IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-09-28
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07:51:05 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7639: Fix: Total reset of DMusic driver once every hour https://git.io/JeZgm
07:51:05 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed pull request #7639: Fix: Total reset of DMusic driver once every hour https://git.io/fj6Q2
07:59:25 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZgZ
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10:31:41 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZ26
10:32:39 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii updated pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZlF
10:35:42 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZ2M
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10:49:35 <andythenorth> but where is cat?
11:19:03 <TrueBrain> as long as it is not in /usr/sbin
11:22:36 <TrueBrain> so .. what was I going to do today ... yeah, come to terms with the fact that managed infrastructure is expensive :P
11:23:21 <TrueBrain> a managed database server is 15 dollar a month
11:23:31 <TrueBrain> are "we" willing to pay for that .. hmm
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11:30:31 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii updated pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZlF
11:31:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZaZ
11:55:52 <andythenorth> TrueBrain: I always enjoy spending money :D
11:56:05 <andythenorth> then there is someone to blame :P
11:58:15 <TrueBrain> it is just such irony, that I try to keep everything as cheap as possible for OpenTTD .. while at work you are doing the right thing (tm)
11:58:23 <Wolf01> Spending money, hmmm...
12:01:06 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed pull request #7540: Change: New layout for the Station view window https://git.io/fjsc0
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12:03:22 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output. https://git.io/fhjJc
12:07:10 <TrueBrain> stalebot no longer running? :D
12:09:21 <Wolf01> <Wolf01> Spending money, hmmm... <- done
12:13:19 <TrueBrain> seems the stalebot was de-registered or something .. not sure if that was by choice, or because GitHub changed things :D
12:16:11 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7486: Fix: AI/GS settings with the flag SCRIPTCONFIG_RANDOM could be altered after loading from a savegame. https://git.io/JeZad
12:36:19 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale https://git.io/JeZVm
12:36:31 <TrueBrain> there, that should fix silly stalebot being out to play
12:36:53 <TrueBrain> testing is a bit difficult ... at least it triggers correctly :D
12:37:29 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale https://git.io/JeZVY
12:39:14 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7749: Fix: Some typos found using codespell https://git.io/JeZVs
12:40:44 <TrueBrain> hmm .. no, my PR doesn't do what I want it to do :(
12:40:51 <TrueBrain> a comment doesn't remove the stale label
12:41:23 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale https://git.io/JeZVn
12:41:23 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed pull request #7753: Change: [GitHub] switch from stalebot to actions/stale https://git.io/JeZVm
12:42:08 <TrueBrain> right .. so then I need to know if it was disabled on purpose or not :D (I can imagine both ways)
12:46:50 <TrueBrain> LordAro: you happen to know if stalebot got disabled on purpose? Can we just reactive it? :D
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13:11:33 <LordAro> TrueBrain: on purpose
13:11:41 <LordAro> it was closing things before anyone got to them
13:13:09 <andythenorth> the important thing
13:13:23 <andythenorth> is that the backlog of things to get to should keep growing :)
13:14:43 <TrueBrain> LordAro: and so why not reconfigure to give more time?
13:15:16 <TrueBrain> (honest question btw; trying to understand :D)
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13:42:46 <andythenorth> TrueBrain wonder what the rate of closing PRs is, moving average
13:42:51 <andythenorth> we have the data :P
13:43:38 <andythenorth> stalebot should close at 90% of the average approval time :P
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14:21:17 <LordAro> TrueBrain: can't remember, but also the fact that several of us didn't like things being closed arbitrarily anyway
14:21:43 <LordAro> see if planetmaker or peter1138 can remember
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15:14:15 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZrH
15:21:56 <glx> looking at #7752, it seems commit checker doesn't work correctly
15:22:42 <glx> it's supposed to validate each commit, but it doesn't fail
15:25:58 <LordAro> it usually manages it..
15:26:06 <LordAro> are you surr it's not github ui screwing up?
15:26:59 <glx> every where I checked I can see 6 commits
15:32:01 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZoe
15:38:06 <TrueBrain> LordAro: yeah, we have been up and down that road ;) Keeping them open is not any better :P But tnx, I noticed that probot got a few changes, so good to know it was not a system error :D
15:39:44 <TrueBrain> right, back to the dilemma of: how to run a new database for OpenTTD ..
15:46:41 <frosch123> still master server?
