IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2012-08-27
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05:05:48 * Supercheese just noticed that HEQS doesn't support Autorefit
05:06:38 <Supercheese> Oh gads, it's in NFO
05:07:02 <Supercheese> No chance of me helping out, then :(
05:09:13 <Supercheese> barring helping with a full conversion to NML, that is
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06:10:24 <Supercheese> Hmm, if I wanted to make an Addon grf to an existing vehicle set, I suppose I'd have to grab the vehicle IDs from that set somehow
06:11:39 <Supercheese> If they're auto-assigned, that could get tricky, no?
06:14:37 <Supercheese> Oh pfff, the wiki has all that, I'm blind
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07:02:49 <Supercheese> I'd presume that allowing an autorefit that changes vehicle length is a bad idea
07:08:05 <Terkhen> I'm not sure what would happen, but probably bad things
07:20:45 <Terkhen> hi andythenorth and planetmaker
07:25:18 <Supercheese> I liked r24497, solved my autorefit woes rather nicely
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08:24:10 <dihedral> hey Terkhen :-) had a nice weekend?
08:31:36 <Terkhen> yes, thanks, I hope you did too :)
08:43:47 * andythenorth has been redesigning the internets
08:50:07 <Terkhen> andythenorth: your design takes into account transmission over distances in which light speed has a significant impact?
08:51:18 <andythenorth> mostly it's css :P
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09:06:49 <Eddi|zuHause> "windows 8 phones home about every app you install"
09:12:18 <szaman> i wonder how blue screen of death sounds like on the phone
09:13:10 <Terkhen> it's only to make sure that you don't install malware, such as programs not recommended by microsoft
09:13:11 <Chris_Booth> that would be amazing if their phones blue screened
09:13:42 <Terkhen> and they changed the blue screen to black IIRC
09:14:00 <Chris_Booth> does anyone remember the Red Screen?
09:14:10 <Chris_Booth> from one of the Vista Beta versions
09:14:11 <Terkhen> to spend less energy I guess
09:14:54 <Terkhen> Vista beta? I thought that vista was windows 7 beta
09:17:23 <szaman> w thought vista was windows 7 beta
09:17:59 <szaman> oh, sorry, same thought
09:20:15 <NGC3982> Afaik, the BSOD doesn't exist in Windows 7 and later?
09:23:04 <Eddi|zuHause> my impression was that they made it black, and more difficult to trigger
09:23:50 <szaman> i saw one while loading windwos 7 and it was blue, but it was no 80x25 mode, it was something like 80x50 or more
09:24:40 <szaman> it happens when you change your mobo
09:24:47 <szaman> or hard disk controller
09:25:05 <szaman> but less frequently as in XP, in XP every mobo change ruins OS :]
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09:33:02 <NGC3982> szaman: Yeah, that was the lame thing about XP.
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10:40:28 <andythenorth> is there a shell command to chain 2 fg processes, and both die when I kill the one in fg?
10:40:32 <andythenorth> nvm if that's insane
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10:50:50 <planetmaker> andythenorth: blah && bluh
10:50:53 <planetmaker> like ./configure && make.
10:51:09 <planetmaker> or maybe blah | bluh like cat blub.txt | grep 'bullshit'
10:51:15 <andythenorth> && requires the previous command to return
10:51:20 <andythenorth> whereas this process doesn't
10:51:23 <planetmaker> depends what you want :-)
10:51:30 <andythenorth> & works, but leaves the first process running when I ctrl-c
10:51:39 <andythenorth> then I have to ps and kill :P
10:51:44 <planetmaker> so... what do you mean with "chain"?
10:51:56 <andythenorth> I could just user supervisord to run these :P
10:52:17 <andythenorth> I'm just trying to avoid having two shells to run two foreground processes
10:52:30 <andythenorth> there's an app to do it for me, but that's cheating
10:52:40 <bolli> kill 'ps aux | grep processname' ?
10:52:40 <andythenorth> I think I'll stick with ps + kill :P
10:52:55 <andythenorth> that's how I kill them more or less
10:53:32 <andythenorth> wish my mac would stop correcting my spelling, it's annoying
10:53:50 <andythenorth> planetmaker: 10.7 is significantly faster than 10.6.8 in many areas btw, despite no full-screen openttd :P
10:54:12 <andythenorth> (those two points are not connected, but no full screen openttd is the only big problem so far)
10:54:37 <andythenorth> oh, my nml is broken, but I'll figure that out
10:54:49 <bolli> Really? I was talking to someone I know with it and he said he hadn't noticed a speed increase at all.
