IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2012-01-04
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00:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: michi_cc * r23749 /trunk/src/video/win32_v.cpp: -Fix: [Win32] Work around a possible deadlock when initialising threaded drawing.
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09:56:30 <Rubidium> such a big boy that he can't even wait more than a minute for a reply...
10:01:51 <peter1138> MNIM, zomg 90° turns
10:04:23 <appe_> MNIM: that is omgwtfpancake.
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13:48:33 <Hirundo> NewGRF specs state "Actions 6, 7, 9, B, C, D (except resource management sprites), 10 and 14 are valid before an action 8.
13:48:42 <Hirundo> Is that enforced in any way?
13:57:10 <frosch123> disabling grfs in the activation stage is one of the higher mysticisms of newgrfs :)
13:58:11 <frosch123> i would assume action1 and 2 do not matter for ottd either
13:58:38 <frosch123> but with action 0 and 3 being executed in activation stage when the grf is disabled later, might cause problems
14:00:09 <Remi_Woler> hmm, the latest nightly is a palindrome version :o
14:00:45 <Eddi|zuHause> why don't we have a party then?!?
14:01:09 <frosch123> we did not party on the recent fibonacci nightly either
14:01:27 <Hirundo> frosch123: I'm currently looking at unifying the filescan and safetyscan, so all newgrfs are scanned for safety at startup
14:01:28 <Remi_Woler> dev team doesn't know what fun is :/
14:01:44 <Eddi|zuHause> we did not party on a lot of recent revisions...
14:02:21 <Hirundo> All unsafe actions are basically invalid before action 8, which would make that slightly easier / faster
14:02:39 <Hirundo> (With one exception: writing >0x80 params in ActionD)
14:03:20 <frosch123> Remi_Woler: fun is, if you add 975 to the revision number :p
14:03:54 <Eddi|zuHause> Hirundo: i'd read that as a clarification of "except ressource management"
14:04:21 <frosch123> yes, i would also consider writing >=0x80 variables as invalid
14:04:41 <frosch123> basically it is about: a newgrf is active if its action8 has been processed in activation stage
14:05:02 <frosch123> so all disabling must happen before, and everything that defines some entity must happen after
14:05:31 <Remi_Woler> frosch123: not seeing the fun… 24707
14:06:07 <frosch123> exactly, why would you want to party r24707? there is nothing special about that number
14:06:10 <Eddi|zuHause> @openttd commit 1
14:06:10 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: Commit by truelight :: r1 / (202 files in 13 dirs) (2004-08-09 17:04:08 UTC)
14:06:11 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: Import of revision 975 of old (crashed) SVN
14:06:33 <Remi_Woler> ah! So that's why there's no party
14:06:44 <frosch123> well, maybe you have to add 974 though
14:07:18 <Remi_Woler> so the actual palindrome was 974 revs ago. Complicated :S
14:09:33 <Eddi|zuHause> worse. we're already 17 revisions beyond the nightly revision
14:10:56 <Remi_Woler> then stop committing! How are we supposed to have a party when y'all keep upping the rev counter?!
14:11:51 <frosch123> by committing the party-triggering revision during the party
14:14:11 <frosch123> Hirundo: technically you can of course put the forbidden actions at the start of the file, skip them using action 9 and later jump back to execute them after action 8 :p
14:15:06 <Hirundo> sounds almost as bad as changing action bytes with action 6...
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14:32:24 <Hirundo> Does the GUI filter framework allow multiple filters?
14:37:16 <frosch123> multiple filters, but only one at a time
14:43:20 <planetmaker> 15:15 Hirundo: sounds almost as bad as changing action bytes with action 6... <-- omg... !
14:43:37 * Hirundo needs more than one at a time (static/non-static, and tag/name)
14:43:58 <Hirundo> planetmaker: AFAIK the spec doesn't forbid it :-)
14:44:54 <planetmaker> yes, I don't know it either. It's just I didn't think of that madness before
14:50:33 <planetmaker> Remi_Woler: we've proven that we can party AND commit ;-)
14:52:00 <planetmaker> (or at least rb did)
14:55:55 <michi_cc> Hirundo: Make the tag/name filter also compare static/non-static with some appropriately set variable.
