IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2007-04-05
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00:06:06 <Kander> Ok, is it supposed to complain that the dir I am trying to mkdir (mkdir /usr/src ) already exists, on each of the three libraries I am installing? :/ If so, who figured it'd be a good idea to include the mkdir in the commands for each of the libs?
00:09:19 <glx> the complain seems logical to me :)
00:10:38 <Kander> I thought so too, but being as unfamiliar with this whole unix-syntax as I am, it might as well be that the mkdirs should end in various places and I am doing something terribly wrong ^_^ It's all so [expletive] confusing sometimes. [subject rests head on hands and mutters inexplicably for several minutes before resuming installing]
00:15:00 <Kander> Ok. Hurray - managed to get all four libraries installed. I'm skipping DirectX for now.. let's first get something working, then add fancy stuff like music and all that.
00:15:28 <glx> music works without directX :)
00:16:02 <Kander> Is the freetype mingwport sh script supposed to give lots of warnings, by the way? It seemed to work fine, but it did seem a bit worrying to me..
00:16:53 <Kander> (lots of 'dereferencing type-punned pointer will break strict-aliasing rules' warnings.. no idea what it means :) )
00:16:54 <glx> I never used mingwport (I download source the configure && make && make install usually)
00:17:08 <glx> don't worry about these warnings :)
00:17:14 <Kander> Is that more complicated then what I am doing right now?
00:17:56 <Kander> Heh, alright. Not worrying and being happy. 'cause every little train (and bus and plane and boat) is gonna be alright...
00:20:58 <Kander> Hmm. Another bump on the road: I run the "get latest openttd.sh" script, it tells me it's updating to latest revision and immediately after that 'Done.' (seems suspicious, considering how verbose other installing and updates scripts have been so far..). After that it tells me to CD into the openttd source directory.. which does not exist. Wasn't the getlatest script supposed to take care of that?
00:27:42 * Kander does his happy dance. It's compiling, it's compiling! *bounces up and down*
00:36:13 <Kander> Ok. It compiled. But it won't run. *sigh*
00:36:56 <Kander> Nothing - the standard crash thingy from MS (do you want to send a report to MS?)
00:37:31 <Kander> Want the result of my compilation (the textual output) in a pastebin?
00:38:30 <Kander> Is there an easy way to copy-paste from the MINGW32 window? :/
00:39:18 <glx> dunno, I use all of this from cmd
00:42:48 <Kander> One thing I do notice is that the directory in which it was built is very.. empty, compared to the normal (pre-compiled) openttd directory. Is that a queue for problems?
00:45:34 <Kander> Just the graphics files, some subdirectories (data, lang, save, scenaroio) and openttd.exe (the dir I am looking at is f:\local\msys\home\openttd\build\ )
00:45:46 <Kander> (graphics files = the 3 icon images)
00:46:23 <Kander> I know I have to copy the .grf and .cat file from my original TTD to the data dir.
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01:45:24 <HMage> where can I get a list of patch setting names for console?
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04:57:06 <DaleStan> HMage: The source code?
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04:58:09 <HMage> DaleStan: yup, the problem got solved by looking at the source code. I wonder what would happen if someone else wasn't that lucky enough to know how to read source code (ie typical sysadmin).
04:59:29 <DaleStan> This is why documentation was invented.
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05:11:58 <DaleStan> I dunno. I've basically stopped expecting any but the most user-obvious parts of Open to be documented.
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07:49:08 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9563 /trunk/ (23 files in 4 dirs): -Feature: Add more finer control to transparency options, including a new toolbar, accessible from the map menu or Ctrl X. Patch by Wolf01.
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08:40:12 <Maedhros> /home/jc/src/openttd-svn/src/main_gui.cpp:40:30: error: transparency_gui.h: No such file or directory
08:54:06 * ThePizzaKing has the same problem as Maedhros
08:54:21 <peter1138> did i not add it? :P
08:59:02 <valhallasw> what does transparency add? I can't find anything on the forums about it :P
09:00:12 <valhallasw> Or I am midding it, very well possible
09:00:21 <Wolf01> it add only a gui... and split all the things so you are able to make transparent only houses to see stations, bridges, industries etc
09:01:12 <Maedhros> hmm, is it not possible for station signs to be transparent all the time now?
