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00:00:16  <hannah777> it worked for an older version which i accidentally installed

00:00:22  <hannah777> with apt-get

00:00:47  <hannah777> then i noticed it was old so i copied over the .deb file i downloaded from the website reinstalled it and added the graphics pack now i get this error

00:01:36  <FLHerne> Oh, > getaddrinfo for hostname "f" <

00:01:40  <FLHerne> is definitely not right

00:01:49  <hannah777> yeah that seems odd :P

00:02:29  <FLHerne> What command are you running exactly?

00:02:32  <FLHerne> and what OS?

00:02:38  <hannah777> openttd -D on ubuntu

00:02:58  <FLHerne> Have you typed -D f instead of -D -f ?

00:03:18  <hannah777> ive not

00:04:07  <FLHerne> Huh, can reproduce here

00:04:13  <FLHerne> that's a bit surprising

00:05:16  <hannah777> at least im not crazy!

00:08:12  <FLHerne> ...and now I can't start openttd because of some weird SDL2/wayland bug yay

00:08:29  <hannah777> :(

00:08:52  <FLHerne> Oh, it's the opposite

00:09:18  <FLHerne> I had SDL_VIDEODRIVER=wayland set, but now I'm not using wayland because I broke it so that was wrong

00:10:19  <hannah777> burn all technology, return to monkey

00:10:24  <hannah777> id be fine playing an older version since that worked, do you know where i can download old clients? i think it was 1.9something for the server that worked

00:11:32  <glx> hmm the weird part is hostname "f", IIRC nothing changed in network area for a long time (except recent nightlies)

00:11:47  <FLHerne> hannah777: What are you using now? 1.11.2?

00:11:55  <hannah777> yes

00:12:25  <hannah777> talking about recent, i found an 11 year old forum post with the same problem https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=48334

00:12:27  <hannah777> no solution tho

00:12:54  <FLHerne> TrueBrain made some relevant changes recently, but I think those are only in master/nightlies

00:14:28  <FLHerne> hannah777: Can you try the latest nightly from https://www.openttd.org/downloads/openttd-nightlies/latest.html ?

00:15:00  <FLHerne> might have been fixed in passing by https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/9199

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00:15:48  <DooM> u can always use ip option on dedicated server

00:16:02  <DooM> hostname isnt exactly the best to use dedicated tho

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00:16:09  <FLHerne> If you really want older builds, you can get them from https://cdn.openttd.org/openttd-releases/1.11.2/ with different number

00:16:57  <FLHerne> If you find out which the latest version that works for you is, that would be useful to know

00:18:30  <FLHerne> but please do try the nightly first ;-)

00:18:35  <hannah777> do i just copy the tar contents into the installation directory?

00:18:52  <hannah777> i installed the other build with the .deb file so not sure how to proceed here

00:18:59  <FLHerne> Just untar it and run ./openttd in the directory

00:19:03  <glx> it's better to use a different folder

00:19:04  <FLHerne> it'll work

00:19:10  <hannah777> ah i see thanks

00:19:19  <FLHerne> Don't try to overwrite system paths, that'll make a mess

00:21:07  <glx> check [server_bind_addresses] section in openttd.cfg

00:21:23  <glx> maybe there's an "f=" in it

00:21:58  <_dp_> that's not the first time I see weird hostnames...

00:23:04  <hannah777> same error for the nightly

00:23:04  <glx> I think any "garbage" after -D may be stored permanently in the config

00:23:13  <_dp_> my guess that is because if you even run -D blahblah it adds to the config

00:23:28  <glx> for nightlies it will be in private.cfg

00:23:44  <glx> and removed from openttd.cfg

00:24:01  <glx> just retry 1.11.2 now

00:24:41  <hannah777> i dont see server_bind_addresses in the config

00:25:13  <hannah777> woah

00:25:16  <glx> yeah, you tried a nightly, some values have been moved

00:25:26  <hannah777> yeah it works now what the heck

00:25:49  <hannah777> aaah

00:26:06  <hannah777> okay so if i run it openttd -Df it wont work again. now lets try running nightly again

