IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2010-01-17
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00:19:44 <frosch123> noone plays with waypoints, right?
00:24:07 <frosch123> but then you do not use newgrf waypoints, or non-default rail, right?
00:24:46 <Eoin> i just use the default one :P
00:25:20 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i occasionally use the dbset waypoints
00:26:06 * fjb uses waypoints with grfs but dind't have time to play the last weeks.
00:26:30 <frosch123> oh weeks do not matter
00:26:45 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: anything particular?
00:27:36 <frosch123> just the default waypoint uses the signalsprites for monorail and maglev in the waypoint picker for some thousand revisions :p
00:28:09 <Eddi|zuHause> i never use monorail or maglev :p
00:28:16 <Eddi|zuHause> but something's wrong
00:28:19 <frosch123> well, or third-rail or metro or so
00:28:39 <Eddi|zuHause> but the "change visual of adjacent waypoints" thing doesn't work anymore
00:29:31 <frosch123> i guess it behaves the same as stations now, just that you cannot build more than one waypoint tile at once
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00:35:17 <Eddi|zuHause> compare the waypoints in this picture: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Ravenswald%20Transport,%2024.%20Jan%201951.png
00:35:20 <Eddi|zuHause> and this picture: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Ravenswald%20Transport,%2024.%20Sep%201987_1.png
00:39:16 <frosch123> well, they are different waypoints, aren't they?
00:39:37 <frosch123> but what did you with the sign?
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00:41:31 <Eddi|zuHause> turned invisible, of course...
00:42:06 <Eddi|zuHause> but why change the drawing from "waypoints next to each other" to "waypoints of the same 'station'"?
00:42:38 <frosch123> no idea, maybe that is what the specs say
00:42:58 <frosch123> how does it look nowadays if you join the waypoints?
00:44:27 <Eddi|zuHause> joined waypoints look like the old one
00:44:59 <Eddi|zuHause> but it doesn't make sense, they should look like that in both situations...
00:46:13 <frosch123> and if you two adjacent non-joined stations? shall they also join graphics?
00:46:39 <frosch123> and also if they are from different companies? or only after you took the other company over?
00:48:20 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: what if you try to build one station out of separate platforms? they should look joined
00:48:56 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know about different companies... could look weird with company colours ;)
00:49:05 <frosch123> that is business of the newgrf, it can distinguish those cases
00:50:35 * frosch123 wonders whether Terkhen also used kde4 kate with its broken indenter
00:51:33 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r18841 /trunk/src/ (station_cmd.cpp train_cmd.cpp): -Fix (r16869): Default-waypoint was drawn incorrectly for monorail and maglev in the waypoint picker.
00:51:41 <fjb> In which way is it broken?
00:52:44 <frosch123> it lacks an option to define whether indenting is done with spaces or tabs. it looks like it tries to determine the indenting style from the previous line, which obviously fails if that one starts at column 1
00:54:24 <Rubidium> not to mention that adding/removing indentation with /*\n *...\n */ style comments fails horribly
00:54:35 <frosch123> so i always have to fix the indenting when starting a new function or so, and sometimes i forget and get something like space+tab
00:55:28 <frosch123> now i wrote a script to fix that, and it just fixed a case not by me :p
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00:59:46 <Eddi|zuHause> <Rubidium> not to mention that adding/removing indentation with /*\n *...\n */ style comments fails horribly <-- that's a design issue, because kate is line based, so regexp matching cannot span multiple lines
01:00:19 <Eddi|zuHause> well. it's theoretically possible, but more difficult to implement
01:00:59 <Rubidium> it should just remove the first tab or add a tab at the begin... not mess with stuff further in the line
01:01:02 <frosch123> it worked fine in 3.5.10
01:02:08 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r18842 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: Rename SPRITE_MODIFIER_USE_OFFSET to SPRITE_MODIFIER_CUSTOM_SPRITE, invert its meaning, and also use it for industry/house layouts instead of IS_CUSTOM_SPRITE().
01:04:13 <frosch123> hmm, i cannot remember using the remove/add indent thingie. but pressing enter after \t\t/** correctly indented with \t\t *
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01:22:55 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r18843 /trunk/src/sprite.cpp: -Codechange: Only NewGRF supplied spritelayouts use SPRITE_MODIFIER_CUSTOM_SPRITE, so no extra tests needed.
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01:39:51 <Rhamphoryncus> I use gvim set to show tabs and only use spaces for indentation (in my own code). Much less confusing
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09:00:28 <andythenorth> peter1138: go there and see it for the rest of us
09:00:39 * andythenorth has never played with DBSet
09:01:13 * andythenorth offers players "FISH with no default ships"
09:02:21 <peter1138> well i mean running it on my server for a change, heh
09:04:41 * andythenorth decides that "realism" is less important than "don't have industries screw with players vehicles"
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09:13:00 * peter1138 ponders rewriting bridges-over-stations
09:14:32 <peter1138> gosh r9833 that was for
09:15:55 <Terkhen> andythenorth: the default ships were just some annoying stuff that made me scroll down before creating a ship
09:21:22 <welshdragon> the X32 Bangor - Aberystwyth Trawscambria service
09:22:02 <welshdragon> question is: will google maps know where I am...
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09:27:00 <Izlots> hi, maybe someone can help me. I tried to use 32bpp grafics: I enabled a blitter in my openttd.cfg, but where to put the .tar files? Its windows 7, so i tried data folder in programm dir, and data folter in C:/Users/<my username>/Documents/OpenTTD/data. Also i extrated the tar file and put the sprites folder to both data folders, all without any effect
09:27:23 <Yexo> are you using opengfx or the original ttd graphics?
09:27:47 <Yexo> and if you extract the tar file,what are the directories called?
09:28:07 <Izlots> ogfx1_base, ogfx1_tropical
09:28:24 <Yexo> have you tried extracting the opengfx tar file?
09:29:19 <Izlots> opengfx is extratected to <program dir>/data
09:29:52 <Yexo> if you put the 32bpp tars in the same directory is should work
09:31:43 <Yexo> oh, you're trying to use some extrazoom level graphics
09:31:52 <Yexo> did you download the patched binary?
09:34:12 <Izlots> nope :( thanks! now i know whats wrong :)
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10:06:32 <peter1138> oh, i never wrote the code to allow building stations under bridges, only bridges over stations
10:07:25 <peter1138> sprite sorting issues abound :(
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12:48:22 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: yexo * r18844 /trunk/src/table/airport_defaults.h: -Codechange: add GPL notice to src/table/airport_defaults.h
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13:11:02 <PeterT> Terkhen, why do you use question mark -> screenshot instead of Ctrl + S?
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13:12:51 <PeterT> because that little GUI stays on the screenshot
13:12:56 <PeterT> and, I was just wondering
13:13:12 <Terkhen> as long as it does not cover what I want to show, I don't think that's a problem
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13:35:10 <DorpsGek> PeterT: I have not seen Bjarni.
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14:05:26 <PeterT> is there ever a good reason for someone making an entire cpp file in comments?
14:08:25 <Xaroth> dunno, some people like to include their license in that way
14:08:53 <PeterT> look at clipboard_gui.cpp
14:09:27 <Xaroth> not everything is commented
14:09:53 <PeterT> Xaroth: <PeterT> look at clipboard_gui.cpp
14:10:17 <Yexo> most likely reason for it: fix compile problems in the rest of the code first without worrying about that file
14:10:28 <Yexo> but as long as it's commented out it doesn't do anything (obviously)
14:10:35 <Xaroth> Penda: IO clearly see 2 functions and a var
14:10:40 <Xaroth> the rest, yes, is comments
14:11:03 <Xaroth> s/Penda/PeterT/ s/IO/I/
14:11:20 <PeterT> Xarenda, what line number was that?
