IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2013-11-12
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03:42:24 * Supercheese is alive, last he checked
03:58:37 <Eddi|zuHause> don't feed cats after midnight
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07:59:42 <Supercheese> Looks like a sunusoidal waveform ;)
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14:24:53 <krinn> script: saving time question
14:25:51 <krinn> do size of data count ? like 100xarray(1) takes more times than 1xarray(100) but alas array(100) may be too big
14:27:14 <krinn> or is it really limited to ticks, and i could save a 10000000000000 array size as it takes 1 tick only to return an array of any size
14:27:37 <krinn> and hello too belugas :)
14:33:49 <frosch123> i would tend to think that saving an array cost the same amount, independent of its size
14:34:42 <krinn> me too, hence why i'm seeking if there's a limit to that array size
14:35:36 <frosch123> i think there is a limit on the total size a script can size
14:36:15 <Rubidium> either look at the code, or try to find the limits emprically
14:37:05 <krinn> I think the saving need updating or some few functions added with GS so
14:37:29 <Rubidium> emperical evidence shows that people using lots of vehicles often don't use shared orders
14:37:54 <krinn> GSStoryPage create page and element, they are saved by openttd itself, but there's no functions to retake any ID
14:38:19 <krinn> if i create a page, and get ID 3 openttd save the page but i have no way to get the ID=3 back, except saving it
14:38:21 <frosch123> max 25 levels of nested data structures
14:38:46 <frosch123> strings are limited to 254 chars
14:39:22 <krinn> and array ? (with 1 depth)
14:41:54 <frosch123> doesn't look like there is an explicit limit
14:42:10 <frosch123> so i guess it will only fail when you hit some ottd savegame format limit
14:42:28 <frosch123> most likely you are find with 2 billion entries
14:42:42 <krinn> lol should be enough :)
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15:12:48 <frosch123> @calc 32767 * 70 / 74
15:12:48 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 30995.8108108
15:13:10 <frosch123> @calc 31000 * 74 / 70
15:13:10 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 32771.4285714
15:13:21 <frosch123> @calc 30996 * 74 / 70
15:13:25 <frosch123> @calc 30995 * 74 / 70
15:13:25 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 32766.1428571
15:13:33 <frosch123> @calc 30997 * 74 / 70
15:13:33 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 32768.2571429
15:15:08 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25966 /trunk/src/script/api (script_town.cpp script_town.hpp) (2013-11-12 15:15:02 UTC)
15:15:09 <DorpsGek> -Fix: [NoGo] Properly validate the range of the growth rate passed to GSTown::SetGrowthRate, instead of masking it to 16 bit.
15:17:09 <Rubidium> that kinds looks like the commit before that ;)
15:22:50 <frosch123> it breaks neighbours are important or so
15:23:46 <krinn> why push uint16 to 32 for days, do anyone wish set more than 65000 days between towngrowth?
15:24:12 <frosch123> nai set it to 16 million as a substitute to "no towngrowth"
15:24:32 <frosch123> but the maximum was actually 30996
15:24:44 <frosch123> the 16 million was just mapped to some arbitrary number
15:25:35 <frosch123> anyway fs5786 adds a special value for "no growth"
15:25:46 <frosch123> so, no need for weird values :)
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17:56:41 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25967 /trunk (8 files in 5 dirs) (2013-11-12 17:56:35 UTC)
17:56:42 <DorpsGek> -Add: [NoGo] GSTown::TOWN_GROWTH_NORMAL to reset a town growth rate set previously via GSTown::SetGrowthRate.
17:57:18 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25968 /trunk/src (8 files in 4 dirs) (2013-11-12 17:57:12 UTC)
17:57:19 <DorpsGek> -Add: [Script] ScriptTown::TOWN_GROWTH_NONE to indicate no town growth via ScriptTown::SetGrowthRate and GetGrowthRate.
17:57:39 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25969 /trunk/src/script/api (6 files in 3 dirs) (2013-11-12 17:57:32 UTC)
17:57:40 <DorpsGek> -Add: [Script] ScriptTown::GetFundBuildingsDuration.
18:07:00 <Eddi|zuHause> where the hell are palette options in gimp?
