IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2008-04-02
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00:00:05 <Roujin> something broke in a file not altered by the patch oO
00:01:01 <SmatZ> you will need more includes probably
00:03:06 <Roujin> that could be... but the error somewhat disturbs me: multiple types in one declaration oO
00:03:43 <Roujin> maybe that particular revision was broken... retrying with another one ^^
00:04:29 <Roujin> aha, now i need some more includes
00:05:32 <Roujin> since a header file was split in between :)
00:08:02 <Roujin> current trunk, wohoo ^^
00:08:25 <Roujin> so... anyone interested in a rct style game menu?
00:08:46 <Yexo_> Roujin, you mean a screen following one vehicle?
00:09:10 <Roujin> nope, jumping to preset locations
00:09:19 <Roujin> where preset = signs, alphabetically
00:09:27 <glx> like ctrl-center_view_on_vehicle Yexo?
00:09:29 <Roujin> also, signs are not drawn while in the game menu
00:09:59 <Yexo> glx, I didn't know that was already possible :P
00:10:09 <Yexo> but that was indeed what I ment
00:11:10 <Roujin> so basically, you set up a nice intro game, place signs labled 'a' through 'x' in the locations you want to show, save, rename to opntitle.dat and place it in the /data dir, thats it
00:11:44 <Yexo> sounds cool, but well, I don't care much about the title screen, as I don't look at it for long
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00:11:51 <Roujin> oh yes, and there's a patch option for the duration between jumps (in game days; 0 = turn off)
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00:12:56 <Roujin> to be fair, i have to credit wolf01 for the idea and initial work. ;)
00:13:26 <Roujin> ok, one answer so far, being "i don't care" - other opinions?
00:13:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: smatz * r12537 /trunk/src/newgrf_config.h: -Cleanup: comment newgrf_config.h a bit
00:15:41 <Roujin> any other devs still here?
00:16:26 <Roujin> besides SmatZ who cowardly fled from my question?
00:17:30 <Yexo> seems everyone is fleeing :P
00:18:23 <Roujin> dang, i hoped for a more positive response...
00:21:39 <Yexo> Well, I think it's a cool feature, but for me, I still have the default intro
00:22:08 <Yexo> busy playing with paxdest and yapp
00:22:44 <Roujin> well, my patch won't change anything if you have the current intro file ^^ it only jumps if there are signs in the savegame
00:24:06 <Roujin> but maybe it's time for a new intro.. i mean there are quite some new features since that game was made. and when we're at it, why not include the patch i made and have it jump around to show different features? :P
00:24:45 <Yexo> like the intro competition held in january?
00:25:20 <Roujin> yeah, i thought about getting in contact with littlemikey, who held that competition... but he's inactive since february :(
00:25:42 <Yexo> have you tried #openttdcoop?
00:26:36 <Roujin> nope... will they be interested in holding such a contest?
00:27:24 <Roujin> they could be showing off their fancy rail designs with something like that ^^
00:27:37 <Yexo> I should have explained myself better, I was asking if you looked for littlemikey on #openttdcoop
00:28:38 <Yexo> openttdcoop usually plays with a lot of grfs, so that's not suitable for an intro screen
00:31:02 <Roujin> hows that bot command...
00:31:08 <DorpsGek> Roujin: LittleMikey was last seen in #openttd 10 weeks, 0 days, 10 hours, 17 minutes, and 14 seconds ago: <LittleMikey> I'm off too, see you all
00:31:35 <Roujin> well, yep. he definately went "off". oO
00:31:43 <Roujin> to mars or something...
00:32:25 <Roujin> same time in #openttdcoop, guess he's gone for good...
00:32:44 <Yexo> he might turn op sometime, but for all we know that may be next year
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00:35:42 <Roujin> hm.. i could contact the other people who judged then, if they want to make something like that again..
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01:04:24 <DorpsGek> Sacro: I have not seen Mr_Hyde.
01:04:30 <Sacro> he should appear any minute
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04:15:20 <TheJosh> releaseing on april fools day...classic!
