IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2009-10-25
⏴ go to previous day
00:02:48 *** KenjiE20|LT has joined #openttd
00:13:02 *** Gorillagram has joined #openttd
00:13:21 <Gorillagram> I finished... wait... shit... D:
00:16:25 <Eddi|zuHause> you should try this new invention
00:16:31 <Eddi|zuHause> speaking in whole sentences
00:17:05 <Gorillagram> I finished drawing a set of sprites last night
00:17:25 <Gorillagram> but it looks like I was actually saving it on the desktop where I'd saved a copy to show someone, instead of in the correct working file
00:17:32 <Gorillagram> and I've since deleted the file off the desktop
00:17:52 <FauxFaux> This is why you should never delete things.
00:24:29 <Gorillagram> looks like it's lost, oh well. redrawing tiems
00:26:52 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17863 /trunk/src/build_vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: make the build vehicle window nested
00:28:33 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd
00:28:51 *** Gorillagram is now known as Pikka
00:29:49 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd
00:31:02 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd
00:31:56 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd
00:32:23 <Eddi|zuHause> if you did it once, you can do it again ;)
00:33:55 <Pikka> it's more tedious than anything else
00:34:23 <Pikka> damn steam engines and their funny shapes... damn chris sawyer and his round squares...
00:34:36 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: really? Try properly dieing and then doing it again!
00:35:28 <Eddi|zuHause> i immediately thought of walter when i said that :p
00:45:21 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that walter
00:45:30 <Eddi|zuHause> he talks about suicide bombers ;)
00:52:08 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
00:59:08 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
01:21:24 *** Chillosophy has joined #openttd
01:22:27 *** Gorillagram has joined #openttd
01:50:40 *** Gorillagram is now known as Pikka
02:14:15 *** Gorillagram has joined #openttd
02:20:34 *** Gorillagram is now known as Pikka
02:24:02 *** kieran491 has joined #openttd
03:33:25 *** Singaporekid has joined #openttd
04:27:06 *** nicfer1 has joined #openttd
06:44:43 *** eQualizer has joined #openttd
07:08:03 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
07:26:01 *** |Jeroen| has joined #openttd
07:48:03 *** Alberth has joined #openttd
07:58:01 *** Rhamphoryncus has joined #openttd
08:08:14 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
08:18:06 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd
08:22:58 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
08:24:45 *** andythenorth__ has joined #openttd
08:35:38 <andythenorth__> our phone line is in the sky, old, rusty
08:43:30 *** Progman has joined #openttd
08:59:09 *** [com]buster has joined #openttd
09:17:01 <andythenorth__> soon be time for a UK game again then...
09:17:13 <andythenorth__> NARS good, but I've played it *a lot* :D
09:17:25 <andythenorth__> still my favourite
09:17:36 <andythenorth__> shame OzTrans is sulking about Canset though
09:17:50 <Pikka> well, when this is done, and NARS is updated a little, you'll be able to play them /together/, moderately sensibly. :P
09:18:01 <andythenorth__> Next stop: Australian trainset?
09:18:04 <Pikka> but yeah, I'm just about finished all the steam locos, and all the steam-era rolling stock.
09:19:07 <andythenorth__> australia has a lot of things that look like f units?
09:19:21 <Pikka> down south they did, yes
09:19:28 <Pikka> up here, not so much, 'cause we're narrow gauge
09:20:00 <andythenorth__> when I've done what I'm doing (if that's ever finished), I want to do North American Road Vehicle Set
09:20:15 <andythenorth__> then when *that's* done...Australia / Commonwealth road vehicle set
09:20:26 <andythenorth__> because it's similar trucks, just more trailers :D
09:20:37 <Pikka> you should talk to Dan, he drew a load of north american trucks which I never quite got around to coding :]
09:21:16 <andythenorth__> I know :) I've been making sure HEQS scales ok against them
09:21:28 <andythenorth__> kind of tricky, cos it also has to scale against eGRVTS
09:21:42 <Pikka> eGRVTS is a little overscale, I think
09:22:01 <andythenorth__> HEQS is a little underscale
09:22:34 <Pikka> we have 3'6" track and a loading gauge similar to the UK
09:22:59 <Pikka> (and all our signalling and practice is very UK too, whereas it's more american down south)
09:23:26 <andythenorth__> 2100 looks like UK 66 without skin?
09:23:57 <Pikka> but we also had EE locos which looked similar
09:24:43 <andythenorth__> FIRS deliberately includes some 'Oz-friendly' industries.