00:26:20  <glx> up to 1.11 there was [server_bind_addresses] in openttd.cfg, now it's moved to private.cfg

00:26:23  <hannah777> now i see the thing you mentioned in the config

00:29:00  <hannah777> alright and removing it manually makes it work again

00:29:04  <hannah777> thank you all very much

00:29:05  <hannah777> :)

00:33:14  <FLHerne> _dp_: I don't remember *ever* trying to run a dedicated server on this machine, and yet I have that, oh wait

00:33:29  <FLHerne> I did run -D f when I was testing whether it would produce that output when running -D f

00:33:39  <FLHerne> and then I only ran -D on its own after that

00:33:46  <FLHerne> So yeah

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00:34:01  <FLHerne> Automagically persisting typoes seems like a bad idea

00:34:13  <FLHerne> hannah777: Great, goodnight :-)

00:34:46  <hannah777> oh yeah, bedtime. good night!

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12:03:39  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/nml] kaechele opened pull request #228: Fix: define PY_SSIZE_T_CLEAN in _lz77.c https://git.io/JBhfz

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13:06:18  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Jeems4727 commented on issue #9459: [Crash]: Game crashed out of nowhere https://git.io/JBwFt

13:08:51  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on issue #9459: [Crash]: Game crashed out of nowhere https://git.io/JBwFt

13:08:54  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed issue #9459: [Crash]: Game crashed out of nowhere https://git.io/JBwFt

13:09:21  <LordAro> aw, i had a half written response

13:09:26  <LordAro> TB's is better though

13:09:32  <TrueBrain> sorry :P

13:09:36  <LordAro> :p

13:09:39  <TrueBrain> but this ticket already dragged on waaayyyyy too long :)

13:15:29  <LordAro> yup

13:15:41  <glx> only 4GB on windows 10 is quite low

13:16:07  <TrueBrain> having more than one tab in your Chrome browser == asking for problems

13:16:10  <TrueBrain> no matter how much RAM :P

13:16:44  <glx> an active twitch chat in firefox is as worse :)

13:17:17  <TrueBrain> OpenTTD in Firefox with console open is equally worse :P

13:17:21  <TrueBrain> reloading doesn't free the memory

13:17:25  <TrueBrain> you run out of memory REALLY quick :)

13:17:38  <glx> yeah you need to close the tab to clear

13:17:49  <TrueBrain> only happens if you open the console, weirdly enough

13:19:37  <LordAro> dev console or OTTD console?

13:19:42  <LordAro> one would be weirder than the other :p

13:19:52  <TrueBrain> first :)

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13:46:42  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #9461: Fix 68f2213: Don't use GetPoolSize() for end of pool iterator https://git.io/JBhBU

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14:13:12  <Samu> i need an ai that crushes my road vehicles to test this

14:14:34  <Samu> I have a bad feeling this won't work

14:17:24  <Samu> but first, going to test 5000 rvs/5000 ships with 250k ops very fast, 4k map, see how much game speed I get

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15:50:36  <andythenorth> solitaire so addictive

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16:22:52  <TrueBrain> poor andythenorth 

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16:27:39  <andythenorth> 48 hours of spider

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16:30:14  <TrueBrain> so .... are we going to delete the lobby window?

16:30:24  <TrueBrain> guess one of us should just make a PR doing that, and see if it gets approved or not? :P

16:30:31  <Rubidium> you have been lobbying for it ;)

16:30:54  <TrueBrain> really? RREAAALLLYYYY??!!! :P He went there ...... :P

16:30:55  <TrueBrain> :D

16:32:51  <TrueBrain> but you have to admit, it is a shitty flow :P

16:33:11  <Rubidium> though, can you set servers to disallow spectators? That might make things tricky (or a minimum change)

16:33:32  <TrueBrain> yeah, and I am also not sure just removing it would be good for the flow

16:33:44  <TrueBrain> it might surprise people too much .. as you have to spot tiny buttons to press to join a company

16:37:42  <TrueBrain> for sure the current window doesn't work .. people just blindly press "New Company", no matter what their intentions are .. it creates a connection to the server and closes it after query .. it is slow in showing companies because of that ..

