IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-04-24
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09:11:48 <peter1138> I better go to work :/
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10:57:52 <nielsm> "Individually simulated land animals, birds and fish" important feature?
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11:38:17 <Xaroth> Immersion dude, immersion
11:45:56 <Artea> There were 19553 failed login attempts since the last successful login.
12:18:46 <peter1138> Actually 'ambient' noises need work.
12:18:54 <nielsm> can we have elephants roaming around, destroying your infrastructure?
12:19:06 <peter1138> A zoomed out arctic map is pretty noisy :/
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14:52:14 <V453000> How would you say the following error? "Can only attach the same engine as self, or any RAIL wagons."
14:52:20 <V453000> the first part is wtf
14:53:42 <V453000> Maybe if it's like "Can only attach RAIL wagons,{}or the same engine as self." so the second weird thing is on a new line, it's already better?
14:57:39 <V453000> better ideas please :D
14:57:40 <LordAro> perhaps "or to the same engine" ?
14:58:10 <LordAro> if i'm understanding what the message is trying to say, the "as self" is redundant
14:58:47 <V453000> but if I say "Can only attach the same engine." is it clear that it's the same as self?
14:59:03 <V453000> I might be overthinking it :) it's a hard topic
14:59:09 <Wolf01> Unless "as self" means stand alone
14:59:37 <V453000> my english is also falling a bit short here :)
15:10:59 <Eddi|zuHause> "Can only attach RAIL Wagons or other engines of the same type"
15:11:18 <Eddi|zuHause> possibly with comma
15:11:40 <Eddi|zuHause> the "RAIL" bit might need clarifying
15:41:11 <V453000> that sounds pretty good Eddi
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17:40:16 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh merged pull request #7351: Add: Warn players that company passwords are not truly secure https://git.io/fhhrD
17:40:31 <nielsm> totally forgot about that one...
17:47:05 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7514: Scale oil refinery edge distance up by map size https://git.io/fjsku
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18:31:09 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7514: Scale oil refinery edge distance up by map size https://git.io/fjmhp
18:35:07 <peter1138> Hmm, would be nice to squash those reverts before merge :p
18:37:15 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output. https://git.io/fjsIG
18:40:09 <peter1138> nielsm, can you squash 7516 a bit before review?
18:40:23 <peter1138> You've got fixes and removes in there.
18:40:55 <peter1138> That's assuming you think it's ready :-)
18:42:07 <nielsm> hmm, I think just a single commit for it all
18:43:41 <peter1138> Maybe. Maybe one for sq changes, and another for the GUI.
18:49:35 <nielsm> "Change"/"Add"/"Feature"?
18:50:57 <peter1138> Add, perhaps. It's not really a gameplay feature.
18:52:12 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7516: Memory measurement and limits for Squirrel https://git.io/fjYfW
18:54:04 <peter1138> Does the commit checker care about bad indentation if you don't actually touch the bad lines?
18:54:55 <nielsm> if it only checks added lines (which would make the most sense)
18:58:45 <peter1138> Not that fixing that file harms it.
19:01:57 <nielsm> I've considered just deleting sqmem.cpp
19:28:28 <Wolf01> Ok, friend of mine just arrived in London
19:34:33 <Wolf01> If you see a guy with a small girlfriend (yeah, small) which chases every Tesla he see, then you found it :P
19:35:12 <Wolf01> (small as "not quite a hobbit but not so far"
19:39:06 <peter1138> I'm not quite in London, so.
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19:42:10 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7514: Scale oil refinery edge distance up by map size https://git.io/fjsLC
19:42:27 <peter1138> Avengers: Endgame better be good. 3 hours long o_O
19:42:42 <peter1138> Not seeing it tonight though, that'll be home very late/early...
19:44:24 <Samu> already updating tournament games with new nonocab version, Wormnest
19:45:06 <DorpsGek> frosch123: planetmaker was last seen in #openttd 22 hours, 59 minutes, and 31 seconds ago: <planetmaker> whatever caused it to fail. Previously... well... probably wrong boot order of VMs
19:45:21 <frosch123> so, not on vacation
19:53:18 <Wolf01> I'm going to see it tomorrow night
19:58:03 * LordAro doesn't get to see it until tuesday :(
19:58:52 <peter1138> Don't worry I can tell you the story before then :)
20:04:52 <Wormnest> Nice Samu, I hope I fixed all bugs and didn´t cause any new ones ;)
20:06:54 <peter1138> Right, I best be off.
20:07:03 <peter1138> To the mountains^W^H hills...
20:08:02 <Samu> results didn't change so far
20:08:27 <Samu> on the crashed game, nonocab took more time now, but still finished first
20:14:51 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7514: Scale oil refinery edge distance up by map size https://git.io/fjsLH
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20:56:01 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Wormnest commented on issue #7530: Crash in kdtree.hpp when removing track in development version https://git.io/fjstg
21:01:30 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause
21:04:57 <Samu> man... it's tough to see air based ais to get wins so easily, I need to make airports more difficult
21:05:06 <Samu> how about infrastructure maintenance? :p
21:07:49 <nielsm> I believe infrastructure maintenance was in part invented to make aircraft less OP
21:08:25 <Samu> mogulai needs 1600 trucks to be ahead of its competitor with 20 aircraft
21:10:18 <glx> that's why aircraft are banned on some servers I think
21:14:57 <nielsm> make cargodist also consider the travel cost when picking a route and make not everyone a rich bastard
21:15:52 <nielsm> (effectively limit max station rating)
21:21:14 <nielsm> but I have been wondering if it wouldn't be possible to make an alternate rule system for cdist destination picking and cargo generation in all, but keep the core routing algorithms and link graph
21:22:03 <andythenorth> nielsm: tell me more?
