IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2024-02-13
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07:10:34 <rau117> Subsidy... how about making subsidies more useful? For example, give the distance not at “2 neighboring cities 10 tiles apart”, but something further away, say ~500 or 1/4 of map size, so that it makes sense to spend time on this
07:10:34 <rau117> in some ways it could become something like an unobtrusive cargo-DEST
07:16:32 <locosage> main question here is useful for what
07:16:39 <locosage> game is absolutely fine without subsidies
07:23:21 <rau117> Getting +300% profit on a solid 500 tile route can be quite useful, especially early in the game. It will also be more “competitive” than the current option. Nobody even wants to pay attention to the current subsidies, let alone “compete”.
07:23:36 <LordAro> is it not doing that already?
07:23:42 <LordAro> the limit certainly isn't "10"
07:28:39 <rau117> 10 tiles just to enhance the effect of futility.
07:28:39 <rau117> For example, In the current game 2k x 2k I have something very sad like this route available.
07:30:22 <LordAro> taking the minimum distance available is disingenuous
07:30:30 <LordAro> what's the average? what does the code actually say?
07:31:51 <rau117> Just checked, every subsity has a distance of 50-60 tiles
07:33:10 <LordAro> `SUBSIDY_MAX_DISTANCE = 70;`
07:34:01 <LordAro> it does feel like something that should be scaled by map size though
07:38:36 <LordAro> on the other hand, the whole point of subsidies (in the real world) is to incentivise companies to create routes that are not as economically viable as other (longer) routes - e.g. connecting local villages together
07:38:52 <peter1138[d]> I was just about to write this 🙂
07:45:33 <rau117> Anyway, not so many people use subsidies (from my multiplayer experience). Even x4 profit is not always worth it, especially when the subsidy is temporary.
07:45:33 <rau117> Even though long subsidies will lose realism, they will at least be more interesting from the perspective of the game itself.
07:48:54 <jfs> Honestly, I'm really wondering if having the version 14 beta and the title screen competition threads on tt-forums as "announcements" is a disservice, and causing people to miss them. I think they would be more visible if they were regular sticky threads instead.
07:50:58 <rau117> Hmm… yeah, it’s worth making an announcement on reddit. Forums are useful… but not for a wide audience.
07:53:07 <LordAro> sticky threads where?
07:53:49 <locosage> rau117: hands to hands competition doesn't work well in openttd, it's better to have the opposite situation where companies are spread across the map instead of fighting for a few subsidies, especially early game where losers are just eliminated from the game since they have no money to build anything else
07:58:58 <rau117> . . . although about “competition”, it would be very good at the game level to prohibit taking cargo from “taken” industry.
07:58:58 <rau117> The same «primary (stealing) competition». On paper it sounds not so bad – you need to increase station rating to get more but… in fact, a noob with 10 trucks can very unpleasantly take away ~50% of the income from a long-developed 2k coal mine.
07:59:25 <peter1138[d]> You can use a game script to do that.
08:00:11 <peter1138[d]> Mythical cargo dest would also help 😄
08:00:45 <rau117> But it must be done first. _After all, it would also be possible to use scripts for the recently added infi-money mode_
08:01:10 <peter1138[d]> And you could have done.
08:02:15 <peter1138[d]> I am fundamentally opposed to this idea that transporting cargo... the entire premise of the game... is considered stealing just because it's competing with another company.
08:04:34 <locosage> it's considered stealing because it's no fun
08:09:36 <locosage> it's not stealing of cargo that is the problem but stealing the work to produce it
08:10:07 <locosage> competition on primary industries in frozen economy is totally fine because no effort was put into it
08:11:43 <locosage> well, until that competition is used as way to sabotage the opponent
08:12:06 <locosage> then it's just elaborate blocking
08:14:51 <rau117> Hmm… I don't 100% on frozen. Even in a frozen economy, just one unfortunate troll who was allowed to take primary resources can take away 50% of the entire production chain,
08:14:51 <rau117> It may not be so noticeable from one industry, but copying mini-stations in all your mines is not such a difficult task.