04:15:30 <TheJosh> just like StarCraft (10 years ago though)
04:25:05 <TheJosh> me off now, need to do some video editing
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07:22:41 <DorpsGek> Celestar: Open Bugs: 30; Not assigned: 22; Closed this week: 8; Opened this week: 17
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09:41:41 <Eddi|zuHause2> no, it's called halo
09:51:54 <Trond> I never really liked halo :P
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09:54:46 <keyweed> gay nazi zombi slayers from dimension x?
09:55:07 <Gekz> dimension y do you question me
09:59:29 <Trond> what a mess that would be if they crashed...
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10:34:47 <SpComb> no GSoC for OpenTTD? :(
10:38:45 <ben_goodger> well, there are some pretty obvious areas that could do with it
10:39:14 <ben_goodger> the most obvious I can think of is 32bpp
10:39:17 <peter1138> nothing to stop people working on those areas
10:39:28 <peter1138> 32bpp works perfectly :D
10:39:30 <ben_goodger> indeed not, but gsoc makes people work on them more
10:39:58 <ln> ben_goodger: but does gsoc support projects whose copyright holder and legal status is unknown?
10:40:50 <ben_goodger> it's now in debian contrib [sinbin] exclusively because it requires the old graphics files
10:41:11 <peter1138> and nothing at all to do with the dubious origins
10:44:27 <peter1138> does GSoC include graphics data files?
10:45:13 <peter1138> i don't know, but i'd imagine it's more of ... a code thing.
10:46:22 <ben_goodger> there's [afaik for all] the rivers thing, that needs testing and stabilising; newPBS, same; AI
10:46:49 <peter1138> pbs is done, pretty much
10:46:55 <peter1138> ai is already being worked on
10:47:31 <ben_goodger> yes.. that doesn't mean it can't be improved significantly [my copy gives a big warning on start that says "works only for X mode of transport"
10:48:18 <ben_goodger> I don't know what it's called. I press "enable new AI [beta/something]" and it presents that
10:48:27 <ben_goodger> that's on 0.6.0beta2, I believe
10:48:27 <peter1138> well that's old and obsolete
10:48:43 <peter1138> noai has been in development for a while, but separately
10:49:13 <ben_goodger> ok, I've now lost my openttd installation
10:50:21 <ben_goodger> it was on my desktop last week! !.!
10:50:30 <ln> i was able to compile trunk in ~23 seconds while experimenting with overclocking.
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10:51:08 <ben_goodger> beagle informs me that openttd has inexplicably been moved to my films directory
10:51:44 <Belugas> blame GSoC for that :D
10:55:49 <peter1138> well the AI's not been changed
10:56:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12538 /branches/noai/ (14 files in 4 dirs):
10:56:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Codechange: introducing fiber.hpp, a class to have fibers in your application via either Windows Fibers, or via thread.h
10:56:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: [NoAI] -Codechange: rewritten ai_threads.cpp, to work with Fiber class. Reduces code duplication, and should fix all the stupid asserts we had with newgames and dying AIs
10:56:12 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -NOTE: now my head spins.. 24 hours of working with threads/fibers is bad for health :p Tnx glx for the testing!
11:06:13 <Eddi|zuHause2> wtf is a "fiber"?
11:06:30 <ben_goodger> a fibre, badly misspelled so as to not confuse obese people
11:07:19 <ben_goodger> same with liter, meter, gram, program, etc
11:07:35 <peter1138> it's like a thread but cut down
11:07:44 <peter1138> whatever that means
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11:14:42 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12539 /branches/noai/src/economy.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: when you take over an AI, the game no longer crashes when a new AI starts again
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12:11:24 <Diadem> Is there a way to conveniently add trains to lists?
12:11:31 <Diadem> Like all trains servicing station x
12:11:53 <peter1138> you can see which trains stop at a station
12:12:02 <peter1138> but no explicit grouping
12:13:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> click on the station, and then on the little train icon
12:14:47 <Diadem> And then Eddi|zuHause2?
12:14:53 <Diadem> Then I can send them all to depot, but not to a group
12:15:11 <keyweed> Diadem: don't think there's any other way then dragging
12:15:35 <peter1138> you can group vehicles with shared orders easily
12:15:44 <peter1138> but not just because they stop at the same station
12:15:58 <keyweed> true, but i always think about shared orders when it's too late already :P
12:16:30 <peter1138> i never think not to
12:18:27 <SpComb> Byou mean you actually play OpenTTD?