09:24:47 <Pikka> QR had a long-time policy of sourcing alternate loco classes from EMD and EE, just in case one or the other went broke and couldn't supply spares any more; it'd only take out half the fleet. :P
09:25:20 <Pikka> speed freaks are gonna hate a QR set though
09:25:28 <Pikka> maximum speed of trains in 1900: 50mph
09:25:31 <Pikka> maximum speed of trains in 2000: 50mph
09:25:53 <andythenorth__> Oz Trucks: max speed 50mph?
09:26:38 <Pikka> road would be faster than rail... could be interesting
09:27:00 <andythenorth__> project for 2012
09:27:06 <andythenorth__> if I'm not utterly bored by TTD by then
09:28:41 *** |Jeroen| has joined #openttd
09:35:31 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
09:37:16 <Pikka> there's so many projects which sound like a good idea, but one can't quite summon the willpower for :P
09:39:13 *** Terkhen has joined #openttd
09:39:31 *** Cybertinus has joined #openttd
09:39:36 <andythenorth__> Pikka: any favourite examples?
09:40:18 <frosch123> ripping all the crap from kde-4
09:40:57 <andythenorth__> writing a compiler for nfo for any sane language of choice (preferably Python)?
09:41:11 <andythenorth__> speaking of which, frosch123 I think I now grok registers
09:42:47 <andythenorth__> I think I'm always going to have questions about bit shifts, AND masks etc, but I think I can now use most action 2 / cb / advanced action 2
09:43:11 <andythenorth__> I don't really understand the purpose of operator 7E, but I don't seem to need it...problem for another day
09:44:23 <frosch123> you can use 7e for parentheses inside computations
09:44:54 <frosch123> or for sharing subterms accross multiple computations/decisions
09:45:55 <andythenorth__> ok I think I get it
09:46:28 <andythenorth__> so val 2 in an advanced calculation could be the result of a varaction 2 chain
09:51:30 *** Luukland has joined #openttd
10:02:30 *** teuntjuhh has joined #openttd
10:03:27 <andythenorth__> I guess there's no value in a crash log from a patched nightly running development nfo code?
10:09:33 *** Belugas has joined #openttd
10:09:33 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Belugas
10:14:20 *** thingwath has joined #openttd
10:14:48 <frosch123> did f12 cause some crash?
10:22:40 <andythenorth__> frosch123: no, it was a different patched version (I am using f12 patch, but not when it crashed - savegame compatibility reason)
10:37:52 *** LadyHawk has joined #openttd
10:45:25 <andythenorth__> Pikka: ooh...sugar mill :)
10:45:45 <andythenorth__> looks nice. I've got to draw one for FIRS sometime
10:46:25 <andythenorth__> and a dragline for coal
10:46:56 <andythenorth__> Guess there are licensing issues with the Pineapple ones [:)
10:51:03 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttd
10:55:54 *** lobstar has joined #openttd
11:05:53 <Pikka> sorry... andy, if you want to use my dragline, feel free, it's pretty crap though :P
11:06:16 <Pikka> most of the other industries are based on TTD graphics, so you probably wouldn't want to use them.
11:15:20 <andythenorth__> Pikka: so the Pineapple sugar mill produces directly? No cane cargo?
11:20:34 *** kannerke has joined #openttd
11:22:47 <Pikka> the cane is gathered from the fields by the 2ft tramways, and brought to the mill for processing. there's no industry one could really use as a source for the cane.
11:23:32 <Pikka> and the 2ft tramways aren't used to transport anything else, they really are single-use industrial railways, so having them player buildable wouldn't be useful/realistic
11:24:54 <Pikka> do the 3d fields work in OTTD, btw? I don't remember ever trying it.
11:28:10 <andythenorth__> I've tried touching the screen where the fields are, but I can't feel any bumps...
11:28:26 <Pikka> the sugar fields have height, and should hide the tile behind them
11:28:44 <andythenorth__> they do in OpenTTD as well
11:29:23 <andythenorth__> you know OzTrans is planning QR / NSW (?) cane trains for CanSet?
11:30:12 <andythenorth__> I'll buy them for a dollar
11:31:01 <Pikka> is he going to draw the track for them?
11:31:12 <andythenorth__> canset has NG already, think he's just using that
11:31:25 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17864 /trunk/src/osk_gui.cpp: -Codechange: make the OSK nested
11:33:34 <Rubidium> ~5 km/h / ~3 mph / walking speed
11:33:50 <Rubidium> though faster than when I would need to pull it
11:34:02 <Pikka> 'cause that's about as fast as they go :)
11:35:56 <frosch123> [12:29] <andythenorth__> they do in OpenTTD as well <- fields do not have BB in ottd. they will not hide houses or stuff on foundations. also railway fences will be in front of them
11:36:38 <Rubidium> oh, later on it's going more like 10-15 km/h
11:38:09 <andythenorth__> 1km long train at ~3mph? And they have grade crossings right?
