IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2013-05-25
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00:29:18 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd
01:27:47 <Eddi|zuHause> ok, i never played ANY of these games...
02:06:22 <Supercheese> No Legend of Zelda? For shame
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07:45:29 <Aridorn> is there an admin around?
07:46:40 <Aridorn> the citybuilder server for 4k goal is bugged and wont reset, even though its a couple of hours ago someone reached the goal
07:53:18 <planetmaker> you should try to contact the admins of that server...
07:53:30 <planetmaker> not sure they're (ever) here
07:54:37 <planetmaker> besides "citybuilder" is hardly a unique server describtion ;-)
07:55:08 <planetmaker> at least three completely different servers bear that in the name
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07:57:17 <planetmaker> they surely have a website
07:59:32 <Aridorn> i found where they have their IRC
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08:49:49 <Alberth> hmm, why would you want partial loading? it makes so little sense to me
09:16:48 <planetmaker> Alberth, it makes sense from a service perspective. Consider a setup like
09:17:00 <planetmaker> mine1 ---- mine2 ----- steel plant
09:17:14 <planetmaker> you want to pickup 50% at mine1, 50% at mine2 and then return to steel plant
09:17:39 <planetmaker> thus you regularily pickup at each station (good for rating), but still deliver quickly without the train standing there, loading for ages
09:17:50 <Alberth> 2 trains: mine1 -> mine2 (a short one), and mine2 -> steel plant (long one) ?
09:17:54 <planetmaker> it makes sense for low to intermediate prod. levels
09:18:00 <planetmaker> of course, that works
09:18:23 <planetmaker> or conditional orders with like (if load% > 80 --> goto steel plant; otherwise goto mine2). But less nice
09:18:32 <planetmaker> and your suggestion needs 2 trains. while load% needs one
09:19:16 <planetmaker> thus if you play for the original points you can gain (performance graph), feeder services are not necessarily good
09:19:17 <Alberth> with firs farms, I usually have trucks driving around between them until they are sufficiently loaded
09:19:24 <planetmaker> as profit annually for that kind < 20k
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09:20:33 <Alberth> well, ok. we need extended orders, probably :)
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09:27:39 <Eddi|zuHause> man this certificate thing is annoying. how long does it take to renew a certificate?
09:28:51 <TinoDidriksen> SSL/TLS? A few minutes.
09:50:08 <Eddi|zuHause> TinoDidriksen: it was rather a rhethorical question :p
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10:03:02 <alluke> how to mod devzone issues
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10:06:30 <Eddi|zuHause> there's a very hidden "edit description" button
10:06:59 <Eddi|zuHause> click on "edit" on the bottom, and then above the comment section, there's a property section
10:10:21 <alluke> could you provide a screenshot?
10:11:34 <frosch123> what's the best newgrf/nml link to give to someone who submits a townname patch to fs?
10:12:13 <frosch123> i have some shaded memory about a townname howto somewhere
10:14:34 <frosch123> Alberth: you seem to be a manager of that project. can you please fix the "homepage" link
10:14:42 <frosch123> Town_Names->Town_names
10:15:14 <alluke> when i right click the issue theres edit but its greyed out
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10:16:53 <Alberth> no idea I was manager of that :)
10:19:16 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, whole news is full of football stuff :/
10:19:33 <frosch123> yeah, though wcs ro8 is way more interesting
10:23:50 <Alberth> nice, I cannot change the ticket status, or close old ones :p
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10:52:17 <planetmaker> which issues, Alberth , alluke ?
10:52:48 <alluke> one i made some time ago
10:52:55 <alluke> then i realized i forgot to add something in it
10:53:11 <planetmaker> just reply / update the issue, alluke
10:53:37 <alluke> id like to put it into the same window
10:53:39 <planetmaker> update button is top right. Above the issue description. below the main menu(s)
10:54:09 <planetmaker> you likely cannot edit your postings there, if you're not admin or manager of that project
10:54:38 <alluke> i gotta ask if i can get promoted
10:55:06 <planetmaker> generally it's not recommended to edit replies there... Just add a new one
10:55:23 <planetmaker> it's not like it opens a new "window"
10:55:32 <planetmaker> it's just a new reply. Like in any forum
10:55:38 <planetmaker> added below previous replies
10:55:52 <alluke> but in forums you can edit your posts
10:57:06 <planetmaker> Alberth, "townnames" is more of a meta-project. To edit an issue assigned to a sub-project you probably need be manager / developer of that (too)
10:57:42 <planetmaker> alluke, yes. For a day or so
11:02:00 <planetmaker> Alberth, anything in particular you want / need?