12:19:53 <bowman> about that, why isn't the replace option available in the stations list? :)
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12:24:24 <peter1138> because replacement only work on 'real' groups (or the other two options)
12:25:54 <bowman> I see there is already a feature request
12:25:56 <peter1138> there'd be *loads* of checks required all the time if 'virtual' groups were used to
12:26:33 <peter1138> with groups, we can check if one number is the same as another number
12:29:03 <bowman> a shortcut for creating a group with all vehicles for a station would suffice
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12:31:54 <Yexo> bowman, what would that button do when some vehicles are already in a group?
12:32:07 <bowman> cant a vehicle be in multiple groups?
12:32:08 <Diadem> I manually dragged them now :)
12:32:20 <Diadem> But it would be a nice feature to have really
12:33:30 <bowman> manual grouping becomes problematic in big games with a 1000+ vehicles hehe
12:33:58 <Yexo> not if you use shared orders and "add all vehicles with shared orders"
12:34:10 <hylje> shared orders and groups go together
12:34:12 <bowman> ah theres an option for that?
12:34:24 <Yexo> under manage vehicles in the groups window
12:34:41 <Diadem> Yeah that's a life saver if you have 150 vehicles with the same orders :)
13:06:01 <Joop> can i ask something about the script autopilot?
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13:57:49 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r12540 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: Enumify some values in original pathfinder and remove an unused variable.
14:13:27 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r12541 /trunk/src/ (slope_func.h slope_type.h terraform_cmd.cpp water_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: Declare Slope enum as bit set, and remove some (then) unneeded casts.
14:21:43 <jordi> okay, official Debian packages are now in, thanks to blathijs
14:22:17 <jordi> I wonder if there's any Ubuntu MOTU in the audience, or should I use my influences to make sure 0.6 is in the hardy release.
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15:21:33 <jordi> it's a request, but it needs to go in the bug tracker
15:22:30 <blathijs> It's more like a request tracker, not only a bug tracker :-)
15:23:14 <glx> well this tracker then miss a "request type" field ;)
15:24:24 <ln> in Ubuntu, stability matters, not whether you can actually use the product for anything.
15:24:53 <ln> also stability doesn't mean the same as non-crashing.
15:42:41 <blathijs> To whom should I complain^Wask for advice about the configure script?
15:44:43 <blathijs> Rubidium: svn blame says it's you, but svn log can't seem to find that revision (7604)
15:45:11 <blathijs> Rubidium: When you set a personal dir, make install also tries to install scenarios into the personal dir of the user running make install
15:45:52 <blathijs> Which is mostly unwanted IMO (will end up installing scenarios into root's homedir I guess) and breaks on Debian buildd's, because their homedir is /nonexistent
15:48:04 <blathijs> I guess a seperate ./configure option for that would make sense (there is already a seperate INSTALL_PERSONAL_DIR variable in the Makefile, which gets set to PERSONAL_DIR now)
15:49:11 <blathijs> Ah, the revision svn log refused to show me was in the makefilerewrite branch :-)
15:49:29 <blathijs> And the log says it's "semi-proper install functionality"
15:49:49 <Rubidium> blathijs: 7604 was in branches/makefilerewrite (or whatever way it was written back then)
15:50:47 <Rubidium> blathijs: from the log it looks like I copied the behaviour directly from what was trunk back then
15:51:20 <blathijs> Don't remember this being in there, but doesn't really matter
15:51:37 <blathijs> Shall I just add a --install-personal-dir option?
15:52:05 <Rubidium> the first question is whether the current behaviour is actually correct
15:53:05 <blathijs> Ie, we could also remove the INSTALL_PERSONAL_DIR stuff alltogether you mean?
15:53:23 <blathijs> The current behaviour is, at least for Debian packaging, unwanted
15:53:29 <blathijs> and for any packaging I guess
15:53:42 <blathijs> The only use for this is end users running make install themselves
15:53:48 <blathijs> or something like that
15:54:07 <blathijs> Did we have search paths or stuff like that already?
15:54:20 <blathijs> Ie, does openttd look in /usr/share and ~ for scenarios now?
