IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2018-03-01
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13:17:48 <Thedarkb> When is libicu52 getting replaced with 57?
13:19:20 <LordAro> when someone replaces it
13:19:37 <planetmaker> ^^ Feel free to make a patch for that and submit that. Would be welcome
13:19:57 <LordAro> it's a bit tricky because the layout engine got removed
13:20:32 <LordAro> frosch & i were vaguely looking at using pango
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17:31:47 <Alberth> variation is nice, but the first ship is silly
17:32:03 <Alberth> perhaps drop the green chimney instead?
17:32:33 <Samu> STR_GOAL_REACHED : {WHITE}{COMPANY}{BLACK} {COMPANY_NUM} was the first company to reach a company value of {GREEN}{CURRENCY_SHORT}
17:32:44 <Alberth> or no blue cabin, but the white part higher
17:32:54 <Samu> now I'm adding the days it took for that company to reach it
17:33:05 <Samu> how do I add that information in that phrase
17:33:51 <andythenorth> I think it looks odd with house in middle
17:33:59 <andythenorth> but I think the variation is worth exploring
17:34:04 <Samu> xxx was the first to reach, in yyy days, a company value of zzz?
17:34:04 <Alberth> break the cargo-hold in two then
17:34:18 <Alberth> ie make 2 smaller cargo holds
17:34:27 <Samu> xxx was the first to reach a company value of yyy, in zzz days?
17:34:49 <Alberth> after foo days, bla company made a million!!
17:35:45 <andythenorth> if I can get it to look right, I can use the same shape for cement/powder ship
17:35:57 <Samu> After xxx days, yyy was the first company to reach a value of zzz?
17:36:03 <andythenorth> but they really do look ugly with that configuration
17:37:14 <Alberth> perhaps make the blue cabin smaller in width, as you want to maximize cargo hold space
17:37:47 <Alberth> or change the colour to white too :)
17:37:57 <Alberth> but indeed, it looks weird
17:38:24 <Samu> After xxx days from inauguration, yyy was the first company to reach a (company?) value of zzz?
17:39:04 <Alberth> final picture looks like a tanker
17:39:29 <Samu> __ln__: english master, plz halp
17:41:35 <Alberth> you missed a few "companies", let me help you: after xxx days of inauguration of the company, company yyy was the first company to reach a company value of zzz
17:41:47 <Alberth> I think it needs even more companies
17:42:07 <Samu> I just noticed it's repeating
17:42:37 <Alberth> "from inauguration" seems a bit superfluous too, to me
17:42:59 <Alberth> I mean are there other relevant dates ?
17:43:44 <Samu> it stores the inauguration date of a company, then the date it reaches, and computes the days that passed
17:44:40 <Samu> it's just for "competition" purposes
17:45:05 <Alberth> the script is intended for a race, right?
17:45:22 <Alberth> so everybody always aims for the end from day 1
17:45:31 <Samu> yes, but not against a specific date
17:45:31 <Alberth> no need to make that explicit
17:46:14 <Samu> perhaps that could be another goal mode
17:46:35 <Alberth> so, can I win the competition, and yet start very late with my company?
17:47:02 <Alberth> even after a company that started earlier has reached the end goal?
17:47:31 <Samu> ah, nah, if the goal was reached before, the GS switches from goal mode to ranking mode
17:47:32 <Alberth> I could have fewer xxx days!
17:48:12 <Alberth> so "from inauguration" is a lie
17:50:56 <Samu> it's the day the company was created
17:51:30 <Alberth> yes, but it's not relevant in the result, like your message claims
17:52:14 <Samu> well, that's how most servers that have a company value goal work atm
17:53:03 <Samu> but they use real world time, I use openttd's
17:53:11 <Alberth> that's fine, but in that case only the date of the first win is relevant
17:53:23 <Alberth> and not how long the company exists
17:54:01 <Alberth> so make your message convey that message properly
17:54:38 <Alberth> hmm, two "message" words there, first should be "text", I guess
17:55:21 <Alberth> there usually is, in competitions :)
17:56:27 <Alberth> my point is that by printing the number of days it took, it looks like that is relevant for winning
17:56:46 <Alberth> as it is not, perhaps better not print that information?
