IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2011-01-29
00:17:03 *** Kurimus has quit IRC
00:20:36 *** roboboy has joined #openttd
00:22:19 *** Zuu has quit IRC
00:23:05 *** Cybertinus has quit IRC
00:27:13 *** Brianetta has quit IRC
00:40:13 *** pugi has quit IRC
00:45:54 *** Devroush has quit IRC
00:50:55 *** roboboy has quit IRC
00:55:33 *** KritiK has quit IRC
01:01:03 *** Progman has quit IRC
01:10:49 *** Fast2 has quit IRC
01:17:22 *** X-2 has quit IRC
01:17:48 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC
01:44:01 *** Chris_Booth has quit IRC
01:58:23 *** kamnet has joined #openttd
01:58:48 <kamnet> OpenMSX needs a logo
02:12:54 *** roboboy has joined #openttd
02:24:04 <kamnet> Hi roboboy
02:24:13 <roboboy> hello
02:25:49 *** Lakie has quit IRC
02:28:51 *** KouDy has joined #openttd
02:47:26 *** Pikka has joined #openttd
02:50:47 <Pikka> gentlemen
02:52:51 <Pikka> can anyone tell me what the current value of action 7 variable A1 D OpenTTD version is, both in the nightlies and betas and 1.0.5?
02:56:41 *** Fuco has quit IRC
03:10:28 <Eddi|zuHause> Pikka: something like \dx10580000 for 1.0.5 and \dx1100XXXX (where XXXX is the current revision) for beta/nightly
03:10:43 <Pikka> something like that, yes Eddi
03:11:32 <Pikka> it doesn't seem to be doing what I want it to do, but I guess I'll keep trying
03:11:48 *** KouDy has quit IRC
03:17:50 <Eddi|zuHause> for a diagnosis we need four pieces of information: what you try to achieve, what you do, what it does, and what you expect it to do
03:19:58 <Pikka> oh
03:20:23 <Pikka> further testing reveals it's working fine, don't mind me :) thankyou.
03:20:33 <Eddi|zuHause> who the hell is this TiagoTiago guy who pops up out of nowhere and writes lengthy essays on old suggestion topics?
03:21:33 <Pikka> he's a
03:23:30 <Eddi|zuHause> the bad thing is the first two lines of each of his posts sound so absurd that i can't possibly imagine anything coming out of reading all this stuff...
03:23:59 <Eddi|zuHause> i need to hold back to not just reply with a "tldr" :p
03:27:00 <Pikka> "new reply notification emails don't always get to my inbox, please let me know if you think it has happened"
03:27:25 <Pikka> a) how would we know and b) why would we care if he didn't get a reply notification?
03:27:34 <Eddi|zuHause> i remember seeing this signature before
03:27:55 <Pikka> hm
03:29:02 <Eddi|zuHause> but i haven't bothered looking up his old posts
03:30:14 *** KouDy has joined #openttd
03:33:34 <Pikka> oops
03:34:02 <Pikka> latest nightly crashes on my savegame. :] but I've buggered around with the newgrfs so much it's probably not worth reporting.
03:34:44 <Pikka> Assertion failed at line 222 of c:\openttd\compile\src\ground_vehicle.hpp: this->z_pos == GetSlopeZ(this->x_pos, this->y_pos)
03:36:19 <Eddi|zuHause> sounds like a cache-sanity-check fails
03:36:44 <Eddi|zuHause> there's been some messing around with bridges and bridge heads recently, maybe this is related?
03:36:54 <Pikka> hmm
03:37:01 <Pikka> perhaps I should report it then
03:37:04 <Eddi|zuHause> it can't hurt to post the savegame to the bugtracker, though...
03:41:29 <Eddi|zuHause> Pikka: two reasons to report anyway: a) asserts should never be reached. if the savegame is screwed up beyond repair, it should be caught with an actual error. b) the red warning message is (imho) actually there to scare the people. crashes should still be avoided
03:41:50 <Pikka> rgr
03:47:12 *** JOHN-SHEPARD has quit IRC
04:24:43 *** Pulec|XNB has quit IRC
04:34:36 *** roboboy has quit IRC
04:54:41 *** glx has quit IRC
05:00:57 *** roboboy has joined #openttd
05:13:16 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
05:14:30 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd
05:22:48 *** Guest1798 has quit IRC
05:23:09 *** z-MaTRiX has joined #openttd
05:23:39 *** z-MaTRiX is now known as Guest2009
05:24:35 *** roboboy has quit IRC
05:38:30 *** Guest2009 has quit IRC
05:38:39 *** Markavian` has joined #openttd
05:40:52 *** roboboy has joined #openttd
05:42:16 *** z-MaTRiX_ has joined #openttd
05:46:14 *** Markavian has quit IRC
05:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC
05:56:18 *** Eddi|zuHause has joined #openttd
06:00:05 *** z-MaTRiX1 has joined #openttd
06:01:19 *** z-MaTRiX_ has quit IRC
06:01:26 *** roboboy has quit IRC
06:13:19 *** z-MaTRiX1 has quit IRC
06:13:42 *** z-MaTRiX_ has joined #openttd
06:51:11 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
07:10:28 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
07:12:47 *** George is now known as Guest2013
07:12:51 *** George has joined #openttd
07:14:02 *** Pikka has quit IRC
07:17:45 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
07:21:19 *** Cybertinus has joined #openttd
07:23:07 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
07:36:17 <z-MaTRiX_> hey
07:40:40 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
07:45:24 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
07:53:43 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
07:56:21 *** Kurimus has joined #openttd
07:59:05 <andythenorth> morening
08:00:02 <kamnet> Good morning
08:06:53 *** DayDreamer has joined #openttd
08:22:23 *** Chrill has joined #openttd
08:26:24 *** Zuu has joined #openttd
08:32:32 *** Chrill has quit IRC
08:34:50 *** DDR has joined #openttd
08:35:04 *** DayDreamer1 has joined #openttd
08:39:54 *** DayDreamer has quit IRC
09:11:40 <andythenorth> is including vehicle ferries in FISH misleading?
09:11:53 <andythenorth> will players think that RVs can actually drive on them?
09:12:24 <kamnet> Have they sofar?
09:14:22 <andythenorth> dunno
09:14:25 <andythenorth> no reports :)
09:30:47 *** Alberth has joined #openttd
09:30:47 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth
09:34:39 *** LordAro has joined #openttd
09:34:48 <LordAro> moin
09:34:50 *** JOHN-SHEPARD has joined #openttd
09:35:02 *** Progman has joined #openttd
09:37:51 <Alberth> moin
09:40:13 <andythenorth> hi Alberth
09:43:36 *** pugi has joined #openttd
09:44:58 *** DDR has quit IRC
09:50:08 <planetmaker> moin
09:53:14 <Terkhen> good morning
09:53:31 <andythenorth> mornings
09:54:16 *** DDR has joined #openttd
09:55:20 *** roboboy has joined #openttd
09:55:58 <kamnet> Meh, it's morning anyhow.