16:37:51  <TrueBrain> and in general I doubt people ever used it for what it is intended

16:38:14  <TrueBrain> just joining the server sounds like a good idea, but indeed we would have to remove spectator limits .. or at least set a higher low-bar :P

16:38:27  <TrueBrain> but when joined, only showing the multiplayer window is weird and frustrating

16:38:40  <TrueBrain> so I have been thinking about stuff like: remember what company you last joined a server on

16:38:45  <TrueBrain> and if still available, rejoin it

16:39:05  <TrueBrain> and replace "Join Game" with "Join Game" and "Spectate Game"

16:39:19  <TrueBrain> (and remove the lobby window)

16:41:04  <TrueBrain> I dunno .. I lack inspiration to "fix" this .. for sure I know people will ask about the double-turn-window now :P

16:42:35  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8398: Change: Distribute left over cargo to stations according to the highest remainder https://git.io/JLuoN

16:43:52  <glx> is https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/compare/master...glx22:script_events a good idea ?

16:44:13  <TrueBrain> who is going to set that to false?

16:45:32  <TrueBrain> (or worded differently: where do you see the use-case for this?)

16:46:08  <glx> I think there are AIs not checking events

16:46:42  <glx> so their event stack just grows uselessly

16:47:02  <TrueBrain> feels like a bug in any AI, if they are not subscribed to Events? It is part of the tutorial :D

16:47:46  <TrueBrain> what is the function to poll events again?

16:48:46  <glx> https://docs.openttd.org/ai-api/classAIEventController.html#a6d378298663c513bcb23a2ce30b6b50f and https://docs.openttd.org/gs-api/classGSEventController.html#af495cff743df3f101927ce9bacd215d3

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16:49:44  <glx> ideally it may be possible to detect calls to this function during script compilation, but looks like a not easy task

16:50:05  <TrueBrain> my problem with such settings, it just creates more fuzz for users to take care off

16:50:09  <TrueBrain> it doesn't make things simpler

16:51:24  <LordAro> glx: doesn't fix existing AI though

16:51:28  <LordAro> which is most of the issue

16:51:45  <glx> yeah, that's why autodetect would be better

16:52:06  <LordAro> super hacky though

16:52:08  <TrueBrain> okay, raw values: 451 uploaded AI versions do events, 137 do not .. but many of those are older versions of which never do .. lets see if I can deduplcate ..

16:52:56  <TrueBrain> never = newer

16:52:59  <TrueBrain> bah, nasty tpo :P

16:54:04  <glx> (and another one)

16:54:27  <TrueBrain> some are not by accident glx ;)

16:54:35  <TrueBrain> 47 AIs do, 25 do not handle events

16:54:39  <TrueBrain> I think

16:55:19  <glx> also I noticed regression AI checks for events, but there's none before it finishes

16:55:43  <TrueBrain> glx: as alternative, we can trigger a warning in the AI logs when the event-stack gets above a certain amount and we never seen a call to NextEvent

16:58:46  <glx> that's also an option yes

16:59:21  * andythenorth wonders if spider solitaire is always winnable

16:59:37  <TrueBrain> andythenorth: go solve the 3x+1 problem instead

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16:59:42  <glx> I think all games are winnable in theory

16:59:48  <andythenorth> 99.991% of draws are winnable according to [internet]

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17:00:12  <LordAro> and yet i keep getting myself into unwinnable scenarioes

17:00:14  <TrueBrain> so you can always blame the 0.009%, instead of your own poor game-choices :D

17:00:18  <LordAro> i blame you for this, andythenorth

17:00:37  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8461: Feature: Permanent rivers https://git.io/JLS3A

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17:09:42  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8609: Fix: Equalise the number of frames needed for road vehicles to traverse different radius curves https://git.io/JtnEF