17:57:18 <Alberth> or you change the script such that it becomes relevant, of course
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17:59:20 <Samu> it's merely informative, not relevant for winning, but it's nice to know this bit of information for the next time the server restart, and try to redo a better time
18:00:13 <Samu> there is no "highscore" table feature though
18:00:27 <Samu> would be interesting to have such a feature
18:01:04 <Samu> or maybe, there is, but it's xhuntershunter or whatever, and I'm not using that
18:07:59 <Samu> {COMMA} days or {NUM} days? or is there anything better for counting dates?
18:11:31 <Alberth> bla years and bla days, is probably the only better form
18:12:11 <Alberth> 1464 days means so little :p
18:13:39 <Alberth> actually it's 4*356+4
18:14:22 <Alberth> there are no long periods in openttd
18:14:31 <Alberth> or at least no long periods that are reported
18:15:03 <Alberth> trains have nice round model years :)
18:16:29 <Alberth> could add a day once every 4 years, but I wouldn't bother
18:16:51 <Alberth> it makes it also simpler to compare lengths
18:18:16 <Alberth> ie decrease from 5 to 3 years, is that 2 years, or 2 years and 1 day?
18:24:21 <andythenorth> it's logical, but is it appealing :P
18:25:54 <Alberth> swap the big and the small cargo hold?
18:26:10 <Alberth> I'd suggest a test-drive at the forum?
18:26:59 <Alberth> the yellow antenna and green chimney look weird, but that holds for more ships imho
18:27:12 <Alberth> paint some chimneys white as well?
18:27:43 <Alberth> and a darker teint of yellow/brown here and there?
18:27:52 <Alberth> or remove a few antennas :)
18:28:15 <andythenorth> the antennas could go
18:29:38 <Alberth> or make them black, so they don't stand out so much
18:30:20 <andythenorth> they're nice if only a few ships have them
18:30:25 <andythenorth> otherwise just noise
18:33:02 <Samu> STR_GOAL_REACHED : {BLACK}After {WHITE}{COMMA} days{BLACK} of inauguration, {WHITE}{COMPANY}{BLACK} {COMPANY_NUM} was first to reach a company value of {GREEN}{CURRENCY_SHORT}{BLACK}. {}{}Game is now paused. {}{}Press {YELLOW}Continue{BLACK} to resume game.
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18:38:20 <andythenorth> different positions
18:38:26 <andythenorth> still not convinced
18:44:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i've never seen ships where the steering cabin is in the front
18:44:59 <andythenorth> all swans are white, no?
18:46:27 <Alberth> 5 and 6 look best to me
18:46:40 <andythenorth> most offshore support vessels have house forward
18:46:47 <andythenorth> but now also lots of coasters
18:50:29 <Alberth> I'd call them exotic :)
18:50:31 <andythenorth> Alberth: 6 is ok, but I think they're all clunky
18:51:08 <Alberth> add a black high powered swan :p
18:52:22 <SpComb> Transport Fever is maddeningly slow, if you start in 1850 and maximize your loan, I can't seem to get profitable enough to sustain actual gameplay
18:55:13 <andythenorth> quite repetitive with other ships, but eh :P
19:00:04 <Eddi|zuHause> SpComb: yeah, it's pretty crazy at high difficulties
19:05:18 <SpComb> hmm, can't remember if this was easy or normal
19:10:21 <andythenorth> there are others ;P
19:12:02 <Samu> good english, color choice?
