IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2011-09-13
00:24:42 *** Devedse has quit IRC
00:28:28 *** glx has joined #openttd
00:28:28 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx
00:46:29 *** Priski has joined #openttd
00:48:47 *** KritiK has quit IRC
00:50:58 *** bryjen has joined #openttd
00:57:37 *** glx has quit IRC
01:55:07 *** bryjen has quit IRC
01:57:02 *** dfox has quit IRC
01:59:09 *** dfox has joined #openttd
02:00:55 *** TWerkhoven has joined #openttd
02:26:32 *** rhaeder has joined #openttd
02:31:28 *** rhaeder1 has quit IRC
02:38:22 *** TWerkhoven has quit IRC
02:52:02 *** dfox has quit IRC
03:16:56 <EyeMWing> When figuring tractive effort when real figures aren't available, what's a good value for the coefficient of friction? Theoretical max is .78, but that's crazy unrealistic.
03:17:34 <Elukka> i haven't the slightest idea, but i'd take an engine that does have its tractive effort known and fiddle with the equation until it results in something close
03:18:22 <EyeMWing> Oddly enough, the only locomotive I DON'T have a real value for is the only one I actually have a sales brochure for
03:18:50 <EyeMWing> I suppose I could just look at the US Set and assume oracle did his homework back in the day.
03:24:24 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
03:51:18 *** Kurimus has joined #openttd
04:02:17 *** Xrufuian has joined #openttd
04:18:45 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC
04:28:06 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd
04:43:55 <EyeMWing> Huh. OTTD's realistic acceleration model is actually seriously damned realistic.
04:44:15 <EyeMWing> Punched in the exact real world numbers for this train, built a realistic consist
04:44:23 <EyeMWing> and it EXACTLY hits the real world performance figures.
04:47:57 <Elukka> that's a bit amazing
04:48:54 <EyeMWing> The bug reports for this will be delicious
04:49:19 <EyeMWing> "IT NEVER HITS ITS TOP SPEED!" (It doesn't in real life, either)
04:49:39 <EyeMWing> and "it takes a million years to get to that speed" (because it does)
04:50:52 <Elukka> my trains in 2cc don't either
04:51:03 <Elukka> though i'm running a little switching diesel because i can't afford any better :(
04:57:11 <Elukka> feature request: ship railroad
04:57:12 <Elukka>
04:57:14 <Elukka> :P
04:57:17 <EyeMWing> Hrm
04:57:52 *** DOUK has quit IRC
05:00:26 <Elukka>
05:00:42 <Elukka> ha, that was posted in a something awful thread
05:00:45 <Elukka> the second reply to that is "Someone needs to put atomic engines into OpenTTD."
05:01:42 <EyeMWing> I'm pretty sure there's a nuclear-fired steam engine somewhere
05:02:22 <Elukka> "Fun fact: a colleague of mine came in to the tech room on site one day laughing because he'd seen a loco come in with a fault. Looked up the fault code, turns out it's the fault that says you haven't had a fault in 28(? or so) days and to check shit to make sure it's still working."
05:02:51 <Elukka> "Our locos run 24/7 until they break and get dragged in dead or they hit their ~3-week maintenance block and come in for inspection. That is to say, they go mine<->port in a constant loop, stopping every 10-12 hours (as they pass the stations near the ports) to do a crew change but otherwise run literally 24/7 (or close to it) in most cases."
05:02:51 <Elukka> o_O
05:02:57 <EyeMWing> BMW makes locomotives?
05:05:55 *** KouDy has joined #openttd
05:06:09 *** TheMask96- has joined #openttd
05:07:50 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC
05:14:59 *** PhoenixII has joined #openttd
05:18:29 *** dfox has joined #openttd
05:20:20 *** Phoenix_the_II has quit IRC
05:27:15 *** dfox has quit IRC
05:36:40 *** jo2k has joined #openttd
05:44:17 *** dfox has joined #openttd
05:46:45 *** DayDreamer has joined #openttd
05:47:55 *** DayDreamer has left #openttd
06:09:47 *** Br33z4hSlut5 has joined #openttd
06:17:18 *** Prof_Frink has quit IRC
06:27:23 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
06:31:47 *** valhallasw has joined #openttd
06:34:12 *** jo2k has quit IRC
06:34:22 *** jo2k has joined #openttd
06:55:24 *** PeanutHorst has joined #openttd
06:57:22 *** Cybertinus has joined #openttd
07:06:33 *** valhallasw has quit IRC
07:08:30 *** Devroush has joined #openttd
07:19:30 *** TheMask96- has quit IRC
07:23:52 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd
07:25:56 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd
07:33:41 *** Priski has quit IRC
07:33:42 *** Priski has joined #openttd
07:38:46 *** AD has quit IRC
07:41:15 *** kamnet has joined #openttd
07:41:34 <kamnet> Good morning all. Long time, no see.
07:43:49 *** Belugas has quit IRC
07:44:00 *** AD has joined #openttd
07:44:03 <__ln__> true, the project has been C++ for years.
07:44:26 *** Belugas has joined #openttd
07:44:26 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Belugas
07:44:38 *** AD is now known as Guest10085
07:53:42 *** Xrufuian has quit IRC
08:05:01 *** TWerkhoven has joined #openttd
08:08:37 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
08:09:04 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd
08:10:57 *** Mks has quit IRC
08:16:09 <Terkhen> good morning
08:18:05 <Ammler> buenos dias
08:25:10 <Sacro> Прижет
08:25:17 <Sacro> *Привет
08:25:44 <Markk> Goedemorgen
08:32:19 *** pjpe has quit IRC
08:34:28 <V453000> hm, plastic in Pikka basic industries should look like toyland grey-ish thing, or can it be colourful? What do you think? I am trying to compare it to other cargo sets ... would comparison to dyes/chemicals (ecs/firs) be appropriate?