09:01:33 <Wolf01> is not toggled with the x key
09:01:59 <Wolf01> but you can toggle it easily with ctrl+1
09:03:08 <peter1138> Maedhros: just needs to be skipped in main_gui.cpp
09:03:17 <peter1138> which i'll sort out
09:05:54 <peter1138> gah, takes *ages* to compile
09:06:30 <boekabart_> or develop faster compiler, of course :D
09:07:22 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9564 /trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): -Fix (r9563): When adding files remember to add them...
09:08:44 <ThePizzaKing> yay, works fine now
09:08:52 * ThePizzaKing congratulates peter1138
09:10:37 <Wolf01> i hope the version you applied was the last one, i tried to document it very better with Belugas yesterday evening
09:10:58 <peter1138> Wolf01: i used the version on the bug tracker
09:11:51 <Wolf01> i think that something changed since that version
09:12:26 <Wolf01> something that makes you unhappy... i removed the transparency at purchased land yesterday :P
09:12:34 <peter1138> that was already removed
09:13:00 <peter1138> besides, i didn't apply the patch anyway
09:13:09 <peter1138> i went through it manually
09:13:21 <peter1138> hence it uses HASBIT()
09:14:44 <peter1138> added extra param,s heh
09:15:20 <Wolf01> and optimized the patch very much
09:16:43 <peter1138> but inconsistent. hmm.
09:18:17 <peter1138> i can revert what i've done if you want
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09:19:18 <Wolf01> maybe if you can wait this evening, or if you can help me to finish to document the AddSortableSprite() function, is better
09:19:41 <peter1138> here's a tip though
09:19:50 <peter1138> DO_ is "Display Options"
09:20:05 <peter1138> so i used TO_ instead of DO_TRANS
09:22:17 <peter1138> your declaration and definition of AddSortableSpriteToDraw() are different
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10:07:50 <l_Blue_l> hi is there any openTTD forum moderators on atm?
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10:10:36 <l_Blue_l> on the openTTD forum i would like that thread lock
10:14:31 <l_Blue_l> did you understand that
10:16:09 <Kander> Morning (or whatever it is in everyone's timezone)
10:16:59 <Kander> Hehe, yet another variation on TrueLight, Patric?
10:18:06 <TrueBrain> Kander: not a variation :)
10:18:21 <blathijs> l_Blue_l: We understood, but we're no moderators (at least I am not)
10:18:28 <blathijs> TrueBrain: Perhaps you can help l_Blue_l ?
10:19:53 <Kander> Last night I have been trying to get OpenTTD to compile for the first time in a long, long time - I tried to follow the steps outlined on the Wiki for compiling using MinGW and failed miserably. Another user, who's name sadly seems to elude my thoughts for now, helped me to get it at least into a somewhat succesful compile run, but now the executable spawned by it crashes immediately upon...
10:19:55 <Kander> ...starting. Do you guys have time to point me in the right direction?
10:20:44 <Kander> (32 bits edition - call me oldfashioned)
10:20:55 <TrueBrain> lol, like the 64bit edition is that good :s Brrrr
10:21:24 <Kander> Well, at work it seems to work fine. But then again I don't do anything more fancy then word and notepad.
10:21:49 <Kander> Standard 'report to microsoft' screen.. not sure how to explain it otherwise? As soon as I start the executable.
10:22:30 <TrueBrain> your best chance is to wait for glx
10:22:44 <Kander> Glx.. that's it :) He was the guy who helped me last night.
10:23:05 <Kander> Do you happen to know what timezone he is in?
10:23:05 <TrueBrain> he is the mingw guru :)
10:23:14 <TrueBrain> he will be online in 2 hours
10:23:20 <TrueBrain> mostly exactly 14:30 he joins
10:23:27 <Kander> Sounds like a very consistent man :)
10:23:36 <TrueBrain> yesterday it was 14:48
10:23:39 <TrueBrain> so it can be a bit later :)
10:24:15 <TrueBrain> l_Blue_l: topic locked
10:24:36 <Kander> Alright, I'll wait for him then :) In the meanwhile I'll just toss my MinGW installation away and install it all from scratch.. things were messy, to say the least, last night.
