IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2026-03-09
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02:10:19 <keimfrei> Hola, short question. When i join a new server and create a new company. i have no chance to safe my company with an password.
02:10:32 <keimfrei> i see no padlock at my company
02:13:53 <emperorjake> Company passwords have been removed in 15.0
02:14:28 <emperorjake> It's been replaced by an invite system
02:16:37 <keimfrei> but i was on an public server with 10 companys and everyone got an pw
02:16:47 <keimfrei> is that by the invitessystem?
02:22:25 <Zathras_11> right, keimfrei. in the Online Players menu click on the green icon of a player to invite them to participate in your company
02:25:55 <Zathras_11> the cretentials to that are saved in secrets.cfg
02:26:57 <Zathras_11> which you can copy if you try to connect to that online game from more than one device.
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07:25:30 <DorpsGek> - Add: summary for week 10 of 2026 (by OpenTTD Survey)
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10:48:57 <peter1138> The lock is probably a bit of a confusing icon to use now.
10:54:40 <peter1138> Hmm, no zephyris to ping :)
10:54:50 <peter1138> Something that means "you don't have access" instead?
10:55:22 <peter1138> Or perhaps reversing to "you do have access" is tidier.
11:02:13 <peter1138> I think I'll give unit-testing an authenticated web-api a miss for now :o
11:18:12 <ahyangyi> A symbol like "β" might work?
12:31:33 <peter1138> Ah, the AI-upscaled images have been... er... left as is.
12:36:30 <eed_edward> AI images are the best part of that
12:38:50 <locosage> there is no particular reason to use any icon now
12:38:59 <locosage> it's not like there are public companies
12:39:46 <locosage> and even if they're added it's probably better to mark them with a special instead
12:43:29 <peter1138> What's "a special instead"
12:43:57 <mmtunligit> was edited but ofc you cant see that
12:44:18 <peter1138> 10:55 <@peter1138> Or perhaps reversing to "you do have access" is tidier.
12:44:43 <peter1138> As currently the "special icon" is the lock :)
12:52:35 <andythenorth> was it naptime yet?
12:53:25 <andythenorth> I lost the game again :|
12:54:50 <goddess_ishtar> locosage: there probably should be the option
12:55:30 <andythenorth> says "FIRS" but that could have been fixed
12:55:34 <andythenorth> by Claude or not
12:56:30 <andythenorth> I think the dude has spent weeks *manually* writing down all the AXIS industries and cargos
12:56:45 <andythenorth> then got the robot to make a bad website from those instructions :|
12:56:59 <andythenorth> this makes me unreasonably, stupidly sad
12:57:07 <goddess_ishtar> andythenorth: bold of you to assume that he didn't use AI from start to finish
12:58:23 <goddess_ishtar> but yeah automatic docs from the .toml industry definitions are on my (unreasonably long) to-do list
13:01:47 <ahyangyi> goddess_ishtar: Well, that's what he claimed in the forum post
13:05:22 <goddess_ishtar> you have no idea how much effort it took to write 4 sentences of LLM prompts
13:13:13 <ahyangyi> Does puzzle me, they could have prompted am llm to write that prompt π
13:15:56 <goddess_ishtar> oh, god, their forum comments have that too-bright LLM tone too
13:15:57 <goddess_ishtar> > Thanks for the feedback. I appreciate the detailed response, even if I have to admit it surprised me a little. I've spent several weeks on this project, putting a lot of time and effort into every detail, so a reaction like that is something you have to digest first. That said, you're right on several points, and I've already started addressing them.
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13:18:19 <telumendur> Although that might just be their way of dealing with the language barrier: I gathered that they're german.
13:18:39 <goddess_ishtar> also all of the classic indicators (excessive sets of three, "it's not an X, it's a Y")
13:19:46 <LordAro> the upscaled images are very amusing
13:20:09 <goddess_ishtar> telumendur: I don't find that excuse very compelling, given how prominent and capable machine translation has been for a while now
13:20:11 <LordAro> even industry aside, the grid lines still don't line up
13:20:42 <LordAro> i do like the overall design though
13:21:05 <ahyangyi> LLM translations are (un?)surprisingly unreliable when the text being translated itself looks like a prompt though
13:27:48 <goddess_ishtar> the industry categories are a nice idea
13:28:05 <goddess_ishtar> that's one good thing out of this heap of slop
13:29:14 <goddess_ishtar> oh, the website is simply broken on mobile and the sidebar takes up most of the screen and doesn't retract
13:29:22 <goddess_ishtar> so much for responsive design
13:35:53 <peter1138> Well, I have a patch that 'improves' the in game industry chain window.