11:04:12 <Alberth> no, I was just trying to delete old compiler failure messages
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11:27:50 <Samu> anyone from yesterday here?
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11:32:27 <Mazur> No, they all went to the beach to play with eachother.
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11:41:08 <V453000> frosch123: do you watch wcs? :)
11:43:31 <Samu> didn't buy heart of the swarm
11:44:10 <frosch123> i do now even have wol. you do not need to play the game to watch it
11:45:04 <Samu> i'm not bothering anymore with blizzard titles
11:45:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i watched this for 2 minutes, and didn't understand a single word
11:45:17 <frosch123> you can code ottd in parallel to watching it, but you cannot code in paralel to playing
11:46:25 <Samu> they released diablo 3 with some auction house... rip before it was even out
11:47:33 <Samu> last i've heard they want to port it to consoles
11:48:01 <Eddi|zuHause> what's wrong with consoles?
11:48:24 <frosch123> i've heard xbox one presentation was quite entertaining
11:48:34 <frosch123> though not in a positive sense
11:48:40 <Samu> controlling characters already retarded on d3
11:48:55 <Samu> they want to port it to consoles
11:49:39 <Eddi|zuHause> i never played diabolo, so i've no clue what all the fuzz is about
11:49:55 <Samu> it is about switching skills
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11:50:16 <Eddi|zuHause> a friend recently recommended to me a diabolo-esque game called "path of exile"
11:50:20 <Wolf01> gah, skyrim crashed again :(
11:50:25 <Samu> on d2 i could switch skills on a whim, at any time
11:50:34 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: every generation has to learn that a sequel to anything does not necessarily match the style of the earlier stuff
11:50:48 <frosch123> some learn it with settlers, some with matrix, some with diablo
11:50:56 <Samu> on d3, to switch skills, i have to confirm with some delay, up to 5 simultaneous skill choices
11:51:24 <Samu> no real freedom to control our skills
11:53:18 <V453000> may I ask which game developer company is not idiots in your eyes?
11:53:32 <V453000> cause in my eyes blizzard is miles ahead of anyone else in game quality
11:53:59 <Samu> blizzard quality declined greatly
11:54:12 <V453000> starcraft 2 is excellent
11:54:13 <Samu> whoever played their games since tthe start
11:54:28 <Samu> just knows blizzard is more greedy that ever before
11:54:36 <Eddi|zuHause> but i have no idea how it compares to diabolo 2 or 3
11:54:57 <Samu> feature that were granted were taken away on their next titles only to be re-introduced like they're something new
11:55:28 <V453000> ok, so starcraft 2 is uncontested by any other RTS game, but you complain that blizzard is "greedy" which I honestly dont even understand what is it supposed to mean by you
11:56:00 <V453000> lol isnt rts, lol is moba
11:56:08 <frosch123> lol is contested by dota 2
11:56:10 <V453000> which isnt even remotely similar
11:56:24 <frosch123> but yeah, comparing lol with sc2 is quite silly
11:56:24 <V453000> and/or hon, as frosch said
11:57:11 <Eddi|zuHause> now you're just making up random 2 letter abbreviations
11:57:14 <V453000> btw I actually bought sc2 + hots frosch123 :P totally worth it, it is amazing
11:57:18 <Samu> sc2 better because everyone buys it nowadays
11:57:44 <Samu> but there is not anything worthy out there anyway
11:57:54 <Samu> it's like it's the only thing
11:57:56 <frosch123> V453000: i've been watching sc2 since wol beta (that's 4 years?), but never got around to buy it .p
11:58:02 <V453000> so which real time strategy is worth it? :D
11:58:26 <V453000> frosch123: me too, but bought it a month ago :)
11:58:40 <V453000> the campaign is awesome, and I am not even mentioning all the multiplayer stuff
11:59:13 <V453000> well, and why is there no other RTS Samu? Oh could it be because nobody even dares to contest sc2?
