IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2012-07-26
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00:52:28 <Silo> stop_ai <company_slot> what is the company slot?
01:01:35 <Eddi|zuHause> a number between 1 and 14
01:01:59 <Eddi|zuHause> (0 is your own company)
01:04:01 <Eddi|zuHause> you should be able to run "companies" to find out which ones are used. or the AI debug window (in the [?] menu)
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07:11:56 <NGC3982> how does that look to you?
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08:00:01 <Alberth> if there is no file for your language, yes, english is the simplest starting point
08:01:51 <Alberth> any other language file can also be used but they may be out of date w.r.t. the master lang file
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10:52:14 <andythenorth> the var61 thing?
10:52:30 <andythenorth> can't that be done by checking consist length and subtracting current vehicle's position?
10:52:34 <andythenorth> to get an offset?
10:52:49 <andythenorth> i.e. advanced varact 2, no special cases to trip up the unwary
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10:53:12 <Eddi|zuHause> not even that complicated
10:53:25 <Eddi|zuHause> query the related object and put in the consist length
10:53:52 <michi_cc> andythenorth: Of course it can, var 40 has the consist length, but apparently that is too special for mb.
11:13:21 <mb> I just wanted to avoid the introduction of a "special" parameter in m4nfo function veh_getinfo().
11:13:31 <mb> And BTW, most of those counter arguments were moot ...
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11:18:14 <peter1138> Do you watch often, mb?
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11:19:06 <NGC3982> in the FIRS primary industries with more then one cargo; shipping cargo #1 doesnt affect cargo #2, right?
11:19:30 <andythenorth> totally unconnected
11:19:41 <NGC3982> i understood this correctly, then.
11:19:46 <andythenorth> there is no magic specific to FIRS that isn't explained
11:19:52 <andythenorth> or that we don't at least try to explain
11:20:08 <NGC3982> i read something about it, but i didnt really.. understand.
11:21:19 <andythenorth> stick some feedback in if you can find the bit that you read
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11:25:33 <NGC3982> andythenorth: i noted that you are the head chicken in the pound of FIRS
11:33:16 <andythenorth> that's what we go to school for
11:43:49 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know what you did in school, but we played Doppelkopf whenever we could...
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11:50:27 <andythenorth> I mostly didn't go to school if I could avoid it
11:50:31 <andythenorth> there was nothing useful there
11:50:41 <TechnoBass> Is there anyone in here?
11:51:11 <TechnoBass> So wats da topic????
11:51:32 <Eddi|zuHause> "1.2.1 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only"
11:52:09 <TechnoBass> Very Helpful Considering i dont know wat that means
11:54:37 <Alberth> you do know you are in #openttd, right?
11:54:45 <TechnoBass> I hate the boring topic
11:55:21 <Zuu> Why care about the topic?
11:55:27 <TechnoBass> # Openttd What is it?
11:56:12 <TechnoBass> It is the forum and am Do you have something with me?
11:56:37 <TechnoBass> Darn stupid translation
11:57:20 <TechnoBass> Since I have been using the translation, I can not speak English I is I do not think that 's work
11:57:40 <Eddi|zuHause> there is a german forum at www.tt-ms.de
11:58:14 <TechnoBass> What about translations cheating?
11:58:45 <TechnoBass> What about inaccurate translations?
11:59:41 <TechnoBass> is so difficult to communicate in a different language, when in fact make sense
11:59:47 <Eddi|zuHause> which translaton?
11:59:52 <Zuu> If you know german, frensh or any other language which an OpenTTD community, you might try there instead of using a translator?
11:59:59 <TechnoBass> is so difficult to communicate in a different language, when in fact I do not make sense
12:00:59 <Zuu> I would be surprised if there isn't a japanese forum. Although I have never been looking for one as I wouldn't understand a word. :-)
12:01:02 <Eddi|zuHause> there is also a japanese community
12:01:29 <TechnoBass> I avoid speaking Westerners
12:02:10 <TechnoBass> Dam ARRRRGGGGGHHH translation
12:03:06 <TechnoBass> It is not translated the right word why?