14:55:59 <Remi_Woler> planetmaker: pics or it didn't happen? :P
14:59:58 <frosch123> r20000 (new counting) was commited from inside a tent
15:03:20 <blathijs> That's where the greatest stuff gets conceived (Games, babies, etc.)
15:07:28 <Remi_Woler> frosch123: so planetmaker made a cake 74 revs too late?!
15:09:25 <frosch123> it was a "20k" cake, so the last 3 digits were dropped :p
15:09:45 <Remi_Woler> and this is how rounding bugs happen :o
15:10:49 <Eddi|zuHause> there were r20k pictures somewhere
15:11:01 <__ln__> nonsense, a cake is always precisely on time, the rest of reality can be either late or early.
15:11:05 <frosch123> only non-public ones :)
15:11:19 <planetmaker> well... there still are. But I didn't ask everyone whether I may publish them ;-)
15:11:46 <planetmaker> and I'm totally with __ln__ there ;-)
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16:29:24 * andythenorth spots a Godwin event
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16:30:30 <andythenorth> new cargo for FIRS: 'subjugated races'
16:30:37 <decoded> did some openttd AI achive consciousness and now threatens man kind with efficient cargo hauling?
16:38:22 <planetmaker> andythenorth: I'd rather suggest the anti-thesis: "happy people", like Alphas ... Epsilons
16:38:52 <andythenorth> anyway, the community has policed that idea away :P
16:39:06 <Aali> I'm looking forward to setting up my soylent green shipping empire
16:39:54 <andythenorth> I didn't find the 'segregated buses' suggestion that offensive
16:39:59 <andythenorth> but not offensive
16:42:24 <planetmaker> well. it's racist and certainly won't add to the game
16:42:44 <planetmaker> at least not more than tourists and normal passengers
16:42:51 <planetmaker> or if you want tourists and commuters
16:43:16 <Aali> all the passengers in ottd are white anyway
16:43:46 <andythenorth> definitely racist :P
16:45:51 <peter1138> what about newstats' passengers?
16:50:27 * andythenorth needs custom fields for industry
16:58:13 <Rubidium> so many reactions to a troll :(
16:59:25 <andythenorth> it was a well-executed troll
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17:08:18 <frosch123> let's make him a developer
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17:17:27 <andythenorth> compared to the typical suggestion...it was better explained, more interesting, and had more chance of being viable
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17:23:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i tried to answer, but there was no way it wouldn't be offensive and insensitive
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17:41:39 <Terkhen> let's remove all road vehicles from OpenTTD
17:42:15 <andythenorth> can you do that before I go any further on BANDIT?
17:42:16 <frosch123> there is already no civil traffic :)
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17:46:02 <Terkhen> andythenorth: no, I want just a bunch of completely empty roads
17:46:22 <andythenorth> Terkhen: newgrf to disable vehicles?
17:47:09 <Terkhen> hardcode "max road vehicle amount" to 0
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18:07:20 * Hirundo ponders NewGRFs that change grifd via a loading-stage-dependant action 6
18:09:01 <Yexo> during first scan (where grfid is read) action6 is not executed
18:09:27 <Yexo> after that in the loading stage the action6 is executed, but if at that point the grfid doesn't match the grfid from the scan stage the grf is disabled
18:11:48 <planetmaker> now, that surely would lead to evilgasms
18:11:53 <planetmaker> if it were possible
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18:16:47 <LordAro> interesting, my AI repo has broken mercurial :)
18:19:31 <Hirundo> Yexo: In GRFInfo the grfid is updated and a debug message is issued, but no disabling takes place
18:19:55 <Hirundo> Whether that is the Right Thing (tm) I'm not sure
18:22:33 <planetmaker> LordAro: how do you mean "has broken hg"?
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18:26:23 <TrueBrain> concratz LordAro :D
18:26:58 <LordAro> i must say, i'm surprised it exists in both 1.9.1 and 2.0.2
18:27:11 <LordAro> i mean, i would've thought it would've been fixed :)
18:28:43 <Terkhen> wow, you managed to crash hg with just "diff"
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18:34:22 <BUTTMUNCH> why is it that me and my friend timeout all the time
18:34:37 <BUTTMUNCH> when i create a server he times out, when he creates a server I timeout
18:34:56 <TrueBrain> start with a smaller game?
