IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2011-07-08
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01:34:27 <Eddi|zuHause> that was weird...
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01:35:08 <supermop> ierd
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02:03:58 <supermop> not sure what, if anything, i should draw for ottd
02:35:12 <Eddi|zuHause> i could give you a list of engines ;)
02:39:30 <supermop> never drawn a vehicle thusfar
02:40:27 <supermop> i have some rhino models of buildings/stations/bridges, and then pixel art of sheds, but i am having trouble motivating myself to work on either
02:41:43 <supermop> i need to recruit a coder
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06:57:31 <dihedral> mornings :-)
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08:18:09 <Terkhen> good morning
08:31:00 <planetmaker> moin
08:41:52 <peter1138> so, last shuttle launch today, maybe
08:42:17 <planetmaker> yeah :-(
08:42:25 * Alberth forgot to book a shuttle flight :(
08:43:10 <planetmaker> <-- book there
08:43:15 <planetmaker> next flight somewhen 2012
08:43:29 <planetmaker> and actually... equipment of my working group is booked in there :-P
08:43:57 <planetmaker> they don't dare to launch humans yet, though :-(
08:44:58 * Alberth was expecting a website of the commercial space flights :)
08:45:17 <planetmaker> <-- "cheap" flight opportunities also there
08:45:23 <planetmaker> Alberth: it is
08:46:10 <Alberth> yeah, that one :)
08:46:36 <planetmaker> also the first one ;-) - though indeed I don't find a booking option
08:47:43 <Alberth> no worries, you're not rich enough yet
08:47:58 <planetmaker> yeah :-(
08:48:12 <planetmaker> I guess one has to own Amazon in order to apply... :S
08:48:21 <planetmaker> (blue origin is owned by its founder)
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11:40:53 <__ln__> they're on their way to the shuttle
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13:25:45 <Belugas> hello
13:26:03 <Belugas> missed the bus, this morning.
13:26:13 <Belugas> damned bus
13:30:27 <Alberth> bus was too early?
13:31:28 <Belugas> naaa... the man was too slow
13:31:53 <Belugas> like... it's summer, i don't have to rush kid to school, i was reading a book while walking to to bus stup etc etc
13:32:08 <Belugas> and it's soooo good to be outside ;)
13:34:18 <Alberth> so you wanted to enjoy outside a little longer, sounds like a good reason :)
13:47:30 <Belugas> not willingly, yes :)
13:47:52 <Belugas> subconscience slowed my walk, I guess
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14:42:25 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r22643 /trunk/src/object_cmd.cpp: -Fix: Disallow building NewObjects on water tiles owned by another company.
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15:21:39 <peter1138> T-5:30
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15:27:20 <MNIM> hmmmh. has anybody ever thought of orbital transports for ttd?
15:27:38 <Zuu> I'm sure someone has though about it.
15:28:01 <MNIM> bah. stuck at T-31 seconds
15:28:50 <MNIM> running again
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15:56:58 <MNIM> lol, forum sigs
15:57:04 <MNIM> Worst Behaved IRC Member of 2008! - Wahoo!
15:57:04 <MNIM> Worst Behaved IRC Member of 2009! - Yay!
15:57:04 <MNIM> Worst Behaved IRC Member of 2010! - Even though i'm not even there anymore. How bad can I be?
15:57:25 <MNIM> guess he'll lose his title this year. >:P
15:58:05 <supermop> was fun to watch
15:59:50 <MNIM> what was?
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16:06:29 <supermop> shuttle rolling over
16:06:55 <MNIM> oh.
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16:36:24 <Eddi|zuHause> wait... shuttles play dead?
16:37:23 <Chris_Booth> they do if they are american
16:39:49 <Eddi|zuHause> well, russian shuttles never made it off the ground ;)
16:42:51 <MNIM> actually, they did, but not with human passengers :P
16:45:31 <supermop> lets have an ESA shuttle
16:46:36 <MNIM> mweh. I doubt any shuttle system similar to the exisiting american/russian will still have the same problems.
16:46:41 <MNIM> IE risky and expensive
16:48:38 <supermop> yep
16:49:10 <supermop> but there is certainly going to be a capacity gap until there is a replacement
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16:56:26 <MNIM> hmmmmh.