11:59:29 <Samu> I don't know what to say
11:59:30 <V453000> because other companies would have to spend so much money and so much research into how to actually make a better game than that?
11:59:40 <Samu> the SC2 feels more like C&C
11:59:59 <Samu> feels not really a successful title for Brood War
12:00:17 <V453000> do you even know what C&C specifics are
12:00:19 <Samu> feels more fast paced but also more reckless
12:00:27 <V453000> (a title which EA releases, and since then does not care about it at all)
12:00:52 <V453000> quality of any C&C game is uncomparable to what blizzard brings any of their game with patches to
12:01:19 <_aD> Quality of any C&C game is comparable to what year it was released in :-)
12:01:43 <Samu> C&C are always bad titles
12:02:00 <V453000> tiberium wars was amazing when it came out
12:02:04 <Samu> SC2 was approaching the feel of C&C
12:02:11 <V453000> but after 1 year, all of the top players left
12:02:36 <V453000> by what do you judge that sc2 has the feel of cnc? :D
12:02:43 <V453000> that it has 3d graphics?
12:02:57 <alluke> is there any mp-compatible patchpack that supports 1.2.0 and above?
12:03:14 <V453000> I played cnc3 competitively, please tell me more
12:03:44 <Samu> all these playing styles
12:04:12 <V453000> cnc3 has absolutely different playing style than sc
12:04:15 <Samu> TFT and SCBW for example really seem like they're coming right
12:04:35 <Samu> they aren't too fast to get things, just precise
12:04:36 <V453000> all you do in cnc is do some build and hope opponent doesnt do what is good against it, because the pace is so fast that you cant even scout it soon enough
12:05:09 <Samu> there are ways to go around the enemy in multiple ways
12:05:42 <V453000> yes, but the counter is not reactive, it is just guessing and hoping
12:05:45 <Samu> cnc3 seems to have a counter system but units that fit multiple roles at the same time
12:05:51 <V453000> where starcraft is a reactive game
12:06:03 <Samu> the counter system pales
12:06:09 <V453000> it is irrelevant which units there are, that doesnt matter
12:06:28 <Samu> and sc2 wol does seem to have several units that do way too much
12:07:00 <Samu> they are units that can do much damage without much effort
12:07:10 <V453000> so you are saying that sc2 is unbalanced
12:07:16 <V453000> good luck justifying that
12:07:28 <V453000> atm all 3 races have the same winrate
12:07:49 <V453000> how come Every other strategy game has less balanced races?
12:07:54 <Samu> the same winrate but when looking
12:08:12 <V453000> how does it matter how you win
12:08:25 <Samu> it is just a bit reckless, or that it was obvious
12:08:29 <frosch123> yeah, samu has a point. i always thought it's just protoss players being stupid
12:08:40 <frosch123> noone sane would play protoss :p
12:08:40 <Samu> or from somewhere at some point in the game
12:09:18 <Samu> game was over already at some point, and not expected to change
12:09:26 <Samu> it is just being delayed
12:10:06 <Samu> like dealing with terran expansions
12:10:08 <V453000> cnc3 at the time of patch 1.09 which was the final one, had One player playing Scrin race in top 100, about 60 Nod players, and about 40 GDI
12:10:33 <V453000> please tell me sc2 is poorly balanced
12:10:46 <Samu> a nonstop flowing of mmm
12:10:58 <Samu> dealing with it is an hassle
12:11:00 <V453000> frosch123: protoss have their playing style, playing protoss well isnt easy at all
12:11:13 <frosch123> V453000: sorry for trolling :)
12:11:37 <Samu> protoss feeks weak against this
12:12:05 <V453000> 50-50 PvT means they kill them tons
12:12:10 <Samu> but it's just that they just keep coming eveywhere and it feels
12:12:18 <Samu> it's not going to stop soon
12:12:38 <V453000> there is always something you can do against every and each thing
12:12:43 <Samu> but protoss also needs to expand and take care of the map if it want to win
12:12:51 <V453000> if your opponent has 6 bases and you have 2, yes you probably fucked up earlier
12:12:52 <frosch123> anyway, balance is not decided by the units, but by the maps
12:13:20 <Samu> terran feels more reckless this way
12:13:26 <V453000> so what you are saying is that protoss cant expand ... makes sense
12:13:33 <V453000> surely zerg cant expand either
12:13:46 <Samu> but they're always on defensive
12:13:54 <frosch123> forge - fast expand - or die trying :)
12:14:06 <V453000> protoss are always on defensive?