11:38:20 <andythenorth__> I guess people in QL try and beat the train?
11:38:51 <Pikka> rarely, down here at least. up north, possibly.
11:39:45 *** Grelouk has joined #openttd
11:40:39 <Pikka> QR trains on branchlines up north usually crawl up to crossings anyway because the crossings have no bells or gates, and the branchlines see only one or two trains a year :)
11:41:02 <Pikka> yeah, he's going some :o
11:41:34 <Pikka> I like the rail/rail level crossings.. interesting :)
11:44:56 *** Chris_Booth has joined #openttd
11:46:26 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
11:50:04 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
11:50:27 <andythenorth__> I like sets with NG
11:53:48 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
11:55:44 <Pikka> I think dan was thinking about it :)
11:55:59 *** kieran491 has left #openttd
11:57:56 <andythenorth__> there are engines in canset already...not much drawing required
11:59:20 <Pikka> right, if I want to get this alpha out tonight I'd better get on with it!
12:00:16 <Pikka> gonna be busy with uni work all day tomorrow...
12:05:55 *** Gorillagram has joined #openttd
12:07:18 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
12:09:01 *** Polygon has joined #openttd
12:13:47 *** Gorillagram is now known as Pikka
12:14:28 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
12:30:09 <andythenorth__> frosch123 / Rubidium: how expensive are things like branching varaction 2s, for example, when used by the regular production cb?
12:31:18 <frosch123> andythenorth__: don't care about single branching, care about the total number of callbacks called
12:32:58 <andythenorth__> ethics: code with significant redundancy and more complicated logic (hard to work with)
12:33:11 <andythenorth__> versus code that's really easy to share between industry...(usually easier to maintain and debug)
12:39:15 <andythenorth__> frosch123: is there a handy 80+ var that I could use to figure out how many output cargos there are
12:39:27 <andythenorth__> or I could just hard code it
12:40:15 <andythenorth__> nvm, I've just realised I can do it with a constant
12:41:21 <frosch123> sure you could use var 88 and 89, but you could also organise the varact2 chains, so you know what is present
12:48:04 *** [alt]buster has joined #openttd
12:51:54 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
12:59:53 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
13:00:11 *** Luukland has joined #openttd
13:00:24 <Luukland> I need more servers :P
13:02:34 <Luukland> Can someone make me an ottd server offer?
13:06:08 <Alberth> Didn't TrueBrain give you one yesterday ?
13:06:58 <Luukland> he didn't, because he is a merchant
13:07:06 <Luukland> and not a server engineer
13:07:32 <andythenorth__> frosch123: any cost to using persistent storage instead of registers? (I have more than enough persistent spare for my needs, it's useful for debug)
13:08:33 <frosch123> there should be no difference
13:12:53 * Alberth wonders why TB is sys-admin at openttd.org then :p
13:13:28 <TrueBrain> I wonder about that too ..
13:13:36 <TrueBrain> or rather: I am as suprised as you are Alberth :)
13:13:46 * Luukland grabs a stone and trows it into Ex\'s Servers
13:14:01 <Rubidium> can I join you with throwing rocks?
13:14:37 <Luukland> If you try to miss my servers
13:15:07 <frosch123> Luukland: he is 4 years older than you
13:19:54 *** Cybert1nus has joined #openttd
13:28:02 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd
13:34:08 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r17865 /trunk/src/ (group_gui.cpp vehicle_gui.cpp vehicle_gui_base.h): -Codechange: Remove references to specific widgets and step-heights from BaseVehicleListWindow::DrawVehicleListItems().
13:38:39 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai
13:53:10 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17866 /trunk/src/graph_gui.cpp: -Codechange: make the remaining graph windows nested
14:14:45 *** andythenorth__ has quit IRC
14:20:36 *** Doorslammer has joined #openttd
14:29:21 *** Rubix`` has joined #openttd
14:30:28 <yorick> hmm...clients with STATUS_AUTH aren't autokicked
14:31:05 *** sdafsdf has joined #openttd
14:31:09 *** Rubix`` has joined #openttd
14:31:15 *** sdafsdf is now known as LadyHawk
14:31:18 <yorick> which allows to DoS a server just by having open connections
14:37:50 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
14:38:36 *** worldemar has joined #openttd
14:44:58 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
14:52:58 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r17867 /trunk/src/ (vehicle_gui.cpp vehicle_gui_base.h): -Codechange: Prepare BaseVehicleListWindow for nested widgets.
