IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-11-01
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00:44:12 <Samu> st2 u there? or glx or someone
00:45:14 <Samu> static SmallIndustryList _cargo_delivery_destinations;
00:45:41 <Samu> but i need cargomonitor.cpp to access _cargo_delivery_destinations
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01:04:24 <Samu> Severity Code Description Project File Line Suppression State Error C2065 '_cargo_delivery_destinations': undeclared identifier openttd D:\OpenTTD\trunk\src\cargomonitor.cpp 157
01:07:21 <Samu> i don't know how to declare it :(
01:07:41 <Samu> i'm a noob in regards to declaring stuff around
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01:26:04 <Samu> I did it! by other means, without having to declare
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01:56:02 <ST2> Samu: I'm on the middle of a couple players blocking on our servers and till now 2 permbans - no time for it now ^^
01:56:07 <Samu> im so sleepy, made so many wording mistake
01:56:19 <Samu> alright, i got to go though
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08:20:04 <andythenorth> 3 outputs for industries? o_O
08:35:40 <andythenorth> just need to break reality a bit
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08:44:51 <V453000> I was thinking about an industry set where you would have a power plant and the power plant would be powering nearby industries
08:45:21 <andythenorth> considered that before
08:45:32 <V453000> you could make various cargoes for power and to get good profits you would have to split power plants apart, distributing cargo between them
08:45:44 <V453000> but the thing is that I think it would generally lead to 2 clusters
08:46:00 <V453000> unless you add rules that only certain industries can group together
08:46:08 <andythenorth> it's ok if that's the design :P
08:46:20 <V453000> or stuff like 2 industries per power plant
08:48:03 <andythenorth> so can drop goods and food from steeltown?
08:48:06 <andythenorth> want moar cargos
08:50:08 <V453000> you have vehicles kind of thing right?
08:50:17 <V453000> that's basically fancier goods
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09:05:01 <PressureLine> *luxury vehicles*
09:05:06 <PressureLine> even fancier goods!
09:07:03 <PressureLine> i keep looking @ ECS and FIRS
09:07:35 <PressureLine> but just thinking "What I really want is IOre->Steel->Goods chain in Arctic"
09:10:29 <andythenorth> try ogfx+ industries
09:13:29 <PressureLine> but... much prefer the TTD sprites :/
09:13:56 <PressureLine> or is it not dependant on the ogfx sprites?
09:28:56 <V453000> only way to distribute it under gpl
09:35:10 <PressureLine> I could probably hack something together. but it just doesnt bother me that much
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10:14:48 <PressureLine> windmills do not work that way!
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11:25:47 <Wolf01> Cats.. can't decide if in or out
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12:09:03 <peter1138> It's sensible, it's not touching hg :p
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14:02:10 <Samu> peter1138: sorry, my fix is bugged :( damn sorry
14:05:29 <Samu> i can't use (*ip)->incoming_cargo_waiting[cargo_index]
14:07:03 <Samu> DeliverGoodsToIndustry updates incoming_cargo_waiting, from 0 to 5, then 5 to 10, then 10 to 15
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14:07:50 <Samu> AddCargoDelivery was updating 0 to 5, then 5 to 15, then 15 to 30... i was counting it wrong
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14:22:53 <andythenorth> can't read it, paywall
14:25:03 <supermop> ft is only news i pay for
14:25:22 <supermop> wife pays for nyt but i don't have her log in
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14:55:07 <andythenorth> might be close to winning
14:55:19 <andythenorth> it's steeltown, with added chemicals :P
14:55:39 <supermop> "now with more carcinogens!"
14:56:09 <andythenorth> look at all the cargos in the second column
14:56:23 <andythenorth> max delivery insanity
14:56:33 <andythenorth> it's going to be really hard to play
15:02:28 <andythenorth> sufficiently Becher + Becher?
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15:14:49 <supermop> force greyscale pallet on sprites
15:16:20 <andythenorth> do it in the blitter?
