IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2016-11-27
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09:02:45 <andythenorth> dot layout from graphviz is non-deterministic :D
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09:15:25 <Alberth> although, are you sure you give it the exact same file every time?
09:15:53 <Alberth> and not eg, generate the file from a Python dictionary, which stores its data in a non-deterministic way?
09:19:22 <andythenorth> it _seems_ to be deterministic for me locally, but bundles varies
09:19:35 <andythenorth> might be different python version, different graphviz, different xyz :)
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09:41:37 <andythenorth> how could I group specialty metals?
09:41:42 <andythenorth> nickel, zinc, copper etc
09:42:04 * peter1138 ponders getting the dev tools out
09:42:06 <andythenorth> which are used for (1) making alloys with iron / steel (2) plating (3) tubes and stuff
09:42:17 <andythenorth> doing subways? o_O
09:42:20 <peter1138> or i could just do the normal thing and go on a bike ride
09:42:43 <peter1138> nah i usually just update my ancient patches and then leave them to stagnate again
09:42:53 <peter1138> rgb company colours!
09:43:14 <peter1138> remember when i had working custom bridge heads once...
09:53:32 <andythenorth> I need zinc, nickel, copper
09:57:22 <Alberth> perhaps make an invisible connection between them?
09:58:31 <Alberth> although, in general, giving dot more freedom produces less bad results
10:00:00 <andythenorth> I think I’ll leave dot to do its thing :)
10:01:43 <andythenorth> too much about vehicle parts
10:02:26 <andythenorth> also I added grain and livestock for food and alcohol
10:02:36 <andythenorth> but maybe that’s not needed
10:03:29 <andythenorth> the flow should be quite linear in this economy, but currently it’s spidering
10:14:05 <Alberth> port shouldn't take vehicles?
10:15:25 <andythenorth> the port-type industries are usually where the hax happen to make an economy work without all cargos/industries
10:15:34 <andythenorth> in this economy, they’re not helping at the moment
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10:37:15 <andythenorth> hmm no source for alcohol
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10:41:26 <Alberth> it's not possible to leave it out, apparently :)
10:48:51 <andythenorth> I might drop it :P
10:49:23 <andythenorth> seems a bit unfair, steelworkers probably like a drink
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12:03:31 <frosch123> until slag/steel it looks good
12:03:35 <frosch123> then it turns weird
12:04:05 <frosch123> 3 sources for farm supplies in an economy with hardly farms seems off :)
12:04:29 <frosch123> i would think almost all the steel industries would use eng supplies
12:05:45 <andythenorth> could drop slag as a source of fmsp
12:05:56 <andythenorth> I thought there would be more farm industries when I added that
12:06:09 <frosch123> i would keep slag, and drop the lime
12:07:54 <andythenorth> drop alcohol? or import it?
12:08:46 <frosch123> alcohol from port, base metals from bulk terminal, oil from liquid terminal
12:09:01 <andythenorth> I am thinking approx. same
12:09:09 <andythenorth> but I have nothing to deliver to liquid terminal
12:09:12 <andythenorth> so no prod. boost
12:09:31 <frosch123> farm supplies for export?
12:09:39 <andythenorth> liquid tractors? o_O
12:09:42 <frosch123> hmm, but makes no sense for liquid terminal given the source industries
12:09:54 <andythenorth> I am thinking to expand ‘chemicals’ a bit
12:10:04 <andythenorth> splitting out ‘plastic’ or something
12:10:05 <Eddi|zuHause> fertilizer is usually powdered, not liquid
12:10:19 <andythenorth> I don’t know much about chemical industry
12:11:03 <frosch123> alcohol from port, oil from bulk terminal, drop base metals and add aluminium chain instead?
12:11:28 <andythenorth> bitumen from oil -> + slag -> asphalt
12:11:46 <frosch123> asphalt sounds like builindg materials
12:13:03 <andythenorth> I think it’s too detailed
12:13:19 <frosch123> chemical plant / oil refinery looks redundant
12:13:38 <andythenorth> unless I add plastics or specific petrochemicals
12:13:54 <andythenorth> but I don’t see the point of either, it’s Steeltown, not Petroltown
12:14:11 <andythenorth> Chemical Refinery just looks cool :P
12:14:14 <Eddi|zuHause> lots of roads around here were paved with some kind of slag-cobble, but it turned out to be very slippery when wet, after the initial grippy surface wore off
12:14:26 <andythenorth> could import chemicals and fuel
12:15:05 <andythenorth> I need some liquid cargo for export
12:15:33 <andythenorth> but from what? Grain?