09:58:30 <LordAro> i lol'd:
10:01:36 <planetmaker> :-D
10:12:36 <kamnet> *snickers*
10:15:11 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd
10:22:09 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC
10:34:45 *** |Jeroen| has joined #openttd
10:35:16 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
10:46:26 *** JOHN-SHEPARD has quit IRC
11:02:02 *** fmauneko has joined #openttd
11:04:10 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd
11:04:14 *** Fast2 has joined #openttd
11:04:52 <Wolf01> hello
11:10:52 *** Maluf has joined #openttd
11:11:16 <Alberth> moin
11:11:19 <Maluf> hi
11:11:45 <planetmaker> ho
11:12:01 *** DDR has quit IRC
11:13:25 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
11:16:58 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttd
11:19:44 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
11:23:54 *** Pulec has joined #openttd
11:34:39 *** fjb has quit IRC
11:36:16 *** KouDy has quit IRC
11:39:37 *** Fuco has joined #openttd
11:44:55 *** KouDy has joined #openttd
11:47:02 <Terkhen>
11:49:15 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
11:51:23 <__ln__> eh
11:54:24 <__ln__> i read the text yet i don't see anything conclusive that would make it a 'fraud'.
11:54:58 <Terkhen> shouldn't it credit the original authors?
11:55:20 <__ln__> should
11:55:44 <Terkhen> that still does not make it a fraud, though
11:56:05 <__ln__> but if the CD indeed contains "an unmodified ... setup" as they say below the last image, and License.txt and Read me.txtis there, ...
11:56:45 <frosch123> the article also says, that it does not violate the license in most cases. it is just making money of fools :)
11:57:10 <frosch123> but they get a colourful box for the cd
11:57:17 <__ln__> it looks a lot like the author did not understand the GPL.
11:57:50 <Terkhen> buying a game and then learning that you could have gotten it for free after checking the readme included in the CD is not very helpful :P
11:58:02 <__ln__> selling Free software is not a fraud, many companies such as Red Hat and Canonical base their business on it.
11:59:33 <Alberth> it is imho, if you don't tell your customers before they buy
11:59:33 <Terkhen> but not telling what you are really selling is dishonest
12:00:02 *** fjb has joined #openttd
12:00:46 <Ammler> maybe we should try to sell a OpenTTD CD with 1.1 release
12:01:58 <__ln__> Alberth: it's an interesting point whether the license requires you to tell people in advance it's free software. as far as i know there is no such requirement.
12:02:20 <fjb> Moin
12:02:21 <Terkhen> the license allows to change the product name?
12:02:23 <Terkhen> hi fjb
12:02:53 <Alberth> __ln__: try it, buy a copy, then sue them :)
12:03:56 <Ammler> Terkhen: i would say, it does, but it is clearly a "hint", it wants to hide the origin
12:04:07 <__ln__> Terkhen: it may even be necessary to change the name because the original could be a registered trademark. (not maybe in this case, but generally)
12:05:03 <Terkhen> I still think that announcing that the product is GPL in the CD instead of in the box is not right
12:05:32 *** perk11 has joined #openttd
12:06:21 <Ammler> he, ridirects to ror
12:06:44 <frosch123> that's what is said on that page
12:07:15 <__ln__> Terkhen: i see the moral dilemma, but still it's far from a fraud imho.
12:07:43 <Terkhen> let's call it a dishonest rip-off :)
12:08:34 <Ammler> frosch123: that is clearly no fraud, the eu registrar did a mistake :-o
12:10:16 <frosch123> ?
12:10:42 <frosch123> Ammler: the article said, that ror registered that url after they learned of transport sim
12:11:04 <frosch123> so, ror steals the product name and advertising effort from transport sim :p
12:11:17 <Ammler> so they printed a unregistered domain on the coper?
12:11:26 <Ammler> cover*
12:11:28 * andythenorth decides not to get into ror
12:12:06 <Ammler> oh well, that is just dumb
12:12:37 <frosch123> yeah, quiet weird :)
12:13:43 <Terkhen> heh, that's dumb, yes
12:15:11 <Ammler> andythenorth: we need a nice OpenTTD cd cover to sell the game :-)
12:15:34 <frosch123> wouldn't some ror screenshots fit?
12:15:39 <Ammler> lol
12:15:42 <Terkhen> :D
12:16:05 <Terkhen> probably the "Open" part of the name would give away that you could get it for free :P
12:16:08 <Ammler> maybe the russian openttd3d could work
12:16:53 <Ammler> Terkhen: well, we could make it seriously just to check if people would still buy it
12:18:48 <andythenorth> yeah they'd buy it
12:18:57 <Terkhen> probably, yes
12:18:58 <andythenorth> the major issue is where the money would go
12:19:05 <Terkhen> but I wonder if it would be worth the effort to set that up
12:19:11 <andythenorth> I reckon it would see $100s per year
12:19:16 <andythenorth> not $thousands
12:19:20 <andythenorth> less costs
12:19:33 <andythenorth> it's just enough revenue to be awkward :P
12:20:31 *** Adambean has joined #openttd
12:20:56 <Alberth> with isometric 2.5D graphics? nah
12:23:27 <Ammler> andythenorth: depnds on the prize, if you sell if for 20€ you can't forward much to openttd
12:24:05 <andythenorth> but someone still has to do the work :P
12:24:17 <andythenorth> lets do something else :D
12:24:54 *** KritiK has joined #openttd
12:24:59 <Ammler> well, you need one "burner" per country :-P
12:25:37 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
12:25:39 <frosch123> preferable aged < 12
12:27:14 <Ammler> he needs a cd printer
12:27:25 <__ln__> illegally in the country, without a passport
12:28:43 <Ammler> I once bought OpenOffice that way
12:31:08 <Eddi|zuHause> making money off openttd is kind of a risky business
12:44:45 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: indeed
12:47:16 <__ln__> it could be sold from some poor third-world country which is not a member of EU or anything... say Switzerland
12:48:00 <Alberth> preferably a country without internet, say Egypt
12:49:02 <Terkhen> :D
12:49:36 <Terkhen> how would you advertize it then?
12:49:57 <__ln__> hieroglyphs
12:50:02 <lugo> telefax
12:55:16 <Terkhen> :)
12:55:36 <Terkhen> let's hope they get internet (and other things) back soon
12:56:23 <__ln__> yes, now they are limited to single player or local servers.