12:03:53 <TechnoBass> Can you tell the link for my Japanese community?
12:03:56 <Zuu> translators that don't use full information about the situation tend to pick the wrong word from time to time.
12:04:12 <Zuu> Even a human translator is not perfect either.
12:05:05 <Eddi|zuHause> he's got batman ears! shoot him!
12:05:11 <TechnoBass> Your language, it is translated from the right is me How can I see you talking about?
12:05:42 <TechnoBass> I Mean Can You see The Language That I am being Translated From Right?
12:06:40 <Zuu> I don't have a link. It is probably easiest found if searching in japanese on google, but I don't know japanese.
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12:46:18 <Varazir> Is there a way to replace a tranin with the same model with out clone the train ?
12:46:37 <NGC3982> im getting reports on a lot of people being unable to download files from the online content.
12:46:50 <NGC3982> and something about lots of them being corrupt.
12:46:56 <NGC3982> are all of the online-content from the same source?
12:47:18 <NGC3982> (with "online-content" as the usable function in the game)
12:47:22 <Varazir> Zuu: is it a consol command ?
12:47:47 <Zuu> Varazir: Not as far as I know. It's the name of the feature. You enable it through the advanced settings.
12:48:32 <Zuu> In adv. settings you set the money and age limit before it will kick in. It might also be possible to turn it off completely there.
12:56:13 <Varazir> I would like to replace them every x year
12:58:09 <Zuu> The feature exist to stop you from having to do tedious manual work, but still not allow you to get fresh (<2 year old) vehicles without having to do any work.
12:59:15 <Zuu> Set the age limit to -12 months, and your vehicles will be replaced one year before it will complain about being old.
13:05:10 <Varazir> ok I can accept not auto just that I can replace the tranin with the same model and not have to replace them model x and back to the model y again
13:06:56 <Varazir> if it's not going to happen I guess cloning is the next best thing
13:08:29 <Varazir> I'll look at the adv option
13:08:35 <michi_cc> NGC3982: Using nightlies on windows?
13:11:54 <NGC3982> michi_cc: no, 1.2.1 stable.
13:12:11 <NGC3982> michi_cc: ill have a version check with the people that reported errors.
13:16:27 <Terkhen> Varazir: using advanced orders you can stop vehicles with a given age in a specific depot
13:17:30 <Terkhen> although you still need to clone new ones that should reduce micromanagement a bit
13:19:47 <Alberth> alternatively, spend your time expanding the network :)
13:33:33 <andythenorth> if the config for a vehicle specifies which other vehicle replaces it...
13:33:40 <andythenorth> I can automate all the model life crap
13:34:21 <andythenorth> make the computer do the maths
13:44:28 <Eddi|zuHause> that's exactly what i did in CETS
13:45:13 <Eddi|zuHause> (because of the flexible sets within CETS, i occasionally specify multiple replacements, of which the earliest available is taken)
13:47:22 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause you did it in nml? or in python when processing config?
13:48:50 <Eddi|zuHause> in python i calculate the difference in years, and in nml i use ternary operator for model_life = orig_model_life + vehicle1_available?-5:vehicle2_available?-2:0; or similar
13:49:32 <Eddi|zuHause> where "available" means "is selected by parameter"
13:51:21 <Eddi|zuHause> and where "orig_model_life" is calculated based on real stats for when the vehicle was removed from service
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14:02:47 <Eddi|zuHause> since you don't have this dynamic approach of selecting or deselecting certain vehicles, you can do all in nml, i suppose
14:03:09 <Eddi|zuHause> except for looking up the introduction year for the replacement vehicle
14:03:33 <andythenorth> I can get that at compile time, python obj. ref
14:04:08 <Eddi|zuHause> the formula would be "model_life = replacement.introduction - this.introduction + this.vehicle_life;"
14:04:31 <Eddi|zuHause> early retire stays the same
14:08:24 <andythenorth> isn't it nicer writing nml with python objects in scope? :)
14:08:28 <andythenorth> for the vehicles...