12:15:35 <Eddi|zuHause> cut the liquid terminal, and add cargo to bulk terminal?
12:15:41 <andythenorth> I did already :)
12:15:46 <andythenorth> now I’m proposing reversing that
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12:16:23 <Eddi|zuHause> sausagefinger-tab
12:16:48 <frosch123> andythenorth: i guess engineering supplies for liquid terminal
12:16:53 <frosch123> they just get machinery to unload stuff
12:16:58 <frosch123> nothing for real export
12:17:44 <andythenorth> as I cut out more cargos, it’s tempting to add more steel types
12:18:11 <frosch123> i still like aluminium
12:18:32 <andythenorth> aluminium could be imported now
12:18:42 <frosch123> also a second farm would be cool to dump more of the slag
12:18:49 <andythenorth> I didn’t want an alu. smelter
12:18:51 <frosch123> and to supply alcohol somehow
12:19:21 <Jinassi> It's awfully nice seeing more interaction with ships, but how does that correlate with ship pathfinder? Even a 100 ships can wreck a gameplay, if orders not set right/no buoys/not enough buyos?
12:20:27 <Jinassi> Has there been any update adressing that?
12:20:43 <andythenorth> frosch123: I want to add an engine plant: that would be iron + base metals, and that’s where aluminium could also be used
12:21:00 <frosch123> what exactly are base metals?
12:22:09 <andythenorth> nickel, copper, chromium (and lead, but that’s irrelevant here)
12:22:20 <andythenorth> they go into alloys and for plating
12:22:32 * andythenorth had to look it up :P
12:22:43 <andythenorth> nickel was too specific, as was copper
12:23:30 <andythenorth> I’ve got a better graph, just waiting for bundles
12:29:20 <andythenorth> interesting how different the dot output is on bundles vs. locally
12:32:20 <frosch123> that graph is complete, isn't it?
12:32:41 <frosch123> no cargo without producer or accepter
12:35:08 <frosch123> i think the graph looks good, but it has too much farm supplies and to little eng supplies, compared to which industries need it
12:35:21 <frosch123> how about adding engsup as output to metal workshop?
12:35:34 <frosch123> and droppping farmsup from machine shop?
12:35:53 <andythenorth> or adding more fmsp consumers
12:36:28 <frosch123> well, maybe shipping them to the bulk terminal is fine
12:36:58 <andythenorth> tractors are big in pittsburgh / cologne :P
12:38:10 <frosch123> rename hotel to adventure farm and make it accept fmsp?
12:38:19 * andythenorth wondered about distinguishing steel coil, steel bar etc
12:38:44 <frosch123> you already have galvanised steel :)
12:40:56 <frosch123> maybe a forest for fmsp? wood could go to builders yard and metal workshop
12:42:19 <andythenorth> the building materials lacks lumber
12:42:42 <andythenorth> there was a forest, but I removed it when I removed iron works
12:44:30 <andythenorth> I guess weapons factory is out? :P
12:45:23 <frosch123> shipyard is like a port without output cargos
12:45:45 <frosch123> spaceport is only useful for accepting nuclear waste
12:46:36 <frosch123> shipyard would accep steel, wood, vehicle parts?
12:46:37 <andythenorth> oil rig fab yard?
12:46:53 <andythenorth> yes, vehicle parts for ships :)
12:46:59 <andythenorth> engines, tyres to hang on the side :)
12:48:57 <andythenorth> I considered a few other things that didn’t make it
12:49:05 <andythenorth> - electrical machinery
12:49:18 <frosch123> make the metal workshop produce mechanics? vehicle factory uses mechanics instead of chemicals?
12:49:59 <frosch123> shipyard then uses steel, wood and mechaincs
12:50:42 <frosch123> or possibly building materials instead of wood
12:51:00 <andythenorth> considered also something like turbines + wind farm components
12:51:24 <frosch123> just needs a better name for "mechanics"
12:51:38 <andythenorth> mechanical components
12:51:43 <andythenorth> overlaps with vehicle parts though
12:52:31 <frosch123> very different input cargos
12:52:37 <andythenorth> could do body parts and mechanical parts
12:52:50 <andythenorth> powertrain components
12:57:23 <andythenorth> I wouldn’t mind dropping chemicals from vehicle factory, it’s too prevalent
12:59:57 <frosch123> so, body parts and powertrain parts?