08:35:37 <Terkhen> in the next version of OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles it will be carried in small barrels or covered
08:35:48 <Terkhen> I'd say it is more similar to chemicals
08:36:13 <V453000> right :) you know, I want to have all cargoes visible, putting those three in a see-through tanker
08:36:21 <V453000> guess it wont hurt if they are the same :)
08:36:38 <V453000> who plays PBI anyway..
08:36:42 <Terkhen> makes sense for your set, but I don't think that any other set carries plastic in the open
08:37:03 <V453000> well, not in the open, it is in the tanker! :P
08:37:07 <Terkhen> we have barrels with different colours at the top for each cargo, chemicals, plastics and something similar
08:37:12 <Ammler> nuts!
08:37:18 <Terkhen> the tanker only has a sprite for chemicals... a warning sign
08:38:01 <V453000> but in the end ... I am going to have 2 wagons, one tanker with chemicals, one with plastic for toyland, so I guess PBI plastic can be put to either one without extra drawing effort :) solved
08:39:20 <b_jonas> shouldn't plastic look like little colored cubical packages of uniform size?
08:39:53 <V453000> I have absolutely no clue how "plastic" actually looks like
08:40:05 <b_jonas> I'm not saying it actually looks like that
08:40:18 <planetmaker> <-hmm... he really doesn't understand the benefit of using patch queues
08:40:18 <b_jonas> I'm saying it should look like that so it's more easily distinguishable
08:40:39 <b_jonas> just make sure it's not the same as goods (but goods is usually carried in closed wagons, it's colored cubes only on stations)
08:40:43 <V453000> :P
08:41:07 <V453000> it probably does not matter anyway
08:41:16 <V453000> it is just one cargo in PBI which I believe is not very played
08:41:37 <b_jonas> I'd like more wagons that clearly show whether they're full
08:42:03 <b_jonas> ideally all (except possibly mail and livestock) should be like that
08:42:04 <V453000> all of my wagons show whether they are full
08:42:14 <V453000> but there are only 3 kinds of empty ones
08:42:15 <b_jonas> what's the name of this GRF?
08:42:26 <V453000> well, NUTS ... in development
08:42:36 <b_jonas> oh
08:43:01 <V453000> you can find it on the openttdcoop devzone under "unrealistic train set"
08:45:17 <planetmaker> can someone tell ic111 that using a patch queue is not about distributed development at all, but about easing his work (and easing review of it)?
08:45:22 <planetmaker> I obviously failed :-P
08:46:09 <planetmaker> it's a shame to see a good idea so badly managed :-)
08:51:48 <Terkhen> I can try an indirect way
08:52:05 <Terkhen> but I already failed when trying it directly :P
08:54:26 <V453000> hm, what are refined products actually<
08:54:29 <V453000> ?
08:54:45 <V453000> some sort of liquid chemical?
08:57:21 <Terkhen> given that refined products and chemicals share a cargo label, I always considered them to be the same thing
08:57:23 <Eddi|zuHause> fuel oil, plastic, fertilizer, ...
08:58:13 <V453000> hmm, yeah, I am just trying to put them in "how does it actually look like" ... so some yellow-ish liquid?
08:59:30 <Eddi|zuHause> chemicals come in all kinds of colours
09:00:51 <Terkhen> random recolour? :P
09:00:51 <b_jonas> so it can be whatever color differs enough from other cargo?
09:01:22 <V453000> hmm >p
09:01:24 <V453000> :p
09:01:34 <V453000> I suppose
09:01:58 <Eddi|zuHause> you don't usually see the chemicals... why do you need their colour?
09:02:06 <TWerkhoven> transparant tankers?
09:02:54 <V453000> ^
09:03:11 <MNIM> ...that's kindof interesting
09:03:24 <Eddi|zuHause> to differentiate fuel oil from heating oil (for tax reasons), they are added with different colours
09:03:55 <Eddi|zuHause> fuel oil gets slightly green-ish colour, while heating oil gets red
09:04:03 <V453000> true :) good point
09:04:05 <TWerkhoven> and theres white (colorless) and red (pink) diesel in some countries
09:04:37 <Markk> We have ethanol that is red here in Sweden.
09:04:37 *** PeanutHorst has quit IRC
09:04:42 <Markk> Pure ethanol that is.
09:04:53 <Markk> Or ~99%-ish.
09:04:59 <MNIM> red diesel means diesel for agrarian purposes over here, for, you know, tractors, combines, that kind of things
09:05:05 <Markk> So that people won't drink it.
09:05:06 <TWerkhoven> and citroen uses biohazard-green hydraulic fluid, recentrly changed to bright orange
09:05:06 <MNIM> no tax over that
09:05:11 <V453000> ok, now technical question ... what is the maxium of possible refits for a single wagon<
09:05:12 <V453000> ?
09:05:41 <Eddi|zuHause> 32*256
09:05:53 <Terkhen> 32 cargos, 256 subtypes IIRC
09:06:02 <V453000> ooh
09:06:04 <Terkhen> but you can always use cargo classes / cargo labels for the rest
09:06:11 <MNIM> white diesel is your average 'get it at the pump' variety, with massive tax on top of it
09:07:08 <TWerkhoven> yup
09:07:19 <Terkhen> <--- that is how my cargo sprite switch looks in ogfx-rv :P
09:07:31 <MNIM> so for people with agrarian machines it gets rather tempting to use their red diesel meant for the tractor for the family car too
09:07:53 <TWerkhoven> not that red is so much cheaper these days
09:08:08 <TWerkhoven> its not tax-free, just less taxed afaik
09:08:37 <V453000> Alright, and is that separate with for example firs/original? So I could make 1 wagon for all 29 FIRS cargoes, and one for all the default cargoes?
