IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2014-09-02
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04:48:56 <LSky`> Anyone have a clue as to what could be happening here?
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05:52:33 <Rubidium> LSky`: sounds like a case of 'I have this nice patch pack, but want it to be able to join stable servers so I mess with the version' and/or 'I have this nice deep packet inspection firewall that messes around with my packets'
05:56:05 <Rubidium> LSky`: it's most likely the first case though
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07:39:01 <LordAro> Rubidium, the guy claims he's running standard stable, is there a way to force a crash log to prove otherwise?
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09:08:12 <DorpsGek> LordAro: I have not seen DorpsGek.
09:14:01 <planetmaker> LordAro, as that's supposedly a release build, it's hard. But one might try alt+0 for a self-compiled one
09:14:46 <planetmaker> but that only crashes in debug builds
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10:12:44 <peter1138> 9422.028635] scsi 11:0:0:0: Direct-Access WD My Passport 0820 1012 PQ: 0 ANSI: 6
10:12:47 <peter1138> [ 9422.029006] scsi 11:0:0:1: Enclosure WD SES Device 1012 PQ: 0 ANSI: 6
10:12:55 <peter1138> the enclosure has a scsi id... o_O
10:13:54 <peter1138> does not support smart, heh
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11:11:14 <Eddi|zuHause> only if compiled as a debug build :p
11:11:46 <Eddi|zuHause> re: <LordAro> Rubidium, the guy claims he's running standard stable, is there a way to force a crash log to prove otherwise?
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16:36:28 <Rubidium> LordAro: run a server, let him join and look at the error (Dnet=1 (or more) on the console of the server
16:40:35 <Rubidium> though that doesn't tell you about the proof
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17:37:03 <planetmaker> would it help, if we reset founder information of industries to game-founded when a company closes? Or change ownership when two companies merge?
17:37:13 <planetmaker> or is that weired when they change colour and looks?
17:41:48 <Wolf01> I didn't even noticed that player founded industries had those informations, so for me it doesn't matter :P
17:42:32 <planetmaker> there usually is no such indicator :)
17:43:11 <planetmaker> it's just some information stored in the map array without being used, sometimes to display some company colour in the industries. I know of no other usage anywhere
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17:51:03 <DorpsGek> DanMacK: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 12 hours, 2 minutes, and 4 seconds ago: <andythenorth> not funny
17:52:00 <planetmaker> chance are that he'll immediately show up, once you log-out, DanMacK :)
17:52:20 <DanMacK> of course he will lol
17:52:22 <planetmaker> he'll then query when you've been seen last, too
17:52:46 <planetmaker> it's a well-established recurring pattern :P
17:57:05 <frosch123> planetmaker: newgrf just use the colour iirc
17:57:28 <frosch123> iirc there are even two variables per industries: company id of founder, and colour at the time of being founded
17:57:40 <frosch123> also iirc the founder information is not used at all, but only the colour
17:57:50 <planetmaker> yeah, might be...
17:58:21 <planetmaker> hm... FIRS uses founder information for 'can be built' check. But that's before the industry's existence
17:59:13 <frosch123> ChangeTileOwner_Industry <- oh, it is actually updated
18:00:01 <frosch123> ah, i confused it with the "owner" variable, which is some silly variable that is always OWNER_NONE
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18:39:54 <planetmaker> patterned recurred
18:41:39 <andythenorth> there’s a ticket for that :P
18:41:44 <andythenorth> $someone should do ti
18:43:25 <andythenorth> Alberth: any volunteers? o_O
18:43:56 <Alberth> pondering about it, but not tonight, tooo sleepy
18:45:45 <andythenorth> I’ll write the nml if it’s not there already
18:46:55 <Alberth> yeah, some offset x 8 :)
18:53:28 * andythenorth considers finishing an MP game
18:53:30 <andythenorth> about 2 years left
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19:23:06 <b_jonas> so does the stable openttd release include diagonal rails in stations, or does this require some extra patches? if the former, are there nice gfx that contain such stations?
19:23:29 <andythenorth> diagonal stations are not a thing
19:24:05 <b_jonas> what... I've seen some pictures showing them. those pics might not have been made by the stable openttd, and they might not even work well of course, but they do seem to exist.