10:55:16 <bolli> And doesn't know why he spent money upgrading for simply iMessenger :p
11:01:17 <Eddi|zuHause> what does that mean, actually?
11:02:55 <Eddi|zuHause> <andythenorth> then I have to ps and kill :P <-- you can just "fg" and then ctrl+c it
11:06:02 <Eddi|zuHause> or maybe making them child processes of some sub-shell works, and you just kill the shell (including the child processes)
11:06:17 <bolli> Hmm. This could be why I'm getting awful performance on my work server :|
11:06:29 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: sounds like supervisord ;)
11:06:38 <bolli> Its running a named pipe between 2 processes thats causing an infinate loop :|
11:07:01 <andythenorth> I could just use the supervisord config that's in the dir :P
11:07:05 <andythenorth> but learning shell is good for me
11:07:31 <andythenorth> they should teach shell in school :(
11:07:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i learnt dos in school
11:12:17 <Eddi|zuHause> szaman: that doesn't work if 2 is killed first
11:12:40 <Eddi|zuHause> and you can't ctrl+c it
11:13:01 <planetmaker> if they should teach Shell in school, they should also teach total exxon :-P
11:13:36 <Eddi|zuHause> well, they also taught us BP in school :)
11:14:14 <Eddi|zuHause> (meaning "borland pascal", obviously)
11:14:25 <planetmaker> :D Indeed, I was taught that there, too
11:14:34 <planetmaker> and... prolog. Oh my
11:14:49 <Eddi|zuHause> no, i only learnt that in university
11:16:09 <Terkhen> I hated learning prolog
11:16:34 <Eddi|zuHause> but i'm regularly the only person in a room having that opinion :=)
11:20:06 <planetmaker> it's an interesting concept imho. But ... not usable :-P
11:39:52 <bolli> Is there a way to give commands over the internet to openttd at all? :p
11:40:08 * andythenorth needs to play the game perhaps
11:40:34 <Eddi|zuHause> in the easiest case: rcon <password> "<command>"
11:40:56 <Eddi|zuHause> (the quotes are important!)
11:41:08 <bolli> I mean, how to do in in a TCP request :P#
11:41:14 <bolli> So It can be done by a script :p
11:41:21 <Eddi|zuHause> oh, then you want the admin port
11:41:22 <planetmaker> write an admin script
11:42:19 <planetmaker> are the two freely available *libraries*. Not scripts themselves
11:42:35 <bolli> Thanks, I'll check them out :P
11:43:58 <planetmaker> joan / grapes is java, libottdadmin python
11:45:25 <planetmaker> *if* you write something... please make it open-source :-)
11:45:38 <planetmaker> and yes, I shall be very interested in results
11:46:49 <planetmaker> I'm quite sad about a lot of people not doing that... while making use of a game which wouldn't exist without this concept and attitude
11:51:51 <dihedral> if you code java, before starting a new project, get in touch with dih :-P
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12:13:03 <andythenorth> is it time for an MP game?
12:14:07 <andythenorth> V453000: you haven't played NoCarGoal yet :D
12:14:22 <V453000> no I indeed havent :)
12:14:26 * andythenorth wonders if there are enough to play co-opetive
12:14:56 <andythenorth> V453000: you'll need a nightly ;)
12:19:43 <bolli> hmm. libottdamin looks almost unfinished :|
12:21:27 <bolli> And do I need a username to download from openttdcoop?
12:22:39 <V453000> what exactly do you need to do?
12:22:50 <bolli> a mercurial clone of joan :p
12:23:10 <Fremen> hm aren't there any good new builsing graphics?
12:23:39 <andythenorth> planetmaker: what nightly version are we on?
12:23:55 <andythenorth> [for nighlty server]
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12:28:39 <andythenorth> V453000: nightly server is on 24494
12:29:11 <andythenorth> don't know how you'll get that, current nightly is 24498
12:29:18 <V453000> thought it is some patched thing
12:30:33 <V453000> ah just wrong directory in the link
12:30:53 <planetmaker> andythenorth: the server is still 24494. We could update...
12:31:13 <andythenorth> planetmaker: want to play? also Yexo Terkhen ?
12:32:00 <V453000> yeah I found it manually as well, thanks though
12:49:21 <Terkhen> andythenorth: I'm working, so no :P
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12:59:27 <andythenorth> not bank holiday in EU?