12:56:34 <planetmaker> [13:18] <andythenorth> the major issue is where the money would go <-- I could sell them and thus finance the DevZone :-)
12:58:00 *** ctibor has quit IRC
12:59:41 *** ctibor has joined #openttd
13:04:46 *** ctibor has quit IRC
13:05:11 *** ZirconiumX has joined #openttd
13:06:18 *** ctibor has joined #openttd
13:13:18 * andythenorth ponders
13:13:20 <andythenorth> what to do
13:13:54 *** Brianett1 has joined #openttd
13:15:07 *** Brianetta has quit IRC
13:15:26 <Alberth> play a game
13:17:53 <andythenorth> meh
13:18:18 *** glx has joined #openttd
13:18:18 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx
13:20:15 <Terkhen> why not? :)
13:22:15 <Eddi|zuHause> 'meh' is pretty much describing my mood today
13:22:40 <Terkhen> mine too :D
13:22:51 * Terkhen is not doing anything
13:23:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i need a new set of music... the old one gets boring
13:24:02 <__ln__> here,
13:24:28 *** ZirconiumX has quit IRC
13:26:39 * frosch123 wrote two lines of code in past 5 hours :p
13:26:47 <SmatZ> :)
13:26:51 * andythenorth made up some names
13:26:59 <andythenorth> Terkhen: rv-wagons!!!!
13:27:06 <andythenorth> I need something to collaborate on :P
13:27:11 <andythenorth> I am mostly drumming my fingers
13:27:24 <Terkhen> andythenorth: I'm running some profiling test on the code I'm currently unifying
13:27:34 <andythenorth> Terkhen: did you code a newgrf yet to understand the spec?
13:28:37 <Terkhen> no :P
13:29:30 <andythenorth> do you need help?
13:29:40 *** fonsinchen has joined #openttd
13:29:53 *** fmauneko has quit IRC
13:30:53 *** fmauneko has joined #openttd
13:31:28 <Terkhen> once I finish this code I'll try to code a small articulated vehicle and fiddle a bit with the "can be attached" callback
13:31:50 <andythenorth> ok
13:32:38 <devilsadvocate> fwiw, i would buy an openttd cd if there was one.
13:33:09 *** fmauneko has quit IRC
13:36:44 <andythenorth> I could add more greeble to FISH :P
13:36:48 <andythenorth> or do something on FIRS
13:36:50 *** thomas001 has joined #openttd
13:36:51 <andythenorth> anyone playing FIRS?
13:37:04 <thomas001> hi, can you reconnemd a nice AI? or do you like playing without any AI?
13:37:12 * andythenorth finds it hard to prioritise for FIRS without player feedback :D
13:37:41 <Terkhen> lately I have been too lazy for playing with FIRS :(
13:37:51 <V453000> andythenorth: what exactly do you need?: )
13:38:22 <andythenorth> dunno
13:38:24 <andythenorth> :D
13:38:33 <andythenorth> "input"
13:38:33 <V453000> making chains more equal is number one for nice gameplay imo :)
13:38:43 <andythenorth> the ticket you opened?
13:38:47 <V453000> yes
13:39:09 <andythenorth> ok I'll look at that
13:39:10 <V453000> I dont think it needs to be like ... mathematically presicely balanced, but just "about-ish" :)
13:39:18 <V453000> the coal chains are way too strong :)
13:39:36 <V453000> on the other hand, I would make some sort of thingy that would make farms stronger
13:39:54 <andythenorth> town growth needing food :P
13:39:56 <V453000> be it more profit for farm supplies, or just something similar
13:40:05 <andythenorth> food could be a high value cargo?
13:40:08 <V453000> nobody really cares about towns in FIRS
13:40:20 <V453000> as good as goods would be ok I think :)
13:41:50 <andythenorth> I could reduce amount of coal produced at mines
13:42:13 <andythenorth> ENSP goes from 'scarce' to 'abundant' rather quickly once the chain is setup
13:43:00 <andythenorth> and the wood chain is too weak generally
13:43:02 <planetmaker> nah... mines are quite nice as they are IMHO
13:43:10 <andythenorth>
13:44:22 <planetmaker> but maybe don't reduce their output (that's boring), but the price of coal delivery, if that needs balancing
13:44:35 <planetmaker> only transporting 2t of coal is boring in transport games
13:44:41 <planetmaker> I want a whole train of it :-)
13:44:47 <planetmaker> and not wait 1 year for it to load
13:44:54 <andythenorth> coal is very high value in FIRS for some reason
13:45:31 <fonsinchen> Rubidium: I don't really get what it does, yet, but your patch for FS#4440 is considerably smaller than mine.
13:45:33 <andythenorth> whereas iron ore is same as wood
13:45:46 <andythenorth> V453000: I'll reduce payment for coal
13:45:50 <planetmaker> well. reduce coal profits then ;-)
13:45:57 <V453000> both at least
13:46:00 <V453000> production and payment
13:46:07 <planetmaker> production, too? Na...
13:46:12 <planetmaker> I want to transport stuff
13:46:20 <V453000> even if the coal is equal to all other primaries, it still has the best chain
13:46:37 <V453000> 135 production where everything else has 80-90 is imo quite bad
13:46:39 <andythenorth> I think coal production is too high. It starts around 135t
13:46:45 <andythenorth> forest is 96t
13:46:51 <planetmaker> V453000: not with appropriate prices
13:47:04 <andythenorth> I think about 108t is better
13:47:07 <planetmaker> coal is also needed in many places
13:47:16 <V453000> yes, that is why it is so useful
13:47:20 <planetmaker> thus it has to be more abundant than, say, ore
13:47:33 <V453000> therefore it should be penalized on profits
13:47:34 <planetmaker> V453000: yes, but it destroys the balance overall, if you cannot meet demand
13:47:43 <V453000> ?
13:47:47 <planetmaker> profits may be low; but production should not drop
13:48:02 <V453000> I see ... let more coal mines spawn instead?
13:48:12 *** dfox has joined #openttd
13:48:19 <planetmaker> and have all trains wait eternally to load? Na...
13:48:26 <planetmaker> coal mines IMHO may be productive. Why not?
13:48:35 <planetmaker> Just make it cheap bulk cargo
13:48:55 <V453000> then it needs to be cheaper than for example ore or wood :)
13:49:01 <planetmaker> yes.
13:49:05 <planetmaker> of course
13:49:06 <andythenorth> I have another answer to this
13:49:15 <andythenorth> currently industries don't randomise on map gen
13:49:24 <andythenorth> (starting cargo production)
13:49:38 <V453000> they will?
13:49:50 <planetmaker> andythenorth: randomization is no answer to this
13:49:57 <planetmaker> it just dilutes the problem
13:50:08 <V453000> anyway, I have to go for lunch, laters :)
13:50:13 <andythenorth> assume that I'll change the rates
13:50:15 <planetmaker> once balanced, then randomization will be nice
13:50:23 <fonsinchen> However, it changes saveload code ...
