IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-06-29
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08:23:06 <reldred> Hmm, this action2 chain wasn't too bad to write in the end
08:23:21 <reldred> a lot easier when it's not 4am and you're sober
09:27:20 <reldred> LordAro: to be fair it took being drunk at 4am to come up with the logic for the action2 chain, but yes, it took being sober to actually implement it...
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10:15:14 <nielsm> or "git gud" as it's called ;)
10:15:35 <reldred> well my makefiles are working a lot better now
10:15:43 <reldred> nested includes working nicely
10:16:01 <reldred> so I only have to write action2 chains once >:D
10:16:43 <reldred> a lot less errors from nforenum when I process
10:58:57 <peter1138> My Windows tablet just updated.
10:59:02 <peter1138> Welcome to the April 2018 update
10:59:24 <reldred> May 2019 made my surface go feel a bit snappier
10:59:31 <reldred> might just be the drugs though
10:59:57 <peter1138> It is downloading cumulative updates for version 1803, so it is actually on the April 2018 update!
11:00:38 <peter1138> This is an HP 7 tablet, kinda small and chunky. And slow.
11:01:01 <peter1138> I can't remember if it started life with Windows 7 or 8.
11:05:01 <reldred> I like the surface go
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11:23:00 <reldred> sigh, now the fun part of testing
11:23:09 <reldred> sitting and watching a town on fast forward for a few decades
11:30:00 <michi_cc> peter1138: Any opinions on PRs #7627 and #7628?
11:30:40 <reldred> Is there any limits on how many newobjects can be spawned onto a map? I'm wondering if I should start doing silly things with them next
11:50:55 <reldred> Sigh damnit I've got an edge case that's causing one of my buildings to sit and just animate through its construction stages -_-
11:56:17 <andythenorth> North American Buildings!
11:58:07 <michi_cc> Haven't really looked at the code, but I like the idea.
12:00:14 <andythenorth> so many other projects :P
12:00:33 <reldred> that's oooh neat to both american iron horse and multi tile docks btw
12:00:45 <reldred> arguably leaning more in favor of the choo choo trains :P
12:01:07 <reldred> an updated polished up version of NARS would be nice
12:02:43 <andythenorth> give me a couple of years :P
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14:39:12 <peter1138> Is it lunch time yet?
14:39:29 <reldred> it's always lunch time somewhere
14:39:48 <andythenorth> probably lunch time
14:39:54 <andythenorth> I have coffee with sugar in
14:39:59 <andythenorth> can that be mistaken for lunch?
14:40:12 <peter1138> Why would you ruin coffee with sugar?
14:40:21 <andythenorth> normally I wouldn't
14:40:24 <andythenorth> but I was hungry
14:40:52 <andythenorth> is it too sunny to merge some PRs?
14:42:37 <reldred> the stars are not in alignment. you can't see them yet but give it some time.
14:43:14 <reldred> ahhh I think I fixed my disco flicker building
15:13:34 <reldred> ahah, so action2s for houses support multiple sprites per tile since like forever
15:14:34 <reldred> yeah, trying to figure out how better to handle the Chicago School varients of which there are far too many
15:14:48 <reldred> problem is I received them in already assembled form
15:15:06 <reldred> but I want more variety and to mix and match the larger CS buildings with smaller buildings
15:15:23 <reldred> maybe even get one of the tall deco buildings in there for the available combinations.
15:24:46 <andythenorth> peter1138: have you fixed my Horse sprite offsets yet? o_O
15:31:50 <reldred> damnit so I'd still have to assemble all of the combinations and make a seperate extended action 2 for them and then randomly choose between those?
15:32:29 <reldred> here I was hoping I could point the building sprite number at a random action2
15:32:39 <reldred> but no it points at the action1
15:42:20 <reldred> could I just make a varact2 that has two valid matche? or would that break the universe?
15:42:35 <reldred> or would only the first match get used?
15:42:57 <andythenorth> I haven't done houses
15:43:07 <andythenorth> is it action 3 -> action 2 -> action 1?
15:43:27 <andythenorth> random varact 2?
15:43:53 <reldred> that's the point though, I want to layer two buildings on one tile but have each building be determined randomly
15:44:16 <andythenorth> so there might be 4 combinations>?