14:11:42 <Xaroth> line 625-ish in the diff
14:12:24 <PeterT> like I said twice before
14:12:34 <PeterT> look at Index: src/clipboard_gui.diff
14:14:47 <PeterT> seems adf88 already responded
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14:22:19 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: yexo * r18845 /trunk/ (9 files in 4 dirs): -Codechange: introduce AirportTileSpec and use it for animation
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14:43:42 * peter1138 ponders removing all the copyrighted graphics
14:47:43 <Terkhen> you mean the option of using the original graphics?
14:49:55 <Noldo> I think there are some sprites that are derivates of the originals distributed with openttd
14:50:56 <Terkhen> but if they are removed, their substitutes will not match with the original graphics
14:56:45 <peter1138> i mean the sprites that have been extracted and plastered all over the wiki
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15:01:11 * Terkhen doubts that the Foster bus changes in tropical climate
15:03:12 <Terkhen> you could give a time to change all of these sprites (for example, before 1.0.0) to avoid getting a lot of empty spaces at the wiki
15:05:38 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: frosch * r18846 /trunk/src/ (11 files): -Codechange: Merge DrawTileSeq into DrawCommonTileSeq.
15:27:28 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Bjarni
15:29:06 <Bjarni> I just read through the whole future for OSX port thread
15:29:31 <Bjarni> that wasn't any fun :(
15:29:59 <PeterT> are you back for good/
15:30:09 <PeterT> do we have a MacOSX developer?
15:31:02 <Bjarni> err.... I'm quite busy with my master thesis. I recall when I made the mac port in the first place I worked day and night (mainly nights) and I simply don't have that kind of time right now :s
15:32:45 <Bjarni> what saddens me the most is that while I have been busy things have become quite bad (worse than I expected) and nobody bothered to send a mail or PM to me
15:33:25 <Bjarni> not even asking if I might resume work or why I was absent
15:34:37 <Bjarni> All I got was user support requests, which were all replied with a solution (mainly read the wiki)
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15:35:32 <Bjarni> for all you know I could have been in an accident and ended up in hospital...
15:35:54 <Bjarni> PeterT: I just read it
15:42:35 <andythenorth> Bjarni: I for one am grateful for the work you *did* do on the Mac port
15:43:27 <Bjarni> yeah I like autoreplace too
15:43:33 <Bjarni> and the port is nice too ;)
15:43:46 <Bjarni> not to mention all the other stuff
15:44:59 <Bjarni> actually the hardest part of making the mac port in the first place (just getting it working) was due to SDL weirdness. If everything just did as expected and according to documentation then it would have been much faster to make
15:46:52 <jonty-comp> heh, I hate it when things don't work like the documentation says they will
15:47:20 <Bjarni> I spent a week getting the game to open a window to draw in
15:47:50 <Bjarni> once the issue was resolved (added one line of code) then it just worked
15:48:05 <Bjarni> because I had already done all the work to get it to compile
15:49:43 <Bjarni> On the other hand Apple provided great documentation on how to make universal binaries which meant I manage to make a working one (worked flawless!) on a Friday. Apple released the first intel mac the following Monday
15:50:20 <Bjarni> the documentation were so good that I could get it working without being able to test while coding
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15:55:44 <Bjarni> looks like Digitalfox has yet to figure out how a revolving door works :P
15:58:08 <askme> hi all , do you want to make more 500$ daily.. pm me now
15:58:28 *** Bjarni sets mode: +b *!*barakied@94.249.87.*
15:58:33 <arachnist> askme: i want to get less spam daily, kthx
15:58:42 *** askme was kicked by Bjarni (stop spamming)
15:59:12 <Bjarni> now that's one problem easily solved
15:59:26 <Digitalfox> Bjarni Actually I was setting up my neowin IRC account, so instead of clicking in close tab I clicked disconnect... My girlfriend is driving me mad with her thesis, shes making me answer a survey she's doing at the same time I'm coding a Project in C...
15:59:36 <jonty-comp> only ten minutes back and you're already banning people :D
16:00:31 <Bjarni> it wouldn't be responsible not to ban him. He were the one to make money out of whatever he had planned, not the people replying to him
16:00:41 <Bjarni> they could be the ones to lose the money
16:01:05 <Bjarni> so all in all it was my duty to protect the weak minded users in here
16:01:08 <PeterT> Bjarni: Nice. First day back and already an easy ban :-)
16:01:11 <jonty-comp> I would point out that those people don't appear all the time, though
16:01:21 <jonty-comp> they only showed up since you returned :P
16:01:26 <jonty-comp> and on freenode, apparently
16:01:48 <jonty-comp> although I ragequit freenode yesterday after getting ~10 global notices in an afternoon
16:02:56 <Bjarni> PeterT: with my interface all bans are easy. The real question is if they are fair or not ^^
16:04:32 <Bjarni> Digitalfox: oh good. You are replying to surveys for people doing thesises. Nice to know as I'm doing a thesis too :P
16:05:11 <Bjarni> jonty-comp: sounds bad. In fact it sounds like everything goes downhill the minute I turn my back on stuff
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16:07:15 <Digitalfox> Bjarni yeah, but her master thesis it actually interesting :p erotism in publicity ;)
16:08:06 <Bjarni> care to share the outcome of it?
16:08:34 <Digitalfox> not before tryinh some things out first :)
16:08:54 <Bjarni> remember to bring a camera for documentation purposes
16:09:40 <Bjarni> a master thesis should be a scientific sound piece of paper. You can't get anywhere without proper documentation
16:11:28 <Bjarni> hmmm... on a serious note. I wonder how one would actually do a master thesis on a topic like that
16:11:59 <Bjarni> I mean it's somewhat clear how you do it investigating some math theory or whatever
16:12:13 <Bjarni> however this topic... it's not that clear
16:12:20 * SmatZ chokes Hirundo for uploading crash.* in archive
16:12:47 <Digitalfox> yep, that's why she even has tv people that work in publicity replying to her with opinions, answering surveys and she is doing lot's of research on the topic.. And more importantly she's having fun with it :)
16:13:09 <Bjarni> erotism in public is mentioned and then SmatZ shows up
16:14:34 <Bjarni> Digitalfox: most people would have fun with a topic like that
16:15:20 <Bjarni> though I say it needs a certain degree of lack of shyness, not to mention the ability to keep a cool head when stuff gets hot
16:16:08 <Hirundo> Smatz: What's the issue?
16:16:09 <Digitalfox> She told of a case where a public poster was removed because the women in the picture had a breast showing up, many people complained and it was removed.. But at the same time the same pic was cover of many magazines and no one complained about those magazines.. She told me that many times in public people complain but in private they look at the picture a thousand times looking at every detail..
16:18:11 <Bjarni> Digitalfox: now that you mention magazines. I hate that you can't buy a train ticket or anything like that anymore without being exposed to the front pages of magazines containing rather lightly dressed women
16:18:52 <Bjarni> "hello I would like a ticket for (station)". "ok, that will be xx.xx. Leave the money on the boobs"
16:19:23 <Bjarni> some places have the magazines in piles on the table where you have to pay, which create situations like that
16:19:24 <Digitalfox> Yeah, but I'll ask you.. How many times have you been starring at home or in a coffe looking at the pic of a women half dressed?
16:19:54 <Bjarni> Digitalfox: 0 at the time when I was 10 and wanted to buy a Donald Duck magazine
16:19:54 <Digitalfox> Better not answer that bjarni ;)
16:20:46 <Bjarni> seriously... who would want to do something like that at the age of 10?