13:00:19 <frosch123> powertrain parts also being used by shipyard?
13:00:28 <andythenorth> body parts sounds like stolen kidneys, but yes
13:00:47 <andythenorth> so does the vehicle factory drop galvanised steel (goes to body plant)? Or does it drop chemicals?
13:01:14 <frosch123> there are already many chemical destinations and only once source
13:01:26 <frosch123> and the chemicals/paint thing seems a bit far fetched
13:18:12 <andythenorth> graph would be neater if a metals terminal supplied base metal, also then aluminium
13:25:02 <andythenorth> frosch123: ^ needs either a metals terminal, or an ore dock (and maybe aluminium chain added)
13:25:25 <andythenorth> port could provide food also, there would be very little food, which is bad for arctic / tropic
13:25:27 <Wolf01> andythenorth, ever considered to do somethin like ECS?
13:26:25 <andythenorth> most of the FIRS game for me is designing economies
13:26:47 <andythenorth> modular systems remove all the interesting design questions, and substitute very boring design questions
13:27:03 <andythenorth> it’s just a technical exercise of ensuring compatibility for all combinations of module
13:27:45 <andythenorth> not yet, got to go the supermarket in a minute :D
13:28:04 <andythenorth> airplane factory also? (It’s planned for a ‘seattle’ economy anyway)
13:28:26 <frosch123> seems to be the same as shipyard wrt input/output
13:28:38 <andythenorth> outputs ‘airplane bodies’
13:28:42 <andythenorth> they go somewhere off-map
13:28:43 <frosch123> shipyard appear more visually inteesting to me
13:29:41 <andythenorth> limits the game to post 1930s or so
13:29:44 <andythenorth> shipyard doesn't
13:30:05 <frosch123> only small planes fit on a train
13:31:14 * andythenorth wonders about aluminium: import it, or smelt it?
13:31:34 <frosch123> if you add it, then smelt it
13:31:41 <frosch123> import bauxite, like manganese
13:32:00 <andythenorth> might add an ore terminal
13:32:11 <andythenorth> dunno what that accepts
13:32:21 <andythenorth> planned for australia / brazil economy also :P
13:32:24 <andythenorth> oh such plans :)
13:33:12 <andythenorth> bauxite + aluminium puts it at 29 cargos
13:33:16 <andythenorth> that’s probably enough
13:33:42 <andythenorth> import explosives from port?
13:34:23 <frosch123> and since when do you try to fill all cargo slots?
13:35:02 <andythenorth> I am trying to keep to less than 30
13:35:10 <andythenorth> explosives -> supply yard -> ensp
13:35:45 <frosch123> explosives only work for mines, and you are importing all the mine stuff
13:35:58 <frosch123> engsups is for heavy industry in this economy
13:36:18 * andythenorth considers pipe cargo, looks cool in wagons
13:36:34 <frosch123> so steel plate and steel pipe?
13:37:06 <frosch123> does not really work together with the galvanized stuff
13:37:24 <andythenorth> it would have to be a pipe mill
13:37:33 <andythenorth> steel -> pipe -> liquids terminal
13:38:00 <frosch123> i guess is also fine :)
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15:24:08 <andythenorth> is PIPE countable bulk? o_O
15:24:12 <andythenorth> or just piece goods?
15:26:39 <andythenorth> and is the unit tonnes, or metres?
15:29:32 <Eddi|zuHause> think like wood logs
15:29:57 <Eddi|zuHause> so, goes on stake wagons
15:30:27 <Eddi|zuHause> and tonnes should work
15:30:28 <andythenorth> wood can be countable bulk :P
15:30:40 <andythenorth> and measuring it by length isn’t funny
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15:47:26 <Eddi|zuHause> there's lots of Mühlheims, but that one is probably in the Ruhr-area
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15:55:00 <andythenorth> fits this economy :)
15:55:05 <andythenorth> for whatever that’s worth (not much)
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16:19:46 <Eddi|zuHause> can't say anything about that
16:30:12 <andythenorth> think I have to delete it
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16:32:09 <frosch123> base metals is missing from metal workshop
16:32:20 <frosch123> did you decide against a shipyard?