19:24:12 <b_jonas> train stations of course
19:24:41 <planetmaker> stations like --- or ||| instead of /// or \\\ ?
19:25:24 <andythenorth> never been a thing :)
19:25:32 <frosch123> there may be a fake-grf
19:25:37 <frosch123> similar to diagonal airports
19:25:49 <b_jonas> what? diagonal airports? what are those good for?
19:26:01 <frosch123> fake graphics, just for the looks
19:26:13 <frosch123> no actual game functionaliy
19:26:14 <b_jonas> I mean, do we even have just airports rotated by right angles or mirrored?
19:26:28 <frosch123> get 'ogfx+airports'
19:26:30 <b_jonas> that's sad, because they looked god
19:26:32 <planetmaker> use OpenGFX+Airports
19:26:41 <planetmaker> meh, frosch is just a tad faster :)
19:27:15 * planetmaker goes emptying the washing machine ... :P
19:27:25 <Eddi|zuHause> must be the leaping musces
19:27:31 <frosch123> planetmaker: i did that 2 hours ago :p
19:28:44 <b_jonas> diagonal tunnels are also not a thing, right? just to make sure
19:28:59 <frosch123> there is some teleport-tunnel patch iirc
19:29:12 <b_jonas> I understand why diagonal bridges would be difficult, but I don't know about diagonal stations
19:29:20 <frosch123> something where you can arbitrarily put entrance on exit somewhere on the map
19:29:45 <b_jonas> I only heared of some option that allows tunnels to cross each other
19:29:48 <Eddi|zuHause> that was years ago
19:30:24 <b_jonas> how long are the teleport tunnels to cross, and how are they priced?
19:30:55 <frosch123> no idea, didn't try them
19:32:48 <LordAro> wasn't there an *extremely* old patch by peter1138 (typically enough) which sort of did diagonal stations?
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19:33:22 <frosch123> there have been several underground rail patches
19:33:29 <frosch123> some diagonal road-rossing patch
19:33:36 <frosch123> but i do not recall a diagonal station patch
19:35:13 <michi_cc> There's at least a diagonal screenshot by peter, but I don't know if there ever was any proper patch.
19:35:40 <frosch123> oh, right, i remember that image
19:36:45 <b_jonas> I don't remeber that thread
19:36:48 <Rubidium> but then... that post is roughly mid way between when the patch was made and now
19:36:51 <b_jonas> I've seen the thread for diagonal road crossing
19:37:30 <Wolf01> mmmh, I might have somewhere my sloped station patch if you want to add it to the list
19:38:15 <b_jonas> sloped station? that sounds dangerous. how do they couple and decouple trains there? what if the breaks fail?
19:38:34 <Rubidium> that's no problem since we don't decouple
19:38:39 <Rubidium> also... what is a slope?
19:38:49 <b_jonas> yeah, I guess you do that only in depos
19:38:51 <Rubidium> 30 meters over 600+ kilometers, that's barely a slope
19:39:21 <Rubidium> otherwise, 30 meters over 5 meters, that's very unsafe even for rail tracks (you'd basically crash into it)
19:39:56 <frosch123> Rubidium: the biggest issue is the angle between vehicle and ground. it's very incovenient to get in and out
19:39:57 <b_jonas> isn't the height unit 5 meters?
19:40:45 <Eddi|zuHause> train stations must be level, so the train doesn't roll away when the brakes are loose
19:41:05 <Eddi|zuHause> b_jonas: no units are any meters...
19:41:14 <andythenorth> iirc Eddi|zuHause has a diagonal crossings patch that he has forgotten
19:41:23 <andythenorth> or it patched adjacent crossings on multiple tracks
19:41:27 <andythenorth> one or the other
19:41:31 <Eddi|zuHause> i have not forgotten.
19:41:53 <Eddi|zuHause> it's just unfinished
19:42:02 <andythenorth> the curse of our times
19:42:10 <andythenorth> is anything finished?
