IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2010-05-16
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00:05:54 <Nite_Owl> That is if you are leaving for the night - otherwise Hello Ammler
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00:33:28 <switchgirl> i have just realised i spent the last week not eating and i drank water like 5 times :s - so adicted to the game
00:33:48 <Nite_Owl> it can do that to you
00:33:58 <PeterT> switchgirl: try to control yourself
00:34:19 <switchgirl> i'm a woman i'm superb at control :D
00:35:45 <Nite_Owl> wait until you learn the real intricacies of the game and then see how all consuming it can be
00:36:37 <switchgirl> Nite_Owl, just wondering about train signals
00:36:55 <PeterT> which ones, switchgirl
00:37:18 <switchgirl> i want to have a main line and have other trains using the same stations etc
00:38:13 <Nite_Owl> there are two types of signals - basic block signals and path signals
00:38:46 <Sacro> i've done 32 hours solid
00:39:09 <Sacro> openttd, on Brianetta's server
00:39:26 <PeterT> you've played 32 hours straight on Brianetta's server?
00:39:27 <switchgirl> Sacro, I started hallucinations
00:39:54 <Nite_Owl> path signals are generally easier to use but harder to understand while block signals are just the opposite
00:40:12 <Sacro> and lots of insanely designed junctions
00:40:27 <PeterT> Sacro: brianetta doesn't have a server up atm
00:41:05 <Nite_Owl> switchgirl: did you read the wiki article on signals ??
00:41:25 <Sacro> PeterT: Yes I know :( I was an admin for a while
00:41:34 <Sacro> I miss his standard, his nightly, his deathmatch
00:42:00 <switchgirl> Nite_Owl, yeah i still don't get it
00:42:19 <Sacro> switchgirl: what's your issue?
00:43:16 <Nite_Owl> is also good but is not for OTTD but can still be applied
00:43:57 <Nite_Owl> there are also a lot of signaling threads on the forums
00:45:41 <Nite_Owl> for block signals the only two you really have to worry about are entry and exit signals which do what their names suggest
00:47:40 <Nite_Owl> incoming track -> entry signal -> track splits into station -> exit signals on each track (two way if it is a terminus station)
00:48:05 <switchgirl> yellow white yellow?
00:48:51 <Sacro> ooh, not used presigs in ages
00:48:54 <Nite_Owl> entry are yellow across the upright\
00:49:55 <Nite_Owl> exit are white while combo are yellow
00:50:24 <Nite_Owl> up and down on both - no 'T' shape
00:51:47 <Nite_Owl> path signals are either two way (no bars at all) or one way (look like entry block signals but with two lights)
00:53:44 <Nite_Owl> so to use your earlier example with block signals it would be: yellow (T shaped) -> white
00:55:36 <Sacro> switchgirl: path signals are much easier
00:58:57 <Nite_Owl> Terminus station with path signals: incoming track -> one way path signal -> track splits -> two way path signals at the edge of the station facing in to the station
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01:15:01 <Nite_Owl> I guess switchgirl got the point
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04:58:34 <z-MaTRiX> sálálá in the morning
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06:22:18 * Alberth gets really tired of all those 'can someone compile this patch for me?' requests
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06:50:46 * andythenorth wonders where to get the dos pallete :P
07:41:35 <switchgirl> aka didyou sleep well
07:42:36 <switchgirl> i just made a coal train 100 carrages long
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07:51:18 * planetmaker wonders why adding a "NWidget(NWID_SPACER), SetMinimalSize(0, 4)," crashes the window...
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07:52:20 <Yexo> did you add that within a horizontal container?
07:52:52 <planetmaker> I added it withing a WWT_TAB - which is a re-coloured WWT_INSET
07:53:17 <planetmaker> it's not the first nor the last within that container
07:55:13 <planetmaker> But somewhere further levels up in the nesting there's also a WWT_HORIZONTAL
07:56:11 <Yexo> it really was just a stab in the dark, even adding it in a horizontal container shouldn't be a problem
07:57:57 <planetmaker> I fear I can't provide a small patch to show it...
07:58:07 <planetmaker> The new game window got kinda big ;-)
07:58:15 <Alberth> there is something else wrong, I think
07:58:57 <Alberth> you assume resizing capabilities?
07:59:10 <Alberth> then you need SetResize() there as well
07:59:25 <planetmaker> Hm... no problem, when I also add SetResize(1, 1)
07:59:35 <planetmaker> so, yes, I assume that, I guess
08:02:27 <Alberth> lots of code use "click_pos / this->resize.step_height" to compute a line in a panel/matrix (ie it uses the vertical resize step of the window). If you miss a resize capability somewhere however, the window cannot resize, and this->resize.step_height == 0 => crash when clicking
08:03:09 <Alberth> of course the core dump tells you exactly where it breaks :)
08:03:16 <planetmaker> well, actually even upon call of the window, but I guess that's the same
08:03:27 <planetmaker> Message: Assertion failed at line 807 of /Users/ingo/ottd/gui/src/widgets/../window_gui.h: nwid != NULL
08:03:33 <planetmaker> which is peculiar
08:03:47 <planetmaker> as it hints that a widget is used but not defined
08:04:07 <Alberth> or has the wrong class
08:04:17 <planetmaker> ah, yes, that again :-)
08:04:31 <Alberth> you only use GetWidget<>() after finishing initialization?
08:05:13 <Alberth> hmm, that is not the problem here, most likely.
08:05:22 <planetmaker> it's only used in OnPaint()
08:05:42 <Alberth> you could print the number getting retrieved, and check whether you use that widget consistently
08:05:58 <Alberth> OnPaint() should be fine
08:06:22 <Alberth> although you should have exactly one line in OnPaint() :p
08:07:34 <Alberth> this->DrawWidgets(); should be in OnPaint(), which walks through the tree to render the widgets.
08:07:58 <Alberth> virtual void DrawWidget(const Rect &r, int widget) const gets called then for custom renderings
08:07:59 <planetmaker> The rest should be in OnClick and others
08:08:22 <planetmaker> Also like SetWidgetLoweredState and alike?
08:08:42 <planetmaker> or Disabled which depend upon certain values?
08:09:13 <Alberth> usually these values change under your control, so you can update the widgets when the values change
08:09:34 <planetmaker> Well, upon initialization they're read from the config
08:09:35 <Alberth> often such widget update code is moved to OnInvalidateData()
08:10:31 <Alberth> this->OnInvalidateData() in the constructor ?
08:11:01 <planetmaker> under which conditions is that proc called?
08:11:20 <Alberth> point is that you are wasting CPU time by setting widget states with every paint if they never change without you knowing
08:11:26 <planetmaker> or do I have to call it manually in the OnClick()
08:11:33 <Alberth> when you call the method :)
08:11:45 <planetmaker> Then it's useful to use that
08:11:53 <planetmaker> Currently the NewGame window doesn't
08:12:32 <Alberth> OnInvalidateData is also accessible from outside by some Invalidate function, useful for inter-window communication
08:13:27 <Alberth> if you don't want that, make your own Update method
08:14:17 <planetmaker> Sounds useful :-)
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08:15:47 <planetmaker> But I still need a boolean or so for the SaveLoadDialogue
08:16:09 <planetmaker> Or some feedback whether a valid filename was selected :-)
08:17:02 <andythenorth> Terkhen: would you mind pulling FIRS and telling me if any of the new mini-map industry colours cause you problems?
08:23:49 <Terkhen> andythenorth: not on dark green
08:24:47 <Alberth> planetmaker: extend the SaveLoadDialogue (misc_gui.cpp, around lines 1901 and 1908) with calls to your window with void InvalidateWindowData(WindowClass cls, WindowNumber number, int data) function.
08:25:34 <Alberth> however, I don't know exactly where that dialogue is used, so better check its usage first
08:25:47 <planetmaker> hm, sounds useful
08:27:02 <planetmaker> but I'm not quite sure yet what data are accessible from the outside... The file name seems to be handled by some obscure mechanism currently
08:27:11 <Terkhen> andythenorth: the steel mill and the paper mill seem to have the same colour
08:27:17 <Alberth> I can also imagine that the saveload dialogue gets a pointer to some shared data in the parent instead of the global _file_to_saveload :)
08:27:24 <planetmaker> but currently there's no need to distinguish whether one was selected or not either...
08:27:24 <Terkhen> besides that I think they are fine
08:27:36 <planetmaker> Alberth: yes, that variable, exactly
08:27:43 <andythenorth> I'm trying to stick to original map colours for original industries
08:27:51 <andythenorth> but I'm sure there's an exception here
08:28:28 <planetmaker> the dialogue has only a mode as parameter which tells it what to save/load
08:29:26 <Alberth> so somewhere that data is read and initialized, near those points you should be able to find how the communication is done
08:29:57 <Alberth> I would not be surprised if your window does not fit in the current use.
08:31:20 <planetmaker> well... yes and no
08:31:36 <planetmaker> But it was not quite designed to be used like that is my feeling
08:33:30 <planetmaker> I'll have to dive in that more :-)
08:33:41 <Alberth> the whole system is pretty much state-less with respect to the gui, that is, the system does not care whether a window happens to be open or not. Only when the user does something interesting, it gets an event.
08:34:40 <planetmaker> which makes kinda sense
08:34:41 <Alberth> that makes windows quite independent of each other, and of the simulation
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08:35:09 <planetmaker> hm... but that means I could get the event "file selected"
08:35:31 <planetmaker> or use the handling of that event in order to cross-communicate this event to the newgame window
08:36:17 <Alberth> well, apparently, the event is currently communicated by writing in some location.
08:36:43 <Alberth> I have no idea how it is picked up by the simulation.
08:40:59 <Alberth> ARGH why can you not initialize a static const data member in a class by simple assignment as in "static const int v = 3;"
08:42:51 <peter1138> because it has to be annoying
08:43:23 <peter1138> assigning it outside the class is ... obvious, right?
08:43:34 <peter1138> must've made sense to somebody
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08:50:56 <Alberth> Annotated C++ reference manual: "..The problem is that class declarations typically appear in header files, so a declaration like the one above will be seen by a compiler many times. ... Especially when dealing with general initializers, it is important that there is exactly one definition of an object in the program Allowing examples like the ones above would complicate separate compilation."
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09:31:27 <Weeknie> Everybody, make Wolf01 feel special, say hi to him!:D
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12:09:37 <Wasila> What's OwenS's username on the forums?
12:10:02 <Wasila> about 32bpp compatibility
12:10:23 <Wasila> " So long as I have any pull, I will never allow separate tars for EZ and SZ. The player experience is just too dismal if we go that way again. I will look at the autocompiler script today and hopefully tomorrow's builds will be compiling without suffixes for z2 sprites. Jupix"
12:11:06 <OwenS> We will no longer get people wandering in here every few days wondering why their 32-bpp sprites don't work
12:11:19 <Wasila> It hasn't been done yet though
12:11:48 <Wasila> Owen, what packs do people tend to use? The automated one or the one on the forums?
12:12:40 <OwenS> Wasila: I don't know. I just know that it doesn't work and they come here confused
12:14:26 <Alberth> Wasila: look at the pack threads to see how many people write posts
12:15:35 <Wasila> complaining about incompatibility?
12:16:08 <Alberth> (02:14:04 PM) Wasila: Owen, what packs do people tend to use? <-- I was trying to answer this question
12:16:41 * andythenorth blew up the game
12:16:55 <Wasila> I think it would be the manual one
12:16:58 <Wasila> since it's so much smaller
12:17:08 <Wasila> andythenorth! I'm insulted!
12:17:17 <Wasila> It has a lot more files
12:17:22 <Wasila> Just download it and check it out
12:17:35 <planetmaker> Wasila, you err with the file and the sprite count
12:18:06 <planetmaker> I'd bet there's WAY less 32bpp sprites than 8bpp
12:18:16 <planetmaker> Even if you only count base sprites and dismiss newgrfs
12:18:27 <Wasila> I'm saying that the pack on the forums is larger than Jupix's automated one
12:18:52 <planetmaker> yes, and most probable the forum one is bound to fail
12:19:02 <Wasila> It's a temporary solution
12:19:19 <Wasila> And if we can get the automated one to be compatible with trunk
12:19:53 <Wasila> We were discussing how to make the 32bpp regular zoom graphics compatible
12:19:59 <Wasila> the z2 sprites in the repository
12:20:08 <Wasila> so that you can use them with trunk
12:20:32 <Wasila> See! All you had to do was ask :P
12:23:16 <planetmaker> <Wasila> 32bpp is epic!