16:32:39 <frosch123> not sure the pipe mill should get base metals
16:34:15 <andythenorth> I need to add the shipyard :)
16:34:23 <andythenorth> pipe mill now produces ENSP and BDMT
16:34:32 <frosch123> i like the pipe cargo
16:34:43 <andythenorth> ok I’ll revert my delete
16:34:45 <frosch123> the basemetal adds the chaos
16:35:43 <andythenorth> no cupro-nickel pipes here
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16:38:50 <andythenorth> this economy has an annoying number of coastal industries :)
16:39:13 <andythenorth> game will build them in tiny lakes :)
16:40:41 <frosch123> yes, it's different to the other economies in having very few primary industries
16:40:59 <frosch123> which is good, since it makes it different for playing other than looking different
16:43:50 <andythenorth> one day I will find a fix to that coastal industry problem
16:45:33 <andythenorth> so what does shipyard make? o_O
16:45:41 <andythenorth> Some kind of Marine Supplies?
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17:00:49 <andythenorth> frosch123: ok you get aluminium
17:01:06 <andythenorth> Alcoa is a big aluminium company, they started in Pittsburgh
17:01:17 <andythenorth> ‘Steeltown’ is Pittsburgh (crossed with the Ruhr)
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17:08:37 <frosch123> shipyard is black hole
17:09:25 <frosch123> though if you add marine supplies, you could deliver them to all the other ports
17:09:46 <frosch123> might be more interesting than the normal engsups
17:09:47 <andythenorth> odd concept, might work
17:09:59 <andythenorth> I’ve pushed, waiting for bundles again
17:10:12 <andythenorth> aluminium smelter messes up the graph, because it needs chemicals :P
17:10:34 <frosch123> Wolf01: what nrt stuff are you working on? i don't want to work on the same :)
17:10:52 <frosch123> i would add the savegame conversion for roadsubtypes otherwise
17:11:57 <Wolf01> I only implemented part of the patch you linked me yesterday, but I stopped when I noticed it needed the conversion
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17:20:47 <frosch123> vehicle parts to shipyard?
17:21:55 <andythenorth> dunno, seemed like they’d want glass and stuff
17:22:13 <andythenorth> happy to change it
17:22:32 <andythenorth> ach, aluminium plant has chemicals to nobble it in extreme
17:22:48 <andythenorth> otherwise it’s much more efficient than steel mill at converting scrap metal
17:22:51 <frosch123> build materials instead of vehicle parts to shipyard?
17:23:06 <andythenorth> ha, that is plausible
17:23:18 <andythenorth> especially if it’s a marine yard that produces rigs and stuff as well
17:23:22 <andythenorth> like the forum suggestion
17:24:34 <frosch123> split engsups into engsup/marinesup? or keep it as it?
17:24:39 <frosch123> looks done otherweise
17:25:03 <andythenorth> I am thinking split it
17:25:10 <andythenorth> to see if it makes any sense
17:25:26 <andythenorth> I see nothing else to add, but wonder what can be removed...
17:25:53 <andythenorth> machine shop builds tractors, shipyard builds tugs
17:26:10 <andythenorth> aluminium smelter is bothering me
17:27:01 <frosch123> you could drop vehicles and turn them into goods
17:27:08 <frosch123> then you can also drop vehicle dealer and petrol
17:27:42 <frosch123> you can always drop the hotel
17:29:46 <andythenorth> hotel seems to be undeletable
17:29:53 <andythenorth> whenever I delete it, I add it back :P
17:30:08 <andythenorth> I think I depend on it too much for pax when building first route
17:30:33 <andythenorth> MASP seems ugly :P
17:34:27 <andythenorth> just sounds ugly in my head :)
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17:58:05 <andythenorth> so err…what’s the unit for marine supplies?
17:58:12 <andythenorth> and what if it’s a ship? :P
17:58:50 <andythenorth> vehicles are just ’n vehicles'
17:59:18 <frosch123> i guess crates are the only thing that makes sense to transport
17:59:32 <frosch123> you don't put ships on trucks
17:59:36 <frosch123> at least not real ships
18:02:30 <andythenorth> I’ve pushed, waiting on bundles some more
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18:08:37 <andythenorth> I tried quicklime -> aluminium plant, it’s a bit of a mess
18:08:44 <frosch123> you need to add MASP to the graph script :)
18:09:12 <andythenorth> Extreme aluminium smelter merges both bauxite refining and scrap melting
18:09:21 <andythenorth> this economy should just pick one or the other
18:09:35 <Wolf01> Petroleum Fuels to Vehicle Dealer? Why?
18:09:45 <andythenorth> yeah, I wonder if petrol could be dropped entirely?
18:09:47 <frosch123> remove engsups from the ports now?
