IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2016-10-29
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10:55:31 <Ethereal_Whisper> I jammed up one of my ML's lanes because I de-electrified my network and thought I had gotten rid of all the electric locos
10:55:33 <Ethereal_Whisper> I guess not lol
10:56:39 <Alberth> good way to find them :p
11:25:44 <andythenorth> then can have hover-craft only routes
11:26:13 <Wolf01> Throws the stone and quit
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12:03:38 <Wolf01> Ho! Now that I've seen it better, Apple removed all the function keys... how is possible to live without all the function keys?
12:04:16 <Alberth> My only use of function keys is f1 for pausing openttd
12:04:56 <Alberth> which I agree should be a real key for a keyboard
12:05:35 <Alberth> hmm, google chrome may need that
12:05:42 <Alberth> but normally never use that
12:06:00 <Wolf01> F5/F8/F9 to quick save/reload in games?
12:06:40 <Wolf01> F10 to open Starcraft menu
12:06:42 <Alberth> I play only a few games
12:07:41 <Alberth> ever used scroll lock?
12:07:58 <Alberth> hmm, I also seem to have a "pause/break" key, no idea what's that for
12:08:17 <Alberth> "insert" seems useless too, to me
12:08:17 <Wolf01> Scroll lock is used in Excel iirc
12:09:22 <Wolf01> Yes, it is used in excel, you scroll the sheet or move through cells
12:09:48 <Alberth> hmm, maybe not, it's suspend input, iirc
12:10:03 <Alberth> which does have the same effect in a terminal :)
12:13:30 <Wolf01> The only useless keys I have are most of the 18 macro keys on my keyboard... because I don't remember which function I assigned to them
12:18:27 <Wolf01> I want one of those keyboards with lcd macro keys
12:18:59 <Wolf01> Oh, that's not even all, I can switch between 3 profiles, so I have 54 macro keys
12:19:52 <Wolf01> Also every software could have it's own keys, infinite possibilities
12:20:54 <Alberth> what kind of macros do you have under a key?
12:22:04 <Wolf01> Every kind of stuff you can even imagine
12:22:30 <Wolf01> From "run a software" to "write an entire poem typing random keys"
12:23:37 <Alberth> ah, small script-like things, where I'd write a bash or python script for in $HOME/bin
12:25:06 <Alberth> not sure it's of any use though
12:25:21 <Alberth> but people will find applications for it :)
12:27:01 <Alberth> bleh, one morning wasted on trying to merge a long patch queue with new master changes
12:38:12 <Youbi> Hello! I built OpenTTD from source (r27669), and when I save the game, openttd crashes. Should I report it as a bug?
12:42:10 <Alberth> did you configure it correctly?
12:42:59 <Youbi> I think so. I just disabled lzo2 which is used to load old savegames.
12:44:06 <Youbi> It crashes when I click on “Save”
12:44:38 <Alberth> I mean, in what function, at what line? ie a readable stack trace
12:44:55 <Alberth> "Save" runs a few zillions lines of code
12:45:27 <Youbi> Yep I ran strace, does it produce a correct stack trace?
12:45:47 <Alberth> strace does system call tracing
12:46:26 <Alberth> I mean use a debugger like gdb, trigger the crash, and get a stack of functions that are called at that time
12:46:59 <Alberth> you do need a debug build, to get readable symbols, at least at Linux
12:48:30 <Alberth> alternatively, get a core dump when it crashes, and analyze that in a debugger or crash-analyzer or whatever you have
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13:03:19 <Youbi> Alberth: ok I will try gdb :)
13:20:42 <argoneus> good morning train friends
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14:11:53 <Wolf01> I need to decide how much headache I want today
14:22:20 <Wolf01> Scene state machine: I can register a scene only once in the SceneManager and retrieve it by type, to move to another scene I need to set it as "active", then do SceneManager::Next(), which looks for the next active scene, deactivate the current one, loads the new one and unloads the current one
14:23:31 <Alberth> why not give the new active scene to the SceneManager directly?