16:21:16 <Digitalfox> puberty comes sooner to some... :p
16:21:52 <Bjarni> oh wait... I once visited a friend and when we were alone in the house he said he had to show me something funny
16:22:10 <Bjarni> turned out it was his dad's magazine collection
16:22:12 <Digitalfox> oh no details bjarni please....
16:22:21 <Bjarni> oh man was that boring
16:23:36 <Rubidium> Bjarni: last time you joined it was because you were sick; you said back then that you were incredibly busy with uni stuff. You were also told about the bad shape of the OS X port back then. Now you're wondering why we didn't sent you an email every week to see whether you might have time to fix the stuff that's broken?
16:23:39 <Digitalfox> seriously, erostism in publicity is increasing, another example is that there's more publicity with erotism directed at women these days..
16:24:01 <Bjarni> jonty-comp: Do you know that's actually a joke in Denmark because hot women can be referred to as herrings....
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16:25:16 <jonty-comp> also, Bjarni: Rubidium welcomes you back
16:25:50 <Bjarni> Rubidium: well there is a difference between what you said back then and then publicly announce that the OSX port will be unsupported
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16:27:08 <Phazorx> got non ttd relevant question but i hope you guys excuse me :)
16:27:20 <Phazorx> trying to profile sometihng, and been a very long time since i used gprof
16:27:28 <Bjarni> you can go to the toilet now
16:27:29 <jonty-comp> I hope it isn't if we want to earn $500 extra per week
16:27:29 <Phazorx> does it only do like 1k ticks by default?
16:27:46 <Phazorx> jonty-comp: that's next on the agenda
16:27:57 <Phazorx> right before pant to take over the world
16:28:20 <jonty-comp> no, he stole my plan
16:28:27 <Phazorx> you can conquer it enxt week
16:28:39 <Phazorx> anwyay i compiled it with -pg
16:28:58 <Phazorx> and run it with gprof... but i get like only ~1000 ticks
16:29:06 <Phazorx> so i wonder if it is limitted or soemthing?
16:29:11 <Bjarni> seriously though I can't answer gprof questions :/
16:29:18 <Phazorx> well someone should be able to
16:29:26 <Phazorx> i know you guys profiled the pathfinders
16:29:31 <Phazorx> even i profiled yapf few times
16:29:32 <Terkhen> Phazorx: you can set the number of ticks with the -v null parameter... but I don't remember the syntax right now :/
16:29:36 <Phazorx> but that was 2 years ago
16:29:44 <Rubidium> Bjarni: we publicly announced that we would drop official OS X support if there would be no improvements. Primarily to get the bugs in the Mac port fixed by *some* Mac developer.
16:29:59 <Phazorx> Terkhen: The -v flag causes "gprof" to print the current version number, and then exit.
16:30:34 <Rubidium> Bjarni: with making the public announcement half a year before actually doing it we would at least not be blamed by "why didn't you tell us you needed help" kind of remarks
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16:32:21 <Yexo> Phazorx: it's a flag for openttd, not for gprof
16:32:26 <Terkhen> Phazorx: I meant OpenTTD option. -v null:ticks=(number)
16:32:47 <Phazorx> well that doesnt help much since i am o doing ottd :)
16:33:09 <Phazorx> but back to original question - is gprof limited by default
16:33:20 <Phazorx> or it runs till sighup?
16:33:47 <Terkhen> sorry, I can't help you then; I have only used gprof without options
16:34:05 <Phazorx> totaly agreed to that
16:34:10 <peter1138> openttd's null video driver is limited to 1000 ticks by default
16:34:17 <peter1138> 16:27 < Phazorx> got non ttd relevant question but i hope you guys excuse me :)
16:34:24 <peter1138> but you're not talking about that
16:34:29 <Rubidium> we also officially don't support 10.6 for 0.7 (e.g. FS#3194), given that 10.6 will quickly end up being the major version of OS X, what is the point in saying "we support OS X" whereas that would be a lie for the majority of OS X installs?
16:34:44 <Phazorx> i am talking about naev, whoch is completely different game
16:34:52 <Phazorx> has nothing to do with openttd
16:35:01 <Phazorx> but aside of that it is still a cpp app
16:35:07 <Phazorx> and i want to know why it pegs my cpu
16:35:11 <Phazorx> so i want to profile it
16:35:13 <peter1138> nothing to do with gprof
16:35:32 <Phazorx> peter1138: so gprof functions for whole duration while executable is running
16:35:51 <peter1138> yes, it doesn't know anything else
16:35:54 <Phazorx> there is no limitter of any kind based on number off calls, log size, image nubers, dll calls ?
16:36:16 * Phazorx mumbles so why the heck is it stopping it 1000 then :/
16:37:13 <SmatZ> Hirundo: I have to download the archive, I can't open the files in the browser
16:39:20 <zzero> I downloaded the recent svn trunk
16:39:33 <zzero> with my trains in a loaded game
16:39:51 <zzero> after the new beta came out
16:40:02 <zzero> and it worked fine through many revisions
16:40:10 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18847 /trunk/config.lib: -Fix [FS#3541] (r18769): configure didn't properly detect libtimidity anymore (hannibal218bc)
16:41:07 <zzero> my trains got *really* slow
16:41:21 <zzero> I weren't using any grf-s
16:41:37 <zzero> is this a bug or a feature?
16:42:10 <Terkhen> what revision are you using?
16:42:17 <Bjarni> do the trains just feel slow or do they report slow speeds as well?
16:42:19 <Rubidium> and what trains are you using?
16:42:49 <Bjarni> report slow speed as in the vehicle window reports like 20 km/h
16:43:04 <Bjarni> but they reported full speed?
16:43:09 <zzero> i'll check the reported speed
16:45:00 <zzero> I have reverted to an earlier version which worked fine
16:45:09 <Alberth> zzero: slow or just very slowly increasing in speed?
16:45:15 <zzero> I'll check the problematic one
16:45:46 <Alberth> check the vehicle acceleration setting
16:46:19 <Alberth> original causes very slowly increasing speed
16:46:43 <peter1138> train acceleration model: slow
16:46:43 <zzero> I did not change that setting
16:46:57 <zzero> I just loaded the game after compiling a new version
16:47:54 <peter1138> cos nobody seriously uses original acceleration
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16:48:30 <Phazorx> peter1138: can i bug you a bit more with gprof stuff
16:48:38 <Phazorx> i'm failing to comprehend sometihng
16:49:04 <Terkhen> zzero: in which revision it worked fine? what realistic acceleration setting are you using?
16:49:36 <Rubidium> Terkhen: the original settings
16:50:06 <zzero> I was using original acceleration
16:50:58 <zzero> I was using a trunk version from a few days ago
16:51:52 <Phazorx> also, cpu sats say it was 3 minutes as well rather than 3 seconds... so am i missing something or 99% of time goes to nowhere?
16:52:00 <Yexo> maybe because gproff has a lot of overhead?
16:52:01 <zzero> but for example a train with 2 sh40 engine is accelerating awfully slow
16:52:34 <Phazorx> Yexo: cpu usage seems same for regular binary and for one copiled with -pg flags
16:52:47 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18848 /trunk/src/train_cmd.cpp: -Fix (r18838): the original accelaration got broken
16:53:26 <zzero> I changed to realistic acceleration
16:53:37 <zzero> and my trains became really fast
16:53:43 <Rubidium> Phazorx: gprof doesn't do libraries that aren't compiled with gprof support. If you're doing a non-null/non-fast forward game most time is spent in 'sleep'
16:53:59 <zzero> they're climbing hills like going horizontally
16:54:31 <Yexo> zzero: but in turns your trains will slowdown more
16:54:42 <Phazorx> Rubidium: reason why i want to profile this thing is because it uses 1.5 cores while showing title screen which is static
16:54:50 <frosch123> zzero: that is because most players want their trains to go very fast with lots of cargo, and as they lack any reasons for trains doing so, they call it "realisitc"
16:55:03 <Phazorx> which makes me beleife it does sometihng other than sleeps
16:55:13 <Rubidium> Phazorx: SDL + Audio + Ubuntu?