09:08:42 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC
09:09:15 <Eddi|zuHause> the red colour is evil, after you filled your tank with it once, it can be measured even after >100 refills
09:09:43 <MNIM> very effective.
09:10:22 <MNIM> it's easier and cheaper to fill your tank with kerosene - if your engine can run it
09:10:32 <Terkhen> V453000: if you mean my code, it is separated by labels; that's the bulk truck, and it can carry all bulk cargos from all sets
09:10:48 <MNIM> but then you need to procure kerosene somewere
09:10:52 <V453000> no, in general
09:11:06 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: can you buy heating oil from a pump on a regular gas station over there?
09:11:15 <Terkhen> you could make a wagon for FIRS cargos and another one for default cargos, and you could make a universal wagon that carries cargo from every set
09:11:30 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: not that i know of...
09:11:57 <Terkhen> the 32 limit IIRC is for refittable_cargo_types
09:12:04 <__ln__> over here you can; not on every gas station, but many.
09:12:08 <V453000> what does that mean Terkhen ? :)
09:12:09 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: but if you have 4000l at home, it's not that difficult to get it into your tank...
09:12:36 <Terkhen> if you use refittable_cargo_classes and non_refittable_cargo_classes only, you have no limits
09:12:42 <Terkhen> then you can make a huge switch with all cargos
09:13:04 <V453000> oh :) okay
09:13:23 <V453000> so basically it is possible to have one wagon refittable to any cargo in the game
09:13:34 <V453000> and changing it's sprites accordingly
09:13:48 <Eddi|zuHause> yes.
09:13:59 <V453000> good :) what I needed to hear, thanks
09:14:00 <__ln__> however, getting caught using heating oil instead of diesel results in a massive tax bill to pay.
09:14:04 <Terkhen> refittable_cargo_classes: bitmask(CC_PASSENGERS, CC_MAIL, ... , CC_OVERSIZED, ..., CC_whatever)
09:16:22 *** yorick has quit IRC
09:17:08 *** Progman has joined #openttd
09:20:53 *** Neon has joined #openttd
09:43:21 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd
09:47:45 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
09:49:47 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC
10:19:44 *** jotham has joined #openttd
10:19:56 <jotham> is there a way to double the size of the tiles? on my laptop it's quite tiny
10:20:00 <jotham> 15" 1920x1080
10:20:34 <Markk> That's a pretty huge laptop imo.
10:20:35 <Yexo> you could play fullscreen and chose a lower resolution
10:20:59 <Yexo> there is no other supported option
10:21:15 <Yexo> you can download the extra-zoom version, but it's a bit outdated by now
10:21:26 <peter1138> must be an old laptop
10:21:35 <peter1138> all the modern ones come with 1366x768 :(
10:22:02 <Yexo> mine has 1680x1050
10:22:13 <b_jonas> like these strange mini-laptops
10:22:47 <jotham> 1 year old w510 thinkpad
10:23:00 <__ln__> peter1138: that's because laptop manufacturers noticed OpenTTD is too tiny on the screen and in lack of a software solution, they chose to use smaller resolution screens.
10:23:01 <jotham> yeah i remember i think with ttdx there being a double size option
10:23:11 <jotham> if it was a mac it'd be fine
10:23:16 <jotham> love their zoom function in the os
10:23:43 <Yexo> jotham: there never ws with ttdx. There was a double-size option in very old versions of OpenTTD, but it only worked on windows
10:23:52 <jotham> ahh
10:26:49 <peter1138> yeah, do it the ttd way. set it to fullscreen 640x480
10:27:18 <jotham> le sigh
10:29:13 <b_jonas> what? ttd runs in a higher res than that
10:29:33 <__ln__> who?
10:30:53 <b_jonas> no, you're right, it's 640x480
10:31:00 <b_jonas> I don't know why I thoguht it was higher
10:31:57 <peter1138> well, back when it was new, 640x480 was high res
10:32:18 <b_jonas> sure, I just misremembered
10:32:50 <__ln__> was Locomotion also 640x480?
10:33:08 <b_jonas> no, Locomotion needs more hardware so I think it can run on higher res
10:33:20 <b_jonas> I'm not sure, I don't have a copy of it handy
10:33:23 <b_jonas> I don't like that game
10:34:04 <__ln__> It certainly didn't support very high resolutions in any case.
10:56:47 *** Eddi|zuHause2 has joined #openttd
10:58:13 *** zachanima has quit IRC
11:03:02 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
11:04:10 <kamnet> So, if I get unlazy enough, I'm thinking about Fake Airports for OpenGFX. :)
11:06:02 *** Swissfan91 has joined #openttd
11:08:05 <b_jonas> fake airports? what are those?
11:08:41 <kamnet> Station tiles/eyecandy that make airports look bigger
11:08:53 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd
11:09:00 <b_jonas> oh, you mean custom assemblable airports
11:09:06 <b_jonas> like the way newgrf stations work now
11:09:20 <kamnet> Well not really. Planes etc. won't actually use them.
11:09:45 <kamnet> But, they look pretty :-)
11:10:09 <jotham> screenshot of a cool newgrf stationnnn
11:10:16 <kamnet> Really though it needs redone in NML / NewObjects. I might see if I can rope WallyWeb into coding for it for me *chuckle*
11:10:19 <b_jonas> coudln't a newgrf just implement those as no-rail railway station tiles?
11:11:08 <kamnet> Yep. And that's what the current Fake Airport does. But because they're not rail tiles, and because they're just eyecandy, they should be redone as NewObjects.
11:11:26 <kamnet> But when Fake Airport was originally created 6-something years ago, there was no NewObjects yet.
11:11:51 <b_jonas> so you mean they shouldn't count in cargo collection/acceptance and station spread?
11:12:29 <kamnet> Nope, not necessary.
