IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2013-03-21
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08:22:56 <Pikka> snowbody here butters chickens
08:26:38 <V453000> I think written tutorials are best all in all for anything OpenTTD related Zuu
08:26:47 <V453000> and I have already written some amount of stuff that way :P
08:27:23 <Zuu> Yeah I've seen your document on map creation :-)
08:28:06 <V453000> uh, that one is kind of an exception, having a blog/wiki page is a lot better maintainable
08:28:33 <V453000> but for that pdf was nicer :)
08:29:31 <V453000> either way, what I meant to say was, in videos people get only like 50% of the information you actually tell them ... unless the caster is really good at talking
08:29:46 <V453000> while they can read written text line by line multiple times
08:30:16 <V453000> also in OpenTTD you often mention the same words and/or explain complicated things, which I really have a hard time explaining without writing it
08:33:14 <V453000> static images with text do wonders :)
08:42:24 <Pikka> video tutorials are terrible
08:42:47 <Pikka> I do not want to watch a half-hour video for the one little piece of information I need and which probably isn't in there anyway
08:48:54 <V453000> cant ctrl F in them either
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10:02:20 <Ristovski> will doing "exit" in the dedicated server console save the map before quitting?
10:03:44 <V453000> one way to find out :P
10:32:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't really remember whether there was an "autosave on exit" feature in this game, but if there was, there'd be an option about it
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11:02:42 <Bonez305> how much RAM is needed for a 1024x1024 server map ?
11:25:55 <dihedral> Ristovski, you could use a script, alias its execution to something like saveexit which does that job for you ;-)
11:26:50 <dihedral> Bonez305, that depends on how advanced the game is ;-)
11:27:18 <Ristovski> would be cool if openttd could use a real scripting lang., like python or lua
11:27:47 <dihedral> you can connect to openttd with python via a dedicated protocol just for that purpose
11:28:42 <dihedral> my main issue is time ;-)
11:28:53 <dihedral> else the implementation of that would be further than it is currently
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12:14:57 <planetmaker> Ristovski, there's obviously two java implementations for a library which allows connecting to the admin port and one in python
12:19:10 <Ristovski> ill use the python one
12:19:34 <Ristovski> planetmaker: but, I'm looking for a way, to make the server use python as a scripting language
12:20:18 <adamt> Is it possible to tell openttd where to put save games?
12:21:07 <__ln__> Ristovski: who is ill?
12:21:18 <Ristovski> __ln__: clearly you
12:22:08 <planetmaker> what do you want to script in python, Ristovski ?
12:22:17 <adamt> looks like Ristovski is repeating many of my questions from yesterday :-)
12:22:32 <planetmaker> you can write your sever management in python. But the game and ai scripts are needed in squirrel
12:23:07 <Ristovski> planetmaker: hmm.. I mean, openttd can't really run complex scripts
12:23:12 <Ristovski> only like commands/aliases
12:23:56 <Ristovski> you can't make a complex script, since you can only use the commands and aliases
12:24:32 <planetmaker> Ristovski, possibly, yes. But use the admin port for complex stuff
12:24:57 <planetmaker> there you can interface openttd and write in your own script whatever you need. And you know what's going on by monitoring what's going on
12:25:11 <planetmaker> thus make callbacks on the events you want to do *whatever* and it should work ;-)
12:27:15 <planetmaker> adamt, maybe you two should sit together and share the workload for better results ;-)
12:27:45 <adamt> planetmaker, yeah, but although we made similar questions, and not sure our aims is the same.
12:27:56 <adamt> so Ristovski, what are you doing?
12:28:31 <Bonez305> dihedral: what do you mean advanced? like how far along the game is, and how many transports there are?
12:28:33 <Ristovski> adamt: oh nothing, just derping around, I was trying to see if I can make some complex scripts for my server, but ohwell
12:28:45 <planetmaker> The main task is to make the admin script do *something*...
12:29:14 <adamt> so except for both of us probably needing to connect to the port, we're not doing the same. :P
12:29:37 <Ristovski> I am also listing the code to see whats where
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12:40:01 <dihedral> Ristovski, with the admin interface you can get notifications and data pushed
12:40:09 <dihedral> your code in turn will then run what is nessesary
12:40:22 <dihedral> e.g. on a new player, or if a player leaves, same with company stuff
12:40:35 <Ristovski> dihedral: tho I need it to run on my PC right? or can I run it on the server too
12:41:02 <dihedral> you can request updates on daily weekly monthly quarterly and yearly (depending on the information your want)
12:41:21 <dihedral> you can run python on the same machine you run the openttd dedicated server
12:41:29 <dihedral> or even from a remote location if you so wish
12:41:38 <dihedral> it is a tcp connection you set up
12:41:57 <Ristovski> oh, ok, ill try it out later
12:46:03 <adamt> what he's saying, is, your script and openttd will run separately, bound together by the admin port talking together over tcp/ip.