14:54:22 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
14:57:21 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
15:04:32 *** Chillosophy has joined #openttd
15:08:28 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r17868 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Vehicle list window uses nested widgets only.
15:27:50 *** combuster has joined #openttd
15:28:24 *** worldemar has joined #openttd
15:32:49 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
15:35:56 *** worldemar has joined #openttd
15:46:39 <andythenorth> Repeat games might be more fun if the cargo payment rates were randomised at the start of the game...
15:46:43 <andythenorth> ..or even during it!
15:46:58 <andythenorth> ...once again, I have to start with coal...boring boring boring
15:51:10 <Alberth> that saves a few clicks only, ie you don't have to look at the cargo payment rates first.
15:52:04 <Alberth> somewhere in the graphs you can find how much money you get for each cargo
15:52:25 <andythenorth> I know but what does that have to do with randomising them? :P
15:53:13 <andythenorth> also eGRVTS should include flocks of sheep, and herds of cattle, for the purposes of transport livestock...
15:53:16 <Alberth> the game can randomize what it likes, but one look at the graph tells me what to start transporting, so you don't gain a lot of game play imho
15:53:52 <andythenorth> but what you transport changes the whole game?
15:53:56 <Eddi|zuHause> wait, you don't put 3 sheep on one horse for transporting them???
15:54:17 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I do today, but it would be better not to....we should tell Zephyris :D
15:54:20 <Alberth> that's around 1900 Eddi|zuHause
15:54:43 <andythenorth> I have just started a 1900 game...spooky
15:55:10 <Alberth> did coal mines exist back then?
15:55:44 <Alberth> people just chopped down the nearest tree, didn't they?
15:56:37 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: coal became important during the beginning of industrialisation, so around 1800
15:57:51 <Alberth> oh, I am off a century. Ah well.
16:03:15 <yorick> client slots: 256/8579
16:03:50 <yorick> companies: 743/2084... hmm, more companies than clients
16:09:22 *** Biolunar_ has joined #openttd
16:18:35 *** worldemar has joined #openttd
16:31:44 *** Biolunar_ is now known as Biolunar
16:37:22 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
16:57:36 <andythenorth> hmm...I've ctrl-joined truck and rail stations, and they aren't accepting cargo. Never seen that before. r17590 (patched)
16:58:02 *** worldemar has joined #openttd
17:00:23 <andythenorth> level crossings fail to stop vehicles if no signals built on the rail line
17:01:57 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: smatz * r17869 /trunk/src/window.cpp: -Codechange: don't create OnScroll() event for zero delta
17:04:02 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: trains only reserve paths if they encounter a path signal, if only block signals or no signals are present, they don't reserve a path, so level crossings only close on imminent approach of the train
17:04:32 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I found that out the hard way :)
17:13:18 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, why do all holidays fall on a saturday this year... the 3rd october was a saturday, the 31st october is a saturday...
17:14:24 * SmatZ had holidays on 28th September and 28th October
17:15:01 *** KritiK_ has joined #openttd
17:15:13 <Eddi|zuHause> should i feel honoured that you celebrate my birthday that much? :p
17:19:31 <SmatZ> dihedral / planetmaker / OSX users - when OTTD starts, there is a splash image, right?
17:20:11 *** KritiK_ is now known as KritiK
17:20:52 <SmatZ> it is not "fullscreen", right?
17:21:29 <SmatZ> does one of these diffs change the behaviour?
17:22:46 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r17870 /trunk/src/ (aircraft_gui.cpp roadveh_gui.cpp ship_gui.cpp): -Codechange: Use fontsize when drawing roadveh, ship, and aircraft details.
17:27:54 <SmatZ> andythenorth: could you test that please?
17:28:10 <SmatZ> if you have trunk sources somewhere around :)
17:28:12 <planetmaker> [18:19] <SmatZ> dihedral / planetmaker / OSX users - when OTTD starts, there is a splash image, right?
17:28:27 <planetmaker> ^ yes ,there is. It's the OpenTTD thing on black background
17:29:07 <planetmaker> but the black covers the whole screen
17:29:16 <SmatZ> planetmaker: is black background nice? shouldn't it be rather white or transparent?
17:29:33 <planetmaker> I don't mind either actually. It's too short to bother me in any way.
17:29:50 <frosch123> SmatZ: how would you do transparent?
17:29:55 <planetmaker> like 1/4th of a second or so
17:30:05 <SmatZ> frosch123: I don't know
17:30:51 <frosch123> planetmaker: is it shown before ottd scans for grfs and such?