18:10:26 <andythenorth> main input to smelting aluminium is refined bauxite (aluminia), and some cryolite (wiki that)
18:10:31 <andythenorth> + loads of electricity
18:10:40 <andythenorth> and some base metal for tuning the resulting alloy
18:22:54 <andythenorth> dot has done a nice job there
18:23:01 <andythenorth> steel from bottom left, foundation of economy
18:23:08 <andythenorth> over to town and export
18:23:37 <andythenorth> pipe has got a bit isolated
18:23:44 <andythenorth> looping it back to liquids terminal made a mess :P
18:23:49 <Wolf01> frosch123, working on something else than saveload?
18:24:51 <frosch123> andythenorth: the graph script has a list of the supplies labels
18:25:05 <andythenorth> I have just changed it :)
18:25:20 <frosch123> Wolf01: i pushed some stuff earlier
18:25:45 <frosch123> though you may need a new newgrf
18:26:18 <Wolf01> I'm going to remove the old Set/GetRoadTypes()
18:26:56 <frosch123> Wolf01: i am about to remove them :)
18:27:13 <frosch123> that's part of the savegame conversion
18:27:44 * andythenorth wonders if designing economies to make a nice dot graph is wise :)
18:27:45 <frosch123> earlier i wondered about the autoreplace gui
18:27:55 <frosch123> for trains there is a selection of railtypes
18:27:55 <Wolf01> You already simplified RoadTypeIdentifiers::FromTile too?
18:28:19 <frosch123> andythenorth: it's not the worst thing if players understand the flow :)
18:28:36 <frosch123> andythenorth: but definitely fix the masp before judging :)
18:29:58 <Wolf01> <frosch123> earlier i wondered about the autoreplace gui <- yeah, a big mess, I think we should also split trams from there, as you can't even convert a bus to tram in vanilla
18:31:38 <andythenorth> I think that’s worth me play-testing now
18:31:49 <andythenorth> there is probably some back-and-forth with goods, and so on
18:31:56 <frosch123> bulk terminal gets two supplies, intentional?
18:32:03 <andythenorth> yes, we’re over-supplied for FMSP
18:32:17 <andythenorth> relative to demand
18:32:31 <andythenorth> the ports have quite high supply requirements (640t for gung ho)
18:33:05 <andythenorth> that’s why I left ENSP on the ore terminal initially :)
18:33:23 <frosch123> ah, you moved pipe to shipyard
18:33:31 <frosch123> that's why the graph got simpler :)
18:34:04 <frosch123> also add pipe to builders yard?
18:34:28 <frosch123> it's a bit weird that you can send steel to shipyard via and not via pipe mill
18:34:52 <frosch123> but it would be fine if pipe had another destination
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18:36:43 <andythenorth> I think it’s a bit of a mess right now
18:37:53 <andythenorth> I only want the cargo because it might look good on trains :)
18:49:27 <andythenorth> I think pipe has to go
18:51:47 <andythenorth> it can be building materials
18:52:12 <andythenorth> pipe can re-appear in some oil-based economy :P
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18:52:29 <frosch123> you mean, keep pipe mill, but make it produce building materials?
18:52:39 <frosch123> and add building materials to shipyard?
18:53:10 <andythenorth> all of those things
18:53:21 <andythenorth> in another economy, import pipe, and use it for vehicles there
18:53:23 <frosch123> replace vehicles with goods, and drop the port?
18:53:31 <frosch123> and drop vehicle dealer
18:53:39 <andythenorth> nah, I want vehicle cargo sprites :)
18:53:40 <frosch123> oh, no alcohol then :p
18:53:45 <andythenorth> and I won’t provide this chain other place
18:56:01 <andythenorth> could be ‘rolling mill’ not ‘pipe mill’
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19:42:19 <andythenorth> then make Farm Supplies ‘Logging Supplies’?