10:25:22 <TrueBrain> l_Blue_l: I hope I win an award with the quote: gone offtopic :p (as it is the biggest understatement ever I believe)
10:28:53 <l_Blue_l> true. At best only 4 comtribute to the topic. It such a let down each time i read the topic and some peoples comments are so rude / stupid i just couldnt stand it anymore
10:30:04 <TrueBrain> I do hope it doesn't spoil your fun in coding...
10:31:33 <TrueBrain> tadadadadadadada tadadadadadada BATMAN!
10:31:42 <DorpsGek> oh for the love of God....
10:32:10 <l_Blue_l> TrueBrain: omg no i love it it will take alot more then that to scare me away.
10:34:01 <l_Blue_l> TrueBrain: i havent yet been able to finnish a single patch of mine ..... maybe this time i can finnish this one (fix up the code so it can get included into the trunk)
10:34:34 <TrueBrain> Clean it up, post it at bugs.openttd.org :)
10:34:48 <Ailure> just don't go bitch when it dosen't get included though
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10:35:42 <peter1138> of course, me posting a query in the original thread and not getting a reply counts as "no interest" according to he who should know better
10:35:57 <l_Blue_l> ok ha no i wont bitch .... i fully understand the reason why there are rules for things getting included or not
10:36:11 * TrueBrain starts to wonder about Ailure :p
10:36:42 <Ailure> eh well some people take critique as "OMG YOU STABBED MY SOUL" instead of "Ok, I fix this"
10:37:06 <peter1138> when i *do* add someone's patch it turns out they didn't post the latest version :P
10:37:16 <peter1138> so there's no getting it right
10:37:59 <TrueBrain> Ailure: and it seems to be rather hard for people to follow a coding style: IT AINT MY STYLE SO WHY SHOULD I FOLLOW IT?! :) You got to love users :)
10:38:27 <Ailure> the OTTD style looks good for me :P
10:38:35 <Kander> Style leads to order, order leads to peace, peace leads to the DARK SIDE!
10:38:38 <Ailure> Although I only looked through it hastily
10:38:44 <Ailure> as I hadn't done any patch, so far
10:38:51 <TrueBrain> Kander: welcome to the dark side :)
10:38:55 <Rubidium> and ofcourse: "but the coding style isn't consistent in the code"
10:39:07 <Ailure> Mostly becuse I have no idea where to start
10:39:31 <Kander> Would a patch that does nothing but clean up the coding style in existing parts of the code be considered for inclusion??
10:40:04 <TrueBrain> Kander: it happens a lot lately :)
10:40:08 <TrueBrain> doxygen thingies too
10:41:02 <Kander> That's good to hear :)
10:41:22 <TrueBrain> they aren't that dark in here yet :p
10:43:05 <Ailure> only thing that annoys me with openTTD at the moment
10:43:11 <Ailure> is the 8 company limit
10:43:19 <TrueBrain> which is rather a tricky one
10:43:29 <Ailure> from what I been able to gain, yeah.
10:43:44 <TrueBrain> most users suggest changing it to 16, which isn't a solution
10:43:47 <TrueBrain> it needs to be made dynamic
10:43:53 <TrueBrain> which is possible for most parts, but not the GUI
10:43:58 <TrueBrain> which is being worked on to make that possible :)
10:44:17 <Kander> I know GLX would be able to answer with more authority, but is there a practical reason not to use the latest/greatest version of every compile tool, instead of what is linked to in the compile-instructions on the Wiki?
10:44:52 <Rubidium> b0rkedness of binaries?
10:44:54 <Ailure> Well, it would make long and huge games even more epic
10:45:08 <TrueBrain> Kander: you can use the latest version of most things, just some are known to be broken. The versions used on the wiki are tested and therefor known to work :)
10:45:08 <Ailure> I hate deleting companies whem running a server
10:45:58 <Ailure> I yet have to break the player limit though, but been close to
10:46:06 <Kander> Is there any chance of the AI being improved upon? I read in the changelog that it has recently been dumbed down even further, in favor of performance (is such a thing even possible, I wonder??)