17:31:06 <planetmaker> frosch123: it's shown before I see anything else
17:31:22 <planetmaker> whether it scans for newgrfs before... dunno
17:31:40 <frosch123> oh, so you do not have enough grfs installed
17:31:41 <Eddi|zuHause> scanning for newgrfs is probably the largest task ;)
17:31:59 <planetmaker> frosch123: how many would I need?
17:32:16 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: the coop pack not enough?
17:32:25 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: I surely have more
17:32:29 <planetmaker> bananas has many :-)
17:32:34 <planetmaker> and a dozen further or so
17:32:52 <Eddi|zuHause> ./openttd -d misc=2 will tell you
17:33:02 <frosch123> planetmaker: actually the whole time from starting ottd until the main screen appears is used for scanning grfs
17:33:32 <planetmaker> ok, I guess it scans before
17:33:53 <frosch123> ottd 0.5.3 starts in about 0.1 s, while trunk needs some seconds on my pc, when they are not already in some cache :p
17:34:14 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, it spends ages in "dbg: [misc] Loading blitter..."
17:35:37 <frosch123> ah, i see, first scanning for tars, then the blitter line, and then scanning for grfs
17:36:23 <Eddi|zuHause> it "scans for tars" a dozen times...
17:36:26 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause, planetmaker: -d misc=1 -d grf=1
17:36:36 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: smatz * r17871 /trunk/src/os/macosx/splash.cpp: -Fix (r11342): memset() accepts only 1-byte argument
17:37:21 <Eddi|zuHause> ah, it loads the grfs, that's what's taking ages
17:37:45 <frosch123> yeah, it parses every grf to find the name, grfid and md5sum
17:37:59 <planetmaker> Ok, I got 197 tars ans 326 grfs
17:38:01 <frosch123> i.e. it has to read them all
17:38:03 <Eddi|zuHause> hm. NewShips is GRVv2 :p
17:38:19 <planetmaker> and it's all done before I see anything
17:38:29 <frosch123> so the splash is quite useless :p
17:38:54 <Eddi|zuHause> it should be started earlier
17:39:01 <planetmaker> oh, it should persist till scanning is done...? Hm... :-)
17:40:22 <Eddi|zuHause> dbg: [grf] [ecs_machinery_vector.b5__25_sep_2009_/ecsmachw.grf:71] Unsupported in-game variable 0x93
17:40:24 <planetmaker> SmatZ: both patches don't compile: /Users/ingo/ottd/trunk/src/os/macosx/splash.cpp:158: error: ‘x’ was not declared in this scope
17:41:35 <Eddi|zuHause> is that something to ignore/worry about/report/other ?
17:42:36 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: "zutreffendes bitte unterstreichen" :p
17:43:35 <planetmaker> hm... should be easy to amend, though
17:46:47 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, would it be useful to have a "human readable" display of the GRF-ID? i.e. "6D620601 (mb 6 1)" or something?
17:47:08 <planetmaker> SmatZ: it was just a missing uint x in the for loop
17:47:20 <SmatZ> planetmaker: yeah, this adds some coding style as well :)
17:47:28 <planetmaker> but... what should have changed? I didn't perceive any change...
17:47:39 *** lobstar is now known as lobster
17:47:47 <SmatZ> planetmaker: nothing should change
17:48:16 <SmatZ> planetmaker: with splash3.diff, is the screen black or white?
17:50:18 <planetmaker> actually... it first turns white, then black, then the title menu
17:50:43 <planetmaker> nicely visible if there's a concurrent compile job slowing down everything ;-)
17:51:13 <SmatZ> planetmaker: but there isn't any difference between splash3.diff and splash3b.diff, right?
17:51:48 <planetmaker> SmatZ: there isn't. yes
17:52:03 <andythenorth> time for something else...