13:50:47 <andythenorth> planetmaker: randomisation will the problem
13:51:01 <planetmaker> andythenorth: how?
13:51:15 <planetmaker> it makes finding out the "correct" balance just so much more difficult
13:51:29 <planetmaker> it's the cream on top. But not good, if the coffee itself is bad
13:51:45 <andythenorth> well yes
13:52:13 *** fonsinchen has quit IRC
13:52:18 <andythenorth> but it also means there's no predictable 'best' chain
13:52:42 <andythenorth> 'best' depends on randomised production + how close together industries are
13:52:53 <planetmaker> of course. But that's only true, if they're somewhat equal in the first place. Otherwise it's still true
13:53:18 <andythenorth> currently the coal -> ensp chain is too dominant
13:53:22 <planetmaker> If wtih 80% probability coal is best - oh well. Doesn't matter to care about 20% games ;-)
14:05:20 *** fonsinchen has joined #openttd
14:11:57 * andythenorth wonders why FIRS default PAX rate is so low :o
14:14:24 <andythenorth> RL coal price per t is about same as oil price per barrel
14:14:30 <andythenorth> but 1 barrel != 1t :D
14:14:40 <Rubidium> fonsinchen: in line count yours is smaller. Mine "keeps" the service order as the current order over loading at stations by exploiting some stuff
14:15:12 <Rubidium> but it skips the order as cur_order_index
14:16:12 <fonsinchen> Mine asserts that auto-orders are created after the service order and also fixes the cur_order_index to make things work.
14:16:51 <fonsinchen> But I'm not sure it really works. There might be a problem with multiple service orders in a row.
14:17:29 <Rubidium> multiple service orders in a row are bogus in any case
14:17:57 <Rubidium> if the first doesn't trigger, then the rest doesn't trigger due to evaluating the next order
14:18:15 <Rubidium> if the first does trigger, then the rest doesn't trigger due to it having gone to a depot very recently
14:18:34 <Rubidium> but yes, that corner case has to be tested (somewhat)
14:18:49 <Rubidium> likewise what happens when the service order is the last/first in the list
14:22:37 * andythenorth ponders
14:22:54 <andythenorth> I need a way for a vehicle to reduce the late delivery penalty :P
14:23:02 <andythenorth> fish should be a high-speed cargo
14:23:07 <andythenorth> but boats aren't
14:23:07 <frosch123> the problem with both of your patches is, that it breaks everything which assumes that the current order is after cur_order_index
14:23:19 <andythenorth> boats have ice :P
14:23:30 <fonsinchen> I'll have a look at that later. First I have to get myself into a living state and then do some work for my day job.
14:23:40 <andythenorth> frosch123: ^ any bright ideas?
14:23:47 <frosch123> currently i try what happens if there are two cur_order_index, one for the current automatic order, one for the current real order
14:24:31 <frosch123> andythenorth: check the payment callback whether it tells something about speed and or vehicle type
14:25:24 <andythenorth>
14:25:32 <andythenorth> seems to have a limited range of vars
14:25:53 *** noteda has joined #openttd
14:25:55 <noteda> iwillrockyou
14:25:55 *** noteda has left #openttd
14:26:06 <andythenorth>
14:26:15 <andythenorth> "Currently, cargos don't have 40+x, 60+x, or 80+x variables, but they might be added later."
14:26:46 <Alberth> 6 fishing grounds, and no harbour :p
14:26:52 <andythenorth> What would type 82 check be for a cargo?
14:26:59 <andythenorth> the station, or the transporting vehicle?
14:28:27 <frosch123> or the industry/town ? :p
14:28:31 <andythenorth> hmm
14:28:53 <andythenorth> custom profit would enable various interesting gameplay effects
14:29:04 <andythenorth> reduced penalty for refrigerated cargos
14:29:18 <andythenorth> enhanced passenger rate for e.g. restaurant car in train
14:29:19 *** SmatZ sets mode: +b noteda!*@*
14:29:48 <Eddi|zuHause> SmatZ: you think that helps?
14:29:54 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: not really
14:30:01 <andythenorth> improved payment for an 'improved' station :P
14:30:16 <Rubidium> s/not \(.*\)/\1 not/
14:30:26 * andythenorth admits to playing a lot of railroad tycoon
14:30:29 <SmatZ> ok :)
14:30:37 <Terkhen> traitor!
14:30:52 <Rubidium> SmatZ: but heh, if it makes you feel better... why not. It doesn't hurt us much
14:31:00 <SmatZ> Rubidium: indeed :-)
14:32:50 <andythenorth> so I would need some kind of new vehicle property
14:33:01 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: different pricing for local and long distance passengers
14:33:11 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: that's already possible with the cb
14:34:09 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i mean whether a passenger travelled in a long distance car. not what distance he travelled
14:34:16 <andythenorth> ok
14:34:37 <andythenorth> some kind of label system for vehicles
14:34:48 <andythenorth> I believe I've thought of that before :P
14:34:56 *** roboboy has quit IRC
14:36:13 <Eddi|zuHause> basically: local passenger: low income, but low sensitivity to time. long distance passenger: higher income, but high sensitivity to time. long distance passenger with dining car: higher income, medium sensitivity to time [dining car has high maintenance, so only useful in longer trains]
14:37:20 <andythenorth> I thought labels would also be a good way to indicate compatibility between vehicles
14:38:01 <Eddi|zuHause> i think the whole mixing between vehicle sets thing is bogus...
14:38:07 <andythenorth> should coal be more or less money-earning than PAX in default FIRS?
14:38:19 <andythenorth> currently way more.... seems wrong
14:39:33 <Eddi|zuHause> in the beginning of the prussian state railway (around 1880-ish), the government had decided to reduce the transport price for coal, to encourage the factories to buy the local coal, instead of import coal from england
14:40:41 <Eddi|zuHause> (where "local" means silesia and the rhine province)
14:43:28 *** perk11 has quit IRC
14:44:54 * andythenorth rebalances FIRS rates
14:45:06 <andythenorth> bulk cargos: low rate, barely any payment penalty
14:45:18 <andythenorth> town cargos, very high rates, steep payment penalty
14:45:38 <andythenorth> farm cargos: increased rates so farms are more interesting to play with
14:45:46 <andythenorth> intermediate cargos: mixed
14:46:04 <andythenorth> and PAX way increased
14:53:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess low price rate can explain the problems i'm having ;)
14:55:08 <andythenorth> I can't decide what to do for 'Dredging Site'
14:55:25 <andythenorth> either show a crane on a barge / platform
14:55:38 <andythenorth> or do it like the Fishing Grounds - some bouys
14:55:45 <andythenorth> and include dredgers in FISH
14:59:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm leaning towards barge/platform
15:01:19 <andythenorth> I'm leaning towards both (random), or user configurable, or detect sets known to contain dredgers and change accordingly
15:09:50 * andythenorth ponders
15:09:56 <andythenorth> dredging site ~= quarry
15:10:15 <andythenorth> but combining one industry with onshore and offshore variants is a brainshaft
15:14:29 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't suppose you can retroactively change payment rates in a running game...