08:14:51 <rau117> On “hard” servers, such a joke could mean the end of the company no matter how much work was put into it
08:16:34 <locosage> yeah, that's why citymania has a more complex rule that competition is allowed but only to achieve game goal
08:16:35 <rau117> Yes... you can do a lot with scripts. But compare how easy it has become to open your own server now, and how difficult it will be to write a script that blocks “competition on resources”.
08:18:07 <rau117> rau117: ** for those who just want to play peacefully without going into custom programmable things
08:18:25 <reldred> don't play open lobbies with shitters?
08:18:44 <reldred> like 99% of these problems sound more like problems of more server management
08:19:28 <locosage> openttd isn't a competitive game and it takes a lot of effort to make it one. just competition alone won't solve the issue and there is no one size fits all solution anyway, desired rules depend on the game mode.
08:19:35 <reldred> can't really code the game to enforce for what is essentially an ever shifting set of 'customary' practices that differ from admin to admin, player to player
08:19:49 <locosage> like what's the point of preventing competition in cb when opponent can just bomb your city?
08:19:57 <locosage> and that's not even something you can stop with script
08:21:30 <rau117> reldred: Bad excuse. Finding a good company for a game can be more difficult than writing such a script.
08:21:48 <andythenorth> multiplayer, but we up the disaster rate
08:24:28 <peter1138[d]> I recommend playing single player with no AI if you want no competition.
08:25:38 <reldred> or play on co-operative servers
08:26:30 <locosage> ai competition is fine, you can always bully them in return xD
08:26:31 <rau117> Competition can be different. Although “targeted «destruction» of resources” cannot be called fair competition.
08:26:31 <rau117> It would be much more competitive if the industries had individual resource values for each player.
08:26:31 <rau117> For me this is 2k, for a beginner it is only 72 units of resource.
08:28:00 <rau117> *It’s one thing to compete globally in “who can make the most money in 24 hours”; it’s another thing to ~~fight~~ compete in one mine that you’ve been developing since the beginning of the game.*
08:30:12 <locosage> it's very hard to define "targeted destruction" algorithmically
08:30:31 <locosage> like they could transport it 3 tiles but deliver into factory that produces goods for their town
08:32:46 <locosage> on citymania it's up to a moderator to decide fairness of competition and I've seen quite some tricky cases over the years
08:33:12 <locosage> though automatic exclusivity on secondaries solve the most common issues
08:43:25 <peter1138[d]> Coffee running out 😦
08:53:41 <rau117> locosage: //not “targeted destruction”, but rather “taking resources away from you to annoy and reduce your income”//
08:54:03 <andythenorth> peter1138[d]: not even had any yet 😐
08:54:23 <andythenorth> is it the bi-annual discussion of MP?
08:54:31 <LordAro> competition / government meddling
08:54:39 <peter1138[d]> Each player gets their own section of the map to play in.
08:54:41 <andythenorth> TL;DR play NoCarGoal with friends, end of message
08:54:47 <peter1138[d]> Because everyone hates competition, it will be the only game mode.
08:55:32 <LordAro> OTTD isn't really the place to discuss the advantages & disadvantages of the structure of the world's economy
08:56:57 <rau117> Another option is to make resource production individual for each company. Not so logical/realistic, but it will take away that “not-quite-fair” side of competition
09:01:30 <LordAro> that's a funny way of spelling "all competition"
09:02:02 <LordAro> i'm increasingly convinced you're just a troll that's trying to trick us into making fundamentally broken changes
09:02:20 <LordAro> go away and read a book on game design
09:06:04 <peter1138[d]> And all I did was add some icons :p
09:16:53 <peter1138[d]> Maybe I should go to a coffee shop to do some work
09:45:34 <_zephyris> Go to a workshop to do some coffee
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10:51:07 <aviationgamerx> where are the last 4 options?
10:51:31 <aviationgamerx> this is for translating, not sure if this is the right channel
10:51:43 <reldred> It's grf/script developer options
10:51:50 <reldred> they're enabled with some console commands
10:52:10 <reldred> they allow cheeky boys and girls to poke around the games innards
10:52:44 <reldred> they put some additional buttons on the tops of windows as well to access additional debug views, etc.