15:21:18 <andythenorth> the late game cargos need some work
15:21:27 <andythenorth> might need a metals terminal
15:21:33 <andythenorth> and ENSP is way too hard to get
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15:22:57 <supermop> i wonder if a black and white base set would be playable
15:23:27 <andythenorth> that heads towards where BRIX started
15:23:30 <supermop> or if it wouldn't be able to hook people psychologically
15:24:18 <supermop> whole 'use a grey background to break smartphone compulsion' thing
15:24:51 <supermop> thing is, i can look at a becher photo for very extended time -
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15:25:10 <supermop> i think it has more to do with contrast and detail than color
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15:32:22 <supermop> i need to take some IR photos of decorative gourds
15:32:34 <supermop> to make invites for fall cocktail party
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16:17:02 <Alberth> I'd be surprised, as it hooks directly into the delivery handling code afaik
16:17:28 <Samu> the problem is arising from here: DeliverGoods in economy.cpp
16:17:40 <Alberth> "then sent a train delivering wood to both Sawmills" <-- that won't work
16:17:50 <Alberth> in unpatched openttd at least
16:21:45 <Samu> it's DeliverGoodsToIndustry doing one thing vs AddCargoDelivery doing it in another way
16:22:26 <Samu> they're both called from DeliverGoods
16:24:38 <Alberth> wouldn't it be the bug this mismatch then?
16:25:32 <Samu> DeliverGoodsToIndustry can find 2 near Sawmills
16:25:46 <Samu> the first one gets the cargo
16:26:40 <Samu> wait, i fail at explaining
16:27:10 <Samu> it's just that AddCargoDelivery works with the amount, without caring which Sawmill actualyl got it
16:38:58 <Samu> DeliverGoodsToIndustry found industry index 76 , the Sawmill on the right, delivered 5 cargo there
16:40:08 <Samu> AddCargoDelivery found industry index 2, the Sawmill on the left, adds 5 cargo to the monitor
16:41:48 <Samu> I'm failing to come up with words explaining why this happens
16:46:08 <Alberth> I need some tea and food first
17:02:40 <Samu> it's clearer now. CargoMonitorMap::iterator iter = _cargo_deliveries.find(num); this contains a list of industries BusyBee is monitoring
17:03:16 <Samu> it is monitorizing Sawmill with index 2
17:03:38 <Samu> for (const Industry * const *ip = st->industries_near.Begin(); ip != st->industries_near.End(); ip++)
17:04:33 <Samu> st->industries_near lists the industries near the station, and both index 2 and index 76 are there
17:05:04 <Samu> the iterator is only interested in the industry index 2
17:06:08 <Samu> it finds it, then adds the amount delivered to it, wrongly
17:06:53 <Samu> it was industry with index 76 that received it
17:08:31 <Alberth> do you have a save game?
17:08:40 <Alberth> a simple test worked as expected
17:08:42 <Samu> what it should do was deliver an amount of 0
17:09:23 <Samu> don't have a handy savegame though, i used a patched openttd
17:10:13 <Samu> unless you can hack the savegame and load it by force?
17:10:20 <Samu> savegame version was upped :(
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17:12:01 <Alberth> wouldn't matter, as it doesn't proof it can be created in unpatched openttd, which is a pre-condition for all bugs
17:12:52 <Samu> ok i'm creating a scenario for this
17:13:22 <Alberth> probably make a copy as close to what you had gives the best chance
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17:33:53 <Samu> i changed iter->second += (*ip)->incoming_cargo_waiting[cargo_index]
17:33:58 <Samu> to iter->second = (*ip)->incoming_cargo_waiting[cargo_index]
17:34:19 <Samu> += to = in my patch, but i'm not sure it's correct to look at incoming_cargo_waiting
17:37:26 <Samu> hmm it shouldn't be like that
17:37:59 <Samu> have you seen DeliverGoodsToIndustry
17:38:30 <Samu> the closest sawmill gets the unloaded cargo
17:38:40 <Samu> and it won't iterate anymore
17:38:56 <Samu> the other sawmill gets 0
17:39:02 <Alberth> yes, it always delivers to 1 industry
17:43:05 <Samu> cargomonitor searches from the list of near industries, the one that matches what's being monitorized
17:44:00 <Samu> the one far away is in it, and the amount is added
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17:51:55 <Alberth> where does that haoppen?
17:56:06 <Samu> line 1092 - DeliverGoodsToIndustry, then line 1115 - AddCargoDelivery
17:58:11 <Alberth> ok, fair enough, looks fuzzy at least
17:59:01 <Alberth> You also read the note?
17:59:27 <Alberth> cargomonitor 145 * Note that delivery in the right area is sufficient to prevent trouble with neighbouring industries or houses.
