IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2009-11-26
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00:10:30 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r18295 /trunk/src/road_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#bigos](r18283): Missed one PR_TERRAFORM.
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00:41:58 <O----notas> Hi everyone, please, how can I enable logging to a file?
00:41:58 <O----notas> I've tried DEBUG, or printf, but that goes to a console (Windows XP, compiled using MinGW.
00:41:58 <O----notas> I've tried openttd -d 1 > foo.txt, but OpenTTD opens another console for stdout...
00:44:22 <frosch123> <- iirc you have to convert ottd to a console application
00:44:33 <frosch123> (but i have no idea about windows)
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00:46:23 <glx> frosch123 is right :)
00:47:54 <O----notas> frosch123, glx: Thanks, I will try that ;-)
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03:34:16 <PeterT> night all
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09:23:06 <bartavelle> hello
09:23:12 <Luukland> ...
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10:10:01 <Terkhen> good morning
10:12:32 <planetmaker> \o/ @ Rubidium! Timetable separations, yeah! :-) (or do I mis-understand?)
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10:16:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i only saw start dates, not separation
10:20:53 <fjb> moin
10:22:10 <Eddi|zuHause> from what i see, the expected arrival/departure and the start date have been included, so it misses the autoseparation [headway], the virtual 24h clock, the station timetables and probably more pieces
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10:43:50 * Rubidium sees Eddi has good eyes
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10:50:40 <Rubidium> though I'm having some thoughts about the whole 24h clock especially on the savegame compatability side
10:55:59 <planetmaker> given a start date and the usual travel times... can't that be used for a separation (if I don't share orders)?
10:57:06 <Rubidium> it can, but then you already could without anything that I just added by 'timing' the arrival+late counter reset just right
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11:09:49 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: yes, but it's very tedious, especially if adding vehicles to an existing line
11:12:18 <Rubidium> too bad headway isn't perfect either; I haven't been able to find the trick to set a start date *and* use headway
11:12:47 <Rubidium> vehicles always seem to end up having timetables that do not coincide with my wishes
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11:16:12 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, and i totally can't handle this inner-city traffic without a subway...
11:18:04 <Rubidium> 6 inch or footlong subway?
11:19:35 <Eddi|zuHause> the bigger the better ;)
11:19:54 <planetmaker> size matters, eh? ;-)
11:21:01 <Eddi|zuHause>,%2011.%20Jul%201967.png
11:23:12 <Rubidium> that's quite an old build
11:23:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i hate scp... it says "100%" while it is not finished by far...
11:23:40 <Rubidium> agreed
11:23:59 <Rubidium> although... from scp's point of view it has sent 100% to the OS' send buffer
11:24:13 <Eddi|zuHause> then i should decrease the send buffer somewhere..
11:24:21 <Eddi|zuHause> where do i do that?
11:25:01 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, the build is from when i updated the timetable patch...
11:26:13 <Rubidium> /proc/sys/net/core/wmem_max ?
11:27:44 <Eddi|zuHause> says 131071
11:27:57 <Eddi|zuHause> is that byte?
11:28:51 <Rubidium> I hope so :)
11:29:14 <Rubidium> cause ~128 MiB is a bit excessive
11:30:34 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, no, that didn't help
11:30:58 <Rubidium> then I have no clue
11:31:05 <Eddi|zuHause> still says 100% (of 528KB) immediately
11:31:10 <Rubidium> except limiting the upload speed
11:34:25 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18296 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: show the next 4 orders instead of the first 4 orders in the ship/aircraft vehicle lists
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11:36:23 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: what do I have to envision with the station timetables?
11:36:50 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure either, i think i screwed up that part of the gui when updating
11:37:06 <Rubidium> oh... ctrl-click on the vehicle in the station window
11:37:49 <Eddi|zuHause> some things are very hidden ;)
11:38:40 <Eddi|zuHause> there was also some thing about sorting vehicles by planned arrival, expected arrival or lateness
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11:53:23 <Eddi|zuHause> this city is even worse:,%2031.%20Jul%201967.png
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12:01:03 <asilv> i should perhaps make an option to reduce passenger/mail generation for swedish shouses set at some point...