11:13:04 <b_jonas> I guess, with the large catchment area airports have these days, you don't need extra tiles for them
11:16:29 <kamnet> Nope
11:16:39 <kamnet> Here's a screenshot I did a long time ago
11:16:40 <kamnet>
11:18:12 <b_jonas> ah
11:18:24 <b_jonas> pity the real airport is still surrounded by a fence
11:18:34 <b_jonas> but it looks nice
11:18:38 <b_jonas> withthe large airport building
11:19:00 <b_jonas> with train coming in
11:20:16 <b_jonas> and all the cars
11:21:38 <kamnet> Yep. The Fake Airport tiles are to the left and bottom of the airport. They need redone.
11:22:06 <kamnet> The original author decided to make his own color of asphalt instead of using something closer to the original TTD tiles
11:23:04 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause
11:23:10 <Eddi|zuHause> un-fencing the real airport can be done
11:23:15 <kamnet> The hangars don't match with the TTD ones either.
11:23:28 <kamnet> Yeah, it *SHOULD* be done.
11:23:55 <b_jonas> Eddi|zuHause: sure, just turn off full detail
11:23:59 <b_jonas> :-)
11:24:09 <Eddi|zuHause> b_jonas: no, i mean by the newgrf
11:24:21 <Eddi|zuHause> like, detecting objects nearby and stuff
11:25:37 <kamnet> Would be nice if ChillCore could find some time to update his patch pack with a new OpenTTD revision. :D
11:26:02 <Eddi|zuHause> kamnet: there's a difficulty to distinguish original hangars, opengfx hangars, or some visual airport replacement hangars
11:27:00 <kamnet> There is?
11:27:38 <Eddi|zuHause> kamnet: i mean the newgrf can't properly detect which ones are actually used
11:28:23 <kamnet> Which NewGRF, specifically?
11:28:24 <Eddi|zuHause> kamnet: maybe you can reuse the original hangar sprite by the object, then you would catch at least all Action A replacements
11:28:45 <Eddi|zuHause> kamnet: i mean a hypothetical fake airport objects grf
11:29:49 <kamnet> Well you can't use the original hangar sprites from TTD. That would (hypothetically) get you in trouble.
11:30:44 <kamnet> But, I can replace the sprites in a copy of FA with the ones from OpenGFX+
11:32:00 <kamnet> Really it's the asphalt that bothers me the most.
11:32:40 <Eddi|zuHause> kamnet: you can reference an original sprite without including it in the grf
11:33:20 <kamnet> I could, if I wanted to make something that worked with Original TTD.
11:33:20 <Eddi|zuHause> kamnet: look at the fenced land in opengfx+landscape, it automatically reuses the fence of whatever base set you use
11:33:49 <kamnet> I'm looking at this to specifically match OpenGFX.
11:33:57 <Eddi|zuHause> that is silly.
11:34:32 <kamnet> Quite possibly the silliest thing I've done since creating a rock to replace a transmitter :-)
11:36:38 <kamnet> If somebody wants to trouble themselves with writing that code, that's fine. But, sad to say, I neither have the time to bury my head back into old NFO, or try to figure out NML to a large degree.
11:37:23 <Yexo> Eddi|zuHause: you could reuse the sprite from the baseset, but it only has them in one rotation
11:37:45 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: indeed, that is a problem
11:37:47 <Yexo> if you want multiple rotations (to fit the rotated airports in opengfx+airports) you'll have to include sprites from that project
11:37:48 <kamnet> So if I can't figure out Wally's example NewObjects code, then I may opt to just do a sprite swap on a copy of Fake Airports.
11:38:00 <kamnet> Ah good point Yexo.:D
11:38:13 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: we could add the other rotations to the base set :p
11:38:32 <Yexo> you can't in a good way
11:38:33 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: afair RichK once made them to match the original hangars
11:39:01 <Yexo> you only grf you can add sprites to in the baseset is the extra grf, and those don't get static sprite numbers since those sprites are added by action5
11:39:43 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: so we need a way to access action-5 sprites?
11:39:58 <Yexo> yes, which doesn't exist yet
11:40:08 <Eddi|zuHause> they don't have absolute sprite numbers, but known IDs and positions within that ID
11:40:26 <Yexo> yes, I'm not saying it can't be done, just that it isn't done yet
11:40:40 <Yexo> and I don't see much relevance in adding those extra airport sprites to the baseset, they don't belong there
11:41:35 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: no, but then we only need to prepare the action 5 code, not actually include them. then a static grf could provide them
11:41:53 <Eddi|zuHause> that's probably a silly idea :p
11:45:46 *** norbert79 has joined #openttd
11:48:57 <norbert79> Question: While I am happy to see, that Generic Linux binaries are linked statically again (caused me a bit of a headache figuring out which libraries I am missing), does this mean any changes to the minimum requirements?
11:49:13 <kamnet> What I'd really like to do is just a whole refresh on Fake Airports. First with OpenGFX, then with the rest of the graphics from Combined Airports.
11:49:33 <norbert79> good afternoon btw :)
11:49:53 <Eddi|zuHause> norbert79: what minimum requirements?
11:50:07 <norbert79> Eddi|zuHause: Behalf of libraries present, and Kernel minimum
11:50:19 *** yorick has joined #openttd
11:50:40 <Eddi|zuHause> no idea what those are...
11:50:45 <norbert79> Eddi|zuHause: Example: While some libraries were already statically linked, SDL was to be expected to be present.
11:51:00 <norbert79> Eddi|zuHause: I mean such
11:54:02 <norbert79> Eddi|zuHause: Never mind, I assume it will be the same like before 1.1.2
12:12:34 *** kamnet has quit IRC
13:12:35 <Belugas> hi
13:13:15 <norbert79> Hi Belugas
13:13:25 <Belugas> hi norbert79 :)
13:35:32 *** Markavian has quit IRC
14:19:21 *** Adambean has joined #openttd
14:26:04 *** glx has joined #openttd
14:26:04 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx
14:28:39 *** Pulec has joined #openttd
14:51:15 <__ln__>
14:52:00 <Sacro> anyone python here?
