IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2014-03-06
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07:39:48 <Flygon> Work on a fictional story for a contest
07:39:51 <Flygon> Or work on a map some more
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08:28:02 <planetmaker> hehe, that's a nice 'question' :P
08:29:07 <V453000> is any of those actually correct?
08:32:00 <V453000> id say it is something between 25 and 50 but idk :D
08:32:49 <planetmaker> it's either 25% or 50%. But obviously both is wrong :)
08:34:43 <planetmaker> if all four answers were different, chance would be 25%. But the "25%" is present twice... :)
08:35:40 <V453000> so I assume the chance is something between 50 and 25 :D
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11:17:03 <Eddi|zuHause> the answer is 0% obviously
11:32:13 <Xaroth|Work> Eddi|zuHause: but that's not one of the answers ;)
11:32:26 <Xaroth|Work> and if it were, it'd be wrong as well
11:32:53 <Xaroth|Work> and the whole point of the question is, that it is invalid, and cannot be answered
11:33:14 <Xaroth|Work> normally, it'd be 25%, but since there are 2 25% options, that would yield 50% .. which only has one option.
11:33:46 <Xaroth|Work> so the answer would be 0%, as there's no right answer.. but 1) if that were an option, it'd be wrong and 2) it's not an option, so cannot be an answer
11:33:48 <Eddi|zuHause> Xaroth|Work: who said the answer has to be given as one of {A..D}?
11:34:35 <Xaroth|Work> that is implied by it being a multiple choice question
11:34:45 <Xaroth|Work> you have to choose an answer, and you're presented with the options
11:34:47 <Eddi|zuHause> nothing is ever implled
11:37:13 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, multiple choice questions are not popular over here
11:37:50 <Xaroth|Work> I don't see the relevance of something being popular or not :)
11:38:30 <Eddi|zuHause> it has. if you want to challenge the mindset, you need something that is commonly "known" :)
11:38:52 <Xaroth|Work> knowledge of something and popularity are not related
11:39:05 <Xaroth|Work> there are enough things that are commonly known, but not popular at all
11:39:13 <Eddi|zuHause> like if you make a parody of knock-knock jokes, it won't work as well if the audience is not familiar with knock-knock jokes
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12:05:55 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, you'd be surprised as to *how* popular multiple choice actually is
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12:39:16 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: maybe in the west. but in the east, no serious test i remember was multiple choice
12:39:51 <planetmaker> for me, that's the case neither. But if you look for instance at the (final) examinations for pharmacy students: they're all multiple choice
12:40:07 <planetmaker> disgusting if you ask me, but that's how it is
12:40:21 <planetmaker> and tests for driver licenses etc etc
12:41:12 <Eddi|zuHause> ok, drivers license, but that's already more complicated because more than one answer may be correct. also it's only part of the test.
12:43:04 <V453000> I had some english tests which were ABCD, and it was the toughest test I ever wrote :D it was made so that the answers were so similar, that before you read all 4 of them, it confused you to hell ... plus possibility of multiple being correct and 0 points if you have one missing or too many :D
12:44:19 <V453000> actually negative points for incorrect answers, makes it that much cuter
12:45:00 <planetmaker> hehe. I like that scheme. And you pass, if your score is > 0 or so :)
12:45:08 <planetmaker> but it's psychologically not so nice :D
12:45:27 <peter1139> anyone familiar with the vpn client on os x?
