IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2013-02-14
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06:00:00 <__ln__> but they use helium, what a waste of natural resources
06:07:27 <Flygon> I'm more of a hydrogen guy myself
06:30:43 <Supercheese> FAA probably won't let them use anything other than helium
06:30:49 <Supercheese> silly regulations
06:54:27 <peter1138> less of a waste than bloody party helium balloons
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07:21:25 <andythenorth> mornings and pikkas
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07:22:33 <Supercheese> Bridges-over-stations not in trunk yet? :<
07:25:28 <Pikka> duh, how do I pay attention
07:25:58 <Supercheese> I don't think credit cards will work
07:26:05 <Pikka> I set a value to random 1,240 and then a couple of lines later clamp it to max 100.
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07:37:37 <andythenorth> "the rules have to change"
07:37:52 <Pikka> yes, that's what I said
07:38:34 <andythenorth> amendment to ToS: if those with root on the mysql DB think you're being a dick, they can remove your grf. Arguing will result in termination of your account and refund of all monies paid.
07:38:49 <andythenorth> good luck defining what's allowed and what's not
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07:39:29 <andythenorth> I don't like all this Daily Mail "Something must be done" crap
07:40:54 <andythenorth> otherwise there would be a worldwide shorrrrtage
07:42:01 <andythenorth> then the price would rise
07:42:11 <andythenorth> we'd have to have export restrictions
07:42:25 <Pikka> Idiot Weekly, Price 2d?
07:43:10 <andythenorth> cheap at twice the price
07:47:21 <Twofish> what are you talking about?
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08:01:47 <andythenorth> the global market for idiocy of course
08:01:55 <andythenorth> is there a shortage?
08:02:03 <andythenorth> these are important questions of the moment
08:03:31 <Supercheese> I believe Einstein made the definitive statement on the idiocy market
08:03:38 <Pikka> better put it into my industry set
08:03:47 <Pikka> are idiots bulk or piece?
08:04:06 <Supercheese> there's a cargo class for that, no?
08:04:22 <Supercheese> bitmask(hazardous, livestock)
08:04:59 <Pikka> transport idiots to the forum
08:05:07 <Pikka> produces large amounts of hazardous liquid
08:06:33 <Supercheese> bitmask(CC_HAZARDOUS , CC_SPECIAL)
08:13:41 <Pikka> UKRS2 running cost code was 150 lines long
08:13:49 <Pikka> 10CC running cost code is 3 lines long
08:14:16 <andythenorth> but are they 3 really long lines? o_O
08:14:25 <andythenorth> could chain a lot of advanced varact 2 :P
08:15:56 <Pikka> UKRS2 running cost code is incredibly "realistic", and has different code for steam, diesel and electric
08:16:22 <Pikka> 10CC is sensible, trains are cheap when they're not moving and expensive when they are.
08:16:55 <Pikka> overall outcome, probably 95% the same
08:18:05 <Pikka> I wonder if my industries are simple enough :)
08:18:12 <andythenorth> cargo in, cargo out
08:18:39 <andythenorth> cargo in * wastage = cargo out
08:19:32 <andythenorth> for secondary, what have you been able to invent that's complicated? o_O
08:21:16 <Pikka> www.pikkarail.com/junk/Image12.png
08:21:46 <Pikka> just the way it handles stockpiling and production rate, which is much smoother than the old version
08:21:51 <Pikka> also the way industries shut down
08:22:23 <Pikka> default secondary industries tell you 1 month before disappearing
08:22:46 <Pikka> mine tell you five years in advance, and if you establish good supply you can stop them closing down.
08:22:53 <andythenorth> I can absolutely grief you in MP
08:23:02 <andythenorth> in which case you should stop playing with me :)
08:23:29 <Pikka> you can knock the bottom out of the coal market and decrease coal mine production across the map by funding more coal mines :)
08:23:52 <Pikka> my coal mines like to cluster together
08:23:54 <andythenorth> so the amount of production per map is relatively constant?
08:24:11 <Pikka> so there's a reasonable chance that the new mines you prospect will pop up next to the one I'm already serving ;)
08:24:47 <Pikka> I don't know about constant, but yes, the industries all affect each other
08:24:55 <Pikka> you can also increase coal mine production by building power stations
08:25:18 <andythenorth> it's like a fake market economy
08:25:28 <andythenorth> or a planned one
08:25:38 <Pikka> but a /lot/ simpler than I'd originally intended ;)
08:26:21 <andythenorth> where is server?
08:26:38 <Pikka> 2 down (except the graphics), howevermany to go.
08:26:53 <andythenorth> well why are you here talking to me then? :P
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08:28:54 <Supercheese> I implemented variable running costs, and just made the vehicles' running costs decrease to 1/4 when speed = 0
08:29:14 <Supercheese> Is that more or less what 10CC is doing?
08:31:19 <Supercheese> Oops, did notice people had left... I should sleep too
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09:03:19 <peter1138> kamnet you are a fucking derp
09:08:57 <DorpsGek> __ln__: kamnet was last seen in #openttd 2 weeks, 0 days, 0 hours, 5 minutes, and 3 seconds ago: <kamnet> I tried to create an 8k*8k map once. I gave up on the generation after 20 minutes. :D
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09:28:33 <Eddi|zuHause> "Draap Trading Ltd is a Cypriot-registered company, run from the Antwerp area of Belgium, and owned by an offshore vehicle based in the British Virgin Islands. Draap spelled backwards is the Dutch word for horse."
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10:08:48 <MNIM> Eddi|zuHause: that sounds like it's got more behind it
10:09:55 <Eddi|zuHause> it's either a really crazy conspiracy theory or the key player behind the horse meat scandal
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11:06:09 <Pikka> there's a lot of it about, peter1138
11:06:10 <DorpsGek> Commit by matthijs :: r24991 trunk/src/table/settings.h.preamble (2013-02-14 11:06:01 UTC)
11:06:11 <DorpsGek> -Doc: Clarify comments regarding settings macros.
11:06:17 <DorpsGek> Commit by matthijs :: r24992 /trunk/src/video (sdl_v.cpp sdl_v.h) (2013-02-14 11:06:06 UTC)
11:06:18 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: [SDL] Make CreateMainSurface and PollEvent private methods instead of static functions.