16:56:38 <MNIM> ask the russians to whip something up with the energia
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16:57:10 <MNIM> knowing the russians, they'll build the rocket faster than it took the apollo 13 to get back home
16:57:12 <__ln__> i guess it'll be chinese shuttles next
16:57:23 <Eddi|zuHause> the americans had a lot of time to find a replacement system, they didn't use it properly
16:57:50 <supermop> no, we had lots of time, but little money
16:58:08 <supermop> because NASA isnt as glamorous to congress as it used to be
16:58:24 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: that is a symptom, not the cause
16:58:30 <__ln__> fortunately the money was well spent in iraq and afghanistan
16:58:44 <supermop> plus 8 years of a government that starved Nasa of funding due to its stance on climate change
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16:58:58 <supermop> we could have paid for both
16:59:12 <supermop> we just had a government that didn't want to
16:59:15 <andythenorth> meh
16:59:17 <andythenorth> space is silly
17:00:12 <__ln__> how does the US intend to get the starfleet headquarters into San Francisco with that attitude
17:01:46 <supermop> i assume that in 400 years governments might be very different
17:02:43 <Eddi|zuHause> just compare it with the governments 400 years ago :p
17:03:44 <supermop> anyway the hole goerge bush fort of mars is indeed silly
17:04:04 <supermop> but there is plenty of serious work to be done in orbit and with satelites
17:04:32 <supermop> plus NASA can, and should do serious work regarding climate and geology
17:04:47 <supermop> and not be collared due to politics
17:05:17 <Eddi|zuHause> nah, it'll all get "outsourced" to india and china
17:05:40 <supermop> we thats fine too
17:05:45 <andythenorth> US military space programme spending is believed to far exceed NASA's, so it's ok, the US still spend on space ;)
17:05:45 <supermop> *well
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17:05:53 * andythenorth will now do other stuff
17:05:57 <supermop> exactly andy:
17:06:08 <Eddi|zuHause> meanwhile the europeans get settled in their starting places in french guyana and kasachstan
17:06:08 <supermop> we need more academic research money
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17:10:40 <Belugas> # we need love and peace!
17:12:01 <supermop> yep
17:12:09 <andythenorth> we need the US to not default on debt
17:12:10 <Eddi|zuHause> "Wollt ihr das TOTALE WELTRAUMPROGRAMM?"
17:12:15 <andythenorth> or perhaps we don't care
17:12:25 <andythenorth> perhaps a US default might be good for us
17:12:36 <Eddi|zuHause> it probably would be
17:12:36 <andythenorth> if the world economy collapses - lots more time for ottd
17:12:46 <andythenorth> I could finish these stupid river banks
17:12:52 <andythenorth> whilst stockpiling tins of beans
17:12:53 <andythenorth> and gungs
17:12:55 <andythenorth> guns /s
17:12:57 <Eddi|zuHause> there's currently a race who can delay their default further, the EU or the USA
17:13:05 <supermop> well, that is unlikely, as we can just massively devalue our currency if it comes to that
17:13:35 <supermop> but there is a big fear in the US of what is essentially short term debt
17:13:37 <MNIM> Bah. Why do people develop a patch, a feature or a grf and then not show in a screenshot what it looks like?
17:14:21 <MNIM> it's like building a fucking car, hiding under a sheet and then trying to get customers to sign the purchase papers before they have ever seen the thing!
17:14:31 <supermop> but we can actually handle greater debt in the short term fairly well (even though it is unpopular with populist pseudo libertarian groups)
17:14:33 <MNIM> *hiding it under...
17:14:49 <supermop> what our problem is is long term debt
17:14:53 <Alberth> not all patches can be usefully screenshotted
17:14:57 <andythenorth> MNIM: tell them in the thread no?
17:14:59 <supermop> on the scale of the next 50-70 years
17:15:26 <supermop> whith rising healthcare costs et cetera
17:15:40 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: no, what your problem is is that the likes of china don't want to buy any more of your debts
17:16:16 <supermop> they like to buy it so long as we dont let our currency devalue, and they dont have to let theirs appreciate
17:16:53 <MNIM> don't have a forum account
17:17:16 <supermop> what we need is to ensure strong regrowth in the short to medium term, so that we can pay for the huge wall of cost that is coming in a few decades
17:17:20 <Belugas> yup, forums accounts are hard to get :)
17:17:45 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: that is exactly the point, the USA has constantly been devaluating their currency over the last 10 years
17:18:12 <supermop> which is actually good for us
17:18:13 * Belugas wonders: what would it be like for a country to bankrupt?
