygon> Accidentally erase natural river
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06:19:29 <Flygon> Is there any GRFs that basically acts as a 'blank' tile?
06:19:34 <Flygon> As in, adding an object
06:19:44 <Flygon> Say I don't want a median strip to have houses in it
06:21:09 <Supercheese> probably also on Bananas, checkin
06:21:12 <Flygon> Yeah, was looking around, just found that one myself
06:21:15 <Flygon> Thanks a tonne, man :3
06:21:53 <Supercheese> yeah seems to be called EmptyGRF on fruits
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11:05:36 <Flygon> Has Waypoints for Roads ever been requested?
11:09:02 <Johnnei> It is listed on the wiki as a requested feature. Note: One can use "go via" orders on drive through road stops instead since r12689
11:09:55 <Flygon> Not exactly very elegant
11:09:57 <Flygon> But, I lack any choice
11:10:20 <Johnnei> The feature request isn't listed as closed, so I think the note just means to use it as work around until someone makes them
11:10:52 <Flygon> It's an open source project
11:10:58 <Flygon> I'll place my bets on "Glacial" :P
11:13:59 <Johnnei> Ha :p I guess the devs just prefer to work on other stuff when there is a viable work around available
11:14:54 <Flygon> Viable? It's uuugly :P
11:14:59 <Flygon> And looks stupid on the setup I got :P
11:19:38 <Johnnei> -kuch- looks wonderful -kuch-
11:20:13 <Flygon> It might look good, but without waypoints
11:20:18 <Flygon> The buses will go to the wrong place
11:20:58 <Johnnei> My looks wonderful was supposed to be sarcastic :p
11:22:03 <Johnnei> It works though, and that's why they probably don't give priority to road waypoints :p
11:25:07 <Flygon> Oh, that's without waypoints
11:25:34 <Flygon> The double stops are to account for future growth and me invariably solving it with punching in more stops
11:29:15 <Flygon> It'd have multiple names x.x
11:29:43 <Flygon> Part of the issue (with rail also) is the inability to waypoint on anything but a flat land straight
11:29:47 <Flygon> No diagonals, no slopes
11:34:12 <Johnnei> You could consider to write out a forum post requesting the feature and explaining it in full detail, maybe one of the community devs picks it up.
11:35:16 <Flygon> I don't wanna be that whiny idiot that complains everything's wrong and that it's not perfect
11:38:56 <Flygon> I think I took Railbus too literally...
11:39:11 * Flygon has been using railbuses to run as buses <_>
11:41:58 <Johnnei> well... if it works xD
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12:01:10 <Eddi|zuHause> you can just make waypoints with "go via" orders. what's the problem?
12:16:15 <argoneus> just like make train
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14:43:52 <kamnet> Road waypoints have been requested on the forums a few times, hence the avility to now use road stations as a waypoint. And, really, all a train waypoint is, is a station that you can't stop at (which is another requested feature).
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15:36:47 <Eddi|zuHause> IMHO, waypoints should be on tile borders, so they take up no space
15:37:18 <Eddi|zuHause> and are freely combinable with signals and junctions
15:37:56 <Eddi|zuHause> then they would also make enough sense for road vehicles to be coded
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16:38:17 <argoneus> can't you make waypoints not be an actual object
16:39:35 <Eddi|zuHause> argoneus: that is pretty difficult, as you need free space to store the waypoint for any tile you might want to put it on (road, rail, station, ...)
16:39:58 <Eddi|zuHause> also, graphics...
16:40:15 <argoneus> graphics wise it could be just a text bubble like from signs
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17:14:49 <tyteen4a03> are there any ways of improving game performance when the connection between the client and the server is slow?
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17:41:52 <Alberth> play with fewer people, or if you mean the pause during map download, play with a smaller map
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19:07:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i hereby conclude that the kerbal space program demo is completely broken...
19:08:30 <frosch123> maybe demos are like readmes
19:08:41 <frosch123> noone expects they are used
19:08:42 <Wolf01> I concluded it now costs more and I should have purchased it in beta
19:10:41 <Eddi|zuHause> there's a -25% sale
19:10:54 <Eddi|zuHause> which, as i understand it, is basically the beta price
19:10:55 <Wolf01> still more than the beta
19:11:49 <Wolf01> at least in euro tier 2
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20:20:59 <Rubidium> (is it completely broken?)
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20:21:38 <Rubidium> I changed some settings and then I could see the vehicle building
20:21:52 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: i tried the rocket building tutorial, and i can't attach a fuel tank to the pod
20:22:15 <Rubidium> works for me, after messing with the settings
20:22:29 <Eddi|zuHause> then clear me up. which settings?
20:22:34 <Rubidium> as I couldn't see anything; I think I messed with opacity
20:22:48 <Eddi|zuHause> i can see the pod and the fuel tank
20:22:53 <Eddi|zuHause> they just won't attach
20:24:27 <Eddi|zuHause> i downloaded the demo throug steam
20:24:37 <Rubidium> I just got some zip download
20:34:11 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: The demo works for me
20:34:56 <FLHerne> But is incredibly lacking in features compared to the current paid version, being pretty much [some early alpha] with restrictions
20:35:19 <FLHerne> On the flipside, it#s actually _playable_ on my ancient laptop
20:35:39 <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: "works for me" is not helpful
20:36:31 <frosch123> it tries to send you a message
20:39:26 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: Can you see the green nodes on the pod and fuel tank when hovering one near the other?