12:46:50 <Ristovski> btw, are .grf's just compressed sprites?
12:47:56 <Ristovski> planetmaker: I am speaking about OpenGFX's .grf file
12:49:17 <planetmaker> well... sprites, yes... but expecially the ogfx_extra.grf contains also loads of pseudo sprites
12:49:30 <Ristovski> what format are .grf's?
12:49:38 <Ristovski> I mean, how can one extract the sprites
12:50:10 <Ristovski> planetmaker: thanks
12:50:57 <planetmaker> Ristovski, grf are written in their own programming languages, compiled by their own compiler
12:51:41 <planetmaker> a grf can be way more than just image sprites
12:52:14 <planetmaker> it can contain desription and behavioural logic for basically all map components
12:52:40 <planetmaker> s/map component/game objects/
12:53:56 <Ristovski> planetmaker: can I use grfcodec -d on all the .grf files?
12:54:06 <planetmaker> opengfx itself as a base set is one of the most simple forms of grfs, though. 5 of the 6 grf are indeed only compilation of real sprites
12:54:08 <__ln__> is the grf-ese language turing complete?
12:55:27 <__ln__> and can GCC be made compile e.g. C into a grf?
12:56:24 <Ristovski> planetmaker: hmm.. Error opening ogfxc_arctic.grf/ogfx1_base.nfo: Not a directory
12:56:25 <planetmaker> yes. iirc nearly, yes. Get started writing plugin ;-)
12:57:25 <__ln__> so if the whole OpenTTD could be compiled into a grf, ....
12:57:29 <planetmaker> depending on what you want to do, Ristovski, you're better off getting opengfx' or the newgrf's source code
12:57:59 <Ristovski> planetmaker: how can I do that?
12:58:07 <planetmaker> read the readme of opengfx
12:59:04 <Ristovski> hmm, I dont see how to obtain the source code anywhere
12:59:39 <planetmaker> 6.1 Obtaining the source
12:59:56 <Ristovski> there isnt any 6.1 tho
13:00:24 <planetmaker> but read the readme, it#s in there...
13:08:42 <__ln__> that's the shortest lunch i've seen.
13:09:37 <Ristovski> __ln__: I eat quick
13:09:54 <Ristovski> but yeah, this was pretty fast
13:10:01 <Ristovski> normally it takes ~10mins for me
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13:16:13 <planetmaker> Ristovski, if you do not want to make use of mercuria to obtain the source, the link you gave might be better
13:16:22 <planetmaker> but generally using the VCS is the much preferred way
13:22:38 <planetmaker> hm... 13 minutes compile time for OpenGFX on our server :D
13:23:10 <Ristovski> planetmaker: -j3 ftw
13:23:18 <Ristovski> or how many cores you got + 1
13:23:22 <planetmaker> explicitly limited to -j1
13:23:39 <planetmaker> gimp scripting barfs when run too much in parallel
13:24:00 <Ristovski> brb, gotta go buy something, afk
13:24:04 <planetmaker> otherwise -j9 ;-)
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15:46:52 <Ristovski> planetmaker: octacore? nice
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15:47:46 <Ristovski> planetmaker: hmm, AMD-FX 8350 might be better
15:47:52 <Ristovski> since cheaper, and octacore
15:48:57 <planetmaker> The pricing for that root server in the data centre is quite acceptable.
15:49:13 <planetmaker> it's not like I buy the hardware
15:55:07 <Ristovski> planetmaker: but for the money, it's good
15:56:16 <V453000> 4000 dollars for a cpu :DDD
15:58:53 <planetmaker> obviously not for the big hosting providers
15:59:25 <V453000> I have i7 myself and I cant complain
15:59:35 <planetmaker> nope, me neither :-) Quite happy with it
16:00:13 <V453000> I know you have something very similar to mine we already discussed that :P
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16:12:59 <peter1139> with dual integer units
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16:33:03 <auvajs> I am very new to openttd. been trying to run the 32bit graphics, where to put those datas? what directory?