17:14:24  <Samu> game speed around 1.00x - 1.10x, with 5000 rvs + 5000 ships + ai with 250k ops very fast on a 4k map

17:14:37  <Samu> i'm pleased

17:14:52  <Samu> now gonna enable aircraft, and i bet it's gonna be ruined

17:44:31  <andythenorth> I blame Wolf01 for spider

17:44:35  <andythenorth> or maybe Eddi|zuHause 

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18:09:58  <TrueBrain> just anyone not you? :)

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18:23:43  <frosch123> i vote for removing "max_spectators". "max_clients" is enough

18:24:29  <frosch123> it's super weird, if you are in a company and you can't leave it because there are too many spectators :p

18:41:42  * andythenorth won solitaire

18:44:12  <frosch123> do the card still jump over the screen like they did 30 years ago?

18:50:24  <Timberwolf> more to the pint, do they go impossibly fast bwcause the timing loop is still calibrated for a 386, like they did 20 years ago?

18:50:31  <andythenorth> not in this variant :P

19:04:57  <glx> I vote for always join as spectator with the client list open, number of click to join or create a company will be the same as with lobby window

19:11:16  <Wolf01> [20:41:41] * andythenorth won solitaire <- spider?

19:14:36  <nielsm> agree with glx, joining everyone as spectator by default is better

19:14:57  <nielsm> it will also save many servers for the headache of cleaning empty companies left by players joining to look around

19:14:57  <andythenorth> spider

19:17:48  <TrueBrain> glx: that alone is not enough I think .. maybe a dialog to tell you joined as spectator? Especially to help people getting used to it?

19:18:11  <glx> people read dialogs ?

19:18:47  <TrueBrain> Otherwise the flow is pretty confusing, especially if you have played the game before

19:20:03  <TrueBrain> "Welcome to Nnn! You joined as spectator. Use the client list to either join a company or start a new one."

19:20:24  <TrueBrain> Maybe only show it the first time you join any server? Dunno

19:20:36  <frosch123> can servers configure a MOTD?

19:20:44  <glx> they can

19:20:48  <glx> via script

19:20:52  <frosch123> some servers use chat for that

19:21:02  <frosch123> but we could provide a default message

19:21:16  <frosch123> servers may have custom rules about joining/creating companies

19:21:23  <TrueBrain> Motd dialog? Hmm

19:22:04  <frosch123> motd could be shown in the client list

19:22:06  <TrueBrain> Almost a gamescipt

19:22:09  <frosch123> so it is also readable later

19:22:49  <TrueBrain> We still need to add something to sync servername to clients too, so adding motd would be trivial 

19:22:57  <frosch123> i guess difference would be: in-game tooltips about how to join companies would be translated

19:23:01  <frosch123> while motd would probably not

19:23:32  <TrueBrain> Via gamescript it would :p

19:23:35  <frosch123> but multiplayer and translations is always weird

19:23:44  <TrueBrain> But that requires allowing multiple gses

19:25:02  <TrueBrain> I think it is a good idea, at least for now, to do a motd dialog, with a good default.

19:25:26  <TrueBrain> And yeah, it won't be translatable .. but we can't have it all :)

19:25:55  <TrueBrain> And indeed remove max spectators

19:41:21  <nielsm> Timberwolf: here's solitaire from windows nt 3.51 running on my windows 10 machine: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/538081719111122999/872202017618141204/2021-08-03_21-38-55.mp4

19:41:58  <nielsm> and if anyone needs that version for something, here's a copy: https://0x0.st/-4e-.zip

19:47:20  <frosch123> something is wrong with the mouse position :p

19:49:44  <nielsm> my recording software isn't entirely compatible with per-monitor DPI scaling

20:01:09  <andythenorth> oof 1 hour to win that one

20:01:17  * andythenorth very not doing newgrf :P

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20:42:43  <Timberwolf> nielsm: nippy!

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22:24:11  <glx> oh dead AIs still receive events

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