12:23:16 <planetmaker> <Wasila> I mean bigger <-- and my initial statement referred to that - and holds still true
12:23:49 <Wasila> When I said 'I mean bigger;
12:23:52 <PeterT> <Wasila> Anyone here <--
12:23:54 <DorpsGek> PeterT: Don't ask to ask, just ask
12:24:05 <Wasila> I was referring to when I had said the manual pack was smaller
12:24:29 <planetmaker> that context was not quite clear then
12:24:37 <planetmaker> anyway, it's sorted
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12:27:32 <Wasila> planetmaker: didn't you help organise the OpenGFX project>
12:28:14 <Wasila> Are the graphics still being improved?
12:29:21 <planetmaker> I just release the very same thing every now and then with an up'ed version number
12:30:06 <Wasila> We could use a hand over at 32bpp
12:30:09 <Ammler> pm is a release junkie
12:30:23 <planetmaker> I don't have time for that, Wasila
12:30:51 <planetmaker> Or I'd need to make clones
12:30:58 <Wasila> That'd be a good idea!
12:31:07 <Ammler> jupix does a good job there, imo
12:31:19 <Wasila> I suppose the organisational area is not where we're lacking
12:31:32 <Wasila> But we could do with a more inspiring figure
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12:32:33 <Wasila> Was that what you were doing?
12:32:38 <Wasila> Forcing the artists to get on with it
12:32:42 <Sacro> switchgirl: ctrl+alt+c iirc
12:32:42 <planetmaker> but I think indeed that maquinista and Jupix are doing a decent job
12:32:53 <planetmaker> You cannot force anyone
12:33:09 <planetmaker> What you can do is be quick with coding.
12:33:12 <planetmaker> Showing what you coded
12:33:18 <planetmaker> Making it decently available
12:33:18 <andythenorth> it's funny, in 8bpp newgrf-land, 'organisers' outnumber 'artists' by about 10:1....
12:33:33 <andythenorth> ....and artists:coders is also about 10:1
12:33:43 <Wasila> Yet the work gets done
12:33:52 <andythenorth> hmm....so organisers:coders is about 100:1 :P
12:33:59 <planetmaker> andythenorth, the latter number is certainly right. The first... yeah... 1:1 is also already a lot :-)
12:34:02 <Wasila> Something wrong there :P
12:34:17 <Wasila> I don't think coding is a real problem
12:34:18 <planetmaker> as there are little organizers needed ;-)
12:34:29 <Wasila> We've got most of the work coded already
12:34:47 <planetmaker> then why does nearly no 32bpp work with trunk? ;-)
12:35:09 <Wasila> Because of the _z2 taggedo n at thend
12:35:14 <Wasila> doesn't work with trunk
12:35:17 <Wasila> that's something being dealt with
12:35:21 <Ammler> or at least support both
12:35:35 <Wasila> Hopefully the automated build will be compatible as of tonight
12:35:59 <Wasila> Perhaps if it was compatible more artists would be willing to help out
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12:36:40 <planetmaker> I won't install the patch just to look at graphics ingame
12:37:29 <Wasila> That's the automated build
12:37:54 <Wasila> It should come out around six tonight GMT
12:37:58 <Wasila> that should be compatible
12:38:54 <planetmaker> When it works, when it's available: make a posting in tt-forums in the appropriate thread. Show two screenies and link directly the download
12:39:24 * andythenorth browses 32bpp forum
12:40:17 <Wasila> Maybe we should upload it to the Automated Content System too
12:40:25 <andythenorth> 32bpp is cute....especially when the models are more toylike
12:40:36 <andythenorth> it lacks a certain nostalgia for me though :)
12:41:38 <Wasila> Well you can always go back
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12:41:45 <Wasila> The problem is that there are no standards to
12:41:53 <Wasila> So it's not really a 'set' yet
12:42:07 <andythenorth> the best sets have one or two people with a vision of what they want...
12:42:30 <Wasila> Unfortunately I don't know the numbers
12:42:57 <Wasila> I mean, I don't know the details of how sprites work
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12:45:05 <planetmaker> Wasila, most importantly it doesn't fit any bananas category
12:45:28 <planetmaker> it's not a base set
12:45:43 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: Yexo was last seen in #openttd 4 hours, 49 minutes, and 31 seconds ago: <Yexo> it really was just a stab in the dark, even adding it in a horizontal container shouldn't be a problem
12:45:59 <planetmaker> Weeknie, ask. Don't ask if someone's here... it's annoying
12:46:20 <Yexo> but what planetmaker says, if you want to ask me something just be sure to highlight me and I'll answer when i see it
12:46:28 <andythenorth> if you can auto-complete the nick, they're probably here....
12:46:34 <glx> unless he's not in the list :)
12:46:44 <Weeknie> glx, I figured that much, thank you:p
12:46:49 <planetmaker> but that's obvious then ;-)
12:46:55 <andythenorth> what was the question?
12:47:04 <planetmaker> and people who're here will read it later, if you highlight the line with the question
12:47:23 <planetmaker> andythenorth, "how can I ask a question" :-P
12:47:54 <Weeknie> I mean, is this how I should be writing it or what am I missing here?
12:48:03 <Yexo> I suggest you try some other nfo first, a small vehicle grf or something like that
12:48:05 <Zuu> Weeknie: You probably need to get some basic NewGRF undestanding first.
12:48:36 <Yexo> airport nfo makes very heavy use of advanced varaction2, which is one of the hardest parts of nfo to understand
12:48:49 <planetmaker> Basic newgrf understanding will help indeed much
12:49:27 <Weeknie> But tbh, form what I'm seeing here (reading the comments), it doesn't look like I'll be able to do what I want to with the statemachine:P
12:49:35 <Weeknie> Oh well, let's start with the other stuff first
12:50:10 <Yexo> what do you want to do with the statemachine?
12:50:59 <Weeknie> I described it in my own topic, planetmaker reacted to that, lemme get the link
12:53:00 <Yexo> it's a fair bit of work, but it's possible to implement that
12:53:18 <Weeknie> I know it probs would be
12:53:25 <Weeknie> But would it be possible with one of those nfo's?
12:54:06 <Yexo> yes, that is what I ment
12:56:04 <Weeknie> I guess I'll start by reading up on those nfo's
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13:13:46 <Jupix> what's the correct (legacy) naming scheme for z2 32bpp mask sprites? xxxxm.png?
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13:28:06 <Weeknie> grf wizard works just as well for openTTD as it does for TTDPatch right?
13:29:05 <Ammler> why should you use grf wizard for openttd?
13:29:09 <Alberth> the NewGRF format is the same for both programs, yes
13:29:32 <Weeknie> Ammler, what else would I use
13:29:51 <Ammler> I would use it for (new)grfs
13:30:06 <Weeknie> Oh sigh, not now please...
13:30:21 <Weeknie> I'm trying to understand this stuff, don't need people whining about my grammer right now:P
13:31:23 <Weeknie> Or was your question geniune?:P
13:31:41 <Ammler> yes, it was serious, sorry.
13:31:56 <Weeknie> Lol, sorry here too;)
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13:48:51 <Weeknie> When GRFWizard asks for the TTD path, I should just link it to the root folder of OpenTTD right?
13:50:56 <planetmaker> You might try NML instead of plain NFO or GRFWizard
13:51:25 <planetmaker> more versatile than GRFWizard and better readable than plain NFO
13:51:43 <Weeknie> NML is the full name?
13:52:09 <planetmaker> it could be said to stand for nfo meta language.
13:52:24 <planetmaker> But... as it meanwhile can write grf directly it's a bit obsolete
13:53:09 <planetmaker> yes, the name only :-)
13:53:42 <Mazur> Ah. Important distinction.
13:53:42 <Ammler> nobody here knows GRFWizard, I would guess...
13:54:12 <Ammler> it sounds like a prenewgrf tool
13:54:23 <planetmaker> Also: NML allows to use nice units - which makes things easy with the action0
13:54:34 * Mazur knows Gandalf. Merlin. Such wizards.
13:55:33 <planetmaker> Weeknie, if you want to start new with writing NewGRF it's something I'd honestly recommend to look at
13:55:40 <planetmaker> It has the biggest potential :-)
13:55:52 <Weeknie> So I should look at NML
13:55:59 <planetmaker> And is the only newgrf programme which really is actively maintained by more than a half person
13:56:13 <Weeknie> Has revisions from yesterday ^_^
13:56:33 <planetmaker> it currently gets revisions very frequently. It's not even finished
13:56:53 <planetmaker> It even might require you from time to time to change some things as NML itself changes
13:57:16 <planetmaker> But programming in it goes quite smoothly :-)
13:57:23 <Weeknie> Well I like the fact that it's python
13:57:28 <Weeknie> Atleast I can run that stuff
13:58:38 <Weeknie> Though 1 problem, how do I get the files?
13:59:14 <planetmaker> easiest is via mercurial checkout
13:59:20 <planetmaker> That makes it easy to update it, too
13:59:30 <Weeknie> Lol, anoter version management system
13:59:32 <planetmaker> mercurial is a python-based version control system
13:59:57 <Weeknie> Yeah, had git installed for a previous open source project
14:00:01 <Weeknie> Subversion for openTTD itself
14:00:06 <Weeknie> And now Mercurial for NML:P
14:00:14 <planetmaker> use also mercurial for OpenTTD
14:00:31 <planetmaker> it's actually recommended unless you're core dev :-)
14:00:37 <planetmaker> you then have the full history locally
14:00:59 <planetmaker> and it's easier on some things like maintaining patch queues and alike
14:01:16 <planetmaker> you have all OpenTTD revisions within that repository.
14:01:17 <Weeknie> Well never heard of that stuff before lol
14:01:26 <planetmaker> svn needs online connection in order to change the checked out version
14:01:41 <planetmaker> the difference between a centralized CVS and a distributed one
14:02:02 <Rubidium> planetmaker: mercurial too if you want to update, which is what 99% of the users only do
14:02:36 <planetmaker> Rubidium, yes, of course it needs to be online for an update.
14:02:58 <Rubidium> so why download 5 years of history in 99% of the cases if you're not going to use it?
14:03:04 <planetmaker> But it's helpful if you play around with versions :-) Or clone locally in order to different things in different checkouts
14:03:05 <Zuu> hmm, does NML needs to be updated maually by someone when the nfo spec changes?
14:04:04 <Zuu> Eg. do you or someone else who work on NML need to update it when a new property etc. is added to the nfo spec?
14:04:20 <planetmaker> it will need updating, too
14:04:26 <Yexo> yes, there is no way around that (at least not for action0 properties)
14:04:46 <Yexo> for new varaction2 variables no update is needed
14:05:24 <SpComb> tsk, NML is missing the testcases :(
14:06:12 <planetmaker> but test cases are missing for every grf producing programme
14:06:33 <andythenorth> FIRS question....."Lumber Treatment Plant"...might need a better name....
14:06:49 <planetmaker> but it's one of the items to be added, SpComb : a test suit to check for sanity of the output
14:06:53 <andythenorth> it treats lumber with creosote and other chemicals, and produces engineering structures from timber
14:07:08 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: ^ you normally have an opinion on FIRS industries :)
14:07:38 <Eddi|zuHause> how about "processing"?
14:07:42 <andythenorth> I thought of "Timber Engineering", but it's nice to make it obvious that it uses Lumber cargo
14:07:48 <andythenorth> "Lumber Processor"?
14:07:54 <Weeknie> Lumber processing plant
14:08:38 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not entirely sure what it does...
14:08:41 <Weeknie> Planetmaker, what's the repo url for NML?
14:08:52 <Weeknie> Can't seem to find it on the site
14:08:55 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: it's a slightly made up industry to provide another source of ENSP
14:09:09 <Alberth> andythenorth: it does more than a lumber mill?
14:10:20 <SpComb> the constants like CC_PASSENGERS or whatever are defined inside the parser?
14:11:12 <andythenorth> "Southern Tie and Timber Treating"
14:11:34 <andythenorth> or "International Creosote & Construction Co"
14:11:35 <planetmaker> SpComb, yes, they are
14:11:47 <planetmaker> cargo classes are part of the nfo specification
14:11:56 <planetmaker> cargo short names are not
14:12:12 * SpComb wonders if they could be externalized to library-style data files
14:12:30 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: a lumber mill processes wood into lumber
14:12:30 <SpComb> also missing the 'include' functionaliy, as far as I can see :)
14:12:57 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: this industry processes lumber into "engineering supplies" or so i understood
14:13:15 <andythenorth> could just be "Lumber Yard"
14:13:38 <andythenorth> That will probably make it obvious enough
14:14:15 <Weeknie> planetmaker, what's the entry point for the whole nml app, or is there some page on how to use it?