11:06:25 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Commit by matthijs :: r24993 /trunk/src (sdl.h video/sdl_v.cpp) (2013-02-14 11:06:12 UTC)
11:06:26 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: -Fix: [SDL] Improve 8bpp hardware palette support. Instead of always requesting SDL_HWPALETTE, it is now only done for 8bp blitters in fullscreen mode.
11:06:27 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: - This fixes 32bpp blitters on 8bpp X11, which would only render garbage with SDL_HWPALETTE.
11:06:28 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: - This prevents the colors of other applications from being messed up when running a 8bpp blitter on a 8bpp system.
11:06:29 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: - When running a 8bpp blitter on an 8bpp system without SDL_HWPALETTE (e.g., in windowed mode), this uses a new shadow surface with color approximation.
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11:08:17 <blathijs> TrueBrain: Why is dorpsgek prefixing its messages with your name?
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11:23:37 <Pikka> should've left that thread as blah blah blah :)
11:24:17 <andythenorth> it's now a wall of text
11:24:23 <andythenorth> can I have a cookie for predicting that?
11:24:41 <andythenorth> forums should enforce linebreaks after n words
11:28:48 <andythenorth> Pikka: change the title back, I am confused
11:28:58 <andythenorth> it currently suggests something useful, or even informational
11:29:05 <andythenorth> blah blah blah is more proper
11:34:15 <andythenorth> blah blah blah blah blah
11:34:38 <andythenorth> a tool that decompiles a grf, multiplies all dates by (some factor), then recompiles
11:34:46 <andythenorth> done, done, donety done
11:34:59 <andythenorth> and ignore the real dates
11:36:12 <andythenorth> the only valid argument I've ever seen for it is
11:36:18 <andythenorth> "I want to watch the trains for longer"
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11:56:22 <Flygon> andythenorth: I have no idea if that link is NSFW or not
11:57:07 <peter1138> depends how your workplace sees non-work-related urls
11:59:49 <Flygon> MNIM: I'm referring to the image macro examples near the bottom of the article
12:02:24 <Eddi|zuHause> not NSFW, double negative is an emphasis?
12:10:04 <andythenorth> the forum is currently heavy on walls of text, and light on kitten pictures
12:10:14 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause can you oblige with photos of your cat?
12:10:28 <andythenorth> cats always cheer peoples up
12:10:53 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't have any available on my computer, currently
12:29:52 <Pikka> hey guyz I have a great idea
12:35:11 <Pikka> andythenorth, I should have kept it in gfx discussion
12:35:23 <Pikka> then I could change the thread title as often as I please. :)
12:40:13 <andythenorth> well, it's more interesting than BBC news at any rate
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12:48:16 <andythenorth> so shall I put a 'fake time' parameter into Squid then?
12:49:16 <Pikka> oh, a shipspeed parameter? :)
12:50:41 <andythenorth> I was thinking of fake intro dates :P
12:50:48 <andythenorth> for these daylength nerds :)
12:50:56 <andythenorth> I liked eddi's patch best for daylength
12:50:58 <Pikka> oh, I thought that's what you may have meant
12:50:59 <andythenorth> it was super awesome
12:51:10 <Pikka> but shipspeed is a reasonable idea
12:51:14 <andythenorth> everyone can just use eddi's patch
12:51:19 <andythenorth> shipspeed smells of wee
12:51:23 <Pikka> I'm a little worried how my industries will go with ships... but I guess we'll find out
12:52:16 <MNIM> heck, maglev supertankers!
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13:10:20 <MNIM> the british queen! porno! in a basement!
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14:02:50 <peter1138> Sign up for quick access to this article
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14:02:50 <peter1138> World’s fastest container ships mothballed
14:03:07 <peter1138> what's this, the simuscape of news?
14:09:44 <planetmaker> that's the new financing model of the FT... signup and get some for free. Pay for increased usage
14:12:23 <Flygon> It's called Australian internet
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14:38:53 <Eddi|zuHause> random idea: a town-type "village" that has no growth, and "upgrade to town" and "upgrade to city" option (very expensive)
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14:58:20 <andythenorth> peter1138: that story was free for me, first time :P
15:00:55 <V453000> andythenorth: do you have any checks in firs like "if newgrf = newbridges, use spriteset X, else use spriteset Y" ?
15:01:10 <andythenorth> sprites specific to other newgrfs?
15:01:13 <V453000> I see only incompatible stuff and if (check for setting
15:01:26 <V453000> yeah I need a little bit different overlays on bridges
15:01:39 <andythenorth> no, generally I would say, fuck that
15:01:43 <andythenorth> but bridges are different
15:01:57 <V453000> can something like if (climate == ... be converted to grf == ?
15:04:33 <V453000> with like output to different spritesets
15:06:03 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: typically, sites like these offer the story "for free" when you open it through a google referrer, but from other referrers it will show the paywall
15:09:30 <andythenorth> 46knot, 150t cargo
15:09:36 <andythenorth> it's a bit *too* good
15:28:41 <V453000> wtf are we talking about btw peter1138
15:35:04 <planetmaker> V453000, you can, of course, set a global variable to one value or another depending on the presence or absence of a certain NewGRF
15:35:13 <planetmaker> And then use that global variable to show one spriteset or another
15:35:32 <planetmaker> But then you also want to make sure to test NewGRF order and not just NewGRF presence ;-)
15:36:05 <V453000> uhm ... what is that? :D
15:36:12 <planetmaker> is_newgrf_present = will_be_active(GRFID) or something like that
15:36:20 <planetmaker> and then use is_newgrf_present later on
15:36:57 <V453000> I will try something thanks
15:39:51 <planetmaker> selecting tree sprite depending on other grf's presence
15:40:43 <V453000> right and the tree_base_sprite is then used somewhere like in forests
15:43:07 <V453000> can the GRF ID shown in the game be used?
15:43:20 <V453000> for newbridges that is 535A0501
15:43:26 <planetmaker> what do you mean?
15:43:31 <V453000> or do I need to convert that somehow?