10:52:45 <aviationgamerx> ight nice, but it ain't easy to translate some terms without context cause there is no direct word for it
10:52:57 <emperorjake> They're under the :Questionmark: button when newgrf_developer_tools is enabled
10:53:00 <aviationgamerx> what exactly does it refer to
10:53:20 <aviationgamerx> emperorjake: ight nice
10:53:28 <emperorjake> Widgets are components of the UI
10:54:18 <aviationgamerx> as in everything you see, or windows that are open on the screen?
10:54:32 <reldred> some terms aren't necesarily 'english' words, they're made up words used in computer science, your language might have an appropriate analogue to it, it may not.
10:54:42 <reldred> buttons, scroll bar ends, etc.
10:54:49 <reldred> all the individual little 'bits' of a UI
10:54:55 <emperorjake> Here's what it looks like when widget outlines are enabled
10:55:12 <aviationgamerx> ohhh alright that helps a lot thanks
10:55:12 <reldred> damnit jake you beat me to it
10:56:55 <aviationgamerx> reldred: ye that's something that makes translating harder, sometimes best I can do is leave it as english to not mess it up
10:56:59 <emperorjake> All the debug options enabled is quite a sight
10:57:30 <aviationgamerx> emperorjake: woah, it's like an xray, or an engineer's blueprint on autocad
10:58:33 <aviationgamerx> emperorjake: how do you enable it?
10:58:36 <reldred> aviationgamerx: Yup. At least with a bunch of that stuff they're normally hidden from users, and the users enabling them are generally reading the newgrf wiki which is in english anyway, so having consistent terminology probably helps at that point.
10:58:58 <emperorjake> Open console and type `set newgrf_developer_tools 1`
10:59:31 <aviationgamerx> reldred: not just that, some things like the word "newGRF" is better left as it is, can't translate that
10:59:47 <aviationgamerx> emperorjake: ight nice thx
11:00:57 <aviationgamerx> the dirty blocks option is interesting
11:01:48 <reldred> Yeah I know some languages like french have an overseeing body that will come up with a specifically 'french' translation for every single word no matter how niche it is, but a lot of other languages don't bother, and then for domain specific technical terminology or acronyms it's probably better to not touch it at all.
11:02:43 <reldred> GRF for an example is an acronym that Chris Sawyer from the original Transport Tycoon came up with. It's in file headers but noone outside of him knows the actual canonical meaning of it.
11:03:05 <reldred> we can assume it stands for GRaphics Format but nobody really knows.
11:03:50 <peter1138[d]> I hate bikes... another spoke snapped on a sturdy stick last night...
11:05:34 <reldred> Should get a car, peter, they're great.
11:06:10 <aviationgamerx> reldred: yeah, I can tell you that computer terminology, especially when it comes to gaming, doesn't have a confirmed translation to any of it, u will almost always find another wording in each game, or maybe they do but isn't easy to find
11:06:13 <peter1138[d]> I'd break the spokes on that too.
11:31:07 <aviationgamerx> where can I find the linkgraph?
11:33:29 <reldred> I've got cargodist turned off for cargo atm so not all of those tooltips (the descriptions that pop up on hover) are relevent to me atm
11:34:51 <reldred> You have to hover very precisely over the little squares that are at the vertices (nodes) of the linkgraph lines
11:36:27 <emperorjake> I thought that's a JGRPP feature
11:39:18 <aviationgamerx> reldred: alright thanks
11:41:01 <peter1138[d]> Quite some AIs assume that mail exists.
11:41:39 <_jgr_> reldred: You can however anywhere over the line
11:42:09 <reldred> I was struggling trying to not get the general station tooltip lmao
11:42:18 <aviationgamerx> I have never seen this tool, seems pretty useful, I didn't even know there were options under the map button
11:50:32 <peter1138[d]> Hmm, probably enough spamming of the AI forum for now.
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12:49:32 <keseliman> so i am asking this since unbunch is a new feature
12:49:52 <keseliman> Will this unbunch command also take place in dat depot?
12:50:07 <keseliman> Or it will unbunch then service at the depot?
12:53:54 <merni> This isn't a command but a status displayed in the vehicle window
12:54:08 <merni> (similar to "Heading to Sirkeci, 50 km/h")
12:54:21 <merni> But all unbunch commands take place in depots
13:08:28 <Flygon> I assumed it was General Resource Format
13:08:39 <Flygon> But I think that's just what the Ragnarok Online scene assumed .grf meant
13:10:08 <locosage> is it using the same format?