15:46:59 <TrueBrain> currently, yes. But also mediawiki has to be moved sooner rather then later
15:47:12 <TrueBrain> for MS, I can use a simple MongoDB setup
15:47:14 <frosch123> i never understood why masterserver db is so persistent
15:47:35 <andythenorth> what does it do?
15:47:39 <andythenorth> it's a mystery to me :)
15:47:48 <andythenorth> is it the thing that lists servers?
15:47:54 <TrueBrain> back in those days there was a wish to do more data sciency stuff with that data
15:48:00 <TrueBrain> but I guess that is not really relevant anymore
15:48:22 <TrueBrain> frosch123: but it needs some form of persistancy, for a website to list the servers
15:48:51 <andythenorth> rolling restarts :P
15:48:53 <TrueBrain> yeah, well, we had people who totally freaked out if their server got another ID
15:49:05 <TrueBrain> because they wrote HTML parsing scripts to publish a banner on their site telling how the server was doing
15:49:06 <andythenorth> are they here making PRs? :)
15:49:12 <TrueBrain> (instead of polling their own server directly :P)
15:49:20 <andythenorth> ignore me, I have a scorched earth policy :P
15:49:53 <TrueBrain> there used to be a script that removed all servers not online for 90+ days
15:50:04 <TrueBrain> so we no longer have a script that removes old servers :P
15:50:10 <andythenorth> databases are so boring
15:50:13 <TrueBrain> space-wise, it really really doesn't matter
15:50:34 <andythenorth> I have this troll idea of trying to use git as a database
15:50:45 <TrueBrain> so that a server from 2015 is listed .. I really don't care, honestly :P
15:50:49 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZoY
15:50:54 <frosch123> andythenorth: doesn't moinwiki do that?
15:51:12 <TrueBrain> still I wonder how I am going to do database stuff for OpenTTD ..
15:51:13 <andythenorth> if complex queries aren't needed, and infrequent writes
15:51:27 <TrueBrain> easiest is to get the managed database from DigitalOcean
15:51:32 <andythenorth> grownups can do grownup things
15:51:39 <TrueBrain> or we want to get ride of mediawiki :P
15:51:40 <andythenorth> TrueBrain serverless no? o_O
15:51:50 <andythenorth> what's that hosted wiki?
15:52:19 <andythenorth> yeah wikia fandom thing
15:52:25 <TrueBrain> hmm .. for some reason I did not consider hosted wikis .. funny
15:52:47 <andythenorth> delete the wiki, move it to fandom
15:52:48 <TrueBrain> so used to doing everything ourself
15:52:58 <TrueBrain> pretty sure that is a terrible move :P
15:53:13 <andythenorth> let the community do it?
15:54:34 <TrueBrain> yeah, so in 5 years it might have done 2%?
15:54:38 <TrueBrain> I mean .. be realistic :P
15:55:06 <andythenorth> we have to have a wiki?
15:55:24 <TrueBrain> I assumed the same; but, assumption
15:55:33 <TrueBrain> and we need to do something with it ..
15:55:46 <TrueBrain> leaving it as it is, is not an option
15:55:47 <milek7> does server list really needs any DB?
15:55:50 <glx> can't we move wiki to github ?
15:56:07 <TrueBrain> glx: you could; but who is going to? :)
15:56:29 <milek7> couldn't be just in memory structure in master server daemon?
15:57:22 <andythenorth> delete wiki, see who complains?
15:57:27 <andythenorth> it is useful as docs though
15:57:35 <TrueBrain> we have a lot of hits on our wiki daily
15:57:59 <milek7> and ID could be hash of IP and name or something
15:58:39 <TrueBrain> hmm .. looking more closely at the stats, there is 1 bot that is doing 10% of the hits
15:58:41 <TrueBrain> I should fix that ...