16:55:21 <Phazorx> especially if it does use these ticks as fasr as kernel is concerned
16:55:36 <zzero> I just wanted to ask the corresponding question
16:55:38 <Phazorx> SDL + OGL + OAL + MinGW + XP32
16:55:54 <Rubidium> oh, then I've got absolutely no clue
16:55:56 <Phazorx> sound is a bit relevant but it is not pulseaudio anyway
16:56:12 <Phazorx> OAL somehow is messed up as well here, ut i test with no audio atm
16:56:16 <Terkhen> parenthesis... my old nemesis strikes again :(
16:56:17 <Rubidium> but you'd be better of compiling all libraries with profiling support too
16:56:32 <Phazorx> hmm... that will be a chllenge
17:01:43 <Phazorx> okay, say i have list of ddls i want to find sources for
17:01:55 <Phazorx> how do i go about that
17:02:00 <zzero> so now my trains neglect any slopes
17:02:13 <zzero> but if I go with the original model
17:02:14 <Phazorx> also, where does OpenTTD SDL libs come from?
17:02:16 <Terkhen> zzero: using realistic acceleration, you can change how they behave in slopes
17:02:21 <Phazorx> for win builds that is
17:02:42 <Terkhen> also, the commit that was just made should fix original acceleration
17:02:59 <zzero> okay, I'm gonna check that one
17:04:00 <Terkhen> I was the person who broke it, not the one who fixed it :P
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17:06:17 <Phazorx> and it just occured to me there are no dlls that come with openttd?
17:06:26 <Phazorx> or are they dumped by installer into system?
17:06:38 <zzero> Terkhen: maybe not so much thanks than :-p
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17:14:36 <DorpsGek> PeterT: Bjarni was last seen in #openttd 31 minutes and 32 seconds ago: <Bjarni> but they reported full speed?
17:14:56 <DorpsGek> Bjarni: PeterT was last seen in #openttd 20 seconds ago: <PeterT> @seen Bjarni
17:16:13 <PeterT> Bjarni: Why were you "saddened" when you read the Future of the MacOSX port?
17:16:38 <PeterT> sorry, I mean this: <Bjarni> that wasn't any fun :(
17:17:18 *** welshdragon has joined #openttd
17:18:01 <Bjarni> PeterT: well it looks like the mac port blew up after I last checked it
17:18:49 *** Terkhen has joined #openttd
17:19:23 <Bjarni> PeterT: yes. Never got around to actually investigate how to solve this one
17:19:24 <Alberth> Phazorx: OpenTTD is cross-platform, dll's are useless at any non-windows platform, hence we use external libs, or provide source.
17:19:31 <Bjarni> though somebody was bugging me to do it ASAP
17:20:04 <PeterT> I'm really glad I have Windows and Linux
17:21:37 * jonty-comp seems to apply to different parts of all of those
17:21:44 <jonty-comp> perhaps I'm an everything-fanboy
17:22:16 <jonty-comp> in fact, if you read in a vertical zig-zag from the bottom left upwards, that's me
17:22:17 <PeterT> My favorite is how Windows fan boys see Mac
17:22:42 <jonty-comp> if only Macs came with graphics tablets
17:22:45 <Bjarni> and that's possibly the only picture where I pass and state that's not how the world is
17:22:49 <Xaroth> jonty-comp: some do :o
17:22:59 <Sacro> they do if you get a glass trackpad
17:23:03 <jonty-comp> well, new mighty mouse not included
17:23:04 <Bjarni> <jonty-comp> if only Macs came with graphics tablets <-- I went to a mac shop and tried one
17:23:15 <Xaroth> but the tablets suck donkey
17:23:17 <Xaroth> if you're used to a mouse
17:23:23 <Xaroth> might be useful for a graphic artist
17:23:25 <jonty-comp> I dropped the new mighty mouse in PC world
17:23:31 <Bjarni> worked ok, but I wasn't convinced that it would be a good investment
17:23:46 <PeterT> Bjarni: How well do you know GIT?
17:23:48 <jonty-comp> I could never get the hang of them, you have to draw while not looking at what you're drawing
17:24:13 <Bjarni> PeterT: I failed to get it working :(
17:24:24 <Bjarni> used mercurial instead
17:24:47 <Bjarni> <PeterT> on a mac? <-- yeah, though it was ages ago
17:24:52 <jonty-comp> that's a point, you're supposed to be able to install OS X in VirtualBox now
17:24:59 <Bjarni> the code might be more user friendly now
17:25:25 * Bjarni investigates virtualbox
17:25:32 <jonty-comp> well, it's a bit hacky
17:25:37 <jonty-comp> but they recently added EFI support
17:26:11 <Xaroth> Bjarni's firewall is set to deny all :P
17:26:54 <glx> [18:02:26] <Phazorx> also, where does OpenTTD SDL libs come from? <-- win builds don't use SDL by default
17:27:19 <Phazorx> glx: how are they complied then?
17:27:55 <Bjarni> EFI isn't enough on it's own. It also needs some extended memory management
17:28:02 <glx> dynamically loaded if the dll is found and the code compiled to use it
17:28:14 <glx> but MSVC builds are compiled without sdl support
17:28:37 <Phazorx> and if i use mingw myself?
17:29:27 <glx> if headers are found by configure, then mingw builds are compiled with sdl support, but it's activated at runtime only if the dll is found
17:29:39 <glx> and with -s sdl of course
17:29:40 <Bjarni> PAE... that was the name
17:31:16 <DorpsGek> PeterT: fonsinchen was last seen in #openttd 3 days, 16 hours, 24 minutes, and 14 seconds ago: <fonsinchen> Eddi|zuHause: almost. I have added gitmake and .gitignore
17:36:23 *** fjb is now known as Guest2549
17:37:19 <Eddi|zuHause> the second time...
17:37:49 <Eddi|zuHause> the third time and i'll send in a formal complaint...
17:38:19 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... Bjarni is back and the whole channel is full of spam... correlation or causality? :p
17:40:11 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause: I don't think spam have been a severe issue today
17:40:25 <Bjarni> except for that banned bigot
17:40:27 <Xaroth> compared to the past months, it was
17:41:26 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe my level to declare "a lot of text" to "spam" is a little low ;)
17:42:14 <Bjarni> isn't spending several lines talking about spam kind of spam on it's own?
17:42:51 <Eddi|zuHause> see... you're even causing me to spam!
17:42:52 <Bjarni> I mean if no spam appeared, then you wouldn't talk about it and this means your outburst is part of a spam issue
17:43:08 <Eddi|zuHause> definitely causality :p
17:44:32 <Eddi|zuHause> 416 Requested range not satisfiable <-- :p
17:45:08 <Bjarni> you are just spamming with pointless issues
17:45:10 <Eddi|zuHause> Bjarni: means "i already have that file" :p
17:48:10 <Bjarni> buhuu... no free milk today :(
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17:58:25 <Bjarni> I haven't forgotten who you are either :P
17:58:45 <Sacro> I'm not sure if that's a good thing or not
17:59:22 <Sacro> or whether to feel insulted
17:59:27 <Eddi|zuHause> Bjarni: well, you have about two months time to get the mac port in order, or there won't be any mac version of 1.0.0
17:59:38 <PeterT> anyone know how to check out a certain revision using GIT fetch?