13:10:26 <Flygon> But the .grf files for that game stored *literally everything*.
13:10:32 <Flygon> Hence everyone assuming it meant generazl.
13:11:25 <keseliman> merni: Yeah totally got it thanks ❤️
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13:12:50 <teun3908> so i just thought this
13:13:06 <teun3908> in the content download menu
13:13:14 <teun3908> have a button to show only selected items
13:17:07 <keseliman> merni: I want to ask one more translation question as i am new to this codes mostly I copy from base text
13:17:33 <keseliman> {BLACK}Servicing interval: {LTBLUE}{COMMA}{NBSP}days{BLACK} {STRING} the original is this
13:17:45 <LordAro> there's many things that could be improved about the content download window
13:18:10 <keseliman> so if I do {BLACK}Bakım aralığı:{BLACK} {STRING} {LTBLUE}{COMMA}{NBSP}gün will it work will it display as "5 gün" or do i break it
13:19:39 <_glx_> you can reorder using {1:STRING} and {0:COMMA}
13:20:24 <_glx_> else translator tool will reject the translation
13:21:25 <keseliman> {BLACK}Bakım aralığı:{BLACK} {STRING} {COMMA} {LTBLUE}{NBSP} gün
13:21:57 <_glx_> will still need 1: and 0: here
13:22:50 <keseliman> ah thank you i'll check the guide
13:23:31 <_glx_> order of the commands is important, but it can be modified using the correct syntax
13:23:41 <keseliman> ah i thought comma is literally ","
13:23:44 <keseliman> it means the number
13:24:14 <keseliman> Then if i do the string order wrong the systom blocks me right so i cannot do something to break ti
13:24:34 <_glx_> the tool validates the string yes
13:24:59 <keseliman> cool thanks i'll experiment a little bit if necessary
13:39:34 <xarick> that was a strange stall
13:40:07 <xarick> I don't think I can trust these numbers fully
13:44:42 <xarick> 12080 adds the widgets, but not the functionality
13:54:30 <talltyler> Ah, I was wondering what was needed 🙂
13:56:37 <keseliman> I don't think this is happening because of something i did
13:57:15 <keseliman> I click copy base and edit
13:57:36 <_glx_> the {P} format for your language might need different arguments
13:58:33 <_glx_> I think there are details lower on the page
13:59:17 <keseliman> the whole page is like this
13:59:52 <merni> (sorry I can't type the i without dot)
14:00:31 <keseliman> no worries but it should be yıllar but still denies {NUM}{NBSP}yıl{P "" lar}
14:02:38 <_jgr_> For Turkish you need to use just {P "lar"}
14:03:55 <keseliman> the english being outside of "" confused me i think that seems to be an error no ?
14:04:13 <_jgr_> The number of different plural forms is different for each language
14:04:51 <keseliman> shouldn't english be {P "s"} instead of {P "" s}
14:05:02 <merni> keseliman: What the english says, is the singular suffix is "" (empty) and the plural suffix is `s`
14:05:53 <_jgr_> merni: I wouldn't pay much attention to ancient stuff on the wiki
14:06:13 <_glx_> english can use `{P man men}`
14:07:06 <_glx_> or `m{P a e}n` to be confusing 🙂
14:07:23 <keseliman> it actually clarifies a lot
14:08:21 <_glx_> for french the tool shows me
14:08:31 <merni> _jgr_: Well... is there more up-to-date docs on lang files?