17:52:08 *** andythenorth has left #openttd
17:52:28 <SmatZ> planetmaker: thank you :-)
17:52:41 <planetmaker> as always, welcome :-)
17:53:53 <planetmaker> if not: yes, it compiles with the same result as before - and as should be expected, you coding-style nazi ;-)
17:55:08 <planetmaker> btw: that was the concurrent compile job :-P
17:55:25 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: smatz * r17872 /trunk/src/os/macosx/splash.cpp:
17:55:25 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: -Codechange: apply coding style to splash.cpp
17:55:25 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: -Fix (r17871): missing variable declaration
18:48:04 *** yorick_ has joined #openttd
18:48:22 *** yorick is now known as Guest408
18:48:22 *** yorick_ is now known as yorick
19:04:50 *** Progman has joined #openttd
19:08:31 *** Rhamphoryncus has joined #openttd
19:14:13 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd
19:17:44 *** nicfer1 has joined #openttd
19:24:23 *** Dred_furst has joined #openttd
19:40:38 *** TrainzStoffe has joined #openttd
19:42:18 *** George3 has joined #openttd
19:42:59 <dihedral> SmatZ, yep there is a "splash screen"
19:43:22 <dihedral> however, not like a splash screen jedit has for example
19:43:56 <SmatZ> I thought there is desktop visible when splash screen is shown
19:44:22 <SmatZ> (it has the same size as OTTD window)
19:44:32 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
19:45:20 <dihedral> and for me it takes a while till it gets there
19:46:21 <SmatZ> so I thought Alpha has to be == 0 so desktop is visible under the rest of window (outside the splash image)
19:46:30 <SmatZ> but alpha has no effect
19:47:33 *** TrainzStoffe is now known as Stoffe
19:49:28 <dihedral> i get a load of dbg: [misc] Scanning for tars
19:50:10 <dihedral> loads all content downloaded from bananas
19:50:35 <SmatZ> someone(tm) could change that
19:50:42 <SmatZ> so splash screen is shown during tar scan
19:50:59 <frosch123> but then it should be done for all os :)
19:51:00 <SmatZ> unless it has to be done in that order
19:51:19 <SmatZ> frosch123: how do you mean?
19:51:43 <frosch123> hmm, never mind, i just noticed that you cannot print any text until the basegrfs are loaded
19:52:35 <dihedral> dbg: [misc] Scanning for tars
19:52:43 <dihedral> that is the first action after finding personal dir
19:52:48 <frosch123> dihedral: use -d misc=1 -d grf=1
19:53:11 <frosch123> so it takes most time to print stuff to console?
19:58:17 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
20:10:43 <dihedral> frosch123, it's more detailed at least ;-)
20:14:43 *** PeterT_ has joined #openttd
20:19:50 *** JFBelugas has joined #openttd
20:32:27 *** Nite_Owl has joined #openttd
20:49:42 *** Chruker has joined #openttd
21:01:09 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttd
21:17:01 *** PineappleBoy has joined #openttd
21:17:43 <PineappleBoy> what files do I need to open OpenTTD?
21:17:59 <Rubidium> the ones mentioned in the readme?
21:18:17 <PineappleBoy> where in the readme
21:18:26 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r17873 /trunk/src/settings_gui.cpp: -Codechange: make the advanced settings window nested
21:18:43 <Alberth> as stated in the toc iirc
21:20:28 * frosch123 is very disappointed that noone on the forums complained about the nightly being late
21:21:25 <Eddi|zuHause> who cares about nightlies anymore?
21:22:10 <Rubidium> at least 1 person who started to mention that there were no MSVC builds after two nightlies
21:22:39 <glx> they are build at the same time
21:22:59 <Alberth> yes, but we shifted an hour :)
21:25:55 *** Terkhen has joined #openttd
21:26:56 <PineappleBoy> where do I find the .grf files
21:27:12 <Rubidium> glx: but... Belugas will be here an hour earlier
21:27:55 <glx> PineappleBoy: TTD files ?
21:28:00 <frosch123> [22:23] <glx> 20:00 CET <- is that the same time as 2000 CEST?
21:28:23 <PineappleBoy> from the readme.txt
21:28:32 <Nite_Owl> U.S. does not time shift foe another week
21:28:43 <glx> frosch123: no, but 20:00 is still 20:00 :)
21:29:29 <glx> compile farm starts at 20:00 CE(S)T indeed
21:29:30 <Rubidium> Nite_Owl: for the parts of the U.S. that do shift
21:30:02 <glx> PineappleBoy: ask google for the files, we won't give links to them
21:30:08 <frosch123> they shift on haloween?
21:30:09 <Nite_Owl> I think only Arizona and parts of Indiana do not time shift
21:30:46 <Rubidium> that's going to be a long night :)
21:30:49 <Eddi|zuHause> PineappleBoy: we can give you the hint to look for opengfx, though
21:31:27 <Nite_Owl> technically it would be on November 1st
21:31:54 <Eddi|zuHause> exception from the exception are the native territories within arizona :p
21:32:13 <Alberth> lots of opportunities for time traveling
21:32:50 * Rubidium always wonders how to do building jobs that work acros time zones
21:33:07 <Rubidium> suppliers coming too late/early etc
21:33:19 <Sacro> any train drivers in here?