19:43:27 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: i have been twice at a station, where the train actually rolled back while people where entering, and someone yelled at the trani driver from the speakers to turn on the breaks
19:44:15 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: that's because theory and practice are often not matching :p
19:44:17 <Rubidium> frosch123: but the angle of 30 meters of height difference over 600+ kilometers is negligable. I reckon most stations have a higher inclination
19:45:20 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: but a slope is 50%
19:45:47 <frosch123> Rubidium: what speeds to the doors close with? aren't they quite fast? don't get sliced up
19:45:49 <Eddi|zuHause> 8 height steps on 16 length steps
19:46:05 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: well, or even 30 meters over 5 meters, so what's that... 600%?
19:46:39 <Rubidium> if you'd drive your maglev train at full speed "into" that, you'd definitely crash it
19:47:23 <frosch123> downhill could be more interesting
19:47:35 <Eddi|zuHause> well, we can't do that anymore, since they crashed the maglev into a service vehicle first...
19:47:37 <frosch123> how far will it jump?
19:47:43 <Wolf01> aaaaand I found it on page 28
19:47:56 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: it doesn't jump, it levitates.
19:47:59 <Rubidium> frosch123: which part?
19:48:16 <Rubidium> cause I'd reckon it kinda desintegrates a bit
19:48:26 <frosch123> your maglev driving straight and then reaching your 30/5 downhill slope
19:48:34 <Wolf01> ahha! andythenorth liked the patch!
19:49:00 <frosch123> Wolf01: i think i still have the bookmark :p
19:49:17 <Rubidium> mostly because of inertia of the train and the undercarriage trying to follow the track
19:50:25 <b_jonas> maglevs can handle it because they're magical anyway
19:50:30 <Wolf01> wow, it was really old: r15778
19:51:17 <Rubidium> that's only 5.5 years old
19:52:57 <Wolf01> too bad I've never understood the grf code :/
19:58:10 <andythenorth> pikka understands the grf code
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20:00:35 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd really like sloped road stations, btw
20:00:47 <b_jonas> Eddi|zuHause: drive-through ones?
20:01:10 <Eddi|zuHause> yes. doesn't make a lot of sense for the other ones :p
20:01:32 <frosch123> the other ones already are buildable on slopes :üp
20:01:55 * Pikka wants docks buildable on slopes
20:01:59 <b_jonas> frosch123: that doesn't really help if you want to connect the station to an adjacent road on the lower level
20:02:04 <andythenorth> you stole the words from my mouth :(
20:02:08 * andythenorth should type fasterererer
20:02:27 <Eddi|zuHause> docks on sloped rivers? :p
20:02:34 <andythenorth> given the latency to BNE, he must type really fast :(
20:02:45 <andythenorth> one day I’ll learn to type with more than one finger
20:03:41 <andythenorth> airports on water
20:03:46 <andythenorth> docks on airports
20:03:58 <b_jonas> and large airports above the middle a city, supported by giant legs
20:04:11 <Pikka> docks in the morning, docks in the evening, docks in the summertime
20:05:17 <planetmaker> docks in winter, too?
20:05:17 <Eddi|zuHause> underground airports!
20:05:50 <andythenorth> no docks in winter
20:05:55 <andythenorth> water is frozen innit
20:05:57 <b_jonas> bridges over airports
20:05:58 <andythenorth> silly planetmaker
20:06:16 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd settle for airports on bridges...
20:06:54 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a great view driving on the autobahn and seeing a plane cross your way.
20:07:14 <b_jonas> also bridges containing turns, diagonal tracks, signals, junctions, slopes, stations, stations on slopes, stations with turns and diagonals and junctions and slopes, all on the same bridge
20:07:21 <planetmaker> thinking of the one close to your home, eh, Eddi|zuHause ?
20:07:27 <planetmaker> indeed that looks quite awesome
20:07:35 <Eddi|zuHause> that would be too obvious :p
20:08:00 <b_jonas> although that would be sort of like Locomotion where you can build almost any rail or road stuff in the air or underground
20:12:05 <b_jonas> ah right, the tunnels crossing each other is a cheat
20:15:20 <andythenorth> how would we even spec flat docks?
20:15:37 <andythenorth> I guess it needs all kinds of newgrf complications and such
20:15:45 <andythenorth> just two flat tiles is out of the question
20:15:52 <b_jonas> what does "flat docks" mean?
20:16:45 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: but why not use the autobahn for landing?
20:17:06 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: they did that.
20:17:23 <b_jonas> Rubidium: ah, you want a road passing through the airport runway?