14:24:28 <Wolf01> I could do ::Next(typeof(NewScene))
14:24:43 <Wolf01> But not already active, or I'll have 2 running loops
14:25:20 <Alberth> what I mean is "which looks for the next active scene" is a bit weird if you already found it
14:26:19 <Wolf01> Because I might have something to do before ::Next(), like an easing
14:26:31 <Wolf01> And at the end of the easing it does ::Next()
14:27:03 <Wolf01> I could set the type in a private variable and pass it to ::Next() at that time
14:27:24 <Wolf01> So the SceneManager doesn't need to look for it
14:28:22 <Alberth> would clarify who should decide the next scene, I think
14:29:24 <Alberth> as well as avoiding double work
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14:30:23 <Wolf01> The current scene decides where it wants to go, think about a menu
14:30:48 <Wolf01> The SceneManager moves, updates, loads, unloads, pauses...
14:30:56 <Alberth> you can have multiple exits from a single scene
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14:31:20 <Alberth> you have an "active_scene" pointer-ish variable in the scene manager?
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14:31:38 <Alberth> that would eliminate the possibility to have 2 running scenese
14:31:42 <Wolf01> Not at the moment, but I'm considering it to do it
14:35:27 <Wolf01> As it is now, it is able to run all the active scenes in the Update() loop
14:36:10 <Wolf01> This to allow to load modal scenes (like a menu)
14:36:51 <Wolf01> While keeping the underlying scenes paused but not unloades
14:42:08 <Wolf01> I could create linked lists for easings, so I will have curScene -> easingScene -> otherScene, instead of having the easing inside the scene
14:42:41 <Alberth> makes scene management more complicated
14:43:15 <Alberth> or you get a lot of the same-ish easingScenes, perhaps?
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14:43:46 <Alberth> actually, you can do the above split now too
14:44:08 <Wolf01> Yes, like EntranceFromLeftEasing, EntranceFromRightEasing, DarkenEasing...
14:44:10 <Alberth> you just get more scenes
14:44:39 <Alberth> doesn't need a linked list
14:45:55 <Wolf01> LinkedList has AddAfter()/AddBefore() methods
14:50:43 <andythenorth> ^ not happy with that
14:50:51 <andythenorth> it’s RH, but copied from somewhere, maybe FISH
14:50:56 <andythenorth> doesn’t set good buy costs
14:52:17 <andythenorth> notably pax trams are coming out relatively cheap compared to buses
14:52:22 <andythenorth> on per passenger basis
14:52:36 <Wolf01> Now I'm undecided about the parameters type :E ::GetScene(Type scene) -> .GetScene(typeof(MyScene)) or ::GetScene<T>() -> .GetScene<MyScene>()
14:53:40 <andythenorth> that formula looks like it might have been Iron Horse, where engines don’t have capacity, mostly
14:53:57 <Wolf01> andythenorth, add consist_capacity_points to buy_cost?
14:54:00 <Alberth> Wolf01: you have 1 scene of each type?
14:54:10 <Wolf01> Yes, I said that before
14:54:24 <andythenorth> Wolf01: seems easiest eh?
14:55:31 <Alberth> I don't see the advantage of having a type, tbh, but ymmv
14:55:38 <Wolf01> Just make both properties the same, one with base_buy_cost and the other with base_running_cost
14:56:03 <Wolf01> The type is the key of the dictionary
14:57:01 <Alberth> ie why is there a dictionary?
14:57:18 <Wolf01> To hold the registered scenes
14:57:46 <Alberth> andythenorth: maybe dump the values of the various sub-parts for the various vehicles, to get an impression of their values?
14:57:58 <Wolf01> I register all the scenes at game initialization
14:58:15 <andythenorth> Alberth: possibly, I am trying first just putting capacity in :)
14:58:24 <andythenorth> might be a big enough hammer for this nail
14:58:35 <Alberth> how do you look for a new scene? using the same dictionary?
14:58:54 <Alberth> maybe the dictionary is at the wrong place?
14:59:02 <Alberth> and you need a scene storage or so?
14:59:02 <Wolf01> There isn't a "new" scene, you can only pick one of the other inactive scenes
14:59:26 <Alberth> ok how do you find one of the other inactive scenes?