13:00:55 <planetmaker> hm, no? Why should it?
13:01:23 <planetmaker> what's special about today?
13:04:07 <andythenorth> standard bank holiday in UK, last weekend of Aug.
13:04:18 <andythenorth> last one of the year :P
13:04:39 <planetmaker> I'd assume that Christmas is also a bank holiday? ;-)
13:05:44 <bolli> public holdiay, not a bank holiday surely? :P
13:10:28 <planetmaker> hm, what's the difference?
13:11:34 <bolli> Ala Wikipedia: Bank holidays are holidays when banks and many other businesses are closed for the day. Public holidays are holidays which have been observed through custom and practice.
13:22:12 <Terkhen> I never heard about bank holidays before
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14:10:58 <Fremen> so is 2cc (trains) working ok with eGRVTS (road/tram) ?
14:11:09 <Fremen> guess i'll play a 150 years to see :)
14:13:30 <NGC3982> Fremen: It works neat.
14:14:05 <NGC3982> Though, the vehicle running costs may be a bit odd in relative to each other.
14:14:07 <Fremen> anyone thought of insane far future vehicles yet for an newGRF? :)
14:14:34 <NGC3982> afaik, NUTS have some that are pretty far out.
14:14:54 <Fremen> ah yes I tlooked at that one, it's a bit too chaotic but maybe worth a try someday
14:15:12 <andythenorth> so you don't want too insane then :)
14:15:38 <Fremen> well for one I didn't understand all the types when I looked at it the first time :p
14:16:14 <Fremen> but as I like to play for hundreds of years in 1 game I guess I need some insanity :p
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15:44:58 <Fremen> aight, 2cc + eGRVTS + av8 + FISH should make things fun :)
15:52:39 <Terkhen> drop HEQS into the mix too
15:58:13 <Fremen> well looks that those are just for fun, and not too useful?
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16:11:33 <Hirundo> Fremen: HEQS is quite useful, those vehicles work well for feeder services
16:14:19 <Fremen> not counting the forklifts I assume? :p
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16:18:03 <Hirundo> Some are more eyecandy-ish, or suitable for supplies deliveries with FIRS
16:18:24 <Matulla> Hi all QUESTION if i bring goods to a nearby city airport stationname is different to the city Station name does that has the same effect ,as the Airport Tiles match the City THEN Having to unload to truck or train and drive to city center
16:18:29 <Fremen> I'll wait with FIRS for now, it's too much at once :)
16:19:02 <Fremen> btw UK Towns + TTRS + original buildings is a nice mix :)
16:23:04 <andythenorth> Fremen: try TAI on its own
16:23:31 <andythenorth> the HEQS forklifts are dumb, I added them on request ;)
16:26:15 <Fremen> so great to look into all the work that has been done for this game and find your suitable needs
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16:35:08 <bolli> How does openttd cope with strange characters in identifiers?
16:35:29 <bolli> will it cope with TÜVASAŞ?
16:37:25 <Terkhen> as long as you have loaded an appropiate font it should be fine
16:37:57 <bolli> So its probably best not to include it in a GRF? :p
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16:42:23 <Fremen> hm the train wagons in 2cc are half the size ot teh normal ones? so double cargo? o_O
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17:32:23 <andythenorth> NoCargoGoal game later? :P
17:33:52 * andythenorth has the uncanny habit of summoning people :)
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17:35:35 <CaptObvious> I can't seem to find documentation on how to install newgrfs on a dedicated server with no graphical support
17:36:22 <CaptObvious> that's handy, thanks ¬.¬
17:36:25 <Zuu> I have a new NoCarGoal version that I worked on yesterday. It includes a fix of the double counting and string updates.
17:36:29 <bolli> is this a linux server? :P
17:36:43 <Zuu> To clarify, that new version haven't yet been released.
17:36:45 <CaptObvious> I mean where to, and what do I need to add to the config file to get it to use the newgrf for new games etc
17:36:49 <bolli> you can also use Cyberduck if it suppors SCP :p
17:37:12 <CaptObvious> I'm aware of how to get files onto a linux machine, thanks.
17:37:31 <andythenorth> I have to do some driving for a bit soon, but I might have time for a 1hr game later, if anyone else would
17:37:48 <andythenorth> I want to play an MP game with HEQS buy costs reduced by 50%
17:37:56 <andythenorth> way too many trains in the games we've been playing :P
17:39:10 <CaptObvious> do I leave them in the tarball or extract the .grf file?