20:17:37 <Eddi|zuHause> several strips in both east and west were prepared to be used as landing strips in wartime
20:18:02 <andythenorth> flat docks are just flat
20:18:31 <b_jonas> oh, you mean they wouldn't be on sea level, but in raised water squares?
20:18:33 <Eddi|zuHause> which means no grass on the middle strip, and no bridges, or at least no pillars under the bridges
20:18:39 <b_jonas> connected to the sea with locks?
20:19:07 <andythenorth> just on the ground
20:19:15 <andythenorth> next to rivers and canals
20:19:40 <Eddi|zuHause> b_jonas: you can have canals (and thus flat shores) on sea level.
20:20:00 <Pikka> how does it know what direction to go it if there are multiple water tiles around the flatbit, andythenorth?
20:20:17 <andythenorth> Pikka: player chooses?
20:20:22 <b_jonas> I didn't think of canals because I haven't used them much
20:20:24 <Eddi|zuHause> Pikka: no autodirection, choose direction like for other stations
20:20:36 <andythenorth> or like build road - move the cursor in the tile
20:21:08 <andythenorth> I tried patching for flat docks, but just got an assert when a ship tried to route to it iirc
20:21:44 <andythenorth> I kind of like the docks on slopes
20:21:48 <andythenorth> they look so nice
20:21:51 <b_jonas> instead of a flat dock, could we just have an ordinary dock on a flat tile with sloped foundations under it automatically?
20:22:24 <andythenorth> also unlike docks on coasts, docks inland are much harder to integrate with train stations
20:22:26 <andythenorth> which is a bonus
20:22:29 <andythenorth> especially in cities
20:22:45 <andythenorth> it encourages lots of terraforming which is important
20:23:10 <andythenorth> airports don’t need much terraforming
20:23:16 <andythenorth> they seem to build anywhere these days
20:23:27 <andythenorth> you can build an airport on top of a mountain in recent ottd
20:23:56 <b_jonas> andythenorth: what? don't they require land that's almost flat?
20:24:01 <b_jonas> like, within one level difference?
20:24:15 <andythenorth> I always build them at sea personally
20:24:33 <andythenorth> michi_cc: wtf is that? :)
20:24:38 <andythenorth> I never saw it before
20:25:25 <andythenorth> also we should have more terraformings
20:25:32 <andythenorth> otherwise where will the terrapins come from?
20:26:34 <planetmaker> hehe, michi_cc :)
20:27:14 <michi_cc> frosch123: I was just digging that up myself :p
20:27:39 <planetmaker> andythenorth, it's one of the most un-used features in NewGRF land. It's how I define in OpenGFX+Landscape the -- and | rivers, by actually using the dike map
20:27:42 <frosch123> anyway, for rivers and canals it would be much nicer if the dock was along the water, not into the water
20:28:00 <frosch123> i would expect them to be in ttdpatch.grf
20:28:08 <andythenorth> planetmaker: one day will you help me ‘fix’ ottd rivers with that? (for original base set)
20:28:14 <andythenorth> I have 60% of the sprites or so
20:28:41 <planetmaker> andythenorth, too much pain to code in NFO for me... but I'll port it to OpenGFX base set eventually. Probably before 1.5
20:28:52 <frosch123> though possible docks would be nicer also at sea, if along the water :p
20:28:54 <andythenorth> I have plenty of bugs left to introduce to other sets
20:28:56 <planetmaker> it's only copy&paste for that :)
20:29:32 <planetmaker> the biggest pain is copying the generation from the 200MByte gimp file to OpenGFX :P
20:29:57 <planetmaker> and removing the gridless parts
20:30:14 <andythenorth> also on corner slopes
20:30:15 <b_jonas> as for docks, it's nice how I can put rail-less railway station tiles next to them to make them look bigger and nicer
20:30:49 <b_jonas> even if technically a single two-tile dock can handle any number of ships, because the ships don't take up space, it looks nicer if the docks are larger and have squares with cargo boxes
20:31:06 <planetmaker> indeed, docks along the shore would be nice. We need NewDocks anyway, with multiple load places :P
20:31:49 <b_jonas> planetmaker: for multiple load places, you can just use railway newstation tiles combined with multiple docks. only probably all ships will use the same loading place.