15:44:22 <reldred> from what I can see though even though I can declare two action1's on an action2 that still means I have to create an action2 for each possible combinations
15:44:47 <reldred> Oh we're talking already 8*16 combinations already in the current setup
15:44:47 <andythenorth> I would expect so
15:45:04 <reldred> with the 8 being 8 seperate action0 buildings.
15:45:14 <andythenorth> combinatorial sprites means combinatorial action 2s iirc
15:45:20 <andythenorth> just automate it all :P
15:45:36 <reldred> oh I'm nowhere near that smart :P
15:47:37 <andythenorth> but I automate all the newgrf stuff
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15:54:35 <reldred> yeap just confirmed if you have multiple matches in a varact2 it uses the first match
15:54:54 <reldred> bugger I was hoping I could be a smartarse with that
16:08:27 <snail_UES_> can depots be coded so that they’re covered with snow when needed? like stations?
16:10:08 * andythenorth checks GH issues
16:22:09 <snail_UES_> andythenorth: from MB’s screenshot, I understand it’s possible?
16:25:11 <snail_UES_> but the issue was closed? so the terrain will always be snowless...?
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18:02:53 <andythenorth> snail_UES_: done any French wagons yet? o_O
18:03:24 <snail_UES_> andythenorth: the narrow gauge set has been complete for a while now :)
18:03:47 <snail_UES_> hahaha, don’t hold your breath
18:04:06 <snail_UES_> I had started the SG set a few months ago, but then I got the idea of diversifying the NG depots a bit :p
18:04:18 <andythenorth> there's always a distraction :P
18:04:22 <snail_UES_> and in any case I’ll do the SG steamers first
18:15:14 * andythenorth wonders if we could have a cargo payment multiplier for vehicles
18:15:18 <andythenorth> premium transport
18:40:56 <snail_UES_> andythenorth: a vehicle set can do something similar using cargo aging
18:41:14 <snail_UES_> although the cargo aging function works like a hyperbula… it’s not very effective
18:41:21 <andythenorth> it only works as a nerf
18:41:29 <andythenorth> no option for bonus
18:45:18 <andythenorth> if there was a bonus option would you use it?
18:45:26 <andythenorth> e.g. 1st class pax etc
18:46:10 <snail_UES_> I would. It would be nice to have special refitting options to lower cargo amount, but multiply the revenue by X
18:46:28 <snail_UES_> right now I do this with cargo aging but it has a limited in-game effect
18:46:45 <andythenorth> transport company should be able to set freight rate :P
18:47:13 <snail_UES_> yep, and this would have an effect on the quantity of cargo available at their stations
18:47:32 <snail_UES_> if you set an astronomical rate, no one shows up at your stations, and so forth
19:11:01 <andythenorth> maybe we should patch for it :P
19:14:42 <Eddi|zuHause> <andythenorth> transport company should be able to set freight rate :P <-- if you also come up with a balancing mechanism?
19:15:03 <andythenorth> my intent is per vehicle type
19:15:10 <andythenorth> not per station or per map
19:15:35 <Eddi|zuHause> i would probably have it per route
19:16:11 <Eddi|zuHause> but you compete with some imaginary hidden company that just sets a price depending on some pathfinder penalty
19:17:01 <andythenorth> Railroad Tycoon 3 had 'invisible movers'
19:17:12 <andythenorth> as a hidden competitor
19:17:40 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can charge higher prices if the hidden company has to cross water or mountains
19:18:03 <Eddi|zuHause> and hidden company reduces prices over time, simulating private motorization
19:18:04 <andythenorth> yes, that's precisely how RT3 did it
19:18:18 <andythenorth> except that rivers and coasts dumped the price
19:18:28 <andythenorth> due to easy water transport
19:18:37 <andythenorth> the implementation was really good
19:18:57 <Eddi|zuHause> effect of rivers could stay constant or drop over time
19:19:08 <andythenorth> I talked to the main dev for RT3 though, and he said it was probably too complex and he slightly regretted it
19:19:18 <Eddi|zuHause> it would also be different if you go along or across the river
19:23:32 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai
19:26:39 <snail_UES_> hidden movers were there since RT1 :)
19:27:07 <snail_UES_> neglected cargo would slowly disappear if left at stations
19:27:51 <snail_UES_> station improvements (livestock pens, cold storage…) could reduce this
19:28:10 <snail_UES_> but it wasn’t as sophisticated as to take into account geographical features
19:29:41 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the real question is, how do you introduce a balanced feature into a game that is so blatantly unbalanced?