20:40:01 <Eddi|zuHause> but once i did something to flip stuff around, and a green spot appeared very far away
20:40:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i couldn't reproduce that though
20:40:55 <FLHerne> So you bought a capsule, and a fuel tank?
20:43:54 <FLHerne> If you bought a [not-capsule] and then tried to stick a fuel tank onto it, it wouldn't work
20:44:25 <FLHerne> Because you can only attach things to the section of rocket that's built onto the capsule
20:45:08 <FLHerne> Ah - if you have *two* capsules, you can only attach things to the first one
20:45:24 <FLHerne> Maybe you bought one early and managed to hide it in a corner?
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20:57:21 <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: i literally just clicked through the tutorial
20:57:58 <FLHerne> I don't think I ever saw the tutorial
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20:58:23 * FLHerne clicks through tutorial to see
20:59:57 <FLHerne> In continued uselessness, it still Works for Me™
21:04:21 <FLHerne> Maybe you should ask the semi-official KSP folks in irc://irc.esper.net/#KSPOfficial
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21:30:02 <Johnnei> How can I verify that noone is working on a bug ticket (task?) and is submitting a patch just commenting the file to the ticket?
21:31:16 <frosch123> we don't believe in plans to work on something
21:31:39 <frosch123> usually it is safe to assume that noone is working on a ticket
21:32:05 <frosch123> but if you get some partial results in makes sense to post partial updates to flyspray
21:32:40 <frosch123> i..e don't hide for two weeks while working on something
21:33:23 <frosch123> but rather post a partial thing after you worked on something for one or two evenings
21:35:14 <Johnnei> Alright, Thanks. Was wondering as almost all tickets seemed to either be new or closed :D
21:51:14 <glx> if it's an OSX bug, almost nobody works on them ;)
21:51:41 <andythenorth> fonso closed some
21:52:35 * andythenorth is considering switching to OpenTTD on linux
21:52:51 <andythenorth> OS X port is ~unusable
21:53:21 <andythenorth> dunno if running it in a VM will work any better though
21:53:32 <andythenorth> tried it on a Windows VM, unusable
21:54:53 <Johnnei> I can run windows and linux (esxi based server in my house :D), not sure if I can emulate OSX on it properly though... besides that I don't have any experience with objective c xD
21:55:23 <frosch123> i believe there are more windows bugs than osx bugs meanwhile
21:55:44 <frosch123> though likely both are outmatched by the generic bugs :)
21:56:07 <andythenorth> maybe I should make this mac boot native linux
21:56:10 <andythenorth> and run OS X in a VM :P
21:58:30 <Taede> does mean you have to reboot a lot
21:59:09 <andythenorth> change 1 pixel of a sprite in photoshop
21:59:09 <__ln__> what's unusable about the OS X port?
21:59:22 <andythenorth> compile, reboot linux, test, reboot OS X :P
21:59:33 <Taede> you can mitigate some of it with a linux vm for quick tests before rebooting into linux
22:00:13 <andythenorth> OS X port issues: (1) ffwd doesn’t (2) cursor lags (3) game lags with [some condition of having vehicle windows open that I haven’t pinned down reliably yet]
22:00:28 <andythenorth> (4) animation has to be off (5) switching animation on/off covers the screen in black squares
22:00:57 <peter1138> (1) Stop OS X being slow :S
22:01:06 <peter1138> (2) Stop OS X being slow
22:01:12 <peter1138> (3) Stop OS X being slow
22:01:16 <peter1138> (4) Stop OS X being slow
22:01:24 <peter1138> (5) Something else.
22:01:35 <andythenorth> yeah, OS X changed something
22:01:48 <andythenorth> ffwd used to be unusable due to being stupidly fast, until some time in 2014
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22:03:12 <__ln__> frosch123: umm, not all the time, but once in two months surely
22:03:43 <andythenorth> it might even just be my mac
22:04:07 <andythenorth> think it’s just me left using OS X though, nobody else afaik
22:04:22 <__ln__> andythenorth: how much memory does it have?
22:05:39 <andythenorth> it goes in swap sometimes
22:22:08 <glx> maybe OSX needs a new video driver again
22:23:58 <andythenorth> I have tried switching the various blitters
22:24:22 <andythenorth> no meaningful effect, on subjective performance (hold down ffwd for one minute, count game time)
22:25:31 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: it's not as funny as when they overpainted a door red and a wall white, to make it look like a door
22:26:19 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: but i always wonder how they come up with the 5-digit numbers in "damages" that they claim
22:26:21 <frosch123> ah, i remember that :)
22:26:58 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: what do you think what an hour of a train mechanic costs?
22:27:12 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: three digits.
22:27:27 <Eddi|zuHause> times two digit hours, makes 4 digits
22:27:32 <Eddi|zuHause> where does the other digit come from?
22:28:55 <frosch123> the other day a coworker told me when he made a trainee thinging at a s bahn company
22:29:18 <frosch123> one day they had to measure how long it takes to perform a standard maintenance procedure
22:29:57 <frosch123> he was assigned a simple task with the words to not even consider being done before the other day
22:31:07 <Eddi|zuHause> well, surely there's bureaucratic nonsense in there.
22:31:23 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: you also have to aacount for the time the train needs to move to the factory
22:31:30 <frosch123> and that on that day another trains has to drive
22:32:20 <Eddi|zuHause> but the railway has special drivers that all day long only drive trains from station to yard and back
22:36:42 <andythenorth> if they just drive from station to yard and back
22:36:46 <andythenorth> why not stay in the station?
22:38:14 <Eddi|zuHause> space restrictions, i guess :p
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