20:32:17 <andythenorth> b_jonas: did you just ask for multi-stop docks? Shameful behaviour.
20:32:31 <planetmaker> andythenorth, no, I did
20:32:54 <b_jonas> no, I'm fine with just one shop, as long as there's some extra facilities on the land next to it
20:33:16 <b_jonas> but loading facilities like storage areas and cranes on the land
20:33:32 <b_jonas> that can be done easily with newstations
20:33:40 <b_jonas> I like grf station tiles
20:34:08 <andythenorth> too much eye candy causes blindness
20:34:13 <andythenorth> or is that something else?
20:34:52 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: best come back reply I think
20:35:06 <andythenorth> I have no answer to that
20:36:02 <planetmaker> err-no-context, too
20:36:23 <Eddi|zuHause> needs to be more specific
20:36:37 <andythenorth> how many funny replies did you do today? :o
20:38:15 <planetmaker> :) The replies of both of your are totally in line
20:38:25 <Eddi|zuHause> doesn't matter if there's only one. if it's pushed out of short term memory, it needs the right context to be accessed again
20:38:50 <andythenorth> I now know who Eddi|zuHause actually is
20:39:05 <andythenorth> there are only 33 people in the world, everyone on irc is actually somebody I already know :P
20:39:13 <andythenorth> I won’t reveal who the others of you are :P
20:39:36 <frosch123> andythenorth: daylength factor 40000?
20:39:52 <planetmaker> sounds about right. Maybe a bit too much
20:40:09 <planetmaker> @calc 24*3600 / 74
20:40:09 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 1167.56756757
20:40:24 <planetmaker> @calc 24*3600 / 74 / 0.03
20:40:25 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 38918.9189189
20:40:47 <planetmaker> but then, that's good. Still time for food and loo ;)
20:41:40 <andythenorth> travelled about 4.5 miles on it :P
20:42:50 <planetmaker> looks like great fun :)
20:43:38 <Pikka> my grandmother's husband had a 5" gauge black five
20:44:13 <Pikka> when he died she gave it to the museum... they don't want it, it's in the back of a shed out at ipswich somewhere.
20:45:12 <andythenorth> they should give it to Strawberrry Line :P
20:45:29 <andythenorth> also, does Banananaans keep old versions of grfs around for scenarios that need them?
20:46:20 <Eddi|zuHause> we have a somewhat larger scale over here...
20:47:32 *** User is now known as Guest1281
20:48:50 <Eddi|zuHause> at which point does it fail?
20:49:08 <Guest1281> 2.8 Navigate to Configuration Properties -> VC++ Directories. is my problem. I don't find the VC++ Directories?
20:49:26 <andythenorth> michi_cc: so spec is good? Just needs ottd implementation? o_O
20:49:45 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, i can't help with that. i have no VC here
20:50:15 <andythenorth> Pikka: scripted any games?
20:50:28 <Pikka> getting there, andythenorth
20:51:50 <Pikka> just up the road... haven't been out there in years, though
20:55:37 <andythenorth> “This place is insane..."
20:58:40 <andythenorth> spose it’s bedtime
21:01:19 <andythenorth> Pikka: opinion on cargo sprites for boots?
21:01:26 <andythenorth> yes / no / mebbe
21:01:32 <Pikka> if you can be bothered?
21:02:00 <andythenorth> depends if I can find a short cut
21:02:16 <andythenorth> is everything crates, bulk cargo, or logs?
21:02:21 <andythenorth> or do I have to do better than that?
21:02:36 <Pikka> pretty much everything is those things
21:02:50 <andythenorth> what about haybales
21:02:59 <andythenorth> are they all logs?
21:03:21 <Pikka> too much work. I think haybales are boxes and cows go inside?
21:03:49 <andythenorth> I could do crates + bulk, then recolour them in code
21:03:55 <andythenorth> not too much work
21:04:00 <andythenorth> everything else, way too much work
21:04:06 <Pikka> code recolouring though
21:04:35 <andythenorth> I could recolour them in 32bpp, python doesn’t care
21:04:43 <andythenorth> but the indexed palette does :P
21:05:03 <andythenorth> precolour indeed
21:05:10 <Pikka> not recolour in OpenTTD? in that case, carry on.