19:29:55 <andythenorth> probably can't :)
19:30:20 <Eddi|zuHause> could make a blog post about it :p
19:30:29 <Eddi|zuHause> did we have a june blog post?
19:36:20 <andythenorth> let's do one now
19:36:45 <LordAro> almost as if maybe a july post might be more appropriate :p
19:36:52 <LordAro> assuming we actually have anything to talk about
19:37:51 <andythenorth> recent commits are all translations
19:38:03 <andythenorth> couple of minor bug fixes
19:38:25 <LordAro> file still needs renaming
19:38:27 <andythenorth> it's summer, commits drop off
19:38:32 <andythenorth> also TB rage quit
19:38:38 <andythenorth> and NRT was a big thing that is done
19:39:25 <andythenorth> there are some pretty solid PRs waiting for review / approval
19:40:10 <LordAro> i think i'll boot into linux
19:40:19 <LordAro> so i can actually test some of these things
19:41:16 <snail_UES_> andythenorth: if there’s time to work on projects, I’d suggesr 6407 :p
19:41:46 <andythenorth> 49 PRs queued up :)
19:42:16 <LordAro> many of those are waiting-on-author though
19:42:51 <andythenorth> 7441 and 7380 look good to go to me
19:43:03 <andythenorth> 7248 has performance implications that I can't comment on
19:43:45 <andythenorth> has stalebot died?
19:57:50 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth closed pull request #7073: Feature: Generate lock ready rivers upon world generation https://git.io/fhuqz
19:57:51 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #7073: Feature: Generate lock ready rivers upon world generation https://git.io/fjo7h
19:58:21 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth closed pull request #7094: Fix #7088: Retrieve an appropriate name for a non-existant AI/GS when displaying a textfile https://git.io/fhrqY
19:58:22 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on pull request #7094: Fix #7088: Retrieve an appropriate name for a non-existant AI/GS when displaying a textfile https://git.io/fjo5e
19:58:54 <andythenorth> they won't be missed
19:59:02 <LordAro> probably not those, no
20:00:29 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... the steam wishlist is annoying... it doesn't remember me setting it to compact mode
20:01:34 <LordAro> ooh, lots of new warnings when compiling with gcc9
20:05:46 <LordAro> stop breaking the game!
20:05:56 <Eddi|zuHause> backtrace or it didn't happen
20:06:19 <andythenorth> that's reproducible it seems
20:06:36 <Eddi|zuHause> probably a missing or surplus parameter
20:07:30 <Eddi|zuHause> don't suspect things
20:08:45 <andythenorth> I guess I need the debugger?
20:08:49 <andythenorth> it's reproducible
20:09:07 <Eddi|zuHause> that's not really helping
20:09:14 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, debugger would work
20:09:25 <Eddi|zuHause> question here is, which string triggers this
20:11:43 <Eddi|zuHause> did you compile without debug again
20:12:06 <andythenorth> yes, I turned debug off, it appears to dump performance :P
20:12:34 <Eddi|zuHause> there's different debug levels, each one disabling more and more optimizations
20:13:56 <Eddi|zuHause> with less optimizations it's slower, but you can better follow the original code
20:14:09 * andythenorth wonders why debug_level isn't documented as a configure option anywhere online
20:14:32 <Eddi|zuHause> --enable-debug=blah
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20:20:34 <andythenorth> where does it originate?
20:21:03 <Eddi|zuHause> the GetIndustryString function in src/industry_gui.cpp
20:23:10 <Eddi|zuHause> also, how do i get rid of a commit i actually commited to master instead of a branch?
20:25:05 <andythenorth> probably interactive rebase
20:26:21 <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: reset --soft HEAD~1, probably
20:29:14 <Eddi|zuHause> something like that seemed to work
20:32:56 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i'm fairly sure this is a missed sideeffect from 16-in-out
20:33:24 <andythenorth> should I inspect any frames?