18:00:48 <Alberth> although I don't remember the specific reason for that
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18:37:57 <Alberth> it means what you observed, delivering to a near-enough station is sufficient
18:38:21 <Alberth> not sure why that solution was chosen
18:38:47 <Alberth> maybe for houses you cannot find which town actually gets the cargo
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18:41:03 <Alberth> ie you need several houses to get to 8/8, and they're not all from the same town
18:41:17 <Alberth> don't know if that can actually happen
18:43:06 <Samu> i could take a look maybe
18:43:37 <Samu> see how houses handle cargo acceptance
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18:45:10 <Samu> i was working with passengers acceptance cargo yesterday
18:45:42 <Samu> oil rig vs town, to see which one would actually accept, it's the industry that accepts it first
18:46:13 <Samu> i haven't tried town vs town acceptance though
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19:09:55 <Samu> Alberth: What does BusyBee do when the industry announces closure. It can happen if I'm not delivering cargo to it
19:10:34 <Samu> talking about the 2 sawmills situation
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19:12:51 <Alberth> it should retract the offer
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19:13:05 <Samu> but BusyBee believes i'm delivering cargo
19:13:32 <Alberth> I had one report where it fails to do that, but we couldn't reproduce that
19:13:49 <Alberth> closure and delivering cargo are not related
19:14:04 <Alberth> you can deliver right up to final closure
19:14:44 <Alberth> ie the industry is leading, BB can't do anything about it
19:20:09 <Samu> houses from town 1 and houses from town 2 added together will make the station accept passengers
19:20:31 <Samu> the station belongs to a town though, that would be the town that gets the cargo
19:20:47 <Samu> st->town->received[cs->town_effect].new_act += accepted;
19:21:53 <Samu> doesn't look like it matters which house really accepts it, just st->town
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19:27:09 <supermop> having trouble coming up with ideas for generative gourd modelling
19:27:35 <andythenorth> pinterest is a scourge
19:29:58 <supermop> thinking of a grasshopper model to make some kind of low-poly yayoi kusama thing
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19:32:26 <Samu> that seems to be about how indexes are attributed to industries
19:32:59 <Samu> IndustryPool _industry_pool("Industry"); INSTANTIATE_POOL_METHODS(Industry)
19:33:15 <Samu> I have no idea what Pools mean
19:34:01 <Samu> when i look at pool_func.hpp, i just dunno what the crap happens there
19:35:10 <andythenorth> haven't play tested yet
19:37:06 <V453000> looks pretty glorious I must say
19:37:28 <andythenorth> I couldn't fit caustic soda in :P
19:37:48 <andythenorth> also I didn't do 5 kinds of steel :P
19:39:19 <V453000> looks like every primary can produce ENSP?
19:39:39 <V453000> and not in a trivial pattern, looks very nice
19:39:47 <V453000> shame there is no vehicle set for all the unique cargoes :P
19:40:13 <andythenorth> dunno about the ENSP
19:40:27 <andythenorth> producing at the end of the chain is tedious
19:40:35 <V453000> I like how you call a farm trading post :P
19:40:36 <andythenorth> all the work to get ENSP, then what do you get? More ENSP
19:40:48 <andythenorth> V453000: nice touch by frosch123 that farm
19:40:52 <Samu> is that Engineering Supplies?
19:41:54 <V453000> I should add recolour sprites to NUTS for some of those cargoes
19:42:58 <Alberth> Samu: everything is being saved :)
19:43:58 <Samu> all industries that have ever existed?
19:44:38 <Samu> it seems to reuse indexes of deceased industries
19:44:45 <Samu> don't think it keeps track of everything
19:58:53 <frosch123> guess the grf file size :p
19:58:53 <V453000> how many articulated consists does it require?
19:59:29 <frosch123> it's a single 4/8 unit, which you can concatenate as long as you want
19:59:53 <frosch123> technically it's 800k sprites (including 1x,4x,8bpp,32bpp)
19:59:59 <frosch123> but most of them are empty and duplicates
20:00:09 <andythenorth> now we can make snake
20:00:11 <V453000> how many sprites per rotation that is?
20:00:18 <andythenorth> make it count how many times it passes a waypoint
20:00:22 <andythenorth> then make it longer
20:00:36 <andythenorth> also Toyland -> Dune replacement
20:00:59 <frosch123> 32 angles forward, 32 angles backward, 5 slopes forward, 5 slopes backward, front and tail special
20:01:20 <frosch123> about 3/4 of those sprites cannot happen though
20:01:33 <frosch123> like 180 degree turns within train
20:02:26 <V453000> so let's say I give it 32 rotations total
20:02:31 <V453000> will it automatically do it's magic?