15:00:13 <Wolf01> Dictionary [Type, instance]
15:00:15 <Alberth> so you don't actually have a scene, only a type, ie <T> is still a type
15:00:34 <Wolf01> As lists/arrays only allow int indexes
15:00:46 <andythenorth> ha ha, one pax tram now costs more than high speed electric engine in Iron Horse
15:00:48 <Wolf01> And I don't want to look up for the index
15:00:55 <Alberth> it's weird to name it a type, as 'type' implies you have more than one of them :)
15:01:40 <Wolf01> Dictionary [MyScene, instance_of_MyScene], [MenuScene, instance_of_MenuScene] and so on
15:01:41 <Alberth> well, just pick the simplest solution, we discussed it long enough without getting anywhere
15:02:01 <andythenorth> code something, delete later
15:02:08 * andythenorth may not be helping
15:02:23 <Alberth> a shitload of singletons :)
15:02:36 <andythenorth> 140 pax tram has more power than 400 pax metro
15:02:43 <andythenorth> but metros don’t go up long hills...
15:03:00 <andythenorth> consistency across sets :P
15:03:17 <Alberth> 140 pax tram has more room for the engine :p
15:03:35 <Wolf01> Yes, I have single instance scenes
15:03:54 <andythenorth> can you just access them by name? o_O
15:03:57 <Wolf01> I don't see the point of having multiple instances of the same exact scene
15:04:17 <Wolf01> Yes, the Type *is* the name
15:05:38 * andythenorth will stay out of it :)
15:06:23 <Wolf01> Even the UWP page manager works like that, but they use typeof(class) instead of <T>
15:07:15 <Wolf01> But for component services I use <T> and I would like to mantain the same for scenes too
15:08:32 <Wolf01> It's just moving the typeof() inside the method instead of passing it as parameter
15:08:42 <andythenorth> why don’t you want to look up the index?
15:08:47 <andythenorth> other than that always seems clunky?
15:08:56 <andythenorth> I suspect the performance hit is negligible
15:09:02 <Wolf01> Because I already know the name
15:10:11 <andythenorth> so no ‘for i in array, if i.name == the_name, return i’ stuff
15:10:16 <Alberth> I think a lot of confusion arises from the word 'Type', rather than 'name'
15:10:40 <Wolf01> Type is the class name
15:10:53 <Wolf01> I don't need other names, one class = one scene
15:11:05 <Alberth> no, Type is the class, normally
15:11:14 <Alberth> ie "Object" vs Object
15:11:41 <Alberth> I would really hope it is
15:11:42 <andythenorth> afaict, this is the same shaped problem as I have in newgrf
15:11:54 <andythenorth> I frequently have to look up vehicle objects, or industry objects or whatever
15:11:57 <Alberth> or you can't have strings with a name of a class in it :)
15:11:57 <andythenorth> in lists or dicts
15:13:07 <andythenorth> do they have to be kept in an array or similar for ordering?
15:13:22 <andythenorth> or could you just fetch them with scenes.scene_1, scenes.scene_2 or so
15:13:28 <Wolf01> If you need to check if x is an instance of Class you do "x.GetType() == typeof(Class)", if you need to check if x is instance of a more generic type, like object or interface, you do "x is object/interface£
15:14:05 * andythenorth looks up some c#
15:15:08 <andythenorth> Wolf01: got a paste? :)
15:15:15 <andythenorth> I have no idea if I can help, just curious
15:15:23 <andythenorth> also avoiding eating my greens on Road Hog
15:15:33 <Wolf01> Even with subclassing, if you have class MyClass : BaseClass, you do x is BaseClass, because the type is MyClass
15:15:56 <Alberth> How is a class not a type?