16:33:25 <LordAro> nowadays, you don't need to do anything like that
16:33:44 <LordAro> just go to your download content window in game, and download zBase
16:34:29 <planetmaker> auvajs, use the ingame content download
16:34:43 <planetmaker> oh, Hi LordAro :-) You were faster :D
16:35:20 <auvajs> ok I downloaded it, what's the next step?
16:35:45 <planetmaker> from main menu: game options
16:35:49 <auvajs> ah I see.. it works.. cool! great :-)))
16:36:39 <nicfer> how can I make a wagon to change cargo and give extra power when added to a MU?
16:37:47 <V453000> nicfer: powered_wagons
16:37:55 <V453000> you need to have livery override for that
16:38:10 <V453000> see NUTS, monorail Intercity trains
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17:50:54 <auvajs> accepted industries: houses - what's that?
17:51:53 <planetmaker> look at a town and think again ;-)
17:52:22 <auvajs> yes but how to transport it?
17:52:35 <V453000> town aint no houses, town is piggybanks and igloos
17:53:09 <planetmaker> house is no cargo. It's a destination
17:54:20 <auvajs> yes but where to export "crates of goods" ?
17:54:38 <auvajs> display chains shows "houses"
17:54:47 <Pinkbeast> Where are houses generally found?
17:55:22 <auvajs> so it is to be transported to a town railway station?
17:55:25 <Pinkbeast> When you're creating a station, the interface shows what cargoes it will accept. If you are creating a station in a town, it will sometimes accept goods.
17:56:29 <Pinkbeast> Only larger buildings accept goods, which can make it tricky to get them in - sometimes I use goods trams into the centre of town.
18:00:54 <LordAro> perhaps that string (in the display chains) should be changed to "Towns" or something similar
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18:21:10 *** ChanServ changes topic to "1.2.3, 1.3.0-RC3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only | #openttd.dev for dev-talk | #openttd.notice for commit notices"
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18:45:20 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25112 /trunk/src/lang (english_AU.txt serbian.txt) (2013-03-21 18:45:13 UTC)
18:45:21 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:22 <DorpsGek> english_AU - 1 changes by mrtux
18:45:23 <DorpsGek> serbian - 17 changes by ivan_mile
18:46:33 <LordAro> (of course i look at the chat for updates every minute :L )
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19:14:32 <LordAro> oh, heyo, linux build of kerbal space program :)
19:14:50 * LordAro resists urge to buy the game immediately
19:20:31 <LordAro> the demo works rather well via WINE, if a little laggy
19:22:19 <peter1139> i tried it with wine about 2 years ago
19:22:50 <LordAro> 2 years ago? hardly surprising :P
19:23:19 <peter1139> kerbal space program
19:23:23 <LordAro> even my limited knowledge about wine tells me it's got a lot better (with games especially) recently
19:23:45 <peter1139> : Too many buttons; using buttons 0 - 19 and ignoring buttons 20 - 22
19:24:33 <LordAro> how many buttons do you have?
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20:08:06 <andythenorth> are you dancing?
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22:36:31 <nicfer> how can I set livery override for a wagon?
22:44:00 <nicfer> I found something but for NFO
22:47:57 <Eddi|zuHause> what about reading the NML page that says "livery override" in the title?
22:51:24 <V453000> I already linked to monoICE at NUTS which uses exactly that :P
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23:01:08 <planetmaker> OpenGFX+Trains also never uses livery override for the MU passenger wagons. never. ;-)
23:02:40 <V453000> well you dont need to use it unless you use powered wagons pm :P
23:02:51 <V453000> at least I dont use it unless I need powered wagons ... :D
23:03:08 <planetmaker> well. but it's easy if you want matching wagons for an engine
23:03:41 <planetmaker> but yes, not needed in that case, strictly speaking
23:03:47 <V453000> idk I was told some time ago that livery override is outdated and so I used switch with leading engine ID :P
23:04:03 <planetmaker> actually livery override is a newgrf odditiy which never should have been invented in the form it exists :D
23:04:12 <planetmaker> yeah ^^ what you say
23:04:25 <planetmaker> that's the better approach
23:05:21 <V453000> <- as long as it works, :P :)
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23:25:17 <nicfer> is that only graphicwise or can I also change wagon stats?
23:31:07 <Eddi|zuHause> just define a real wagon...
23:43:08 <LordAro> right, properly 'night all' this time
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23:54:29 <nicfer> One question, can I make an industry to boost production when one of its tiles receive cargo? Not actual accepted cargo, but for example, passengers as for steel mills
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