15:15:12 <Alberth> andythenorth: Fertilizer plant does 8t production per 8t delivered, except it accepts liters, and produces crates
15:17:02 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: you sort of can
15:17:10 <andythenorth> it's not supposed to work, but does seem to
15:17:13 <andythenorth> I wouldn't trust it
15:17:22 <andythenorth> Alberth: that raises the 'crates' issue again
15:17:24 <andythenorth> :D
15:17:31 <andythenorth> among other things :P
15:18:10 <Alberth> oh, the less generic description thingie
15:18:23 <Eddi|zuHause> non-water liquids (like oil) tend to have lower density than water
15:18:33 <Eddi|zuHause> so 1000l < 1t
15:19:27 <andythenorth> the spec allows for that
15:19:42 <andythenorth> I will happily put in whatever units other people provide in tickets :D
15:19:52 <andythenorth> it's one of those things I don't care about ;)
15:23:32 <Alberth> interestingly, the monthly crate delivery count to the forest is accurate :)
15:24:07 <andythenorth> yes
15:24:13 <andythenorth> that was slightly puzzling
15:24:20 <andythenorth> but the forest probably has no unhandled cbs
15:26:33 *** noteda1 has joined #openttd
15:26:35 <noteda1> iwillrockyou
15:26:35 *** noteda1 has left #openttd
15:26:48 *** Lakie has joined #openttd
15:27:13 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC
15:27:47 *** SmatZ sets mode: -b noteda!*@*
15:27:48 *** SmatZ sets mode: +b noteda*!*@*
15:28:02 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
15:28:11 <frosch123> smatz is too fast for me :)
15:28:19 <SmatZ> :-)
15:28:54 *** Zuu has quit IRC
15:36:13 <Wolf01> what about a ctrl+click->select number of days to delay the start of vehicles from a depot?
15:37:11 *** DanMacK has joined #openttd
15:38:06 <DanMacK> Hey all
15:39:29 <Wolf01> hoy
15:48:01 *** dfox has quit IRC
15:51:36 <andythenorth> frosch123: how feasible is something akin to action 14, but for vehicles?
15:51:56 <andythenorth> purpose would be to allow newgrf author to put additional static properties on vehicles
15:52:11 <frosch123> what meaning?
15:52:12 <andythenorth> and possibly let player make certain choices of static property (e.g. livery, capacity etc)
15:52:21 <planetmaker> eh?
15:52:36 <planetmaker> those are certainly not static properties
15:52:58 <andythenorth> hmm
15:53:05 <andythenorth> terminology is always a bit...fluid in my head
15:53:07 <andythenorth> :)
15:55:55 <andythenorth> it could be a solution to multiple issues:
15:56:07 <andythenorth> using cargo subtype is a bonkers way to do capacity refits
15:56:19 <andythenorth> using cargo subtype is a bonkers way to do livery refit
15:57:08 <andythenorth> any sane compatibility check between vehicles when using cb 1D / 15E requires a grf to know about all other vehicles in all other sets
15:57:10 <andythenorth> which is insane
15:57:46 <andythenorth> using cargo subtype for regearing is bonkers
15:58:50 <andythenorth> basically grf authors are using subtype as a chunk of vehicle-local-storage...
15:58:59 <andythenorth> ..., which happens to be connected to the GUI so they can provide arbitrary strings
15:59:54 <andythenorth> what would be a better way?
16:01:31 <Eddi|zuHause> the better way would be exactly to turn cargo subtype into a vehicle-local storage independent from actual cargo
16:02:04 <andythenorth> and in a way with GUI menu(s) for player?
16:04:12 <Eddi|zuHause> what's wrong with the split refit gui?
16:04:39 <andythenorth> maybe nothing
16:05:10 <andythenorth> depends how many choices you get and whether they're mutually exclusive or can be combined
16:08:29 *** |Jeroen| has quit IRC
16:13:31 <Eddi|zuHause> so you need a way to construct a custom dialog ;)
16:20:59 *** Fast2 has quit IRC
16:24:46 <Hirundo> Trains have 'user defined data' already, but without access to the GUI that's pretty useless
16:26:21 <andythenorth> which is where something akin to action 14 comes into play...
16:26:42 <andythenorth> all it can do is set the values of certain stored properties on the vehicle
16:26:59 <andythenorth> newgrf author has to handle what to do with those in nfo
16:48:36 *** ctibor has quit IRC
16:50:59 <Eddi|zuHause> problem with that: if you fit that into the refit gui, you must make test-runs with several callbacks, to update the capacity and possibly visual representation. those test-runs may not alter the persistent storage
16:52:15 <andythenorth> so handling failed cbs would present a problem?
16:52:40 <andythenorth> I think I see the issue
16:53:56 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it's the same thing as running commands without DC_EXEC
16:54:42 <andythenorth> hang on
16:54:58 <andythenorth> where did persistent storage arrive in this question? :)
16:55:03 <__ln__> Who is running OTTD in fullscreen on Windows?
16:55:15 <andythenorth> persistent storage isn't what I'm thinking of
16:55:33 <andythenorth> although it might come to the same thing when all said and done
16:55:59 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you said each gui-element has one or more persistant storage bits assigned to it
16:56:10 <Eddi|zuHause> like action 14 and parameter bitstuffing
16:56:20 <andythenorth> effectively yes
16:56:35 <andythenorth> if nfo can modify the parameters, I see the issue
16:57:03 <andythenorth> but we established before that parameters that can be modified from nfo are a no-no
16:57:16 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, varaction2 may change persistant storage...
16:57:46 <andythenorth> but not global grf parameters...
16:57:46 <Eddi|zuHause> this is different from parameters
16:57:56 <andythenorth> but it can't be like persistent storage :)
16:58:34 <andythenorth> there is that nasty issue where a consist checks storage on another vehicle which refers back to first vehicle in some horrible loop
16:58:56 <Eddi|zuHause> so you want to make it read-only if action 14-style refit gui is present?
16:59:10 <andythenorth> I can't see any other route that is viable
17:00:09 <kamnet> Looks like Planetmaker has his hands full today ;-)
17:00:16 <planetmaker> meh
17:00:35 <Eddi|zuHause> you might have weird feedback effects, but not really a loop in the sense of repeaded calculation
17:00:36 <planetmaker> I should just not read the forum today anymore. I'm sufficiently annoyed already at all this ignorance
17:01:04 <Eddi|zuHause> the callback can only be run at defined locations in the code
17:07:05 * fonsinchen hates javascript vigorously.