18:07:29 <frosch123> image -> mode -> indexed
18:07:35 <frosch123> or something like that
18:08:11 <frosch123> if you import the palette once, you can select it from there
18:09:09 <Eddi|zuHause> the image is windows palette, i wanted to convert it to dos palette. but selecting "indexed" there does nothering. and i probably don't understand it correctly
18:10:29 <frosch123> with gimp you would run into issues with animation colours
18:13:33 <planetmaker> I usually do both: load image in gimp, convert -> rgb -> indexed (DOS); save. load in ttdviewer and fix now wrongly animated pixels
18:14:28 <frosch123> unless your image is layered, i would not know why you would do it like that
18:14:29 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, dockable dialogues -> colour table
18:14:52 <Eddi|zuHause> "can't read input file"
18:14:56 <planetmaker> frosch123, converting from indexed to indexed works rather badly for me
18:15:13 <Eddi|zuHause> and why is it "TTDViewer"?
18:15:15 <frosch123> it supports pcx and png
18:15:23 <frosch123> in win and dos palette
18:15:34 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, now it works
18:15:37 <frosch123> and it views and can save
18:15:43 <Eddi|zuHause> didn't work giving input file in command line
18:17:51 * Alberth would probably write a Python script for it :p
18:18:15 <frosch123> i guess there are like 10 tools to convert palettes :p
18:18:20 <frosch123> one worse than the other :)
18:20:06 <planetmaker> well. NML does it. windows -> dos
18:20:07 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: only thing i'm missing is showing the palette index of a pixel i select
18:20:25 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, gimp kinda does show you which if you use the colour picker tool
18:20:34 <planetmaker> and you happen to have the palette window open, too
18:20:44 <Eddi|zuHause> but why use gimp when i have TTDViewer?
18:21:00 <planetmaker> that doesn't convert, no?
18:21:10 <Alberth> to get the index of the pixel?
18:21:24 <Eddi|zuHause> "hide stupid pink" :p
18:22:03 <frosch123> planetmaker: it does
18:22:10 <frosch123> you can load win and dos, and save as dos
18:22:29 <frosch123> you can in theory also apply a recolouring inbetween
18:22:44 <planetmaker> I never was aware of that. drat
18:22:55 <frosch123> well, it was not in the first version
18:23:05 <planetmaker> and you only tell me now? :D
18:23:58 <frosch123> not my fault if you use software older than 2 years :p
18:24:37 <planetmaker> I likely even have that - unaware of that possibility :-)
18:26:45 <Eddi|zuHause> "unknown recolouring" never knew that existed...
18:29:05 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: uhm, you sure that saving uses the right palette? when i load it in GIMP, the transparent colour is missing
18:29:46 <Eddi|zuHause> well, subsequently, all other indices are shifted by 1
18:31:17 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r25970 trunk/src/video/sdl_v.cpp (2013-11-12 18:31:12 UTC)
18:31:18 <DorpsGek> -Fix [FS#5787]: [SDL] Recursive mutex locking when changing blitter
18:31:23 <frosch123> hmm, looks like well tested software :)
18:33:33 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: and fix loading file from command line...
18:34:59 <Eddi|zuHause> > TTDViewer docs/liveries.png
18:35:10 <Eddi|zuHause> says "can't read input file"
18:36:50 <frosch123> well, do you have some weird path?
18:37:02 <frosch123> maybe with spaces or usual things which break stuff?
18:37:31 <V453000> I dont use ttdviewer after I learned to code and compile :D
18:37:32 <Eddi|zuHause> no, standard linux paths
18:37:51 <frosch123> "standard linux paths"? :p
18:38:34 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: no spaces, nothing special
18:38:53 <frosch123> well, check the content of TTDViewer.sh
18:38:59 <frosch123> and discover what weird path it constructs
18:39:47 <Eddi|zuHause> oh, it doesn't even pass along any parameter
18:39:55 <Eddi|zuHause> java -jar /usr/share/java/TTDViewer.jar ""
18:40:12 <frosch123> maybe you have no "readlink" ?
18:40:24 <frosch123> maybe it is bashism or so
18:41:46 <frosch123> hmm, oh, the readlink is only used for the jar
18:41:53 <frosch123> well, no idea why $@ does not work for you
18:42:04 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, it works now
18:42:17 <Eddi|zuHause> after i added the $@
18:43:01 <frosch123> oh, so the makefile fails for you?