17:40:41 <bolli> if they're from bananas,they go tarred into content_download/newgrf
17:41:02 <bolli> easiest way to set it up is to do the same on your computer then just upload the whole file...
17:41:15 <CaptObvious> I'm on a windows machine
17:41:29 <CaptObvious> and the server's all set up and running, all that needs doing now is adding newgrfs
17:44:37 <bolli> its still the same folder layout as on the windows machine :p
17:45:10 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r24499 /trunk/src/lang/welsh.txt:
17:45:10 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:10 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: welsh - 7 changes by kazzie
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17:45:58 <CaptObvious> so once the files are in content_download/newgrf/ I just start a new game and it uses them automatically?
17:49:40 <bolli> have you restarted ottd? :P
17:51:10 <bolli> you left them as tar files?
18:07:08 <bolli> I have no idea then sorry...
18:07:36 <CaptObvious> maybe file permissions, sec
18:09:35 <CaptObvious> openttd@heimdall:~/.openttd/content_download/newgrf$ ls
18:09:35 <CaptObvious> eGRVTS-1.0.tar.gz FISH_ship_set-0.9.2.tar.gz Reduced_Passenger_Payment-1.0.tar.gz UK_Renewal_Set-3.04.tar.gz
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18:12:16 <CaptObvious> I don't need to activate them anywhere do I? do they need to go under the newgrfs section in openttd.cfg?
18:20:59 <CaptObvious> I activated them on my local client
18:21:06 <CaptObvious> and it added lines to openttd.cfg
18:21:25 <bolli> My openttd.cfg file hasn't got anything in its [newgrf] section...
18:21:27 <CaptObvious> so I copied those lines to the server's .cfg and I'm waiting on it rebooting now, because for some reason the init.d script wasn't working to start the server
18:22:01 <bolli> try running it as an executable rather than init.d
18:22:09 <CaptObvious> the init.d script was working
18:22:10 <frosch123> CaptObvious: easiest solution is generally to set up a savegame on your client, and transfer that one to the server
18:22:23 <CaptObvious> but it stopped working before I started messing with newgrfs
18:23:51 <CaptObvious> frosch123 - I'm wanting to avoid having to do that, since what happens when I need to start a new game on the server?
18:27:13 <CaptObvious> wtf. it's removing the lines from the [newgrf] section when the server starts
18:27:31 * bolli is failing at looking up how to get something to select liveries as different types of cargo
18:27:53 <bolli> you're not loading a game each time are you?
18:28:09 <CaptObvious> no, new map each time
18:28:22 <frosch123> CaptObvious: if it is removing lines, then it cannot find the files
18:28:27 <frosch123> maybe some / \ issue?
18:29:12 <bolli> you could also tried the console content download...
18:29:20 <CaptObvious> I couldn't find how to do that anywhere
18:29:25 <CaptObvious> I googled for it for about 20 mins
18:29:46 <CaptObvious> it wasn't a \ / issue
18:30:59 <bolli> type in content to get an output of how to use it :p
18:31:43 <bolli> right. Anybody know how to make different liveries refittable?
18:36:16 <CaptObvious> great, it doesn't want to get the list of content
18:47:47 <CaptObvious> ah, disabled ipv6 and all is grand
19:11:57 <CaptObvious> when I'm entering a multiplayer game my nick is getting "#1" appended to it
19:14:48 <Zuu> CaptObvious: Is there another player with the same nick on that server?
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19:20:08 <andythenorth> NoCarGoal v3, start in 20 mins or so? Go to bed at sensible time?
19:20:39 <andythenorth> 512^ map, 5 years, 1980 start, cheap HEQS, flat map, lots of rivers, lots of industry (default industry)
19:27:12 <Rubidium> what is a sensible time?
19:27:32 <andythenorth> after you have finished playing an MP game of course :)
19:28:04 <andythenorth> I have 24494, but could get 24498
19:28:25 <andythenorth> 5 years = in bed by 10pm if we start within 20 mins or so :P
19:28:52 <Rubidium> that sounds reasonabe
19:29:17 <andythenorth> ¿ planetmaker: Yexo frosch123 Terkhen Zuu V453000 ^^
19:29:41 <frosch123> start the game, i might join later on
19:30:15 <Zuu> Mind that if you upgrade to version 3, the difficulty for most cargos have doubled.
19:30:19 <frosch123> if you want to keep the server, it should stay with r24494
19:30:29 <andythenorth> 5 years, what cargo goal?