21:05:20 <andythenorth> also I don’t understand this newfangled millions of colours
21:05:28 <andythenorth> where I come from, computers have 16 colours
21:05:31 <andythenorth> 256 is showing off
21:06:27 <Eddi|zuHause> the first computer games i played had 4 colours. in a world with mostly black and white monitors
21:06:48 <Eddi|zuHause> where "white" actually meant "green"
21:06:51 <andythenorth> the first game I played had 1 colour
21:07:03 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds boring
21:07:23 <andythenorth> I’m not counting black :P
21:07:36 <Eddi|zuHause> so you mean 2 colours
21:07:53 <andythenorth> but as one of them is created by turning the crt gun off…
21:07:55 <andythenorth> I don’t count it
21:08:05 <andythenorth> the only true 1 colour game I can think of would be called something like ‘can you induce an epileptic fit'
21:08:13 <andythenorth> or ‘decode morse code'
21:08:34 <andythenorth> and even that needs whole screen on / off, so still 2
21:08:58 <Eddi|zuHause> the only way you get 1 colour is if you turn off the screen
21:09:11 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can play a sound-only game
21:09:21 <Eddi|zuHause> (like actual morse code :p)
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21:11:41 <andythenorth> don’t seem to have a screenshot of the game
21:11:43 <andythenorth> anyway car racing
21:11:48 <andythenorth> two lines, one blob for the car
21:11:51 <andythenorth> circles for obstacles
21:12:37 <peter1138> Remember when arcade games (Remember arcade games?) use monochrome screens with colour filters stuck on in certain places?
21:14:59 <andythenorth> mine was white on black, not blue
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21:18:02 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: i have never seen such an abomination
21:18:27 <Guest1281> dmusic.cpp is missing what did I wrong?
21:19:10 <Eddi|zuHause> Guest1281: either you forgot to install something or you didn't set up the search path properly
21:19:43 <frosch123> wasn't there something that you need to use an ancient sdk for ottd?
21:20:06 <Eddi|zuHause> afair that was actually optional
21:20:17 <Guest1281> I'm sure I did everthing mentioned in the tutorial. Yes the Windows SDK but I installed it already
21:23:42 <Eddi|zuHause> there might be a switch to disable compiling with dmusic
21:24:38 <frosch123> dmusic was removed in 2005 or something :p
21:26:33 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, space invaders did it...
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22:59:11 <peter1138> Checksums match for track 1
22:59:16 <peter1138> Rip quality: 94.49 %
23:02:30 <|xk05|> is there an 'official' #openttd server?
23:06:06 <peter1138> god no, that would require playing the game
23:17:03 <Guest1281> Hello, now i get error C1001: An internal error has occurred in the compiler. \trunk\src\3rdparty\squirrel\squirrel\squtils.h
23:17:32 <Eddi|zuHause> that appeared in the forum somewhere...
23:18:39 <Guest1281> search did not help me a lot
23:20:14 <Guest1281> It can not be so difficult to build this software
23:20:57 <Guest1281> Search said:No suitable matches were found. with the query squtils.h
23:32:58 <Guest1281> @glx i did this already. How do you guys build the game?
23:33:35 <Eddi|zuHause> most people here use linux, or mingw on windows
23:33:59 <Eddi|zuHause> and other people just download the precompiled binaries
23:34:33 <glx> precompiled win32 and win64 builds are built with MSVC
23:34:45 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, as said in the thread, "internal error" is nothing that can be fixed by us
23:35:02 <glx> yes that's a compiler problem
23:36:18 <Guest1281> ok do you know which version of MSVC do you use? Do you provide images of the build farm?
23:39:55 <glx> I use express 2012, compile farm uses 2010
23:41:35 <glx> but I use windows7.1sdk compiler, not the one from VS
23:44:21 <glx> (v110 complains about macro redefinitions)
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23:44:56 <Guest1281> yes but you can turn this off
23:45:22 <Guest1281> What IDE do you guys use with Linux
23:57:58 <peter1138> or monodevelop for .net stuff
23:58:09 <peter1138> or eclipse... never
23:59:23 <Guest1281> so no auto code completion and such features ?
continue to next day ⏵