13:36:45 <goddess_ishtar> you have a screenshot?
13:37:03 <peter1138> Relies a bit too much on colour though, and without a legend that's not all that useful.
13:37:49 <goddess_ishtar> for me the point of having an external website is to have a reference for the chains when you're not actively playing, so "I just use the in-game view" isn't terribly useful
13:38:23 <goddess_ishtar> so there is a niche for external AXIS documentation, just not... this
13:39:17 <peter1138> Is there all that much reason to reference it if you're not in game?
13:39:34 <peter1138> That also doesn't preclude making the in-game window better.
13:40:15 <goddess_ishtar> that wasn't a counterargument
13:40:23 <goddess_ishtar> we were talking about the LLM site
13:40:42 <goddess_ishtar> I think the industry chain view in game does need improvement regardless
13:40:55 <goddess_ishtar> (it's functional but a bit barebones)
13:41:28 <eed_edward> SHould be higher tolerance for missclick, I mean bigger 'click areas'
13:42:38 <eed_edward> or maybe I should buy better mouse
13:44:23 <goddess_ishtar> goddess_ishtar: to be clear, I think the patch is a good idea, it's *the AXIS website specifically* I think isn't good
13:56:32 <ahyangyi> goddess_ishtar: Indeed
13:58:43 <ahyangyi> I do think it builds upon two existing ideas,
13:58:43 <ahyangyi> 1. the vanilla distinction of primary, secondary and tertiary industries
13:58:43 <ahyangyi> 2. the ECS breakdown of different parts of the supply chain into different "vectors"
13:59:44 <ahyangyi> but i don't have much experience with complex economies π
14:00:02 <goddess_ishtar> the ECS paradigm of vectors you can easily enable and disable individually is quite interesting
14:00:27 <goddess_ishtar> I considered it, but ultimately it would make it difficult to properly interleave the different chains in the economy
14:01:58 <goddess_ishtar> having them as separate GRFs is a pain in the ass though
14:05:50 <goddess_ishtar> goddess_ishtar: I still have the classifications, though, for ITI-style map quadrants
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14:22:39 <jfkuayue> goddess_ishtar: some Machine translation software still translate "nail infection" into "inflammation"...
14:25:00 <_glx_> well the infection causes an inflammation
14:28:23 <jfkuayue> doesn't inflammation mean fire or something
14:29:16 <rito12_51026> ignition and inflammation translate the same into polish
14:29:36 <jfkuayue> At least the medical staff was confused when I showed "nail groove inflammation" to them
14:29:52 <peter1138> inflammation refers to the body's immune system response to, uh, things like infections.
14:30:26 <peter1138> So yeah, it's not the same thing as an infection, but also it's not literally fire.
14:31:49 <LordAro> that's not even the confusing one
14:32:03 <LordAro> unlike inflammable and flammable
14:33:05 <goddess_ishtar> flannable (able to be turned into flannel)
14:33:29 <jfkuayue> also, Povidone-iodine is not available.
14:40:00 <_glx_> commercial name is betadine in france
15:06:37 <goddess_ishtar> rito12_51026: apparently English "inflammation" comes from Latin *inflammatio*, which has both meanings
15:06:48 <goddess_ishtar> but yeah "inflammation" has nothing to do with fire
15:06:58 <goddess_ishtar> classic English etymological trap
15:07:39 <LordAro> English is actually 3 languages in a trenchcoat
15:09:11 <goddess_ishtar> it jumps other languages late at night in a dark alleyway and rifles through their pockets for loose grammar
15:16:15 <ahyangyi> I don't need to be in a formation to get information either π
15:21:32 <rito12_51026> Why grfcodec sometimes writes labels with use of ASCII values in hex instead of letters surrounded with "" like in other places?
15:29:03 <rito12_51026> yeah, right, Why does...?