20:34:25 <LordAro> backtrace is probably enough
20:35:15 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it's trying to push 20 things to the text stack, which seems to blow it up
20:35:47 <andythenorth> that's interesting
20:36:14 <Eddi|zuHause> StringParameters _global_string_params(_global_string_params_data, 20, _global_string_params_type); <-- 20 is the hardcoded limit
20:36:31 <andythenorth> wonder what I've done in FIRS
20:36:36 <andythenorth> and why it didn't trigger until now
20:38:07 <Eddi|zuHause> probably you added enough input/output things to trigger this
20:38:56 <andythenorth> possible I didn't try to use the industry directory previously
20:39:33 <Eddi|zuHause> that's of course also possible
20:40:29 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: as a workaround you can increase that number in the strings.cpp line i quoted, but there should probably be a proper fix
20:41:18 <Eddi|zuHause> there's some more 20s that probably need to change
20:53:56 <LordAro> good ol magic numbers
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21:06:59 <andythenorth> probably needs an issue opened?
21:15:25 <LordAro> i got distracted from reviewing PRs
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21:45:09 <andythenorth> I'll file an issue for the text stack later :)
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23:00:10 <andythenorth> this text stack issue occurs in a patched OpenTTD
23:00:25 <andythenorth> do I need to repro it in master?
23:00:40 <LordAro> but probably not essential
23:00:52 <Eddi|zuHause> depends on the nature of the patch, mostly
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23:02:42 <glx> LordAro: clang-3.9 image creation fails
23:04:36 <glx> I don't really understand the error
23:05:12 <LordAro> that error is not very helpful though
23:05:35 <LordAro> clang's package is 1:3.8-36
23:05:45 <LordAro> clang-3.9's package is 1:3.9.1-9
23:06:31 <LordAro> gimme a sec, is an easy fix
23:06:48 <Eddi|zuHause> just turn 3.9-* into 3.9*?
23:07:01 <LordAro> not sure why it's listing a version like that anyway
23:07:16 <LordAro> that's the clang-3.8 package
23:07:20 <LordAro> not the clang package :)
23:08:09 <Eddi|zuHause> it'll now do weird things on 3.90 :)
23:09:16 <LordAro> only if they for some reason name the package clang-3.9 :p
23:09:31 <LordAro> and if they somehow completely redid their version numbers
23:09:57 <Eddi|zuHause> is there a reason we use the oldest possible one?
23:10:29 <Eddi|zuHause> (probably libc?)
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23:10:37 <LordAro> no, just what comes with debian stable
23:10:45 <LordAro> so maximum number of people can compile
23:11:02 <LordAro> if we wanted maximum compatibility at *runtime*, we'd need an older libc indeed
23:11:12 <LordAro> (and would probably compile on centos5 or 6)
23:11:48 <glx> runtime is limited by icu too ;)
23:12:28 <Eddi|zuHause> glx: that's probably better included as static link?
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23:14:17 <LordAro> it'd be linked statically as well
23:14:19 <glx> anyway clang is used only for CI
23:14:27 <LordAro> but you don't link libc statically ever
23:14:43 <glx> releases are built for ubuntu and debian only currently
23:15:17 <LordAro> there's an issue about it somewhere :p
23:15:28 <andythenorth> can't paste an lldb stacktrace into github :(
23:21:27 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #7086: Change #6173: Update SDL driver to use SDL 2.0 https://git.io/fjoda
23:21:58 <LordAro> andythenorth: ```\nfoobar\n``` for multiline codeblocks
23:22:48 <LordAro> i've fixed it for you
23:23:00 <andythenorth> much better thanks
23:29:02 <LordAro> andythenorth: does firs have an industry that produces 5 (or more) cargoes?
23:29:21 <LordAro> that will cause the 20 limit to be exceeded
23:29:48 <andythenorth> there is a Bulk Terminal producing 5
23:32:02 <glx> oh it's a nice class around global data
23:32:55 <LordAro> that function's very weird anyway - it sets up all the parameters for 1 of 3 strings, but none of them have more than 7 parameters
23:33:03 <LordAro> unless i'm misunderstanding how SetDParam works
23:33:36 <LordAro> ..which would make sense, given the previous maximum was 2 produced cargoes
23:34:50 <LordAro> quick and dirty fix would be to replace 'lengthof(i->produced_cargo)' with '2' in the 2 for loops inside GetIndustryString
23:44:37 <glx> other option is to increase array size
23:45:11 <glx> looks like only 3 lines need to be touched
23:47:57 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro requested changes for pull request #7441: Feature: Per-group wagon removal flag https://git.io/fjoF8
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