19:12:08 <Samu> probably not best english
19:12:36 <Alberth> 16 days AFTER inauguration
19:13:16 <Samu> oh, i see, my poor english skillz
19:13:25 <Alberth> amount doesn't seem important, but ymmv
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19:20:47 <Samu> local days_taken = GSDate.GetCurrentDate() - this.companies[c_id].inauguration_date;
19:24:58 <Eddi|zuHause> SpComb: also at least in train fever it got even worse after 1950, when passenger numbers break down due to emergence of cars
19:25:17 <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't played transport fever that far
19:27:20 <SpComb> that sounds terrible :D
19:28:08 <Eddi|zuHause> and i think income also changes at 1900 and 1950
19:28:23 <SpComb> but hey, just as I complain and continue playing again today, suddenly I'm making 5m/yr income and I just paid off my loan in 1895
19:28:34 <Eddi|zuHause> SpComb: well, in any case, it comes with a "remove money" mod :)
19:29:17 <SpComb> I got burned so badly in the campaigns on the fickle industry chains that I started this sandbox game with just passengers, far simpler to manage
19:29:35 <Eddi|zuHause> managing industry chains is tricky
19:29:46 <Eddi|zuHause> because if any part of the route breaks down, everything breaks down
19:30:20 <Eddi|zuHause> that's why in my game i used ships for most industries
19:30:38 <Eddi|zuHause> because you get all the connectivity with few to none of the infrastructure
19:30:49 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can cover the distance between all the industries in the chain
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19:31:23 <SpComb> yeah, that happened in pretty much every one of the campaign games that I played
19:31:48 <SpComb> had to just give up at the point where none of the trains are making any profit anymore and I max out my loan
19:32:01 <SpComb> this pax game is going much much better in comparison
19:35:06 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a quirk of the game that you can't do partial industry routes like in openttd. you have to make the route from primary to finished product
19:35:32 <Eddi|zuHause> and balance the primary outputs
19:35:42 <Eddi|zuHause> and get rid of some of the byproducts
19:36:04 <Eddi|zuHause> and now talking about it i REALLY want to play it...
19:45:45 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27971 trunk/src/lang/spanish_MX.txt (2018-03-01 19:45:36 +0100 )
19:45:47 <DorpsGek> spanish (mexican): 2 changes by Absay
19:47:20 <andythenorth> probably worth continuing
19:52:19 <andythenorth> less bad than before
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20:31:27 <frosch123> 9 adds more variety, 10 is very similar to the bigger ships
20:31:34 <andythenorth> there are others like 10
20:32:00 <peter1138> Do them all. Whatever it is.
20:33:45 <frosch123> 9 is more like a river ship, 10 is a sea ship
20:57:52 <Eddi|zuHause> Mar 01 20:55:27 Johannes-II smartd[1091]: Device: /dev/sdd [SAT], 1442 Currently unreadable (pending) sectors
20:57:53 <Eddi|zuHause> Mar 01 20:55:27 Johannes-II smartd[1091]: Device: /dev/sdd [SAT], 2 Offline uncorrectable sectors (changed -12)
20:59:04 <Wolf01> Time to change the HDD
21:02:23 <Rubidium> rather too late to change the HDD
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21:20:38 <andythenorth> 11 is a better sprite, but boring
21:25:18 <Eddi|zuHause> all good things come in 12
21:28:51 <andythenorth> I am waiting for 29
21:30:11 <Eddi|zuHause> so i bought that HDD in sept. 2010
21:30:45 <Wolf01> Mine are from 2007, but don't tell them
21:31:09 <frosch123> hdd used to have negative reliability decay
21:34:29 <Eddi|zuHause> meaning the older they get the more reliable they become?
21:34:48 <Eddi|zuHause> i think much of that is selection bias :p
21:35:13 <supermop_work_> andythenorth: i like the split holds for little tanker
21:35:25 <andythenorth> I think I use that for gen 1
21:35:37 <andythenorth> I am only drawing gen 2 ships currently, but with a steam funnel
21:35:41 <andythenorth> I think that is nice gen 1
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23:17:57 <SpComb> ok, so double-track tunnel entrances are broken
23:22:05 <Eddi|zuHause> tunnels always were a bit weird
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23:47:16 <Samu> - In the rare case where more than one company reach the target value at the same time, the most valuable of them, or the newest, in case of a tie, is victorious.
23:48:24 <Samu> need to insert "at the time of checking" somewhere
23:48:54 <Supercheese> "In the unlikely event that multiple companies reach the target value simultaneously, then the most valuable wins. If their values are identical, then the newest wins."
23:49:01 <Supercheese> but that's just my take on it
23:49:25 <Supercheese> instead of "most valuable" perhaps even "one with the highest value"
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23:56:11 <Samu> this is part of a changelog
23:56:31 <Samu> the old behaviour was... bad
23:57:10 <Samu> it would re-write multiple times while iterating over the winners, the last one iterated would be the winner
23:58:24 <Samu> since it is iterating the rankings, it would be the lowest valued winner, :(
23:58:46 <Samu> and i have no idea what it does in case of a tie
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