15:44:06 <V453000> you have if (grf_future_status("\4D\66\6F\01")) { format
15:44:18 <planetmaker> that's the way you need to write it, yes
15:47:50 <andythenorth> calling other people dicks makes me a dick too
15:47:59 <andythenorth> let's not do that :P
15:49:10 <V453000> no you have a strong point there
15:49:40 <V453000> because that is the closest description of the problem there is so far
15:53:17 <andythenorth> about making hovercraft unreliable, due to being too fast
15:53:24 <andythenorth> but then...breakdowns off
15:53:29 <V453000> uhmmm you play with breakdowns?
15:53:34 <andythenorth> so I never bother setting reliability
15:53:46 <V453000> reliability is not a factor andy :)
15:53:58 <V453000> I guess all you can do is reducing capacity for ships?
15:54:30 <andythenorth> capacity & speed are the only two stats that really matter
15:54:41 <andythenorth> reliability, cost, running cost are all pointless
15:54:50 <andythenorth> strange that we broke the game so much eh?
15:55:28 <V453000> not really that is how the game always was, you either make profit or you dont, how much is just a matter of time you are willing to wait
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16:05:37 <planetmaker> andythenorth, even when you (and me and V) play w/o reliability it does make sense to make it a valuable property for those who play with it
16:05:59 <andythenorth> I play with breakdowns on sometimes
16:06:16 <planetmaker> then you definitely should put that into your consideration
16:07:44 <SAC> Hi all... do you have an OpenTTD dev around here right now?
16:08:06 <Eddi|zuHause> we have plenty of devs around here, but they only respond to real questions
16:08:30 <SAC> What's that suppose to mean?
16:08:43 <kormer> You have to fill out a captcha first before asking questions.
16:08:57 <SAC> Okey, sorry to bother you...
16:09:09 <andythenorth> what was the question?
16:10:22 <Eddi|zuHause> that was... unhelpful, i suppose :p
16:11:52 <Eddi|zuHause> that define doesn't make any sense
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16:12:44 <V453000> lets see if I understand it (apparently not but ye) .. I define a variable bridge_overlay_stuff, which I add a value and then eventually change the vlue with the if?
16:12:47 <Eddi|zuHause> "#define X Y" is a pre-processor directive that says "whenever X stands in the below code, treat it like Y would stand there"
16:15:24 <peter1138> if (reliability_is_not_set_by_andy_the_north) refuse_to_load_grf(bad_gameplaY)
16:15:43 <andythenorth> make it part of the ToS
16:16:00 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: remove all GRFs from bananas which don't utilize reliability correctly
16:16:02 <V453000> if trains <3000, deactivate newGRF (not enough madness)
16:16:03 <peter1138> there's no ToS for loading newgrfs
16:16:14 <andythenorth> peter1138: well there fucking should be :o
16:17:00 <V453000> Eddi|zuHause: so the #define is outright wrong
16:17:07 <planetmaker> V453000, just replace the line with #define by
16:17:17 <planetmaker> bridge_overlay_stuff = 0
16:17:26 <SpComb> playing with breakdowns on peter's server wasn't really that bad as such
16:17:36 <planetmaker> you cannot use #define w/o use of gcc preprocessor in this context
16:17:38 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: define is not what you want to do
16:18:02 <SpComb> but being offline while others were playing meant that your trains were always 50 years old and breaking down every five tiles once you returned to the game..
16:18:11 <planetmaker> and probably you want to use
16:18:15 <andythenorth> it was good for beating Flherne
16:18:19 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: you "define" a named parameter by assigning a value to it, like in the line below
16:18:21 <andythenorth> all his trains got slow
16:18:27 <planetmaker> bridge_overlay_stuff = 1 two lines further down
16:18:34 <planetmaker> and then in the actual spritesheet use like
16:18:47 <Eddi|zuHause> not sure if you can assign a spriteset to a parameter, though
16:19:18 <planetmaker> sprite: (bridge_overlay_stuff ? value for grf present : value for grf not present)
16:19:29 <planetmaker> (if you use default sprites)
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16:19:41 <Eddi|zuHause> nmlc will probably blow up in your face if it's not allowed :)
16:19:46 <planetmaker> if you use your custom spritesets, you can use that variable in a switch decision like any other variable
16:22:54 <V453000> should be there anything after the sprite(bridge_overlay_stuff ? canalrails_bridge_surfaces_newbridges : canalrails_bridge_surfaces_original) ?
16:23:03 <V453000> if I put ; there ,it sez unexpected token ;
16:23:38 <V453000> oh that doesnt ask about the newgrf anyhow
16:24:16 <Eddi|zuHause> oh no, there it is
16:24:40 <Eddi|zuHause> i have no idea, this is not a magic i have used before
16:25:49 <V453000> how simple it is .. :)
16:25:58 <V453000> as always, getting lost in it ... thanks pm :)
16:27:26 <planetmaker> anyway... gotta go. See you (much) later or tomorrow
16:29:12 <V453000> hm, what could the grf_present stand for in the switch block
16:30:56 <V453000> nmlc crunching it now :) so happily
16:33:45 <V453000> congratulations, you led the idiot to success again ... thank you :)
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17:04:07 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r24994 /trunk/src (12 files in 2 dirs) (2013-02-14 17:04:01 UTC)
17:04:08 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: Replace access to service_interval with accessors (peter1138)
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17:06:55 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r24995 /trunk/src (10 files in 3 dirs) (2013-02-14 17:06:49 UTC)
17:06:56 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: Add flags to vehicle service interval for custom & ispercent (peter1138)
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17:09:01 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r24996 /trunk/src (4 files in 2 dirs) (2013-02-14 17:08:56 UTC)
17:09:02 <DorpsGek> -Change: Apply default service interval changes to vehicles without custom interval (peter1138)
17:11:48 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r24997 /trunk/src (3 files in 3 dirs) (2013-02-14 17:11:42 UTC)
17:11:49 <DorpsGek> -Change: Use dropdown list to select between Default/Days/Percentage (peter1138)
17:12:33 <andythenorth> shall we just bin the web interface to Bananas?
17:12:51 <andythenorth> [the public list of content]
17:25:01 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r24998 /trunk/src (10 files in 2 dirs) (2013-02-14 17:24:55 UTC)
17:25:02 <DorpsGek> -Fix [FS#5137]: Set vehicle's service interval is percent flag appropriately on creation (peter1138)
17:29:55 <peter1138> new rage against the machine song
17:29:59 <peter1138> "committing in the name of"
17:33:56 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: why?