21:22:09 <glx> like defining GS functions as callbacks for cdist ?
21:23:10 <nielsm> well I suppose having it call into GS would not be impossible? depends on the GS being reentrant probably
21:23:45 <glx> I think it's possible, scripts have mandatory functions called by openttd already
21:24:26 <Artea> I think CashDrainGS does that
21:24:39 <nielsm> an issue could be GS spending too much time picking a destination
21:24:56 <nielsm> so you'd still have to abort it forcibly after some time to avoid hangs
21:25:23 <glx> this class has required and optional functions
21:25:34 <glx> which are called by openttd
21:27:58 <glx> I guess it should be possible to limit what the script can do in the callback
21:28:24 <glx> but the script could still prepare data in its main loop and pass it in the callback
21:29:50 <Artea> can someone join my server and tell me if is hard or not, please ?
21:32:27 <glx> and I don't have 1.9.1 anyway
21:33:14 <Artea> I find hardcore playing now
21:34:34 <Artea> but didnt build anything
21:34:50 <Artea> only other one still have money
21:34:56 <glx> you don't have pause when no player I guess
21:35:04 <Artea> but started at same time as me, 2040
21:35:52 <glx> pause on join helps a lot for big maps
21:36:10 <Artea> but also breaks the ingame
21:36:39 <Artea> if someone is building stuff, it gets lost
21:36:51 <Artea> pause can take alot of time
21:36:57 <glx> you can't build during pause
21:37:19 <Artea> for someone who is already playing is messes is the game
21:37:53 <glx> just need to wait for unpause
21:37:55 <Artea> sorry, hard to put the ideas into words now
21:38:07 <Artea> yeah, I took put that off
21:38:24 <Artea> so that way there is no interruption ingame
21:39:05 <glx> but if it's very active then many will not be able to join because they won't be able to apply all queued commands
21:40:00 <Artea> I think people are scared of high age servers
21:40:02 <glx> the new client must download the game then apply all commands that happened between the save and the download end
21:40:40 <glx> and it can be too slow to do that, especially with big maps
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22:00:01 <frosch123> glx: gs only runs no the server. so all gs decisions must be distributed via commands
22:00:13 <frosch123> no callbacks possible
22:20:29 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh requested changes for pull request #7521: Fix: Stop Construction Windows Closing on Company Rename (Issue #7479) https://git.io/fjsmI
22:34:13 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7498: Change: Consider any cargo with passenger town effect for passenger-type subsidies. https://git.io/fjsmE
22:44:43 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7446: Feature: Show coverage area for existing stations and towns https://git.io/fjsmV
23:06:29 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #7498: Change: Consider any cargo with passenger town effect for passenger-type subsidies. https://git.io/fjsmh
23:11:21 <frosch123> where do ECS tourists go to? i thought they go to specific industries
23:15:04 <peter1138> Possibly specific industries too.
23:17:26 <peter1138> Yeah, TE_PASSENGERS... isn't used for anything o_O
23:18:44 <frosch123> it's used for statistics
23:18:47 <frosch123> and gs can query it
23:19:19 <frosch123> town effects are ttdp's citybuilders
23:19:42 <peter1138> town effects are cargospecs way of hardcoding features
23:21:16 <peter1138> Looks like everything that used it was either in my imagination, or was ripped out.
23:21:56 <peter1138> Maybe it's just something I have a patch for ;p
23:22:01 <frosch123> the newgrf spec summarises past usages
23:23:28 <peter1138> This specific place hardcodes CT_PASSENGERS, which is, admittedly, probably always there, but still.
23:23:57 <frosch123> it's about which cargos are produces by houses
23:24:53 <frosch123> i have no idea how ecs tourists work, the ecs manual says they go to/from tourists centers
23:24:57 <frosch123> but maybe houses too?
23:25:50 <frosch123> "Tourists has a weight of 125 Kg per tourist."
23:26:41 <peter1138> Scary, I was more than that once :p
23:27:20 <frosch123> i don't know, my scale stops at 120
23:28:35 <frosch123> so, doesn't ottd create subsidies for tourists between tourist centers and hotels and stuff?
23:35:28 <Artea> I think I found a bug :S
23:35:56 <Artea> why my airport doesnt get passengers after a large advertise ?
23:36:27 <Artea> I have to level up from water to construct it, maybe bugged ?
23:41:40 <nielsm> well screenshot? does it actually cover town buildings?
23:41:58 <nielsm> are there other stations in coverage range of those town buildings that may have higher rating than your station?
23:42:14 <nielsm> (only the two stations with highest rating will receive cargo)
23:43:23 <peter1138> So tourists between towns does already work, just comes under the cargo algorithm rather than passengers.
23:43:43 <peter1138> I wonder the passenger-specific method even needs to exist
23:44:50 <peter1138> I might give up on playing hell revealed 2 in ultraviolence mode
23:44:55 <peter1138> I can't get past the first level :p
23:47:46 <Artea> really, I don't know the routes of them after crash :(
23:48:09 <Artea> at least move them to crash group
23:48:23 <Artea> disaster group or something...
23:50:46 <nielsm> aircraft that crash don't lose their orders, and they remain on the runway for a while
23:51:02 <nielsm> you can just clone the crashed aircraft to get a new one of same type and same route
23:51:18 <Artea> I know, but problem is they crash while I'm sleeping
23:56:48 <peter1138> The vehicles are gone.
23:56:55 <peter1138> So they can't be in any group.
23:58:01 <peter1138> Pause on no players is a nice option to have :p
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