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12:09:48 <Eddi|zuHause> that could be useful
12:10:18 <Eddi|zuHause> but possibly coordinate that with other house sets like TTRS or TaI
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12:12:30 <asilv> Tai is quite different from other houseset with its town size restrictions etc, and should not be mixed with other sets imo. I agree for other sets however
12:13:42 <asilv> the problem is that the two main housesets ttrs and nacities don't seem to be actively developed anymore
12:15:14 <planetmaker> there's a 3rd set: swedish ;-)
12:16:18 <Eddi|zuHause> no, that's the set we are originally talking about ;)
12:16:19 <planetmaker> and I would still like to convince you to use the DevZone as your repository ;-)
12:16:28 <asilv> i guess i could ask zimmlock if he allows to make updated "cargodist edition" of ttrs, with reduced passengers and modified house propabilities
12:16:57 <planetmaker> asilv: the TTRS license should allow to modify it. It explicitly grants this permission
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12:17:28 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, as you are here, i have a very basic concern with all the house sets out there: why do the houses have to be green?
12:17:32 <planetmaker> along the lines of "free to use and modify for (O)TTD(P) use"
12:17:46 <planetmaker> uh?
12:17:47 <asilv> i don't draw them i just code :p
12:18:05 <asilv> but whats wrong with green houses?
12:18:24 <asilv> and there aren't that many of them anyway
12:18:47 <Eddi|zuHause> not many? about half of the houses in every city here are green...
12:19:01 <Eddi|zuHause> green is ugly...
12:20:07 <asilv> if I count correctly there are two green houses in swedish set
12:21:27 <asilv> many others have green roofs however
12:23:28 <Eddi|zuHause> take for example this screenshot:,%2011.%20Jul%201967.png <- between Mühlheim Transfer and Mühlheim Zentrum there are two houses with green roof and one with green front, and lots of other houses that way, not counting the TTRS ones
12:27:00 <asilv> well i'm not sure if there is anything wrong with green spesifically, but maybe there are too many colourful buildings in general
12:27:33 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, and there are too many skyscrapers in TTRS, and lots of other stuff...
12:28:12 <Eddi|zuHause> in general, many GRFs focus too much on "beautiful" desinger-stuff, and miss out on the basic stuff
12:28:45 <asilv> somewhat true, i agree
12:30:20 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: with "basic stuff" you mean the not-so-fancy houses?
12:30:32 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, for example
12:30:35 <Eddi|zuHause> also bridges
12:30:38 <planetmaker> e.g. kind of default houses which add to the usual urban tristesse?
12:30:41 <Eddi|zuHause> or stations
12:31:02 <planetmaker> Well... bridges and stations are separate grfs IMO.
12:31:10 <planetmaker> each
12:32:46 <planetmaker> something worthwhile to take up sometime might be to enhance TBRS with the snowy and japanese bridge versions. Other versions are there, too. And make one newgrf out of it.
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12:33:46 <planetmaker> asilv: but one thing I just wrote in a forum posting: it's nice that you have your set GPL. Only it allowed me to understand how those things really work by looking at it as good examples :-)
12:33:51 <asilv> i'm not sure how the snowy versions could be used as there is no varaction2 for bridges
12:33:57 <planetmaker> thanks! :-)
12:34:15 <planetmaker> oh, there isn't? Hm... sad
12:34:30 <asilv> it's good if it's helpfull to someone
12:34:58 <asilv> I have to admit that it isn't very well commented in many places
12:35:23 <planetmaker> only the wiki alone at my disposal would have left me wondering in places, I think
12:35:36 <planetmaker> it's alright, I think :-)
12:36:12 <asilv> well, you haven't seen the new road sensitive buildings code
12:36:26 <planetmaker> So IMO it was a good example that it helped to have open source, even if it isn't copied, it helps by example :-)
12:36:27 <asilv> it's one big hack :p
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12:36:33 <planetmaker> hehe :-)
12:37:03 <asilv> as it uses animition frames to store information about house directions
12:37:17 <planetmaker> I thought of going in that direction, too. There are some houses in the comic set which seem to have a preferred road side.
