IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2022-06-24
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09:42:14 <andythenorth> forgot to eat breakfast
09:42:17 <andythenorth> mistakes were made
09:42:30 <LordAro> too late now, you'll have to try again tomorrow
09:42:47 <andythenorth> is breakfast a time, or an action?
09:45:19 <Samu> im using your grf intensively for my testings
09:47:25 <Samu> i just realized trains sometimes use 2 ticks, some other times 1 tick
09:48:52 <peter1138> That depends how fast they go.
09:54:34 <Samu> the first TrainLocoHandler returns true, which means the second TrainLocoHandler also runs
09:54:42 <Samu> which is the case for my case
09:59:18 <Samu> it just makes brute forcing iron horse take twice the time
09:59:39 <andythenorth> possibly Iron Horse is slow :P
10:07:05 <Samu> alright, now it got Nimbus (Electric) with 5x Suburban Coach (Large) with 360 passengers
10:07:54 <Samu> I assume now that trains are full loaded, going in a straight line with all pieces running up inclined slopes
10:10:42 <Samu> i wanted to add breakdowns logic into this
10:10:56 <Samu> gonna have to investigate
10:12:54 <peter1138> Why twice the time?
10:15:11 <Samu> it is computing ~65 days worth of TrainTicks
10:15:35 <Samu> for each engine/wagon combination
10:17:27 <Samu> simulating 4810 train ticks per combo
10:19:10 <Samu> which are actually 9620 TrainLocoHandler calls
10:21:11 <Samu> have yet to get how many combinations are there
10:24:32 <Samu> got it, 5683 combinations
10:30:42 <Samu> mail computed! it picked Triton (Electric) + 4x Sliding Wall Van (Twin) with 528 mail capacity
10:31:27 <Samu> train is full loaded, going straight line with all pieces running up inclined slopes
10:31:38 <Samu> does this choice make sense?
12:07:43 <peter1138> Dunno, does it look good?
13:07:45 <glx> I still think it would be better for an AI to use presets for newgrf vehicle
13:08:27 <glx> plus some limitations only a human could understand
13:10:47 <LordAro> Samu: remember, the goal of an AI isn't necessarily to be "the best", ideally it should be fun to play against
13:23:17 <Samu> train_slope_resistance, unsure how to deal with this
13:24:09 <Samu> if i assume worst case, going up hill with all wagons, it prefers to pick a strong engine
13:24:40 <Samu> if resistance is 0, it usually picks fast but weak engines, at least with iron horse
13:25:34 <Samu> then i have to actually build the route, which may include some nasty inclinations, hmm
13:26:02 <Samu> worst case is maybe preferred
13:26:10 <Samu> only to be on the safer side
13:30:31 <FLHerne> glx: too many grfs :-/
13:40:35 <Eddi|zuHause> callback 18 was meant for that
13:41:14 <Eddi|zuHause> but someone decided that it was too ridgid for openttd's AIs and not implemented
13:52:17 <peter1138> It also allows the AI to cheat by buying vehicles that can't be purchased by players.
14:07:58 <Samu> wow, it even solves the issue of losing precision
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14:56:13 <Samu> is there a FALLTHROUGH for squirrel? or i just ommit it?
14:56:35 <LordAro> just omit break, iirc
14:57:18 <LordAro> (FALLTHROUGH in OTTD code is only an indication to the compiler that "yes, this was intentional", it doesn't actually do anything else)
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15:16:04 <Samu> reliability = rel = max((rel_old = reliability) - reliability_spd_dec, 0);
15:16:11 <Samu> can squirrel accept this syntax
15:19:08 <Samu> I'll see, im still copying code
15:19:43 <Samu> oh, it has a Random() function
15:20:51 <Samu> not sure it's a good idea to have something that's random in the formula
15:21:57 <Samu> how would i make it fair
15:26:30 <Samu> what's the Chance16I equivalent in squirrel
15:57:57 <andythenorth> Samu can you do an AI battle to evolve the strategy for choosing?
15:58:37 <andythenorth> eh, how about AI Train Whack, in game?
15:58:38 <frosch123> andythenorth: remember the security researcher who said something about DMARC? now they want a bounty :)
15:59:19 <frosch123> yeah, two monkeys, same joke
15:59:19 <andythenorth> oh you guessed :(
15:59:35 <andythenorth> Samu ^^ pls make Train Whack! in AI
15:59:50 <andythenorth> Train Whack! is inspired by Pikka's CivilAI and the Horse trains it builds
16:00:06 <frosch123> is it? or did you just make that up?
16:00:36 <andythenorth> I ran some games with multiple Civil AI to test elements of Iron Horse
16:00:43 <andythenorth> unrelated frosch123 you never told me I can write train prop 25 with cb 36 :(
16:00:46 <frosch123> i hope civilai does not play with boring-mode enabled
16:01:05 <andythenorth> I feel I have not been exploring the newgrf spec sufficiently
16:01:08 <frosch123> why should i have told you that?
16:01:16 <andythenorth> imagine the lolz
16:01:36 <frosch123> did you find a usecase for prop25?
16:01:52 <frosch123> i never found one, or at least none with callback
16:01:57 <andythenorth> no, because it can't be read as a var
16:02:00 <andythenorth> I might patch that though
16:02:12 <andythenorth> it's so funny having such a potentially useful prop
16:02:14 <frosch123> why read something, which you can compute?