15:54:30 <Rubidium> hmm, seems like 0.5 only creates the directories, but never copies something to there
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15:56:51 <Rubidium> blathijs: now I think about it the copying with make install to the homedir is bogus
15:59:56 <blathijs> Ah, openttd offers to play scenarios from /usr/share only if you don't have a scenario dir in your personal dir
16:00:26 <blathijs> people wanting to work on their own scenarios and also play the default want should either copy them or keep browsing around, I guess
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16:07:56 <blathijs> Rubidium: Any objections? ifdef INSTALL_PERSONAL_DIR $(Q)mkdir -p ~/"$(INSTALL_PERSONAL_DIR)" $(Q)cp -R "$(BUNDLE_DIR)/scenario" ~/"$(INSTALL_PERSONAL_DIR)"
16:09:51 <blathijs> hmm, how was this commit message style for openttd again... :-)
16:11:26 <blathijs> Does this count as a -Remove, or is that really strictly for removing files only>?
16:13:05 <frosch123> -Change perhaps, no clue
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16:15:19 <blathijs> I'll go for -Fix, since the old behaviour is broken behaviour
16:18:45 <blathijs> Hmm, the commit style on the wiki is also quite out of date, really
16:19:13 <blathijs> The section as hardly ever put up front, and the space before the leading - is also a bit ambiguous
16:20:53 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: matthijs * r12542 /trunk/Makefile.in: -Fix [Makefile]: Don't install scenarios into the current user's homedir when running 'make install', that is silly. Simply always install scenarios system wide instead.
16:23:18 <blathijs> Rubidium: Shall I merge it to 0.6 right away, or should I rather list it somewhere for a batch merge later on?
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16:39:27 <jordi> blathijs: thanks mate. If you can add a patch to our svn I'll try to build a new one tonight
16:39:40 <jordi> blathijs: I need to get out of here right now
16:43:08 <jez9999> i wonder why OpenTTD is more popular in Europe than the US
16:43:12 <blathijs> jordi: Yeah, that was the next thing on my list :-)
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17:07:13 <DorpsGek> dih: I have not seen OptimusS|TTd|.
17:07:23 <DorpsGek> dih: I haven't seen anyone matching OptimusS*.
17:07:33 <DorpsGek> Bjarni: I haven't seen anyone matching Op*.
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17:29:05 <Brianetta> svn diff | patch -R
17:29:45 <SmatZ> isn't svn revert simpler?
17:33:46 <Brianetta> mine you can offer as a "fix"
17:34:12 <Ammler> for i in `svn st src/ | sed -n -e 's/^\? //gp'`; do rm $i; done
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17:37:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> Ammler: put those two on the same line
17:37:41 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause2: they are in a script "cleanrevert"
17:38:38 <Ammler> try to update source with patch, that creates new files
17:39:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> but can't you just rm * then?
17:39:26 <Ammler> well, you could rm src/*
17:39:39 <Ammler> but then you also need to dl the whole source again
17:40:06 <Ammler> is that saved in .svn?
17:40:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> revert does not download anything
17:40:19 <Eddi|zuHause2> a copy of the original files is in .svn
17:40:37 <hylje> there's also those other VCSes supported by openttd, hg and git
17:40:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> this is used by svn diff and svn revert
17:40:42 <hylje> which store the whole repository locally
17:40:59 <hylje> rather than just the latest and a working copy
17:41:43 <Ammler> so "rm ./src/* && revert . -R" would do the job without downloading?
17:42:56 <Eddi|zuHause2> rm $(find | grep -v "svn")
17:43:29 <hylje> yeah, eddi's got it better
17:43:35 <hylje> its good to preserve the .svn dir
17:43:52 <Ammler> shouldn't be deleted with *
17:44:02 <Ammler> you would need .* for that
17:44:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> no, but find will find it
17:44:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> so it will delete everything within .svn
17:45:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> Ammler: rm * will not apply to subdirectories of src
17:45:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> whichof there are plenty
17:45:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> is that a word even?
17:45:50 <glx> I had something with 'svn st | grep "?"'
17:46:22 <Eddi|zuHause2> -R will recurse into .snv
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17:56:13 <Prof_Frink> blathijs: No, number of Debian users that have openttd and popcon installed.
17:56:34 <blathijs> Prof_Frink: Hmm, good point :-)
18:00:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> is there a number of total people somewhere?