12:37:36 <planetmaker> Depending on the road layout I would use one house or another
12:37:58 <planetmaker> couldn't that be done with varaction 60+x instead?
12:38:31 <asilv> yes, but then they change direction when for example bus station is built
12:38:44 <planetmaker> hm, that's bad indeed.
12:40:12 <asilv> so I decide the direction when house is built with var (maybe 64?) and store that with animation frame
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12:41:06 <asilv> 62 it is not 64
12:43:21 <planetmaker> what about 67?
12:43:36 <planetmaker> or 66
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12:44:40 <planetmaker> it doesn't give you road. But it gives you "no house"
12:45:30 <asilv> hmm, but then houses could be facing to water or industries or whatever
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12:47:01 <planetmaker> they could, yes
12:47:13 <planetmaker> But you can check for water by means of 62
12:47:24 <blathijs> How about 42?
12:47:47 <Sacro> it's a good number
12:49:34 <planetmaker> blathijs: "nearby" is needed, so it needs to be some 60+x number. But yeah...
12:50:03 <asilv> anyway, some people complained that houses should not in general change direction after they are built, no matter what happens. and the code already works so it is not that big problem
12:50:42 <planetmaker> :-)
12:50:54 <planetmaker> I guess you have kind of eternal animation frames?
12:51:57 <asilv> yes the frame selection code is run if frame is 0, otherwise frames 1-8 show the direction
12:52:25 <asilv> and frame is never changed if it isn't 0
12:53:08 <asilv> George gets credit for the idea
12:53:22 <planetmaker> good one, yes
12:53:44 <planetmaker> probably better than many checks
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12:56:37 <asilv> yeah, it isn't actually that big hack, but using animation frames to store information just feels wrong
12:58:30 <planetmaker> I agree. Somewhat. But if you skip the animation from that, it's right again :-)
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13:05:59 <planetmaker> Anyway, I'm looking forward to the next version! :-)
13:07:06 <asilv> should be out soon
13:07:14 <asilv> maybe even tomorrow
13:08:23 <asilv> but before end of the month anyway
13:13:27 <planetmaker> wow. Good news :-)
13:17:56 <asilv> i'm still wondering whether the 42 was serious suggestion or a hitchhiker's guide reference :p
13:18:25 <planetmaker> I think it was serious. But 62 would be more appropriate as you don't want to investigate the very tile of your house ;-)
13:18:56 <planetmaker> but anything is possible
13:19:11 <asilv> 42 is town zone
13:19:21 <planetmaker> yes
13:19:31 <planetmaker> ah, damz, they don't correspond
13:20:30 <planetmaker> <-- btw. Anyone who can clearify what's the difference between feature 07, vars 60 and 61?
13:20:55 <planetmaker> Looks to me like some kind of error...
13:22:47 <asilv> 60 = original ttd houses, 61 = newgrf houses from the same grf, i think
13:22:52 <planetmaker> maybe I just don't understand the difference between "new" and "old" type house number.
13:22:56 <planetmaker> yeah, maybe.
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13:24:47 <asilv> for houses each grf has it's own ids so there can be multiple houses with same id without problems, unlike vehicles for example
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13:28:01 <asilv> so without 2 variables ottd wouldn't know if you want to look for origal house with id 00 or newgrf house with same id
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13:35:04 <planetmaker> hm... makes sense.
13:38:10 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... headway gets somewhat confused when replacing vehicles...
13:46:12 <Eddi|zuHause> hm²... something suddenly slows down my game
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14:36:59 <Belugas> hello
14:38:16 <Sacro> Posso restare la notte?
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14:56:40 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r18297 /trunk/src/vehicle_base.h: -Fix: Preserve timetable-start when auto-replacing/-renewing.