14:09:41 <keseliman> So it would be batter{P "y" "ies"}
14:10:59 <keseliman> Well that might be somewhat correct
14:11:04 <keseliman> Let me give an example
14:11:31 <keseliman> But when you say 35 years = 35 Yıl
14:12:19 <_jgr_> Odd, because the existing language has plenty of ler/lar suffixes using {P}
14:12:24 <merni> Then, considering the text you're translating is `{NUM}{NBSP}year{P "" s}`, this would be for things like "1 year" or "35 years"
14:12:40 <merni> So the correct translation may be yil
14:13:09 <keseliman> Let me give another example on how to use plural
14:13:34 <merni> _jgr_: Perhaps it's just using those for singular as well... only someone playing the game in Turkish would know :p
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14:14:03 <keseliman> So If you say choose 5 cars it would be "5 araba seç" but if you say choose cars "arabaları seç"
14:14:29 <keseliman> But for someone playing a lot of games with little Turkish translation most people wouldn't mind 35 years being 35 yıllar
14:14:46 <merni> Well, to my knowledge, the plural code in the translation is mostly used for numbers
14:15:05 <keseliman> Then we wouldn't use plural yeah
14:17:18 <keseliman> merni: yeah i should leave it at yıl instead of adding the lar
14:17:48 <_jgr_> Just checked and it's always adding the suffix in {P}
14:18:21 <merni> Might make more sense to disable the {P} code entirely for languages with plural form number 1
14:18:45 <_jgr_> The plural form of the language can be changed easily enough
14:18:54 <_jgr_> Plural form 1 does not seem to be the correct one
14:19:13 <merni> Sure, but there are other languages with plural form 1 which are perhaps correct
14:20:10 <merni> Oh great, the comments in strings.cpp are out of date...
14:20:14 <merni> hungarian uses form 2, not 1
14:20:22 <_jgr_> Yes, I mean changing the `##plural 1` tag at the top of Turkish.txt, not changing how plural form 1 works
14:20:48 <merni> _jgr_: Yeah, but I would also say that in plural form 1, there is no reason to allow the use of {P} tag
14:21:10 <merni> if you want to add a suffix in all cases, just add it to the string itself...
14:21:32 <keseliman> yeah regardless of the plural i can do it all like {NUM}{NBSP}yıl{P ""}
14:21:42 <keseliman> and it will all be yıl and wouldn't matter
14:21:57 <merni> That's better than pluralising 1 anyway :laugh`
14:22:02 <_jgr_> If the {P} is empty you don't need to add it at all
14:22:56 <_jgr_> Would plural form 0 or 2 make more sense?
14:24:35 <keseliman> ler lar only changes with the letter before the plural so if its e like "tren" it would be "trenler" if its a like "araba" it would be "arabalar"
14:25:01 <_jgr_> The vowel harmony thing?
14:26:19 <keseliman> but still its 5 araba not arabalar so it wouldn't matter in this game
14:27:02 <keseliman> And adding one more thing to the equation
14:27:47 <keseliman> 5 cars " 5 arabalar" is more meaningless than choose cars " araba seç" instead of "arabaları seç"
14:27:57 <keseliman> so no plural is good
14:29:23 <peter1138[d]> _glx_: It doesn't.
14:30:24 <_glx_> but they use the same header
14:30:26 <peter1138[d]> english is "1 car" vs "2 cars", turkish is "1 car" vs "2 car"
14:31:26 <peter1138[d]> The plural form is used in "car" vs "cars" -- which means it does fit how we use plurals.
14:32:03 <_glx_> ah so in most places were we use {P} they just have to remove it
14:32:35 <_glx_> because {P} is always used with a number
15:48:59 <talltyler> andythenorth: If you want #11932, you need to make some noise to get it approved. 😄
15:51:49 <_glx_> you know there's also the option to only change translation using 0: and friends to not require all SetDParam changes
15:53:45 <_glx_> as a bonus all existing translations will remain valid
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16:44:21 <wormnest[m]> peter1138[d]: Is there a specific newGRF without mail cargo that I can use to test a fix for WormAI?
16:44:55 <peter1138[d]> Improved Town Industries
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17:18:19 <wormnest[m]> At this time only bug fixes :)
17:35:32 <xarick> how did you make Lists accept an additional parameter as optional?
17:36:20 <xarick> I thought optional parameters was impossible
17:43:30 <keseliman> Just a quick question is it anyway possible to get proper metro's in this gime like proper underground stations
17:43:40 <keseliman> I mean not currently but in the future if added
17:43:46 <wormnest[m]> I have no idea, most of this code was written years ago. Your best bet is checking the code
17:44:35 <merni> Yeah, it would require quite big changes in the code
17:45:22 <xarick> too much work for my little brain
17:45:23 <Rubidium> keseliman: underground stations have not been definitely rejected as a feature, but those ideas existed a decade ago and there hasn't been a feasible implementation yet
17:45:45 <wormnest[m]> The AI parameters dialog when setting up AI before starting a game for int parameters doesn't show the set min/max values, but what looks like 50% and 150% of the current value. Is that intentional?