18:01:06 <yorick> on top of the town list?
18:01:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> do not trust a statistic that you did not forge yourself
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18:17:15 <dih> yorick: i have a nick name for you
18:17:37 <dih> yorrige (yorick porrige) :-D
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18:20:54 <jez9999> did it take you all year to think that up?
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18:51:30 <okali> What I am donate money on this game ?
18:52:04 <mrfrenzy> there is a linkon the website if you would like to do that
18:53:50 <okali> I want to donate money for my friend
18:54:19 <okali> sorry, my english is bad...
18:58:00 <Patrick`> he knows it's in like 75 languages and most of us speak french, right?
18:58:46 <mrfrenzy> I only speak swedish, english and german
18:58:58 <mrfrenzy> but I'd guess there are a few french speaking in here ,)
19:00:20 <yorick> I'm learning chinese, french, german, and speaking english, dutch :)
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19:45:28 <dragonhorseboy> just wondering but any of you know what the hell is up with a new openttd folder (I just downloaded 0.6.0 to see what it was like) it always keep warning of many missing newgrfs even although I did -not- even specify any cfg files yet? :|
19:45:44 <dragonhorseboy> this been like the third time anyhow
19:46:23 <peter1138> warning of missing newgrfs?
19:46:36 <peter1138> or rather when and how?
19:47:09 <Belugas> loading a game that requires grf that you do not have?
19:47:18 <peter1138> that's the usual cause, yes
19:47:33 <dragonhorseboy> download 0.6.0 zip .. extract it into a new folder .. open openttd.exe for the very first time ... it keep warning of missing newgrfs (no they're not t1gr.grf etc)
19:48:13 <peter1138> did you use an betas or RC?
19:48:52 <dragonhorseboy> its been doing that ever since I've downloaded 0.5.7 then one 0.6.0-beta and then also 0.6.0
19:49:04 <peter1138> now that's imaginary
19:49:06 <dragonhorseboy> like why is it trying to look for any newgrfs when it shouldn't
19:49:17 <glx> so you may have an openttd.cfg already
19:49:22 <peter1138> however, it's probably using your openttd.cfg in My Documents
19:49:31 <dragonhorseboy> glx...nope the folder is fresh empty save for copying the five ttd files into data folder
19:49:48 <dragonhorseboy> glx..what mydoc? there's none
19:50:26 <dragonhorseboy> glx...what kind of name is that for a game folder anyhow? ^-^
19:50:51 <glx> My Documents is a standard windows directory
19:51:02 <peter1138> Well the game is called OpenTTD, so a directory called OpenTTD is hardly... surprising
19:51:19 <dragonhorseboy> glx...well I don't have it anyhow
19:51:33 <hylje> peter1138: yeah, ottd should use a directory called TTDPatch
19:51:42 <dragonhorseboy> peter...I meant the main directory
19:51:53 <Ammler> where do you save your pictures word documents etc.?
19:52:40 <peter1138> C:\Windows\System32\
19:52:41 <dragonhorseboy> ammler...either on desktop if I'm still working on them or C:\mystuffs to keep them
19:53:11 <hylje> if we go into that, i rather have a proprietary binary format containing everything
19:53:14 <Ammler> so maybe you have a folder \mystuffs\OpenTTD?
19:53:19 <hylje> and chuck that into System32
19:53:35 <dragonhorseboy> messenger/etc are redirected to C:\onfiles
19:53:51 <dih> noris that into the system32? <-- hylje ^^
19:53:59 <dragonhorseboy> ammler...hmm no don't see one in dir
19:54:46 <Ammler> windows guys, there is a command to print out system var mydoc, isn't?
19:54:48 <peter1138> well, a lot of people store things in My Documents, as that is, you know, what it's for
19:55:07 <peter1138> it'll be a %SOMETHING% one, i suspect
19:56:06 <dragonhorseboy> peter...well I don't since windows cd seem to strangely want to affect that particular folder at random
19:56:31 <glx> set doesn't show anything about mydocs
19:57:55 <glx> mydocs is D:\Mes Documents, user profile is C:\Documents And Settings\<user>
19:58:18 <dragonhorseboy> hm now searching for openttd.cfg excluding games/ folder.....