15:16:24 <Alberth> ah well, nvm, please go ahead
15:16:47 <Alberth> too much headache for me :)
15:17:12 <andythenorth> this will be like one of those programming pickles where the smoke clears and all is obvious
15:17:18 * andythenorth has been there before
15:18:22 <Alberth> Type looks smelly to me, as a class is not a type, which is weird to say the least
15:20:16 <Wolf01> Ok, in the first one I could cast it inside the method
15:22:11 <Wolf01> No, it doesn't cast with variables, only with T
15:22:49 <Alberth> compile-time generic, I guess
15:24:39 <andythenorth> ach, RH buy costs seem to work now
15:24:53 * andythenorth guessed an arbitrary adjustment, all is well
15:25:47 <andythenorth> now I am going to automate vehicle weight, based on capacity
15:25:58 * andythenorth has frameworked away most vehicle choices :P
15:26:09 <andythenorth> but hopefully the set still feels varied and interesting
15:26:45 <andythenorth> global rules for cost, capacity, weight, speed, power, and also automated cargo sprites
15:26:51 <andythenorth> but eh, it looks nice
15:28:44 <Wolf01> Oops, I made an error, public object(Type scene)... or cast inside return (Scene)_scenes[scene], but still likited to BaseClass/Interface
15:29:24 <Wolf01> With T is less verbose
15:29:50 <Wolf01> (I could keep both eh)
15:33:31 <andythenorth> ach, automating weight is tricky, as there are varying number of vehicles in consists
15:35:20 <andythenorth> hmm, no, weight is only on lead unit of consist anyway
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16:13:19 <Alberth> it's like Java generics
16:13:57 <Alberth> but my problem is mostly why a class is not a type :)
16:14:58 <Alberth> maybe they do weird stuff with generics or templates or so
16:15:51 <Wolf01> You still need to do typeof(T), its just to be able to pass the class as parameter instead of the type of the class
16:17:14 <Alberth> it's typeof() that confuses me
16:17:35 <Alberth> in Python: class X: .... f(X): return X() just works
16:18:02 <Wolf01> It's reflection, MyClass != typeof(MyClass), even if typeof(MyClass) is MyClass
16:18:06 <Alberth> X is the class, and the type as well
16:20:11 <Eddi|zuHause> wtf are you doing?
16:20:11 <andythenorth> python seems rarely to be a useful routemap in other languages :P
16:20:38 <Alberth> yeah, well, other languages are often needlessly complicated :p
16:21:11 <Alberth> no doubt they have a reason for it, I just don't see it
16:21:38 <Alberth> reflection doesn't convince me of the need of a new object
16:22:23 <Wolf01> _sceneManager.GetScene(MenuScene); <- throws a "MenuScene is a type, which is not valid in the given context", I need to do _sceneManager.GetScene(typeof(MenuScene));
16:22:24 <Alberth> ie what information does the class not have?
16:22:58 <Alberth> Wolf01: yeah, I get that, it just makes no sense from a C# language design point of view
16:23:20 <Alberth> for some reason, they threw the simple solution out of the language
16:23:41 <andythenorth> livestock is a low density cargo in TTD? Seems to have very low weight
16:24:05 <Wolf01> Cram more cows in the car then :D
16:25:43 <Wolf01> Maybe they were meaning chickens and there isn't anything about cow transport, it's just our fantasy
16:26:32 <andythenorth> probably don’t weigh much
16:26:35 <andythenorth> wool is very light, no?
16:26:39 <andythenorth> weighs less per ton
16:26:44 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe they had a syntax/semantics conflict when calling <function>(<type>) so they needed a <function>(typeof(<type>)) to resolve it?
16:27:05 <Wolf01> I don't know the background
16:28:00 <Wolf01> Maybe all even started with the introduction of generics
16:29:59 <Eddi|zuHause> what exactly is a "generic"?
16:30:56 <Wolf01> As you can't cast with a variable, you can't be able to cast with (typeof(Class))var or with (x.GetType())var for sure or with Type x => (x)var
16:31:08 <Alberth> in java, it's code that ignores the parameterized class, eg "List" doesn't touch the values it stores
16:31:10 <Wolf01> Generic is a typeless parameter
16:31:37 <Alberth> in C# it's handled better, the type parameter is preserved
16:32:12 <andythenorth> anyone want to translate Road Hog?
16:32:14 <andythenorth> it’s kind of 1.0
16:32:18 <Alberth> and you can do things like generic over different type parameters
16:32:27 * andythenorth will tag it if nobody wants me to wait for translation
16:33:12 <Alberth> Road Hog Done! 43 0 0 0 0 <-- NL_nl is done
16:33:21 <Wolf01> Tag and then do a translation tag if it's required
16:33:23 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe announce it in the forum that you tag it next week, and call for translators?