17:46:27 <keseliman> Rubidium: maybe it could be added as a 5th transportation way instead of adding it to trains that way changing the code would be averted
17:47:06 <_jgr_> keseliman: You may have a hard time finding someone to volunteer to do that
17:47:20 <andythenorth> also pipelines before that 😛
17:47:23 <keseliman> Yeah i see why is that but it is possible right ?
17:47:47 <_jgr_> Many things are possible
17:47:48 <xarick> wormnest[m]: they reworked difficulty settings, easy medium, hard was removed. Instead it's now randomized apparently from easy to hard, something like that
17:49:21 <merni> keseliman: You would still have to change lots of code even with that approach
17:49:28 <merni> Definitely not impossible
17:51:14 <andythenorth> no if we just change the code, we don't have to change the code 🙂
17:51:23 * andythenorth bad andythenorth
17:52:25 <keseliman> merni: so underground would have to be implemented as a feature right
17:53:15 <_glx_> wormnest: min/max were never shown, but were used to enable/disable [<]/[>] buttons, and clamp the value entered
17:55:01 <_glx_> xarick: but you can easily fix it by just setting `default` and no `random_deviation`
17:58:42 <wormnest[m]> _glx_: Thanks, it's been a long time since I looked at this.
17:59:39 <_glx_> and when the GUI shows `[xx, yy]` it means `random_deviation` will be applied to the value on AI start
18:00:40 <_glx_> if you used easy/medium/hard it's converted to default = medium and random deviation = (hard-easy) / 2
18:01:33 <_glx_> but you can replace easy/medium/hard with just default
18:01:44 <wormnest[m]> _glx_: What if I use the new default, will that cause problems in older versions of OpenTTD or should I set a new minimum compatible version?
18:01:44 <peter1138[d]> Nah, underground is not a separate transportation method.
18:02:08 <peter1138[d]> Underground rails, roads, trams, shops and uh.... Aircraft...
18:02:26 <merni> peter1138[d]: Ships, too
18:07:37 <xarick> rocket launcher! new transportation method!
18:09:47 <peter1138[d]> Silly phone autocarrotting ships to shops
18:18:13 <wormnest[m]> Actually I 'll probably leave that out for now to keep compatibility with older versions. The medium settings work well enough.
18:19:44 <_glx_> there's the option to set easy/medium/hard to the same value 🙂
18:23:42 <xarick> wow CTest has way many tests now
18:25:19 <_glx_> xarick: it's not impossible, but it requires working in low level inside squirrel VM
18:30:06 <wormnest[m]> I don't mind a little variation. For AI contests I could always add a boolean setting that overrides all settings if I ever feel the need for that.
18:37:29 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
18:40:38 <keseliman> i will probably finish turkish translation today or tomorrow
18:59:37 <michi_cc[d]> keseliman: No need to worry, the 14.0 release isn't that close 🙂
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19:25:59 <_zephyris> keseliman: Good though! Have you tried the new font? Is it working OK for Turkish?
19:40:50 <rau117> ok, ok, now a really good idea, not like... other
19:40:50 <rau117> Add a button to the transport list at the top of groups sub-menu, something like “New group”, which acts like dragging onto an empty space… it creates a new group.
19:40:50 <rau117> At the moment, if you have too many groups, it is way harder to add more – you need to either create new group using a button on bottom-left and then drag vehicles, or somehow collapse all existing groups to free up space
19:45:59 <peter1138[d]> Healthy pancake dinner :p
19:48:42 <keseliman> _zephyris: i am actually sucker for the traditional but i'll take another look
19:51:39 <keseliman> its a bit quirky with the ü ç ğ and other turkish letters but it does the job and doesn't look out of the place
20:04:54 <andythenorth> peter1138[d]: Same
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20:33:29 <xarick> GetNumHangars should work for airport type as well
20:34:21 <xarick> is there a way to accept both TileIndex or AirportType?