12:46:16 <V453000> yeah :D we had to get like 80%+
12:46:22 <V453000> the teacher was seriously brutal
12:48:19 <Eddi|zuHause> usual grading systems are ">50% = barely passed" ">90% = excellent"
12:48:59 <Eddi|zuHause> with slight modifications
12:49:19 <V453000> well this was more of a binary grading system for most of us :D passed or not ... though there was some grading but within the 20%, you didnt really care
12:50:52 <planetmaker> well, the 50% makes only sense, if you do not use multiple choice :)
12:51:40 <Eddi|zuHause> what i never understood is, when we switched from the eastern (1-5) to the western (1-6) grading system, they basically split "fail" into two categories
12:52:25 <Eddi|zuHause> like you can "fail, but maybe there is hope" and "fail, and all hope is lost"
12:52:29 <planetmaker> well :) 5 is you failed. And 6 is you failed so hard, it's hopeless :P (or if you committed fraud)
12:56:59 <Eddi|zuHause> there was a chemistry test, where a pupil dropped a sheet of paper to the ground, the teacher picked it up, and read outloud: "Spickzettel"... :p
12:57:56 <Eddi|zuHause> when he gave back the graded test he said something like: "i'm fairly convinced you couldn't use this cheat sheet, so i give you the 5 instead of a 6" :p
12:59:34 <Eddi|zuHause> there were also other teachers of the opinion "well when you went through the trouble of making a cheat sheet, then you probably don't need it anymore"
13:00:42 <Eddi|zuHause> and in some university tests, it was actually allowed to have "one A4 paper, handwritten"
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15:27:05 <Eddi|zuHause> "We might as well be reporting that slithy toves gyre and gimble in the wabe." <-- can someone translate this for me?
15:30:17 <Pinkbeast> Eddi|zuHause: Serious question?
15:31:13 <Eddi|zuHause> Pinkbeast: not entirely serious
15:31:35 <Pinkbeast> Well, let me know if you want me to answer it. ;-)
15:31:51 <Eddi|zuHause> Pinkbeast: but it sounds like something that could either be an old and antiquated expression, or completely made up gubbledigoo
15:32:23 <Pinkbeast> It's from Lewis Carroll's _Jabberwocky_, a nonsense poem that includes a number of made-up words that sort of make sense in context.
15:33:08 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think i ever actually heard/read that poem. only people referencing it
15:33:08 <Pinkbeast> ... at least one of which ("chortle") has become a perfectly normal English word
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15:35:08 <rubidium> add portmanteau to that list
15:35:24 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a perfect example of what i tried to say earlier: if you make a parody of something that is so well-known in one culture, that parody may be completely lost in other cultures where it's not well known
15:35:32 * Pinkbeast looks up which words were new. "Burble" is now fairly normal; "galumph" slightly whimsical, "vorpal" in gaming at least...
15:36:18 <Pinkbeast> Errr although Carroll came up with the use of "portmanteau" as in "portmaneau word" the word itself is older
15:38:18 <rubidium> but portmanteau wasn't used in English before (according to wikipedia)
15:38:55 <Pinkbeast> rubidium: Even WP says "In then-contemporary English, a portmanteau was a suitcase that opened into two equal sections."
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15:39:16 <andythenorth> "Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun The frumious Bandersnatch!"
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15:40:05 <Pinkbeast> OED has 1553 in J. B. Paul Accts. Treasurer Scotl. (1913) X. 197, vj quarteris bukrum to be ane portemantew to my lorde governour.
15:41:33 <Eddi|zuHause> we have an expression for people that act like andy: "Ruhe auf den billigen Plätzen!"
15:42:11 * Pinkbeast knows Ruhe from Coppelius's "Ruhe, bitte" signs but pray translate? :-)
15:42:16 <Eddi|zuHause> (which translates to: "quiet on the cheap seats)
15:42:24 <Pinkbeast> "Quiet at the back, there!"
15:42:35 <Eddi|zuHause> something like that
15:42:42 * planetmaker is unsure how that applies though :)
15:43:16 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: it's generally thrown at people who jump into conversations they were not part of
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17:18:52 <Pikka> oh never shall I forget the cry or the shriek that shriek-ed he
17:19:22 <Pikka> as I gnashed my teeth when from its sheath I drew my snickersnee
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17:52:10 <andythenorth> bonsoir Pikka chops
17:52:34 <andythenorth> where is game at?
17:53:13 <andythenorth> where is truck set at?
17:57:21 <andythenorth> can I start a new set if the others aren't funished?
17:58:22 <Pikka> we'll need the server updating to the latest nightly or such?
17:58:39 <andythenorth> also I have to cycle home in the rain first
17:58:42 <andythenorth> unless you can do that
17:58:58 <andythenorth> planetmaker: MP game? o-O
18:06:40 <andythenorth> what are we playing?