17:07:28 <fonsinchen> Why couldn't they invent a language for the web that's actually a language.
17:07:42 <Terkhen> ^
17:09:04 <Eddi|zuHause> misguided design goals like "targetting simple people without computer science background". has also brought us glorious moments in history like COBOL
17:11:26 <fonsinchen> fortunately COBOL is mostly dead, though.
17:15:39 <Eddi|zuHause> unless you get hired to maintain 50 year old banking software :p
17:19:22 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd
17:22:03 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: terkhen * r21921 /trunk/src/ (ground_vehicle.hpp vehicle_base.h): -Codechange: Move GroundVehicleSubtypeFlags as they will be needed by some Vehicle functions.
17:23:07 *** Chillosophy has joined #openttd
17:26:47 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: terkhen * r21922 /trunk/src/ (ground_vehicle.hpp vehicle_base.h): -Codechange: Unify articulated vehicle checking functions.
17:27:51 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: terkhen * r21923 /trunk/src/ (train.h vehicle_base.h): -Codechange: Unify articulated vehicle iteration functions.
17:29:11 <andythenorth> Alberth:
17:29:22 <andythenorth> ^ also applies to Machine Shop and other industries
17:29:23 <andythenorth> :(
17:30:27 *** fjb is now known as Guest2055
17:30:29 *** fjb has joined #openttd
17:30:37 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: terkhen * r21924 /trunk/src/ (9 files):
17:30:37 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: -Codechange: Unify some parts of the articulated vehicle code.
17:30:37 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: -Cleanup: Avoid conversions to Train and RoadVehicle that are no longer required.
17:30:53 <Terkhen> ^ another bit of code unified :)
17:32:04 <andythenorth> :)
17:32:22 * planetmaker applauds Terkhen :-)
17:32:50 <Terkhen> besides a few bits of code remaining, now Train and RoadVehicle use the same code for articulated vehicles
17:33:14 <planetmaker> :-)
17:33:23 <Terkhen> once I finish with the remaining articulated vehicle changes I'll give depot_gui another look to see what else we need to unify before starting with wagons
17:33:42 <planetmaker> Next then: articulated vehicles with arbitrary ID?
17:34:22 <andythenorth> Terkhen: I had a go at the depot code
17:34:24 <andythenorth> and broke stuff :P
17:34:37 <andythenorth> it looked like quite a lot of changes needed
17:34:40 <andythenorth> but most looked to me simple
17:34:53 <Terkhen> planetmaker: since I have no clue of what you are suggesting, I suppose it is related to the NewGRF specs
17:35:03 <Terkhen> I should try to code an articulated vehicle to understand that part
17:35:15 <planetmaker> Terkhen: yes, it is :-)
17:35:32 <planetmaker> the articulated parts can - afaik - have only an ID between 64 and 128(?)
17:35:37 <planetmaker> or something. I never coded one
17:35:41 <andythenorth> I think that changed
17:35:46 <planetmaker> it did?
17:35:53 <andythenorth> I'd have to read commits
17:35:56 <andythenorth> or ask someone who knows :P
17:36:05 <Terkhen> hmm... why is that? some weird arbitrary limitation?
17:36:14 *** planetmaker sets mode: +b *!*@174.122.112.*
17:36:33 <andythenorth> ID had to be less than <128
17:36:42 <andythenorth> there's probably a good bit-based reason somewhere
17:36:54 <Terkhen> oh, missing bits in callbacks or something like that
17:37:14 *** Guest2055 has quit IRC
17:37:18 <planetmaker> Terkhen: it's newgrf specs... limitations are always there for obscure historical reasons ;-)
17:39:21 <Terkhen> yes, these limitations always make me remember those famous computing quotes about "x will be enough for everybody"
17:40:13 <planetmaker> tehehe - me, too
17:40:30 <planetmaker> like ipv4 ;-)
17:40:39 <planetmaker> or as they now tell for ipv6 ;-)
17:41:09 *** nicfer has joined #openttd
17:41:10 <planetmaker> I wonder how many years that will last.
17:41:11 <__ln__> #elsewhere someone was remembering that in the original Civilization pyramids allowed a revolution without a period of anarchy
17:41:29 <Terkhen> 640K of ram, 5 computers for the united states, etc
17:41:45 <planetmaker> oh... a windows administrator account using IRC
17:41:55 <planetmaker> hehe, yeah.
17:42:04 <planetmaker> world market: 5 computers / year
17:42:08 <Terkhen> :D
17:42:47 <Alberth> andythenorth: thanks
17:43:30 <andythenorth> planetmaker: I need to specify sugar refinery industry window text depending on climate
17:43:34 <andythenorth> how do I do that?
17:43:47 <planetmaker> define 4 strings.
17:44:01 <planetmaker> set the stringID into a parameter, depending upon climate
17:44:10 <andythenorth> ok
17:44:11 <planetmaker> write that stringID via action6 into the action4
17:44:28 <nicfer> remember the suggestions about trains requiring fuel to run?
17:44:32 <planetmaker> ehm... not action4, but whereever the string is used in the industry definition
17:44:47 <planetmaker> or you just do it simpler, andythenorth :
17:45:04 <planetmaker> is it an action0 string?
17:45:06 <andythenorth> I thought calling it 'Sugar' might be sufficient, but not
17:45:21 <andythenorth> no it's an industry window text - D0 probably
17:45:33 <Mazur> _In_ I have that one lying around.
17:45:33 <nicfer> well, that would've a good idea for a challenge mode
17:45:40 <planetmaker> well... but where / how are they given?
17:46:09 <andythenorth> lang/7F_any.pnfo is where the text is
17:46:21 <planetmaker> :-) I meant rather conceptually
17:46:22 <Mazur> pm: Wasm't it "5 computers(/year) by the year 2000"?
17:46:30 <planetmaker> which action brings it into the game?
17:46:39 <andythenorth> sugar refinery industry window text, it's cb
17:46:51 <andythenorth> I could branch on climate in varaction 2
17:47:07 <andythenorth> but that's a bad idea
17:47:30 <planetmaker> ah, callback.
17:47:32 <andythenorth> be better to change text contents depending on climate
17:47:43 <planetmaker> yes, then climate-branching might be easiest.
17:48:52 <nicfer> players start with a limited stock of fuel to run some oil routes in order to prospere
17:50:09 * andythenorth puzzled
17:50:47 <planetmaker> hm?
17:50:58 *** kamnet has quit IRC
17:51:33 <andythenorth> I don't want to use the cb
17:51:39 <andythenorth> that means branching the template
17:52:44 <planetmaker> can you give me the template filename and the industry filename?