10:46:16 <Ailure> Some players simple just play at diffrent names
10:46:24 <Ailure> Kander: Check out the noAi branch
10:47:02 <Kander> Wha! Never found that section of the Wiki
10:47:21 <Ailure> well it's something quite recent
10:47:32 <TrueBrain> Kander: it is relative new
10:47:57 <peter1138> so i do need a new pc
10:48:08 <TrueBrain> peter1138: you talk about that for, what, 2 months now? :)
10:48:17 <TrueBrain> so you are waiting for donations or something? :)
10:48:27 <peter1138> finally you get the hint
10:48:48 <TrueBrain> let me wire 1 eurocent to your account :p
10:48:48 * Kander tosses Peter a blank check. Uncovered, of course.
10:49:05 <TrueBrain> at least I send you something :p
10:49:24 <Ailure> just took out mine from the microwave
10:49:42 <Kander> Seriously: Would you have any use for a AthlonXP 1700+ which has been gathering dust for the past few months?
10:49:43 <Ailure> quick lunch before next lecture starts
10:50:21 <Ailure> even if I have a 64bit dual core processor ;)
10:50:35 <Kander> Lol, use it as a secondary machine? :P
10:51:02 <Ailure> I dunno what I would use it for
10:51:23 <Ailure> I mean, a dual core processor with two monitors. Now if I could run two OS's at the same time ;)
10:51:37 <Ailure> (virtual machines dosen't count :P)
10:51:41 <Kander> Hmmm... you could run a virtualized session on the second monitor ::... never mind
10:52:32 <peter1138> Kander: i have a 2000+, but my boards too old to run it at full speed
10:52:37 <peter1138> plus it's PC133 memory, heh
10:53:01 <Kander> :) The board I have as well.. but it's an Asrock so might not make you happy.
10:53:33 <Ailure> I rarely use my CPU to it's fullest
10:54:03 <Ailure> All I really required when getting a new computer was 2 GB memory
10:54:08 <Ailure> since the programs I run is memory h
10:54:47 <Kander> Hmm, what kind of programs are they? (I've got the Electric Sheep screensaver running in a window to burn up any spare CPU cycles.. works like a charm!)
10:55:11 <peter1138> i'm still stuck between AM2 or 775...
10:55:39 <Ailure> One of the better java SDK's, but eats memory like there was no tomorrow
10:55:39 <MiHaMiX> Ailure: you meant Netbeans? :)
10:55:41 <Kander> Java? *shudders* Not my thing...
10:55:57 <Ailure> There's a huge diffrence between a SDK and IDE
10:56:22 <MiHaMiX> Ailure: at me, netbeans not used to eat more than 80mb
10:56:41 <Ailure> Java isn't slow though
10:56:44 <Kander> Peter: My new machine's AM2 and been happy with it. Very easy installation, even with extra fan and all.. but it all depends on what your needs are.
10:56:45 <Ailure> java VM can be a bit slow to start
10:56:52 <Ailure> but when you get it started, it usually runs quite smoothly
10:57:30 <Kander> My regards of Java have been totally demolished by a single poor teacher.. taught all the wrong habits.. :/
10:58:13 <Ailure> programming wise, only annoying thing is that it can be a bit nazi about some things that is possible (but potentionable dangerous) on other languages
10:58:36 <valhallasw> eclipse is eating up 200M atm :(
10:58:50 <MiHaMiX> valhallasw: yeah, that's why i dislike eclipse :)
10:58:55 <Kander> Any of you ever used the BlueJ IDE?
10:59:00 <valhallasw> but netbeans somehow seems slower
10:59:10 <Ailure> Netbeans take less memory than eclipse then
10:59:15 <valhallasw> and c++ is freaking me out atm
10:59:16 <MiHaMiX> i have 2 fav java ide: netbeans and intellijIdea
10:59:36 <MiHaMiX> though the latter is not free
11:00:09 <Ailure> that some things are done automtically done in netbeans
11:00:35 <Ailure> although is probably in other IDE's
11:00:48 <Ailure> I really hadn't compared them :p
11:00:58 <MiHaMiX> ok, end of lunchtime folks.. bye :)
11:00:59 <Kander> Are there still people who prefer programming in plain ol' notepad (or other non-graphical editors) ?