17:34:57 <frosch123> why did eddi post such nonsense in my topic?
17:35:07 <frosch123> this is no shunting
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17:35:20 <frosch123> all vehicles in the consist stay in their place
17:35:31 <frosch123> else we have the same complex nonsense as the old reverse flag hack
17:36:02 <frosch123> engines running around a consist, lol? how do you imagine this should work with two engines in the consist?
17:36:09 <frosch123> do you want to add the whole consist to the orders?
17:37:02 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i'm posting this because your patch is a solution to the wrong problem
17:37:32 <frosch123> the patch is meant for dual headed consists
17:37:37 <frosch123> not for shunting steam engines around
17:38:13 <andythenorth> frosch123: it literally is just permitting going backwards yes?
17:38:16 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, and that is the problem :)
17:38:30 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: shunting is silly
17:38:36 <frosch123> you can barely define it for a single engine
17:38:44 <peter1138> frosch123, yeah, i find i get annoyed when i ask something and they reply about something completely different too :S
17:38:50 <frosch123> so it limits gameplay and turns ottd into a realism game
17:38:57 <frosch123> worst feature ever, i would say
17:40:48 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i know how it works in my head. it's not that complicated... let me try to phrase it in words
17:45:59 <peter1138> frosch123, first step, remove the flag, second step, don't commit your patch because it "is just useless", third step, ignore them
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18:01:45 <andythenorth> frosch123: do I misunderstand? Does the reverse patch *require* an articulated vehicle?
18:01:51 <andythenorth> or just a flag on a vehicle?
18:04:37 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i hope that is clearer now...
18:04:55 <frosch123> when i mention articulated parts i only want to point out that articulated parts of engines also count as engines
18:05:04 <frosch123> (while they normally would not)
18:07:30 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: do you realise how complex your suggestion is? and that it completely breaks newgrfs defining graphics depending on the position in the consist?
18:08:15 <andythenorth> so I can build some engine
18:08:17 <Eddi|zuHause> but my opinion is that without this, the feature is worthless
18:08:22 <andythenorth> and put a cabbage and the end of the train
18:08:27 <andythenorth> and it will just go backwards
18:08:38 <andythenorth> no need to faff about shuffling newgrf graphics around
18:08:48 <peter1138> andythenorth, something like that
18:09:01 <andythenorth> I don't make trains, so my opinion is worthless
18:09:03 <peter1138> but people conflate reversing with some form of shunting
18:09:23 <andythenorth> to me this seems like a way to save newgrf authors writing a whole lot of code
18:09:32 <andythenorth> while adding a teeny-tiny gameplay benefit
18:10:01 <peter1138> personally i find terms like "useless" and "worthless" pretty offensive... and i didn't even write it
18:12:39 <andythenorth> it's definitely fun around here at the moment :)
18:14:23 <peter1138> i guess it would work if you removed though 4x variables
18:14:38 <peter1138> want a different look? use a different id... heh
18:17:01 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: the newgrf stuff can be solved by passing to the newgrf the data how the consist was arranged in the depot, instead of how the consist is arranged currently
18:17:52 <frosch123> if you think that is correct
18:17:54 <Eddi|zuHause> that is in the same spirit as how you keep the old "train was flipped an odd number of times" flag in case of the old behaviour
18:18:00 <frosch123> why would the newgrf not want to access the current layout?
18:18:40 <frosch123> i think you should draw some non-trivial examples, and then realise that the whole suggestion is nonsense
18:18:52 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: the newgrf could deduce the current layout by reading the "goes backwards" flag that you introduced, and which backwards-method is applied
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18:49:23 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r24999 /trunk/src/lang (60 files in 2 dirs) (2013-02-14 18:49:11 UTC)
18:49:25 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:49:26 <DorpsGek> english_US - 4 changes by Rubidium
18:49:27 <DorpsGek> french - 4 changes by glx
18:49:28 <DorpsGek> greek - 156 changes by Evropi
18:49:29 <DorpsGek> spanish - 5 changes by Terkhen
18:49:30 <DorpsGek> swedish - 9 changes by Joel_A, Zuu
18:49:58 <Superuser> had even more amazing progress yesterday
18:50:24 <Superuser> actually it may have counted as today, as I was translating late into the night, hence the 156 changes
18:50:39 <Superuser> (I change a lot of strings, but probably not the majority of the ones I go through)
18:51:04 <Superuser> also continuous integration ftw
18:51:24 <Zuu> afaik it show the number of strings that were changed since last sync to svn.
18:52:12 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r25000 branches/1.3/ (2013-02-14 18:52:05 UTC)
18:52:13 <DorpsGek> [1.3] -Branch: time to get this thing done and do some new stuff in trunk
18:52:19 <Superuser> oh okay, 24 changes yesterday
18:52:24 <Superuser> I just checked the svn myself
18:53:19 <Superuser> and 53 changes 3 days ago
18:53:38 <Superuser> still, I've probably had more productive periods, but then again, the effort is almost over
18:53:47 <Superuser> this will be my finest work yet :D
18:56:11 <Supercheese> r25k is 1.3.0 eh?
18:56:49 <Superuser> that said though I have built up a backlog of ~200 strings that need to be checked. Occasionally their original English strings may have to be changed, which is a long and arduous process
18:56:56 <Terkhen> nope, just the branch
18:58:11 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r25001 /trunk (9 files in 6 dirs) (2013-02-14 18:58:04 UTC)
18:58:12 <DorpsGek> -Change: heading for 1.4 now
18:59:43 <joey8> anyone know how to stop those annoying "Message from the manufacturers" please
19:00:10 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: no, r25k is just splitting the development version from the testing version, which means one of the next commits to that branch will be 1.3.0-RC1
19:00:15 <Superuser> why is vim under windows such a piece of ass
19:01:17 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: whereas trunk can now move forward with experimental patches, not affecting the testing version's feature freeze (e.g cargodist or more height levels)
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19:02:10 <Supercheese> and Bridges-over-stations :)
19:03:32 <Eddi|zuHause> and for the record, you guys drive me mad with the 5 letter common prefix...
19:04:15 <Eddi|zuHause> (not as mad as people with the same colour talking to each other, though)
19:04:34 <Zuu> Superuser: because you screwed up
19:04:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i've never had a problem with vim under windows...