18:43:15 <Eddi|zuHause> i installed the rpm from devzone
18:43:28 <frosch123> ah, ok, never tried that
18:43:33 <frosch123> i have no rpm system
18:43:39 <frosch123> so ammler broke it :p
18:43:45 <Eddi|zuHause> but the file missed the $@
18:44:31 <Eddi|zuHause> so possibly misses a layer of escaping :p
18:45:07 <frosch123> but does its own stuff
18:45:16 <frosch123> yeah, that looks wrong
18:45:23 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25971 /trunk/src/lang (dutch.txt vietnamese.txt) (2013-11-12 18:45:15 UTC)
18:45:24 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:25 <DorpsGek> dutch - 4 changes by habell
18:45:26 <DorpsGek> vietnamese - 1 changes by nglekhoi
18:46:41 <Eddi|zuHause> while you edit that file, change the exectutable name from TTDViewer to ttdviewer, like normal programs :p
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19:43:52 <Eddi|zuHause> File "/usr/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/pixa/pixa.py", line 340, in pixarender
19:43:54 <Eddi|zuHause> imagepx[sx, sy] = scol
19:43:55 <Eddi|zuHause> IndexError: image index out of range
19:44:01 <Eddi|zuHause> how the hell did i manage that?
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19:45:49 <Alberth> iirc it copied stuff until it finds a pixel of some specified colour?
19:50:17 <Alberth> that looks out of range :p
19:51:07 <Alberth> but if it doesn't find the pixel, it will continue copying until you hit some border
19:53:55 <Eddi|zuHause> i suspect some weird type of endless loop
19:54:09 <Eddi|zuHause> but i don't understand it
19:54:34 <Eddi|zuHause> all my sequence points are of the type (0,-y,colour)
19:55:13 <Eddi|zuHause> so if it goes linearly from top left to bottom right, it should not hit any loops
19:56:44 <Eddi|zuHause> and i don't know how to get the image out of it
19:57:00 <Eddi|zuHause> to understand what it actually did so far
19:58:11 <Alberth> image.save("foo.png")
19:59:56 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, looks cut off at the left...
20:01:18 <Eddi|zuHause> about two columns of pixels missing, then a grey pixel at the top left that shouldn't be there
20:04:28 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, the two pixels missing is in the original template, something went wrong there. but totally doesn't explain this error
20:13:02 <Eddi|zuHause> now it worked. is it possible that pixa has problems replacing stuff directly at the image border (column 0)?
20:13:57 <Alberth> no idea,it's too long ago :)
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20:39:54 <LordAro> anyone here have detailed knowledge of cmake?
20:41:16 <Eddi|zuHause> certainly not me
20:44:43 <LordAro> good for cross-platform though
20:45:02 <LordAro> and in what way is it "crap"? i've had no troubles with it
20:45:46 <V453000> hmmm I get the feeling that nmlc cant seem to "update" some of the images I overwrote ... could it be saved in cache somewhere and how could I clear that eventually?
20:46:24 <__ln__> first of all, it overwrites any existing Makefile with the crap it generates itself. and the new Makefile isn't self-contained, it just calls cmake.
20:46:52 <LordAro> kinda the point, isn't it?
20:46:53 <planetmaker> V453000, if you suspect that, delete the nuts.grf.cache and nuts.grf.cacheindex files
20:47:30 <V453000> did in backup folder :D
20:47:31 <planetmaker> LordAro, I looked at cmake like 3 years ago. I found it adding complications rather than solving :-)
20:47:38 <__ln__> LordAro: if it just uses the Makefile as a sort of batchfile that calls cmake, why does it need to use a Makefile in the first place?
20:47:45 <LordAro> it's changed a lot in 3 years, i understand
20:48:25 <LordAro> __ln__: for cross-platform stuffs, it can create a makefile based on the system, i.e. visual studio project files on windows
20:48:35 <__ln__> LordAro: and by contrast, i don't think e.g. Visual Studio projects generated by cmake need cmake to run.
20:48:59 <LordAro> once they've been generated, no
20:49:04 <__ln__> LordAro: i know what cmake is meant for, i wouldn't call it crap if i didn't know what it is.
20:49:21 <__ln__> LordAro: right, but the Makefiles do need cmake once they've been generated.
20:50:24 <LordAro> but then, if you just created the makefile with cmake, what's the issue?
20:50:54 <__ln__> that it overwrites whatever Makefile i might already have in the current directory, no questions asked.
20:51:08 <__ln__> even if it isn't generated by cmake.
20:51:19 <LordAro> that may be in issue, i can agree
20:51:36 <LordAro> but then, you might argue that it's your fault for running cmake with an existing makefile
20:52:30 <V453000> of fucking course I was saving the file to backup disc :D
20:52:41 * V453000 awards himself idiot of today
20:52:54 <LordAro> V453000: isn't that done by default? :p
20:53:11 <V453000> well perhaps but certainly not as the first spot :D
20:53:17 <V453000> if you are trying to compile in the "Real" folder
20:53:29 <__ln__> LordAro: Makefiles are for make, i'd expect cmake to call them something else.
