IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2023-08-02
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02:27:11 <jorropo> Hey this probably is an already over asked question but why would adding signals on bridges and tunnels is the borderline impossible ?
02:27:11 <jorropo> I get that the map is 2D and tunnels and bridges only really exists at the entrances, then the "physical" being of the train is removed and teleported to it's own "subspace bubble" that is the tunnel or bridge, finally teleported back at the end.
02:27:11 <jorropo> I mean, what I expect right now is that there is a signalling system that snips the tracks in blocks and a graph for path signals, wouldn't it be easy to have the subspace bubbles feed in their own graph / blocks data ? It would be tricky at the entry and exits since they could be real / subspace world, or different subspaces, but I think it should be fine using aliased pointers.
02:27:11 <jorropo> Github tells me it's 84% C++, so what I expect is that there are asbtractions everywhere except changing anything still require breaking all of them.
02:27:11 <jorropo> From a scale of 1 to 10 how much wrong am I ?
02:27:12 <jorropo> I'm really tempted by trying to send you a patch but I'm kinda scared of something like old C transitioned into C++ and the 2D map indecies are used in a hash table to compute signaling blocks time and actually there is subspace bubble, just portals on the 2D floodfill.
02:32:46 <belajalilija> Jgrpp has signals on bridges
02:32:52 <belajalilija> And in tunnels
02:33:05 <belajalilija> Not reading all that though
02:36:05 <jorropo> belajalilija: Intresting thx, so if someone were to send signals on bridges and tunnel, would the anwser be "use Jgrpp instead" ?
02:36:38 <belajalilija> jorropo: Wdym
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02:38:36 <jorropo> belajalilija: Does the Openttd maintainers would look at code that do this in openttd ?
02:39:57 <jorropo> I guess it's a meta question, what is Jgrpp's relationship with openttd, I've heard the name before but never looked deeper.
02:40:13 <belajalilija> Possibly, you’d have to talk to them though, they might also mention that adding a new feature means that it is more to be maintained
03:41:47 <jorropo> belajalilija: I've tried, it has on entry / exists, it's not quite what I want, I want that if I have a 60 long tunnel I can still have my 7 signal spread
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04:52:08 <shrekshellraiser> jorropo: It is a fork of openttd with more features that either nobody has tried to merge into base openttd, or don't fit in openttd
06:38:18 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Bouke opened issue #11166: [Crash]: pressed 'R' after selecting railway station builder
06:45:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #11166: [Crash]: pressed 'R' after selecting railway station builder
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07:43:24 <locosage> jorropo: There is some graph but it's in a firm of pathfinder cache. First and foremost signals are stored on map tiles that don't allow for multiple height layers.
07:44:41 <locosage> What jgrpp has is a hack that stores bridge signals on bridge heads. It works alright in the most common case of auto-spaced signals but it doesn't to place signals on bridges freely
08:23:01 <belajalilija> locosage: Correct
09:04:45 <talltyler> And that is the hack that makes it unsuitable for vanilla, IMHO. Signals on bridge heads with virtual signals spaced along the bridge is not really user-friendly design
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09:11:53 <talltyler> If the user experience could be improved I would love to see it in vanilla
09:26:13 <FLHerne> jorropo: the implementation in JGRPP is a bit of a hack, it assumes that bridges/tunnels either have no signals, or block signals spaced <n, configurable globally> tiles apart
09:26:43 <FLHerne> oh, covered already
09:27:07 <_jgr_> The spacing is per bridge/tunnel these days
09:29:58 <FLHerne> _jgr_: oh, neat
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10:17:01 <peter1138> jorropo: Not impossible. Main issue is that beyond the end tiles, bridges and tunnels don't exist, so the simple solution of just storing signal data on the map isn't possible.
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12:05:19 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Bouke commented on issue #11166: [Crash]: pressed 'R' after selecting railway station builder
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12:44:02 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on issue #11166: [Crash]: pressed 'R' after selecting railway station builder
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15:10:11 <jorropo> locosage: I was expecting to do the same thing but configurable per bridge, that means you could use a signal on a bridge, and a UI allows you to configure signal spread and the spread offset, it would also integrate with the CTRL + Click placing feature.
15:10:44 <jorropo> Thx peoples
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15:40:14 <_jgr_> Where to store the signal data is not really the thing to worry about
15:41:05 <_jgr_> For the most part it doesn't matter if end tiles or somewhere off map are used
15:41:56 <_jgr_> The complexity mostly comes from train movement, and to a lesser extent from PBS interactions at the two ends
15:45:35 <truebrain> Did anyone mention newmap already? 😄
15:45:45 <truebrain> I thought, let's do an Andy 🙂
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16:15:30 <kamnet> andy said he's waiting to install ChatGTP on his MBP to work it all out.
16:38:30 <truebrain> Yeah, he shouldn't, he is hosting atm ..
16:38:49 <LordAro> just get ChatGPT to host the website for us
16:40:18 <FLHerne> ask it to write the game code while you're at it
17:01:22 <alfagamma_0007> FLHerne: Very funny
17:08:26 <truebrain> FLHerne: I tried. It refuses, talking some bullshit about needing to understand the code and not being uptodate and more blabla excuses .. sad.
17:12:59 <peter1138> Oh balls, I used tar to clone an lxc container... it hasn't preserved file owners properly 😦
17:14:00 <peter1138> Although that doesn't really seem to make sense with how tar works :/
17:14:49 <peter1138> > This answer is simply incorrect. tar does record owner names.
17:14:50 <peter1138> Oh, fair.
17:16:36 <truebrain> `-a` option of tar helps for many of these things (archive)
17:55:20 <andythenorth> GPT claimes it could write GS, then hallucinated something javascript-ish that was not GS nor better
17:56:35 <andythenorth> I am really puzzled by all these “this GPT prompt makes me $1m per week” youtube videos.
17:56:58 <andythenorth> Might they not be 100% true?
18:08:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rubidium42 merged pull request #11165: Fix #11164: Duplicate town names when using the many random towns function
18:08:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] rubidium42 closed issue #11164: [Bug]: Scenario editor: Many random towns function creates towns with duplicate names
18:23:41 <truebrain> andythenorth: lies? With "make NNN per week with ZZZ" videos? Well, not really .. THEY make NNN, but they are not telling you 😛
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18:29:47 <peter1138> Artificial Insemination commonly results in bullshit.
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18:38:29 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] eints-sync[bot] pushed 1 commits to master
18:38:30 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
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18:44:45 <andythenorth> truebrain: Do you have a course I can take?
18:45:02 <truebrain> yes. For 1000 dollar, I will tell you how to make YouTube movies to tell others how to make money
18:45:11 <truebrain> damn, I sold this poorly
18:45:29 <truebrain> "Make over 1000 dollar a day by this one simple trick" course can be made available to you .. for 1000 dollar
18:46:11 <truebrain> Gauranteed success or money back! ("success" is measured by how content I am with your 1000 dollar)
18:53:53 <andythenorth> I sign up!
18:54:17 <truebrain> sorry, the class is full, you are just too late
18:54:24 <truebrain> let that be the first lesson
18:54:29 <truebrain> the bill is on its way
19:08:51 <peter1138> do do, do do, do! do do de do do de do doodly doo...
19:10:06 <peter1138> <>
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