21:33:27 <DorpsGek> Sacro: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 6 weeks, 5 days, 1 hour, 33 minutes, and 22 seconds ago: <Bjarni> Belugas: there is no reason to write to PeterT. We already know he is unable to read anyway :P
21:33:28 <Eddi|zuHause> since when do contractors ever arrive on time?
21:33:36 * Sacro needs to find some train drivers
21:34:02 <Eddi|zuHause> Sacro: i have a handful of trains, but they're not good for driving, really
21:34:24 <Rubidium> Sacro: maybe you can find some train drivers at say... a train station?
21:34:50 <Sacro> Rubidium: yes, but not one's that i can get to stop and answer some questions
21:35:07 <Eddi|zuHause> reminds me of that april 1st article, about how train drivers oppose to the time shift, because they have to work an extra unpaid hour
21:35:24 <Sacro> my stepmum had to work an extra hour last night
21:37:44 <glx> but it's compensated 6 month later
21:38:31 <Eddi|zuHause> unless you don't work the nightshift in 6 months, or you have one less hour to do the same work in that nightshift == more stress
21:38:51 <Nite_Owl> That always happened to me when I worked a midnight shift. I put in for the overtime when they went back and kept my mouth shut when they went ahead.
21:42:16 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: alberth * r17874 /trunk/src/vehicle_gui.cpp: -Codechange: vehicle details window uses pure nested widgets.
21:42:47 <CaptObvious> you know what would rock in OpenTTD? an auto-levelling trackbuilding tool.
21:42:58 <CaptObvious> so it carves out valleys to keep your track level
21:44:12 <Alberth> many users prefer to follow the terrain
21:44:54 <Alberth> for you it may be easier to play at a level map to start with
21:44:59 <CaptObvious> that's why it would be a separate tool
21:45:14 <CaptObvious> I don't mind terraforming, I'd just prefer it to be a little easier
21:45:21 <PineappleBoy> what is the 'installer'
21:45:34 <PineappleBoy> "If you are not using the installer to install OpenTTD, (or are just curious) you need to copy certain files by hand. "
21:46:06 <Rubidium> for mac there's no installer
21:46:15 <PineappleBoy> so I need to .grf files?
21:46:45 <CaptObvious> I'm tempted to write a small app that pulls the latest .zip from the openttd site and the .grf files too and just does it for you
21:46:46 <Rubidium> yes, with installer too... only with the installer the installer can copy the files for you and without the installer you have to copy them yourself
21:46:46 * Alberth suggests to read the readme
21:46:48 <glx> on windows they are needed too, but the installer can copy them from the TTD CD
21:47:01 <PineappleBoy> does it come with the .zip
21:47:43 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: smatz * r17875 /trunk/src/music/ (allegro_m.h extmidi.h): -Change [FS#3272]: prefer extmidi over allegro midi and allegro over null driver
21:47:57 <Rubidium> no, those file are, as explained in the readme, not our files but from a third party (that hasn't given us permission to (re)distribute those needed files)
21:48:06 * frosch123 wonders what reemerge made X move from alt-f7 to alt-f8 :s
21:48:45 <SmatZ> frosch123: didn't happen to me :(
21:48:48 <CaptObvious> Rubidium - I take it attempts have been made to contact the owners of the copyright on them
21:48:59 <SmatZ> just upgrade of xorg disabled Alt+Backspace by default...
21:49:24 <Rubidium> CaptObvious: dozens, yet no-one knows exactly who is the copyright owner
21:49:45 <CaptObvious> does the company that made TTD no longer exist?
21:50:23 <glx> it's part of infogrames now (if I followed correctly)
21:50:41 <glx> infogrames bought atari ;)
21:50:56 <Rubidium> oh, it's become even messier
21:50:56 <Eddi|zuHause> basically, there are two candidates, candidate A says "we don't own it" and candidate B says "we can't be bothered to find out whether we own it"
21:51:08 <PineappleBoy> so do I need to find it on my own
21:51:21 <Eddi|zuHause> PineappleBoy: like i said, search for opengfx
21:51:25 <Rubidium> yes, or look at the (unfinished) OpenGFX
21:51:34 <glx> TTD files are easy to find too
21:51:43 <CaptObvious> am I allowed to link them in here?
21:52:08 <CaptObvious> even though they're on orudge's site?
21:52:26 <glx> orudge's site is not related to openttd
21:53:14 <Eddi|zuHause> just because $they are doing illegal things, doesn't mean we should support that
21:53:51 <PineappleBoy> do I download the Latest Release?
21:54:05 <Rubidium> I know installing OpenTTD is a bitch because you've got to search for some stuff yourself, but there's hardly anything 'we' (the OpenTTD developers that can't draw/make proper sound effects) can solve
21:54:59 <Nite_Owl> A forum search you should do. DONOTREADME you should also read.