12:14:13 <V453000> how about 100+1 2 base agression builds?
12:14:20 <frosch123> yeah, blink stalkers and recall are completely defensive :)
12:14:24 <V453000> 6-7 minute timing attacks?
12:15:07 <frosch123> i thought wol pvz is broodlord vs. vortex? :p
12:15:11 <Samu> well i dont follow proscene much
12:15:20 <V453000> also, when you get protoss deathball of units, it is fucking hard to win a game
12:15:45 <V453000> I wonder what do you follow Samu
12:15:57 <Samu> that's what i can call reckless
12:16:10 <Samu> takes much effort to fight against
12:16:10 <V453000> sure, then you do different style than late game army composition
12:16:52 <Samu> feels like 200/200 vs 200/200
12:16:53 <V453000> you should consider to learn something about the game first maybe
12:17:11 <Samu> way different than in bw
12:17:12 <V453000> because you have no clue?
12:17:28 <Samu> bw 200/200 was nearly non-existant
12:17:40 <Samu> if there was no unit cap
12:17:42 <V453000> I didnt say bw is the same as sc2
12:17:49 <Samu> there would be a balance issue
12:17:56 <V453000> but 200/200 was very common in bw just as well
12:17:58 <Samu> it would be more obvious
12:18:56 <V453000> "you cannot have 17 control groups of zerglings, zerg is a bad race"
12:19:05 <V453000> or some similar logic?
12:19:46 <Samu> i remember 200/200 was rare
12:20:33 <Samu> i dont know why you want proof
12:20:46 <Samu> bw wasn't as easy to play
12:21:10 <V453000> and that is an argument for?
12:21:14 <Samu> it had much more opportunities
12:21:22 <frosch123> the term "easy" does not exist in a human vs. human game
12:21:24 <V453000> of course, it had different controlling, so it was technically harder to play
12:21:40 <Samu> and have some degree of success
12:22:49 <V453000> blizzard is bad for making the 2 best strategy games
12:23:16 <Samu> it's being carried away by younger ppl
12:23:21 <V453000> regardless which is better in your opinion. But technically if you look at the amount of features, sc2 is clearly a worthy successor to me
12:23:27 <Samu> they have little idea what bw was
12:23:44 <Samu> and also because every other RTS titlle is just crap
12:23:47 <V453000> XD oh the old man argument
12:23:52 <V453000> In my time it was better!
12:23:54 <Samu> maybe except those Lol-kinda RTS
12:24:09 <Samu> which in my opinion suck
12:24:17 <V453000> by any logic, by any sense, they have nothing in common
12:24:19 <Samu> but they get ppl playing it
12:24:32 <Samu> way too many ppl playing mobas like u say
12:24:42 <V453000> so what? :D how is it related to RTS that people play some other genre?
12:25:07 <V453000> it still doesnt put starcraft 2 to being a bad game
12:25:59 <V453000> to me you are just a whiny bitch to who are all games bad, the only thing which is good was the good old times
12:26:00 <Samu> sc2 is a good game because they haven't heard of any better, because there's also nothing better
12:26:15 <V453000> because nobody made anything better?
12:26:16 <Samu> old times bw is/was better than sc2
12:26:40 <V453000> therefore Which company is better than blizzard if No company made the better thing, or even TRY to make something better because they knew the investment would be huge?
12:27:18 <Samu> you'll keep saying blizzard is best
12:27:32 <V453000> what does it even mean greedy
12:27:43 <Samu> you look like someone who's gonna buy the 3 sc2 titles
12:27:51 <V453000> to me greedy means making shit quality game, selling it for a lot of money, not upkeeping it and moving onto another shit title, same routine
12:28:10 <V453000> yes, because they are so high quality that they are worth the money
12:28:13 <Samu> because there's no one better
12:28:21 <Samu> so u must spend the €180
12:28:34 <TinoDidriksen> Whether they are greedy or not doesn't have to affect whether the games are good. Only care where their greed has ruined a game so far is D3.