18:00:05 <PeterT> Sacro: That's not helpful at all
18:00:55 <Eddi|zuHause> Bjarni: that, or teach someone else to maintain the port
18:01:04 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause: who said I would do it? Today two people showed up on the forum claiming to be professionals who wants to take a look
18:01:49 <Bjarni> considering the solution is likely something regarding some API I don't know and don't have time to study right now I guess such outside assistance should be welcomed
18:01:53 <Rubidium> the thread has shown more people that are willing and (according to themselves) qualified, yet not much has come since they said they'd do it
18:01:55 <Eddi|zuHause> lots of people tried to help, nobody ever was heard of again...
18:02:16 <Sacro> what happened to KUDr :(
18:02:31 <Bjarni> he got really busy doing something
18:02:37 <Rubidium> Sacro: he got hit by complex C++
18:03:06 <Eddi|zuHause> one of his template creations got scentient and killed him :p
18:03:15 *** |Terkhen| has joined #openttd
18:03:45 <Bjarni> plenty of people have claimed to do something and then left before it was done
18:04:29 <Sacro> though yacc and bison are worse
18:06:08 <Eddi|zuHause> they used eli on our university...
18:06:09 <Bjarni> Sacro: when what do you like?
18:07:22 <Bjarni> on our uni they learned us C and then they told us to use Java "because it's easier"
18:07:35 <Bjarni> some students objected
18:07:40 *** |Terkhen| is now known as Terkhen
18:07:49 <Eddi|zuHause> another one that mixes up teach and learn...
18:08:45 <Sacro> though I keep liking the look of Vala
18:09:12 <Bjarni> anything sharp in his presence seems dangerous
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18:11:24 <Sacro> like C# syntax wise but builds to C
18:11:38 <Bjarni> you certainly have an interesting taste :P
18:12:34 <Rubidium> isn't Vala that con artist?
18:12:40 <Bjarni> builds to C while maintaining C# interface. Sounds interesting considering how many people who prefer C#
18:13:09 <Alberth> Bjarni: Your guess was not bad: (wikipedia) "Vala Mal Doran is a fictional character in the Canadian-American Sci-Fi Channel television series Stargate SG-1"
18:13:48 <Rubidium> oh shoot... now Alberth broke my joke
18:14:46 <Bjarni> <Alberth> Bjarni: Your guess was not bad <-- that goes without saying though I had no idea about Stargate
18:15:10 <Alberth> Neither had I, apparently :)
18:15:28 <Bjarni> My only chance to watch it is Swedish TV6 and they transmit with a low bitrate and hardcoded big Swedish subtitles
18:16:13 <Bjarni> and it's on at odd hours, like lunchtime on weekdays
18:16:53 <Bjarni> It's just like when Star Trek was on Danish TV. It was on like 2 O'clock on the night after Saturday
18:17:18 <Alberth> that's where you have a HD recorder for :)
18:17:54 <__ln> wtf, i'm away for a few hours and a Bjarni shows up
18:17:57 <Bjarni> well I could record now, but the Star Trek issue... well VCRs weren't that common back then and I didn't have any
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18:18:33 <Bjarni> surprisingly no Danish channel have decided to show Star Trek since
18:19:02 <Bjarni> except until now. Our brand new HD free-to-air channel have decided to show all the movies in 720p
18:19:35 <Bjarni> so far they have showed 3 of them
18:20:02 <Bjarni> __ln: you stay away and you miss stuff
18:20:22 <Bjarni> you stay here and you miss going to the shop and buy the winning lotto ticket
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18:26:01 <Bjarni> and now everybody went to buy lotto tickets O_O
18:27:38 <Bjarni> they will notice once they reach the shops :P
18:34:21 <Bjarni> I recall something about 32 bpp being horribly slow compared to 8bpp
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18:40:12 <dihedral> a Bjarni ?? no way! fake!!
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18:40:49 <Xaroth> hm, this bot lacks features.
18:41:02 *** Xaroth was kicked by Bjarni (die)
18:41:50 <Xaroth> how can you question laughter, Uberubert?
18:42:14 <Uberubert> it was merely the laughter questioning the situation
18:42:46 <Bjarni> it's always a question if it's a good idea to laugh in a given situation, not if a person is laughing loudly or not
18:43:03 <Bjarni> like if you see a road accident it's not a good idea to laugh at the guy being hit
18:43:46 <Uberubert> unless the guy being hit is a cyclist
18:43:55 <Uberubert> tour de france rocks
18:44:07 <Bjarni> I read about some psychiatrist who stated that he have had several patients who were told to always smile to the customers at work even when unhappy. The result was that they couldn't stop smiling and that caused them severe problems
18:44:44 <Bjarni> like a case where one of them witnessed a severe road accident and she just stood there looking and smiling
18:45:33 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r18849 /trunk/src/lang/ (finnish.txt greek.txt norwegian_nynorsk.txt slovenian.txt):
18:45:33 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:33 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: croatian - 36 changes by
18:45:33 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: finnish - 1 changes by jpx_
18:45:33 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: greek - 1 changes by fumantsu
18:45:34 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: norwegian_nynorsk - 1 changes by bjelleklang
18:45:34 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: slovenian - 96 changes by ntadej
18:46:30 <Uberubert> I hope you didnt just compare a serious road-accident to being randomly kicked from an irc-channel..?
18:47:39 <Bjarni> at least I had no intention to do so
18:48:18 <Bjarni> besides <Uberubert> unless the guy being hit is a cyclist <--- is even more questionable
18:48:55 <dihedral> i'd question the author's sense after reading that quote
18:49:56 <Bjarni> I once saw a whole lot of bikes in a race (not tour de france, but looked similar) and they crossed a railroad crossing
18:50:05 <Bjarni> they didn't care to stop just because there were a train coming
18:50:16 <Bjarni> that ended up as a close call
18:51:06 <Uberubert> I had a nearly daily near-crash with a cyclist whilst driving pizzas
18:51:18 <Uberubert> due to cyclists not caring about their surroundings.. :&
18:52:12 <Bjarni> I was once a few cm from hitting a deer at around 60 km/h
18:52:45 <Bjarni> another time a woman crossed the tracks around 10 meters in front of me without seeing me
18:52:52 <Bjarni> both times driving the very same train
18:53:06 <Bjarni> or at least the same locomotive
18:53:56 <Bjarni> 10 meters sounds like a lot, but if you start to calculate time to cross the tracks and the speed of the train, it ended up as a close call
18:54:13 <Bjarni> never hit anything but bugs though
18:54:17 <Uberubert> they had to rebuild a crossing here in norway where I live
18:54:32 <Uberubert> people tended to run over, when 160km/h trains were trying to pass
18:55:17 <Bjarni> we don't allow crossings if the train is allowed to go faster than 140 km/h
18:55:32 <Bjarni> trains drive 160 km/h in Norway?
18:55:58 <Uberubert> not sure they can, but one train had a speedindicator in the wagons, it went to 160
18:56:30 <Chrill> Dont the X2000 run into Oslo?
18:56:30 <Uberubert> maybe I joined some random speed-test or something
18:56:54 <Uberubert> never seen a speedindicator since
18:56:55 <Bjarni> here there is a steering car, which is allowed to go 140 km/h, yet the speedometer goes to 250
18:57:50 <Uberubert> as far as the X2000 goes, I have never heard of it, and have no idea.. google it
18:57:56 <Bjarni> reason: they wanted one which already passed a specific international test to avoid making new expensive tests and when they found one they stopped searching for more
18:57:58 <Bjarni> or something like that
18:58:47 <Bjarni> X2000 goes to Copenhapen and further north to Østerport to be turned around. This means while the train itself is quite fast it drives on tracks with a speed limit of 60 km/h
18:59:22 <Chrill> X2000 operates at speeds of up to I-don't-know-their-top-speed in Sweden
18:59:38 <Bjarni> I think it's 250, but I'm not sure
18:59:54 <Chrill> top speed in regular traffic, 204km/h
18:59:55 <Bjarni> that's still quite fast though
18:59:59 <Chrill> top speed in testing, 276km/h
19:00:05 <Uberubert> hey, didnt some guy tape himself riding the roof of one of those french supertrains?
