IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2022-02-20
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09:38:25 <nielsm> can we make an SaaS offering? (strgen as a service)
09:39:48 <nielsm> upload a txt file, get back an error/warning list and generated lng file if any
09:40:43 <TrueBrain> lot of work for 1 user :P
09:43:38 <LordAro> can TrueGRF do vehicle name replacement yet?
09:44:08 <TrueBrain> wish Open Source collected enough money for me to not work :P
09:44:17 <nielsm> I think that person wanted to have the vehicle names replaced in the translation because that will work even on multiplayer servers
09:45:35 <nielsm> and apparently the "Rename" function on the build vehicle list is not good enough for some reason
09:46:07 <TrueBrain> as I said, a SaaS to scratch an itch of a single user, doesn't seem like a good use of time / resources :P :D
09:46:13 <nielsm> (it stores the new name in the save game I think)
09:49:55 <TrueBrain> but, this is Open Source .. so knock yourself out if you so like, of course :)
10:46:57 <TrueBrain> just hoping it stays outside
10:47:01 <TrueBrain> doesn't hold true for all houses
10:51:40 <LordAro> can confirm, such weather
10:52:03 <LordAro> had a few cm of snow yesterday, which was immediately replaced with heavy rain
10:52:11 <LordAro> a nice walk while it lasted though
10:52:24 <TrueBrain> you had snow?! Lucky you ..
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11:30:27 <andythenorth> so ships with more than 1 cargo then?
11:31:04 <andythenorth> specifically pax and mail, like planes :P
12:10:20 <peter1138> articulated ships eh
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12:15:33 <frosch123> nielsm: replacing vehicle names is done via static newgrf
12:15:38 <LordAro> ships often become articulated very briefly before sinking
12:15:46 <frosch123> there are at least two gpl'd newgrf for that on bananas
12:21:57 <andythenorth> strings of barges
12:22:14 <andythenorth> but also ships with just a shadow sprite? :P
12:46:53 <peter1138> It was not a salad.
12:47:04 <peter1138> I will now proceed to gain 10kg.
12:47:44 <frosch123> did you kill someone?
12:54:53 <TrueBrain> this is one weird channel :P
13:01:33 <_dp_> frosch123, how is that done technically, with Action4?
13:02:31 <_dp_> I mean changing names, not killing people xD
13:03:03 <frosch123> meh, i forgot to update the source link on bananas
13:03:20 <frosch123> action4 is considered static-safe
13:03:32 <frosch123> it will only apply to original vehicles, not to newgrf vehicles
13:03:40 <frosch123> so you can load it statically in all cases
13:03:58 <frosch123> it does not make the vehicles available if some newgrf disabled/replaced them
13:04:08 <TrueBrain> guess I should add it to TrueGRF and put that in the thread, not? :P Hmm .. reminds me I wanted to figure out how to publish things automatically to BaNaNaS ... that will be interesting to figure out
13:05:46 <_dp_> grf-py can do that already but I don't want to teach that person python...
13:06:20 <TrueBrain> owh, right, I needed to switch UI library, as the current one I am using ... the author seems to have no interest in fixing bugs, even if I PR a fix for them :P
13:06:26 <TrueBrain> bit annoying to patch things locally
13:07:03 <TrueBrain> but I found a very similar library, which is much more used and supported .. just does things just so differently enough that I have to go over each page :P
13:07:08 <TrueBrain> such life, frontends ..
13:08:00 <frosch123> too bad those studends looking for a project never came back :)
13:12:50 <TrueBrain> I also wonder how hard it would be to link to a GitHub git repo, TrueGRF data :P
13:15:20 <frosch123> none if the existing apps require write permission to personal repos
13:15:44 <TrueBrain> given it runs in a browser, I am not sure I need oauth2
13:15:45 <frosch123> unless you want a global repo for everyone :)
13:15:51 <TrueBrain> I think I can just use the API
13:16:17 <frosch123> i doubt that :) that would be a cross-site attack
13:17:21 <frosch123> but yes, you would need the client-only oauth2 stuff, so even more different
13:17:37 <TrueBrain> yeah, as I cannot have an "app-secret"
13:17:41 <TrueBrain> as that would be ... useless :P
13:19:37 <frosch123> haha, looks like github does not even support that
13:19:56 <frosch123> it has the device flow though, which is weird
13:24:33 <TrueBrain> I love that searching for anything GitHub related gives you a lot of totally unrelated projects on GitHub :D
13:36:24 <TrueBrain> well, seems oauth2 is indeed the only way .. just the normal webflow .. guess the origin check has to do
13:37:36 <TrueBrain> euh, webflow -> device flow
13:37:41 <TrueBrain> webflow is a big no-no :P
13:39:10 <frosch123> can readme.md contain a link "open in truegrf" then?