15:29:58 <peter1138> Usually because grfcodec is just guessing if something looks like a string or not.
15:32:40 <rito12_51026> Is it guessing by length?
15:32:57 <peter1138> You should check out the grfcodec source code some time.
15:32:59 <peter1138> I think you'll love it.
15:33:24 <goddess_ishtar> peter1138: fcvo?
15:33:34 <peter1138> Oh, whoops. fcvo = for certain values of.
16:22:26 <_glx_> oh yes the lovely mix of coding styles
16:23:49 <goddess_ishtar> there are no consistency errors, just happy little accidents
16:24:26 <peter1138> Hmm, I have a couple of chnages sitting around since December.
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17:21:18 <jfkuayue> is it lordaros or lordaroes
17:49:15 <goddess_ishtar> squirejames: surely that would be Les Orde Arreaux in the plural?
17:49:32 <goddess_ishtar> my French is pretty rusty, though
17:53:17 <squirejames> Because you're worth it
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18:38:34 <jfkuayue> french pronunciation seems more⦠unpredictable
18:39:48 <vondpc> compared to english? π
18:42:30 <peter1138> French numbers are unpredictable.
18:52:41 <ahyangyi> fourscore and fourteen
19:41:45 <andythenorth> "must not reply about AXIS docs"
20:08:46 <goddess_ishtar> is this the "bitching about big problems you've mostly invented for yourself" channel
20:10:37 <goddess_ishtar> I am doing increasing mental gymnastics to avoid having to represent NML features as Python objects
20:15:37 <andythenorth> write a compile :P
20:16:48 <goddess_ishtar> it feels weird to represent features in a format they're not actually running in
20:16:56 <goddess_ishtar> like. OpenTTD doesn't read Python
20:17:05 <andythenorth> code generation is valid
20:17:28 <goddess_ishtar> but it would simplify rendering, I just need to call the `.render()` method on each individual industry object
20:17:36 <andythenorth> you've read FIRS? :P
20:17:52 <goddess_ishtar> (where I can do my own preprocessing before passing it to Jinja)
20:18:08 <goddess_ishtar> andythenorth: frankly I have no idea how the FIRS compile works
20:18:16 <goddess_ishtar> I'm just doing my own thing which seems to be converging
20:20:40 <goddess_ishtar> bwhahahahahaha
20:20:47 <goddess_ishtar> yeah that's basically what I was planning lmao
20:31:02 <goddess_ishtar> goddess_ishtar: the tricky shit is specifically industry graphics definitions
20:32:02 <goddess_ishtar> I wanted to define "industry buildings" as a separate layer of abstraction between spritelayouts and industry tilelayouts
20:35:54 <goddess_ishtar> (groups of spritelayouts which always appear in a fixed relative position to each other)
20:36:45 <goddess_ishtar> so layouts are a collection of buildings which are a collection of spritelayouts which are a collection of realsprites
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20:50:48 <andythenorth> you can be the next FIRS :P
20:54:36 <goddess_ishtar> don't worry, I don't have any intention of going for your throne ~~yet, anyway~~
21:19:10 <andythenorth> grfcodec: not dead
21:26:01 <eed_edward> " For format 1 GRFs, a four byte checksum follows. The algorithm to calculate it is unknown, but it is never processed by the game anyway."
21:29:06 <goddess_ishtar> ladies and gentlemen, GRF technical debt at its finest
21:51:08 <squirejames> Is this a NewGRF "load bearing pineapple" ?
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22:09:16 <telumendur> goddess_ishtar: Late to the party, but I'm french, so I thought I'd chime in: it would/could be *L'Orde Arreau* in the singular, and *Les Ordes Arreaux* in the plural. What "Orde" and "Arreau" might mean is another question entirely ^^
22:10:16 <goddess_ishtar> telumendur: yeah I haven't touched French since high school, so I'm pretty atrocious with it :p
22:39:42 <ahyangyi> eed_edward: If it's not checked, why do we call it a "checksum"?
23:04:29 <locosage> goddess_ishtar: Hah, that's exactly how I (partially) did it in grf-py.
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23:43:08 <peter1138> Hm, keep existing style or slowly not care...
continue to next day β΅