14:14:17 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: does that work for you? I'm about to change it in about 5 places.... :)
14:14:41 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that sounds alright
14:14:51 * andythenorth goes to the code
14:15:17 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: if you use pnfo or similar, you can make it a #define and have it changable in one place ;)
14:15:17 <andythenorth> as the code won't come to me :P
14:15:24 <Alberth> I'd rather make some goods out of it, I think :p
14:15:40 <andythenorth> but there is also a website, a local filesystem etc....
14:16:14 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r19826 /trunk/src/lang/italian.txt: -Add: extra gender to Italian
14:16:15 <andythenorth> Alberth: you can use the Furniture Factory in that case. However goods are currently pointless (apart from getting paid) :P
14:16:53 <Alberth> oh, getting money is not the objective of the game? :p
14:17:00 <Eddi|zuHause> goods need a town-feedback-mechanism, which is outside the scope of a newgrf
14:18:08 <andythenorth> town growth/shrink cargos (both collect and deliver) should be exposed to newgrf
14:18:16 <planetmaker> Weeknie, it works command line
14:18:32 <planetmaker> Look at ogfxplus on how I call it there in the Makefile
14:18:52 <Weeknie> erm, what do you mean?
14:18:54 <planetmaker> but nml has a command line help, too
14:19:25 <Weeknie> But what do you mean with the 2nd thing you said?
14:20:03 <Weeknie> I should just run setup.py build and then install?
14:20:41 <Weeknie> I'm looking at it right now
14:20:45 <Weeknie> all it sais is that I need to install ply
14:23:12 <Zuu> "To start, just run main.py ('python main.py')"
14:23:20 <Weeknie> Yeah, there's no main.py
14:24:16 <Weeknie> why isn't htat file called nml2nfo?
14:24:40 <planetmaker> you'll need ply and PIL modules
14:24:45 <Zuu> btw, how do you install ply. Shall I run setup.py as administrator in windows or can I just put the files in the ply dir in the nml checkout dir? (I'm not a python coder)
14:25:00 <Weeknie> run setup.py build and then setup.py install
14:25:05 <Weeknie> That'll put the stuff where it needs to go
14:25:09 <Weeknie> Atleast that's what I figure
14:25:19 <planetmaker> you might want to do the install as admin
14:25:49 <Zuu> indeed, without admin rights it won't be able to put the files in the phyton dir in Program Files.
14:26:21 <Weeknie> Nor is my python dir in program files, but that's details
14:26:50 <Weeknie> Oh good, I already have PIL
14:28:44 <Alberth> Zuu: just copying the files should work
14:28:46 <Weeknie> planetmaker, I don't think it'll hurt when I change nml2nfo to nml2nfo.py right?
14:29:44 <Alberth> Zuu: I am not even sure ply has an official way of installing :)
14:29:57 <planetmaker> it's a shell script, not a python script
14:30:36 <Weeknie> Only the first line isn't python
14:30:41 <planetmaker> Alberth, Zuu in my case I just installed it by means of my packet managers
14:30:49 * andythenorth ponders writing advanced varaction 2 so that dates, speeds etc can be expressed in sane numbers, not fractions or multiples
14:30:56 <Weeknie> the first line is to indicate this should be executed with python
14:31:10 <Alberth> planetmaker: much better to let a package manager do it :)
14:31:23 * andythenorth rediscovers date escapes
14:31:26 <planetmaker> Which makes it a shell script and which is the whole sense of it.
14:31:38 <Weeknie> Yeah right, the problem is windows doesn't understand it
14:31:48 <Weeknie> NOr dues /usr/bin/env exist under windows
14:31:52 <Zuu> hmm, let see if cygwin can handle this for me
14:31:53 <Weeknie> So I'll change it to py and remove the first line
14:32:07 <Weeknie> I don't se how that should hurt anything?
14:32:09 <planetmaker> Zuu, it works afaik.
14:32:11 <Alberth> Weeknie: the first line starts with #, so it is a comment for Python
14:32:13 <planetmaker> Weeknie, I don't know
14:32:27 <Weeknie> Alberth, that's right, forgot about that;)
14:32:34 <Zuu> cygwin does not seem to have ply.
14:32:44 <planetmaker> well. not by default
14:32:52 <Alberth> as long as you don't want to run the script as a shell script, it should work
14:33:35 <Weeknie> anyway, my parser isn't complaining, so I'll leave it like this
14:33:50 <Zuu> Weeknie: In windows I usually have the first line as "#!ruby" in my ruby scripts and have ruby.exe in PATH, similar should work also for phyton.
14:34:29 <Weeknie> And what's the file name
14:34:40 <Weeknie> As long as it doesn't have an extension, my windows won't execute it
14:35:37 <Weeknie> Oh well w/e, it's working and I'm keeping it this way:p
14:36:53 <Alberth> Zuu: is that line used in windows? I thought it was just the extension.
14:37:07 <Weeknie> I still need grf wizard and such, don't I planetmaker?
14:37:39 <Zuu> well, I need it when I run my ruby files from bash eg ./some_file.rb
14:38:05 <Zuu> which is maybe not particulary standard Windows, but possible if you have bash in Windows.
14:38:07 <Weeknie> Not the windows cammandline
14:38:50 <SpComb> or just `ruby somefile.rb`
14:39:10 <Weeknie> even somefile.py works here
14:39:15 <Alberth> Oh, you use bash with windows. Yeah, then the line could be relevant.
14:39:19 <Weeknie> Just associate the .py files with the pythong parser
14:39:42 <Zuu> "somefile.py" won't work in bash, but in windows cli.
14:40:08 <Weeknie> Now it works and I'm happy
14:40:28 <Alberth> Zuu: with Linux, #! is a kernel thing, not a shell thing :)
14:47:06 <planetmaker> <Weeknie> I still need grf wizard and such, don't I planetmaker? <-- you don't
14:47:56 <Weeknie> So how do I do thinkgs like decode grf's, and combine nfo's and gcx (or those graphics things anyway) to grf's?
14:49:03 <planetmaker> run NML on the source and you'll get a grf
14:49:14 <planetmaker> it can't de-code, though
14:49:47 <planetmaker> but that's something grfwizard can't do either. Or can it?
14:50:04 <planetmaker> besides it's never been fun to read de-coded NFO
14:50:15 <planetmaker> better get the sources
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14:58:55 <Weeknie> planetmaker, how do you generate a grf with NML? You said "run it on the source", but what do you mean by that/
15:01:28 <planetmaker> you never worked with any command line programme and only clicky-colourfully, eh?
15:02:09 <planetmaker> nml2nfo myNMLfile.nml
15:02:15 <andythenorth> anyone here who doesn't know what a pit prop is?
15:02:18 <Weeknie> Lol, I have used that
15:02:25 * planetmaker rises hand @ andythenorth
15:02:36 <andythenorth> what about a fence post?
15:02:43 <Weeknie> Not sure about htat one:P
15:02:55 <Alberth> I have heard of that one :)
15:02:56 <Weeknie> It's a pole that's part of a fence right?
15:03:18 <Weeknie> Then I have heard of it too
15:04:30 <Weeknie> I'm trying to learn newgrf stuff, but planetmaker seems to be getting enough of me:P (sorry for that)
15:04:41 <Weeknie> So I'll just go quiet and start reading
15:06:21 <andythenorth> "Lumber Yard - Produces items such as fence posts, poles and beams"
15:06:58 <planetmaker> sounds fine, andythenorth
15:07:01 <andythenorth> Wasila: it's in game
15:07:06 <andythenorth> in the industry window(s)
15:07:18 <andythenorth> Alberth: has a goods fixation
15:07:37 <Wasila> How about 'produces wood-related goods' :P
15:07:58 <Alberth> a nice catch-all cargo :p
15:07:58 <andythenorth> confusing because Wood is a cargo....but this industry neither accepts nor produces it :)
15:08:12 <Wasila> Accepts wood, produces goods, no?
15:08:24 <andythenorth> accepts lumber and chemicals, produces engineering supplies :)
15:08:48 <Wasila> I mean, what industries use it?
15:08:51 <andythenorth> wood comes from forests
15:08:57 <andythenorth> forest -> paper mill
15:09:01 <andythenorth> forest -> lumber mill
15:09:08 <Alberth> aka 'chopped trees' :)
15:09:22 <Wasila> That's why I don't use FIRS xD
15:09:24 <andythenorth> confusingly, depending on what continent you are on, wood, timber and lumber all mean different things :)
15:09:28 <Wasila> Switching to another climate is confusing enough for me!
15:09:42 <andythenorth> Wasila: you can be a tester for "FIRS Basic" when it's ready
15:10:00 <Wasila> How long will it take to complete?
15:10:18 <Alberth> hopefully less than infinitely
15:11:18 <andythenorth> depends on the type of infinity, and whether you apply Zeno's Paradox to it
15:11:37 <Alberth> I'll leave that up to you :)
15:12:21 <Alberth> but Zeno's paradox is a bit difficult if the smallest unit is a byte, isn't it?
15:12:48 <andythenorth> otherwise I'd never get anything done :P
15:12:59 <Wasila> Paradoxes make my head heart
15:13:00 <andythenorth> I'd be dividing the work into infinitely many steps
15:13:24 <Wasila> I better pull out before you explode the time-space continuum or something like that by mistake
15:14:13 <andythenorth> Sometimes FIRS does seem like a black hole of time....
15:15:03 <Alberth> it probably is, to some extent, you can endlessly change and optimize it. Not to mention do pixel improvements.
15:15:11 <andythenorth> Terkhen: did you see the discussion about Lumber Yard? Got a cargo chains design question....
15:16:14 <Alberth> he didn't react to my highlight an hour ago, so it may take some time before he responds
15:16:29 <Weeknie> Does anyone have any sources of for instance a vehicle?
15:16:53 <andythenorth> Weeknie: in nml or nfo?
15:17:06 <planetmaker> Weeknie, I pointed you already at ogfxplus as a simple example
15:17:48 <Weeknie> oh sorry planetmaker, missed that then I think
15:18:25 <planetmaker> same urls as nml - but nml replaced by ogfxplus
15:18:59 <planetmaker> if you need NFO you might checkout the logic engine somewhere found on that site, too
15:19:15 <Weeknie> No need for the NFO, if the NML works;)
15:19:31 <planetmaker> besides NML can write NFO, too ;-)
15:19:54 <planetmaker> but mainly for NML debugging purposes
15:20:58 *** welshdragon` is now known as welshdragon
15:22:01 <Terkhen> andythenorth: okay, I'll check it later
15:22:27 <andythenorth> Terkhen: okay, I'll ask my question later :)
15:46:35 <Yexo> there is currently next to no documentation about nml, so I'd advise you to read up on the nfo specs first
15:46:48 <Yexo> if you want to do openttd coding related to newgrfs that is a very useful start
15:47:00 <Weeknie> Ok, I'll continue reading then
15:50:32 <planetmaker> maybe I should start with some documentation on NML somewhen
15:51:01 <Weeknie> The only documentation that's there is a little about general vehicle properties
15:56:26 <Weeknie> This NFO stuff is hard to get through lol
15:56:37 <planetmaker> the reason for NML to be born
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15:58:12 <Weeknie> But I'm really beginning to doubt it would be possible to implement the thing I want in those NFO's, or NML for that matter
15:59:14 <planetmaker> or wasn't it you with the airport thingies?
15:59:38 <Weeknie> no no, it was me with the airport thingies:P
16:00:16 <planetmaker> of course it's not yet possible
16:00:25 <planetmaker> it's not implemented, and as such not documented
16:01:02 <planetmaker> that's what the airports branch is about: defining such specs so that something written in NFO or NML can create much more flexible airports
16:01:16 <planetmaker> not by the player, but by the newgrf authors
16:01:42 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
16:02:03 <Weeknie> tbh I fail to see how such a thing could be implemented through NFO's or NML anyway
16:03:36 <planetmaker> you don't know yet how complex industries, vehicles or houses might be, I guess :-)
16:03:47 <planetmaker> it's not just graphics
16:04:01 <planetmaker> and some properties like speed or accepted cargo
16:04:26 <planetmaker> the FIRS industry set has like 10k lines of code. Plus graphics definitions
16:05:02 <planetmaker> yes, andythenorth , you wrote already that much ^ :-)
16:05:32 <Weeknie> now that I think about it, I also fail to see how they would be able to implement the increasing of production with only NFO's/NML too
16:05:41 <Weeknie> but they did it somehow:P
16:06:25 *** Grelouk has joined #openttd
16:06:44 <planetmaker> that's the key to all those vehicle and industry magic
16:06:59 <planetmaker> choice as a function of diverse parameters and variables
16:07:11 <planetmaker> which depend upon the current game state
16:08:39 <Weeknie> Then how does the inside of the parser (I'll just call it that for now) work, does it take all those lines and evaluate them all every game tick?