11:01:12 <MiHaMiX> Kander: I'm used to use gvim
11:01:31 <MiHaMiX> Kander: it's based on the good old vi :)
11:01:34 <Kander> I've seen and heard about vi(m)...
11:01:35 <Ailure> lack of colouring annoys me
11:01:35 <valhallasw> and sometimes mcedit
11:01:51 <Kander> not sure if I could get myself trained in using it.. one time I tried it I ran away screaming in panic
11:01:54 <MiHaMiX> valhallasw: mcedit sucks :)
11:02:07 <valhallasw> MiHaMiX: coloring and edit-paste *inside* mcedit is great
11:02:11 <Kander> Couldn't even close it properly...
11:02:20 <valhallasw> just copy-pasting outside it is a disaster
11:02:28 <MiHaMiX> valhallasw: hmm, that's ok, but i still dislike the editor features :)
11:02:35 <Kander> valhallasw: Point proven.
11:03:01 <valhallasw> ^kx is less logical for write-quit than :wq
11:03:37 <Kander> Clicking the little X button, then pressing 'Save' is more logical for write-quit then :wq... imho.
11:06:58 <valhallasw> 'x' button witout gui
11:07:39 <Kander> :) Which brings us to the overarcing prompt vs gui discussion?
11:07:53 <TrueBrain> now that was a nice lunch
11:08:31 <valhallasw> hey, you started about 'non-graphical editors'
11:08:38 <valhallasw> and notepad isnt one btw
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11:09:43 <Ailure> VI users are elitists?
11:10:18 <valhallasw> what the ... is happening :{
11:10:20 <Kander> Well, they've got all reason to be if they managed to figure out it's syntax.
11:11:59 <valhallasw> is there any reason why the 19th member (index 18) of an int array should act strangely?
11:13:00 <Rubidium> without context I wouldn't know
11:13:23 <valhallasw> acting like it doesn't keep it's value
11:13:39 <valhallasw> is set to 0, jumps to 2293196, 2292860, 2292524 etc
11:13:53 <Rubidium> buffer over/underflows!
11:14:45 <valhallasw> but then why does the 20th member (index 19) work perfectly fine?
11:15:44 <Rubidium> no idea, depends highly on the context
11:16:18 <valhallasw> it's a mess atm, sorry for that (because of the debugging etc ;))
11:16:51 <TrueBrain> we shouldn't be helping you with your homework :p
11:17:19 <valhallasw> the algorithm works perfectly fine
11:17:32 <valhallasw> but c++ is just a fscking stupid language that acts completely weird sometimes
11:18:00 <TrueBrain> lol, you do shit in tex, not bad :p
11:18:40 <TrueBrain> ah, that explains :)
11:19:12 <valhallasw> not like I care about the ECTS
11:19:26 <valhallasw> as they don't really count for anything :P
11:19:54 <valhallasw> CS ects don't count for physics I'm afraid ;)
11:20:10 <TrueBrain> push them to your second year, you need some variation courses
11:20:32 <valhallasw> algo is not one of the allowed ones ;)
11:20:50 <TrueBrain> then you should just enjoy it :p
11:21:17 <valhallasw> I'm still wondering who thought it should be 7 ects
11:22:17 <valhallasw> meh, I'll just redesign without the class and see what happens :P
11:22:48 <TrueBrain> it isn't the fastest way to do what you do :p
11:23:22 <valhallasw> but it was the fastest way to code it :P
11:24:02 <TrueBrain> you fucked up 'm' and 'n', so it looks
11:24:11 <TrueBrain> 'm' sometimes is your width, sometimes your height
11:24:24 <TrueBrain> return this->array + (this->m)*row; <- here it is your width
11:24:36 <TrueBrain> if ( x < 0 || x >= array.n || y < 0 || y >= array.m || array[x][y] != 0 ) <- here is it your height
11:24:53 <valhallasw> that's pretty stupid
11:24:54 <TrueBrain> change the this->m to this->n in the first, and it most likely doesn't overflow :p
11:25:02 <TrueBrain> short to say: USE BETTER NAMING!
