IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-02-07
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13:03:22 <andythenorth> supermop_: did you play any FIRS Steeltown? o_O
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16:22:32 <supermop_> i have played steeltown
16:23:03 <supermop_> not recently though and can't recall any quirks off the top of my head
16:28:46 <andythenorth> I think it’s too faceted and complex
16:28:58 <andythenorth> it’s not bad, but it needs tweaks
16:29:23 <supermop_> extreme is also complex and some people like it
16:29:40 <V453000> my ass is faceted and complex
16:29:50 <supermop_> i like the thematic coherence
16:30:07 <supermop_> i have to say, extreme blk terminals are really boring
16:30:09 <andythenorth> V453000: pictures or it didn’t happen
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16:32:04 <V453000> nice supermop even joining twice to see it
16:33:18 <V453000> are facets the opposite of assets?
16:33:55 * andythenorth is not clicking that link
16:34:26 <V453000> it's not that dangerous andy
16:34:34 <V453000> what can possibly go wrong
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16:35:49 <andythenorth> I have seen goatse before
16:35:54 <andythenorth> there is no need to repeat
16:36:08 <V453000> do you really think I would post a picture of self?
16:38:08 <andythenorth> supermop_: too many port industries
16:38:14 <andythenorth> also aluminium is pointless
16:38:43 <supermop_> i guess its easy for bootstrapping
16:38:46 <V453000> omg he's reworking firs again
16:39:59 <supermop_> buy one 6 tile, chinook hauled rake at game start and send to an alu plant about 100 tiles away and you are already all set
16:40:33 <andythenorth> but the aluminium cargo is daft no?
16:40:47 <andythenorth> it doesn’t produce anything useful further up the chain
16:40:48 <supermop_> i mean in regular firs, where its just metal
16:40:52 <andythenorth> oh yeah that’s fine
16:41:05 <supermop_> it kind of cuts out steel mill
16:41:09 <andythenorth> firs is firs is firs
16:41:23 * andythenorth been playtesting Steeltown
16:42:00 <supermop_> because the alu plant will go 8/8 from the firs delivery, never need scrap, never need to balance deliveries of input cargos
16:43:33 <supermop_> the bulk terminal might as well be the aluminum import terminal
16:45:57 <supermop_> i dont recall how steeltown alu works
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17:05:09 <V453000> the thing you sent makes no sense to me but I will try to understand it later :D
17:05:22 <V453000> for speed I'll probably rewrite the whole thing to a different system
17:05:44 <V453000> for better colour distance calc I have multiple plans, let's see
17:06:02 <V453000> but what was the point of your red grouping thing?
17:10:50 <Alberth> basically, what I try to do is to try 'nearby' colours first, before trying 'further away' colours
17:11:31 <Alberth> the nearby colours give a good 'best_distance', so you can discard most colours, just based on the squared red distance
17:11:42 <V453000> but it goes through all colours anyway?
17:12:19 <Alberth> not likely, but it was too complicated to chop off the palette colours that are never feasible
17:12:35 <Alberth> but you do get the same results as you get now
17:13:10 <Alberth> I start with colours that have mostly the same red component
17:13:20 <V453000> well it's interesting but I will probably continue using what I have now and try to rewrite it into the numpy thing I have no idea about so far
17:13:35 <Alberth> further down the list, the red component distance grows
17:14:00 <Alberth> if it is bigger than the best_distance that you have, you can stop
17:14:35 <Alberth> which probably saves you 3/4 or so of the computation
17:14:54 <Alberth> depending on the distribution of the palette colours
17:15:04 <V453000> the idea is certainly interesting, I'll see if I can re-use it later on
17:40:13 <peter1138> fml, £770 for an upgrade to i7 :(
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19:10:49 <supermop_> so my first action upon getting spotify finally is to listen to a bunch of late 70s funk i never got around to listening to before
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20:27:10 <andythenorth> my game is full of ridiculous broken
20:27:16 <andythenorth> broken industries, broken ships, broken trains
20:27:27 <andythenorth> is price of making own grfs :)
20:32:37 <andythenorth> I think I add new broken faster than I fix it
20:32:42 <andythenorth> situation getting out of hand :)
21:04:20 <Alberth> it's called SilVer :)
21:05:00 <Alberth> gold is just a red herring :p
21:09:15 <andythenorth> Red Herring is a good GS name
21:09:18 <andythenorth> not sure what it does
21:16:04 <andythenorth> so major contributors in medium past….mostly students? o_O
21:17:46 <frosch123> in particular graduating students
21:17:57 <frosch123> for some reason you have time while writing your thesis
21:18:47 * andythenorth wonders post-2008, students have no time any more
21:19:12 <andythenorth> dunno, don’t know many students
21:19:19 <andythenorth> are they all working jobs as well as studying?
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21:20:06 <andythenorth> global financial crisis
21:20:10 <andythenorth> might be irrelevant
21:20:31 <frosch123> i don't think there is any international thing which would affects students
21:20:41 <Alberth> V453000: it's indeed faster, from 78 to 19 seconds here
21:20:53 <Alberth> 3/4 wasn't that far off :p
21:20:54 <frosch123> i think students are rather affected by how the courses are organised
21:21:08 <frosch123> which changed around 2008 in germany funnily :p
21:21:22 <frosch123> so i wondered about your 2008 :p
21:23:11 * andythenorth wonders if OpenTTD is a good way to learn software engineering
21:23:33 <Alberth> if you want to learn code refactoring, yes
21:24:36 <Alberth> if you want to learn writing clean code from scratch, a lot less
21:24:53 <andythenorth> which is more like ‘real’ software engineering? o_O
21:25:11 <Alberth> I'd say code refactoring
21:25:47 <Alberth> but I am not so sure you can learn that if you can't write clean software from scratch, as that's the simpler case
21:27:27 <frosch123> a big existing code base allows you to focus on specific items
21:27:37 <frosch123> if you start from scratch you have to deal with all interfaces
21:28:02 <Alberth> you can just use all the stuff that already exists and works
21:38:50 <V453000> Alberth: that's a lot :D
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21:41:36 <Alberth> hmm, result is not identical, it has a few 'srcatches' for some reason
21:42:45 <Alberth> would need a bit closer checking
21:43:37 <Alberth> oh, the input image has it too, must have picked a different logo image
21:45:56 <Alberth> but you first have to decide on your definition of "closest" , I think
21:46:11 <Alberth> which is simpler with a more naive algorithm
21:47:01 <Alberth> for extra wtf, apply the same trick for green now :p
21:47:53 <Alberth> not sure if it helps, depends a bit on how many palette colours with the same red distance you have
21:48:24 <V453000> basically fucking the values up to match what eye does
21:48:36 <V453000> but I'll likely still try the CIEDE2000
21:49:22 <Alberth> I wondered about that idea too, seems worthwhile to try to weigh red changes heavier than eg blue
21:50:38 <Alberth> makes a colour comparison heavier, so less comparisons has bigger impact even :)
21:53:03 <Alberth> factor 3/4 sort of stays the same
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21:54:39 <Alberth> green looks like the biggest impact, so that should be what you sort on
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22:02:20 <Alberth> it should be possible to establish an upper bound on the error of eg green, given a (small-ish) set of palette colours
22:05:13 <Alberth> then you can compute when you reach infeasible palette colours
22:05:46 <Alberth> only saves memory though, it won't reduce computations
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