16:33:31 <andythenorth> or what Eddi|zuHause said
16:33:37 <andythenorth> dunno, I want it off my plate
16:33:41 <andythenorth> 1.0.1: translations
16:33:43 <Eddi|zuHause> tag it as 1.0RC1
16:34:36 <andythenorth> I could do something about the docs as well
16:34:44 <andythenorth> releasing 1.0 with actually broken docs is kind of rubbish
16:35:32 <Wolf01> Wide range of ship types and capacities ?
16:35:50 <andythenorth> isn’t it good :P
16:35:59 <Alberth> from 0 to infinity :)
16:35:59 <Wolf01> Copied from FISH I suppose
16:38:12 <Wolf01> A friend asked for a the Flintstones based grf for OTTD
16:39:02 <Eddi|zuHause> can't, there are no BC(E) dates.
16:39:42 <Wolf01> They didn't even knew what you are talking about
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16:40:00 <Wolf01> Like if Roman empire used BC dates
16:40:36 <Eddi|zuHause> sure, they gave dates in "we founded this city 753 years before this christ guy gets born"
16:43:11 <Wolf01> Btw, he's not happy with horse driven carriages in 1850
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17:28:03 <andythenorth> this has been bugging me for a while
17:28:14 <andythenorth> vehicles that feature improved / worse cargo decay rates
17:28:19 <andythenorth> player has no way of knowing
17:28:32 <andythenorth> I know, because I’m the newgrf author :P
17:29:23 <andythenorth> but who reads docs? :D
17:30:17 <Wolf01> Btw, that's not a changelist
17:30:39 <Wolf01> That's a list of vehicles introduced by grf
17:31:15 <Wolf01> Changelist is Was: x; Now is: y
17:31:18 <andythenorth> might be talking at cross-purposes :)
17:31:32 <andythenorth> I mean when the cargo decay rate is adjusted for some vehicles, in game
17:31:49 <andythenorth> like refrigerated trucks, cargo pays more per tile than non-refrigerated
17:32:17 <andythenorth> should buy menu tell?
17:32:22 <andythenorth> does player need to know?
17:32:40 <Wolf01> Write it in the buy menu, like on engines "Suitable for express passengers" "Hauls heavy freight"
17:34:45 <Alberth> Suitable for frozen cargo
17:34:59 <andythenorth> ‘Improved payment”?
17:35:08 <andythenorth> dunno if players understand payment rates to be honest
17:35:56 <Alberth> nah, just mention intended use, payment is bonus :)
17:36:55 <Alberth> although 'reefer' already implies frozen stuff, doesn't it?
17:37:06 <andythenorth> that’s why I never bothered putting this in :)
17:37:26 <Alberth> I had to look up the word :)
17:37:29 <andythenorth> player probably has no concept of payment rate algorithm
17:37:37 <andythenorth> ‘reefer’ should maybe be ‘refrigerated'
17:37:42 <andythenorth> owing to drug reference :P
17:38:15 <Alberth> Suitable for frozen cargo <-- that seems clear enough to me
17:38:44 <Alberth> reefer implies you know about wagon types
17:41:16 <Alberth> "use for stuff that should stay cold" :p
17:43:19 <Wolf01> "allow foot to not rot so it will be pais more"
17:57:49 <Alberth> vehicle properties look a bit techy
17:58:08 <andythenorth> “Special features: [Improved Payment], [Improved Loading Speed]”
17:59:25 <Alberth> Loading Speed Multiplier: 2 <- faster loading; Cargo Decay Rate: 0.5 <-- slower cargo decay
17:59:46 <Alberth> would be nice to add it to the buy menu too
18:00:03 <Eddi|zuHause> in CETS i have it so that the additional information looks just like the normal properties
18:00:16 <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. it mimics the formatting
18:00:44 <Alberth> list vehicles could be broken into smaller segments for readability, but otherwise, all seems fine
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18:05:30 <andythenorth> Alberth: I wondered that
18:05:44 <andythenorth> I could sort by sub-class like Code Reference
18:05:47 <andythenorth> or by tram / truck
18:06:26 <Alberth> but mostly it needs some subsection headings, I think
18:06:33 <andythenorth> oh is it sorted lexical on name currently?