19:59:05 <peter1138> maybe you've got a replacement opntitle.dat, hehe
19:59:23 <Ammler> is that the 1.April fool
19:59:48 <peter1138> 20:59 Topic for #openttd: 0.6.0
19:59:54 <Ammler> no kick for that anymore
20:03:56 <dragonhorseboy> hmm...no idea...there's only just one in openttd folder and one catalogued on the backup firewire hd
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20:39:27 <Sacro> dih: funnly enoguh i will be changing planes at budapest
20:40:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> we always went to hungary by bus
20:40:36 <ln> what is the country whose capital is Estocolmo?
20:40:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> never heard of that city
20:41:42 <ln> it is stockholm, in spanish.
20:41:53 <Sacro> shame, means i won't get to see warsaw
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20:42:11 <Eddi|zuHause2> warsaw is nowhere near hungary
20:42:26 <Vikthor> Eddi|zuHause2: That depends on scale
20:42:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> but it's also not on the way from england to hungary
20:43:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> except maybe if you go via stockholm ;)
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20:43:50 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause2: going england - ukreaine
20:43:57 <Vikthor> Eddi|zuHause2: Geographically not, but I won't be surprised if some low-cost airline combination would be cheapest via Warsaw
20:44:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> ln: sorry, but adding vowels is totally changing the emphasis, there's no way to recognise this...
20:45:03 <ln> Eddi|zuHause2: that was kind of the point of this question, to ask something obvious that sounds very unobvious.
20:45:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> i should reduce my shame by saying "norway" :p
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22:41:52 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause2: nice one :-)
22:50:10 <jez9999> Ammler: you suddenly felt an urge to buy a pot from eBay??
22:51:30 <jez9999> hash brownies direct?
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22:52:46 <Ammler> wll, IPod=eipot=egg pot
22:57:15 <jez9999> why is OpenTTD more popular in Europe than the US?
22:57:23 *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01
22:57:48 <Bjarni> <Sacro> buying pot from ebay> <-- well... I guess they have some sort of hashtable in their database. Now we know why ;)
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23:05:35 <Bjarni> <jez9999> why is OpenTTD more popular in Europe than the US? <-- we would have to make a survey in order to answer that one
23:06:03 <Bjarni> putting up a poll on the forum wouldn't really give a decent result so we simply don't know the answer to the question
23:07:05 <Bjarni> I mean why should we care for the reason. It's not like we would add killer robots or aliens if that is what it takes to become popular in the US
23:09:03 <jordi> Bjarni: still it's an interesting question
23:09:23 <Bjarni> but your guess at the answer is as good as mine
23:09:24 <jordi> I don't think he expected an answer to it
23:10:12 <jordi> anyway, the makefile fixes are in Debian now, and it can be built for all architectures
23:11:09 <Bjarni> I guess it could be that a lot of players heard about the game from friends and then it more or less by random got more players in Europe then more people talked about it in Europe so the growth of players in Europe increased
23:13:40 <jordi> Bjarni: maybe the American public is used to other kind of entertainment, more action or so, due to the kind of mass-media culture they have there. I don't know; generalising like this is silly, but it's also true that the American and European cinema productions are quite different.
23:14:00 <jordi> and directors like Woody Allen are totally ignored in their own country, but praised in Europe
23:14:12 <jordi> so there's some kind of difference after all
23:15:00 <Bjarni> when they made that Mr. Bean movie they aimed at the US marked (that's why he travelled there) and it was a disaster in the US (both in the movie and in the cinemas)
23:15:15 <Bjarni> however as a big surprise they liked it in Australia
23:17:04 <Bjarni> maybe some advertising in the US would help
23:17:32 <Bjarni> however since we don't gain money from gaining more players it wouldn't be sane to invest in advertising anywhere
23:18:10 <Bjarni> maybe Sacro has the answer
23:18:48 <Bjarni> the Americans are too stupid to figure out what the game is all about?