20:02:44 <frosch123> this is without any ottd modifcations
20:02:56 <frosch123> it's the slug-model, not the long-wagons model
20:03:31 <frosch123> i just wanted to know what it takes to make wagons attach seemless
20:03:37 <V453000> so it's 4/8 sprites on 4/8 articulated units?
20:03:50 <frosch123> and it's omg, i have to invert all the ottd-orientation-alignment bs
20:04:26 <frosch123> for the 8 vehicle orientations i set 8 times the same sprite, just with different offsets to reverse whatever ottd is doing with them
20:04:53 <frosch123> so, one thing ottd should learn is some flag to disable the historical bs
20:05:13 <frosch123> 1/8 sprites required then
20:05:15 <V453000> being able to define the same image with different offsets would be quite nice
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20:05:29 <V453000> I think I needed that at some point too but don't remember when
20:07:27 * andythenorth wonders where cabeese have gone in Horse
20:07:33 <andythenorth> they've...disappeared in game :P
20:07:37 <andythenorth> but are in the nml
20:08:19 <andythenorth> nah, they have climate
20:08:38 <andythenorth> something stupid I guess
20:10:41 <andythenorth> ok it's something to do with FIRS having 32 cargos in Steeltown
20:10:50 <andythenorth> caboose has no cargo and no power
20:11:26 <andythenorth> doesn't show if Steeltown is active
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20:29:18 <argoneus> good evening train friends
20:31:47 * V453000 is being efficient tonight
20:32:13 <argoneus> how have you been? are you still doing factorio stuff
20:33:08 <V453000> I have released BRIX a week ago
20:33:15 <V453000> now working on new train set
20:33:20 <V453000> atm taking detour and working on something else :D
20:33:31 * V453000 is very good at focusing on 1 project apparently
20:35:07 <andythenorth> so nobody used 32 cargos in a newgrf before? :o
20:35:15 * andythenorth now has to diagnose the issue :(
20:38:08 <frosch123> andythenorth: you probably added a GEAR cargo or something
20:38:48 <andythenorth> default cargo = GOOD
20:39:00 <andythenorth> there must be some reason for that
20:41:14 <supermop> V453000: i needed different offsets for same image
20:41:21 <andythenorth> testing if it's nonsense
20:41:31 <supermop> i ended up just defining the same png twice, felt dumb
20:41:32 <frosch123> you can set different liveries for pax and cargo trains iirc
20:41:45 <V453000> yes that's the same as I did supermop :P
20:42:46 <supermop> rather same pngs, was bout 30
21:03:31 <V453000> I have seen enough for now probably :P
21:03:45 <V453000> am making railtype atm
21:05:05 <V453000> converting BRIX maglev to 32bpp PURR
21:05:21 <V453000> with plan to reuse the templates for the glorious train set
21:11:47 <Samu> when an industry closes, it's index is free
21:12:10 <Samu> if another spawns right away, it can re-use the industry that had just closed, just tested
21:13:35 <Samu> it happens often on large maps
21:13:38 <andythenorth> sounds like a pool
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21:14:51 <Samu> the question was whether it could re-use the index of a just closed industry in such a short time... it can
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21:15:26 <andythenorth> sounds like a pool
21:15:34 * andythenorth doesn't know how IDs work in ottd
21:15:47 <andythenorth> but in a pool, when an index is released, it's released
21:17:47 <Samu> there was a bug report on BusyBee regarding industry indexes
21:27:41 <V453000> what was the issue andythenorth ?
21:29:39 <V453000> default goods on caboose while goods removed by economy?
21:32:26 <V453000> hm yeah that kind of makes sense
21:34:04 <andythenorth> error: not enough wagon types
21:34:22 <andythenorth> even at start of game, I have 7 bulk cargos
21:34:27 <andythenorth> and only 3 types of wagon for them
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22:22:21 <supermop> still haven't even added a way to add bumps yet
22:25:06 <supermop> i feel like python would be better
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23:10:38 <V453000> is it possible for a railtype to use monorail or maglev tunnels?
23:11:07 <V453000> default seems to be rail, and station_graphics doesn't seem to influence tunnels
23:12:23 <V453000> guess I should instead define the tunnel_overlay
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