19:05:16 <Eddi|zuHause> (or i can't remember)
19:05:28 <V453000> I have never had a problem
19:05:54 <Zuu> The only "issue" I had was to figure out where to put my .vimrc and .gvimrc files.
19:06:20 <Zuu> And that the installer diddn't include the themes that I like so I had to get a theme pack manually.
19:06:45 <Zuu> But both are minor things that can be sorted out.
19:07:50 <Zuu> Hmm, a link to show unread with a post hashtag. How is that going to work?
19:07:51 <Eddi|zuHause> (i'm guessing it's an automatic translator failure)
19:08:10 <frosch123> joey8: update to 1.3 beta
19:08:17 <frosch123> it has some improvements in that area
19:08:26 <frosch123> you are only offered engines, if you already have similiar ones
19:08:32 <Eddi|zuHause> Zuu: no idea, i just copied the link that the forum gave me
19:08:32 <joey8> frosch123➤ ah ha ok thankyou
19:09:01 <Zuu> For me that give me page 146 in that thread as that is aparently the first new page for me.
19:12:18 <V453000> OMG pikka also has open wagon livestock :DD <3
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19:21:48 <Superuser> should industry names have genders?
19:22:09 <Superuser> also, they are not pluralised anywhere are they?
19:22:18 <Superuser> nah they ain't, otherwise they'd be marked as such derp
19:23:14 <Superuser> What about town buildings? They definitely not, right?
19:23:23 <Eddi|zuHause> the german industry names have geners male/female/neutral/plural
19:24:36 <Superuser> so add plural too? the english originals don't have plural
19:24:59 <Superuser> and plural is not listed for Greek, only m/f/n
19:25:12 <Eddi|zuHause> it's mainly for the founding news message
19:25:26 <Superuser> That still means it's important
19:25:31 <Superuser> should I add plural to greek via the config page?
19:25:31 <Eddi|zuHause> "new forest is planted" but "new oil wells are opened"
19:25:44 <Superuser> or just use {P x y}
19:26:05 <Eddi|zuHause> no, because P needs a number
19:26:18 <Eddi|zuHause> which you don't have, so it won't work
19:26:42 <Superuser> so we need a p gender I guess?
19:26:51 <Eddi|zuHause> the plural gender worked out very well for german
19:28:00 <Superuser> now I'll have to find all the places industry names are used
19:29:12 <Superuser> lol, looking through the industry names, it strikes me that I won't need a plural gender at all
19:29:54 <Eddi|zuHause> you need to find all places that use {G}, not just industry-related
19:30:20 <Superuser> this will require regex magic
19:30:27 <Superuser> can lng files be edited in a text editor
19:30:50 <Superuser> I'll have to grep this at some point
19:31:01 <Eddi|zuHause> well, the original .txt file, not the compiled .lng file
19:31:21 <Superuser> has a funky graphical interface too
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19:48:00 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i think "shunting" doesn't quite mean the same thing that i suggested... "shunting" would involve exchanging wagons beteen consists
19:51:40 <peter1138> you're talking about detaching the engine, moving it, and reattaching it at the back
19:51:50 <peter1138> which is not technically shunting but i can't think of a suitable word :p
19:53:43 <peter1138> oh the topic was randomly split
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20:01:46 <Superuser> for STR_FORMAT_DATE_LONG
20:01:56 <Superuser> The English (US) original is '{STRING} {STRING} {NUM}'
20:02:06 <Superuser> the Greek translation (not mine) is '{STRING.date} {STRING} {NUM}'
20:02:11 <Superuser> should I remove .date?
20:02:16 <V453000> track_overlay[1] 10 6 flat and 4 slope sprites. Track without landscape ----- when are the slope sprites used there? I cannot seem to find when are these done, on slopes underlay applies, on bridges bridge_surfaces apply
20:02:47 <Superuser> oh and nice application of OO, that's one thing you rarely come across :)
20:03:13 <peter1138> V453000, pbs reservation
20:05:02 <Superuser> Anyone familiar with my issue? :L
20:05:18 <Superuser> exactly 100 left btw (string 3804/3904)
20:05:31 <Superuser> <Superuser> for STR_FORMAT_DATE_LONG
20:05:31 <Superuser> <Superuser> The English (US) original is '{STRING} {STRING} {NUM}'
20:05:31 <Superuser> <Superuser> the Greek translation (not mine) is '{STRING.date} {STRING} {NUM}'
20:05:31 <Superuser> <Superuser> should I remove .date?
20:05:58 <andythenorth> there's no content in base costs grf
20:06:01 <andythenorth> no trains at all
20:06:06 <andythenorth> it's just a list of numbers
20:06:08 <andythenorth> it should be removed
20:06:35 <Superuser> I have NO clue about what you're on about, andy
20:06:54 <V453000> honestly, yes. If you dont care about the problem then dont fuck the discussion up imo
20:07:06 <V453000> I still love you though andy <3
20:07:39 <Superuser> so should .date be removed?
20:08:02 <andythenorth> draw your own ships :P
20:08:22 <peter1138> Superuser, why should it be removed?
20:08:27 <V453000> worst case scenario :P
20:08:30 <Superuser> because the original doesn't have it
20:08:36 <Superuser> and no, not a case glx
20:08:38 <peter1138> original doesn't have cases
20:09:05 <Superuser> sorry for the trouble
20:09:09 <Superuser> okay, last 100 strings!
20:10:05 <peter1138> andythenorth, stfu :p
20:10:16 <andythenorth> about time someone said that
20:10:31 <peter1138> andythenorth, you're caring too much for someone who doesn't care :p
20:11:22 <andythenorth> hmm ok so FISH is nearly 4 years old
20:11:52 <andythenorth> the first post of the thread is quite nice reading
20:11:52 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: it's not much different from CETS :)
20:12:00 <Supercheese> The problem isn't so much about random faff uploaded to Bananas, as Bananas has lots of faff already
20:12:02 <Eddi|zuHause> (although that is not on bananas yet)
20:12:08 <Supercheese> The problem is the community creating drama drama drama
20:12:41 <andythenorth> yet it's obvious when someone is being a dick
20:12:52 <andythenorth> I can be a dick and it's obvious in 1-2 lines
20:12:57 <andythenorth> then someone tells me to stfu
20:13:04 <andythenorth> so why loads of drama when someone else is a dick
20:13:26 <Supercheese> Can no longer be edited :|
20:13:32 <andythenorth> wtf is it reserved for eh?