11:25:15 <TrueBrain> rename 'm' to height, and 'n' to width
11:25:18 <valhallasw> don't change n and m while coding :p
11:25:20 <TrueBrain> and you would never made this mistake
11:25:31 <valhallasw> sais the ottd devver that uses *st *t *etc ;)
11:25:41 <TrueBrain> which can't be confused really :)
11:25:47 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: that if looks ok to me
11:26:03 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: the if is okay, but 'm' has an other function in the first copy/paste then in the second :)
11:26:15 <valhallasw> it should be height, but I changed the m and n in the constructor
11:26:33 <Rubidium> this->m * x + y (where y = 0 .. this->m - 1)
11:26:34 <TrueBrain> valhallasw: you can see that indeed :)
11:27:06 <TrueBrain> 'm' is height according to backtrace.cpp :p
11:27:43 <valhallasw> x/n = height, y/m = width
11:27:51 <valhallasw> y >= array.m <-- see
11:28:00 <TrueBrain> 'y' defines height, not? :)
11:28:10 <TrueBrain> haha, now that is confusing :p
11:28:52 <valhallasw> (3,1) in an array is 4th row 2nd column
11:29:08 <valhallasw> (3,1) most logically is x=3 y=1
11:29:13 <valhallasw> so x=height y=width
11:29:33 <TrueBrain> haha, nice try, but nah, still not logic :)
11:29:38 <TrueBrain> doesn't matter, as long as you udnerstand it
11:30:13 <valhallasw> 13:29 < TrueBrain> doesn't matter, as long as it works and jlaros understands it <-- fix
11:30:24 <TrueBrain> hehe, good enough for me :p
11:31:10 <TrueBrain> anyway, back to OpenTTD :p
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11:44:56 <Scarzzurs> I've made a suggestion in the suggestion forum, but i fear that i might have been to fast to change website as the post isn't there. Should i repost or is there some kind of delay on posts?
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12:41:45 * Kander wonders if GLX will show up...
12:43:47 <TrueBrain> as long as I know him, he never missed a day :)
12:44:17 <Kander> Alright *sits patiently in his corner, and continues fiddling with MinGW..*
12:45:03 <TrueBrain> I really hope mingw isn't a synonym for something you do in the corner
12:49:36 <Kander> Is there a functional difference between openttd.org and openttd.com?
12:49:50 <TrueBrain> .com is 100% alias of .org
12:49:54 <TrueBrain> and we advise everyone to use .org
12:49:57 <Kander> Redirects at the DNS level?
12:50:09 <TrueBrain> no redirect, it is really an alias
12:50:26 <TrueBrain> on http, mail, svn and all levels :)
12:51:00 <Kander> Great - was just wondering, since the get latest openttd.sh script points to .com while I was only used to seeing .org
12:51:30 <TrueBrain> it should use .org :p
12:52:14 <Kander> Then write a new one - and while you're at it, check why it didn't work for me :P
12:53:34 <Kander> Argh. I keep getting the same error message.. and know I must be doing something wrong, but can't seem to figure out what it is..
13:00:03 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9565 /trunk/src/ (console_cmds.cpp settings.cpp settings.h): -Feature: Add list_patches console command. This shows all patches along with their current values. Based on patch by madman2003/GrimRC.
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13:34:56 <Scarzzurs> [13:44] <Scarzzurs> Lo :-)
13:34:56 <Scarzzurs> [13:45] <Scarzzurs> I've made a suggestion in the suggestion forum, but i fear that i might have been to fast to change website as the post isn't there. Should i repost or is there some kind of delay on posts?
13:38:16 <Belugas> or maybe program it yourself ? :P
13:38:24 <Belugas> you should try to refresh or repost
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18:07:56 <Belugas> oups... missed my lunch time by far...
18:08:17 <Belugas> damn ottd code during work hours :P
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19:13:15 <UndernotBuilder> Me can't wait for newcargos/newindustries :P
19:13:53 * Belugas thinks UndernotBuilder will have to wait for still a long time :S
19:14:05 * Belugas is sorry for the pain UndernotBuilder will endure
19:14:49 <Belugas> if you want to help, give me the resolver for industry and industry tile!
19:15:05 <Belugas> before it do it myself :S
19:15:33 <bubersson> logging is not working anymore??