14:52:06 <__ln__> monty?
14:53:28 <Rubidium> no, last time I checked I was human
14:57:30 <planetmaker> zzzzZZZZzzz
14:58:03 <planetmaker> gotta love meta questions :-)
14:58:22 <Terkhen> I saw a python once
14:58:23 <Terkhen> :P
14:58:38 <planetmaker> yeah... was like "zzzzZZZZzzz" ;-)
14:58:58 <planetmaker> maybe I should visit the Zoo again. Or maybe the nearby snake farm
14:59:05 <planetmaker> yes, that exists. I've no idea why
14:59:23 <Terkhen> heh
15:04:39 <Belugas> harvesting the snakes, when they all are mature enough
15:05:05 <planetmaker> maybe snake skin leather hand bags ;-)
15:05:41 *** mib_9xthg0 has joined #openttd
15:09:42 *** mib_9xthg0 has quit IRC
15:09:51 *** Br33z4hSlut5 has quit IRC
15:10:40 <Belugas> indeed :)
15:10:44 <Belugas> and not for the seeds
15:10:46 *** mib_63nlpn has joined #openttd
15:11:29 <norbert79> Sacro: You might be interested in this freely available book, as start.
15:12:19 <Sacro> norbert79: thanks :D
15:12:31 <norbert79> Sacro: You're welcome :)
15:12:59 *** Parastais has joined #openttd
15:13:48 <Sacro> section 2.5 had my answer!
15:15:23 <norbert79> Sacro: I keep a lot of such documents on my PC or the links to such, because I knew, that one day one will come looking for that specific book ;-)
15:15:37 <Sacro> norbert79: hehe :)
15:15:41 <Sacro> I'm anoob at python
15:17:49 <norbert79> Me too, never used it yet, but I still keep copies of documentations, for such occasions
15:22:30 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
15:23:40 *** loopcoop has joined #openttd
15:23:41 <TrueBrain> NOTICE: the website will be poorly reachable for the next 15 minutes due to a MySQL migration (you will receive errors; enjoy them).
15:24:26 <__ln__> unacceptable, we demand 100% uptime and availability
15:24:41 <TrueBrain> @kick __ln__ you knew this would be coming, wouldn't you?
15:24:41 *** __ln__ was kicked by DorpsGek (you knew this would be coming, wouldn't you?)
15:25:21 *** __ln__ has joined #openttd
15:25:26 * TrueBrain hugs __ln__
15:25:36 * __ln__ hugs TB
15:36:21 <TrueBrain> right, 13 minutes later
15:36:25 <TrueBrain> everything should be back up and running
15:36:28 <TrueBrain> please report any problems here
15:50:49 *** pugi has joined #openttd
16:06:06 *** Markavian has joined #openttd
16:09:07 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
16:14:26 *** norbert79 has quit IRC
16:20:48 *** valhallasw has joined #openttd
16:38:16 *** Brianetta has quit IRC
16:43:48 *** pjpe has joined #openttd
16:56:05 *** douknoukem has joined #openttd
16:57:53 *** LordAro has joined #openttd
16:58:17 <LordAro> evenings
17:06:21 <Elukka> ah, one of those history channel ALIENS BUILT THE PYRAMIDS documentaries is on
17:06:52 <Elukka>
17:07:43 <Rubidium> Elukka: oh, you mean Stargate SG-1?
17:08:03 <Elukka> it's pretty much the same except the hair is worse
17:10:48 *** pjpe has quit IRC
17:16:42 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... in case i have the dump of the content of a windows disk, but no appropriate boot loader... where can i get one to boot this in a virtual machine?
17:17:15 <b_jonas> Eddi|zuHause: what version of Windows?
17:17:22 <Eddi|zuHause> 7, i think
17:17:38 <b_jonas> is the dump of a whole hard disk?
17:17:46 <b_jonas> of a partition?
17:17:56 <Eddi|zuHause> the content of a partition
17:19:00 <b_jonas> Eddi|zuHause: was that partition originally the first partition on a disk?
17:19:10 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, drive C:
17:19:36 <b_jonas> in that case the windows boot loader should probably be in the boot sector of that partition,
17:19:51 <Eddi|zuHause> no, i only have the filesystem content
17:19:53 <b_jonas> so you only need a boot loader that loads the first sector of that partition,
17:19:58 <b_jonas> oh, that's worse
17:20:05 <b_jonas> only filesystem content
17:20:12 <Eddi|zuHause> and i don't have an installation cd
17:20:23 <b_jonas> in that case, I don't know, ask someone who actually understands windows
17:20:23 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: boot with the ins... ok
17:21:07 <Eddi|zuHause> i actually don't think i have any windows installation cd at all currently...
17:27:36 <Rubidium> some rescue disk like the ultimate boot cd?
17:27:52 <Rubidium> might have some mbr "recover" stuff for Windows
17:28:49 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC
17:31:22 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
17:38:07 <Eddi|zuHause> other question: how do i decode the windows registry?
17:42:08 <SmatZ> there is an offline registry editor/viewer, iirc
17:44:06 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: maybe
17:44:16 <SmatZ> actually there seem to be many utilites for that purpose
17:44:30 <SmatZ> This is a utility to reset the password of any user that has a valid local account on your Windows system.
17:44:37 <SmatZ> hmm so it only resets the password...