23:19:03 <Sacro> well no, Microprose was a british company
23:19:09 <Sacro> and sold mainly over Europe
23:19:21 <Sacro> so I doubt the game had much exposure over in the US
23:19:30 <Sacro> what with it mainly being British
23:19:38 <Bjarni> that could be a reason
23:20:08 <Bjarni> but that can't explain the Hungarian interest in the game
23:20:29 <Bjarni> I mean the Hungarians picked OTTD as best free game of the year
23:21:37 <Prof_Frink> Bjarni: Get someone to do a writeup of openttd for DPotD or similar
23:21:57 <Sacro> Bjarni: what else is there to do in Hungary?
23:22:08 <Sacro> you can only eat so much goulash
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23:23:35 <Prof_Frink> Debian Package of t'day
23:23:40 <Bjarni> <Sacro> Bjarni: what else is there to do in Hungary? <-- play other games. Considering the country was under strong communistic influence in the TT era and the communists didn't believe in copyright for software they could just copy whatever game they wanted
23:24:56 <jordi> they could play freeciv and try to win the game only using Communism as the ruling style. :)
23:25:14 * jordi also maintains Freeciv in Debian </nb>
23:25:42 <peter1138> the hungarians are revolting!
23:26:25 <jordi> Bjarni: btw, jokes about stupid Americans are not really funny, it's like a meme, but there's so many really dumb people in Europe who wouldn't know how many countries are in the Union right now...
23:26:39 <jordi> peter1138: the Hungarians are no more!
23:26:55 <jordi> so, Freeciv has a Spanish nation, but also a Catalan nation
23:27:14 <peter1138> bjarnis jokes are never funny
23:27:26 <jordi> One has Valencia as one of its major cities, while the others have València
23:27:46 <Bjarni> at one time my brother tried playing freeciv in MP and he thought he did good (could beat the computer at a hard level in normal civ) and all of a sudden somebody started building wonders that indicated that he had like twice the amount of techs... and this is bad when the wonders were in the industrial era
23:27:50 <jordi> Sacro: is that also a joke?
23:28:05 <Sacro> that's what i learnt at school
23:28:18 <Bjarni> turned out that he played against some pretty hardcore games (might even have written the game as it took place at that uni around that time)
23:28:29 <jordi> it was 15 not that long ago
23:28:45 <jordi> then went to 25 recently, and to 27 even more recently
23:29:20 <Bjarni> <jordi> Bjarni: btw, jokes about stupid Americans are not really funny <-- actually the point was more like trying to guess what Sacro would state as a reason but it turned out that he was actually serious this time
23:29:21 <jordi> Bjarni: I'm always ashamed of playing these gameso nline
23:29:49 <jordi> there's always really hardcore players around
23:29:54 <jordi> and make me feel very stupid
23:29:56 <Sacro> Bjarni: i'm not as stupid as you may think
23:30:24 <Bjarni> to be honest I don't think you are stupid at all
23:30:32 <jez9999> i did think it was more popular in Europe because we have way more trains than over there
23:30:54 <jez9999> but i dont think so, i dont tend to use trains anyway, the fun of the game is inherent. anyway as someone said before it's probably because Microprose didn't push it in the US
23:31:15 <jez9999> i wish microprose still existed
23:31:19 <Bjarni> I think the arctic and desert sets were aimed at the US marked as they are full of US trains but it kind of sucks that they have the same top speed :/
23:31:26 <jez9999> they kick the shit out of anything EA ever came up with
23:31:58 <jez9999> yeah, their name looked particularly unimportant ;-)
23:34:25 <jordi> I had no idea Morocco tried to enter the EU
23:35:21 <Bjarni> I'm surprised that they were sane enough to reject it. It feels like they want to expand into the entire planet if they could
23:35:41 <jez9999> yeah but then they'd have to rename it the European and Tinpot Dictators Union
23:35:54 * Sacro wants to be a tinpot dictator
23:36:13 <Bjarni> the EU politicians don't want to have elections anyway
23:36:46 <jez9999> not that i like their 'directives'
23:37:07 <jez9999> the only one that was any good, forcing car insurance companies not to be sexist, was dropped
23:38:10 <Bjarni> they can agree to issue directives telling stuff like how much a cucumber is allowed to bend
23:38:23 <Bjarni> if it bends too much then you aren't allowed to sell it at any price
23:38:51 <dih> but you may shredd it and make a salad out of it
23:39:06 <Bjarni> I'm not even sure if that is allowed
23:39:19 <jez9999> all i know is, Tesco sell me beaten up bananas
23:39:29 <jez9999> i wish they'd issue a directive requiring bananas to be unbruised
23:39:51 <dih> i always went to sainsburry or marks n sparks
23:40:22 <Bjarni> they made a minimum size for tomatoes meaning that the slow growing and small but really tasty tomatoes are banned
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23:41:10 <Bjarni> uncrushed ketchup in your world
23:41:22 <jordi> the EC can piss on their votes
23:41:29 <jordi> as shown by the patents fiasco
23:41:47 <jez9999> software patents are being majorly held up in Europe
23:44:51 <Bjarni> wtf there is talk about Israel joining EU
23:44:59 <jordi> I know, but the commission has promised to find ways to resurrect the project back from the dead after the parliament voted against it
23:45:12 <jordi> Bjarni: Israel, east Europe.