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19:16:01 <Noldo> bubersson: the bottish person is missing
19:16:36 <UndernotBuilder> maybe I need a book for learning C for lazy people? :)
19:20:09 <Belugas> would be a bit more usefull if it was C++, but we're niot fully C++ yet...
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19:21:53 <Noldo> Belugas: what do you mean by a resolver?
19:24:34 <Belugas> look in newgrf_town.cpp
19:24:41 <Belugas> function TownGetVariable
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19:24:57 <Belugas> this is a part of the resolver for houses
19:25:06 <Belugas> same have to be done for indstries
19:30:24 <Belugas> right now, i'm working on decoupling industry_gui.cpp and smallmap_gui.cpp form hardcoded colors/strings guis and use the values stored in the industry specs
19:37:58 <DebolazX> Anybody got any good books to recommend?
19:38:01 * DebolazX is on a shopping spree.
19:38:06 <DebolazX> Of the technical kind.
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19:51:26 <Ailure[apt]> using tightVNC instead of actually installing a own IRC client is... intresting :)
19:52:26 <Belugas> DebolazX, go to a library, close your eyes, and pick any book, until it is a technical one ;)
19:53:23 <DebolazX> I could be using that time to make an MMORPG instead. :-P
19:54:23 <Noldo> Belugas: I supose you have the structure that is goint to contain the industry information somewhere?
19:54:39 <Rubidium> DebolazX: "Implementing NewGRF for OTTD for dummies"?
19:57:14 <Belugas> well... yes and no, Noldo. Each GetxVariable will be on its own file, wioth the same signature
19:57:28 <Belugas> all the cases will have to address the requirement
19:57:42 <Belugas> that each variable needs
19:58:39 <Belugas> then, it will be a matter of gathering that stuff in a stuff like
19:59:40 <Noldo> so the data is stored there somewhere, but it needs to have a interface like that one?
19:59:58 <Belugas> the data is everywhere in the game
20:00:24 <Belugas> it's just that each resolver will have to provide the data that is required
20:01:31 <Belugas> exemple : Animation stage of nearby tiles (63)
20:01:44 <Belugas> right now, thereis no anumation stage for industries
20:01:59 <Belugas> means i have to implrment that with a new tile assignment
20:02:07 <Belugas> and a new map accessor for it
20:02:18 <Belugas> Distance of nearest industry with given type (64)
20:02:19 <Digitalfox[Home]> Bjarni: Are you thinking of adding reffitable cargo options to Autoreplace?? For example with buses of George V4, most of buses have some reffitable cargo, that makes them have more passangers and right now i have to make it all manually.. I love Autoreplace so it would be great if you or other dev could implement this :)
20:02:47 <Belugas> haa... easier... this one is just a matter of calling the right function in ottd to get the answer
20:03:22 <Belugas> tons of stuff to collect, tons of pure fun and joy
20:03:23 <Noldo> is there going to be a function lice uint32 IndustryGetVariable(byre variable,/*stuff*/, Industry *i) ?
20:04:17 <Noldo> which part of the game needs that interface?
20:05:13 <Noldo> and it has to use those odd variable addresses/nubmers ?
20:07:25 <peter1138> could enumify them.. heh
20:12:16 <Noldo> so a guestion like bool CanDeleteHouse(TileIndex tile)
20:13:55 <Noldo> is first translated to the language that the newhouses language and then there is very interesting structure that finds the infromation from everywhere in the game
20:14:47 <peter1138> just be thankful it's changed from the original stuff
20:14:57 <peter1138> which assumed that only vehicles existed
20:17:47 <Belugas> MaybeNewIndustry is fucked up
20:18:11 <Belugas> Noldo, it's a bit like that yeah
20:19:07 <Belugas> i thimk it is easier using plain numbers
20:20:16 <Noldo> could typecast be used to make sure it won't mix with other byte's or is that against coding policy
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20:22:13 <Belugas> anything that serves the Grand Purpose is good
20:22:19 <Belugas> apart from goto... i hate gotos
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20:29:30 <Maedhros> Belugas: how far have you got with the industry resolvers?