17:45:54 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r22930 /trunk/src/lang/ (6 files): (log message trimmed)
17:45:54 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:54 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: estonian - 32 changes by notAbot
17:45:55 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: hungarian - 6 changes by IPG
17:45:55 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: luxembourgish - 17 changes by Phreeze
17:45:56 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: slovak - 67 changes by klingacik
17:45:56 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: turkish - 4 changes by niw3
17:46:19 <Eddi|zuHause> interesting tool... might need that on a different thing ;)
17:46:53 <SmatZ> :)
17:48:04 *** Mucht has joined #openttd
17:53:47 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd
17:54:30 <Wolf01> evenink
17:57:16 <z-MaTRiX> hey-ho
17:57:18 <z-MaTRiX> :)
18:03:36 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
18:07:17 *** loopcoop has quit IRC
18:18:53 *** TWerkhoven[l] has joined #openttd
18:29:03 <EyeMWing> That NT password resetter has saved my ass at least twice. Highly recommended.
18:31:24 *** Anon_ has joined #openttd
18:32:09 *** Anon_ has quit IRC
18:34:58 *** zachanima has joined #openttd
18:35:17 <Elukka> Eddi|Zuhause: any idea what oberhümer did with the top horizontal in ?
18:35:29 <Elukka> i don't understand why he made the overlapping part magic blue on one side but not the other
18:35:30 <appe> i cant get the grf download to work
18:35:50 <appe> its stalled at "begr filer" (requesting files)
18:36:05 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: dunno either
18:36:15 <Eddi|zuHause> appe: poke TrueBrain
18:36:36 <Yexo> TrueBrain: ^^ nl mirror is down again
18:36:43 <TrueBrain> again?
18:36:45 <TrueBrain> ugh
18:36:48 <TrueBrain> where is lennard ...
18:36:53 <Elukka> i also do agree with him now that my version is too textured, but his looks a bit too muted to me
18:37:00 <appe> oh wait
18:37:04 <appe> nope, doesnt work.
18:37:10 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: it's a little too dark, i think
18:37:25 <Elukka> gonna try some kind of middle ground
18:37:36 <Elukka> and will add the buffers to both ends... dunno why i didn't think of that
18:38:20 <TrueBrain> Yexo: it wasn't really. The balancer crashed :D
18:39:18 <appe> it's up again.
18:39:25 <Yexo> (and de.) still worked, while did not
18:39:31 <Yexo> so my conclusion was a bit too fast
18:39:41 <TrueBrain> Yexo: weird; the whole balancer (and his supervisor) was off :P
18:42:59 *** Alberth has joined #openttd
18:42:59 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth
18:48:25 *** Francis has joined #openttd
18:52:28 <LordAro> hai Alberth :)
18:52:32 <LordAro> see pm
18:52:53 *** Rezt has joined #openttd
18:55:27 *** Rezt has quit IRC
18:57:48 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
18:57:57 <andythenorth> hola
18:58:01 <LordAro> hi andy
18:58:52 <Alberth> hi LordAro
18:59:30 <Alberth> hi Andy
19:00:33 <Alberth> LordAro: just found your PM, currently trying to understand it :)
19:01:53 *** jo2k has joined #openttd
19:04:54 <Alberth> LordAro: "... the string seems to be being truncated strangely" what does that mean?
19:07:07 <Alberth> computers don't behave 'strange' usually, they just do what we tell them to do, the result may however not always be what we expect :)
19:09:10 <Alberth> did you got a working version with the two loops after each other?
19:09:24 <Alberth> hmm, s/got/get/
19:23:17 *** LordAro has quit IRC
19:23:57 *** pjpe has joined #openttd
19:32:03 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
19:33:41 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
19:37:25 *** KritiK has joined #openttd
19:52:01 *** Kurimus has quit IRC
19:56:03 *** LordAro has joined #openttd
20:00:44 <Elukka> heh. rockall freighters carrying stone
20:01:03 <LordAro> what did i miss?
20:01:23 <LordAro> hmm. apparently nothing :)
20:02:08 <Alberth> 21:11 -> 21:25 is larger than 480 seconds :)
20:02:50 <LordAro> (i checked logs ;) )
20:03:07 <Alberth> much safer :)
20:03:51 <LordAro> Alberth: by truncating strings i mean characters are duplicated, lines 'cut' in strange places, and charcters missing
20:04:19 <Alberth> ok, that makes sense to me :)
20:04:37 <Alberth> it is just a bit hard to explain :(
20:05:02 <LordAro> if i was clever, i would have managed to record what was being 'drawn', but i didn't :)
20:05:33 <Eddi|zuHause> Ctrl+S is your friend
20:05:34 <Alberth> next time, you will be more smart I am sure :)
20:05:41 <LordAro> troo
20:05:51 <LordAro> *2
20:06:25 <Eddi|zuHause> that isn't even a word
20:08:52 <LordAro> shh!
20:16:04 *** _1009 has joined #openttd
20:18:12 <Alberth> LordAro: PM for you
20:18:13 <planetmaker> hello
20:18:21 <Alberth> hello planetmaker
20:18:37 <LordAro> Alberth: danke
20:18:51 <LordAro> (yes, that's about the only word of german i know :) )
20:19:09 <planetmaker> so what makes you think he speaks German? ;-)
20:19:13 * Alberth was already wondering whether LordAro lived in Germany :)
20:19:35 <LordAro> :)
20:19:43 <Alberth> Ich spreche ja gar kein Deutsch
20:20:01 <LordAro> planetmaker: nothing, just that there are lots of german speakers in this channel
20:21:01 <planetmaker> less than you might think ;-)
20:21:12 <planetmaker> at least less native speakers
20:21:32 * planetmaker knows... 6
20:21:39 <planetmaker> 7
20:22:14 <planetmaker> ok, maybe 10 or a dozen
20:22:23 <Alberth> but I get lots of German emails @ openttd :p
20:22:25 <frosch123> Ik spreek geen Duits.
20:22:37 <__ln__> *fewer
20:24:02 <frosch123> Wat dacht je van een Nederlandse dagen?