17:18:15 <supermop> bad for china
17:18:37 <andythenorth> MNIM: bah. Why do people complain about forum threads lacking stuff, but then not register an account ;)
17:18:39 <andythenorth> :D :P etc
17:19:02 <supermop> but china has problems of its own to worry about, as its middle class grows, they will need greater purchasing power
17:19:02 <Eddi|zuHause> Belugas: that has happened plenty of times over the past centuries
17:19:23 <supermop> which will hurt their manufacturing capacity
17:19:35 <supermop> so it will be hard to balance
17:19:39 <MNIM> andy: because I haven't seen anything worth making a forum account yet
17:19:42 <MNIM> anyway, dinnertime
17:19:52 <supermop> but has already happened for better or worse in europe and the us
17:20:24 <Eddi|zuHause> Belugas: and there's still a chance we might see that happening with greece in the near future
17:20:35 <supermop> yeah
17:20:37 <Eddi|zuHause> or spain, or portugal, or ireland
17:20:56 <Eddi|zuHause> and if it's going really bad, even italy
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17:21:06 <Belugas> right
17:21:07 <supermop> ireland and portugal seem to coping better than greece
17:21:15 <supermop> but italy is a big problem
17:23:26 <Eddi|zuHause> i know there's lots of players in that game, but it might lead to a common european economical government
17:23:39 <supermop> or it might break up the euro
17:24:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that is not a contradiction
17:24:07 <supermop> germany would be better out without a few Greece's on the periphery
17:24:13 <supermop> *off
17:24:36 <Eddi|zuHause> on the contrary
17:25:00 <Eddi|zuHause> germany is the greatest benefactor from having the likes of spain and greece in the euro
17:25:10 <supermop> the problem would be keeping the peripheral emerging european economies viable markets for central 'strong' europe to export to
17:25:49 <supermop> the euro helps that greatly by inflating those countries purchasing power
17:26:52 <Eddi|zuHause> it's kinda funny, the euro was the invention of the WWII victorial powers (france, britain, USA) to keep a unified germany at bay, but in effect, it has made germany stronger ;)
17:27:02 <supermop> Eddi, what would you think of a more federalized european goverment/economy?
17:27:36 <Eddi|zuHause> what do you mean by "federalized"
17:27:39 <Belugas> but it's a bit of an irony, though... a country goes bankupt, but unlike a real company, it does not cease to exist. It will face hard time, granted, but will go on
17:27:48 <supermop> it has had the effect of making war between two european powers untenable, so thats good
17:28:09 <supermop> most bankrupt companies carry on
17:28:38 <supermop> they have to go through tough processes, but emerge in one form or another
17:29:12 <supermop> i guess by federalized, i mean more centralized organization of the economy
17:29:58 <Eddi|zuHause> i think you mix up the meaning of "federalized" there
17:29:58 <supermop> one 'economy' for the core of the euro, instead of several closely bound 'economies'
17:30:16 <supermop> not one state though,
17:31:16 <Eddi|zuHause> "federalized" means "separately, but working together"
17:31:42 <supermop> yes
17:32:28 <supermop> i would say that the current european powers are not even at a federal level yet,
17:32:58 <andythenorth> 1/16 of rivers are drawn :) :| :(
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17:42:45 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: no, and it's a very difficult way to get there. somebody will always think they're screwed over if they have to give away sovereign powers
17:43:54 <Eddi|zuHause> there's always a chance the euro-sceptics rise in power in some country, like denmark, or czechia
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17:50:45 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop: there is probably never going to be a system similar to the american structure. the existance of nations in europe will always get in the way of that
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17:59:51 <Eddi|zuHause> that is a great description of the 2ccSet: "Considering we already have a quite long depot list, a few additional [...] shouldn't make much difference."
18:00:03 <Terkhen> :D
18:00:19 * Terkhen will end up making a patch to get only the metro trains
18:01:22 <Eddi|zuHause> doesn't it have parameters for that yet?
18:01:29 <Terkhen> nope
18:01:33 <Eddi|zuHause> i thought that kind of parameter was discussed quite a while ago
18:01:46 <Terkhen> I have been waiting for those parameters for months :P
18:02:11 <Terkhen> it was discussed but, to my knowledge, never implemented
18:02:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess it comes down to a "just do it" situation
18:06:59 <andythenorth> it's an easy parameter :P
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18:13:06 <supermop> has Dj been coding lately?
18:23:09 <MNIM> back.
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18:28:00 <Eddi|zuHause> probably not
18:28:57 <supermop> i was asked if some of my sheds could be used by nutracks, but as far as i know it hasn't happened
18:29:41 <Eddi|zuHause> "Der cottbusser Postkutscher putzt seinen cottbusser Postkutschkasten"
18:30:21 <supermop> wait what is being cleaned here?