12:29:04 <V453000> I dont know much about D3 but that indeed probably wasnt the most successful thing
12:29:25 <V453000> I am more interested in Samu telling me what is worth his money, if sc2 is overly expensive
12:29:38 <V453000> so far it seems like nothing
12:29:55 <V453000> because of which blizzard is a greedy and bad company
12:30:01 <Samu> features like clans in sc2
12:30:21 <Samu> something that did exist way before
12:30:43 <Samu> that kind of crap they call "new features"
12:30:49 <Samu> that did exist before on bw
12:30:53 <V453000> yes, and they implement them as well, and in a great fashion
12:30:53 <TinoDidriksen> SC2:HotS wasn't a full price game anyway. It was an expansion, and priced as such.
12:30:58 <frosch123> oh, yeah, 1990's stunts also had replays
12:31:22 <V453000> which company is not greedy
12:31:29 <frosch123> Samu: anyway, as long as you say everything is bad, you look like a darn douchbag
12:31:34 <V453000> WHICH game is you purchase because it is worth it
12:31:34 <Samu> but the new kids in the block thing "wow awesome blizzard, i will lick ur ass!"
12:32:23 <Samu> last game I bought was SC2 wol
12:32:37 <Samu> and it was such a disappointment there was not even chat channels
12:32:50 <Samu> only introduced later on as a "new feature!"... oh sure
12:33:02 <frosch123> and, did you have to pay for the upgrade?
12:33:12 <Terkhen> most people welcome new free features in their games :P
12:33:18 <V453000> you arguments dont even make sense, you are comparing companies between each other (supposedly by saying one company is greedy), but you say that all of them are absolutely bad
12:33:39 <V453000> then you say that fixing things with patches is bad
12:33:43 <Samu> they sold you a sc2 beta but ok...
12:34:05 <V453000> you could also say that blizzard games are always beta
12:34:12 <V453000> because they always keep improving them as much as they can
12:34:23 <Samu> i can now go to other regions becase the community complained about their DRM crap
12:34:27 <frosch123> every software is beta
12:34:31 <frosch123> if it is not, it is unsupported
12:34:32 <Samu> or today we'd still be region locked
12:34:37 <Terkhen> I'm quite sure you could have known about that before buying the game; you bought what they were selling
12:34:43 <Samu> there is no lan play or oflline play
12:34:52 <Terkhen> I did know about what you are mentioning before I bought it, for example
12:34:55 <Samu> but the new kids dont care about it
12:35:04 <Samu> they were grown up with internet already
12:35:09 <Samu> what is a lan for them... bah
12:35:11 <V453000> how is lan or offline play relevant nowadays?
12:35:45 <V453000> especially in this discussion as you are just naming features in a discussion about gaming companies being bad, thus one of them is the worst
12:36:18 <Samu> they are selling stuff as new feature which were supposed to be taken from granted
12:36:26 <V453000> either way, enough of this conversation. You are just a butt-hurt asshole who decrees that everything is wrong, therefore the best products have their cost wrong.
12:36:34 <V453000> sc2 wont have lan ever
12:37:43 <Samu> d3 requires internet to play single player
12:37:56 <Samu> now everyone says simcity SUUUUUUCKS
12:39:03 <Samu> i'm limited to 8 characters
12:39:12 <Samu> in constrast, d2 i could play single player
12:39:23 <Samu> I can make 593453489'573489'5238' charactes on battle.net
12:39:37 <frosch123> @kban samu 100000 it's getting boring
12:39:37 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +b *!~oftc-webi@242.59.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt
12:39:38 *** Samu was kicked by DorpsGek (it's getting boring)
12:40:24 <V453000> awesome, especially like how happy he was
12:40:34 <V453000> if you watched shoutcraft US, it was wtf
12:40:41 <V453000> the winner in finals didnt even SMILE
12:40:45 <V453000> he was like, ok I won
12:42:35 <frosch123> i hardly watch us events
12:42:47 <V453000> I like how TB casts :)
12:43:32 <V453000> d.Apollo was the absolute number 1 in cnc3:tiberium wars
12:43:40 <V453000> he was the only one able to play the alien race in top 100
12:44:05 <frosch123> he, did not know about his background :)
12:44:23 <frosch123> and i have no idea about c&c
12:44:25 <V453000> he was always around bw/sc
13:07:44 <Samu> i want to talk with what I did yesterday
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14:51:43 <Alberth> don't be surprised, it's only me :)
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14:55:28 <Belugas> i'm not there, i'm a ghost in my machine!!