16:09:24 <OwenS> Weeknie: No. It executes things which asked to be executed
16:09:54 <planetmaker> e.g. production is only decided 8 or 9 times a month
16:09:58 <andythenorth> planetmaker: mostly the CPP wrote that much :P
16:10:01 <planetmaker> production change only once a month
16:10:11 <planetmaker> andythenorth, no. It's the source code
16:10:15 <planetmaker> not the generated NFO
16:10:25 <andythenorth> copy and paste :P
16:10:53 <planetmaker> hardly :-) You avoid that quite well using templates
16:14:25 <Weeknie> But in case it was needed, the line could be checked every quarter of a day or something in that general direction?
16:14:41 <andythenorth> Weeknie: what are you trying to achieve?
16:15:05 <andythenorth> i.e. what are you trying to do to what items, when?
16:15:46 <Weeknie> Erm, well, I'm trying to think out my idea a little along the lines of this system
16:16:40 <Weeknie> The problem I had right now was that I wouldn't know how to make an airplane land as soon as the runway is clear
16:17:05 <Weeknie> Because basically you'd have to check every so many time (with not too big intervals) whether the runway was empty
16:17:14 <andythenorth> ok, but can you articulate your objective? Maybe I missed a message somewhere....
16:17:22 <Weeknie> I'm gonna have dinner now
16:17:26 <Weeknie> I'll do that when I get back;)
16:17:27 <planetmaker> Weeknie, OpenTTD has to make sure that the checks are called when needed
16:17:40 <planetmaker> The NewGRFs need to decide what they return
16:25:43 *** Chillosophy has joined #openttd
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16:49:33 <fonsinchen> btw, a cheap trick to get an uncompressed version of a savegame is writing every byte to cerr from SlReadByteInternal
16:49:53 <fonsinchen> Took me some time to find the right place and then 10 seconds to implement it.
16:50:22 <fonsinchen> 'll put that on the wiki somewhere
16:50:35 <planetmaker> one could just gunzip a savegame?
16:51:29 <fonsinchen> I think gunzip needs some headers
16:51:49 <fonsinchen> the content of which is implied in OpenTTD
16:51:50 <Eddi|zuHause> fonsinchen: you can just set the compression method in the config file...
16:52:06 <fonsinchen> but then you can't look at an existing save
16:53:10 <fonsinchen> the case was that I had a big pile of desync debug saves and they were all different
16:53:19 <fonsinchen> and was wondering what exactly was different
16:53:39 <fonsinchen> gllx: doesn't work if there is a bug in the saveload code
16:55:06 <Weeknie> Andythenorth, I'm back, so what exactly did you want to know?
16:57:15 *** Weeknie has joined #openttd
17:02:42 <andythenorth> Weeknie: I wasn't sure what you were trying to do with nfo / nml....it helps us to help if we understand your goal
17:03:43 <Weeknie> Erm well, 3rd post in this topic explains it I think
17:06:05 <andythenorth> ah....that makes sense, but I think you'll be waiting for newgrf airports :)
17:06:13 * andythenorth ponders doing some real work
17:06:27 <Weeknie> Lol, right, that's what PikkaBird said:P
17:13:47 *** theholyduck has joined #openttd
17:16:09 <Weeknie> Then perhaps I could after all use my C++ skills
17:16:35 <Weeknie> (not that I have a lot of those)
17:26:07 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
17:31:45 <planetmaker> quak frosch123 :-)
17:32:00 <planetmaker> deprived of alcohol meanwhile? :-D
17:32:17 * andythenorth watches a web app database pack slowly :|
17:34:06 <frosch123> evening everyone :)
17:34:13 <frosch123> nice trip, no alcohol :p
17:35:04 <Rubidium> tss... if fonsinchen only asked the real question instead of wondering how to decompress a savegame (which made me assume he didn't save them himself)
17:35:11 <Rubidium> then it would've been trivial
17:43:01 <planetmaker> Rubidium, I think those were the saves both, saved on the server as well as those she got herself.
17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: translators * r19827 /trunk/src/lang/ (6 files): (log message trimmed)
17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: catalan - 41 changes by arnau
17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: dutch - 48 changes by Hyronymus
17:45:38 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: finnish - 4 changes by erani
17:45:39 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: russian - 7 changes by Lone_Wolf
17:45:39 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: slovenian - 17 changes by ntadej
17:46:36 <Weeknie> It's nightly time again?
17:46:53 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: rubidium * r19828 /trunk/src/lang/italian.txt: -Remove: broken strings from Italian (did hope the translator had fixed them by now)
17:46:56 <planetmaker> every day at 20h CEST
17:47:13 <planetmaker> delivered only 30 minutes later, though
17:47:25 <planetmaker> 19:45h CEST is commit time for translations
17:48:12 <PeterT> planetmaker: I took your advice from a while ago. I have CIA-* on highlight here, and I left #openttd.notice
17:48:34 <planetmaker> why do you highlight on CIA?
17:48:50 <planetmaker> and I cannot remember that advice :-)
17:48:51 <Rubidium> planetmaker: ofcourse you lie...
17:49:09 <Rubidium> as it's 20:00 in timezone (TZ=)"CET-1CEST,M3.5.0,M10.5.0/3"
17:50:02 <planetmaker> oh, I'd call that piece "telling not the whole story"
17:50:28 <Rubidium> so it's like statistics
17:51:00 <Rubidium> i.e. the superlative of lies
17:51:33 <planetmaker> Truely I think statistics are easily abused...
17:51:45 * planetmaker just prepares some statistics slides himself
17:51:52 <planetmaker> cumulative curves are nice :-)
17:53:21 <planetmaker> and logarithms also help nicely to make data look automagically better
18:02:32 *** rhaeder has joined #openttd
18:08:07 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai
18:22:21 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19829 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Extract assignment from the condition-check in the for statement.
18:25:18 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19830 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Move variable declarations to their first use.
18:30:15 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19831 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Rename formal parameters of the constructor to match data member variable names.
18:30:40 <andythenorth> anybody want to grant me a cookie? request = container.REQUEST
18:30:40 <andythenorth> RESPONSE = request.RESPONSE
18:30:41 <andythenorth> from DateTime import DateTime
18:30:41 <andythenorth> if not request.form.get("insight", "").strip():
18:30:41 <andythenorth> raise Exception("Insight required!")
18:30:43 <andythenorth> if hasattr(context, 'i_am_a_referrer'):
18:30:44 <andythenorth> obj_url = context.aq_parent.absolute_url() + ('/edit_object?msg=%s' % msg)
18:30:46 <andythenorth> obj_url = context.aq_parent.aq_parent.absolute_url() + ('/edit_object?msg=%s' % msg)
18:30:46 <andythenorth> RESPONSE.redirect(obj_url)
18:30:48 <andythenorth> for char in title:
18:30:48 <andythenorth> if ord(char) < 32 or ord(char) > 127:
18:30:50 <andythenorth> abort('Referrer titles must be letters, numbers and ordinary punctuation.')
18:30:52 <andythenorth> for char in source_url:
18:30:52 <andythenorth> if ord(char) < 32 or ord(char) > 127:
18:30:54 <andythenorth> abort('Referrer URLs must be ASCII. Put that URL through TinyURL and try again, please.')
18:30:56 <andythenorth> if hasattr(context, 'i_am_a_referrer'):
18:30:56 <andythenorth> # referrer object already exists
18:30:58 <andythenorth> # have to use aq_parent to get correct context
18:30:58 <andythenorth> obj = context.aq_parent
18:31:00 <andythenorth> # referrer object doesn't exist - add a new one
18:31:02 <andythenorth> obj = context.scripts.add_referrer()
18:31:02 <andythenorth> unicode(title,'ascii','strict')
18:31:04 <andythenorth> # used for validation / user feedback messages
18:31:04 <andythenorth> live_submitted = live
18:31:06 <andythenorth> def handle_image_upload(file, name):
18:31:06 <andythenorth> if file.filename[string.rfind(file.filename, "\\") + 1:]:
18:31:08 <andythenorth> context.image_resizer.recompressImage(obj,file)
18:31:10 <andythenorth> upload_large = handle_image_upload(large_image,'large_image')
18:31:10 <andythenorth> # could use the live_check method here, but not much to be gained by the change *right now*.
18:31:12 <andythenorth> if context.validate_image_size(obj=obj,filename='large_image') == False:
18:31:12 *** andythenorth has left #openttd
18:33:12 <Weeknie> It was his exit statement
18:33:14 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
18:33:22 <Alberth> paste with a piece of code
18:33:23 <Weeknie> He returned from the heavens
18:33:40 <andythenorth> sometimes my browser doesn't put urls on the clipboard
18:33:49 <andythenorth> so you got what was already there instead :P
18:33:54 <Weeknie> So then you just copy a shitload of code:P
18:33:57 <planetmaker> paste... sounds like pastries... Hm...
18:34:10 <andythenorth> you got rather a large chunk of python....
18:35:07 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19832 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Rename variables list->actives, sel->active_sel.
18:35:22 <__ln__> years ago i was talking with a friend online, when some application of his crashed and a message he had been writing to some girl got pasted to the talk window.
18:36:09 <Weeknie> You wouldn't happen to have a copy of that on your machine do you?
18:36:35 <Weeknie> Which you could accidentally share with us
18:37:44 <Weeknie> And the paste result is!
18:38:54 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: configure your IRC client so it doesn't send stuff when you paste multi-line content
18:39:12 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: e.g. konversation can open a multi-line edit window instead
18:40:51 <__ln__> Weeknie: btw, is that the kind of thing you would do if you got your hands on your friend's private emails?
18:41:20 <Weeknie> lol, __ln__ don't worry, your dirty little secret is safe with me
18:41:26 <Weeknie> I won't tell anyone you slept with your aunt and your grandma
18:42:12 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19833 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt newgrf_gui.cpp): -Change: Modify NewGRF window towards having combined lists, add captions.
18:47:30 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19834 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Change: Replace matrix list widget in NewGRF gui by a panel with black background.
18:50:49 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19835 /trunk/src/ (newgrf_config.cpp newgrf_config.h): -Codechange: Extract grfident equality check to its own method.
18:52:22 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19836 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Move sprite palette selection code in NewGRF gui to its own method.
18:53:22 <Xaroth> CAPS LOCK IS CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL
18:53:45 <Weeknie> CAPS LOCK ROCKS MAN, IT'S JUST AWESOME
18:54:39 <Noldo> you evil people got me thinking it's that day again
18:54:42 *** Devedse has joined #openttd
18:54:51 <TrueBrain> @kick Xaroth I hate capslock
18:54:51 *** Xaroth was kicked by DorpsGek (I hate capslock)
18:55:11 <Weeknie> For me it's the end of a little vacation:(
18:55:33 <Weeknie> erm wait, Truebrain, what was that for?
18:55:47 <TrueBrain> for abusively using capslock of course
18:56:05 <TrueBrain> I could have kicked PeterT, but he would be all wining and complaining and stuff, not worth my time
18:56:19 <TrueBrain> and I like you Weeknie, so I won't ever kick you
18:56:44 <Weeknie> TrueBrain <3 indeed:D
18:57:19 * planetmaker senses very very thin ice under Weeknie's feet
18:57:58 <TrueBrain> now you are just showing off
18:58:12 <Weeknie> don't worry planetmaker
18:58:18 <TrueBrain> Solid Harmonie - I want you to Want me, click "The Roof, The Roof, The Roof is on fire"
18:58:20 <TrueBrain> something is wrong ...
18:58:22 <Weeknie> You've been helping me a lot more than that TrueBrain thing
18:58:25 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19837 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt newgrf_gui.cpp): -Change: Display list of available (non-active) grfs in the NewGRF window.
18:58:38 <TrueBrain> Weeknie: no need to start being insulting :(
18:58:42 <planetmaker> Weeknie: whether you love me or not certainly won't stop Dorpsgek ;-)
18:58:54 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +o planetmaker
18:58:58 <planetmaker> and the TrueBrain does marvelous work
18:59:01 <OwenS> TrueBrain: Isn't that a Bloodhound Gang song?
18:59:10 <Weeknie> Ok this is getting confusion lol
18:59:14 <Weeknie> TrueBrain, how do you do that?