20:29:36 <Noldo> I really don't understand why the varibles have those address numbers instead of meaningfull names or accessors that have meaningfull names
20:30:36 <Belugas> Maedhros : like... 0% ;)
20:30:49 <Maedhros> Noldo: because that's how the ttdpatch guys wrote the spec ;)
20:30:58 <Belugas> Noldo : don't forget that the spec comes from the ttdpacth
20:31:19 <Noldo> but isn't the spec for storing the data?
20:31:23 <Belugas> i started to take a deep look at it though
20:31:24 <DaleStan> Noldo: Because meaningful names take too long for computers to process.
20:32:23 <Belugas> there is one aspect of the spce that really got me worried though.. the part that askes for closest distance from dryland/sea tile
20:32:30 <Belugas> looks like quite cpu intensive
20:34:14 <Belugas> i really do think we should have some sort of structure that could tell us that land starts ROUGHLY at x,y on four corners
20:34:16 <hylje> shouldnt be too bad unless it involves updating every industry tile when someone terraforms
20:37:18 <DaleStan> Actually, scratch that. It's industries, not industry tiles, and it's only accessible in callback 28.
20:38:35 <DaleStan> So CPU time required shouldn't be a major issue, since CB 28 is only called when attempting to construct an industry.
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20:39:27 <Wolf01> that was the start... now the bugfix patches :D
20:39:43 <MeusH> what bugs do you fix? :)
20:40:08 <Wolf01> not so many bugfixes, but since the applied patch was 4 months old than my latest
20:40:25 <Wolf01> i have some optimizations and little fixes
20:40:55 <Belugas> DaleStan, i'm a bit worried because of the big maps
20:41:08 <Belugas> they will suck a lot of juice, i fear
20:41:27 <peter1138> bah, people running big maps have big cpus ;p
20:41:51 <Belugas> already, the random generation of oil rig and oil refinery are really hugs, because of the immensity of those maps
20:42:04 <Belugas> peter1138, that is why you have to buy a new one ;)
20:42:14 <DaleStan> I don't know how reasonable this is, but it might be possible to scan the map in a vaguely circular path from the industry's north tile.
20:43:29 <Belugas> true, could be done that way, DaleStan
20:43:31 <hylje> i'd still avoid map-wide stuff
20:43:53 <Belugas> the steps of the search could be wider then just one tile each
20:44:03 <hylje> and stop the search at a certain distance?
20:44:23 <hylje> what if the map is a landmass with no lakes
20:44:24 <Belugas> unitl it reaches end of map, or sea, depensing of the search
20:44:38 <Belugas> you have sea on each border ;)
20:44:51 <hylje> hence it would scan most of the map
20:47:33 <Belugas> locked in my office ;)
20:47:54 <Belugas> all that i know is that it compiles heheh
20:48:23 <Belugas> logically, it should work
20:49:02 <peter1138> messing up words...
20:50:42 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: maedhros * r9566 /trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Fix (r9315): Set the SVN properties on some files.
20:52:01 <Belugas> problem is that with the appearing chances stuff, i completely lost the reference of the industry id
20:52:16 <Belugas> so, the array was filled with probabilities,
20:52:41 <Belugas> the position was not the industry id, just...
20:53:09 <Belugas> but kept on a member of its own
20:53:23 <Belugas> not pretty, but it holds the road
20:55:14 <Belugas> the other solution, which i just though of, is to increment the num on each pass, even if appearing chance is null
20:55:25 <Belugas> that way, the offset is really the industry id one
20:55:37 <Belugas> don't know which solution is cleaner
20:59:16 <Noldo> hey whats in newgrf_callbacks.h
21:00:13 <Maedhros> enums for callback ids and which bits will be set in various variables to say they should be used
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21:03:09 <Noldo> do those have something to do with the things we talked about earlier?
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21:10:50 <Belugas> a mix of both ways :)
21:11:11 <Belugas> i wanted to avoid the other array
21:11:50 <Maedhros> btw, how many possible industry ids are there?
21:12:53 <Belugas> it_end for now, but i hope tomake it bigger
21:13:56 <Maedhros> ok, so a uint16 will definitely be enough for cumulative_probs :)
21:22:20 <Belugas> i knew it sound familiar!
21:22:23 <Belugas> HouseID houses[HOUSE_MAX];
21:23:17 <Belugas> i'll fix the 718 tonigh
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