14:55:46 <Belugas> in fact, office called for support :(
15:02:37 * Alberth hopes the amount of support is small
15:36:33 <Rubidium> oh, Belugas found a way to get some rest in the weekend? :)
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17:45:15 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25285 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2013-05-25 17:45:08 UTC)
17:45:16 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:17 <DorpsGek> korean - 1 changes by telk5093
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18:26:34 <Samu> i found a bug - i can't autoreplace some trains because they weren't mine at first, they were from a company i bought out
18:29:09 <Rubidium> what makes you think that is actually the case?
18:34:49 <Samu> all my trains, those that were really mine did autoreplace
18:35:02 <Samu> those that were from the company I bought didn't
18:36:10 <Eddi|zuHause> we'll need a savegame to check your claims
18:36:23 <Eddi|zuHause> preferably one from before and after the autoreplace
18:37:26 <Samu> omg, they are replaced now... I don't get it
18:37:46 <Eddi|zuHause> probably they did not find their way to the depot
18:37:57 <Rubidium> "only autoreplace when old enough to autorenew"?
18:38:14 <Eddi|zuHause> is that a feature?
18:38:49 <Samu> i used the train list autoreplace
18:39:00 <Samu> mine did replace way earlier
18:39:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i probably missed a few things in the last months
18:40:24 <Samu> I'm not sure what to say now
18:41:22 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: all 13+ of them?
18:41:42 <Eddi|zuHause> i saw something about linkgraph
18:42:26 <DorpsGek> Rubidium: Commit by michi_cc :: r24136 /trunk/src (14 files in 4 dirs) (2012-04-17 19:44:02 UTC)
18:42:27 <DorpsGek> Rubidium: -Feature [FS#4465]: Autoreplace vehicles only when they get old. (Vikthor)
18:42:58 <Samu> no i ordered to replace, "now"
18:43:09 <Samu> not the "when old" option
18:48:29 <Samu> a company with autorenew turned on and a company with autorenew off
18:48:53 <Samu> autorenew off goes bankrupt with trains, autorenew on buys autorenew off trains
18:49:06 <Samu> what should happen when I order to autoreplace?
18:53:00 <Eddi|zuHause> you have any test cases for your wild and abstruse theories?
18:55:27 <Samu> 2 years game time is about 20 minutes, it took them way more time than I expected
18:55:44 <Supercheese> you mightn't have enough depots easily accessible
18:55:57 <Supercheese> It will take a long time to autoreplace if your trains can't find a depot
18:56:25 <Samu> there was a depot , those trains did go past it several times, so i assumed they wouldn't be autoreplaced
18:57:44 <Samu> I notice they have a service interval of 135 days
19:00:03 <Samu> I will attempt a new company on this server with some different settings on autorenew
19:06:58 <Samu> to who do I send savegame?
19:07:07 <Samu> oh wait, this is browser irc
19:07:32 <Supercheese> Post it on forums/bugtracker/etc.
19:07:43 <Supercheese> then post the link here
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19:20:28 <Samu> i ordered to replace floss 47 to sh 125, do you need a savegame for this too?
19:20:50 <Samu> that floss 47 from the bankrupted company
19:21:05 <Samu> with autoreplace settings as off
19:22:33 <Samu> it went past the depot 4 times already, not replaced yet
19:25:29 <Eddi|zuHause> the service interval must run out first
19:26:37 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe your bought-out trains had extremely long service interval?