18:35:52 <BUTTMUNCH> hmm i guess i could try that
18:35:59 <Terkhen> either one of the computers is too slow for the game you are trying to run or you have network issues
18:36:00 <BUTTMUNCH> if that would be the case, that’d be really buttsy
18:36:17 <Elukka> i've usually played 1024x, sometimes even 2048x with a few people and it's worked fine
18:36:22 <BUTTMUNCH> it aint slow computers, it could be networking issues
18:37:26 <frosch123> wireless is said to cause trouble with ottd
18:37:35 <BUTTMUNCH> both wired connections
18:37:35 <BUTTMUNCH> but i n ever timeout on irc or anywhere else
18:38:07 <BUTTMUNCH> it looks like most disconnects happen during server saving the map
18:39:46 <peter1138> large maps cause stalls when autosaving on servers
18:40:47 <BUTTMUNCH> isn’t there a way to set autosaving to let’s say every (real life) hour
18:40:55 <BUTTMUNCH> and not game months
18:41:17 <Chris_Booth> BUTTMUNCH: you can work out how long a game day week or month is though
18:41:54 <Chris_Booth> so one month is ~60 ticks
18:41:57 <BUTTMUNCH> so you can put in an amount of ticks for saving?
18:42:22 <BUTTMUNCH> then i’m not folliwing you
18:42:25 <Chris_Booth> but you can work out how many ticks an hour is
18:42:42 <Chris_Booth> and work out which game auto save option is closest to that
18:43:00 <BUTTMUNCH> yearly is the longesdt
18:43:04 <BUTTMUNCH> and that’s too short
18:43:41 <Chris_Booth> or you can dissable it
18:43:56 <Elukka> large maps cause stalls yes but it's not supposed to drop players
18:43:58 <Chris_Booth> or write a patch that allows you to enter in ticks the amount of time you wish
18:44:46 <BUTTMUNCH> i see the message too, where i haven’t hada response (or whatever) for 5 seconds
18:45:08 <BUTTMUNCH> but whoever connects from the outside, gets that message for more than 10 seconds
18:45:16 <Elukka> you might try a vpn (tunngle is nice and works, hamachi is a piece of crap, dunno about others) and a LAN game through it
18:46:05 <Chris_Booth> Elukka: a standard internet connection limit the speed of a VPN
18:46:07 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: translators * r23750 /trunk/src/lang/ (9 files): (log message trimmed)
18:46:07 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:46:07 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: belarusian - 19 changes by Wowanxm
18:46:07 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: croatian - 19 changes by VoyagerOne
18:46:07 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: english_AU - 20 changes by tomas4g
18:46:08 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: italian - 20 changes by lorenzodv
18:46:08 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: lithuanian - 161 changes by BlinK_
18:46:26 <BUTTMUNCH> it’s not the speed really
18:46:26 <Chris_Booth> only way you can get better openttd is buy a beasty CPU
18:46:28 <Elukka> yes but it's not necessarily raw speed that's the issue
18:46:36 <BUTTMUNCH> the connection between me and him are 25mbit
18:46:39 <BUTTMUNCH> since my upload is 25mbit
18:46:43 <BUTTMUNCH> and my download is 120mbit
18:46:54 <Elukka> it's unlikely his games are dropping players because their computers or connections are too slow
18:46:57 <Elukka> it's probably just some hickup
18:47:35 <Elukka> way you work tunngle is you join some room (doesn't matter which one), then make a LAN game and the other players should see it
18:47:44 <Elukka> assuming they're in the same room
18:47:53 <Elukka> works fine for playing with friends but has obvious issues for public servers
18:48:47 <Elukka> in my experience, it usually bypasses annoying indeterminate connection issues
18:48:57 <BUTTMUNCH> thanks for the tip, i will try that right away
18:49:02 <BUTTMUNCH> and yes, this is just a 2 player game we’re running here
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18:49:43 <BUTTMUNCH> i actually put my cpu to stock because i wondered maybe my overclock was the case, buti t wasn’t
18:49:50 <BUTTMUNCH> i’m running a Q9550 @ 4.4ghz
18:50:17 <Solshine> Hi. I'm trying to get all the required parts for me to be able to run AdmiralAI on openttd (ubuntu). I can't get internet on the target machine so I have to gather all the files on this machine.