16:02:15 <andythenorth> but it's crippled
16:02:23 <frosch123> it's just caching at this point
16:02:41 <andythenorth> I wanted to see if it makes Iron Horse draw faster
16:02:56 <andythenorth> it's quite easy to show that Iron Horse has a significant FPS hit
16:03:04 <andythenorth> compared to vanilla trains
16:03:17 <andythenorth> but maybe that's just grf overhead ? :P
16:04:07 <frosch123> compare it to nuts?
16:04:29 <frosch123> reduce spritestacks back to 4? :p
16:10:52 <andythenorth> ok so Horse and NUTS have about the same FPS hit
16:11:37 <andythenorth> ~730x game speed factor for vanilla, ~680x with Horse or NUTS
16:11:53 <andythenorth> I always forget how to calculate that type of % :P
16:12:15 <frosch123> how did you create a comparable savegame with nuts so fast?
16:12:35 <andythenorth> this is just 20 trains in a depot
16:12:35 <peter1138> Ooh, found my old model railway stuff. Class 37, 43 and 58.
16:12:39 <andythenorth> with the train window open
16:12:46 <andythenorth> peter1138 quick eBay it!
16:12:48 <peter1138> Not sure I dare plug in the power supplies...
16:12:50 <andythenorth> probably worth a fortune
16:13:14 <peter1138> It's all Hornby so not exactly high quality.
16:13:23 <andythenorth> power supply probably fine
16:13:28 <andythenorth> there isn't much too them
16:13:36 <andythenorth> it's just a big transformer and a rheostat or something
16:13:47 <andythenorth> I blew up a lot when I was a child, so I took them apart
16:18:34 <peter1138> They look very long... I'm too used to TTD's stubby engines :D
16:25:50 <peter1138> Actually there's some Lima here too.
16:30:48 <Samu> reliability_spd_dec is making this impossible
16:30:55 <Samu> it's an engine property that I can't get
16:31:35 <peter1138> Are you trying to simulate OpenTTD inside OpenTTD?
16:33:03 <LordAro> reimplementing most of the engine power calculations, by the sound of it
16:34:40 <Samu> i was attempting to simulate breakdowns
16:34:57 <Samu> for deciding which engine to get :p
16:35:00 <peter1138> Turn breakdowns off, much easier.
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16:36:22 <peter1138> LordAro, think I fucked my calf muscle up, had cramp yesterday, now it's still aching :(
16:37:53 <peter1138> I probably shouldn't've tried to keep up with the fast group, on my tourer.
16:39:04 <peter1138> I fell back going up a hill (heavy bike innit) and they were off, so of course I tried to catch up. lol
16:39:24 <LordAro> i was having issues with my ankle a few weeks back, but it seems to have gone away after replacing my shoes
16:39:39 <LordAro> legs are just generally a bit tired
16:43:12 <andythenorth> peter1138 trying bulgarian splits or whatever they're called
16:43:26 * andythenorth getting well into stretching, cos it actually works
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17:38:35 <Samu> looks like decay_speed for trains is 20
17:38:52 <Samu> but newgrfs... may change that
17:40:36 <Samu> only ships have a value other than 20
17:44:17 <DorpsGek> Samu: Error: Invalid syntax: illegal operator LShift
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18:10:22 <TrueBrain> frosch123: ugh .. I forgot that issue existed ...
18:15:08 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I think GitHub Actions has a base64 encode thingy
18:15:48 <TrueBrain> or we can do: $(echo ... | base64)
18:16:31 <TrueBrain> I can thinker with it tomorrow .. feel free to experiment with it tonight if you like :D
18:17:03 <frosch123> so the --cli-binary-format option is no good?
18:17:11 <TrueBrain> what is a bit "meh" about the base64, that the secret hider will no longer kick in ..
18:17:22 <TrueBrain> well, I am fine with that option, just not sure till when that is a valid option
18:17:25 <TrueBrain> I assume it is deprecated :P
18:17:42 <TrueBrain> so I am assuming we postpone this issue again
18:18:16 <TrueBrain> but yeah, that option would be better, as the secret hider would still do its work
18:48:47 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
18:49:50 <frosch123> uh, oh, yeah, i understand, you are busy, dorpsgek :)
18:53:21 <TrueBrain> Takes a few moments before AWS loaded the Lambda in memory
18:54:29 <frosch123> hmm, where is the manual-run-workflow button...
18:55:01 <TrueBrain> There we go, all green now :)
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18:55:20 <frosch123> did it rerun itself, or did you press something?
18:56:50 <TrueBrain> I hit rerun on the job :)
18:59:32 <frosch123> not sure the cherry-pick saved any time there
18:59:50 <frosch123> the --cli-read-timeout is not present in staging, so i had to resolve that
19:00:00 <frosch123> and edit the commit message to remove the PR reference :p
19:00:10 <frosch123> but hey, the "ubuntu-latest" worked
19:00:59 <frosch123> oh, the admin-merge button changed into a checkbox
19:08:08 <TrueBrain> That diff looks weird
19:08:32 <TrueBrain> I understand why, but it could do better
19:09:30 <TrueBrain> 1 side project at the time :p
19:11:25 <TrueBrain> One happy family :D
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