15:59:22 <TrueBrain> at least 40% of the traffic is bots
15:59:51 <TrueBrain> anyway, 0.5 million visits a month hit the wiki
15:59:57 <glx> andythenorth still wanting to delete everything :)
16:00:00 <TrueBrain> (unique visitors with a window of 1 day)
16:00:29 <andythenorth> there's something appealing about burning everything
16:03:17 <TrueBrain> bitnami seems to be the only one who offers mediawiki in k8s, which requires MariaDB
16:03:54 <TrueBrain> moving FlySpray to GitHub was a no-brainer .. but wikis are more difficult :P
16:05:19 <glx> hmm the script will lose wiki history
16:05:48 <TrueBrain> but also converts it to a format that might not work :D
16:05:52 <frosch123> it will probably also lose templates and expression magic
16:06:03 <TrueBrain> given the size of our wiki, there will be an issue anyway, to convert it to what-ever :P
16:06:05 <milek7> lots of messages. but false positives mostly
16:07:00 <TrueBrain> all I know we need to do something about the wiki, infrastructure wise; and sooner is better
16:09:55 <glx> IIRC updating wiki software is usually a pain too
16:10:12 <TrueBrain> just ... a tiny bit
16:10:29 <TrueBrain> many promises over the years of people updating it ;) It is ... not trivial
16:11:05 <andythenorth> wiki -> jekyll :P
16:11:17 <andythenorth> we could appoint an editor to approve commits
16:11:24 <andythenorth> like we approve translators right? :)
16:11:46 <TrueBrain> the amount of changes to the wiki is ... very low
16:12:10 <TrueBrain> also, lot of pages are out-dated or not useful :P
16:12:38 <TrueBrain> I can make a static copy of the wiki and put that in a git :D
16:12:48 <andythenorth> sometimes I think about making actual official docs
16:12:55 <andythenorth> then I remember not to smoke crack
16:13:41 <TrueBrain> the more I think about it, the more GitHub wiki sounds lovely :P
16:13:48 <TrueBrain> just not sure what the limitations are :D
16:15:35 <TrueBrain> either way, I take any suggestions what to do with the wiki .. but time is running short, as we have been delaying this for over 2 years now :P
16:16:58 <andythenorth> do we fail out pentest if we don't upgrade?
16:17:13 <TrueBrain> on the topic of things that start to misbehave in ways I have increasingly more difficulty keeping it alive: frosch123, how is BaNaNaS 2 going? :D (any answer goes, not trying to pressure or anything)
16:17:22 <glx> GitHub Pages sites are subject to the following usage limits:
16:17:22 <glx> GitHub Pages source repositories have a recommended limit of 1GB .
16:17:22 <glx> Published GitHub Pages sites may be no larger than 1 GB.
16:17:22 <glx> GitHub Pages sites have a soft bandwidth limit of 100GB per month.
16:17:22 <glx> GitHub Pages sites have a soft limit of 10 builds per hour.
16:17:39 <TrueBrain> Pages != Wiki, btw :)
16:17:49 <TrueBrain> but Pages is also a good solution (the website basically is a GitHub Pages)
16:17:56 <TrueBrain> (website == www.openttd.org)
16:19:08 <frosch123> i think i have retired from ottd
16:19:20 <frosch123> so unlikely to continue on anything
16:19:28 <TrueBrain> you think? Who do we need to bribe to change that? :P
16:19:39 <TrueBrain> fair enough frosch123, tnx for the answer :)
16:22:42 <andythenorth> frosch123 :( have you got addicted to Blitz?
16:22:44 <TrueBrain> glx: mind giving that mediawiki to markdown a look? Just for shit and giggles? :P
16:23:31 <glx> as using windows doesn't seem a good idea for that :)
16:27:00 <glx> of course the VM needs to check the disks
16:28:45 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZo5
16:29:57 <TrueBrain> okay; so the master server is kinda done; it just needs some persistent storage and a web component .. but that is easy :P CloudFlare seems to be working fine too on staging to replace the CDN of DO (which often gives timeouts and 404s on files that exist) .. so that is good too. That leaves the wiki and BaNaNaS. The latter I have some ideas to at
16:29:57 <TrueBrain> least bring it in a modern world (without changing functionality in any form) .. if that is done, the main part left is our developers email .. and I am sure we can work that out :P
16:30:28 <spnda> In NML, does anyone know the variable name for a switch to get a different sprite depending on cargo amount in the vehicle?
16:30:42 <TrueBrain> now all I need is some time, or people actually helping out :D
16:32:02 <glx> ok very useful comment on the PR :)
16:32:27 <TrueBrain> haha, someone hit send without intending to :P
16:33:50 <andythenorth> spnda: you got the NML docs?
16:37:08 <spnda> Thanks, so I guess cargo_count then
16:37:34 <andythenorth> I can paste example code if you need it, but it's pretty easy
16:37:40 <spnda> Nope, I think I got this
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16:54:27 <spnda> So uh, how do I use 32bpp sprites?