17:53:59 <andythenorth> sugarrefinery.pnfo
17:54:59 <andythenorth> you've solved this for the sugar cane cargo label - in nfo_lang.pnfo
17:55:55 <planetmaker> I did?
17:56:29 <andythenorth> yes
17:56:31 <planetmaker> hm... :-)
17:56:33 <andythenorth> I think I see how to do it
17:56:41 <andythenorth> but not sure how to avoid breakages
17:56:57 <andythenorth> action 7 decides the contents of the string
17:56:59 <planetmaker> yeah, seems like an easy solution, too :-)
18:11:11 *** nicfer has quit IRC
18:15:28 *** Fuco has quit IRC
18:27:45 *** Illegal_Alien has joined #openttd
18:36:31 *** FauxFaux_ has quit IRC
18:41:14 *** DanMacK has left #openttd
18:48:09 *** ar3k has quit IRC
18:52:19 *** test has joined #openttd
18:52:22 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
18:52:38 *** ar3k has joined #openttd
19:09:44 *** PhoenixII has quit IRC
19:09:47 *** ecke has joined #openttd
19:10:46 *** Maluf has quit IRC
19:11:19 *** ABCRic has joined #openttd
19:11:45 *** Illegal_Alien has quit IRC
19:13:34 *** Phoenix_the_II has joined #openttd
19:33:00 *** DanMacK has joined #openttd
19:35:57 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
19:48:37 <planetmaker> <-- so... everyone is asked to download that savegame and suggest a better station ;-) :-P
19:48:46 <planetmaker> quite a modest request, I think
20:00:12 <frosch123> upload the latest ps game, and tell him you extended the network a bit
20:03:10 <Wolf01> ahahah
20:09:02 <z-MaTRiX_> hey-ho
20:09:04 <z-MaTRiX_> hm
20:09:19 <z-MaTRiX_> was wondering about the new control traaaforming modifier
20:10:41 <z-MaTRiX_> whats up <;
20:13:56 <Eddi|zuHause> short version: you can't flatten the entire world in one go anymore
20:15:06 <Alberth> except in the scenario editor :p
20:18:14 <ABCRic> :(
20:18:27 <z-MaTRiX_> ;<
20:18:27 <z-MaTRiX_> <;
20:18:30 <z-MaTRiX_> btw
20:18:38 <z-MaTRiX_> this must be asked many times
20:18:52 <z-MaTRiX_> why does a maglev break down?
20:19:26 *** DanMacK has quit IRC
20:19:30 <Alberth> it's made of parts that fail
20:19:32 <z-MaTRiX_> only cheap chinese maglevs available in game and superconductors overheat, computers freeze? :(
20:19:37 <planetmaker> why does a car break down? a train? a plane?
20:19:59 <Alberth> magnetism also fails every now and then
20:20:03 <planetmaker> you don't honestly think that any technology is safe of any failrue
20:20:07 <Eddi|zuHause> they parked a maintenance car on the track.
20:20:08 <z-MaTRiX_> i do
20:20:09 <z-MaTRiX_> :)
20:20:20 <Alberth> there is a setting for that :)
20:20:26 <z-MaTRiX_> sure
20:20:31 <planetmaker> high-temperature super-conductors start to fail above ~80K
20:20:37 <z-MaTRiX_> but that setting assumes everything is breakdown-free
20:20:58 <Eddi|zuHause> it's "cool" to live in a world where 80K is "high temperature" :p
20:21:05 <z-MaTRiX_> oc aeroplances can crash sometimes
20:21:08 <planetmaker> hehe
20:21:16 <z-MaTRiX_> *aeroplanes
20:21:25 *** DDR has joined #openttd
20:21:54 <Alberth> I'd like to have some of the disasters, but not all. You have to pick the setting that gives you the least stress when playing.
20:22:50 <z-MaTRiX_> just annoying to see a high-tech maglev train breakdown :)
20:22:55 <andythenorth> new disasters :P
20:22:59 <andythenorth> disaster framework
20:23:10 * andythenorth wonders what would be a good disaster
20:23:15 <andythenorth> why do I turn disasters off?
20:23:15 <Alberth> andythenorth: yeah, I had such high hopes, but alas
20:23:23 <z-MaTRiX_> when ufo crashes into a city
20:23:24 <z-MaTRiX_> <;
20:23:29 <andythenorth> are disasters just rubbish?
20:23:39 <andythenorth> or is it the ensuing micro-management that's rubbish :P
20:23:45 *** ctibor has joined #openttd
20:24:10 <Alberth> for me it is an annoying ufo that repeatedly destroys the same spot
20:24:18 <z-MaTRiX_> hehe
20:24:21 <z-MaTRiX_> make it random then
20:24:35 <Alberth> it IS random, but not enough
20:24:35 <z-MaTRiX_> weighted on populated places
20:24:37 <andythenorth> floods - all trains run at 10% of normal speed
20:24:41 <andythenorth> better/
20:24:42 <andythenorth> ?
20:27:06 <z-MaTRiX_> earthquakes
20:27:07 <z-MaTRiX_> <;
20:27:15 <z-MaTRiX_> land moves
20:27:42 <z-MaTRiX_> trains then go in a big hole of boiling lava
20:28:49 <Eddi|zuHause> <z-MaTRiX_> just annoying to see a high-tech maglev train breakdown :) <-- "realistically", the higher the tech, the more likely it breaks down.
20:29:11 <z-MaTRiX_> well
20:29:18 <Eddi|zuHause> just compare german technology with russian technology :p
20:29:18 <z-MaTRiX_> it levitattes above the track
20:29:28 <z-MaTRiX_> and basic magnetism causes that
20:29:36 <z-MaTRiX_> magnetism will fail?
20:29:39 <planetmaker> basic?
20:29:48 <z-MaTRiX_> yes, no special things
20:30:00 <planetmaker> it's lifted by linear drives. Which is a complicated piece of electricity
20:30:01 <Eddi|zuHause> z-MaTRiX_: doesn't mean the electric current can't overheat some parts
20:30:03 <z-MaTRiX_> some coils get electric current
20:30:14 <planetmaker> never seen a burned-out coil?
20:30:20 <planetmaker> a bad contact?
20:30:20 <ABCRic> In real life, a magnet failing, a computer missing an instruction, or something as small as that would cause the train to derail
20:30:20 <z-MaTRiX_> and you think they designed the maglev to overheat sometimes?
20:30:21 <z-MaTRiX_> :)
20:30:25 <Eddi|zuHause> there's SOOOOO many things that can go wrong in a maglev...