18:06:56 <Alberth> which is useful, imho
18:07:15 <Alberth> also +1 for mentioning start and end date :)
18:07:52 <Alberth> could move properties after the name name (properties)
18:07:54 <andythenorth> a PIL script could open the vehicle png, crop out the buy menu image, and show it in the list
18:07:59 <andythenorth> or even as a css sprite :P
18:08:16 <andythenorth> nice project for $someone :)
18:08:45 <Alberth> sounds like a great addition indeed
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18:11:34 <andythenorth> “Improved Payment” or “Payment Bonus"
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18:13:08 <Alberth> although I would use a lower case 'p'
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18:25:20 <andythenorth> ‘Improved payent’, or ‘Improved cargo payment’?
18:25:36 <andythenorth> payment / payent /s
18:32:13 <andythenorth> not sure how to group though
18:32:36 * andythenorth experiments with images
18:40:03 <Alberth> split between tram and truck?
18:47:30 <andythenorth> (consist.roadveh_flag_tram) if vehicle_type is 'Tram' else (not consist.roadveh_flag_tram)
18:47:42 <andythenorth> obviously those parentheses are spurious :P
18:47:50 <andythenorth> but also that’s bonkers anyway
18:50:19 <andythenorth> my local version shows the sprites, but the paths are wrong on bundles :)
18:55:42 <Alberth> if you want to go further, you might want to add the cargoes
18:56:01 <Alberth> on the other hand, that information makes much more sense in the game?
18:56:10 <andythenorth> the docs aren’t exhaustive
18:56:17 <andythenorth> also cargos are subject to loaded industry grf
18:56:42 <Alberth> buses could be pulled out from the trucks, but that's only a few
18:57:15 <Alberth> and people using RH aren't doing that for extensive pax options :)
18:59:10 <andythenorth> 1MB of images for such small results :)
18:59:13 <andythenorth> I need to crop them
19:00:01 <Alberth> dark blue makes it difficult to see as well
19:00:26 <andythenorth> if I’m processing them, that can be knocked out
19:00:31 <andythenorth> also 2x zoom? o_O
19:00:59 <andythenorth> this will take a little thought :)
19:04:26 <Alberth> pil doesn't have a scale 2x operation?
19:05:18 <andythenorth> and turn off anti-aliasing
19:05:26 <andythenorth> otherwise pixa has a trick to do it
19:17:29 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: needs transparent blue
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19:34:53 <andythenorth> now looks a bit odd to have vehicle cropped but no bounding box
19:35:28 <frosch123> did you consider adding icons to the purchase list
19:35:33 <frosch123> to indicate the "class"
19:35:54 <frosch123> "fast loading" and "improved payment"
19:36:06 <frosch123> ">>" and "$" or something
19:37:14 <Wolf01> <frosch123> ">>" and "$" or something <- faster and expensive?
19:37:39 <frosch123> expensive for customer :)
19:37:48 <andythenorth> frosch123: interesting idea
19:37:55 <andythenorth> I have been -1 to icons in buy menu crap
19:38:01 <andythenorth> due to ‘flags’ shenanigans
19:38:04 <andythenorth> but it could work
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19:42:47 * andythenorth fixes retina screen shenanigans
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19:50:19 <andythenorth> 1999 called and wants my html back :P
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19:59:54 <Alberth> script made a glitch?
20:00:30 <andythenorth> what’s weird about them? :)
20:00:35 <andythenorth> might just be the sprites...
20:03:51 <Eddi|zuHause> i think that's a zoom step too much
20:05:46 <Wolf01> No, they are just weird vehicles
20:14:00 <Wolf01> Bah, I have instances referenced by something and I'm not able to dispose them...