18:50:28 <Solshine> Where could I find the required libraries?
18:51:03 <Eddi|zuHause> evil thought: grf action "hide this grf from <other grf>"
18:51:56 <Solshine> Nevermind, found the bananas.
18:51:57 <planetmaker> no. That'd only complicate matters.
18:52:25 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it would solve an issue with my hacked alpine
18:52:47 <Eddi|zuHause> it must be detected by dbsetxl, but may not be detected by firs
18:53:10 <Eddi|zuHause> currently i must additionally hack firs to not check for alpine
18:54:14 <Solshine> I think I'm set. Thank you.
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19:11:40 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: hack your alpine climate enough so it becomes static
19:11:48 <planetmaker> or... use ogfx+landscape
19:12:02 <planetmaker> or just any other similar newgrf
19:12:20 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: can't be static, because then dbset can't detect it
19:12:22 <planetmaker> or hack your firs
19:12:26 <planetmaker> that is even allowed
19:12:43 <planetmaker> as you don't play MP that's of no issue to you either
19:13:05 <Eddi|zuHause> dbset will only activate in arctic climate if it detects the grf-id of alpine
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19:13:45 <planetmaker> simplest solution would be to rather hack dbset, eh?
19:14:43 <planetmaker> as it's there where the insufficiency is present
19:15:10 <Eddi|zuHause> the idea is to "hack" as few grfs as possible
19:17:35 <planetmaker> that's one: dbset
19:17:46 <planetmaker> and that's hacking at the root of the problem, too
19:18:18 <Eddi|zuHause> no, alpine is the root of the problem
19:18:23 <planetmaker> and solves more issues, like when you want tropical climate or arctic w/o alpine.
19:18:46 <planetmaker> no, the grfcheck for alpine's presence obviously ;-)
19:19:10 <Eddi|zuHause> that is no problem. that is a deliberate choice of the author
19:19:50 <Eddi|zuHause> there is no reason to change that
19:20:01 <planetmaker> then there's no reason to change anything
19:20:06 <planetmaker> least in the other newgrfs
19:20:33 <Eddi|zuHause> the "problem" is that firs cannot distinguish between the original incompatible alpine and my hacked compatible alpine
19:20:37 <planetmaker> as that's also the choice of their authors
19:21:00 <Eddi|zuHause> since i "fixed" alpine, i could tell it to tell firs that it's now compatible
19:21:03 <planetmaker> see: you need to change dbset to search for another alpine climate ID
19:21:25 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: or just remove the alpine check in FIRS :P
19:21:31 <planetmaker> nope it can't - unless you give alpine a action14 version. Which is stupid to check for unless that's official
19:22:21 <planetmaker> and the statement of "least hacks" clearly wants the check removed at the root: dbset
19:32:12 <andythenorth> so how do I determine whether my blitter is 8bpp or 32bpp?
19:32:56 <planetmaker> on osx it's most likely 32bpp-anim
19:33:11 <planetmaker> unless you changed it
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19:34:15 <andythenorth> I have blitter = ""
19:34:33 <andythenorth> and I'm using trunk ~tip
19:35:05 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: well, i don't share your view there... but i'm not feeling like repeating the argument again
19:35:30 <andythenorth> should I explicitly force my blitter to 32bpp-anim ?
19:35:49 <planetmaker> andythenorth: then you use 32bpp-anim (osx) or 8bpp-optimized (otherwise)
19:36:03 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: usually there is no reason to change the default, unless you have an actual problem
19:36:04 <andythenorth> ok, that means I have 32bpp-anim
19:36:41 <andythenorth> that means it's useful for me to watch out for 32bpp bugs?
19:37:04 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: no need to repeat; the argument imho is flawed.
19:37:22 <planetmaker> aka solving symptoms than causes
19:37:54 <andythenorth> *why* does DBSet need a specific, hacky, climate + industries + houses grf?