19:43:38 <Rubidium> make it a server farm and use it to transport information
19:44:08 <andythenorth> that is a whole economy, baseset and grfs :P
19:45:48 * andythenorth was envisaging a network hardware baseset :P
19:45:51 <andythenorth> not sneakernet :)
19:47:11 <frosch123> andythenorth: farm supplies for forest is fine
19:48:07 <andythenorth> bugs me that fertiliser doesn’t go to farm
19:48:16 <andythenorth> also…finland kills 70k-80k moose per year
19:48:23 <andythenorth> and harvests forest fruits and stuff
19:48:31 <andythenorth> so forest -> food? o_O
19:48:52 <andythenorth> or hunting grounds -> food
19:49:10 <andythenorth> no way to increase the output :)
19:49:22 <andythenorth> unless logging supplies includes hunting gear
19:49:30 <frosch123> sounds like a food chain
19:50:23 <frosch123> hunter, rancher, meat grinder, cook, fast food, frozen lasagna, horse meat recycling
19:51:08 <frosch123> could be your first toyland economy :)
19:51:19 <frosch123> ice cream, burgers and such
19:52:15 <frosch123> but might be more a V thing
19:52:23 <andythenorth> you have just described the urban economy I planned :P
19:52:47 <andythenorth> also I thought a florist maybe? o_O
19:52:54 <andythenorth> air-freight flowers
19:53:00 <frosch123> netherland economy?
19:53:44 <andythenorth> hmm capitalism isn’t really a cargo
19:54:03 * andythenorth ponders a stupid conceptual economy
19:54:23 <frosch123> then you can add cacao, chocolate, wafers
19:54:23 <andythenorth> transporting ideas to and from universities, governments, marketplaces, newspapers
19:54:34 <andythenorth> we never did slaves :P
19:54:49 <andythenorth> I have been reading a book again about how much slaving Europeans did around the North Sea
19:54:57 <frosch123> but it requires work to turn them real
19:55:52 <frosch123> ships, beer -> exploration camp -> slaves, food
19:57:18 <andythenorth> raiders -> monasteries -> tribute
19:58:04 <andythenorth> also the Hanseatic league used to blockade the winter grain into Bergen, if the king of Norway had annoyed them
19:58:14 <andythenorth> and Norwegian Stockfish was a major food commodity
20:07:21 <andythenorth> 1. Logging Supplies -> Forest -> Wood. Hunting Grounds -> Food (no production boost)
20:07:34 <andythenorth> 2. Logging & hunting Supplies -> Forest -> Wood, Food
20:08:23 <frosch123> don't add too many supply types :)
20:08:31 <frosch123> they are all just boxes
20:09:01 <andythenorth> 3. Farm Supplies -> Forest -> Wood. Hunting Grounds -> Good (no production boost)
20:09:33 <andythenorth> don’t really want Logging Supplies, it’s messy
20:10:17 <andythenorth> then there can be a fishing hole
20:13:43 <andythenorth> is ice watertypes? o_O
20:27:41 <Wolf01> Umh, SceneFactory or SceneProvider? I already know (how to build) the scenes, I only need to build them on request
20:46:20 <frosch123> andythenorth: roadtype :)
20:47:16 <frosch123> the ship crossing works different to rail crossing though. while rail crossings are closed some time before the train passes, ship crossing are closed some time after the ship crossed
21:26:37 <andythenorth> I was thinking of ice water, hovercraft only :P
21:27:01 <andythenorth> or ice sailing rigs
21:28:11 <V453000> andythenorth going wild?
21:29:40 <frosch123> Wolf01: pushed the savegame conversion
21:29:45 <frosch123> m7 6..7 is no longer used
21:29:56 <frosch123> GetRoadTypes is still present with some compatibility code
21:30:06 <frosch123> it's still used in many places
21:30:22 <frosch123> if you have savegames from the earlier patch, they are likely broken now
21:52:32 <andythenorth> hunting camp probably works
21:52:42 <andythenorth> no supply boost = ‘interesting’
21:53:04 <andythenorth> I should have consolidated a single ‘Supplies’ for smaller economies maybe
21:56:46 <andythenorth> a moose is 500kg
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21:57:47 <andythenorth> and Sweden shoots 8,000 of them per month, averaged
21:58:16 <andythenorth> 50t / month food is probably about right
22:00:03 <Wolf01> I need to fix scenario editor, crashed badly when opening the road toolbar
22:00:37 <andythenorth> is it all separate code there?
22:01:19 <Wolf01> Not really, it shares a lot with normal game, but some initializations must be done there too, and I think I didn't put them into the editor code
22:02:34 <andythenorth> hmm, can I detect rivers
22:02:41 * andythenorth considers fish nets for river fish
22:13:03 <andythenorth> should probably try and detect rivers :P
22:13:07 <andythenorth> not tonight though
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23:22:32 <Guest175> whats the largest most impressive saved game out there that i can download?
23:23:24 <Guest175> with like the entire map already covered in cities and unlimited trains in every nook and cranny of the map?
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continue to next day ⏵