16:54:49 <glx> 32bpp blitter is enough IIRC
16:54:58 <frosch123> meh, the cppcon videos seem to be very low quality this year... on this one the talk and the slides are like 30s desynced
16:55:03 <spnda> I saw its something with alternative_sprite. No idea what 32bpp blitter is either
16:55:32 <glx> blitter is on OTTD side :)
16:55:45 <frosch123> spnda: define the regular spritesets for the 8bpp sprites, then add 32bpp sprites via alternative_sprites
16:56:00 <frosch123> altenative_sprites referenes the spriteset, and has to use the same order of sprites
16:56:18 <spnda> Not exactly sure what you mean. Do you have any example code?
16:57:32 <frosch123> but you can also look at opengfx (which has 2x gui sprites) or yeti/nuts (32bpp sprites)
16:58:00 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] abmyii commented on pull request #7752: Prevent sounds being produced by inactive industries https://git.io/JeZKO
16:58:12 <spnda> Do I NEED to add 8bpp sprites aswell?
16:58:23 <frosch123> 8bpp 1x zoom sprites are mandatory
16:58:37 <frosch123> V has a script to autognerate them from 32bpp, which doesn't look too bad
16:59:02 <spnda> I think he posted it on Discord once
16:59:29 <frosch123> rgbaeater or something
16:59:39 <frosch123> yeah, probably that one
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17:24:32 <spnda> Do I need some switch or new property for adding the 32bpp sprites? nmlc is giving some weird errors about undefined identifiers, which are clearly defined.
17:25:03 <glx> alternative_sprites should be enough
17:25:05 <andythenorth> supermop_Home_: you here? o_O
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18:29:07 * andythenorth will stop now :P
18:33:12 <LordAro> glx: i've never been very impressed with github wikis
18:33:18 <LordAro> they're not very user friendly
18:44:05 <glx> {|style="width="100%"; border=1" <-- of course it fails
18:52:25 <glx> hmm it doesn't like {{Wikitable}} either
18:55:19 <glx> ok so converting from wikimedia to gfm is a pain :)
18:56:51 <glx> and I only tried on the first 1035 pages
19:00:02 <glx> getting the page list is very annoying
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19:12:47 <andythenorth> now up to 132 different types of intermodal container
19:12:54 <andythenorth> quite addictive drawing them
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19:38:36 <glx> so many pages with weird code
19:38:59 <TrueBrain> for a while there was some quality control, but I am pretty sure that got lost somewhere :D
19:39:08 <TrueBrain> there are a ton of good pages
19:39:12 <TrueBrain> but even more not-so-good :P
19:40:29 <glx> converted doesn't like it
19:41:18 <glx> I already fixed too much in the xml, I give up
19:41:20 <andythenorth> can it spit out a list of malformed pages?
19:42:03 <glx> no it justs stop on the first error
19:42:20 <glx> anyway I was only testing on a subset
19:42:55 <glx> too much human work required to use it
19:43:18 <milek7> could pandoc deal with it?
19:45:13 <glx> but the most annoying part is to get the xml
19:50:43 <glx> Error at "source" (line 40, column 1): <-- so easy when the actual line in the xml is 31866
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20:49:19 <Samu> hum... nielsm I can't work on fixes on this computer.
20:54:10 <Samu> I'm still in a temporary situation/solution, I don't even have access to my home
20:54:36 <Samu> I can't do much to remedy any PR until my life stabilizes
20:55:26 <Samu> if it stabilizes. The death of my father turned the situation more complicated for me
20:57:29 <Samu> I was able to make some work on my AI only thx to programs that don't require admin rights
20:58:03 <Samu> but openttd PRs is something I can't do anything about now
21:01:31 <nielsm> family and health obviously come before leisure projects
21:01:51 <nielsm> you asked about that bug earlier so I took another look at it
21:03:54 <Samu> what I'm saying, basically, I can't fix my own PR's, somebody has to take over
21:05:36 <Samu> I can leave comments, but that's as much as I can do here
21:10:39 <peter1138> Shit, sorry to hear that :(
21:16:40 <Samu> had to give away my cats, too :(
21:20:17 <Samu> can't be living with my brother, my N cousins, my aunts, I'm on a residence kind of place, temporarily
21:20:56 <Samu> with 20's other ppl with problems
21:21:53 <Samu> they say, I don't quite fit here for the type of problems I have
21:23:52 <Samu> awaiting for an answer to my situation, which can take weeks, or months
21:24:34 <Samu> another lair, where I'll be making my life.