19:38:09 <andythenorth> and why isn't DBSet it GPL?
19:38:12 <peter1138> need to replace a dead disk
19:38:21 <andythenorth> waste of time replacing a live one ;)
19:38:23 <peter1138> but i rebooted the machine and it says both work :S
19:38:57 <peter1138> can't remember which one was showing as dead
19:39:50 <andythenorth> TrueBrain: is there a FS for the "crashed vehicles aren't monotone" bug?
19:40:43 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: the people who can fix it, know :P
19:40:45 <TrueBrain> and even have a patch
19:40:48 <TrueBrain> they are just too scared to commit :D
19:40:50 <andythenorth> I can't replicate the issue anyway
19:40:55 * peter1138 tries writing lots of data to trigger it
19:41:21 <Eddi|zuHause> dbset is some CC-BY-ND-simile
19:41:31 <andythenorth> should be banned
19:42:02 <Eddi|zuHause> but it's actually older than CC, so it's some custom license
19:42:50 <Eddi|zuHause> why should the license be changed?
19:43:02 <peter1138> gah, writing 1GB file didn't blow it up :S
19:43:19 * TrueBrain gives peter1138 C4 :D
19:43:30 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: smartctl -a?
19:43:41 <peter1138> but it's on a cpq array
19:43:50 <peter1138> so smartctl probably isn't useful
19:43:58 <andythenorth> everything-GPL = easier
19:44:00 <peter1138> which is probably why it's not installed
19:45:03 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i don't think forcing a control freak like MB to use gpl is the right thing
19:45:05 <peter1138> i kinda hate hardware raid :S
19:45:57 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: but working around other people's control issues isn't either
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19:46:48 <TrueBrain> peter1138: just pull a random one out, and see if the machine still runs!
19:49:07 <peter1138> it will, they both work
19:49:17 <peter1138> but presumably one will hit a write error at some point
19:50:43 <peter1138> hence why i'm trying to fill the disk
19:59:55 <Remi_Woler> TrueBrain: btw: the 5=6 patch worked perfectly :)
20:00:21 <TrueBrain> small bugs, huge crashes :)
20:00:47 <TrueBrain> I just realised I never really tried the patch; just assumed it would fix it
20:00:50 <TrueBrain> that is not good ..
20:01:06 <TrueBrain> owh well, happy to know I did get it right :P
20:01:11 <Remi_Woler> I tested it, worked fine. Already played 6 games with the current nightly
20:01:24 <TrueBrain> you have a lot of time on your hands :P
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20:02:15 <Remi_Woler> not the full 100 years. Usually start in 2034, enough to have the AI go crazy so I can see the effects with a gamescript
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20:09:30 <LordAro> hmmm... why have upgrade/close airport patches never been included in trunk?
20:18:12 <peter1138> bloody thing still didn't error :(
20:19:06 * Remi_Woler hands peter1138 a screwdriver. That should fix things
20:20:02 <andythenorth> peter1138: it's ok, all your data is gone on 21/12/12 apparently
20:20:06 <andythenorth> according to idiots anyway
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20:27:25 <Zuu> LordAro: I guess someone would need to put in time and effort to review those patches.
20:28:00 <LordAro> well, obviously, but why haven't they done so? :D
20:28:09 <Zuu> Now that we got GS, one could implement at least CloseAirport as a GS that you enable by eg. renaming your airport station.
20:28:11 * peter1138 tries reading the whole disk
20:28:38 * andythenorth is having not-coding fail :|
20:28:55 <Eddi|zuHause> LordAro: have you tried reading the threads discussing them?
20:29:08 <Zuu> LordAro: Well, the thing is that anyone, also non-devs could put time into reviewing the patch.
20:29:18 <Eddi|zuHause> LordAro: in all likelyhood, the reasons will be in there
20:30:04 <Remi_Woler> I'll be happy to review them. But I'll reject them if they don't have enough pretty colors
20:31:55 <Zuu> I think one issue that has been mentioned is that the patch improves aircraft as transport mode. And we get all sorts of suggestions on how to make aircraft harder.
20:33:15 <FLHerne> (newish IRC user) How do you enter messages in the format " * | [username]...."?