18:59:26 <PeterT> hey, TrueBrain said he could kick me or Xaroth
18:59:28 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: TrueBrain
18:59:32 <PeterT> which means i'm not on /ignore
18:59:40 * planetmaker is in a very peaceful mind now, though
18:59:45 <planetmaker> I just had nice dinner :-)
18:59:47 <Weeknie> This is getting confusing
18:59:48 *** DorpsGek sets mode: -o planetmaker
19:00:05 <TrueBrain> my scripts are offline :(
19:00:17 <planetmaker> doesn't glx always have some nice ones?
19:01:36 <PeterT> Weeknie: DorpsGek is a bot.
19:01:56 <TrueBrain> Weeknie: without joking, DorpsGek is just a bot, which happens to be under my control
19:02:01 <Wasila> hey, is everyone using Mibbit
19:02:19 <PeterT> everyone has a real IRC client
19:02:31 <PeterT> Well, the free version of XCHat
19:02:36 <Wasila> mIRC is too confusing for me
19:02:44 <PeterT> Pidgin is an IM client that implemented IRC for completeness
19:02:48 <frosch123> [21:02] <TrueBrain> it has no soul <- does that make all of us bots?
19:02:59 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19838 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt newgrf_gui.cpp): -Change: Add filter capability to the availables list.
19:03:01 <Weeknie> Frosch123, speak for yourself
19:03:05 <Wasila> can XChat automatically open particular servers when you log in?
19:03:06 <TrueBrain> frosch123: you have no soul? :(
19:03:25 <Weeknie> PeterT, wait wut, Xchat has a paid version?
19:03:48 <PeterT> XChat is the paid version
19:03:53 *** lewymati has joined #openttd
19:04:01 <PeterT> they are both open source
19:04:18 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19839 /trunk/src/lang/ (41 files): -Change: Also copy the new filter string in the other languages.
19:04:18 <PeterT> the only thing you pay for XChat is that it is compiled for you
19:04:26 <Wasila> How do you pay for an open source program?
19:04:35 <TrueBrain> by sending them money
19:04:37 <Weeknie> You send money to them
19:04:40 <Weeknie> And then you get the program
19:04:52 <Wasila> Surely anyone could just put the source code up?
19:04:55 <PeterT> <PeterT> the only thing you pay for XChat is that it is compiled for you
19:05:09 <Weeknie> Ever heard of liscense?:P
19:05:42 <Weeknie> Wow, another one of those dutch fellas
19:05:53 <PeterT> They're all dutch, Weeknie
19:06:14 <Eddi|zuHause> they are most definitely not! :p
19:06:23 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: you are a fake dutchman
19:06:30 <Weeknie> Well anyway a lot mor dutch people than I thought
19:06:35 <Weeknie> We should arrange a meating once lol
19:06:42 <TrueBrain> no worries, it suprises us every time too
19:06:47 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm so badly faked, i don't even speak their language :p
19:06:52 <PeterT> you mean an all-guy sex party?
19:06:53 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19840 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Add: Add 'rescan' functionality to the NewGRF window.
19:06:54 <TrueBrain> Weeknie: I have had once at my house before
19:06:56 <__ln__> even the ones who claim to be from .de are actually just wearing funny masks on their faces.
19:06:59 <planetmaker> Weeknie: why is it a fail to donate to an open source project, if you like what they provide?
19:07:08 <Rubidium> meating? Is that like slapping with meat?
19:07:11 <TrueBrain> I have no issues doing the same for r20000, but I expect boekabart to arrange the cake again
19:07:14 <planetmaker> All those projects also have running costs. For servers, bandwidth etc pp
19:07:56 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: or will we be doing it at your place this year?
19:08:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: it's an obscure sex practice, of course...
19:08:09 <Weeknie> That was one of the most ill placed typos I've ever made:P
19:08:24 <planetmaker> hm... 16 commits to go...
19:08:40 <TrueBrain> now that is a bad typo
19:08:40 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: I thought it was planetmaker's place this time
19:08:56 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, i thought that, too ;)
19:08:56 <planetmaker> If so it'll have to be in June
19:09:03 <Weeknie> And @ planetmaker, who was still serious, that comment @ rubidium, I'm not going to explain it
19:09:04 <planetmaker> Or we have to do it belated in late August
19:09:06 <TrueBrain> well ... I can borrow a car, so
19:09:11 <Weeknie> Don't really know why I made it anyway
19:09:13 *** Wasila123 has joined #openttd
19:09:22 <Wasila> how do I join multiple networks?
19:09:33 <Wasila> I appear to be on here twice <_<
19:09:42 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: so, June .. any specific date in mind?
19:09:49 <TrueBrain> I wonder how long of a drive it will be ...
19:09:56 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: about 6 hours
19:09:57 <Wasila> How do I automatically join two networks on XChat
19:10:07 <TrueBrain> so I can sleep at your place too? :p
19:10:09 <planetmaker> maybe 5 if you have little traffic
19:10:16 <Eddi|zuHause> 6 hours? where are you driving?
19:10:28 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: from his place to mine ;-)
19:10:29 <__ln__> why not go uninvited to Bjarni's and ring his doorbell?
19:10:37 <planetmaker> probably 5 are sufficient
19:10:41 <PeterT> Wasila123: network list
19:10:55 <TrueBrain> takes me 2 hours to get to Rubidium
19:11:11 <__ln__> PeterT, Wasila123: get a room you two
19:11:23 <Rubidium> Wasila: this is not #xchat
19:11:28 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19841 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt newgrf_gui.cpp): -Feature: Setup NewGRFs from a single window.
19:11:29 <TrueBrain> when did this channel became the irc help channel
19:11:41 <PeterT> this is #nothing-related-to-openttd
19:11:42 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: where do I need to set my route-planner to? (I always forget :p)
19:12:09 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19842 /trunk/src/lang/ (54 files in 2 dirs): -Change: Adapt other languages too.
19:12:15 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: it took me 6 hours from here to karlsruhe, certainly the distance from the netherlands to your place is shorter than that...
19:12:17 <Weeknie> __ln__, why did you have to say that, now I"ve got all messy thoughts in me head
19:12:34 <TrueBrain> google tells me 4 hours and 30 minutes
19:12:41 <TrueBrain> it is almost a horizontal line
19:12:51 <Weeknie> TrueBrain, where do you live then?
19:12:58 <Weeknie> Got to be either germany or france with 4 hours
19:12:58 <PeterT> Alberth: is r19841 the sepcial NewGRF GUIs you've been working on?
19:12:58 <__ln__> for vertical you'd need a rocket
19:12:59 <planetmaker> I didn't know quite exactly anymore your town ;-)
19:13:12 <Weeknie> Perhaps swiss thingy?
19:13:13 <OwenS> TrueBrain: in a home? You're older than I expected
19:13:21 <TrueBrain> OwenS: I have that effect
19:13:36 <OwenS> (For the curious: In the UK saying someone is "in a home" tends to refer to retirement homes :P)
19:13:40 *** Wasila123 has joined #openttd
19:13:43 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19843 /trunk/src/ (widget.cpp widget_type.h): -Codechange: Move ComputeMaxSize() to widget_type.h to make it globally accessible.
19:13:45 <Eddi|zuHause> ... google maps still fails on konqueror...
19:13:50 <planetmaker> I propose either 12/13 June or 19/20
19:14:05 <TrueBrain> OwenS: lucky I don't live in the UK then
19:14:10 <TrueBrain> 12th I am not available
19:14:11 <planetmaker> it's approx. free weekends in my calender
19:14:20 <planetmaker> and distant from nasty deadlines
19:14:32 <TrueBrain> the 19th is no issue for me
19:14:36 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: how about you?
19:14:41 *** Wasila123 is now known as Wasila
19:14:56 *** Wasila is now known as register
19:15:07 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm afraid i'm busy each weekend in june...
19:15:15 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: wtf? Why!
19:15:16 * PeterT puts the cash in the register
19:15:24 <Rubidium> don't think I've got lot to do in the weekends in june
19:15:37 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: how many people can you host a party for?
19:15:41 <Eddi|zuHause> it's that time of a year...
19:15:57 *** register is now known as Wasila
19:16:24 <Weeknie> Wait, planetmaker and truebrain, you're seriously planning something now?:P
19:16:33 *** beerface has joined #openttd
19:17:03 <OwenS> "Maximum vertex attributes: 16 " What? Thats hugely dissappointing :(
19:17:05 <TrueBrain> Weeknie: you want to know just 2 things about me: 1) never piss me off, 2) I am crazy
19:17:14 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19844 /trunk/src/ (widget.cpp widget_type.h): -Fix: Move NWidgetBase::StoreSizePosition() to an include file, and use proper inline macro.
19:17:21 <planetmaker> well. It's not a big flat. I guess if we squeeze, 6 to 8 people could stay overnight, if they bring sleeping bag
19:17:30 <planetmaker> for just the party... could be more
19:17:43 <TrueBrain> so, who here wants free cake? :p
19:17:59 <Ammler> and SmatZ is cooking the gulash
19:18:09 <Eddi|zuHause> "free" if you discount the cost of the train ticket/fuel ;)
19:18:18 <OwenS> Eddi|zuHause: Thats not free! :p
19:18:29 <__ln__> i don't want fuel in my piece of cake
19:18:33 <Rubidium> anyhow, it's in Karlruhe?
19:18:45 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: gulash is hungrian, not czech
19:18:58 <PeterT> Eddi|zuHause: Hungarian.
19:19:19 <Eddi|zuHause> PeterT: i'm hungry, i mean.
19:19:32 <PeterT> I fell right into that.
19:19:32 <planetmaker> Eddi should have a 3 hour ride :-)
19:19:40 <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause should just make time
19:19:43 <planetmaker> if you go 200km/h it's 1:30 ;-)
19:19:43 <TrueBrain> he is always zuhause
19:19:49 <beerface> how do I set the max loan for my server?
19:20:04 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r19845 /trunk/src/newgrf_gui.cpp: -Feature: Dynamically switch between 2 and 3 column NewGRF gui for improved user experience.
19:20:06 <Alberth> you asked that yesterday too
19:20:10 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: google says 1h 55m
19:20:15 <TrueBrain> Weeknie: owh, and a 3rd point: I have a poor sense of humor
19:20:18 <__ln__> planetmaker: Niedersachsen?
19:20:20 <Alberth> and you got an answer
19:20:36 <Weeknie> Lol, good one TrueBrain
19:20:36 <beerface> well do I do it once i have made a game?
19:20:37 <TrueBrain> how about you dihedral?
19:20:38 <planetmaker> "Zonenrandgebiet" :-P
19:20:55 <TrueBrain> (just read your freaking backlog both :p)
19:20:58 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: I had in my mind time from Jena :-)
19:21:15 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: jena is quite a lot further south
19:21:22 <Eddi|zuHause> and we have the B6n now ;)
19:21:24 <planetmaker> yes... one hour or 88 km
19:21:27 <beerface> also im unclean on how to set a goal
19:21:39 <TrueBrain> do I need more highlights? :p
19:21:59 <planetmaker> michi_cc could come over. It's only 60km
19:22:13 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: the B6 quasi directly connects Halle to Braunschweig
19:22:13 <Weeknie> Lol TrueBrain, I think you've had enough of em;)
19:22:24 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: B14 B2 is faster
19:22:29 <TrueBrain> just the people I know are crazy enough to come too :p
19:22:45 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: that were true, if i were on the other side of the Saale ;)
19:22:52 <Zuu> According to google maps it's only a 5 hour drive for me. :-)
19:23:06 <TrueBrain> Zuu: so you should come too :p
19:23:11 <planetmaker> :-O @ Zuu then drop by!
19:23:14 <Ammler> pm lives in the centre of OpenTTD
19:23:16 <Zuu> If it was in Niedersachsen?
19:23:26 <planetmaker> Eastern Lower Saxony
19:23:42 <Weeknie> Planetmaker, where do you live?
19:23:50 <frosch123> he, i left bs just 5 hours ago
19:23:52 <Zuu> If it is the later date, then I don't think I have anything planed at least.
19:24:01 <__ln__> Zuu: where do you live?
19:24:02 <TrueBrain> Osai: I am seriously, come join us at planetmaker's place :D
19:24:03 <planetmaker> and you didn't say a word?!
19:24:10 <Yexo> from which point on do I need to read back?