14:09:47 <Alberth> merge nml and python into one language?
14:10:01 <andythenorth> what would you suggest?
14:10:20 <andythenorth> Alberth: more seriously...
14:10:26 <andythenorth> hide the actual need to write nml?
14:10:37 <andythenorth> just create props on python objs?
14:11:13 <Alberth> or even create NML ast directly from python, skipping the parsing
14:11:39 <Alberth> origin tracking will be a bitch probably :(
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15:09:43 <peter1138> well, this is bullshit
15:14:58 <LordAro> depends what scope you are in
15:22:58 <planetmaker> 15:58 NGC3982: [14:46:37] im getting reports on a lot of people being unable to download files from the online content. <-- that would need to be much more specific, please
15:23:08 <planetmaker> reports like "stuff doesn't work" cannot be fixed
15:27:03 <telanus> cool. ogfx-trains translated into afrikaans
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15:29:23 <Terkhen> telanus: translations for ogfx rv are welcome too :)
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15:29:30 <peter1138> This is _still_ bullshit.
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15:34:16 <peter1138> So I thought, hey, I could use this package and that package in the new version... so upgraded.
15:34:29 <peter1138> Two words: GNOME 3.
15:34:48 <peter1138> Utter useless heap of shite. Totally different from GNOME 2.
15:35:36 <telanus> Terkhen: I'll do it tomorrow
15:36:12 <Alberth> peter1138: yep, I switched to KDE
15:36:28 <Terkhen> telanus: awesome, thanks :)
15:37:36 <peter1138> I can't believe they've made it so useless. So useless that changing fonts is an advanced setting that you need a special tool for...
15:40:03 <Alberth> my biggest problem was the desktops moving when you close some application
15:40:34 <Mazur> My problem was not having my panels on top and botrtom anymore.
15:41:08 <Mazur> And wit KDE it was having a kbuildsycoca stuck in a loop eating up one CPU.
15:41:10 <Alberth> does that have two panels?
15:44:05 <peter1138> metacity --replace&&
15:44:32 <peter1138> Not quite Gnome 2 but so...
15:45:04 <peter1138> Gnome 3 is clearly designed for a use-case of not using a computer.
15:47:39 <frosch123> i heard that kde4 is getting usable again
15:47:54 <frosch123> though i did not hear it yet from someone trustworthy
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15:50:14 <peter1138> Right, I might trash this install and go back to Squeeze...
15:50:43 <Matulla> Hi all can i get a Trainstation split in length so 2 trains are able to unload one behind the other
15:50:44 <frosch123> haha, luckily i installed it only in a vm, so i have still squeeze
15:51:20 <frosch123> Matulla: no, you can only build two stations, and add enough signalling between them
15:51:31 <Matulla> or does parallel unload/load only work in paralles stations
15:54:46 <peter1138> Not a huge issue, this was an old lenny install and had a load of cruft in /usr/local. Installing Squeeze doesn't actually take long at all.
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16:49:58 <NGC3982> any tip on neat big bus/truck grf's?
17:11:58 <Terkhen> HEQS, new eGRVTS and OpenGFX RV... I don't know other updated options
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17:42:36 <peter1138> Okay, XFCE is more pleasant than GNOME 3...
17:42:43 <peter1138> ... and I hated XFCE...
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17:45:27 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: translators * r24436 /trunk/src/lang/korean.txt:
17:45:27 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:27 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: korean - 7 changes by telk5093
18:06:03 <andythenorth> the sky is falling! :o
18:06:23 <__ln__> it's falling and you wouldn't have told us?!
18:06:52 <Alberth> he just did, didn't he?
18:07:41 <andythenorth> ^ worried about the sky
18:07:50 <andythenorth> probably building an underground shelter
18:09:01 * andythenorth concludes that MB got the ship type balance very correct in New Ships
18:09:15 <andythenorth> I have been trying to avoid aping that set, it exists already
18:09:33 <andythenorth> but for gameplay purposes, the ship types are correct
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18:28:22 <andythenorth> broken down vehicles
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18:28:29 <andythenorth> vehicles-in-vehicles surely?