20:24:07 <planetmaker> hehe, Alberth :-)
20:24:13 <Rubidium> ek praat nie duits nie?
20:24:23 <planetmaker> Granted, first when I saw you(r nick), I assumed the same
20:24:33 <Rubidium> frosch123: the last one doesn't quite make sense
20:25:18 <frosch123> yeah. it might be still good enough for the forums :p
20:25:39 <Rubidium> "what did you think of a Dutch days"
20:27:11 *** Prof_Frink has joined #openttd
20:27:12 <frosch123> i tried to suggest speaking dutch for a day :p
20:27:32 <frosch123> though danish might also be an idea :p
20:28:53 <LordAro> Alberth: was my problem (very basically) really just an if statement in the wrong place?
20:28:56 * LordAro sighs
20:29:34 <Alberth> wait until you spend a week finding a , too many :p
20:29:58 <Rubidium> in those very long settings tables you mean? ;)
20:30:01 <Alberth> or 3 weeks before you find that the C compiler is broken
20:30:22 <LordAro> i think i spent at least a day with something to do with a ';'
20:30:39 <Rubidium> or with brainfuck? ;)
20:30:53 <Alberth> Rubidium: no, C/C++ is much too friendly, use Python instead
20:31:07 <Alberth> or the whitespace language :)
20:31:15 <LordAro> and i spent a good hour yesterday trying to compile some other c++ with gcc :D
20:31:43 <Alberth> always fun, especially if the code is old
20:32:05 <Rubidium> Alberth: well, some of my coworkers have a habit of removing my "carefully" (end of statement) placed semicolons from python code ;)
20:33:08 <LordAro> i would've though gcc would detect c++ (#include <iostream>, or similar) better than spewing huge, strange errors :)
20:33:22 <Rubidium> though more interesting are threading issues; easily created with labview. Got to love to find those. The debugger never finds them
20:34:03 *** JVassie has joined #openttd
20:34:06 <Rubidium> LordAro: the compiler has no clue about that include; it's already replaced by the preprocessor
20:34:07 <Alberth> I carefully stay away from any form of threading
20:34:25 <LordAro> Rubidium: good point
20:34:32 <LordAro> the preprocessor then :P
20:34:58 <Alberth> preprocessor just sees the code as a big piece of text without meaning :)
20:35:14 <Rubidium> also, when is something C++ and when not? With #include "stdio.h" it can as well be C++, but it would fail to detect
20:35:33 <Alberth> LordAro: that's why you can use it for pre-processing NML for example
20:35:41 <LordAro> meh, still should be better :P
20:36:14 <Rubidium> ... it could even be valid C, in which case gcc would just emit C code
20:36:28 <Rubidium> but then another unit is detected as C++ and voila... they don't link anymore
20:36:30 <LordAro> the 'pre-processor' is the same for every compiler? i would've thought it would be different
20:36:41 <Rubidium> C++ encodes functions names differently than C does
20:37:06 <Rubidium> LordAro: the preprocessor differs; MSVC has a different one to GCC
20:39:09 * LordAro learns stuff
20:42:29 <Yexo> LordAro: a lot of newgrf projects on the openttdcoop devzone use the GCC preprocessor for NFO and NML files. That shows how much the preprocessor cares about the contents of the files it processes
20:43:11 *** frosch123 has quit IRC
20:46:35 <SmatZ> wtf.. you can rate the girl's look from 1 to 10, but there is one that has 10,4
20:46:40 <SmatZ> as average
20:46:42 <SmatZ> hmm
20:46:48 <planetmaker> :-)
20:47:07 <planetmaker> goddes of insanity?
20:47:32 <SmatZ> hehe :)
20:47:38 <SmatZ> I wonder what my rating is
20:47:48 <Alberth> planetmaker: that's not mutual exclusive :)
20:48:32 <SmatZ> that's one really old photo...
20:48:41 <SmatZ> ~8 years old
20:48:58 <SmatZ> would you guess it's me? :D
20:50:00 <planetmaker> Alberth: I never meant to imply that. Rather on the contrary
20:51:34 <__ln__> SmatZ: is that a nokia 3310?
20:52:02 <planetmaker> looks somewhat different, SmatZ :-)
20:52:07 <SmatZ> __ln__: I think so, maybe nokia 3330... it wasn't my phone after all :)
20:52:15 <planetmaker> though... it looks indeed like a young(er) verison of you
20:52:20 <SmatZ> :-D
20:52:27 <planetmaker> I have a 1-year old one ... it's still online :-P
20:52:31 <SmatZ> :D
20:52:56 <planetmaker> I'll be a good boy and not post the link :-P
20:53:04 <SmatZ> nah :)
20:53:24 <Alberth> good night
20:53:28 <planetmaker> g'night Alberth
20:53:38 <SmatZ> good night Alberth
20:53:58 *** Alberth has left #openttd
20:55:39 <planetmaker> hm... the photo of r20k being committed :-)
20:55:57 <SmatZ> :D
20:56:30 <SmatZ> I can't believe it's over a years since the r20k party
20:56:35 <planetmaker> yeah....
20:56:35 <SmatZ> -s
20:56:50 <Yexo> and r30k is still nowhere near :(
20:56:58 <SmatZ> :-(
20:57:05 <planetmaker> :-(
20:57:11 <planetmaker> and r22222 is past
20:57:14 <SmatZ> maybe there could be a r23k party
20:57:24 <planetmaker> pretty soonish, eh? :-)
20:57:24 <__ln__> r25k has been speculated about
20:57:34 <SmatZ> :)
20:57:53 <planetmaker> r23456 ?