19:27:04 <Samu> it had a long loading at the station
19:27:14 <Samu> but interval was 135 days
19:28:45 <Samu> 64 tonnes of wood a month forest with a train full loading 330 tonnes
19:29:06 <Samu> and another train full loading livestock and grain
19:29:39 <Samu> dang, sorry my error I bet
19:30:08 <Eddi|zuHause> in any case, the probability of "buying out" the company being the cause is near 0
19:34:20 <Samu> I had a similar behaviour with helicopters before
19:36:06 <Samu> it just doesn't happen when I want it to happen for proof
19:41:37 <Eddi|zuHause> (the two concepts have largely the same meaning, although the second one is more specific to software, where the first one can be applied to a wide range of technical or non-technical issues)
19:42:41 <Eddi|zuHause> like, if a physics teacher presents an experiment before class, and it goes wrong, he might claim it's the "Vorführeffekt" ("presentation effect")
19:43:07 <Eddi|zuHause> usually implying that it worked in trial runs
19:51:14 <Samu> what I noticed with helicopters was when they were old already
19:51:56 <Samu> all my other vehicles were black-numbered, but helicopters were red-numbered, and only helicopters
19:56:01 <Samu> planes were black-numbered
19:56:14 <Samu> it was only specific to helicopter
20:05:23 <Eddi|zuHause> they need a hangar at least on one airport they visit
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20:26:08 <wallmani> hello, i am working on an AI for the game, and for some reason when i put the info.nut and main.nut files to /usr/share/openttd/ai/MyNewAI it does not get recognized by openttd
20:26:39 <V453000> side question: who is the cause of files having .nut extension?
20:27:32 <Rubidium> V453000: the guy who wrote squirrel?
20:27:45 <wallmani> yeah, this is specifically for AI
20:27:56 <wallmani> yeah, it's a C++-like language
20:28:12 <V453000> so there is an actual squirrel which eats nuts
20:28:29 <Rubidium> wallmani: by default openttd is installed into /usr/local/, so that's also the path where to place those files
20:28:45 <Rubidium> although ~/.openttd/ai might be an easier location
20:29:32 <wallmani> ah, for some reason archlinux put it in /usr/share/openttd/
20:29:49 <wallmani> i put it in ~/.openttd/downloaded_content/ai before that
20:30:43 <wallmani> that still does not work
20:30:49 <wallmani> well let me try ~/.openttd/ai
20:32:42 <Rubidium> wallmani: if you start openttd -dscript=9, do you get any output?
20:33:23 <wallmani> The script 'MyNewAI' returned a string from GetShortName() which is not four characaters. Unable to load the script.
20:33:48 <wallmani> i did not know about that one, thank you!
20:44:38 <wallmani> everything works well now
20:49:17 <Samu> i discovered something about helicopters
20:49:39 <Samu> when they land on a heliport
20:49:49 <Samu> their last service is updated
20:50:11 <Samu> they don't enter a depot
20:51:03 <Rubidium> that's a configurable feature
20:52:02 <Samu> so that's why they don't get replaced
20:53:10 <Rubidium> autorenew happens when the vehicle thinks: heh, I should service
20:53:22 <Rubidium> if it's serviced on heliports, it never gets into that state
20:53:42 <Rubidium> otherwise a failed autorenew (money or so), would just keep vehicles circling for the depot
20:54:30 <Samu> doesn't happen on airport
20:57:51 <Samu> touches land: tada it's serviced
20:59:50 <Eddi|zuHause> because it's constantly serviced, the service interval never runs out
21:05:56 <Samu> service helicopters at helipads automaticaly? so this is what it does
21:06:02 <Eddi|zuHause> how would americans find words to name these numbers?
21:06:05 <Samu> I was always wondering what it was for
21:06:19 <Supercheese> Past "quadrillion", I have no idea
21:06:24 <Supercheese> "quintillion" perhaps
21:06:36 <Supercheese> "hexillion" sounds dumb
21:07:33 <Supercheese> "sextillion" sounds no less dumb, though
21:08:04 <Supercheese> Past quintillion, I figure most people would stick to scientific notation
21:08:07 <Eddi|zuHause> "Hex" is the wrong language
21:08:24 <Supercheese> 7.523 x 10^20 or whatnot
21:09:27 <Supercheese> "Even well-established names like sextillion are rarely used, since in the contexts of science, astronomy, and engineering, where such large numbers often occur, they are nearly always written using scientific notation."
21:11:04 <Eddi|zuHause> sure, but then you lose the notation of precision to whole numbers
21:11:48 <Samu> it services at oil rigs too
21:12:18 <frosch123> maybe it runs with raw oil
21:12:33 <Samu> heliport, helidepot, helistation
21:12:53 <Supercheese> Waste oil-fired helicopters
21:12:58 <Eddi|zuHause> and not the heliports at real airports?
21:13:15 <Nat_aS> Eddi|zuHause scientific notation has all the presision you need
21:13:23 <Samu> or just doen't refresh service date
21:13:55 <Nat_aS> you only use as many significant figures as your measurement can accurately give you, and chop the rest off.