19:00:15 <Uberubert> how fast are those?
19:00:29 <Chrill> well that particular TGV was
19:00:36 <Chrill> new Chinese railways, 400 something
19:01:26 <PeterT> Openttd compiles completely failed....
19:01:53 <Chrill> Average speed of 313km/h :P
19:04:36 <Xaroth> The trains used on the line are manufactured completely in China
19:05:28 <Bjarni> and if order them we get something not so great
19:05:46 <Alberth> they match the rotational speed of earth then, so they are fixed in space :p
19:05:52 <Bjarni> and when it derails and you see the bottom of it, it has a big marker "made in China"
19:08:35 <Bjarni> While stuff in China can be of quite questionable quality I say that there actually is something good coming out of there
19:08:45 <Bjarni> the problem is to find it
19:09:08 <Bjarni> and if you buy one unit, declares it to be good and order another one, then the next one is crap
19:09:19 <Bjarni> looks the same, but it isn't
19:09:33 <Bjarni> the same goes for other countries
19:09:55 <Uberubert> like norwegian salmon.. :/
19:09:57 * Alberth seldomly buys countries
19:10:22 <Bjarni> Brooklyn bridge had problems with a supplier doing this with building materials. It was a local business, not a Chinese one
19:10:43 * Hirundo posts feature request 'Found New Country'
19:10:45 <Bjarni> * Alberth seldomly buys countries <-- very few people do
19:10:55 <Bjarni> countries do once in a while though
19:11:15 <Bjarni> like UK trying to buy Iceland or parts of it or whatever is going on
19:11:38 <Alberth> hmm, that's an idea for the ice-save money :p
19:12:17 <Uberubert> I thought iceland was declared bankrupt
19:12:23 <Bjarni> looks to me like the fishing war isn't over
19:13:18 <jonty-comp> the UK should buy Iceland
19:13:22 <Bjarni> now the UK state bought the debt from Icesafe and wants the Icelandic government to pay it, even though it's actually an Icelandic bank, with owes the money
19:13:23 <jonty-comp> then I could live there more easily
19:13:28 <Bjarni> the bank is bankrupt btw
19:14:12 <Xaroth> can't, jonty-comp, the dutch already own them :P
19:14:27 <Uberubert> how much does Andorra cost?
19:14:38 <Uberubert> shouldn't be too expensive, seeing how small it is, right?
19:16:04 <Bjarni> I think it's obscene that it's generally accepted that the Icelandic state should cover the loss of Icesafe
19:16:23 <jonty-comp> the Icelandic state has no money anyway
19:16:31 <Terkhen> Uberubert: Andorra is small, but there's a lot of rich people living there to evade taxes
19:16:39 <jonty-comp> although when I was there last summer it seemed there was construction going on literally everywhere
19:16:45 <jonty-comp> so someone must've had some money back then
19:17:15 <Bjarni> <jonty-comp> so someone must've had some money back then <--- no. They just managed to get somebody else to pay. That's part of the whole problem
19:17:45 <Uberubert> what kind of trains does iceland have?
19:18:16 <jonty-comp> they actually have no train lines at all
19:18:25 <Bjarni> a few men (3-5) manage to act like kings in a legal way and run their own economy based on borrowed money. Once the stock marked internationally started to drop, they all went bankrupt
19:18:27 <jonty-comp> heck, there's only one road that circles the island anyway
19:18:35 <Bjarni> and now they are far away with all the money
19:19:33 <Bjarni> <Uberubert> what kind of trains does iceland have? <--- They have Pioneer. A Henschel steamer running on narrow gauge (600 mm... I think)
19:19:52 <Bjarni> used when building the harbour in Reykjavik and now placed in a museum
19:19:59 <Bjarni> they never really had carriages for it
19:20:12 <Bjarni> and the tracks are gone except for the few in the museum
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19:21:46 <DorpsGek> PeterT: fonsinchen was last seen in #openttd 3 days, 18 hours, 14 minutes, and 44 seconds ago: <fonsinchen> Eddi|zuHause: almost. I have added gitmake and .gitignore
19:21:48 <Bjarni> If you go there you can read a whole lot about how the harbour was contructed. You can spend quite a while reading a full wall of information. However it's all in Danish because the harbour was built back when Iceland was a province of Denmark
19:22:19 <Bjarni> seems odd to go to a museum in Iceland and then all the text is in Danish and nobody bothered to translate any of it
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19:23:44 <Uberubert> haha, well it wouldn't bother me, written danish is practicly norwegian
19:24:21 <Bjarni> didn't bother me either ;)
19:24:51 <Bjarni> oh btw how serious is the idea about Norway buying Iceland?
19:25:24 <Uberubert> I must have missed that part in the news
19:26:31 <Bjarni> as weird as it may sound I think it's likely the best outcome for both Iceland and Norway
19:26:31 <jonty-comp> well, I'm going to Norway in the summer anyway
19:26:35 <jonty-comp> so that could be nice
19:26:37 <Alberth> PeterT: instead of querying Dorpsgek in the channel, do it in a private conversation plz
19:26:37 <frosch123> hmm, sincet greenland just left denmark some more
19:26:47 <frosch123> maybe they also want to get iceland
19:27:09 <Bjarni> I don't think Greenland wants to buy Iceland
19:27:23 <Bjarni> and I don't think Greenland wants to leave Denmark either
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19:27:36 <Noldo> how would you buy a country anyway?
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19:27:43 <PeterT> Alberth: Do you know the url for the stats page for #openttd?
19:27:52 <Bjarni> after all schools, hospitals and stuff in Greenland is paid by the Danish state
19:28:51 <Bjarni> <Noldo> how would you buy a country anyway? <-- read the link. You say "let's merge on my conditions and I will be responsible for paying everything you owe other countries"
19:28:53 <Alberth> PeterT: I don't even know what a stats page for irc is (other than a bunch of useless numbers)
19:29:11 <Bjarni> I know what the page is, but I forgot the URL
19:29:21 <PeterT> that's what the stats are
19:30:19 <Bjarni> as for buying a country by paying their debt... the country in question should be more or less bankrupt for that to work
19:30:42 <Bjarni> Saying it to a country like Denmark where the debt to other countries is 0 wouldn't work
19:31:05 <Bjarni> actually it's negative.... so go pay up now :P
19:31:09 <Alberth> yep, that looks like a bunch of useless numbers :)
19:32:01 <jonty-comp> iirc #openttd has never had stats
19:32:24 <DorpsGek> Alberth: I have 8 registered users with 16 registered hostmasks; 2 owners and 0 admins.
19:32:49 <Alberth> more useless numbers :)
19:32:58 <jonty-comp> that's all the useless numbers you need
19:33:05 <Bjarni> means we don't have stats anymore
19:33:56 <Bjarni> either that or I forgot the name of it :P
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19:37:32 <Bjarni> Uberubert: you say you didn't hear about the idea that Norway should include Iceland?
19:37:57 <Uberubert> yeah, I don't watch the news on a regular basis
19:38:08 <Uberubert> there is a good chance I missed it, if they even considered it
19:38:32 <Bjarni> who is this guy anyway?