20:33:19 <Zuu> Though, if closing of airports is implemented already, doing it for the other transport modes I guess is not harder than airports.
20:33:28 <Remi_Woler> FLHerne: /me your message here
20:33:33 <Eddi|zuHause> aircraft are horribly inefficient...
20:33:38 * LordAro think you start with '/me'
20:33:43 <Remi_Woler> FLHerne: the / has to be the first thing on the line
20:34:18 <encoded> i wish openttd responded to alt+f4
20:34:38 <Eddi|zuHause> encoded: hotkeys.conf
20:35:00 <LordAro> openttd responds to alt+f4 to me
20:35:40 <Zuu> But I would think that alt+f4 would be detected by windows that send a close event to OpenTTD.
20:36:11 <Eddi|zuHause> i do think it did respond to that on linux as well
20:36:27 <Rubidium> Zuu: that russian transportgoals translation seems to be utf8
20:36:51 <Zuu> Then the issue is on my side
20:37:02 <Zuu> I'll see what OpenTTD have to say about the file then. :-)
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20:48:27 <frosch123> Zuu: the russian transport goals translation is valid utf8
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21:05:51 <LordAro> I would like to congratulate Truebrain wrt NoGo. Very nice :)
21:06:31 <LordAro> also Zuu: re CityDomination: apparently i have to get a town's population from 170 -> 5000? :P
21:07:06 <Tom__> On the wiki for installing on a mac it says, "download the osx OpenTTD installer from the website" but I can't find any installer, sorry to be a bother
21:07:50 <LordAro> Zuu: edit: oh, _all_ towns to 5000, that was easy :)
21:10:02 <Rubidium> Tom__: I guess someone copied the Windows manual or so; there isn't an Mac OSX instaler (nor has there ever been one)
21:11:19 <Zuu> I haven't actually played with CityDomination lately. Only tested it at version 2 or so.
21:11:38 <Tom__> Rubidium: Cheers, I am a total noob and cant seem to add the OpenGFX textures
21:12:34 <LordAro> Zuu: well, it seems to be working good :D
21:12:45 <Rubidium> Tom__: too bad the OSX version doesn't have support for downloading that upon the first start then (Linux and Windows do have support for that in 1.2.0) :(
21:14:59 <FLHerne> It seems that OTTD is more responsive over a high-latency, 2Mb/s connection than on my computer...
21:15:23 <FLHerne> When SSHing into a reasonably quick one I mean
21:21:39 <LordAro> i must say, it would be clearer if the new tab 'general information' actually told us that they were for goals
21:22:16 <andythenorth> Tom__: just download the zip and install it
21:22:29 <andythenorth> or you have openttd already?
21:23:10 * andythenorth thinks mac users are parasites :P
21:24:50 <Rubidium> because they keep bugging the bug tracker without ever getting rid of them ;)
21:25:14 <andythenorth> because they won't contribute to maintaining the app, but are happy to use it
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21:28:45 <Rubidium> also macs are for artisty people, right? So why are there so few "contributions" of useably 32bpp OpenTTD graphics from them? ;)
21:30:03 <andythenorth> roll out the stereotypes why not :P
21:30:15 <FLHerne> They are? I'm not very arty, and I've got 7, including the one I'm using :P
21:30:16 <andythenorth> *no* serious CGI artist uses a mac
21:30:23 <andythenorth> macs are crap for CGI
21:30:39 <Rubidium> but... only on Macs the colours are right!
21:31:43 <FLHerne> If 'right' is 'different from anyone else', maybe...
21:32:55 <Rubidium> andythenorth: that was the reason why so many used photoshop on the mac, wasn't it?
21:33:08 <andythenorth> once upon a time yes
21:33:18 <FLHerne> That seems to be Apple's attitude on connectors, processors, expansion slots, partition types...
21:33:31 <andythenorth> Rubidium: I think that's somewhat historical :P
21:33:46 <Rubidium> yeah, but I like raisins
21:35:31 <FLHerne> I hate single-button ADB mice, but I do like raisins! Did I miss an injoke or something?
21:36:04 <andythenorth> Rubidium: have you ever considered dropping mac support?
