IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-08-08
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12:11:44 <peter1138> well the link works :p
12:13:21 <peter1138> i had the ship going up and down but not the water
12:14:49 <Wolf01> I can't understand why it wasn't implemented like TTDP the first time (which is like your patch)
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12:23:33 <peter1138> hmm, went a bit overkill on my router
12:23:41 <peter1138> 256MB memory, 216MB free
12:23:51 <peter1138> 880Mhz quad core CPU, 0% used
12:24:12 <peter1138> ooh got it up to 1%
12:28:17 <Wolf01> Fuck youtube... I started by watching lego and now I'm again into scientific experiments
12:29:02 <FLHerne> You'd better install an OTTD server on it
12:33:45 <SpComb> peter1138: you must not have a 1gbps connection with 1m state entries
12:34:28 <peter1138> although the router is gbit
12:35:42 <__ln__> can it handle a gbit of traffic?
12:36:33 <peter1138> depends on the packet size
12:37:08 <peter1138> yes, if it's "normal packets"
12:37:25 <peter1138> unlikely if it's a flood of tiny packets
12:38:31 <__ln__> does it do routing with CPU or some specialized hardware?
12:39:55 <SpComb> sounds almost like an ER-X
12:41:19 <SpComb> sounds exactly like an ER-X, although it's dual-core with four threads
12:41:38 <peter1138> think it is actually
12:41:41 <peter1138> it's a mikrotik though
12:42:31 <SpComb> probably very similar hardware, just different OS/software
12:45:40 <peter1138> thinking about getting a unifi ap
12:46:02 <peter1138> currently just using the old adsl modem/router/ap just for wireless duty
13:15:04 <peter1138> but yeah, because they all respect the GPL just as much as say cisco, netgear, asus, d-link etc... not really able to put ottd on it
13:18:23 <Wolf01> Another topic about changing grfs in scenarios :|
13:20:54 <Wolf01> I vote to make 2 OTTD versions, one for public without any development function and one for grf development already enabled, which is available and signed only for grf developers and closed source, so they wouldn't be able to give it away
13:28:03 <Alkel_U3> want a router that will run OpenTTD? Get a Turris
13:30:03 <Alkel_U3> although it's pretty costly for a router :-)
13:34:36 <peter1138> personally i'd just stick ottd on a computer behind the router :p
13:36:20 <Alkel_U3> that seems to be the most pragmatic solution but not the techno-coolest one :D
13:37:01 <Alkel_U3> well, I'd even say the most practical these days is a rented virtual server
13:37:38 <Alkel_U3> especially for such resource-light game as openttd
13:37:54 <peter1138> tempted to get an hp microserver but the upgrade to xeon is steep
13:39:31 <SpComb> I upgraded to a chieftec 4U rackmount ATX chassis at home... otherwise great, but the separate HDD hotswap chassis (also sold by chieftec) has an horrible built-in nonstandard 80mm fan that you can't swap out without voiding the warranty
13:40:53 <Arveen> am i the only person who has a 42" inch rack in his basement ?
13:40:54 <SpComb> but once I find a 20mm deep 80mm fan and void the warranty on that, then it should all work out as a decently quiet rackmount machine
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13:41:28 <SpComb> I have a wheeled 18U cabinet with a glass door in the corner of the living room
13:41:29 <crem> I do have a rack! but it's empty. I'd like to have 0 noise PC for something which is always on.
13:41:35 <peter1138> basements not common here :(
13:41:45 <crem> And all servers are too noisy.
13:41:51 <SpComb> silent + rackmount is just diffcult/expensive
13:42:02 <Arveen> yeah, thats why its in my basement heh
13:42:16 <peter1138> if it makes a lot of noise, it's probably power hungry too
13:42:18 <SpComb> does someone sell a rackmount rpi case
13:42:42 <crem> I also tried fit-pc2, but it was too slow for minecraft server.
13:43:02 <Arveen> i think there are pi rackmout kits, but its like an 16 slot 2HE case
13:43:05 <crem> rpi is very far from being usable for game servers.
13:43:20 <SpComb> I want something with decent storage... also considered a NUC + external USB3 HDD chassis
13:43:21 <peter1138> it's ok for a normal size ottd game
13:43:45 <peter1138> something like that should do
13:45:06 <peter1138> dell t20 with xeon were cheap for a while, wish i'd got one
13:45:27 <Arveen> i got all my stuff from work when it got replaced at the data center
13:45:55 <Arveen> so it was rather cheap
13:47:01 <Arveen> I am actually trying to get rid of 2 DELL R510 servers which I replaced recently at home
13:47:23 <Arveen> so if anyone wants to buy, they are up for sale
13:49:10 <LordAro> and perhaps more importantly, where from? :p
13:50:01 <Arveen> Germany, near Frankfurt Airport
13:51:56 <Arveen> 2x Xeon L5630 CPUs, i got loads of RAM and SAS/SATA disks laying around so i can put in whatever is needed/wanted
13:53:27 <LordAro> i might know some people who would be interested, if you can deliver to north england
13:53:37 <LordAro> what sort of price are we talking?