19:30:35 <Zuu> Eg. when we played with 25000 as goal, the actual goal was 12500.
19:30:52 <andythenorth> that was 7 years?
19:31:01 <frosch123> 5 years, default industries, 25k (in v3)
19:31:02 <Zuu> 7 years was still correct
19:31:17 <andythenorth> frosch123: 25k is ambitious :)
19:31:21 <andythenorth> I'll make HEQS cheap
19:31:26 <Zuu> 25k in v3 is like 50k in v2.
19:31:30 <frosch123> don'T buy expensive ships :p
19:32:52 <Terkhen> andythenorth: no, sorry :P
19:33:02 <Terkhen> I'm just going to read a few things and go to bed
19:33:59 <Zuu> andythenorth: I'm working on a trivial patch that should make GS testing a tiny bit easier. :-)
19:34:23 <Zuu> Not sure how many people you will get in your game.
19:35:50 <Fremen> I still suck too hard in teh game to be part of anything :p
19:37:59 <Rubidium> r24494 is so ancient
19:41:15 <andythenorth> ok I've got a save
19:41:20 <andythenorth> how do I get it to the server?
19:42:03 <frosch123> upload it somewhere
19:43:51 <frosch123> does that use the new gs?
19:46:58 <Rubidium> so... what rev should I downgrade to and which server is it running on and which team can I join (or is there only one team)
19:47:14 <frosch123> #openttdcoop.nightly
19:48:28 <frosch123> the server runs r24494 :)
19:48:35 <frosch123> and i don't want to install it
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19:51:38 <frosch123> so, who else wants to join #openttdcoop.nightly with r24494 :)
19:51:52 <frosch123> server is up, and waiting for some more players to start
19:52:06 <frosch123> 25k of pax, oil and iron ore within 5 years
19:52:14 <andythenorth> 32 Iron Ore mines
19:52:30 <andythenorth> cheap ogfx + RVs
19:52:40 <frosch123> well, no oil rigs yet
19:52:54 <frosch123> no idea whether oil or iore is harder
19:52:56 <andythenorth> ships are too expensive anyway :)
19:53:03 <andythenorth> someone has to do PAX :P
19:53:57 <Rubidium> is it the nightingall server?
19:53:59 <andythenorth> frosch123: going to wait until 21.00 to start I think :)
19:54:10 * andythenorth just doing 3 chores
19:54:23 <Rubidium> that has non-bananas NewGRFs
19:54:42 <Rubidium> was I looking at an ipv6 timeout here?
20:34:23 <__ln__> this city closes early
20:37:23 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: zuu * r24500 /trunk/src/goal_gui.cpp: -Fix: Don't show the global goals as company goals for spectators
21:10:28 <frosch123> Zuu: does it no longer show a summary at the end of the game?
21:12:35 <Zuu> It should do it, but apparently it is broken under some yet unknown conditions.
21:12:51 <frosch123> i saw it in both the last two games
21:13:05 <Zuu> I didn't see it in the first one.
21:13:06 <frosch123> has it trouble with multiple companies?
21:13:47 <Zuu> I don't think so. At least not on GS side.
21:15:04 <Zuu> Unless there is a problem that the question don't show on clients that have received the pause CMD.
21:16:23 <Zuu> But that would be strange as pause is a DoCommand and would cause the GS to sleep for the reminder of the current tick and not execute the GSGoal.Question untill next tick.
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22:23:27 <hotuhaocehu> i have a suggestion for russian translation
22:23:37 <hotuhaocehu> can i suggest it here
22:24:05 <Yexo> there might be a forum topic for the russian translation
22:24:24 <Yexo> if not, I think there are some russian forums, perhaps they have a thread related to the translation where you can post your suggestions
22:24:28 <hotuhaocehu> i mean maybe there is a russian translator on the channel
22:24:48 <hotuhaocehu> if not, then ok, i will register and ask for translator account by email
22:25:35 <hotuhaocehu> russian translators, please PM
22:26:07 <Zuu> Given the current time of day in Russia, I wouldn't expect too many responses on IRC at the moment.
22:29:39 <planetmaker> hotuhaocehu: ask for becoming a translator. It's easy :-)
22:30:38 <hotuhaocehu> i know, already sent email
22:31:50 <planetmaker> ok. I'm too tired now. I'll look at it hopefully tomorrow
22:53:50 *** Devedse has joined #openttd
23:50:11 *** glx is now known as Guest4667
continue to next day ⏵