21:55:26 <Rubidium> Yoda you should impersonate
21:55:47 *** Dred_furst has joined #openttd
21:56:49 <Nite_Owl> It does come in handy at times
21:58:35 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: yexo was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 0 days, 0 hours, 8 minutes, and 5 seconds ago: <Yexo> yes, thanks
21:58:59 <Eddi|zuHause> you missed it by 8 minutes and 5 seconds :(
21:59:44 <planetmaker> [22:46] <CaptObvious> I'm tempted to write a small app that pulls the latest .zip from the openttd site and the .grf files too and just does it for you <-- you should look for autostart, autottd, and autoupdate
22:00:20 <CaptObvious> planetmaker - it already exists? sweet.
22:02:02 *** MizardX has joined #openttd
22:12:06 <Nite_Owl> feeding time - later all
22:34:36 <Eddi|zuHause> hey, i think i have found a way how i can build my station with one less balancer track!
22:37:22 <Eddi|zuHause> with the side effect of making two platforms slightly longer, without making the station itself (much) longer
22:38:55 <Eddi|zuHause> the station itself gets like 1cm longer, but the two platforms get like 8cm longer
22:48:25 <_ln> how many meters of railway do you have?
22:54:08 *** roboboy has joined #openttd
22:56:31 <ptr_> min_active_clients doesn't seem to be working
22:58:48 <SmatZ> server is probably paused
22:59:04 <SmatZ> what version are you using?
22:59:42 <ptr_> but I'm not running the server as dedicated
22:59:49 <SmatZ> trunk is better wrt autopausing
22:59:57 <SmatZ> I think those changes weren't backported to 0.7
23:01:20 <ptr_> it won't find the variable if I type "min_active_clients" in the console
23:01:33 <ptr_> but it will find "min_players", which is an alias for min_active_clients
23:03:27 <SmatZ> "set min_active_clients"
23:05:10 <ptr_> Current value for 'min_active_clients' is: '1'
23:05:31 <ptr_> it's still running when i disconnect
23:05:47 <ptr_> I've also tried changing the value to 2
23:07:35 <Eddi|zuHause> _ln: i'd guess about 20m, or so, probably more
23:08:12 <Eddi|zuHause> _ln: it's about 2,90m x 2,20m, and about 3 times round, so more like 30m, and i didn't use all tracks
23:08:21 <ptr_> I don't have to restart the server or something?
23:08:43 <SmatZ> ptr_: try opening a bugreport :) but I am not sure this will be fixed, maybe there won't be 0.7.4 anyway...
23:09:04 <SmatZ> I don't really remember how it was supposed to work in 0.7
23:09:17 <Eddi|zuHause> _ln: the problematic parts are the "special" tracks, the limited amount of switches, and the limited amount of special-length balancer tracks
23:11:10 <Eddi|zuHause> _ln: maybe you can count the tracks over here: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Bildschirmphoto17.png
23:11:55 <Eddi|zuHause> the tracks are to scale, one standard straight is 177mm, one curve is 22.5° with a diameter of 880mm
23:12:14 <Eddi|zuHause> shorter tracks are 1/3 or 2/3 of a standard track
23:12:46 <Eddi|zuHause> so 118mm, 59mm or 15°, the narrower curve diameter is 760mm
23:12:54 <Eddi|zuHause> calculate the rest by yourself ;)
23:14:13 <Eddi|zuHause> a switch consists of one 1/1 straight, and a 2/3 (=15°) curve and 1/3 straight
23:15:06 <Eddi|zuHause> the crossings equal two 4/3 straight
23:15:14 <glx> IIRC this setting id for dedicated servers only
23:16:58 <Eddi|zuHause> _ln: the program is supposed to be able to count the tracks by itself, but since it's the demo, i don't have the real track library, so i had to simulate the pieces from flex tracks, so the statistics can't distinguish them
23:18:35 <ptr_> maybe I should try the dedicated server then.
23:27:06 <ptr_> yeah, it seems to be working when I'm using the dedicated server..
23:31:53 <glx> maybe we should disable this setting totally for non dedicated servers
23:33:24 <ptr_> or maybe it should just work :)
23:34:47 *** Eddi|zuHause2 has joined #openttd
23:43:49 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause
23:43:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i know what i forgot
23:44:06 <Eddi|zuHause> changing the time of the forced disconnect
23:44:33 <Eddi|zuHause> whatever... i'm just going to have another one an hour from now
continue to next day ⏵