20:15:30 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean in general, not just those two
20:16:19 <Wolf01> But with one zoom step less you can't see the details ;)
20:16:36 <andythenorth> with one less it’s just tiny
20:16:47 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: how big are they for you (pixels)
20:16:56 * andythenorth wonders if the 50% reduction fails in some browsers
20:17:12 <Wolf01> Stupid code analisys, didn't told me I have to make a class disposable
20:17:34 <frosch123> their height is 3x the font
20:17:35 <Eddi|zuHause> about 3 times the size as the text next to them
20:17:50 <andythenorth> yeah that’s about righ
20:18:07 <Eddi|zuHause> i think it's too big.
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20:26:10 <andythenorth> better Eddi|zuHause ^ ?
20:28:05 <Wolf01> Remove the vertical align on tables
20:29:01 <andythenorth> needs vertical center
20:29:17 <Wolf01> Just remove vertical align on td
20:31:00 * andythenorth does the lazy way
20:31:50 <andythenorth> nah, it’s good, you just have to keep it in a box
20:32:15 <andythenorth> usually I recompile it with stuff turned off
20:32:19 <Wolf01> Also you miss sorting icons in table header
20:32:46 <andythenorth> slow bundles is slow :(
20:33:42 <Wolf01> Eddi|zuHause, did you look at vehicles lists of Transport Fever?
20:34:05 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: yes, better
20:34:21 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: vertical center might help, yes
20:34:30 <Wolf01> Trains and RVs are the same of Train Fever
20:35:41 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, could really have used some more
20:36:33 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm debating whether to order it right now
20:36:46 <Wolf01> I hoped for sea transport, but I think they only made river ones
20:37:59 <Eddi|zuHause> river makes more sense, imho
20:38:58 <Wolf01> It's a more finished TrainFever, just as happened with Planetary Annihilation... instead of patching it they released a new paid version
20:39:56 <Wolf01> Trani/Transport fever? Yes, it's good, some weird limitations and bugs but I enjoy to play it
20:42:22 <Wolf01> It even have working traffic on roads, you need to make dedicated lanes for buses or you'll get stuck in traffic in 1980+
20:44:13 <Wolf01> I hope for intersections on rails, you can't make a X crossing in Train Fever
20:55:00 <Wolf01> Track building allows for effortless construction of compact and complex track fields. For example it is possible to build tracks which can cross each other, have transfer points over multiple tracks and also double-slip switches! Details about these features may be discussed in one of the upcoming developer blogs.
20:55:12 <Wolf01> Tunnels and bridges offer the same possibilities as regular tracks. They can contain the same switches and signals, as well as cross each other.
20:56:46 * andythenorth is doing all the things for docs
20:58:07 <andythenorth> gah how do I pop from an array in JS :P
20:58:12 <andythenorth> at a random location
21:00:56 <Wolf01> What do you need to do?
21:03:39 <Wolf01> Ha! There are lego bricks factories on Transport Fever... I'll buy it with no doubt
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21:10:16 <andythenorth> is it acceptable to hate javascript?
21:10:20 <andythenorth> or is that childish?
21:16:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: they made a video on track construction, it looks promising
21:16:35 <Wolf01> At least there isn't the double bridge glitch anymore
21:16:48 <Eddi|zuHause> you can also make crossing bridges and stuff
21:17:07 <Wolf01> It was a PITA to build a double track bridge/tunnel
21:18:11 <Eddi|zuHause> what i'm afraid they did not adress is building crossing-free junctions by starting with a bridge, and then building the ramps
21:18:45 <Eddi|zuHause> but it might still be less fiddly with the overall track building improvements
21:20:00 <andythenorth> half my life I’ve been writing javascript
21:20:00 <andythenorth> and I’m still inept :P
21:20:06 <andythenorth> embarassingly so
21:23:27 * andythenorth can’t get into Jenkins to kick Road Hog
21:23:34 <andythenorth> I have a user, but creds don’t work
21:23:55 <frosch123> what needs kicking?