19:24:24 <TrueBrain> Yexo: from this point :p
19:24:31 <planetmaker> Yexo: nowhere. Come to Braunschweig 19th/20th June
19:24:45 <Osai> pm, I am close to Braunschweig next weekend
19:24:48 <Yexo> I have exams starting the 21th
19:24:54 <planetmaker> Osai: seriously? Where?
19:25:01 <Osai> but 19th/20th june I am in Frankfurt a.M.
19:25:23 <planetmaker> Schöppenstedt... a village nearby
19:25:29 <planetmaker> I can go there by bike in 30 minutes
19:25:43 <Yexo> is there a decent train connection to braunscheig?
19:25:56 <planetmaker> to Amsterdam it's reasonable
19:25:57 <Rubidium> Yexo: yeah, the IC from A'dam to Berlin
19:26:05 <TrueBrain> I am going to try to get a car, so you can drive with if I can get one :p
19:26:17 <beerface> so can some one help me with setting a goal for my server that I made?
19:26:19 <Osai> what are you celebrating?
19:26:20 <planetmaker> Car is comfortable
19:26:27 <TrueBrain> Osai: r20000 by then, hopefully?
19:26:35 <TrueBrain> well .. I will make sure it happens by then :p
19:26:35 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: that's quite far outside of braunschweig, actually...
19:26:38 <TrueBrain> maybe on that day .. hmm ...
19:26:59 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: I know where it is. 30 minutes, maybe 45 should work
19:27:00 <Osai> hmmm, I'd really like to join
19:27:04 <planetmaker> I live in the NorthEast
19:27:15 <planetmaker> I just have to drive out to the South-East
19:27:40 <planetmaker> Ammler: will come, too?
19:27:50 <__ln__> Osai: more important than r20k party?!?
19:28:00 <beerface> can any one help a semi noob on setting up a server here?
19:28:02 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: my aunt lives not far away from there
19:28:18 <TrueBrain> Osai: going for Gold?
19:28:23 <planetmaker> beerface: goal servers are hacked servers
19:28:25 <Zuu> hmm, does anyone know a good public transport search engine that is somewhat international?
19:28:32 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: in Hötensleben, directly at the border
19:28:36 <Osai> biggest european tournament
19:28:41 <beerface> what? hacked servers?
19:28:49 <dihedral> beerface, why would a semi-noob want to setup a server if he considers himself already a semi-noob?
19:28:56 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: I never heart that name ;-)
19:29:01 <TrueBrain> dihedral: answer our question already!
19:29:10 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: it's directly opposite of Schöningen
19:29:22 <beerface> planetmaker: what do you mean hacked servers?
19:29:26 <planetmaker> Zuu: bahn.de should work
19:29:33 <Alberth> beerface: custom modified
19:29:39 <planetmaker> maybe you can fly even to Hannover, Berlin or maybe even Braunschweig
19:29:54 <Muxy> beerface: did you talk about goalserver or just regular server...
19:29:58 <dihedral> TrueBrain, what? :-P
19:30:13 <TrueBrain> Alberth: will you come too? :p
19:30:18 <planetmaker> Will Hirundo also come?
19:30:27 <Alberth> I have no idea how to get there
19:30:30 <dihedral> TrueBrain, as of my 'hi' or before?
19:30:32 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: google says A14/A2 is exactly the same time as B6
19:30:33 <Ammler> the Dutchies can rent their own train waggon
19:30:35 <Hirundo> planetmaker: When what where?
19:30:35 <Muxy> sory, didnt saw the first request
19:30:48 <planetmaker> 19th / 20th June. 20k party in Braunschweig
19:30:53 <Rubidium> Zuu: only takes ~12 hours from Norrköping Central to Braunschweig Hbf
19:30:54 <TrueBrain> Alberth: well, if you can get to me, you can tag along, assuming I can borrow a car .. :p
19:31:09 <Alberth> you live in the wrong direction :)
19:31:31 <planetmaker> then do it vice versa: TB gets to alberth's place and then you drive ;-)
19:31:33 <TrueBrain> where do you live btw? :p
19:31:45 <dihedral> not looked at irc for a few days now .... until the 'hi'
19:31:47 <Rubidium> Zuu: take the X2000 to Copenhagen, ICE to Hamburg, "Schnellzug" to Hannover and then the Regional-Express to Braunschweig
19:31:48 <TrueBrain> then take a train to Enschede :p
19:31:57 <TrueBrain> dihedral: read what planetmaker says :p
19:32:26 <planetmaker> [21:30] <planetmaker> 19th / 20th June. 20k party in Braunschweig
19:32:29 <Weeknie> And all this started because of me
19:32:33 <Weeknie> Oh I feel so special:D
19:32:43 <planetmaker> you overestimate your influence grossly ;-)
19:32:55 <planetmaker> we talked about that even back in January
19:33:02 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: read PM please :)
19:33:02 <Alberth> volunteers to pay the bill are always welcome :p
19:33:02 <Weeknie> But I brought it up again!
19:33:19 <dihedral> sounds good, but i can be more specific in 10 - 12 days
19:33:34 <TrueBrain> Alberth: or get to amersfoort, also fine by me :p
19:34:01 <Ammler> Is there someone else south of planetmaker?
19:34:36 <frosch123> but i would take the train in any case
19:34:36 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: I switched off sound ;-) that's why I didn't see it ;-)
19:34:51 <dihedral> my brother and my sister live in Hannover ^^
19:34:55 <frosch123> Ammler: there is a direct ice train from basel to braunschweig
19:35:06 <TrueBrain> Alberth: I will be going from Leiden, A4, A1 to Enschede .. everywhere along the line I can pick you up (if you like of course :p)
19:35:10 <TrueBrain> still assuming I can get a car ...
19:35:11 <Ammler> I would prefer train too :-)
19:35:12 * Rubidium is south of planetmaker too
19:35:19 <dihedral> if i travle i would go from Karlsruhe
19:35:28 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: i'm not the kind of south that you'd like ;)
19:35:43 <dihedral> and if i come, i have a car
19:36:06 <Alberth> TrueBrain: ok, that sounds like enough for now :)
19:36:13 <Eddi|zuHause> the 19th i might have time, but i must be back early on the 20th
19:36:15 <dihedral> so - space for another 3 people in that car
19:36:29 <Yexo> TrueBrain: if you have a free place in that car, count me in too :)
19:36:49 <dihedral> Ammler, how would you travle?
19:37:05 * Rubidium votes for TrueBrain picking me up at home :)
19:37:17 <frosch123> planetmaker: your flat will be flooded by 500 people :p
19:37:30 <__ln__> planetmaker: am i invited?
19:37:30 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: no problem :) And if blathijs joins too, the car is full :p
19:37:31 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... i don't trust google... it tries to send me via beesenstedt-friedeburg-könnern...
19:37:44 <Eddi|zuHause> that's an awfully non-direct road...
19:37:44 <planetmaker> sure, come along __ln__
19:37:56 <dihedral> __ln__, remember though - it's in germany - so no 'english only'
19:38:06 <TrueBrain> __ln__: under the condition I can give you a real (gentle) kick? :)
19:38:16 <Weeknie> Whohoo I got zlib to install on msys
19:38:22 <Weeknie> That took me quite long enough
19:38:23 <dihedral> TrueBrain, a kick in the nuts? :-P
19:38:27 <planetmaker> sänk juh for träwelling wis doitshe bahn
19:38:34 <__ln__> dihedral: natürlich, nur deutsch
19:38:46 <Rubidium> because leaving the highway to go to Hengelo station takes 15 minutes extra, going to my house takes 16 minutes extra :)
19:38:47 <TrueBrain> ich spreche keine deutsch
19:38:52 <planetmaker> __ln__: I can host English speaking guests, too ;-)
19:38:58 <Rubidium> and going to Amersfoort station takes 21 minutes extra
19:39:07 <Ammler> ich schnorre au keis Dütsch
19:39:13 <Rubidium> how traffic lights can screw your average speed
19:39:29 <dihedral> sorry - it'd be in dschrmnie
19:39:30 <planetmaker> DJNekkid: come over, too ;-)
19:39:57 <TrueBrain> "including unlimited kilometers. 20 eurocent extra per kilometer"
19:40:02 <__ln__> damn, i already thought i found a cheap flight to hannover, but i hadn't selected the return flight, and selecting that doubled the price.
19:40:27 <Ammler> hehe, DJNekkid sound :-)
19:40:28 <TrueBrain> 6000 Inclusief onbeperkt aantal kilometers
19:40:28 <planetmaker> sixt's conditions got increasingly worse
19:40:29 <TrueBrain> 0.20 EUR Iedere extra kilometer
19:40:41 <Eddi|zuHause> Ammler: "schnorren" means something different around here ;)
19:40:49 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: where are you looking?
19:40:52 <Weeknie> Lol, nice one TrueBrain
19:41:03 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause: I can guess what
19:41:04 <TrueBrain> I want to rent a car for 2 months, or buy one, not sure yet
19:41:18 <TrueBrain> oeh, I almost forgot to prod Xaroth too :p
19:41:22 <dihedral> TrueBrain, you'd be better off buying one for 500 eur
19:41:40 <__ln__> official language for the meeting: ad hoc dutch
19:41:44 <dihedral> and if it breaks - walk the rest :-P
19:42:10 * Rubidium dislikes Hertz already
19:43:11 <TrueBrain> just 2000 euro to rent a car for 2 months .. not bad
19:43:23 <planetmaker> the longer the cheaper. per day
19:43:50 <Eddi|zuHause> "Straße der DSF" --- these things still seem to exist everywehere...
19:45:36 <planetmaker> [21:30] <planetmaker> 19th / 20th June. 20k party in Braunschweig
19:46:23 <planetmaker> hm... I'm used to some Dutch at my parties. But I think had never that many previously ;-)
19:46:48 <TrueBrain> what planetmaker says
19:48:16 <Eddi|zuHause> "DSF" is an abbreviation for "Deutsch-Sowjetische Freundschaft"
19:49:03 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: i can't decide whether i come or not just yet...
19:49:32 <Xaroth> sounds germany, too far away
19:49:38 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: you don't have to decide now. But it'd be awesome :-)
19:49:44 <TrueBrain> it is germany Xaroth .. 5 hour drive for us
19:49:48 <planetmaker> Xaroth: not really. Just next door :-P
19:50:46 <__ln__> TrueBrain: what did you do during the previous meeting besides eating cake?
19:50:52 <Xaroth> yes, like i'm going to drive 5 horus.....
19:50:55 <Xaroth> i can get in england in that time
19:50:57 <TrueBrain> well, somehow we ended up debating 32bit pngs
19:51:03 <TrueBrain> which gave the solution that is now in trunk
19:51:21 <TrueBrain> __ln__: but I hope this time we can just have fun :p
19:51:33 <Eddi|zuHause> Xaroth: not everybody has to drive individually, when 5 persons come from the same general direction...
19:51:34 <__ln__> debating pngs sounds fun :)
19:51:50 <Xaroth> Eddi|zuHause: still, 5 hours by car...
19:51:59 <Xaroth> I'd rather go to england if i had to travel 5 hours :p
19:52:20 <__ln__> 5 hours by car is nothing
19:52:42 <Xaroth> back and forth through the entire country here...
19:53:42 <Zuu> yea, you're supposed to be transport nerds. :-p
19:53:44 <Eddi|zuHause> if you're 5 people, that means only 1 hour each ;)
19:54:04 <TrueBrain> make sure to be there the 19th :p
19:54:05 <Eddi|zuHause> or you can go 5 hours by train instead ;)
19:55:01 <Zuu> 120 Euro just to get to Hanover was the price I got. Hopefully there is some tricks to get it cheaper.
19:55:23 <planetmaker> Zuu: that sounds not too expensive
19:55:45 <__ln__> from Hamburg on you can use Niedersachsen-Ticket
19:56:39 <planetmaker> it's like 25€(?) return from Hannover
19:57:04 <planetmaker> but that might limit you to non-highspeed trains
19:58:13 <__ln__> Zuu: More like travel-as-much-as-you-want-during-one-day-in-Niedersachsen-for-17€-or-so.
19:58:21 <planetmaker> it's a day(?) ticket which allows free travel within all Lower Saxony
19:58:38 <TrueBrain> but you need 2, as you need to get back too
19:58:48 <__ln__> Covers regional trains, public transport of certain cities, and some buses.
19:59:30 <Zuu> I guess "Niedersachsen" means that it is such a ticket. As I said my german is void/null/zero.
19:59:37 <__ln__> TrueBrain: thinking about getting back is premature optimization
20:00:30 <__ln__> Zuu: nieder = nedre, sachsen = sachsen
20:01:15 <Eddi|zuHause> Zuu: no, niedersachsen is the name of the country ;)
20:01:17 <planetmaker> Zuu: it's the name of the federal state I live in
20:01:49 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... going by train is hopeless...