18:31:17 <Eddi|zuHause>
18:32:11 <Eddi|zuHause> google insists that it should be written with one s...
18:32:37 <supermop> google translate doesnt translate cottbusser
18:32:47 <Eddi|zuHause> very unlikely
18:32:55 <Eddi|zuHause> Cottbus is a city
18:33:09 <Eddi|zuHause> so a cottbus(s)er is someone from Cottbus
18:33:24 <supermop> so this is a carriage for this city
18:33:31 <supermop> and it cleans something?
18:33:50 <Eddi|zuHause> no, the driver cleans it
18:34:26 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, it's actually a tongue twister
18:36:42 <supermop> ahh ok
18:37:02 <supermop> i need a new german dictionary
18:37:11 <supermop> also i need to get lunch
18:37:16 <supermop> back later
18:37:40 <Eddi|zuHause> german dictionaries tend to be difficult to read if you have no clue how to concatenate words ;)
18:38:12 <__ln__> but the U-bahn station is actually Kottbusser Tor, funny
18:38:30 <supermop> i used to be pretty efficient with one
18:38:40 <supermop> when i was studying german
18:38:41 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: who ever said people from berlin know how to spell? :p
18:39:00 <supermop> later
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18:40:16 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, the city's real name in lower sorbian is actually Chóśebuz
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19:04:12 <Eddi|zuHause> "Wer anderen eine Grube gräbt, der hat ein Grubengrabgerät"
19:04:23 <MNIM> wass>
19:04:24 <MNIM> ?
19:04:28 <Eddi|zuHause> "Wer anderen eine Bratwurst brät, der hat ein Bratwurstbratgerät"
19:04:59 <MNIM> ah.
19:05:09 <Eddi|zuHause> "Wer gegen ein Minimum an Aluminium immun ist, besitzt Aluminiumminimumimmunität"
19:07:40 <MNIM> Ouch, eddi, that hurts my brain trying to translate it
19:07:50 <planetmaker> :-D Nice word
19:07:54 <planetmaker> good evening
19:08:18 <andythenorth> pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis
19:09:31 <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: what's difficult in translation there? just replace -ät with -y
19:10:18 <Eddi|zuHause> unless you're american, then you also have to remove one i from Aluminium
19:10:27 <MNIM> Well, Im neither
19:10:33 <MNIM> I live, like next door.
19:10:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm fairly sure you're closer to andythenorth than to me ;)
19:11:01 * __ln__ muß wahrscheinlich morgen deutsch in der real life sprechen
19:11:17 <MNIM> but I think the main issue is that a hugely long word like that triggers some kind of latent disleksion or something ;)
19:11:34 <andythenorth> stupid rivers
19:11:46 <MNIM> also, there's at least a whole atlantic ocean between me and andy if I have to believe his hostmask
19:11:50 <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: well, in that particular case, it's kinda meant to do that :p
19:11:58 <MNIM> oh.
19:12:00 <MNIM> ouch.
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19:12:05 * MNIM whacks eddi on the head
19:12:14 <andythenorth> hmm
19:12:55 <fjb> __ln__: Your German is quite good.
19:13:02 <andythenorth> there are two types of terrain in arctic and tropic
19:13:10 <andythenorth> so I have only done 1/24 of the stupid rivers
19:13:25 * andythenorth should whine less and draw more
19:14:27 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you included toyland in that? :p
19:14:40 <andythenorth> kind of have to
19:15:05 <MNIM> well, toyland could be skipped, since it isn't /meant/ to look realistic
19:15:13 <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: what do you mean? a traceroute from here to andythenorth goes Leipzig->Frankfurt->London->Manchester
19:15:37 <andythenorth> oh god
19:15:42 <andythenorth> they know where I am :P
19:15:45 <andythenorth> not hugely accurately
19:15:58 <MNIM> eh, he shows to me as having a cable virgin, and being in internic commercial.
19:16:13 <MNIM> which is america
19:16:31 <Eddi|zuHause> MNIM: they're not allowed to have a "virgin cable" in britain?
19:16:33 <planetmaker> you err
19:16:42 <planetmaker> virgin is in many places
19:16:47 <__ln__> fjb: danke, obwohl schreibe ich besser als ich spreche.
19:16:49 <andythenorth>
19:17:02 <andythenorth> the ones with coloured dots and such are...not done :P
19:17:21 <fjb> __ln__: Then you should speak more. ;-)
19:17:23 <MNIM> well, as far as I know virgin is American, and besides that, Internic Commercial as country code means america
19:17:24 <planetmaker> sweet, andythenorth :-)
19:17:28 <andythenorth> I haven't done any corner pieces. would anyone notice?