21:14:49 <Samu> i have to try different sized airports
21:16:04 <Eddi|zuHause> may be the "service at heliport" codepath should get a check for "but go to next hangar if autoreplace is set"?
21:16:50 <Eddi|zuHause> it's probably tricky, because you can't be sure there's a hangar anywhere
21:17:34 <Samu> when do imbacontinental airports become available?
21:17:40 <Supercheese> I'd just tell all the helicopters that need to be autoreplaced to go for servicing, just using the dropdown on the group page
21:18:00 <Supercheese> removes any ambiguity about servicing
21:21:31 <Samu> alright, just built 1 aircraft station of every type, let's see which ones services the helicopter
21:22:42 <Samu> helicopter lands on helipad and becomes serviced
21:23:14 <Samu> next one is international
21:24:55 <Eddi|zuHause> so likely everything that has a dedicated heliport will service the helicopter
21:26:52 <Supercheese> so the commuter airport will service and small will not
21:26:56 <Supercheese> based on the data thus far
21:27:26 <Samu> commuter: serviced at land touch
21:29:00 <Samu> helistation: serviced at land touch
21:29:38 <Samu> helidepot : serviced at land touch
21:30:04 <Supercheese> that about covers it
21:30:36 <Samu> heliport, serviced at land touch
21:31:09 <Samu> so... I usually have helistations and helidepots for helicopters
21:31:56 <Samu> it doesn't renew them there even though there's a depot
21:33:09 <Supercheese> Yeah, you'd best tell the group to service at a depot manually, then
21:33:27 <Samu> i can turn that setting off
21:33:31 <Eddi|zuHause> or just disable the setting
21:33:55 <Supercheese> Well, if you don't care about servicing, like if you have breakdowns off
21:34:00 <Eddi|zuHause> it's from a time before the helistation/helidepot was introduced
21:34:28 <Eddi|zuHause> so if you sent a helicopter from a heliport to an oil rig, it would never service
21:34:50 <Eddi|zuHause> or you needed a large airport instead
21:35:13 <Eddi|zuHause> (what is now the city airport)
21:35:54 <Eddi|zuHause> over time, some new airports were introduced
21:37:40 <Samu> intercontinental, international, helistation and helidepot were my problem
21:38:17 <Samu> exactly what I had at that time in the game
21:40:01 <Samu> do helicopters service now if there's no station with a depot with that setting off?
21:40:13 <Samu> they fly off to a nearby airport or so?
21:40:51 <Samu> no station with a depot in their order list*
21:44:41 <Samu> cool, they are servicing at a depot
21:44:58 <Samu> their orders only include heliports
21:45:25 <Samu> but they're going to an hangar from somewhere
21:46:18 <Samu> let me try put the hangar at the other side of the world
21:47:30 <Eddi|zuHause> there is probably no distance check
21:47:52 <Eddi|zuHause> planes don't have a pathfinder like other vehicles do
21:48:15 <Samu> funny, it wants to service halfway
21:48:30 <Samu> so... it never resumes schedulle
21:48:42 <Samu> haha i have to be cautious with this
21:50:21 <Samu> it does 1 order at least
21:50:55 <Samu> what if i have 2 hangars
21:52:10 <Samu> fast forward was fooling me
21:54:39 <Samu> this error is funny anyway
21:54:45 <Samu> i reported it the other day
21:55:05 <Samu> Can't send aircraft to hangar... Can't send aircraft to hangar...
21:58:30 <Samu> it should tell me the real reason... unable to find any hangar?
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22:47:25 <LunaVorax> I'm not sure if this the right place to ask that, but I'm looking for help to get the music working under ArchLinux x86_64 using ALSA. I've installed and configured Timidity++ (and a soundfont) and it seems to work (the command "timidity file.mid" actually plays midi) but OpenTTD doesn't seems to notice it, even with parameter "-m extmidi" (I don't know if that helps). Does anyone have a suggestion for this problem?
23:03:28 <Eddi|zuHause> LunaVorax: does the game settings window show that you selected a music set?
23:03:39 <Eddi|zuHause> LunaVorax: and the jukebox is set to play?
23:21:22 <LunaVorax> Eddi|zuHause, the soundfont I was using was incompatible apparently
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