18:33:36 <andythenorth> "But if you want roads itself producing cargos, I must be in the imaginary boundary of hell and heaven."
18:33:49 <andythenorth> "everything is cargo" :D
18:34:16 <andythenorth> should I be putting tinfoil on electrical things?
18:35:28 <telanus> this would be a nightmare to implement , or so I think:
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18:36:54 <andythenorth> it's just a cargo tile (ship) that can move
18:37:00 <andythenorth> loading other cargo (trains)
18:37:06 <andythenorth> containing cargo
18:37:31 <andythenorth> which it can do because the ship itself contains a type of cargo called (station)
18:37:51 <andythenorth> telanus: sadly I am trolling
18:38:02 <andythenorth> frosch123 made a funny joke recently, and I have been unable to let it drop
18:38:10 <andythenorth> despite it was only funny the first time
18:39:11 <frosch123> the problem is that there are only 32 rail types
18:39:43 <frosch123> so the sum of all vehicle types, railtypes, industries and houses cannot go above 32
18:40:12 <andythenorth> ach, but we need to extend that anyway
18:40:18 <frosch123> though if you use "autorail" as cargo you can at least build tracks in all directions instead of using 4 slots for a single railtype
18:51:51 <andythenorth> no rear watertight doors?
18:51:56 <andythenorth> following swell might not be pleasant
18:52:19 <andythenorth> they probably know more about naval architecture than me though :P
18:52:46 <frosch123> looks like the water can easily flow out of the back
18:52:53 <frosch123> so, doesn't that make it unsinkable?
18:53:11 <andythenorth> the upper deck might be an addition
18:54:12 <blathijs> Aren't we looking at the front of the ship, here?
18:54:20 <blathijs> (Also, it looks like half a ship to me...)
19:07:26 * Belugas enjoys DeathMole - Harpies, from Absent Gods & Creatures Foul
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19:55:53 <frosch123> too fast for a boat
20:02:02 <andythenorth> could make stations vehicles :P
20:02:18 <andythenorth> could make vehicles vehicles
20:02:40 <NGC3982> make it, and make my day.
20:03:58 <andythenorth> special rail type
20:04:22 <andythenorth> if the *train* sprites also showed ferry
20:04:27 <andythenorth> when on a certain railtype
20:04:33 <andythenorth> and cb36 for speed
20:04:38 <andythenorth> yeah, it can be done
20:04:53 <andythenorth> just need a special bridge, a special railtype, and some madness with sprites
20:05:23 <NGC3982> to make a ferry for trains?
20:07:38 <Supercheese> Wouldn't there be licensing issues?
20:07:54 <Supercheese> or do Star Wars fan works have immunity?
20:09:07 <Rubidium> only 70 years (+ the number of years that will be added to that in the future) after the death of the author the licensing issues will not be there
20:09:56 <Supercheese> There are so many good isometric sprites of Star Wars stuff out there, I wonder if there's any way to make a grf from them and be able to distribute it without license migraines
20:09:58 <Rubidium> given the way the US congress keeps extending those times for audio, I doubt it will ever be free of copyright and thus license free
20:10:27 <Supercheese> claiming fair use doesn't seem to solve anything
20:12:11 <Supercheese> Here's a trip: Google 3D Warehouse terms say: "You give other end users of the Services a perpetual, sublicensable, irrevocable, worldwide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive license to reproduce, adapt, modify, translate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute Existing Geolocated Models, Existing Non-Geolocated Models, New Models and related content and derivative works...
20:12:12 <Supercheese> ...thereof which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services."
20:12:48 <Rubidium> well... people upload stuff they're not supposed to upload there
20:13:03 <Rubidium> and onto youtube, and onto OpenTTD's content service
20:13:05 <Supercheese> So, derivative sprites of that model would be licensed... how?
20:15:23 <andythenorth> the design is probably distinctive enough to be protected in various ways
20:15:36 <andythenorth> all your base belong to lucas
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