18:09:01 <Pikka> I've got a nocargoal savegame
18:09:12 <Pikka> but if you'd rather make one
18:09:23 <planetmaker> I can try to update .pro server. But I'll have to leave in an hour
18:10:13 <andythenorth> Pikka: let's play yours
18:10:28 <andythenorth> we need an update because pikka is crashy?
18:10:43 <Pikka> I don't know if it's evil
18:12:29 <Pikka> it's FIRS so it's probably evil
18:18:54 <Pikka> y'know, when we actually start playing with trains with running costs, it's going to be a shock. ;) Might have to up the game length by a year or two.
18:19:11 <Pikka> or does IH 3 have running costs now?
18:23:19 <Pikka> well, I think we're about ready to go with the server
18:23:28 <andythenorth> I have to go face the rain in a bit
18:23:40 <Pikka> I'm going to go transport some JAVA
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19:16:12 *** DorpsGek changes topic to "Party!"
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19:18:45 <frosch123> actually you posted 12 mintues too early :p
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19:20:24 <planetmaker> I can change the time :P
19:23:51 <andythenorth> Pikka: we playing? o_O
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19:23:58 <andythenorth> I have to talk to a man in Brisbane in a bit
19:24:03 <andythenorth> Alberth: MP game?
19:27:21 <Alberth> "GoneWacko: Press ALT+ENTER for fullscreen mode. If you want different resolutions, just modify the source code. " /me likes that spirit, who needs configuration files :p
19:30:26 <andythenorth> frosch123: game on?
19:30:38 <frosch123> i'll join when you get started
19:31:05 <frosch123> i need to prepare coffee and such
19:31:10 <frosch123> and finish the forums
19:31:22 <frosch123> i heard there is an awesome post on the forums today
19:34:06 <frosch123> it's not that hard to find :p
19:34:30 <frosch123> it's even linked from the front page
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21:19:47 <DorpsGek> Commit by fonsinchen :: r26393 /trunk/src (3 files in 2 dirs) (2014-03-06 21:19:41 UTC)
21:19:48 <DorpsGek> -Fix: Update distances between link graph nodes when station sign is moved
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22:29:38 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +b *!~ghiigo@49.50.68.17
22:29:39 *** ophjhj was kicked by DorpsGek (planetmaker)
22:35:08 <Aristide> Can I share my music here ? ^^
22:37:13 <Aristide> Sorry, i'm too lazy for go to soundcloud x)
22:37:19 <Aristide> Upload on my freebox is simplest for me
22:38:48 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: (kban [<channel>] [--{exact,nick,user,host}] <nick> [<seconds>] [<reason>]) -- If you have the #channel,op capability, this will kickban <nick> for as many seconds as you specify, or else (if you specify 0 seconds or don't specify a number of seconds) it will ban the person indefinitely. --exact bans only the exact hostmask; --nick bans just the nick; --user bans just the user, and --host bans (1 more message)
22:39:17 <planetmaker> @kban Aristide 86400 once means you post link and are banned
22:44:00 <__ln__> 'once' is eleven in spanish
22:45:05 <NGC3982> Yes, and we have to respect culture.
22:46:22 * Eddi|zuHause points at the sky: *about that direction*
22:46:31 <planetmaker> unless you have permission to distribute that file, do not ever do that again, Aristide. Next time I will not add a leading " " to that line
22:47:29 <Aristide> planetmaker: Do you speak about autorisation from author ? Or autorisation for distribute this file here ?
22:49:15 <planetmaker> you obviously need the first. And the latter is limited by the topic of the channel. somewhat
22:49:37 <Aristide> Ok, sorry if this share is out of rules for channel
22:49:44 <Aristide> But i'm the author of this music :)
22:50:05 <NGC3982> I thought that was copyrighted by Terry Gilliam.