14:56:54 * Sacro notes his uni friend has just piped nano into grep :\
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15:28:14 <Eddi|zuHause> that does not sound exceptionally useful
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16:29:32 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18298 /trunk/ (known-bugs.txt readme.txt): -Document: that the dummy AI message is because 'you' don't have an AI... and how to 'solve' the issue; way too many people are ignorant
16:31:20 <Belugas> buwahahahah!!!
16:31:47 <Belugas> thus social statement is shared by a few people around ;)
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16:47:43 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18299 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_changelog.hpp: -Update: the ai changelog document
16:53:53 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18300 /branches/0.7/ (7 files in 3 dirs):
16:53:53 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: [0.7] -Backport from trunk:
16:53:53 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: - Update: readme / AI changelog (r18299, r18298)
16:53:53 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: - Fix: [NewGRF] When starting a new game the values of action D variable 13 were incorrect [FS#3324] (r18207)
16:53:53 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: - Add: Experimental option to try to statically link to libicu (r18147)
16:53:55 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: - Change: One more developer added to the history of OpenTTD (r18111)
16:58:52 <PeterT> what's a backport from trunk?
16:59:06 <PeterT> all the features in trunk are now implemented in 0.7?
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17:01:02 <SmatZ> no
17:01:08 <SmatZ> only those mentioned in the commit
17:02:24 <dihedral> SmatZ, :-)
17:02:34 <Sacro> sounds like time for a new release...
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18:45:44 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: translators * r18301 /trunk/src/lang/ (9 files): (log message trimmed)
18:45:44 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:44 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: dutch - 20 changes by habell
18:45:44 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: finnish - 10 changes by jpx_
18:45:44 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: german - 20 changes by planetmaker
18:45:45 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: greek - 30 changes by
18:45:45 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: hungarian - 1 changes by alyr
18:48:23 <planetmaker> he... greek changes?
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18:55:14 <Chrill> by whooo?
18:55:21 * Chrill just updated the Swedish
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18:59:16 <SmatZ> by
18:59:47 <asilv> aah, that guy!
19:01:39 <Sacro> then i look at you, and the world's alright with me
19:01:49 <Sacro> just one look at you, and i know it's gonna be, a lovely daaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!
19:03:09 <Chrill> Sacro, stick to singing in #tycoon :P
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19:04:00 <Sacro> hehe
19:04:07 <Sacro> bah, damn you bisn
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19:43:40 <Eddi|zuHause> how good a rating do i need to tear down a hospital? (TTRS)
19:44:41 <SmatZ> I am not sure you can ever do that
19:44:55 <SmatZ> I remember I was trying to do that once, and failed
19:45:03 <SmatZ> but I don't remember how high rating I had
19:45:08 <Chrill> I think it's doable
19:45:08 <Chrill> not sure
19:45:10 <Chrill> but i think it is
19:45:13 <Chrill> with top rating or whatever
19:45:19 <Chrill> Excellent
19:45:22 <Chrill> not sure though
19:46:44 <Eddi|zuHause> why do i have a forest that produces 0 wood?
19:46:52 <Eddi|zuHause> (standard industries)
19:47:22 <frosch123> was it just created?
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19:48:05 <SmatZ> or is going to die
19:49:59 <Belugas> or you;re on pause, which could explain the hospital not possble to destroy...
19:50:02 * Belugas hides
19:50:23 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: oh, it was "Hotel Praha" what I couldn't destroy
19:50:44 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: no, it was there for ages, and produced something before
19:51:00 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: it started producing again
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19:51:55 <frosch123> maybe the monthly production is lower than the amount that is needed to issue transport to station
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19:52:52 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... cargodist and airplanes are hopeless...
19:53:05 <SmatZ> reminds me of this patch :)
19:55:45 <Eddi|zuHause> when does the next larger airport appear?
19:56:07 <Eddi|zuHause> i only have city airport in 1978
19:56:57 <frosch123> 1980 metropolitan
19:57:22 <frosch123> 1983 commuter
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20:11:05 <Timmaexx> Are there any news from the airport branch?