20:02:07 <__ln__> Zuu: do you have a car?
20:02:19 <Eddi|zuHause> it takes me twice as long...
20:02:29 <Eddi|zuHause> with a 1h wait...
20:03:59 <Eddi|zuHause> if i try to avoid IC, three times...
20:05:25 <Zuu> still, if I lend/rent a car the germans would go crazy and flash their head lights as Swedish cars have the lights always on. :-p
20:05:57 <Eddi|zuHause> 0:45 to Halle (bus), 0:30 wait, 2:25 to Vienenburg, 1:30 wait, 0:25 to Wolfenbüttel, 0:20 wait, 0:20 to Schöppenstedt
20:06:19 <Zuu> Anyhow, I'll check that "detail" later.. :-)
20:06:33 <Eddi|zuHause> Zuu: actually that's not that common anymore, since there was a law passed that lights should always be on in the winter
20:07:08 <Zuu> Oh, so germans has shifted their minds towards accepting people driving with the lights on?
20:08:17 <planetmaker> Zuu: when driving 'on duty' I'm required to drive with lights on
20:08:31 <Eddi|zuHause> Zuu: yes, in the past ~2 years
20:08:55 <planetmaker> I made it even a habit to do it personally past-time, too
20:09:26 <Eddi|zuHause> cars support you in that nowadays, automatically switching the lights off if you stop them and open the door
20:09:37 <Zuu> Here I've read about some legislation that would allow people to drive with the ligts off if the car is enquiped with a sensor that turns on the lights when it gets dark.
20:09:37 <Eddi|zuHause> so you never need to touch the light switch
20:10:12 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: in Scandinavia you don't. Lights are switched on with the ignition
20:10:14 <Eddi|zuHause> hee... funny, going back is a lot faster ;)
20:11:36 <Eddi|zuHause> what does a "schönes wochenendticket" cost nowadays?
20:12:21 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: how far is your place from the train station?
20:12:28 <Zuu> planetmaker: though you usually have to use the switch in order to make it possible to toggle the full beam lights. If you don't touch the light switch, then you can only flash with the full beam lights but not enable them persistently.
20:12:51 <Eddi|zuHause> need to catch the train at 6:53 if i want to be back early enough
20:12:51 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: 20 minutes bus and / or tram
20:13:01 <__ln__> Terkhen: ¿vas a participar?
20:13:28 <Eddi|zuHause> need to be back at 11:00
20:13:29 <planetmaker> I guess there's no public transport then
20:13:36 <planetmaker> I could give you a ride
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20:14:07 <planetmaker> public transport is IMHO notoriously bad here when not weekday and working time
20:14:11 <Eddi|zuHause> ... this stupid site doesn't give pricing information...
20:14:23 <Terkhen> __ln__: too much for a student's economy... besides, I'll probably be working
20:14:24 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: does your tram/bus stop have a name?
20:14:26 <planetmaker> you don't even get to church at 10am from here downtown
20:14:43 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: Burgundenplatz or Siegfriedstraße
20:14:55 <wubbel4> what is so speacial about the nightley version?
20:14:55 <planetmaker> the first for tram, the latter for bus
20:15:10 <wubbel4> what is so speacial about the nightley version?
20:15:10 <Zuu> wubbel4: It updates every night
20:15:11 <planetmaker> wubbel4: they are the bleeding edge where devs work upon
20:15:20 <planetmaker> new features and new bugs
20:15:49 <wubbel4> whitch do you prever?
20:15:56 <wubbel4> the 1.01 version on nightleY?
20:15:59 <Zuu> And often more sane people at the nightly multiplayer servers.
20:16:15 <planetmaker> Zuu: at least the more experienced ones
20:16:22 <Zuu> I already miss a few features when I'm playing at stable servers.
20:16:35 <planetmaker> wubbel4: it really depends
20:16:36 <KenjiE20> yea 'sane' isn't the word I'd use for nightly folks :P
20:16:44 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... site doesn't like that name...
20:16:58 * planetmaker definitely is not sane
20:17:11 <Zuu> ctrl+click on buses/trains.
20:17:26 * planetmaker just agreed to host a party for people whom all I have never seen :-O
20:17:28 *** Progman has joined #openttd
20:17:33 <Eddi|zuHause> "Ihre Eingabe "Schöppenstedt, Burgundenplatz" konnte vom Provider "Niedersachsen" nicht interpretiert werden."
20:17:56 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: don't go to Schöppenstedt. Go to Braunschweig Hauptbahnhof
20:18:00 <wubbel4> but i going to play now
20:18:07 <wubbel4> you all have a nice day :)
20:18:22 <Zuu> Sure, though it's more like night..
20:18:36 <planetmaker> yeah... late at night actually
20:18:47 <Zuu> yea, got to sleep soonish
20:18:57 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: well, it _should_ direct me all the way...
20:19:20 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: try bsvag.de
20:19:29 <planetmaker> for that distances
20:19:39 <planetmaker> Schöppenstedt & Co
20:20:40 <Terkhen> andythenorth: about the lumber yard: I thought you was referring to something at the forum threads, I don't know what I did to not see that discussion after connecting to IRC
20:20:43 <Terkhen> what was the question?
20:21:01 <Zuu> hmm, would be fun to meet you all, hopefully not everyone will speak german/dutch :-p And hopefully will serve me well enough. :-)
20:21:15 <andythenorth> I am creating a Lumber Yard that produces ENSP from lumber and chemicals. I was wondering about having it accept MNSP, but I think it's a bad idea
20:21:41 <Zuu> And hopefully my ears will+*
20:21:41 <planetmaker> Zuu: I'm quite confident that we'll find with English a common basis :-)
20:21:45 *** Devroush has joined #openttd
20:22:01 <OwenS> planetmaker: With lots of funny accents :p
20:22:11 <planetmaker> That'll be fun, yeah
20:22:30 <planetmaker> But accents can't get more funny than what one gets served at international conferences
20:22:35 <OwenS> planetmaker: But even in the UK some of us can't understand each other :p
20:22:45 <Terkhen> andythenorth: I agree, I would not use the machine shop at all in that case and that defeats the purpose of the lumber yard
20:22:48 <planetmaker> OwenS: happend me within Germany, too
20:22:48 <Weeknie> Where is this gathering now?
20:27:07 * andythenorth wouldn't bother porting code that works :P
20:27:42 <frosch123> let's post "what a waste of time, port it to nml"
20:29:36 <__ln__> does it make sense to approach from Berlin?
20:30:12 <Zuu> __ln__: you're from Finland right?
20:30:15 <frosch123> there are direct connections between berlin an braunschweig, if you mean that
20:31:57 <__ln__> frosch123: that is what i mean
20:32:44 <Alberth> planetmaker: dev.openttdcoop.org server doesn't tell you the path to clone from, for a project, does it?
20:33:11 <frosch123> 35€ per direction for 3 hours per directon, 50 € per direction for 1.5 hours per direction
20:33:39 <planetmaker> Alberth: not for every project, unfortunately. You could add it to a project description for each one
20:33:58 <planetmaker> for anonymous checkout
20:34:42 <planetmaker> __ln__: Berlin-BS is 1:30h by ICE train
20:35:31 <Ammler> but the other should rewrite and still work
20:35:32 <__ln__> hmm, would have to get insanely cheap flights to Berlin (compared to Hannover) in order to compensate the ICE.
20:35:44 <planetmaker> Ammler: I'll recall that then :-)
20:37:14 <planetmaker> [22:27] <frosch123> let's post "what a waste of time, port it to nml" <- I could hold myself back ;-)
20:37:24 <Alberth> Ammler: thanks, made a note about it.
20:37:50 <planetmaker> __ln__: if Hannover is cheaper to fly in, that's quicker, too
20:37:56 <planetmaker> good night, Alberth
20:38:35 <planetmaker> __ln__: rough estimate: Hannover is 1h, Berlin 1:30h...2h
20:39:31 <frosch123> but hannover - bs is way cheaper per train :p
20:40:36 <__ln__> 293€ turku-hannover by SAS, ugh. that's a lot of €€€.
20:41:09 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: that's only twice as much as what Zuu pays ;)
20:41:39 *** welshdragon is now known as welshdragon`
20:42:10 <Zuu> Actually I found out on bahn.de that from Lund all way to Braunschweig Hbf it costs 129 Euro.
20:43:08 <planetmaker> well, I wouldn't kick you out, if you decided to travel only on Monday or so :-)
20:43:09 <Zuu> I just found out how to get bahn.de in a (for me) more esily understandable language than german. :-)
20:43:31 <planetmaker> or come on Friday
20:43:49 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: going by bus seems to work, they seem to go every hour, and connectivity with the train is not bad
20:43:52 <planetmaker> long-distance travel can be difficult to time accurately
20:44:06 <Eddi|zuHause> like 10 minutes wait
20:44:07 <planetmaker> from Halle? Or Schöppenstedt?
20:44:17 <Weeknie> I got openTTD to compile
20:44:27 <Eddi|zuHause> from braunschweig main station ;)
20:44:46 <planetmaker> ah. Well. From the main train station it's not a problem
20:44:56 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i'm still not sure...
20:45:29 <planetmaker> just Sunday morning won't work :-) But then ... as said, I could give a ride. A taxi is 10€
20:45:36 <planetmaker> alternatively that is
20:45:38 <TrueBrain> glx: will you join us too? Or is it really to far away? :)
20:46:02 <Weeknie> It took me about 3 hours to get zlib working correctly on the thing...
20:46:06 <Weeknie> Oh well, its' fixed now
20:46:37 <Weeknie> Let me be happy if I want to lol
20:47:10 <Weeknie> Hmm well, good night everyone
20:47:21 *** theholyduck has joined #openttd
20:47:30 <planetmaker> from where would you need to travel?
20:48:25 <planetmaker> Ammler: even then :-)
20:48:34 <glx> Ammler: yes the best way to be late ;)
20:48:35 <planetmaker> By car it's 12 hours. By train... dunno.
20:48:36 <Zuu> My bill ends at 270 euro :-p
20:48:46 <TrueBrain> Zuu: :| :| :| :| :|
20:48:55 <__ln__> Zuu: hur mycket säger SAS till dej?
20:49:00 *** Weeknie has joined #openttd
20:49:07 <Zuu> __ln__: haven't checked them
20:49:20 <planetmaker> Zuu: from where do you travel?
20:49:32 <Eddi|zuHause> glx: at least you're late at high speed ;)
20:49:44 <TrueBrain> it will cost me .. 80 euro, both ways (gas-price)
20:49:46 <Eddi|zuHause> glx: and you paid extra to do so ;)
20:50:16 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: sounds about right
20:50:45 <Yexo> TrueBrain: is that totally or per person?
20:50:51 <Zuu> planetmaker: Malmö/Copenhagen
20:51:03 <planetmaker> Oh, that's indeed acceptable distance
20:51:33 <TrueBrain> and I guess we will have to take some drinks or something to share with planetmaker :p
20:51:38 <michi_cc> planetmaker: Am I reading that right, party? Would fit, if no ash is interfering, I should be back in Germany on the 17th :)
20:52:04 <planetmaker> yes, you read correctly
20:52:20 <Zuu> My guess is that going alone in a car will not cost more than 270 even if I have to rent it. Maybe with international extra fees.
20:52:25 <michi_cc> And travel would be no problem, seeing that I live near Hannover
20:53:14 <michi_cc> I might fall asleep in the evening tough, thanks to Bloody Timezones :)
20:54:16 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
20:54:51 <Eddi|zuHause> seems to be 37,50€ per ticket
20:55:33 <Eddi|zuHause> so unless i get back on the same day, that makes almost 80€ for me, too...
20:56:03 <Eddi|zuHause> unless someone meets me in Halle and we share the ticket
20:56:27 <Eddi|zuHause> up to 5 people ;)
20:56:35 <__ln__> is that the wunderschönes weekend ticket?
20:56:44 <planetmaker> Zuu: I calculated that going by car up to Alesund (Norway) costs ~500€ fuel
20:56:54 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: sure there's no 1-person edition of it?
20:57:02 <planetmaker> (return that is). You're about half-way 2/5 to there
20:57:08 <planetmaker> so 200€ might be right
20:57:22 <__ln__> fuel is expensive in norway, at least used to be back in 90's.
