IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2015-09-08
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01:24:25 <Inhumanity> Quick question, can I rotate the camera?
02:06:04 <Eddi|zuHause> basically, if we wanted to add it now, we have to drop the original graphics
02:06:34 <Eddi|zuHause> as we cannot make changes to those, which are needed for having the rotations
02:07:04 <Eddi|zuHause> also, lots of existing house and industry NewGRFs would get invalidated
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03:36:55 <Flygon> Ehh, could always do the 98SE solution
03:37:08 <Flygon> Allow Hibernation ONLY if you have all the right drivers
03:37:15 <Flygon> Do the same with rotations
05:47:53 <Supercheese> Eeeeh... camera rotation is rather TMWFTLB
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13:28:18 <andythenorth> I completely deleted all the things that some players would like about it
13:29:13 <andythenorth> e.g. it no longer looks like you can load vehicles at one specific building
13:29:35 <V453000> but what will The Community say about that?
13:29:55 <andythenorth> maybe they’ll whine about that and overlook the other changes
13:31:34 <V453000> what are the other changes?
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13:34:02 <andythenorth> removed the funky TTD-style fence in favour of base set fence
13:34:07 <andythenorth> removed the pit entrance
13:34:14 <andythenorth> removed the front loader
13:34:23 <andythenorth> removed the loading chutes from the big silo
13:34:47 <V453000> doesnt look like farm yet
13:35:14 <andythenorth> this is one of the early industries I drew and it was trying to be too realistic
13:35:16 <andythenorth> like a scale model
13:46:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd still like it more if there was no gap, and the buildings just alongside one edge of the industry
13:46:50 <andythenorth> yeah you wouldn’t :)
13:46:58 <andythenorth> there’s a horrible graphical glitch then
13:47:20 <andythenorth> the ground tiles for the buildings make a hard edge against the grass tiles
13:47:38 * andythenorth tried it, because convincing argument was made
13:47:58 <Eddi|zuHause> how is that different from now?
13:48:52 <Eddi|zuHause> well, you should make the clay go up to the buildings
13:48:58 <V453000> DRAW stuff to connect it ? XD
13:49:38 <andythenorth> for three different layouts
13:49:51 <andythenorth> for two different industries that use same sprites, recoloured manually
13:51:02 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, and ideally the crane would be on the same side as the buildings
13:51:29 <andythenorth> I’ll consider it for v3
13:52:34 <Eddi|zuHause> also, the buildings should only stick out 1 row out of the pit
13:52:42 <Eddi|zuHause> possibly overlapping the two areas
13:59:12 <andythenorth> basically, to make these sprites good
13:59:28 <andythenorth> it would be best to start with a blank spritesheet :)
14:01:24 <V453000> I think if you ponder less and do more, it will get better results immediately :P
14:04:52 <andythenorth> quarries are stupid to feature in TTD scale
14:04:58 <andythenorth> there’s no way it’s ever going to work
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14:36:50 <andythenorth> which idiot started talking about scale?
15:01:03 <Supercheese> Why does it have fences around the entire perimeter? Where are the workers/vehicles supposed to go in/out?
15:01:36 <Supercheese> Well, in the _10 version, that is
15:04:24 <andythenorth> you don’t need to worry about that
15:04:35 <andythenorth> it’s not important :)
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15:05:54 <andythenorth> first must change OpenTTD
15:06:00 <andythenorth> vehicles now enter industries
15:06:29 <andythenorth> Supercheese: the fence actually contains multiple gates
15:06:40 <andythenorth> but I’ve drawn them small, you can only see them on retina screens
15:06:55 <andythenorth> or in your imagination :P
15:07:57 <andythenorth> shall I add a small truck?
15:08:11 <andythenorth> I feel that pikka’s small generic truck sprite is not used enough :P
15:08:17 <andythenorth> like the crawler cranes also :P
15:10:13 <andythenorth> actually the truck is hardly used at all in FIRS :)
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15:40:17 <andythenorth> V453000: the pit looks bare
15:40:28 <andythenorth> shall I delete 1 row of tiles so it’s 4x4?
15:40:51 <andythenorth> giant yellow duck?
15:48:49 <planetmaker> a truck to haul it away
15:49:13 <andythenorth> there was some reason I deleted the dump trucks
15:49:33 <planetmaker> 4x4 would suffice for size. Or 3x5
15:50:49 <planetmaker> it would be nice to have a version for sloped terrain where the sand is taken from the slope. But placement... so pro'ly not worth the effort
15:51:45 <andythenorth> one day I might tackle it
15:51:50 <andythenorth> the water thing annoys me
15:51:57 <andythenorth> but it’s a lot of work to make good
15:57:29 <planetmaker> open pit mines are big hassle to get right and interesting
15:57:34 <andythenorth> I might do it just for bloody-mindedness
15:57:45 <andythenorth> but not while I have such little time for newgrfs :P
15:59:49 <andythenorth> obviously needs tweaks
16:01:17 <andythenorth> will also improve placement opportunities further
16:02:10 <planetmaker> with a bit less green border: sure, why not? :)
16:02:27 * andythenorth thinks it’s better with less water
16:02:46 <planetmaker> looks quite good, I think. it doesn't miss anything compared to the 4x5 version
16:15:07 * andythenorth is happier with this overall
16:15:36 <andythenorth> I should have left an arbitrary island in the water, with seagulls circling :P
16:17:05 <planetmaker> or just a quacking duck ;)
16:32:17 <peter1138> what is it, a water mine?