20:11:29 <planetmaker> No :-(
20:12:20 <planetmaker> There must have been a black whole somewhere or so... :S
20:12:52 <Timmaexx> I want to thank for including founding towns! Never thought it would ever go in trunk!
20:14:08 <SmatZ> :-)
20:14:20 <SmatZ> I wonder why so many people requested that feature :)
20:14:24 <SmatZ> but there you go ;)
20:14:25 <planetmaker> But it was SmatZ who did it ;-)
20:14:30 <PeterT> SmatZ: What is magic_bulldozer_v3_and_force?
20:14:51 *** andythenorth has quit IRC
20:14:56 <planetmaker> obviously a patch name :-P
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20:15:07 <SmatZ> PeterT: enabling/disabling magic bulldozer and multiplayer-unsafe patches via dedicated console
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20:15:27 <frosch123> PeterT reading "private" stuff again?
20:15:31 <SmatZ> it saves&reloads the game, so it won't desync
20:15:37 <SmatZ> frosch123: it's not that private ;)
20:15:38 <PeterT> Oh
20:15:40 <PeterT> cool patch
20:15:52 <planetmaker> handy at times, yes
20:15:55 <PeterT> frosch123: It's on the internet, it's not private
20:16:21 <SmatZ> it used to be "private", but it's quite known :-p
20:16:53 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
20:16:55 <frosch123> ah, you switched the "private" and "public" folders, as noone looks into "public" anyway
20:17:00 <PeterT> Your dev page is awesome
20:17:04 <PeterT> @SmatZ
20:17:09 <SmatZ> hehe :)
20:17:27 <Timmaexx> @ planetmaker, that was clear
20:17:30 <SmatZ> all devs have awesome pages, some just more private than me :)
20:17:43 <PeterT> does no_airport.diff disable airports?
20:17:57 <SmatZ> I guess so, yes
20:18:20 <PeterT> You don't know for sure?
20:18:36 <SmatZ> I do
20:19:06 <frosch123> PeterT: noone can be sure about some patch, if the number of patches passes some hundrets
20:19:11 <PeterT> How did you get this picture?
20:19:19 <PeterT> that's true frosch
20:19:37 <frosch123> i guess smatz pressed ctrl+s for ingame screenshot
20:19:54 <SmatZ> yeah
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20:20:14 <PeterT> with what patch?
20:20:27 <SmatZ> with that one in that directory?
20:21:06 <frosch123> 11060 :o, it thought it was yesterday
20:21:23 <SmatZ> yeah :(
20:21:31 <Eddi|zuHause> that was ages ago
20:21:33 <planetmaker> :-) Hey, that's even before my openttd time. So aaaages ago ;-)
20:21:42 <SmatZ> hehe
20:22:41 <Eddi|zuHause> this is really hopeless... my air capacity must increase tenfold...
20:23:29 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: do you need 16/4 aircraft speed?
20:24:03 <Eddi|zuHause> no... the speed is not really that important... the landing strips and loading bays are the limiting factors
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20:30:24 <Belugas> he eagle has not yet landed
20:30:33 <Belugas> mmh...
20:30:39 <Belugas> forgot toscroll :S
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20:33:01 <Belugas> [15:17] <SmatZ> all devs have awesome pages, some just more private than me :) <-- some are not really dev oriented anymore...
20:33:22 <SmatZ> hehe :)
20:34:18 <PeterT> What's the chance of small map/minimap zoom getting into trunk?
20:34:35 <SmatZ> high
20:34:47 <PeterT> Soon?
20:35:01 <frosch123> if you finish it :p
20:35:09 <PeterT> What's not finished about it?
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20:35:42 <frosch123> i guess i forgot :p
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20:37:01 <SmatZ> someone has to understand why it looks as it looks now :) and if there is a way to simplify it
20:37:08 <SmatZ> I spent some time with it, but I am not finished
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20:40:38 <PeterT> Thanks SmatZ
20:40:56 <PeterT> Also, is diagonal level and clear destined to fail?