13:55:33 <Arveen> well depends on the actual config but i would say an reasonable to cheap pricing
13:57:19 <LordAro> depends what you think of as reasonable to cheap :p
14:00:41 <Arveen> you want to use this equipment for an home lab or for business ?
14:01:11 <LordAro> this would be a student society
14:01:20 <LordAro> so kind of inbetween :)
14:05:10 <Alberth> gaming is a core value :)
14:08:32 <Arveen> well, usually I sell my home lab stuff for current EBay price minus 10% to 20%
14:10:49 <Arveen> im have no idea how expensive the shipping would be
14:11:23 <Arveen> DHL says 45 eur. caugh caugh
14:11:59 <Arveen> you should book a trip to Germany to pick it up - might be cheaper :P
14:12:56 <__ln__> 45€ sounds cheap to me for international shipping
14:13:56 <Arveen> hmm says max. 120 x 60 x 60cm) - that won't fit
14:14:18 <LordAro> ok, ebay prices look like they'd be a bit on the steep side, but i'll relay info anyway and let you know
14:15:27 <Arveen> right now i am in no rush to sell them. got enough space in my rack :D
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16:06:32 <eekee> (12:15:04) peter1138: but yeah, because they all respect the GPL just as much as say cisco, netgear, asus, d-link etc... not really able to put ottd on it
16:07:03 <eekee> peter1138: what do you mean? i thought the gpl only constrained distribution, not what you do with it yourself
16:09:27 <peter1138> yeah, they don't provide the sources that they should
16:10:55 <eekee> oh you can't compile ottd to run on it?
16:11:31 <eekee> i hate when that happens
16:13:23 <eekee> brb, going to computer shop
16:19:36 <peter1138> probably could compile it
16:19:48 <peter1138> but it's basically an embedded system. 16MB flash storag.e..
16:20:03 <peter1138> (i was surprised it was so low, but it seems to work :p)
17:21:14 <eekee> autosave could create problems with that little storage
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17:30:41 <peter1138> it's not really a problem, it can use microsd or usb storage
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19:15:32 <andythenorth> now that I figured out the schema and the lengths and everything, do I actually have to draw the grf? o_O
19:15:36 <andythenorth> or can I just project manage?
19:24:08 <Alberth> "and everything" didn't include pixels I guess?
19:26:48 <andythenorth> I have drawn them in my mind
19:27:00 <andythenorth> the filesystem is just out of compliance
19:31:53 <Alberth> brain-to-fs is non-functional, apparently
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19:42:54 <frosch123> afaik there is no method to remove stalled nfs mounts
19:42:58 <frosch123> we need to reboot andy
19:43:44 <LordAro> umount -f[f] will sometimes work
19:46:10 <andythenorth> my current code assumes only one of each vehicle type per generation
19:46:16 <andythenorth> but I need 2 cabooses (long and short)
19:46:25 <andythenorth> also I have this crazy articulated code
19:46:32 <andythenorth> 3 parts to every vehicle
19:46:37 <andythenorth> I should refactor that :P
19:46:42 <andythenorth> V453000 is it faster?
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19:59:01 <LordAro> globally, or just for these functions?
19:59:20 <frosch123> for these, no idea who else uses them
19:59:22 <supermop_> andythenorth: are you drawing pivoting bogies?
20:00:35 <LordAro> frosch123: looks like the vast majority are the sorter functions
20:01:12 <frosch123> iirc last time there were issues with some methods returning true for == when reverse-sorting
20:01:44 <LordAro> i believe i fixed that
20:03:29 <frosch123> line 2214 does not compile
20:03:38 <supermop_> why 3 articulated parts then?
20:04:05 <andythenorth> > 8/8 vehicle sprites
20:04:51 <frosch123> LordAro: ModeSorter is not stable sort
20:05:22 <frosch123> actually, it likely causes infinite loops
20:05:38 <frosch123> (100,200) < (200, 100) < (100, 200)
20:05:53 <LordAro> i wondered whether i broke that one
20:07:42 <frosch123> TownRatingSorter likely has the same issue
20:08:10 <frosch123> multiplying with +-1 is a XOR, no AND or OR
20:09:00 <frosch123> anyway, i am confused why some methods have flags to inverse sorting, while other do not
20:09:06 <frosch123> is ottd that inconsistent :p
20:10:42 <frosch123> LordAro: sorry, BinNegator is completely broken
20:10:53 <frosch123> std::sort expects operator<, not operator <=
20:21:17 <frosch123> is that an entry for template horror contest?