21:25:43 <Samu> that's when and where I was promissed I'd get my computer
21:26:25 <Samu> personally, I doubt that I'll ever get my hands on my computer ever again
21:55:34 <andythenorth> is it possible that this be fixed for 1.10.0?
21:59:44 <Samu> true - adds random deviation to 'start_date'
22:00:27 <Samu> false - doesn't add random deviation to 'start_date' (was added some other time)
22:00:43 <Samu> it's a problem with random AIs
22:02:08 <Samu> the original bug: random deviation doesn't occur for random ais, then I added a fix, which in turn made it add random deviation twice to random ais, then that bool all was the workaround, making it behave as being added deviation only once
22:02:44 <Samu> referring only about the start_date parameter
22:03:19 <Samu> deviations to other parameters were fine already
22:03:35 <glx> would be easier to just remove start_date
22:04:19 <Samu> manually selected AIs don't have any issues
22:05:49 <Samu> there a PR about reworking start_date too
22:17:00 <Samu> was unable to test it properly
22:19:56 <Samu> somebody plz test multiplayer
22:20:43 <Samu> requires firewall permissions, and I have no admin rights
22:21:07 <LordAro> pretty sure it doesn't "require" any firewall changes
22:21:13 <LordAro> especially because it's all local
22:21:28 <LordAro> it might ask for them, but local stuff should work fine
22:21:59 <Samu> nop, doesn't work, it isn't listed
22:23:09 <LordAro> listing will require talking externally, yes
22:23:16 <LordAro> but this is just a LAN game
22:26:16 <Samu> wow, i didn't know of that
22:26:28 <Samu> it seems to work, no desync
22:32:21 <Samu> base = GameSettings was perhaps an exageration
22:33:04 <Samu> could be just a gui setting
22:35:14 <Samu> ah no, it needs to be saved
22:35:35 <Samu> must be GameSettings then
22:35:53 <Samu> it's just that it doesn't require to be sync'ed
22:42:38 <peter1138> I'd say it is (at least) 16 bits.
22:42:49 <Samu> max value is 3600, it could be less than 65535
22:43:10 <LordAro> peter1138: i would expect a type named uint16 to be exactly 16 bits
22:43:44 <glx> uint16 is the minimal size for anything between 256 and 65535
22:44:16 <LordAro> it's not uint_least16_t
22:44:51 <LordAro> (which, coincidentally, is the same as unsigned int)
22:47:34 <Samu> there is no SLE_UINT12 right?
22:47:49 <Samu> i think SLE_UINT16 is fine then
22:54:12 <nielsm> peter1138: the uintXX_t types are specified to always be exactly that bit width, but the compiler is not required to offer them if the platform doesn't have a native type of the size
22:55:00 <peter1138> Sorry I didn't see that Samu had asked "how big is uint16_t"
22:55:24 <LordAro> oh, there's static asserts just below
22:56:20 <nielsm> well what if you compile on a platform where char is 32 bits
22:56:25 <nielsm> and short is also 32 bits
22:56:37 <nielsm> and int is also 32 bits
22:56:59 <LordAro> i'd punch the compiler writers for being so stupid
22:58:31 <nielsm> it'd be a platform not really suited for ottd anyway :P
22:58:38 <nielsm> a DSP chip or something weird
23:00:03 <peter1138> Or a 36-bit architecture from the 70s.
23:01:42 <nielsm> but maybe those typedefs should be replaced with stdint.h types
23:01:50 <nielsm> since all supported compilers should have that now
23:02:25 <nielsm> msvc didn't have it until 2013 or something
23:03:49 <glx> hmm after cmake it would be nice to reorder files in the src
23:04:03 <nielsm> you mean directory structure?
23:04:12 <nielsm> yeah some of it isn't very good
23:04:40 <glx> MSVC project was nice for that
23:04:40 <nielsm> there's too many random things under the generic "source code" category in current vs projects
23:05:21 <nielsm> I'd love to have things structured by "feature" instead of by "tech"
23:05:34 <glx> but categories are all virtual, most of stuff was still in src
23:07:07 <glx> generic "source code" will be worse with cmake
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