20:58:49 <SmatZ> :-)
20:59:10 <Yexo> given the average time between commits r25k might be approximately 1.2.0
20:59:22 <LordAro> night all
20:59:22 <planetmaker> :-)
20:59:28 <planetmaker> g'night LordAro
20:59:30 *** LordAro has quit IRC
21:00:18 *** Adambean has quit IRC
21:01:07 <planetmaker> in any case I found the get-together really a good idea and joyful
21:01:09 <SmatZ> frosch has more commits than me, congratulations :-)
21:01:16 <SmatZ> yeah :)
21:01:18 <_1009> Gone with the wind too
21:01:20 *** _1009 has quit IRC
21:03:46 *** loopcoop has joined #openttd
21:04:31 <appe> gone with the wind <3.
21:04:54 <SmatZ> :-)
21:11:15 *** Neon has quit IRC
21:11:38 <planetmaker> hm... ohloh also tells me "25%+ decrease in commits in past 12 months compared to previous 12 months"
21:12:51 <planetmaker> :-(
21:15:32 *** jo2k has quit IRC
21:18:25 <SmatZ> :-(
21:19:52 *** Francis has quit IRC
21:21:49 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
21:29:29 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd
21:29:47 <Eddi|zuHause> err... something weird happened just now...
21:30:33 <Eddi|zuHause> my computer froze, i restarted, and now some colours of my KDE theme changed...
21:31:54 <appe> is there any grf with parameter set cargo trains?
21:32:32 <appe> would be nice to try out a gazillion tonnes of coal
21:33:14 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: that may be partially due to the fact that branches now happen in separate repositories
21:33:52 *** loopcoop has quit IRC
21:33:56 <appe> or what is the biggest cargo train i can use?
21:39:03 *** TWerkhoven[l] has quit IRC
21:39:19 <Yexo> <appe> is there any grf with parameter set cargo trains? <- I don't understand that question
21:39:30 <Yexo> you can make trains of 100 tiles long
21:39:31 <appe> the logic train set, for instance
21:39:38 <Yexo> but the maximum length depends on your setting
21:39:42 <appe> i can set the speed with a parameter
21:40:03 <Yexo> yes, but what do you want to set in this case?
21:40:18 <appe> how much a single cart can carry
21:40:20 <Yexo> all complete train sets that I know support coal by default
21:40:29 <Yexo> ah, I haven't seen such a grf
21:40:30 <Eddi|zuHause> Yexo: afair the limit is 64 tiles
21:40:39 <Yexo> oh, right
21:40:43 <appe> is there any with really, really big carts? :)
21:41:04 <Eddi|zuHause> appe: don't know anything beyond 40t per wagon
21:41:04 <Yexo> create your own grf?
21:41:11 <appe> ah, ok.
21:41:16 <appe> Yexo: oh, how does one begin?
21:41:27 <Eddi|zuHause> appe: read the NML tutorial
21:41:34 <Yexo>
21:41:46 <appe> neat, thank you :)
21:41:54 *** PeanutHorst has joined #openttd
21:42:33 *** TWerkhoven has quit IRC
21:44:50 <Yexo> planetmaker: any clue where the pages with default values / IDs moved?
21:44:55 <Yexo> in the NML wiki I mean
21:45:25 <Yexo> and of course I find them after asking the question
21:45:34 <planetmaker> :-)
21:45:39 <planetmaker> happens all the time
21:45:50 <planetmaker> to me
21:46:41 <Yexo> appe: if you manage to get the tutorial running, I think the only thing you need after the grf-block is this: item(FEAT_TRAINS, my_coal_truck, 29) { property { cargo_capacity: 255; } }
21:47:00 <Yexo> this will create a copy of the default coal wagon and change the capacity to 255
21:48:41 <Yexo> I think you can create a much larger capacity by using callbacks, so perhaps try adding this: graphics { cargo_capacity: return 10000; default: CB_FAILED; }
21:48:44 <planetmaker> sounds pretty stupid idea though
21:48:56 <Yexo> sure, but who cares for some experimentation?
21:49:04 <planetmaker> no-one :-)
21:49:26 <appe> Yexo: ill try it out.
21:49:35 <appe> why would it be stupid?
21:51:32 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC
21:52:39 <Parastais> I want to get a translator account, because my own language translation have a lot of mistakes. I am sent an email to, but i can't wait for the answer. Translations Manager Miham have status: inactive... Someone has ideas?
21:53:53 <Yexo> it's not Miham who is responding to those emails but Rubidium
21:54:07 <Yexo> when did you send your email?
21:54:49 <Parastais> 3 days ago
21:55:06 <Yexo> and for which language is it?
21:55:22 <Parastais> Latvian
21:55:50 <pjpe> that's the blue black grey flag right
21:56:30 <Yexo> Parastais: I'm afraid I can't help you more, but I've notified the right person so hopefully you'll get a response tomorrow
21:56:54 <Yexo> if you don't have a response by tomorrow evening please check back here again
21:57:15 <Parastais> no, its red-white-red
21:58:02 <pjpe> terrible
21:59:15 <Parastais>
22:01:43 <Parastais> Yexo, thanks for the answer :)
22:04:35 *** KouDy has quit IRC
22:06:17 *** Pulec has quit IRC
22:07:46 *** Pulec has joined #openttd
22:14:48 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC
22:14:54 *** valhallasw has quit IRC
22:16:54 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, somehow my hdd is much louder than before...
22:19:45 *** Pulec has quit IRC
22:21:57 *** JVassie has quit IRC
22:32:37 *** Mucht has quit IRC
22:42:23 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC
22:44:20 *** Cybertinus has quit IRC
22:49:00 *** Progman has quit IRC
22:50:05 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
22:53:46 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd
22:59:44 *** Biolunar has quit IRC
23:12:06 *** loopcoop has joined #openttd
23:26:58 <Wolf01> 'night
23:27:00 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC
23:57:37 *** Markavian has quit IRC
23:57:58 *** Markavian has joined #openttd