23:46:27 <jordi> 2862 D+ Apr 02 Debian Installe ( 11) openttd_0.6.0-2_i386.changes REJECTED
23:47:01 <jordi> iow, I fucked up I think
23:48:03 <jez9999> the EuroVision has Israel in :-)
23:48:37 <Bjarni> expanding EU from 15 to 25 countries were a really hot topic. Those in favour of doing it said that the people over there wouldn't come here
23:48:45 <Bjarni> and now we have Polish workers everywhere
23:49:04 <Bjarni> we can deal with that (more or less)
23:49:19 <Bjarni> the problem is that the criminals also figured out that they could come here
23:49:53 <Bjarni> so now we have an increase in armed robberies and murders due to people coming from Eastern Europe
23:50:20 <SmatZ> it sounds like people from the Easter Europe were all murderers and robbers :-x
23:50:30 <SmatZ> I miss "some" in your sentence
23:50:40 <Bjarni> and we went from nearly no pocket thieves to a severe issue due to organised import of trained thieves
23:50:42 <SmatZ> ... due to SOME people...
23:50:44 <jez9999> Bjarni: heh, polish workers everywhere :-)
23:50:51 <jez9999> i thought the UK were the only ones with that problem
23:51:43 <Bjarni> <SmatZ> it sounds like people from the Easter Europe were all murderers and robbers :-x <-- I didn't write that. I wrote "the criminals" which is (hopefully) a small group compared to the whole population in Eastern Europe
23:52:27 <jez9999> im guessing a ton of money is flowing into Poland at the moment
23:52:38 <jez9999> seems pretty unfair to other countries though
23:52:51 <Bjarni> actually it's a problem for Poland because they export their workforce
23:53:08 <Bjarni> so they have to hire workers from the east of Poland
23:53:27 <Bjarni> the country as a whole is losing money on this
23:54:06 <jordi> jez9999: a lot of money flowed into Spain and Poland
23:54:19 <jordi> that money is going to Estonia, Latvia and so now, though.
23:54:23 <jordi> Which is the fair thing.
23:54:32 <Bjarni> SmatZ: oh now I see what you meant.... and yeah you are right. I didn't mean everybody ;)
23:54:42 <jordi> Spain has benefitted *enormously* from joining the EU
23:55:03 <Bjarni> <jordi> Spain has benefitted *enormously* from joining the EU <-- at our expense :(
23:55:08 <jordi> we don't get poles though. We get Romanians ;)
23:55:22 <jordi> Bjarni: well, that's a way of seeing it.
23:55:32 <jordi> Vote for an anti-eu party next time
23:55:39 <SmatZ> Bjarni: all investations will return in benefits...
23:55:49 <jordi> The fact is that Spain is able to give back now.
23:56:14 <Bjarni> but we will not benefit from it
23:56:43 <jordi> and 40 million live a lot better than after the dictatorship
23:57:14 <jordi> I don't know who "we" is, but really, you should campaign to get out of the EU :)
23:57:25 <Bjarni> you are saying that like EU is needed to get rid of dictators
23:57:47 <peter1138> thats what bush is for
23:59:06 <Bjarni> <jordi> I don't know who "we" is, but really, you should campaign to get out of the EU :) <-- actually the Lisbon treaty started that talk again. Not the treaty itself but the fact that that there will not be an election
23:59:32 <Bjarni> even though there has to be one according to the constitution
continue to next day ⏵