20:57:32 <planetmaker> two-way money ;-)
20:57:36 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd
20:58:00 <Eddi|zuHause> don't forget the money exchange fee
20:58:10 <planetmaker> thus I decided to take the plane for that distance. 1/4 travel time for same price (fuel costs halfed)
20:58:28 <Zuu> hmm, so it depends on the car price. My dad's car has the feature of needing you to disconnect the battery when you let it stand unused for any longer time or it will dischanrge. :-p
20:58:52 <planetmaker> what a nice 'feature'
20:59:09 <Zuu> Renting a volvo would be at about 80 euro.
20:59:16 <planetmaker> well, we can arrange that, too, I guess
20:59:25 <planetmaker> (a disconnected battery that is)
21:00:48 <Zuu> I'm not really sure if I would like to go far with that car though as you can't really be sure it will not lose any more functions. :-)
21:01:40 <planetmaker> 6 hours drive according to google
21:05:43 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... DB suggests 30€ per direction
21:06:07 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause: you still have a STudentenausweise?
21:06:25 <planetmaker> then you probably have free travel by Nasa? :-)
21:06:32 <planetmaker> I like that abreviation ;-)
21:07:22 <Eddi|zuHause> included is only within halle during nights and weekend. pay extra for whole day in halle, and more extra if you want one zone outside of halle
21:08:03 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a bad way... but voting for a full region (MDV) ticket was repeatedly rejected, because it would involve everyone who does not want at least two zones pay more...
21:08:57 <Eddi|zuHause> MDV is Halle and Leipzig, plus surrounding area
21:09:37 <Eddi|zuHause> south-eastern Sachsen-Anhalt and north-western Sachsen
21:09:41 <Zuu> Oo, only ~20-30 euro to go by ferry to Rostock :-)
21:09:48 <Zuu> (as passenger without car)
21:09:58 <Eddi|zuHause> would have cost every student 100€ per semester
21:10:27 <Eddi|zuHause> but that didn't find a majority...
21:10:50 <Eddi|zuHause> damn democracy...
21:11:25 * SmatZ should re-enable BNC logging for #openttd
21:12:09 <SmatZ> oh, ZNC got new web interface
21:14:23 <SmatZ> how comes I am able to login to ZNC when the "allowed IP" is 88.146.45.*, but I got different IP now
21:14:50 <xOR> because * is on that list, too?
21:15:11 <planetmaker> SmatZ: r20k party 19/20 June at my place
21:16:03 <SmatZ> __ln__: planetmaker: perfect!
21:16:13 * SmatZ re-enabled logging at #openttd
21:17:24 <SmatZ> planetmaker: where can I find any further info?
21:17:42 <planetmaker> we just decided this evening
21:19:10 <planetmaker> might take a bit from your place...
21:19:19 <planetmaker> but would be pretty cool :-)
21:19:23 <SmatZ> ok, about 450kms for me, fine :)
21:19:35 <planetmaker> ui, I suspected more
21:19:40 <TrueBrain> it is funny that going to somewhere in germany from germany can be so expensive .. in the netherlands, at most it would cost 35 euros I believe
21:19:59 <TrueBrain> I wonder if I should ask DarkVater to join :p
21:20:03 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: distances are bigger :-)
21:20:49 <TrueBrain> lol, and at that moment I see him come online at MSN :p
21:22:28 <planetmaker> then go for it, TrueBrain
21:23:48 <Zuu> Going by ferry I'll get down to about 100 euro in total, given that rostock train station is somewhat close to the ferry terminal.
21:24:04 <planetmaker> I still wonder if I should make a public thread. I guess: why not. It's anyway more people than can sleep in my flat, I think, already :-)
21:24:11 <TrueBrain> Zuu: even if it is not, it doesn't change the price :p
21:24:38 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: that is true; and if too many people come, you will need to find some place for us somewhere nearby :p
21:24:51 <planetmaker> I count 12 so far
21:25:53 <planetmaker> TB, Rb, Yx, Alberth and maybe Hirundo
21:26:06 <planetmaker> maybe Xaroth, but I guess we can dismiss him ;-)
21:26:19 <TrueBrain> I am sure if you put it on the forum, more people will come (if not much more)
21:26:24 <TrueBrain> although it is short-term planning, so :p
21:26:34 <planetmaker> yes, I suspect that'll be the case
21:26:49 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: V453000 was last seen in #openttd 6 weeks, 1 day, 6 hours, 29 minutes, and 21 seconds ago: <V453000> dont use sound ^^
21:26:56 *** welshdragon` is now known as welshdragon
21:27:01 <planetmaker> SmatZ: other universe
21:27:04 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: but it is your party, so ;)
21:27:29 <SmatZ> planetmaker: do you think there are more disjoint universes?
21:27:32 <TrueBrain> let me know how many people will come, and I will take care of the cake :p
21:27:39 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: why disjoint?
21:27:44 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: that amount of people can have a BBQ or so still :-)
21:27:53 <SmatZ> TrueBrain: if they were joint, it would be one universe I think :)
21:27:58 <TrueBrain> oeh, a BBQ sounds like a VERY nice idea
21:27:58 <planetmaker> SmatZ: that's an oxymoron
21:28:11 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: well, it can be non-disjoint and not joint ;)
21:28:12 <planetmaker> uni-verse = all-embracing ;-)
21:28:32 <TrueBrain> like [1,2,3] and [3,4,5] ;)
21:28:49 <Xaroth> planetmaker: I'm not going.
21:29:02 <SmatZ> TrueBrain: that's hard to imagine, at least for me :)
21:29:27 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: well, there are good reasons to believe there is some interaction between other universes and ours
21:29:40 <TrueBrain> well, within certain theories of parallel universes at least :p
21:29:52 * SmatZ never heard of such theories
21:30:05 <__ln__> who's going to invite mr. B?
21:30:07 <SmatZ> maybe in sci-fi movies :)
21:30:23 <planetmaker> __ln__: you mean the dolphin?
21:30:42 <planetmaker> he has a standing invitation at my place
21:30:43 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: I am too hangover to come up with the names, but the current theories say there should be parallel universes :p
21:30:57 <TrueBrain> I think he would be crazy enough to come :p
21:30:58 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: may I doubt that?
21:31:02 <__ln__> i'm not familiar with the concept of the dolphin. :)
21:31:10 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: you may. I am trying to come up with the name ... I fail :p
21:31:29 <planetmaker> __ln__: then I don't know whom you mean with Mr B
21:31:50 <__ln__> planetmaker: the danish one
21:32:08 <TrueBrain> Copenhagen interpretation :)
21:32:16 <TrueBrain> I browsed all cities before I found it ;)
21:32:23 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: I think they mean the one from Canada
21:32:24 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: I have not seen anyone_danish.
21:32:37 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: I thought of the canada one, yes
21:33:05 <TrueBrain> where does Terkhen live?
21:33:06 <SmatZ> btw, is Terkhen coming?
21:33:07 <planetmaker> night Terkhen . Got travel plans for 19 June?
21:33:18 <glx> TrueBrain: south from me :)
21:33:32 <__ln__> he kind of said 'no' earlier
21:34:28 <__ln__> 23:14 < Terkhen> __ln__: too much for a student's economy... besides, I'll probably be working
21:34:44 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: was the Copenhagen interpertation not the most accepted interperation of quantum mechanics atm?
21:35:04 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: it's just different sides of the medal. Neither is wrong nor right.
21:35:11 <planetmaker> Just different ways of looking at hte same thing
21:35:21 <TrueBrain> either way, it depends on the existance of many worlds
21:35:42 <planetmaker> quantum mechanics doesn't require that afaik
21:36:03 <TrueBrain> it in fact defines the probability of observing one path in it
21:36:43 <planetmaker> probabilities of something happening don't require it to happen in another complementary universe
21:36:54 <TrueBrain> but okay, many-world interpertation is more about 1 universe which splits, then multiple universes
21:37:25 <planetmaker> hm... I like the BBQ idea in my backyard :-)
21:37:41 <TrueBrain> if you want any financial compenstation, do let us know
21:37:42 <planetmaker> Germans are infamous for their BBQ obsession
21:37:49 <TrueBrain> or we should ask orudge for donation money :p
21:38:26 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: bring some Duvel :-) Or ... hm, Alberth is from Eindhoven, right?
21:38:37 <planetmaker> He could bring Hertog Jan ;-)
21:38:53 <TrueBrain> haha, we will bring the Hertog Jans for you :p
21:39:27 <SmatZ> from Madrid to Frankfurt
21:39:42 <__ln__> does anyone remember what part of Spain he's from?
21:40:07 <planetmaker> SmatZ: Frankfurt might not be the best destination within Germany, though
21:40:20 <planetmaker> it's quite some distance to there
21:40:36 <TrueBrain> can anyone advise a mediaplayer? (720p)
21:40:55 <planetmaker> TrueBrain: but I'll think about how we deal with all the food I'll have to get :-)
21:41:14 <TrueBrain> yeah, just let us know; I am sure most of us don't mind to chip in a few bucks
21:41:32 <SmatZ> planetmaker: for some reason, I can't search for flights to Hannover
21:41:49 <__ln__> SmatZ: did you try spelling it Hanover
21:42:03 <planetmaker> SmatZ: then Berlin would be better. Yeah, English is Hanover. They spell it wrong
21:48:11 <TrueBrain> either way, night all
21:48:18 <SmatZ> good night to you, TrueBrain :)
21:49:22 <planetmaker> hm, I should go, too :-)
21:49:27 <planetmaker> have a good night folks :-)
21:49:42 <SmatZ> good night to you too, planetmaker :)
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22:05:06 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... triple posting is maybe not the best idea...
22:06:25 * SmatZ isn't here to judge you
22:17:22 <ccfreak2k> You'd better Hanover your wallet!
22:17:56 <Eddi|zuHause> ... take your feet up... flat joke coming...
22:20:41 <__ln__> 175 Jahre Eisenbahn in Deutschland
22:39:06 <__ln__> insane prices... 98 euros one-way for helsinki-rostock for a *seat*. not even a cabin.
22:48:28 <Eddi|zuHause> aren't you on the way for a whole day like that? :p
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22:48:54 <Eddi|zuHause> by helsinki-rostock i presume you mean ferry
22:49:24 <Eddi|zuHause> not sure how you get from rostock to braunschweig, though...
22:50:34 <Eddi|zuHause> braunschweig is on an east-west line (berlin-magdeburg-braunschweig-hannover), how you approach that from the north i don't know
22:54:02 <Eddi|zuHause> by the looks of it, they send you via berlin
22:58:02 <Eddi|zuHause> if you take only regional trains, you go Rostock-Schwerin-Wittenberge-Stendal-Braunschweig (3 transfers)
22:58:28 <__ln__> in any case, doesn't make sense to pay 200€ just for the ferry, as the flight to hannover is "only" 293€.
22:58:40 <Eddi|zuHause> that is probably the least populated area in germany :p
22:59:09 <__ln__> the ferry also takes something like 27 hours one-way :/
23:00:35 <Eddi|zuHause> train goes every 2 hours, if you arrive after 17:00, you won't make it for that day ;)
23:04:02 <__ln__> whatever the method, i think arriving on the german soil one day earlier is necessary
23:04:30 <Eddi|zuHause> this is totally weird... they send you Rostock-Bad Kleinen-Lübeck-Hamburg-Bremen[spend the night (1:30-4:30) here]-Hannover-Braunschweig :p
23:06:26 <Eddi|zuHause> can't use weekend ticket, because you wuld need two of them
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23:24:25 <orudge> [16:37:45] <TrueBrain> or we should ask orudge for donation money :p <-- only if you hold it here in Minneapolis ;)
23:26:13 <Eddi|zuHause> orudge: if the donation money is good for 20ish plane tickets from and to europe :p
23:27:07 <Eddi|zuHause> and i heard they now take "entrance fee" for the USA, like it's a fun park :p
23:28:56 <orudge> no "entrance fee" as far as I'm aware
23:29:01 <orudge> maybe as part of other taxes
23:29:05 <orudge> but that's not uncommon for other countries
23:29:21 <orudge> and, well, perhaps not 20, no, unless you all fit yourselves into each others' luggage :p
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23:44:24 <potrzebie> Hi! I have a bunch of trains, each one with a few coal cars and a few goods cars, going between two stations. I transfer the coal at one of the stations and take cargo (goods), but the coal I just transfered is picked up again :/ Can I solve this with the load/unload/etc-buttons or will I need a extra station?
23:46:17 <Yexo> either you need to make all trains only carry one cargo type (only coal or goods) or you need 2 stations
23:54:55 <potrzebie> A setting for "don't pick up what you've just unloaded" would be a very helpful feature :)
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