20:14:09 <Superuser> Ok I'll masturbate furiously and then sleep, later everyone
20:14:39 <andythenorth> actually not nearly enough
20:14:41 <andythenorth> I wanted pictures
20:15:00 <andythenorth> but mostly diagrams
20:15:05 <Eddi|zuHause> a template maybe? :p
20:16:09 <V453000> andy are you drunk or yes
20:17:00 <andythenorth> V453000: not at all
20:17:16 <V453000> come on I wanted a moral justification for me to be drunk
20:17:27 <V453000> now I have to stay sober, thank you
20:17:56 <Supercheese> No need for justification
20:18:09 <V453000> HOW in the hell do foundations have effect on the opposite end of the tile :D
20:19:02 <peter1138> andythenorth, i can't actually do anything about content on bananas anyway
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20:20:26 <V453000> the snow shouldnt be there, as shown on the right tracks, the water is everywhere there
20:20:39 <V453000> when track is on foundation there, it overwrites the tracks :D somehow
20:21:07 <andythenorth> you know that foundations show a pixel or so above the tile? at least, in my experience they do
20:21:21 <V453000> but this is on the opposite side
20:21:48 <V453000> the snow shouldnt be there?
20:22:04 <V453000> that isnt a foundation, looks like hole in sprites but somehow ... it isnt a hole
20:22:36 <Supercheese> sprite alignment :|
20:22:42 <V453000> the foundation is on the left, and under tracks
20:22:42 * Supercheese hates sprite aligning
20:22:48 <andythenorth> could we change the newgrf spec?
20:22:55 <andythenorth> to allow fetching images from remote sources?
20:23:08 <andythenorth> cb: change sprite source
20:23:09 <Supercheese> Someone write a patch that automatically aligns sprites As They Should Be™
20:23:18 <Supercheese> save us a lot of work :D
20:23:27 * andythenorth considers an actual 'advertising grf'
20:23:29 <V453000> hm yeah when I move the sprites 2 pixels right and 1 down, snow disappears
20:23:30 <Supercheese> autodetect "is this sprite a train"
20:23:50 <Supercheese> "is this sprite a unicorn" execute autoalignunicorn subroutine
20:23:59 <andythenorth> I kind of need to trigger fetching a url in system browser when clicking on a tile
20:24:27 <andythenorth> don't think it can open your browser
20:24:45 <andythenorth> "Get paid to click ads"
20:24:45 <Supercheese> import code from the newgrf settings window
20:25:06 <Supercheese> "This vehicle can only be built after clicking on X advertisements"
20:25:13 <Supercheese> "Or solving Y captchas"
20:25:15 <andythenorth> the actual idea I had was a station set that showed lolcats
20:25:19 <andythenorth> and nothing to do with ads
20:25:29 <andythenorth> secret combinations unlock a new cat
20:25:45 <Supercheese> Autoreplace ceiling cat with serious cat
20:25:56 <andythenorth> could be done without fetching them live
20:26:02 <andythenorth> but live would be more...fun?
20:26:04 <Supercheese> HEQS already has CATs though :P
20:26:26 <andythenorth> how much shall we charge per click?
20:26:30 <andythenorth> and who gets the money?
20:26:37 <andythenorth> obv. it's my idea so 50% to me
20:26:49 <andythenorth> and 25% to openttd
20:26:53 <andythenorth> 25% to newgrf author?
20:27:44 <Supercheese> I should really stop being lazy and add the extra zoom sprites to my grf
20:27:50 <Supercheese> but... effort... ugh
20:27:52 <andythenorth> being lazy is good
20:28:23 <Supercheese> I think I've modified the OTTD source a dozen times since starting my game last month
20:28:26 <andythenorth> busy people are what cause stuff like the seige of staliningrad
20:28:43 * andythenorth has been adventuring in wikipedia
20:28:52 <Supercheese> It's amazing when you say "I don't like this 'feature'" and you can just browse the code and remove it, and recompile
20:28:57 <V453000> zoom sprites? :d what for
20:29:03 <Supercheese> Because it's "easy"
20:29:07 <V453000> brutal effort for no real gain tbh
20:29:08 <Supercheese> I already have large renders
20:29:20 <V453000> ah well with renders it isnt that much effort
20:29:21 <Supercheese> I "just" need to resize them and add some code
20:29:31 <andythenorth> yeah, that's how staliningrad got started too
20:29:34 <andythenorth> "it will be easy"
20:30:18 <andythenorth> be careful, is all I'm saying :P
20:30:29 <Supercheese> does the Dutch station set show passengers on the platforms based on amt of cargo waiting?
20:30:41 <Supercheese> that's become a mandatory feature for my pax-stations
20:32:40 <andythenorth> so where is pikka at?
20:33:31 <Supercheese> the other regions are faff
20:33:57 <andythenorth> frosch123: semi-serious question - not just being a dick - could trams go backwards, in principle?
20:35:03 <frosch123> road vehicle movement is a lot more complicated
20:35:19 <frosch123> and i would wonder whether the tram should then switch the driving side :p
20:35:21 <andythenorth> and there's no obvious way to switch drive side
20:35:40 <frosch123> what's the point of driving a tram backwards?
20:35:46 <andythenorth> one of the (probably many) annoying things with trams is the loops that have to be built
20:35:47 <frosch123> the vehicles behind it will block the path
20:35:56 <andythenorth> state machine might be better :P
20:36:21 <andythenorth> back to cooking dinner
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20:38:30 * Supercheese needs the tiles from VAST Objects for VAST Station tiles
20:38:39 <Supercheese> but no stations for NML :<
20:40:29 <frosch123> V453000: do czech also call baking cakes "cooking"?
20:40:51 <V453000> but cooking is general enough
20:41:01 <V453000> also andy wont cook or bake me anything because he is a bitch, so ...
20:42:27 <Supercheese> Dutch stations do not show passengers on the platforms :<
20:42:48 <Supercheese> Too bad, they have awesome sprites
20:43:03 <bb10> you didn't know? dutch people are invisible.