20:54:03 <LordAro> the makefiles cmake generates are for make
20:54:46 <__ln__> yes, which is even more insane, because you need an additional tool (make) to call cmake for you.
20:55:21 <LordAro> hmm, i understand your issues, but i don't think they're as big of an issue as you make out
20:56:01 <planetmaker> ./configure && make ftw :-P
20:56:08 <planetmaker> least dependencies
20:56:17 <__ln__> autotools is crap also
20:56:36 <Alberth> it's one of the few that does work
20:56:37 <LordAro> Alberth, you supported my decision to switch to cmake, back me up :p
20:56:40 <frosch123> just start from scratch, and program your own solution
20:56:46 <frosch123> with your own language of choice
20:56:48 <Alberth> even though it is hideously complicated
20:57:13 <planetmaker> frosch123, but language X is crap. You must use Y or Z!
20:57:32 <__ln__> LordAro: fair enough, the situation could be tolerated if cmake was otherwise a great tool for cross-platform stuffs.
20:57:42 <Alberth> frosch123: yeah, that's how cmake came into existence :p
20:58:08 <__ln__> frosch123: actually i did start.
20:59:43 <Alberth> LordAro: it's the less bad choice if you ever want to have Windows running the software
21:00:13 <Alberth> but by a VERY small margin
21:01:43 <LordAro> you're welcome to come up with a better solution :p
21:02:22 <Eddi|zuHause> boxy ICEs look weird...
21:03:10 <Alberth> LordAro: Like I said, it's the less bad choice :)
21:04:20 <frosch123> LordAro: maybe become a salesperson for the steam box
21:04:32 <frosch123> if every douchbag uses linux for gaming, you do not have to bother about windows
21:09:01 <Eddi|zuHause> something that went through my mind recently: can we change the meaning of "only creeate cargo if there is demand" from "a train was here to pick this up" to "there is at least one destination for this" if cargodist is enabled for the cargo?
21:09:42 <Eddi|zuHause> i.e. drop any cargo with "to any destination"
21:12:26 <frosch123> and probalby breaks self-regulating networks
21:12:47 <frosch123> so, i would still prefer the manual toggle buttons to start/stop acceptance
21:13:51 <Eddi|zuHause> self-regulating networks probably shouldn't run cargodist :p
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21:14:13 <frosch123> oh, you said "if cdist is enabled"
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21:39:27 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: uhm, why does my latest push not show up in activity?
21:39:48 <planetmaker> redmine takes its time to update. Hourly
21:39:48 <frosch123> spike claims that it updates when you go to the repo tab
21:40:11 <Eddi|zuHause> weird, exactly now it does :p
21:42:41 <Eddi|zuHause> but why would i go to the repo tab?
21:43:54 <frosch123> maybe setup a local cron job, to query the repo pages on the devzone every minute?
21:44:02 <frosch123> and get banned by spike or so
21:44:52 <andythenorth> nothing wrong with a little DoS :P
21:45:07 <Xaroth|Work> redmine is weird like that
21:45:17 <Xaroth|Work> planetmaker: you should check out gitlab btw
21:45:23 <planetmaker> we had such cronjob actually
21:45:27 <Xaroth|Work> less project aimed as redmine
21:45:28 <planetmaker> Xaroth, we use rhodecode now
21:45:30 <Xaroth|Work> more github aimed
21:45:43 <planetmaker> for the repos. And keep redmine for project management
21:45:59 <^Spike^> Xaroth shame gitlab doesn't support hg :(
21:46:10 <^Spike^> else we would've had it running i guarantee cause i work with it aswell :)
21:46:12 <planetmaker> rules it out. kinda ;-)
21:46:24 <Xaroth|Work> ^Spike^: I never liked working with hg, so yeah :)
21:46:44 <planetmaker> Xaroth, no way I'm going to convert 300 repos from hg to git just for... ^
21:46:46 <Xaroth|Work> and we work it at the office now as well (after much pressuring)
21:46:54 <planetmaker> and then support sth I myself don't like :-)
21:47:09 <planetmaker> I would then all direct them to you
21:47:25 <planetmaker> with rhodecode everyone basically has a choice
21:47:47 <planetmaker> exactly. not too helpful to the newgrf developer community
21:47:57 <planetmaker> they don't care one way or another. Just want the grfs done
21:48:18 <planetmaker> it's just tools. They need to work
21:48:21 <Xaroth|Work> you got the paid version or just the free?