20:41:23 <planetmaker> pssst: you ask a lot of questions
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20:41:37 <SmatZ> :o)
20:41:48 <petern> some of you are going to die
20:41:54 <petern> martyrs of course
20:41:58 *** Grelouk has quit IRC
20:42:04 <petern> to the freedom that i will provide
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20:46:06 <Belugas> i know what you're doing !
20:46:32 <Belugas> i'm pingpong-ing with a xylophone
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21:03:21 <Eddi|zuHause> that is so funny... i am on 16th february, and one of my trams already made -1.5Mio DM ;)
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21:04:01 <Belugas> proof that OTTD is not a realistic game!
21:04:18 *** thingwath has joined #openttd
21:06:54 <SmatZ> public transport undergoing sounds quite realistic
21:13:24 <Belugas> trams?
21:13:34 <Belugas> 16th century?
21:13:38 <Belugas> yeah :)
21:13:44 <SmatZ> hehe :)
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21:44:47 <Eddi|zuHause> err... the linkgraph view on the minimap is an extreme ressource hog... does it repeatedly calculate all the values on redraw or what?
21:48:17 <planetmaker> it needs to draw all vehicles
21:50:49 <Eddi|zuHause> but it does not repeatedly need to redraw everything
21:52:05 <Eddi|zuHause> i have the feeling that the metropolitan airport is even more useless than the city airport
21:52:45 <Fast2> Is there a quick way for measuring the length from one point on the map to another (in tiles)?
21:53:08 <Fast2> Oh, I did'nt say hello: Hello :D
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22:01:06 <planetmaker> hi.
22:01:15 <planetmaker> Yes, there is. If it's a straight line
22:01:32 <planetmaker> look for "measurment tool" in the advanced options in the UI section
22:01:37 <Belugas> didn't meush got his tool in trunK?
22:01:40 <planetmaker> and set it to "enable"
22:01:42 <Belugas> yeah.. that one
22:01:52 <planetmaker> quite handy.
22:02:06 <planetmaker> Then use the cost estimation so that you don't accidentially build the road or rail
22:02:28 <planetmaker> or rather control, if nothing is built - you cannot remove unbuilt things ;-)
22:04:25 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: smatz * r18302 /trunk/src/town_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#3328](r18281): city size multiplier was ignored when generating new game
22:05:04 <Fast2> OK, I'll try it.
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22:10:08 <Coco-Banana-Man> hooray =) @r18302
22:10:20 <Forked> =)
22:11:09 <SmatZ> :)
22:12:10 <Coco-Banana-Man> thanks SmatZ :)
22:12:58 <Belugas> waht the hell am i still doing here????
22:13:03 * Belugas leaves in a hurry
22:13:06 <Belugas> BYE!
22:13:59 <PeterT> bye
22:14:00 <Fast2> Bye Belugas
22:14:17 <Coco-Banana-Man> bye Belugas
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22:15:51 <Fast2> Hmmm, I can't find the option... But I found the changelog of version r6800. Is this not an extra tool?
22:16:20 <frosch123> i would search under interface
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22:17:23 <Fast2> If this is "oberfläche" in the german version, than is it not there.
22:18:42 <frosch123> interface->display options->measurement tool
22:19:21 <Coco-Banana-Man> which option? The city size multiplier?
22:19:23 <frosch123> oberfläche->darstellung->abmessungen
22:19:37 <Fast2> "Beim Bauen Tooltip mit Abmessungen anzeigen"?
22:19:44 <Eddi|zuHause> yes
22:20:05 <Coco-Banana-Man> ah, that one..
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22:22:19 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... my game got suddenly really really slow...
22:22:45 <Fast2> I admit, I overlooked it. But it's still not an extra tool. A oppourtunity to get the length of a track, you are planning to build, would be great :)
22:23:48 <Eddi|zuHause> that is exactly what it does
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22:24:16 <Fast2> I meant with all the curves
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22:25:59 <Eddi|zuHause> that's a whole new level of difficulty...