20:43:14 <Supercheese> That would explain a bit :P
20:50:16 <andythenorth> people on stations is lame
20:51:23 <V453000> there should be animals, cakes and cats
20:51:32 <V453000> (cats arent classed as animals)
20:53:06 <andythenorth> that is a good idea
20:53:08 <andythenorth> do a station set
20:53:23 <andythenorth> V453000 really, you should do an industry set
20:53:28 <andythenorth> you are wasting your skills
20:53:29 <Eddi|zuHause> <frosch123> and i would wonder whether the tram should then switch the driving side :p <- yes, just like overtaking vehicles just jump to the other lane (if it's free)
20:54:13 <Eddi|zuHause> (overtaking is not implemented for articulated vehicles yet, afair)
20:54:41 <V453000> andythenorth: I have half complete ;) just no sprites yet
20:54:59 <V453000> never heard of zool tho
20:55:06 <andythenorth> cakes and chupa chups and stuff
20:55:10 <andythenorth> and an awesome soundtrack
20:55:22 <V453000> andythenorth: FARM, FARM Adds Real Mayhem
20:58:13 <andythenorth> games used to have class
20:58:17 * andythenorth is a grumpy old man
20:59:11 <Supercheese> TTO & TTD soundtracks are still my favorite non-Nintendo-game soundtracks
21:02:53 <andythenorth> lotus turbo esprit
21:02:58 <andythenorth> can't be hard to recreate
21:03:08 <andythenorth> I used to code games a bit like that in flash
21:03:13 <andythenorth> without corners :P
21:03:18 <andythenorth> never worked out the corners :P
21:06:38 <andythenorth> my flash is blocked by apple :(
21:06:42 <andythenorth> can't play my old games
21:09:16 <V453000> GO MINIONIZE NEWGRFS INSTEAD
21:16:47 <andythenorth> draw me some ships
21:17:10 <andythenorth> V453000: all the dramas gone, let's make a new one
21:20:14 <andythenorth> and you won't draw me ships
21:20:36 <V453000> well it smells so it needs some smelly ships
21:20:49 <V453000> also what kind of fool are you that you think I am going to draw normal ships
21:20:50 <Supercheese> NewFISH will have Livestock ship no? That surely is smelly
21:21:06 <frosch123> fish is smelly on its own
21:21:14 <V453000> esp with livestock shits
21:21:14 <Supercheese> Hah, drawing graphics? By hand?
21:21:33 <V453000> I want to see a good render for 1x zoom
21:21:42 <Supercheese> You render and then edit
21:21:44 <V453000> the good is important
21:21:54 <Supercheese> You don't just render and say "welp, I'm done"
21:22:12 <andythenorth> Supercheese: you probably do just that :P
21:22:15 <V453000> isnt it easier to draw the silhoulette in the first place?
21:22:20 <Supercheese> Moi? Au contraire!
21:22:32 <Supercheese> Render and then tweak
21:22:46 <Supercheese> I could provide some "before -> after" but meh, effort
21:23:01 <andythenorth> oops, /me remembers not to go too far
21:23:09 <andythenorth> this is not a place for your mum jokes
21:23:10 <V453000> got some examples? :>
21:23:23 <andythenorth> renders should be banned!
21:23:31 * peter1138 smirks at wallyweb trying to code
21:23:36 <Supercheese> that's rendered, no?
21:24:02 <Supercheese> peter1138: trawling Simuscape for more drama?
21:25:08 <andythenorth> he never gets angry
21:25:12 <andythenorth> he's always a decent chap
21:25:42 <andythenorth> his idea is good eh?
21:25:51 <andythenorth> instead of having actual vehicles
21:25:51 <peter1138> thank you for automatically assuming i'm going to go around digging up stuff to cause shit
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21:26:08 <andythenorth> see what you did there?
21:26:11 <andythenorth> an actual drama :(
21:26:17 <V453000> another thread going to shit :D
21:26:28 <andythenorth> natural destination of most threads
21:26:39 <Supercheese> Must be drama o'clock again
21:26:45 <Supercheese> My,lookAtTheTime.jpg
21:26:46 <andythenorth> your fault this time
21:26:51 <Supercheese> oh wait, no commas in filenames
21:27:07 <andythenorth> I have to stop being a dick, or this turns into #tycoon
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21:29:05 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, sir, mister burns.
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21:29:18 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o peter1138
21:31:26 <Eddi|zuHause> <Supercheese> oh wait, no commas in filenames <- are we still using DOS?
21:31:36 <Supercheese> Doesn't like commas
21:31:38 <Eddi|zuHause> medieval times...
21:31:54 <Rubidium> Supercheese: and the filename CON?
21:32:17 <Supercheese> Typing before testing = bad idea
21:32:36 <peter1138> Rubidium, how dare you commit my unfinished work! revert!
21:32:38 <Eddi|zuHause> on linux, the only thing that is not allowed is a "/", on windows a few more, but i don't remember "," being one of them
21:32:59 <V453000> what, windows accepts , in filenames? :D never tried
21:33:07 <Supercheese> Disallowed characters are \ / * ? : " < > |
21:33:17 <Supercheese> guess commas are fine after all
21:33:29 <peter1138> i love having files with * and ? in
21:34:09 <Eddi|zuHause> files which only differ in cases are "fun" as well on windows ;)
21:34:50 <V453000> dont those match in win?
21:35:06 <frosch123> you cannot beat the madness of dos/win filesystems
21:35:45 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: yes, but some evil linuxes might create them anyway, and then windows gets horribly confused by some different directory entries having the same name
21:35:52 <V453000> first time I hear I cant beat madness
21:36:01 <Supercheese> that is how I make most vehicles
21:36:34 <frosch123> using a special first character in the filename to mark a file as deleted, and then later realising that you want to allow that character in filenames, and thus using a second special character to represent the first one :)
21:38:28 <V453000> idk if that isnt faster to draw by hand Supercheese :)
21:38:42 <Supercheese> Try drawing 1x 2x and 4x by hand faster
21:38:55 <Supercheese> but anyway speed is not the point
21:38:56 <V453000> 2x and 4x is pointless imo
21:39:19 <frosch123> "The reason, why 0xE5 was chosen for this purpose in 86-DOS is down to the fact, that 8-inch CP/M floppies came pre-formatted with this value filled and so could be used to store files out-of-the box." <- oh, i learned something new
21:39:57 <Supercheese> Besides, there's a very nice OTTD-plugin for Sketchup that makes rendering fast
21:40:47 <Supercheese> Only issue is you can't really render with a transparent background, but that's a fairly minor thing
21:41:07 <V453000> well if the method works for you, its fine :) just looking at zbase makes me really confused why rendering though :)
21:41:09 <Supercheese> GIMP can remove the background color well enough
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21:43:03 <V453000> you gotta admit that joke was excellent
21:44:45 <andythenorth> 100 pax ferry - how much cargo? 40t?