20:23:36 <frosch123> you can improve it with some #define ☢ template
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21:08:44 <andythenorth> but are you faster now?
21:09:43 <frosch123> depends on the colour of the floor
21:32:29 <LordAro> frosch123: Alberth: gist updated
21:33:09 <LordAro> i gave up and just rewrote TownRatingSorter, and replaced the BinNegator thing with a std::reverse :)
21:37:23 <frosch123> it's from 32bpp age, so dead in a few years?
21:37:44 <frosch123> or did people invent alternative call convertions for x64 yet?
21:40:59 <LordAro> don't think anyone else did
21:41:15 <LordAro> yup, CDECL has been in stdafx.h since r1
21:41:25 <LordAro> so almost certainly redundant
21:48:38 <V453000> well houston we have a fucking problem
21:49:27 <frosch123> mars inhabitable for slugs?
21:50:56 <V453000> well not everything would stay the same
21:51:03 <LordAro> chromium does not let me view https openttdcoop.org
21:51:10 <LordAro> because of the revoked startcom cert
21:51:54 <LordAro> just straight up doesn't let me, no "let me in anyway" button at all
21:51:58 <LordAro> V453000: aye, that works
21:52:16 <andythenorth> V453000: what’s wrong with that approach?
21:52:28 <andythenorth> it looks like the aftermath of a forest fire, but otherwise...
21:52:57 <V453000> well I still really like the concept of having (very) desaturated background to focus things with colour in the picture
21:52:59 <andythenorth> what colour would water be?
21:53:06 <andythenorth> test it with FIRS
21:53:12 <andythenorth> better industries :P
21:53:35 <V453000> I ran away from the concept because snow was a problem but the ground was rather neutral gray or whiteish
21:53:40 <V453000> here it's not a problem
21:53:47 <andythenorth> snow is over-rated
21:53:53 <andythenorth> what colour would desert be?
21:54:38 <V453000> could even be orangey
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21:55:08 <V453000> the thing is I am planning to do this eventually anyway
21:55:19 <V453000> and now when I kind of have most of the pieces, I started playing with colours again
21:55:26 <LordAro> Arveen: boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew?
21:55:41 <andythenorth> will my black ships show up on your black see? :P
21:55:48 <Arveen> would it be possible to put like an RGB selector in the grf options for the tile color ?
21:56:00 <frosch123> i think the contrast is too harsh
21:56:08 <V453000> frosch the contrast will change
21:56:11 <V453000> the tracks are too bright
21:57:31 <frosch123> well, plain black landscape is likely better than plain white
21:57:47 <andythenorth> there’s not much gained from replicating SF graphics, unless you’re me
21:58:14 <V453000> well, green grass is certainly more consistent with other grfs
21:58:20 <V453000> but I don't really like it that much
21:58:27 <V453000> sure I can desaturate grass but meh
22:00:11 <V453000> trees might actually stay green
22:03:03 <V453000> brown is an option but I would prefer to reserve that colour for other things
22:03:12 <V453000> like foundations and bulldozed shit
22:03:39 <frosch123> you could make bulldozes and rough land black
22:03:42 <andythenorth> like my mini-map colour
22:03:49 <Alkel_U3> sorry to interrupt with non-tycoon matters but I've just been informed there's a game I consider good - namely Pony Island - for free on Humble Bundle and I can't just stand idly by seeing people not go get it https://www.humblebundle.com/micro-jumbo-bundle
22:03:54 <frosch123> foundations can be grey
22:04:45 <frosch123> Alkel_U3: don't free the devel
22:05:01 <andythenorth> V453000: what was wrong with greige? o_O
22:05:09 <andythenorth> greige is awesome and has contrast to white
22:05:15 <frosch123> devil? i guess it's the same
22:05:16 <V453000> greige was too netural
22:05:43 <Alkel_U3> pun not intended? Because it was
22:10:57 <andythenorth> anyway, choose happy colours
22:11:04 <andythenorth> SF made all of TTD happy tones
22:11:09 <andythenorth> whereas lomo… :(
22:12:15 <V453000> can't say I am thrilled about happy colours on the background
22:12:33 <frosch123> don't make it blue :)
22:12:40 <frosch123> blue is one of the most boring colors
22:15:21 <V453000> I'll give it some more thought
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