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22:30:12 <Fast2> But you could think on and integrate a planning tool for tracks, where you could , for example, compare the costs of two different variants. (If some developers have time and feel like implementing it :) )
22:31:13 <Eddi|zuHause> honestly, i think it's rather unlikely to happen
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22:33:57 <frosch123> i would like a undo knob
22:36:14 <Fast2> In singleplayer mode, there is already like undo (save and load again :) 9
22:37:07 <Fast2> I considered it interesting, but I know it's much work.
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22:38:16 <frosch123> but autosave is so slow when playing on 2k x 2k
22:38:58 <Fast2> Yes, that's right. By the way: I'm saving by myself.
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22:39:38 <Fast2> You could try to improve the saving process ;)
22:40:05 <PeterT> @seen Born_Acorn
22:40:05 <DorpsGek> PeterT: Born_Acorn was last seen in #openttd 20 weeks, 2 days, 7 hours, 54 minutes, and 23 seconds ago: <Born_Acorn> Bbl
22:40:17 <frosch123> if would rather decrease max map size to 512x512
22:41:01 <Fast2> I'm playing on 1024^2 and it's pretty fast (but I'm still at the beginning)
22:41:09 <Fast2> Big maps are cool
22:42:49 <Fast2> It's time to leave for me. Good night.
22:43:00 <frosch123> iirc i only once tried to play a 1024^2 map: it was the first game with ottd after previously playing ttdp, and i though "cool, big maps". i guess i explored the map for about 1 minute, and then wondered who coded such a stupid thing :p
22:45:20 <Rubidium> guess the most 'big map size' fanatics 'just' want a 1048576x2 map so the can run trains over very long distances making very huge amounts of money
22:45:52 <Fast2> One time, I even had a 2048^2 :D That was slow (and I would say it's only interesting for large multiplayer games). But 1024 is good, I think.
22:46:23 <planetmaker> Fast2: it's not even interesting for MP games
22:46:25 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r18303 /trunk/src/widget.cpp: -Fix: Widget indices are valid when >= 0.
22:46:48 <planetmaker> People simply cannot play those maps online. You never use such map to their potential and 1024^2 is WAY more fun
22:46:54 <planetmaker> 2048^2 stay empty
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22:47:12 <planetmaker> our (un-written) rule is: not more than 1 million tiles
22:47:37 <Rubidium> so... no 1024x10248 then
22:47:50 <Rubidium> s/8//
22:47:54 <planetmaker> well... Computers simply don't handle it :-)
22:48:06 <Fast2> 255 people in 15 companies, saving and loading their previously played game could get that map full. :)
22:48:07 <planetmaker> oh... :-) well, the "computer" million
22:48:36 <frosch123> Fast2: likely you hit the 64k vehicle limit before it is filled
22:48:36 <Rubidium> @base 10 2 1000000
22:48:36 <DorpsGek> Rubidium: 11110100001001000000
22:48:41 <Rubidium> @base 2 10 1000000
22:48:41 <DorpsGek> Rubidium: 64
22:48:53 <frosch123> except you are one of those building 20 parallel tracks for 5 trains
22:48:54 <Rubidium> planetmaker: that's 'only' 64 :)
22:49:28 <planetmaker> hm? oh :-P
22:49:32 <Fast2> frosch123: No, I'm trying the other way round: using less tracks.
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22:50:01 <Rubidium> use ships if you don't have enough space
22:50:03 <Fast2> 5 trains on one track with a few waiting places
22:50:05 <planetmaker> Fast2: but then you don't need too big maps. It's easy to get 1500 trains going on even 512x1024
22:50:06 <frosch123> i'm always impressed by screenshots on the forums with huge junctions, lots of track, but hardly trains :p
22:50:25 <planetmaker> hehe ^
22:50:42 <Fast2> frosch123: They're just looking cool. That's the reason for building them :)
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22:51:05 <frosch123> no, without running trains they look stupid
22:51:21 <frosch123> even more stupid than with blocked trains
22:51:34 <Fast2> That's a matter of your point of view.