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19:39:12 <Uberubert> I never heard of him before
19:39:17 <Bjarni> Danish press made him sound somewhat important
19:39:50 <Bjarni> I wonder if it's just some random person and a journalist who wanted a big story or if there really is something about this
19:40:16 <Uberubert> well, he's blogging for one of the biggest newspapers in norway
19:41:04 <Uberubert> hmm after a quick google-search, seems he's just a darn good economy journalist
19:41:12 <Uberubert> won some awards for it even
19:42:24 <Bjarni> but for all we know everybody ignored this idea
19:42:53 <Bjarni> except a Danish journalist who decided to declare that Norway have mega-lo-mania
19:44:27 <Bjarni> haha. Checking out vg.no to see what kind of newspaper it is. The Dilbert on the front page is quite good :D
19:45:56 <Bjarni> I once received a paper and was told it was a report this student had to hand in the next day and he asked me to give him feedback. It started ok and then it it turned technical and it stopped making sense
19:46:18 <Terkhen> is having different difficulty settings for the same scenario depending on if it was loaded at single player or multiplayer a known issue? (at least for maximum loan: in single player it uses the scenario settings, in multiplayer it uses the current configuration)
19:47:02 <Bjarni> turned out that it was all a joke. The report was written by an application he found online, which could write unreadable reports and make them look so technical that nobody wants to ask questions and make them look dumb. Clearly anybody who could write that would know what he is doing
19:48:55 <Uberubert> you should check out pondus if you're looking for good funnies
19:49:00 <Uberubert> atleast pondus is norwegian-made
19:49:22 <Bjarni> and that should be a sign of quality? :)
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20:28:21 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r18850 /trunk/src/ (genworld_gui.cpp landscape.cpp): -Fix [FS#3540]: don't allow screen redraw when the landscape contains broken slopes
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21:08:28 <Phazorx> got another silly generic question
21:08:53 <Rubidium> generic answer: ask the question, don't ask whether you may ask it
21:10:33 <Phazorx> what exactly happens in utomake when it sees " PKG_CHECK_MODULES([XML], [libxml-2.0], [], [ AC_ERROR([libxml-2.0 not found]) ])" ?
21:11:08 <Phazorx> shouldnt it look into --libdir as configured and try t look for libxml-2.0 in it?
21:11:20 <Rubidium> I have absolutely no clue
21:11:30 <Rubidium> I dislike automake/autoconf
21:11:32 <Phazorx> Rubidium: point was - question does not really relate to OpenTTD
21:11:44 <Phazorx> i dislike it too... but that's wht been used
21:11:52 <Phazorx> and i know i have what it need
21:12:02 <Phazorx> just don know how to convince it to see it
21:12:18 <Phazorx> since my ideas on where it might want it are quite exhausted by now
21:13:29 <Rubidium> you're better of asking in the automake/autoconf channel or the channel of the application using it
21:15:26 <Phazorx> app people are clueless
21:15:35 <Phazorx> and i wonder if there is automake chan on freeode
21:16:28 <__ln> you could try #gnu, but no guaranteed answer
21:16:53 <__ln> and that doesn't change the fact that automake/autoconf is a terrible piece of *.
21:19:50 <thingwath> I guess it wants to tell you that it can't find pkgconfig file for libxml-2.0... :)
21:20:31 <thingwath> it should be in /usr/lib/pkgconfig, or $PKG_CONFIG_PATH, if it is set
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21:23:13 <Phazorx> thingwath: err... what do you mean "it" ?
21:23:22 <Phazorx> the libxml stuff or the file?
21:24:23 <Phazorx> thereis no pkgconfig here
21:24:29 * Phazorx is dealing with mingw
21:25:29 <Rubidium> there's a pkgconfig for mingw too
21:25:38 * Bjarni calls for a witchdoctor
21:25:47 <Bjarni> he is clearly possessed by something very foul
21:26:17 <Phazorx> Rubidium: there isnt one at /usr/lib/pkgconfig
21:27:02 <Rubidium> well, you'd need to hunt it down and install it... but I am sure it exists
21:27:04 <thingwath> Do you have some "pkg-config" binary?
21:27:18 <Phazorx> thingwath: isnt it all just set of scripts?
21:27:23 <Rubidium> can't remember where it's though
21:27:35 <Phazorx> thingwath: let's assume i have it and i found it
21:27:42 <Phazorx> how that exactly helps me?
21:28:18 <Phazorx> cuz i still want to know what it does and how
21:28:33 <Rubidium> whatever you're trying to compile looks for libxml and by the fact that you're asking here you've likely figured out it is really needed
21:28:50 <Phazorx> Rubidium: i also got it
21:28:54 <Rubidium> so there's not really another option than to install pkgconfig and libxml's development stuff
21:29:01 <Phazorx> along with sources includes and devel pakage
21:29:05 <Phazorx> and installed/deplyed them all
21:29:12 <Phazorx> i also made sure they are
21:29:19 <thingwath> all it's going to do is to add something like -lxml2 to gcc parameters.
21:29:27 <Phazorx> and passed libdir to .configure to cure it's blindness
21:29:31 <Phazorx> yet it still doesnt see it
21:29:41 <Rubidium> pkgconfig is an application
21:30:15 <Rubidium> and that application is needed to make 'sense' out of the stuff in the pkgconfig directory
21:30:38 <Phazorx> and how's that relevant to configure.ac ?
21:31:11 <Rubidium> because configure checks whether libxml is installed *via* pkgconfig
21:31:42 <Rubidium> e.g. pkgconfig --modversion libxml which then tells the version of libxml, which it can evaluate to determine whether it's new enough
21:31:45 <Phazorx> k i found pkg-config which probably is it
21:33:27 <thingwath> you can try to run something like pkg-config --list-all | grep libxml :)
21:34:03 <Phazorx> list-all returns nothing
21:35:12 <Phazorx> i bet it is missing some config options
21:35:15 <thingwath> do you have any *.pc file anywhere?
21:37:07 <Phazorx> so it only looks for *.pc
21:37:14 <Phazorx> and does not check if libs are there actually?
21:37:39 <Phazorx> tha's almsot as good as MS patch installer
21:37:53 <Phazorx> which only checks folder presence and disregards content
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21:40:33 <thingwath> so, make pkg-config look into the correct directory, and it should work
21:41:55 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r18851 /trunk/src/landscape.cpp: -Codechange: enumify number of steps needed to generate landscape
21:45:28 <Phazorx> bah.. msys doesnt read /etc/profile
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22:11:17 <Phazorx> either i am going nuts or gcc reads between the lines
22:11:33 <Phazorx> is "mcount" some system define var/function ?
22:12:22 <SmatZ> Phazorx: use gcc -E and see the preprocessed output
22:13:42 <Phazorx> SmatZ: i guess i'll need to reconfigure or add it to make file
22:16:34 <SmatZ> Phazorx: mcount seems to be used by some profilers
22:16:36 <Phazorx> err... there is "CPP = gcc -E" in make already
22:16:45 <SmatZ> try removing all *.o files
22:17:25 <Phazorx> oh yeah make clean would be a smart move
22:18:49 <andythenorth> planetmaker: hi hi
22:19:14 <Bjarni> SmatZ: beat you to say that :P
22:19:52 <planetmaker> :-) Those who are last will be the first? :-)
22:20:40 <Bjarni> yeah. Yexo always watch movies while he rewinds tapes for other people so he assumes being last in races is a good thing
22:21:34 <PeterT> Phazorx: What system are you compiling on?
22:22:09 <Bjarni> he also believes that damage can be fixed by throwing out cannon balls from the damaged areas and make cannons eat the cannon balls
22:22:35 <Yexo> you don't believe that? something must be wrong with you people
22:23:22 <Bjarni> movies can teach you a lot of stuff
22:23:35 <Bjarni> like did you know that they had cars in the viking era?