20:35:41 <xarick> for example, when trying to get a list of airport types available to build, I was interested in knowing whether a type has hangars
20:36:01 <xarick> there's no method to do that
20:36:08 <xarick> until I build the airport
20:38:03 <_glx_> there's no way to know that before building I think
20:41:47 <xarick> there's ::AirportSpec::Get(type) being used for coverage
20:42:02 <xarick> should be possible to get number of hangars as well
20:43:10 <peter1138[d]> airport->GetNumHangers() checks the airport spec.
20:43:16 <peter1138[d]> So yes, it's possible quite easily.
20:45:57 <xarick> wouldn't that add a bit of overhead?
20:46:24 <peter1138[d]> Depends how often you ask...
20:47:51 <_glx_> kind of stuff the AI can cache locally, the number of types is limited
20:48:15 <peter1138[d]> If you really want it can be calculated on start up and stored with the airport spec.
20:48:53 <peter1138[d]> But I doubt it's very expensive in the grand scheme of things.
20:49:28 <peter1138[d]> If you don't care about accuracy then there's already a counter.
20:49:31 <xarick> optional parameters would be a cool feature, but historically... it's been done the other way
20:50:00 <_glx_> because nobody bothered to try 🙂
20:50:18 <xarick> also, how would that work for valuate
20:51:01 <xarick> list.Valuate(GSAirport.GetHangarOfAirport);
20:51:01 <xarick> list.Valuate(GSAirport.GetHangarOfAirport, 0);
20:54:15 <_glx_> though I only tried optional parameters for constructors
20:59:03 <xarick> Need instructions how to do the optional parameter way
21:01:07 <xarick> oh snap, i forgot to add something
21:01:18 <xarick> the commit needs a [Script]
21:06:42 <xarick> Waiting for CodeQL Analysis to finish
21:08:54 <keseliman> do we have a guide for coding with openttd or are you guys just accustomed to the stuff
21:09:03 <keseliman> not with newgrfs though
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21:15:37 <_glx_> hmm seems it's harder than constructors
21:18:40 <_zephyris> keseliman: The u diaresis/umlaut and g breve are quirky to get the diacritic centred at 1x zoom when rendered non-anti-aliased... That's deliberate, but might get improved in the future. The c cedilla is a bit wonky - that one I will check soon! But great that it's useable and readable.
21:27:31 <rau117> andythenorth: yes it exists, but you need to click on it first, and only then push the vehicle into a new group, it’s not as convenient as “drag it to an empty space to immideately create new group”
21:40:53 <locosage> it could probably be allowed to drag onto that button
21:43:53 <xarick> ouch I repeat my self so much 😮
21:44:17 <FLHerne> keseliman: there are some notes in docs/ on a few subjects, but mostly no
21:45:22 <keseliman> FLHerne: yeah I am trying to get my head around on what happens where on the code files and trying to challenge myself if i can i'll put it up here you guys to see if i'm able
21:52:38 <xarick> isn't there a way to get the num of runways, helipads, it's short runway, etc...
21:52:49 <xarick> looking at newgrf_airport.cpp
22:04:37 <xarick> ah, this is what I need AirportFTAClass
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22:43:08 <xarick> NumTerminals is... complicated
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22:49:19 <rau117> SamuXarickviaGitHub: Also an option, but still not as convenient - you still have to aim at a small button, which is relatively far from the sub-window with transport
22:51:19 <rau117> locosage: wrong reply ↑↑
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22:59:59 <xarick> someone explain me how terminals work?
23:00:59 <xarick> > const byte *terminals; ///< %Array with the number of terminal groups, followed by the number of terminals in each group.
23:00:59 <xarick> it says it's an array, but the values are glued together or something
23:01:37 <locosage> rau117: yeah, it's just the "better than nothing" kind of solution
23:02:11 <xarick> if it's NULL, it's 0 terminals
23:02:28 <xarick> if it's something else... it's complicated to extract the number
23:12:15 <_glx_> for intercontinental it's { 2, 4, 4 }, meaning 2 terminals, 4 slots in each
23:21:18 <peter1138[d]> scrollbar limit 😛
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23:48:29 <xarick> There's more I wanted to do, but no time atm
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continue to next day ⏵