22:51:40 <Fast2> *lol*
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22:52:10 <Fast2> But I really have to go now
22:52:16 <Fast2> Bye!
22:56:01 <PeterT> How long is an OpenTTD year?
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22:56:29 <frosch123> @calc 365*74*0.03
22:56:29 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 810.3
22:56:31 <planetmaker> 13.x minutes
22:56:34 <frosch123> @calc 365*74*0.03/60
22:56:34 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 13.505
22:56:41 <PeterT> what is that formula?
22:57:02 <PeterT> days in a year * ??? * ???
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22:57:08 <frosch123> that is the formula of immortalness
22:58:01 <planetmaker> frosch123: you miss 42 in it. And some coffee spillt there, too
22:58:03 <frosch123> the "74" is mentioned at least once a week in this channel
22:58:10 <PeterT> @calc 13.505*11
22:58:10 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 148.555
22:58:48 <PeterT> I was trying to figure out how long until there is maglev in #openttdcoop
22:59:10 <planetmaker> 30 milliseconds a tick. A day is 74 ticks
22:59:30 <PeterT> Oh
22:59:35 <PeterT> 0.03?
22:59:38 <frosch123> @base 18 10 42
22:59:38 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 74
22:59:48 <planetmaker> :-D
22:59:49 <frosch123> planetmaker: i am just using decimal for computations
23:00:11 <frosch123> no idea why others use 18-system
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23:00:36 <planetmaker> frosch123: yes. Along those lines I'll never be 30 ;-)
23:01:08 <planetmaker> @base 10 16 25
23:01:08 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 19
23:01:18 <planetmaker> @base 10 16 23
23:01:18 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: 17
23:01:32 <frosch123> you are unsure about your age?
23:01:53 <planetmaker> (which we actually played on a friend of mine: on her 23rd birthday she got a cake with a 17 on it - with that very explanation ;-)
23:02:14 <planetmaker> (I'm older :-P )
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23:02:50 <frosch123> is she studiing cs, or only all her friends? :p
23:02:55 *** Arvid_ has joined #openttd
23:03:02 <planetmaker> neither nor ;-)
23:03:23 <planetmaker> But there are other things you can study where you also become nerdy ;-)
23:03:27 <frosch123> oh, they are all grf artists?
23:03:49 <planetmaker> (she's a physicist)
23:04:58 *** Progman has quit IRC
23:05:28 <frosch123> chemist can also play such "games" :p
23:07:03 *** asilv has quit IRC
23:08:03 <planetmaker> but there "base" gets an even more extended meaning :-P
23:08:17 <planetmaker> (and might 'solve' problems in a different manner :-P )
23:10:06 <planetmaker> Time for bed.
23:10:18 <planetmaker> Have a good night :-) Quak! ;-)
23:10:36 <frosch123> yeah, i should also leave
23:10:39 <frosch123> night
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23:13:41 <PeterT> @calc 2000/4.5
23:13:41 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 444.444444444
23:13:54 <PeterT> 444.4444/365
23:14:03 <PeterT> @calc 444.4444/365
23:14:03 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 1.21765589041
23:14:19 <PeterT> @calc 4.5*365
23:14:19 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 1642.5
23:14:32 <PeterT> @calc 4.5*730
23:14:32 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 3285
23:15:11 <welshdragon> PeterT, what are you calculating for?
23:15:22 <PeterT> Posts per day
23:15:33 <welshdragon> aah
23:15:42 <PeterT> How many posts per year is what I'm figuring out
23:15:54 <PeterT> The first two equations were messy
23:20:22 <PeterT> @calc 13.5*9
23:20:22 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 121.5
23:20:28 <PeterT> @calc 13.5*9/60
23:20:28 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 2.025
23:20:53 <PeterT> @calc 13.505*9
23:20:53 <DorpsGek> PeterT: 121.545
23:34:05 <Terkhen> good night
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23:59:54 <PeterT> Can anybody on windows shed some light on this?