19:17:33 <MNIM> so unless he's being proxy'd
19:17:42 <andythenorth> they're as-decoded-from-the-grf
19:18:12 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: that reminds me of when SmatZ called and my mother answered the phone, afterwards my mother said SmatZ spoke good german, while SmatZ said he spoke bad german :p
19:18:29 <MNIM> lol
19:18:43 <__ln__> heh
19:18:53 <andythenorth> it's pretty easy to see where I am
19:19:07 <MNIM> well, as long as they don't speak it as bad as I do, no disasters are bound to happen.
19:19:12 <Eddi|zuHause> that was on the way to r20k
19:19:13 <andythenorth> virgin even give away the switch number I think
19:19:34 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i'm sure there are pretty detailed geoip-databases out there
19:19:35 <MNIM> I can read, and to an extent, understand, but speaking is beyond my capabilities
19:19:38 <planetmaker> MNIM: choose one:
19:20:11 <MNIM> wait, that's all the same country?
19:20:14 <andythenorth> whichever geo IP suggests manchester is a bit off
19:20:17 <MNIM> ehh, I mean, company?
19:20:33 <andythenorth> 'adult friend finder' ads manage to locate me pretty accurately :P
19:20:40 <MNIM> lol
19:20:51 <planetmaker> and... virgin is a UK-based holding ;-)
19:20:54 <andythenorth> aztw is a big clue for those in the know
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19:21:03 <andythenorth> anyways
19:21:07 <fjb> r30k is far too far away...
19:21:11 <andythenorth> someone answer my question about river corners?
19:21:59 <Alberth> not until they try to make a 2 tile wide stupid river :)
19:22:15 <Eddi|zuHause> fjb: but we missed r22222
19:22:18 <MNIM> saw it. looks nice, I just hope you;ll be doing better rapids as other river .grf-s out there
19:22:27 <planetmaker> andythenorth: anyone - maybe. someone: sure
19:22:31 <fjb> Oh... :-(
19:23:53 <andythenorth> ok so I leave all the tiny corner pieces until someone complains
19:23:59 <andythenorth> there are a boring amount of them
19:24:04 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: interestingly, those ads randomly show me any minor city in a ~30km radius, but not the major city ;)
19:24:15 <andythenorth> most of you have no idea what corner pieces I refer to :P
19:24:29 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: maybe they're gaming you to think they're more specific
19:24:40 <Alberth> andythenorth: and you need some work for the next version :p
19:25:02 <andythenorth> Alberth: ?
19:25:05 <Eddi|zuHause> none of them managed to pick the right village, though ;)
19:25:19 <Alberth> andythenorth: removal of the corner pieces :)
19:25:36 <andythenorth> they're being removed?
19:25:42 * andythenorth is confused somewhat
19:25:47 <andythenorth> maybe I should have a beer
19:25:55 <Chris_Booth> beer
19:25:58 <Chris_Booth> <3
19:26:19 <MNIM> coding always gets better with beer, right
19:26:38 <Chris_Booth> yeah
19:27:44 <glx> or not
19:27:44 <MNIM> What the fuck.
19:27:54 <MNIM> apparently crashes my mozilla
19:29:24 <MNIM> that's the third time!
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19:33:35 <Wolf01> helo
19:33:42 <MNIM> Oh lol. at least they got the country right this time
19:33:51 <andythenorth> chris sawyer would have probably got online via aztw
19:33:51 <MNIM> still some 300kms off, but oh well. :P
19:48:20 <planetmaker> @base 16 10 37
19:48:20 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 55
19:48:22 <planetmaker> hm
19:48:31 <planetmaker> @base 10 16 37
19:48:31 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 25
19:48:42 <planetmaker> what is callback 25 for industries?
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19:50:51 <Eddi|zuHause> Animation control (1B/25/140/152/159)
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19:51:45 <planetmaker> ah, thanks
19:52:29 <Eddi|zuHause> but after reading the wiki entry, i am totally confused about what it actually does :p
19:53:28 <planetmaker> returns an animation frame explicitly or a pseudo-frame which means next or stop
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20:22:07 <Eddi|zuHause> AH! he's a ghost!
20:26:21 <andythenorth> stupid connection
20:28:24 <Eddi|zuHause> better than Moffat's version of "Ghosting" in the 51st century ;)
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20:54:34 <Terkhen> good night
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20:55:33 <planetmaker> good night Terkhen and all others as well
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22:56:09 <Wolf01> 'night
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