13:39:33 <TrueBrain> hihi, yes, that should be easy :)
13:39:53 <TrueBrain> I also think I shouldn't be storing everything in a single JSON, if I am going to use git as backend
13:40:42 <frosch123> single json is a lot easier, you do not need to keep track of adding and deleting files
13:40:43 <TrueBrain> easier to understand the GRF if you read the repo
13:41:04 <TrueBrain> images are base64 encoded in the JSON .. it grows big really quick :P
13:41:32 <frosch123> though you should store formatted/indented json, to make diffs readable/mergeable :)
13:41:56 <frosch123> oh, ok, storing the images as png would be nice
13:42:36 <TrueBrain> the one thing I still puzzle with a bit .. do I allow a NewGRF to contain -everything-, from industries to vehicles
13:42:46 <TrueBrain> or do I just make you select what type of grf you want to make at the beginning
13:43:59 <frosch123> newgrf that use multiple things always cause trouble
13:44:18 <TrueBrain> but cargo is a bit of an annoying one
13:44:22 <frosch123> "mixing vehicles and cargos" -> "automatically create a firs PR to disable your set"
13:44:25 <TrueBrain> as I guess it belongs to industries and vehicles
13:44:32 <frosch123> "mixing houses and industries" -> oof
13:44:38 <TrueBrain> but I guess I can also force vehicles to use cargo classes
13:44:49 <TrueBrain> or cargo labels only
13:44:57 <andythenorth> I mix things I'm not supposed to
13:45:17 <frosch123> vehicles use cargos, they do not define them
13:45:18 <andythenorth> mixing vehicles and road/railtypes was quite controversial
13:45:34 <frosch123> "mixing vehicles and cargo" are things like regearing cargos
13:45:36 <TrueBrain> frosch123: but what cargoes to list .. that is the trick :)
13:45:44 <frosch123> i.e. those sets that get disabled when you use firs
13:46:08 <TrueBrain> I guess I could make that when you create a vehicle set, you can point to TrueGRF repos that are industry sets, so it can read the cargoes from it :D
13:46:16 <frosch123> technically you want to list all cargos, and error when you need special rules for more than 255 of them
13:46:35 <TrueBrain> "all cargoes" is rather undefined :P
13:46:37 <frosch123> vehicles are supposed to use cargo-classes in the general case, and cargo-labels for exceptions
13:46:47 <frosch123> and the number of exceptions is limited in theory
13:47:03 <TrueBrain> and should a single vehicle set define both trains and ships?
13:47:07 <TrueBrain> or should that just be 2 GRFs? :P
13:47:13 <frosch123> TrueBrain: scan bananas newgrf and extract all cargos :)
13:47:35 <andythenorth> vendoring in a package is a terrible pattern, but that's what I do ^^
13:47:40 <frosch123> it would be funny to generate that site from bananas :p
13:47:41 <TrueBrain> not a bad idea, to just scan everything :)
13:48:21 <TrueBrain> guess we could even publish it on BaNaNaS, yes :P
13:48:24 <TrueBrain> okay, so that solves that for now
13:48:32 <TrueBrain> so how about trains + ships in 1 GRF?