21:44:48 <andythenorth> is about right I reckon
21:46:47 <Supercheese> V453000: No, that's power, not capacity :D
21:47:07 <andythenorth> ratio of mail:pax?
21:47:27 <V453000> ships dont have power ... UNLESS THEY ARE ON RAILS
21:48:51 <Supercheese> Is... is that canals-as-railtype?
21:49:23 <V453000> coming with NUTS 0.4.8
21:49:33 <frosch123> do you have a trainset with matching nacelles?
21:49:41 <V453000> along with A ship, submarine, hovercraft, loch ness, and some other water animals, furballs,...
21:49:50 <Supercheese> There's your diagonal canals, andy
21:50:07 <V453000> and no colliding sihps?
21:50:56 <Supercheese> Although hmm, canals-as-railtypes makes using real water problematic
21:51:01 <V453000> what the fuck is that :D googled
21:51:14 <V453000> well you could put canals around them
21:51:15 <Supercheese> Basically aircraft that run over water
21:51:37 <Supercheese> They can't be made as ships because ships can only go ~80 MPH
21:51:43 <Supercheese> and these things would be faster
21:51:55 <Supercheese> BUT they can be made as "trains"
21:52:00 <Supercheese> for canal-railtype
21:52:06 <V453000> well, this is what is coming for next nuts :)
21:52:26 <Supercheese> Addon-grfs will come shortly
21:52:28 <frosch123> andythenorth: now you can have your articulated tug boats :)
21:52:43 <andythenorth> I had better start redesiging Squid
21:53:08 <Supercheese> V453000: just reuse the baseset river-sprites
21:53:39 <Supercheese> nevermind, whatever works for you then :D
21:53:40 <andythenorth> V453000: just reuse the ones I drew for rivers
21:53:44 <frosch123> Supercheese: the rivers do not have matching sprites for diagonals
21:53:48 <V453000> I think my water looks kind of acceptable for both ttd and opengfx
21:54:01 <V453000> I have water drawn already? :D
21:54:19 <frosch123> [22:54] <V453000> I have water drawn already? :D <- we are used to andy
21:54:21 <V453000> all I need now is signal-buoys, tunnels, road crossings
21:54:26 <frosch123> draw stuff, throw it away
21:54:47 <Supercheese> Just disallow road crossings?
21:54:57 <andythenorth> really, why not reimplement everything as trains?
21:55:00 <V453000> disallowing road crossings is imo a totally wrong option
21:55:10 <Supercheese> Ooh, they can open/close
21:55:32 <V453000> I am going to just make it basic form of worky for now okay :P
21:55:33 <andythenorth> so should I re-do HEQS as trains?
21:56:06 <frosch123> andythenorth: yes, make them completely useless
21:56:06 <andythenorth> planes are harder
21:56:07 <Supercheese> Primary advantage of HEQS trams is they can go into city centers
21:56:12 <Supercheese> tracks over the roads
21:56:19 <Supercheese> no need to bulldoze half the town
21:56:25 <andythenorth> just station walk
21:56:32 <andythenorth> 30 tile spread, place one tile
21:56:38 <V453000> honestly rail ships are just for the visuals
21:56:41 <Supercheese> although not on my machine
21:56:50 <Supercheese> but some older machines might complain about 30 tile spreads
21:56:53 <V453000> and because I am famous for hating ships
21:57:17 <Eddi|zuHause> water flowing upwards!
21:57:21 <Supercheese> (clearly the plural for lighthouse)
21:57:28 <frosch123> water falls and black holes
21:57:37 <frosch123> (did i miss the topic?)
21:57:42 <V453000> I considered making slopes like not normal water, but nO
21:57:46 <andythenorth> frosch123: you are doing fine
21:57:47 <Supercheese> Underground rivers
21:58:23 <andythenorth> yeah, so who ever carries coal in a ferry in FISH?
21:58:53 <Supercheese> I carry all coal in barges
21:58:53 <V453000> aaaanyway, prepare for mayhem
21:59:20 <andythenorth> Squid is going to have more restrictive refits
21:59:30 <andythenorth> FISH was mostly 'carry anything, any ship'
21:59:34 <andythenorth> which is highly realistic
21:59:37 <Supercheese> that needs to be the same
21:59:46 <Supercheese> some ships autorefit 4 times to different cargoes
21:59:51 <Supercheese> as they run about
21:59:56 <andythenorth> yeah, that's nice :)
22:00:18 <andythenorth> no more bulk cargos in ferries
22:00:26 <Supercheese> Iron Ore -> Metal -> Goods -> Iron ore again
22:00:34 <andythenorth> that's ok, use a freight ship for that
22:00:39 <andythenorth> freight ships refit any freight
22:00:57 * Supercheese never uses passenger ships for freight
22:00:58 <andythenorth> ferries refit any pax / mail / express
22:01:00 <Supercheese> that would be silly
22:01:16 <andythenorth> I think ferries refit some farm cargos too
22:01:33 <Supercheese> I tend to use the Labrador Utility for farm cargos
22:02:03 <Supercheese> Farms only need 56t per 3 months for max prod
22:02:04 <andythenorth> Supercheese: it will be probly 16t or so now, maybe
22:04:01 <Zuu> V453000: A water-slug. Eg. a wave that travels through the canal.
22:04:18 <V453000> do you really think I would not include water slugs? :P
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22:45:40 <Prof_Frink> Supercheese: Nessie.
22:45:56 <Supercheese> I think Mr. NUTS has that planned
22:46:12 <Supercheese> "V453000 along with A ship, submarine, hovercraft, loch ness, and some other water animals, furballs,..."
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