21:48:24 <planetmaker> and get the job done
21:48:40 <planetmaker> rhodecode enterprise, yes. Same licensing scheme as atlassian really
21:49:01 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r25972 /trunk/src (rail_cmd.cpp rail_gui.cpp) (2013-11-12 21:48:55 UTC)
21:49:02 <DorpsGek> -Fix [FS#5665]: rail laying sounds of others could be heard in multiplayer (adf88)
21:49:33 <LordAro> Rubidium: how long as that been a bug? :L
21:52:49 <Rubidium> LordAro: not that long
21:53:58 <LordAro> sounds like the sort of bug that has existed forever :L
21:54:01 <planetmaker> I actually wonder whether that *was* a bug
21:54:15 <planetmaker> or whether hearing other players build is a *feature* ;-)
21:54:39 <frosch123> planetmaker: do you want to readd the nsa-viewport?
21:55:08 <planetmaker> hey, we called it 'big brother' patch
21:55:18 <planetmaker> NSA was then a 'no such agency'
21:55:33 <planetmaker> and it was way too exhausting to follow a player's every click
21:55:43 <planetmaker> but fun while it lasted :D
21:56:59 <planetmaker> placed a sign everywhere where one player built :D
21:57:04 <planetmaker> man was he annoyed
21:58:27 <LordAro> wait, i thought you said not that long? :L
21:58:34 <frosch123> was there multiplayer before 0.3 ?
21:58:47 <planetmaker> frosch123, there's multiplayer in TTD...
21:59:34 <Rubidium> LordAro: it's like 1 billionth of history
21:59:41 <Taede> i can probably automate that if rcon/gamescript allows signs to be placed...
22:00:11 <planetmaker> yeah, a GS likely can do that rather easily
22:00:35 <planetmaker> I could open a viewport for each connected client with that patch of smatz'
22:00:38 <frosch123> no, neither of them know about player construction actions
22:01:02 <planetmaker> so give it back to GS via json ;-)
22:01:20 <Taede> logs it to a file and everything
22:02:18 <planetmaker> new command: !trackme
22:02:32 <planetmaker> places signs like "X was here"
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22:06:19 <Taede> X stopped vehicle at date
22:06:46 <Taede> X terraformed water here
22:06:57 <planetmaker> Taede, possibly it could help to gather build statistics for the past PSG though
22:07:07 <planetmaker> to fill-out more easily the participants list
22:07:23 <frosch123> something like a pie chart?
22:07:32 <Taede> built a script that parses the command lines from the logs
22:07:39 <frosch123> percentage built by client?
22:07:52 <planetmaker> yeah. or just a table for starters: X: 3923 commands; Y: 2213 commands; ...
22:07:53 <Taede> ^ example of log output
22:08:26 <Taede> you'd have to check for certain commands though
22:08:40 <Taede> i think if you stop 10 trains at once it counts as 10 commands, though i haven't checked
22:08:47 <Taede> and even if not, its not really building
22:09:13 <planetmaker> well. negotiable :-)
22:09:15 <Taede> but the same could be said for building a long line in one stretch vs building tile-by-tile
22:10:16 <Taede> logfiles are already rotated upon loading a new game, so any file will contain only actions for that game
22:13:01 <Taede> well, anytime a map is loaded
22:13:19 <planetmaker> I figured that :-)
22:13:25 <Taede> so if a map has to be reloaded halfway through for whatever reason, you'd need to parse 2 files
22:14:07 <planetmaker> I'll complain about that when I actually have to do that. But not before ;-)
22:14:39 <Taede> ill just tell you to join the files together and parse the combined one
22:15:15 <planetmaker> yeah. That's what I did a few times when I tried to manually get some stats from the once-upon-atime logging patch
22:19:53 <Taede> well, thats the transfer command for the bot written too. ill test it tomorrow, for now i shall be off as well
22:26:37 <planetmaker> g'night. And from here as well
22:52:44 <Tulitomaatti> you can't do that.
22:53:11 * Supercheese does not actually play chess.
22:54:15 <Tulitomaatti> actually neither of those can be done as the first move.
22:55:37 <Supercheese> I just said a random location
22:56:03 <Supercheese> which accurately describes my chess playstyle :P
22:57:34 <Eddi|zuHause> who said it was opening move anyway?
23:21:37 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd
continue to next day ⏵