13:49:03 <frosch123> heqs mixed road vehicles and trains
13:49:08 <frosch123> the trains were generally hated
13:49:17 <frosch123> mixing road vehicles and trams is rahter common though
13:49:34 <TrueBrain> yeah, so ships / trains / road+tram / planes
13:49:42 <frosch123> the line between road vehicles and trams is rather blurry in general
13:49:52 <TrueBrain> I can work with that
13:49:53 <andythenorth> industries and houses really need to be provided together :P
13:49:59 <andythenorth> but I never got around to it :(
13:50:00 <frosch123> oh, also mixing vehicles and track-types (rail/road/tram-types) is rather common
13:50:22 <frosch123> yeah, track-types are the most weird ones
13:50:41 <frosch123> there are tracktype-only sets, and vehicle sets which include them for convenience or other magic
13:51:03 <andythenorth> I am going to merge Termite into Horse
13:51:12 <andythenorth> this will probably cause complaints but eh
13:51:14 <TrueBrain> so next is ... how to make this user friendly .. as I do not think I can get permission to create a repository for a user
13:51:36 <TrueBrain> I somehow need to tell users to create a repository, and only grant me access to that one :P
13:52:03 <frosch123> make it a social network :) single repo for all grfs, force the users to grant all rights to you, easy forking/copying between truegrf-created sets
13:52:37 <TrueBrain> single organization would be possible .. single repo will hit GitHub limits REALLY quick I am afraid :P
13:52:45 <frosch123> but for real, currently truegrf has these buttons: start empty, fork firs, ...
13:52:52 <frosch123> those should be "fork" buttons on github
13:53:14 <frosch123> so, you start a truegrf by forking an existing set, and then press the "open in truegrf" button
13:53:30 <TrueBrain> but how to make that a nice experience for the not-so-technical people
13:53:50 <frosch123> is it possible to include a "fork this" link in readme.md ?
13:54:10 <TrueBrain> I am wondering if I can get permissions to do the forking for the user
13:54:19 <TrueBrain> basically making a shim on top of GitHub
13:54:20 <frosch123> hmm, though i guess forking is more like a "save as" inside trugrf
13:55:28 <TrueBrain> owh, it seems "repo" scope does give fork access
13:55:49 <frosch123> i think you want "public_repo" scope
13:56:00 <TrueBrain> I don't care if people want to keep it private, honestly
13:56:33 <TrueBrain> I am also not going to dictate their license .. going to strongly hint to use an open license, ofc :P
13:56:35 <frosch123> are you sure? think about the bug reports
13:56:47 <TrueBrain> that is a fair point
13:56:57 <TrueBrain> okay, public by default, private is a paid subscription :P
13:57:17 <frosch123> firs dictates the license
13:57:41 <TrueBrain> but I think I can make something like: you import FIRS
13:57:59 <TrueBrain> you change things .. you want to save it .. which means save as basically .. which means I fork via the API
13:58:01 <TrueBrain> and commit the changes
13:58:30 <TrueBrain> and if I somehow can keep a list of any TrueGRF public project on GitHub
13:58:34 <TrueBrain> I can allow listing them
13:58:45 <TrueBrain> hmm .. a tag on the repo should do
13:58:48 <TrueBrain> you can search for that
13:59:10 <frosch123> fork new projects from the default template, provided by you
13:59:15 <TrueBrain> that only works if everyone is going from FIRS
13:59:15 <TrueBrain> which will not be the case
13:59:29 <frosch123> you can also have an empty-project template
13:59:34 <frosch123> with readme.md and stuff
14:00:56 <TrueBrain> ah, yes, search topics
14:02:15 <TrueBrain> guess I can even use that to allow easy searching for train sets etc .. hmm ..
14:02:33 <TrueBrain> okay, at least worth a test .. better than the current storing in localstorage .. as .. well, I lost some work of my own already :D
14:02:38 <TrueBrain> you can only have 1 project, which is annoying as fuck :P
14:08:25 <andythenorth> maybe I should do boats in voxels
14:14:12 <_dp_> andythenorth, only blender, only hardcore :p
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23:18:47 <dale> Am I right in saying that deprecated NML {PUSH_WORD} string code simply cannot be used with nmlc to push a word that is not also a valid UTF-8 character? I tried to push 0xaaaa but \xaa\xaa is not valid UTF-8 and so nmlc refuses to read my lang file.
23:19:13 <dale> Oh, maybe I can drop bytes with literally "\xaa" in the lang file?
23:21:02 <dale> Yup, sorry, that did the trick (well, \aa\aa). Should have used rubber duck first.
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