21:37:00 <Rubidium> I've actually done it
21:37:47 <LordAro_> andy deleted it from his memories ;)
21:43:05 <peter1138> we did. for ages :p
21:43:21 <peter1138> i don't think i was around when it was reinstated
21:45:53 <Rubidium> I guess we could pull it ;)
21:45:57 <Elukka> holy crap some private operator that still has V200's hasn't painted it in an awful color scheme
21:49:07 <FLHerne> Reminds me of DP1 for some reason
21:49:30 <Elukka> they're some of my favorite locomotives
21:49:32 <Elukka> the warship was based on them
21:50:33 <FLHerne> That pic's about 4x the size of my screen
21:50:50 <FLHerne> And my browser can't zoom webpages :-(
21:51:31 <LordAro_> get a better browser then ;)
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21:52:16 <FLHerne> Yes, but I can't find one with better functionality that runs reasonably
21:52:46 <FLHerne> Firefox is better, but takes 10 minutes to start
21:53:17 <LordAro> its got much better recently
21:53:44 <LordAro> (i use chrome by preference)
21:54:03 <FLHerne> Yes, but FF > 3 and Chrome don't support PowerPC
21:54:28 <LordAro> get a better computer then ;)
21:54:38 <planetmaker> no newer FF for osx 10.5?
21:54:51 <FLHerne> But I like my little 1400 :P
21:55:37 <FLHerne> 10.5 would be rather slow I think
21:56:01 <FLHerne> This thing came with 8.6
21:57:18 <Rubidium> firefox seems to build fine on Debian for PowerPC
21:58:27 <FLHerne> Still probably too slow...I know recent versions are getting better, but FF 1 uses 120% of physical RAM
21:58:50 <FLHerne> Doesn't zoom pages either
21:58:51 <andythenorth> vnc to another box :P
21:59:00 <FLHerne> Or show images for that matter
21:59:57 <FLHerne> Dillo does most things OK, the wireless on this is a bit slow for UI over the network
22:01:26 <FLHerne> Moving back towards topic, why does a V200 have tose big windows in the side?
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22:03:29 <Mazur> Oh, dear, the map at stable has been made wit 10x running costs or so for trains. Anyone know how we can fix that?
22:03:48 <Elukka> no idea about the windows
22:04:13 <Mazur> planetmaker, you still around?
22:08:46 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r23751 /trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: rename NetworkUDPGameLoop to a more descriptive name, and move the UDP specific bits to network_udp
22:11:28 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r23752 /trunk/src/network/network_udp.cpp: -Fix [FS#4938]: missing locking causing crash is extreme case when being in the MP lobby
22:13:17 <appe_> how can i tell when i go bancrupt?
22:13:45 <frosch123> when there is a news item about your company being in trouble
22:14:01 <appe_> ah, i cant tell by the bank balance?
22:14:20 <frosch123> well, when you have no money for some months
22:14:38 <appe_> i was thinking about the numbers behind it :)
22:15:41 <Rubidium> 4 (or 3?) consecutive begins of quarters with a negative bank balance
22:16:08 <frosch123> yeah, it only matters on 1st jan/apr/jul/okt
22:16:17 <appe_> does it ignore the loan?
22:16:28 <frosch123> loan does not matter
22:16:57 <appe_> so i can loan myself up from a bancruptcy?
22:22:45 <Rubidium> doesn't a loan have a chance of being repaid?
22:25:00 <frosch123> would you lend some random dude 300k to build a railroad network?
22:26:36 <Rubidium> then I'd statistically have a chance of getting my money back
22:26:45 <Elukka> doesn't a loan have a chance of being repaid?
22:27:14 <Rubidium> Elukka: they're repaying their loan by loaning more
22:27:49 <frosch123> just don't be the one loaning last
22:28:27 <Rubidium> you mean lending, right?
22:35:09 <appe_> that bancrupcy thing didnt work
22:35:15 <appe_> went bancrupt even when on + :(
22:36:42 <frosch123> you are charged loan interest on every quarter
22:37:07 <appe_> thus, ill keep myself 10-12.000+
22:46:53 <BUTTMUNCH> timeouts were caused due to autosave indeed
22:47:00 <BUTTMUNCH> now we gotta not forget to save
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