21:24:36 <andythenorth> it’s ok, I can see it unauthed
21:24:46 * andythenorth was looking for the failure
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21:38:36 <andythenorth> images are random, and link to the vehicle, FWIW
21:41:08 <andythenorth> the 3 large banner images
21:41:17 <andythenorth> unless my javascript is broken
21:41:21 <frosch123> so, same as firs :)
21:41:42 <frosch123> they change when reloading
21:42:00 * andythenorth has been hitting refresh for 90 seconds :P
21:42:30 <andythenorth> I might 1.0.0 this
21:45:57 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: page is much nicer now
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21:46:57 <frosch123> oh, "bin/openttd" does not start f, even when in the f folder
21:48:21 <frosch123> it copied most of the bugs, so probably
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21:55:05 <andythenorth> needs a screenshot :P
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22:03:04 <frosch123> what else should i do after that anti-climatic wcs
22:05:29 <frosch123> V453000: so, when do we get shared orders or routes or something? :p
22:06:03 <frosch123> hmm, i remember i had a mod for shared orders last time
22:06:04 <Wolf01> I installed the tree growth mod, I already got trees over everything
22:06:51 <Wolf01> Also the IonCannon and a lot of Bob's stuff
22:09:00 <Wolf01> Btw, if you have 2 inserters taking from a factory, how do you prioritize one? I tried connecting them with a cable but if the master one is idle because the output is full, the slave one is deactivated
22:09:50 <frosch123> i usually use a fast and a slow inserter
22:10:02 <V453000> frosch123: I am rooting for it. :D need to buy rseding or hanziq nuff beer
22:11:16 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it's weirdly scaled
22:12:30 <andythenorth> I cba to make proper buy menu screenshots tonight :P
22:12:42 <andythenorth> if anyone wants to step in, feel free :)
22:13:23 <Eddi|zuHause> anyone excited for additional hour tonight?
22:14:17 <Wolf01> You have one more hour to do screenshots
22:14:29 <andythenorth> kids will be up at horrible o-clock
22:14:33 <andythenorth> going by the clock :P
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22:18:06 <Eddi|zuHause> i even started minecraft...
22:18:10 <andythenorth> make Road Hog screenshot
22:18:13 <Eddi|zuHause> but found nothing useful to do...
22:18:28 <andythenorth> I watch a lot of minecraft, but have no inclination to play
22:18:50 <Eddi|zuHause> i found six diamonds...
22:19:13 <andythenorth> I have been setting my 6 year old redstone challenges
22:19:20 <andythenorth> so far he has built:
22:19:31 <andythenorth> - a thing that loads a sheep into a minecart
22:19:37 <andythenorth> - a musical instrument playing a simple tune
22:19:43 <andythenorth> - an automated slaughterhous
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22:20:05 <andythenorth> - a crude series AND gate
22:20:20 <andythenorth> the slaughterhouse was possibly the best :P
22:20:24 <Eddi|zuHause> i have a redstone-less slaughter house. two dogs that hit any cow/pig that i mark with my bare hands
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22:21:32 <andythenorth> maybe everyone builds one
22:21:33 <Eddi|zuHause> but my sandstone-house looks ugly, my map room is too small and i can't be bothered to move to a bigger one, and i also can't be bothered to look for mods
22:21:43 <andythenorth> try a casual game :P
22:22:06 <andythenorth> the dragon farming games are surprisingly addictive, for 20 mins every day
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22:52:07 <Wolf01> Do you want to make my map editor work?
22:53:55 <andythenorth> I made a map editor once
22:53:58 <andythenorth> it used graph paper
22:54:06 <andythenorth> and then we copied the co-ordinates
22:54:25 <Wolf01> I need to make it for the user
22:55:02 <Wolf01> Also for me to not get mad with bundled levels
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22:57:27 <Wolf01> I would like to bundle the game with at least 20 levels to play
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22:58:19 <Wolf01> With 2 boss levels and different gameplay ones
22:59:19 <andythenorth> 20 diverse levels is challenging :)
23:01:02 <Wolf01> I made at least 30 maps for starcraft, I could manage to make 20 levels
23:02:09 <Wolf01> I also made the Wings of Liberty campaign for starcraft when starcraft 2 wasn't even in the minds of the developers
23:02:35 <Wolf01> When I played it "wtf, this is my campaign!"
23:03:45 <frosch123> so you are paying your lego with the money you sued from them?
23:03:52 <frosch123> now all makes sense
23:04:21 <Wolf01> I can't sue them for a thing made with their stuff :D
23:05:16 <Wolf01> It's like suing lego because they started producing your moc
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continue to next day ⏵