22:50:15 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +o frosch123
22:50:30 *** frosch123 changes topic to "1.4.0-beta5, 1.3.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: vcs, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only | #openttd.dev for dev-talk | #openttd.notice for commit notices"
22:50:34 *** DorpsGek sets mode: -o frosch123
22:51:13 <NGC3982> As usual, nobody understands my Münchausen tropes.
22:51:17 <Eddi|zuHause> "A fisherman from Kiel pulled a message in a bottle out of the ocean dated 17th may 1913. if this date is confirmed, it would break the record of the oldest known message found, currently a message from 10th june 1914"
22:51:18 <Aristide> NGC3982: I have create this music ^^This music is a remake from other music from me :)
22:51:41 <NGC3982> Aristide: Yes, i noticed.
22:52:07 <NGC3982> Eddi|zuHause: Jeez. Should be easily dated, i guess.
22:52:11 <Aristide> Sorry again if this share is out of rules
22:52:28 <__ln__> how did he know the date of the ocean
22:52:29 <Aristide> (For information I never share © music from other author than me)
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22:52:49 <NGC3982> Is 1910-1915 too new for Carbon dating?
22:53:41 <NGC3982> I guess there are better ways of dating something that "new".
22:53:45 <NGC3982> Like ..asking people.
22:53:54 <Eddi|zuHause> carbon dating is generally impossible for anything after 1945
22:53:58 <Xaroth|Work> depends on the object
22:54:06 <Xaroth|Work> and also how long you measure
22:54:32 <Xaroth|Work> if you measure benzene for.. what was it.. 4 hours, you'd still have an error margin of 80-100 years
22:54:37 <planetmaker> NGC3982, not so much the nukes but the half-life time is 5700-odd years. so 50 years accuracy is... difficult, 100 years isn't exaclty easy either
22:54:59 <Xaroth|Work> so yeh, you really want to do carbon dating on -old- stuff :P
22:55:02 * NGC3982 puts a lump of barium in __ln__.
22:55:10 <Xaroth|Work> like, hundreds of years at least
22:55:13 <Eddi|zuHause> paper can be dated in other ways, like materials used for production
22:55:26 <Xaroth|Work> else your error margin will be too extreme for it to be reliable
22:55:38 <Eddi|zuHause> this was used to find out the "hitler diaries" were a fake, because the whitener used was only introduced in the 1950s
22:56:07 <NGC3982> Eddi|zuHause: I read that in a book literaly five hours ago.
22:56:12 <planetmaker> Xaroth_, nah, carbon dating really is for new stuff :)
22:56:20 <NGC3982> Gunnar Wall's "Heist of the century".
22:56:30 <planetmaker> for old stuff you want lead-lead or K-Ar :)
22:56:43 <Xaroth|Work> depends on your definition of new :P
22:57:13 <Eddi|zuHause> "new" being "since the beginning of civilisation" :p
22:57:50 <Eddi|zuHause> so 1000-10000 years
22:59:13 <Eddi|zuHause> for things younger than 1000 years you have to figure out other ways. for example you can figure out the year that a tree was cut down by the arrangement of the rings. they form a very unique pattern depending how long the summers and how hard the winters were
22:59:37 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a very well researched topic
22:59:55 <planetmaker> yeah. But you need good sampling from that region for the dendro-chronology method
23:00:22 <Eddi|zuHause> but that won't help you with a piece of cardboard :p
23:00:30 <planetmaker> NGC3982, other isotopic ratios to consider for radiometric dating
23:00:46 <planetmaker> Pb-Pb sometimes also called U-Pb. Depends on what to exactly look at
23:02:42 <Eddi|zuHause> <NGC3982> Gunnar Wall's "Heist of the century". <-- well at least in germany, it's a fairly well known topic. there are occasionally documentaries on TV and stuff.
23:03:56 <NGC3982> Oh. It's still a measurement of decay?
23:04:19 <planetmaker> yes. There's several systems. Depending on material and time span to look at
23:07:03 <Xaroth|Work> ooh, COSMOS airs this weekend :o
23:07:49 <NGC3982> I was like a four year old.
23:07:58 <Xaroth|Work> I would probably be the same :P
23:08:36 <NGC3982> I did mot meet Sagan, though
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