16:33:06 <planetmaker> it explodes upon contact with the crane
16:35:20 <peter1138> water's probably a bit too blue for a clay pit
16:37:33 <peter1138> also there's loads of it
16:39:29 <andythenorth> if someone would patch “newgrf can specify terrain shape” I would bin the water
16:39:33 <andythenorth> and draw a quarry shape
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16:41:31 <andythenorth> I could make the small hut a pump
16:41:41 <andythenorth> and it could have animated ‘breakdown'
16:41:47 <andythenorth> then the pit fills up with water :P
16:41:49 <andythenorth> then drains again
16:42:13 <peter1138> not clean water though
16:43:11 <andythenorth> also, water cycle?
16:43:22 <andythenorth> water cycle is broken for me anyway, maybe I should ignore it
16:44:21 <peter1138> no reason for that to not work
16:45:19 <andythenorth> kills performance horribly
16:45:31 <andythenorth> although “because Apple” is all you needed :P
16:48:27 <andythenorth> if I enable ‘full animation’ OpenTTD chugs horribly
16:48:36 <andythenorth> previous advice was to buy a new computer
16:48:40 <peter1138> it slows down fast forward a bit
16:48:46 <peter1138> but otherwise should be fine
16:50:13 <andythenorth> and black squares all over the screen
16:50:24 <peter1138> no that's not a feature of palette animation
16:50:42 <andythenorth> caused by toggling it on
16:51:53 <andythenorth> anyway I can’t buy a new computer, so I turned off full animation :P
16:55:53 <andythenorth> 512x512 map, 1 train, the animation of track building cost (moving upwards, classic 80s style) takes about 4s with full animation off
16:55:58 <andythenorth> and about 6s with full animation on
16:56:08 <andythenorth> even allowing that my counting is crap
16:58:45 * andythenorth back to muddy waters
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17:46:59 <Sylf> that might look too weird in 8bit graphics
17:47:35 <andythenorth> V453000: I’m done pitting tbh
17:47:51 <andythenorth> new things to do
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18:00:53 <andythenorth> mines mines mines
18:00:58 <andythenorth> are a pain the arse
18:03:14 <Alberth> there is grass underneath the clay :p
18:04:31 <andythenorth> I need to replace base set sprites at multiple other mines
18:04:43 <andythenorth> Gold Mine, Iron Ore Mine, Copper Mine, Bauxite Mine
18:04:57 <andythenorth> open pit mines really don’t work well in OpenTTD
18:05:05 <andythenorth> and deep mines will all look the same :P
18:07:25 <andythenorth> maybe I just need some colour schemes
18:07:47 <Alberth> wouldn't an open mine have big heaps of top soil?
18:07:58 <Alberth> or at least one or two of them?
18:08:34 <andythenorth> open mines have big spoil heaps
18:08:37 <andythenorth> and a massive pit :P
18:08:52 <Alberth> open gold mine is probably very big due to low concentration of the good stuff(tm)
18:09:01 <andythenorth> just make it a gold pan on a river :P
18:09:34 <Alberth> but you need a washing installation, a small lake for the water, and bulldozers
18:12:32 <Alberth> looks like ECS sand pit :)
18:13:18 <andythenorth> we have those rock tiles on base terrain
18:13:26 <andythenorth> repaint those to have no gaps
18:13:31 <andythenorth> let the mine just follow the terrain
18:13:43 <andythenorth> won’t have nice shaped edges and such mind
18:19:35 <Alberth> could be confusing if some have no rocks, and I want to put a track or depot there?
18:20:03 <Alberth> ie it's nice if it's clear where the industry starts and ends
18:21:05 <Alberth> there are a number of industries that are literally invisible in transparent mode, which is highly annoying if you're planning a track through them
18:24:36 <andythenorth> if you notice that in FIRS, let me know
18:24:42 <andythenorth> I can draw ground tiles
18:27:01 <Sylf> i need fix that in YETI too
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18:59:48 <andythenorth> too much bulldozer? o_O
19:02:32 <Rubidium> rather weird scale for the yellow one
19:07:22 <andythenorth> hmm there’s an even bigger one in HEQS
19:22:00 <Supercheese> are all these newly redesigned industries going to be fenced in all-round?
19:22:57 <Supercheese> or perhaps the images at the docs are not indicative of that
19:23:40 <andythenorth> mostly they’re fenced in
19:23:45 <andythenorth> mostly they’ve been fenced in for a while
19:23:51 <Alberth> they're trying to keep all the bad transport companies out :)
19:24:04 <Supercheese> yeah nevermind the docs are seemingly not accurate
19:24:19 * Supercheese hasn't actually tried the newest versions of FIRS
19:24:51 <andythenorth> mostly up to date, ish
19:24:59 <andythenorth> making docs images is tedious, so they’re not 100% accurate
19:25:58 <Supercheese> yeah, I was misinterpreting them
19:26:08 <andythenorth> eh, at least I can animate it :)
19:31:52 <andythenorth> should I just release v2?
19:32:53 <andythenorth> I dunno, there’s always v3
19:33:23 <Alberth> yep, lots of unused numbers available until infinity
19:34:10 <andythenorth> 368 commits since 1.4.4
19:34:16 <andythenorth> commits != features but eh
19:34:51 <Alberth> refactoring improvements is also worthwhile
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19:44:54 <andythenorth> also for v2 I wanted an alternative supplies mechanic
19:45:05 <andythenorth> but eh, too much right now
19:45:43 <andythenorth> btw Supercheese, the fences auto-magically disappear when you build station adjacent ;)
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