20:30:31 <ABCRic> you should be happy it just stops :)
20:30:45 <z-MaTRiX_> sure if computer fails
20:30:52 <z-MaTRiX_> it can stop
20:31:06 <z-MaTRiX_> and if no power
20:31:06 <z-MaTRiX_> ;<
20:31:07 <planetmaker> power glitch causing temporary loss of lift, causing train to become... crashed
20:31:17 <z-MaTRiX_> actually
20:31:21 <z-MaTRiX_> it has wheels
20:31:24 <z-MaTRiX_> and will land on them
20:31:29 <z-MaTRiX_> its just not cool
20:31:48 <Eddi|zuHause> you can still throw away the wheels afterwards...
20:31:50 <planetmaker> why? The lift cannot fail after all >:-D
20:31:55 <Eddi|zuHause> that is maintenance which will delay the train
20:33:49 * Alberth still votes for failing magnetism in OpenTTD
20:33:52 <z-MaTRiX_> “Proven" maglev systems are in commercial operation in Nagoya, Japan (March 2005) and Shanghai, China (March 2004) and both systems operate with a 99.97% on time – to the second – schedule reliability due to precise computer controlled operations
20:33:56 <z-MaTRiX_> :)
20:33:58 <z-MaTRiX_> maintenance included
20:34:09 <z-MaTRiX_> Maglev systems can operate on steeper grades in all-weather conditions with unchanged schedule reliability
20:34:10 *** heffer has joined #openttd
20:34:18 <z-MaTRiX_> High-Speed Maglev (HSM) systems are vastly superior to all traditional (regardless of speed) rail in acceleration, braking, safety, noise levels, all-weather operations, infrastructure longevity/sustainability, maintenance and now, construction costs and speed of construction
20:34:23 <Alberth> I am SO glad OpenTTD is not realistic :)
20:34:25 <z-MaTRiX_> Maglev has non-contact, frictionless operations which allows inherently super low maintenance and low life cycle costs, regardless of weather conditions
20:34:53 <z-MaTRiX_> Maglev systems are long electric motors – the vehicles and guideways (tracks) are interdependent and comprise the two basic elements of an electric motor with no need for bearings or grease
20:35:06 <ABCRic> Also, maglev will fail when the earth inverts its magnetic poles.
20:35:23 <z-MaTRiX_> no
20:35:34 <planetmaker> not quite
20:35:40 <z-MaTRiX_> the track generates magnetic field for levitation
20:35:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i seriously can't decide whether i should laugh at you or feel sad about you...
20:37:24 <ABCRic> maybe not, but it makes some really annoying noise. Or so I heard
20:37:48 <ABCRic> :P
20:38:10 <z-MaTRiX_> haha
20:38:31 <z-MaTRiX_> the wind causes annoying noise ?
20:42:50 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC
20:43:39 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
20:48:10 <z-MaTRiX_>
20:48:14 <z-MaTRiX_> heres the real thing
21:03:30 *** test has left #openttd
21:07:38 *** FauxFaux has joined #openttd
21:09:04 *** thomas001 has quit IRC
21:16:22 *** ABCRic has quit IRC
21:18:51 *** DDR has quit IRC
21:19:11 *** fonsinchen has quit IRC
21:34:02 *** Adambean has quit IRC
21:36:00 *** fonsinchen has joined #openttd
21:37:34 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: alberth * r21925 /trunk/src/ (roadveh_cmd.cpp train.h vehicle.cpp vehicle_base.h): -Doc: Doxygen additions and markup corrections to vehicle-related functions.
21:38:35 *** Alberth has left #openttd
22:05:07 *** ABCRic has joined #openttd
22:12:22 *** Brianett1 is now known as Brianetta
22:16:36 <andythenorth> using smoke to hold more cargos to ships?
22:16:45 <andythenorth> I've read the smoke code, I think it's a no no no
22:17:02 <Terkhen> I don't think that smoke is associated in any way to the vehicle that produces it
22:17:31 <andythenorth> yup
22:17:46 <andythenorth> I wondered about some crazy scheme where cargo is shifted from one smoke vehicle to next
22:17:49 <andythenorth> like a bucket chain
22:17:50 <Wolf01> clone train crashes the game (r21924 nightly)
22:17:55 <andythenorth> but it would be nuts :P
22:18:22 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: what happens when you run out of vehicle IDs and a smoke puff is skipped?
22:18:35 <andythenorth> your cargo went 'puff' :)
22:19:03 <andythenorth> spoilage :)
22:20:54 <ABCRic> Wolf01: indeed
22:21:48 <andythenorth> electricity is like underground metro
22:21:49 *** fonsinchen has quit IRC
22:21:55 <andythenorth> it's the suggestion that won't die :P
22:23:04 * andythenorth knows at least two ways to implement it
22:23:14 <andythenorth> one of which is possible
22:26:03 <ABCRic> Access violation reading location 0x00000008, @vehicle_cmd.cpp:789 if (w->IsGroundVehicle() && w->HasArticulatedPart())
22:28:13 <Eddi|zuHause> missing a check w != NULL
22:28:25 <Wolf01> eh, unified too much ;)
22:28:52 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess Terkhen should check that?
22:32:41 <Terkhen> ABCRic: please post a bug report, I can't look at that right now
22:32:57 <ABCRic> Terkhen: there is one already
22:33:02 <Terkhen> ok
22:33:18 <ABCRic> FS#4450 it is
22:33:20 <Terkhen> I wonder why it did not appear while profiling different games for hours
22:33:25 <Terkhen> but I'll know later
22:35:57 *** andythenorth has left #openttd
22:44:41 *** tokai|mdlx has joined #openttd
22:49:14 *** JOHN-SHEPARD has joined #openttd
22:50:09 *** DayDreamer1 has quit IRC
22:50:17 *** X-2 has joined #openttd
22:51:01 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC
22:56:35 *** welshdragon has left #openttd
23:04:17 *** Fast2 has joined #openttd
23:04:40 <Terkhen> heh, cloning
23:20:24 *** Muddy_ has joined #openttd
23:20:39 *** Muddy is now known as Muddy-
23:20:39 *** Muddy_ is now known as Muddy
23:22:33 *** Progman has quit IRC
23:23:09 *** Biolunar has quit IRC
23:25:22 *** Muddy- has quit IRC
23:25:53 <Terkhen> hmm... this is not making any sense so I'll look into it tomorrow
23:25:56 <Terkhen> good night
23:29:19 <Wolf01> 'night
23:29:24 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC
23:30:27 *** Lakie has quit IRC
23:42:52 <CIA-11> OpenTTD: frosch * r21926 /trunk/src/vehicle_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#4450](r21924): v != w.
23:56:11 *** dfox has joined #openttd
23:58:40 *** Kurimus has quit IRC
23:59:13 <ABCRic> 'night
23:59:19 *** ABCRic has quit IRC