22:23:40 <sawtooth> get to have the honeymoon before the wedding too. fun!
22:23:41 <planetmaker> hehe. Just read a nice question today:
22:23:53 <Bjarni> I saw on TV that the vikings arrived in England and then a car passed by
22:24:08 <planetmaker> if you play the moving of a falling <whatever> backwards. What direction does the acceleration seem to point at?
22:24:52 <Yexo> nice trick, still downwards ;)
22:25:08 <planetmaker> time invariance of physics laws
22:25:24 <Bjarni> speaking of acceleration and questions I read an interesting question yesterday
22:25:24 <Phazorx> grr i'm just not having any luck with devtools tonight
22:25:28 <Phazorx> now cmake is on strike
22:25:37 <Bjarni> are you weightless if you are in the centre of the earth?
22:26:08 <Phazorx> Makefile:65: *** multiple target patterns. Stop. << wth?
22:26:33 <planetmaker> Bjarni: no. You're incinerated ;-)
22:26:38 <SmatZ> Bjarni: well, g ~= 0, so I am (almost) weightless
22:26:39 <planetmaker> But otherwise: SmatZ is right
22:26:57 <Bjarni> Phazorx: tell it to stop drinking. That way it will reduce the number of targets to one :P
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22:27:02 <Phazorx> Bjarni: center as in center of masses you weight is 0
22:27:11 <Phazorx> Bjarni: i never seen anything like that :/
22:27:14 <murr5y> you'd have some strong forces pulling you outwards wouldn't you?
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22:27:25 <murr4y> like the forces of EVIL
22:27:36 <planetmaker> Phazorx: even better: everywhere within a (homogenuous) shell you're weightless
22:27:39 <Bjarni> the force will always be with you
22:27:50 <Phazorx> ther will be a lot of air pressure keeping you at that point assuming atmosphere is present
22:28:15 <Phazorx> planetmaker: in case if you can find a way to negate affect of other masses on you - may be?
22:28:16 <Bjarni> sure there will be a strong force away from the centre, but it's equal in all directions and the resulting force will be zero
22:28:36 <Phazorx> Bjarni: whih is definition of cetre os masses :)
22:28:40 <Yexo> <Phazorx> ther will be a lot of air pressure keeping you at that point assuming atmosphere is present <- I'm wondering if that's true
22:29:09 <planetmaker> Bjarni: that maybe disputed. Forces cancel before they take anywhere any effect as gravitation is a volume force
22:29:19 <planetmaker> so no force is just as right
22:29:23 <SmatZ> there's zero gravity, so there's "no point" for oxygen to be there
22:29:31 <Phazorx> Yexo: imagine you at that point have a rope in your hand
22:29:37 <SmatZ> I wonder where would be the highest air pressure
22:29:46 <planetmaker> SmatZ: in the Earth's centre
22:29:59 <Bjarni> aren't we forgetting something?
22:30:01 <Phazorx> ideal rope, and what if someone starts pulling - will you be objected by that force?
22:30:03 <planetmaker> failing with that at the lowest point
22:30:07 <Rubidium> Phazorx: multiple target patterns usually means spaces in filenames
22:30:13 <Bjarni> how do we get to the centre of the planet in the first place?
22:30:24 <Phazorx> Rubidium: thanks lemme check for that
22:30:38 <planetmaker> Bjarni: ask Jules Vernes ;-)
22:30:54 <Phazorx> Bjarni: actually getting in there is kinda easy
22:30:57 <Bjarni> I spoke with him yesterday
22:31:01 <Yexo> Phazorx: of course, same effect that if you're pulled in water you have to pull harder then if you'd be pulled in air
22:31:02 <Phazorx> getting out would be nearly impossivle
22:31:12 <PeterT> That's what she said, Phazorx.
22:31:19 <planetmaker> Phazorx: getting there is not kinda easy. You melt before you do. As does any material
22:31:41 <Phazorx> Yexo: that isnt my point, point being you feel that force, noe replace rope by a string
22:31:45 <planetmaker> and cutting through solid, 5000°C Ni-Fe alloy... doesn't sound like fun
22:31:49 <SmatZ> hmm what's the temperature in the centre of earth?
22:32:05 <Phazorx> planetmaker: we sortf of negate other physics
22:32:12 <planetmaker> depending upon the un-established eq. of states
22:32:17 <Phazorx> it would be too hard to stay alive due to other things as well :)
22:32:45 <Bjarni> we should all be aware that planetmaker is the real expert in this area. After all he construct planets for a living, right?
22:32:52 <Bjarni> how many have you made so far?
22:33:18 <planetmaker> sure. Delivery times are a bit long, though.
22:33:27 <planetmaker> 5 mega years ok with you?
22:33:33 <Bjarni> I want a planet without stupid people and I have given up on terraforming this one into that goal
22:33:40 <planetmaker> shipping is another issue.
22:34:03 <Bjarni> they claim to deliver everything
22:34:53 <SmatZ> Bjarni: there are several known planes without any people at all
22:34:58 <Phazorx> it is autotool generated tho
22:35:36 <planetmaker> I'd still recommend either Mars or maybe a moon. Either the Moon, or Enceladus.
22:35:41 <Bjarni> I guess I needed to specify temperature and gravity should be acceptable too
22:35:55 <Rubidium> Phazorx: so there's likely a space in $(objects)
22:36:18 <Phazorx> $(objects): $(SHELL) $(auxdir)/mkinstalldirs $@
22:36:20 <Bjarni> why would you sell me Enceladus?
22:36:48 <planetmaker> Bjarni: liquid water?
22:36:50 <Bjarni> you fucked up your house there and polluted it big time?
22:36:59 <Phazorx> OBJECTS = $(objects)/effect_position.lo $(objects)/effect_stereoreverse.lo $(objects)/effects_internal.lo $(objects)/load_aiff.lo $(objects)/load_voc.lo $(objects)/mixer.lo $(objects)/music.lo $(objects)/wavestream.lo $(objects)/common.lo $(objects)/ctrlmode.lo $(objects)/filter.lo $(objects)/instrum.lo $(objects)/mix.lo $(objects)/output.lo $(objects)/playmidi.lo $(objects)/readmidi.lo $(objects)/resample.lo $(objects)/sdl_a.lo
22:36:59 <Phazorx> $(objects)/sdl_c.lo $(objects)/tables.lo $(objects)/timidity.lo $(objects)/native_midi_common.lo $(objects)/native_midi_mac.lo $(objects)/native_midi_macosx.lo $(objects)/native_midi_win32.lo $(objects)/dynamic_ogg.lo $(objects)/load_ogg.lo $(objects)/music_ogg.lo
22:37:09 <Phazorx> that came out much longer than i expected
22:37:31 * Bjarni slaps Phazorx with an imaginary yet painful trout
22:38:29 <Phazorx> dont see spaces there tho :/
22:40:32 <Phazorx> that's actually true...
22:40:37 <Phazorx> but then it makes even less sense
22:40:53 <Phazorx> i should echo that line
22:57:11 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18852 /trunk/src/lang/hebrew.txt: -Update: tweak date formatting of Hebrew
22:59:36 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: smatz * r18853 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: apply coding style to GenWorld's enums, structs and typedefs
23:03:56 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18854 /trunk/src/ (train.h train_cmd.cpp): -Codechange [FS#3539]: unconflict acceleration type as 'status' and rail property (Terhken)
23:06:03 * Bjarni reserves room for AC6000 at a mental hospital
23:07:19 <Bjarni> well a girl was once interested in Sacro and she ended up in a mental hospital
23:08:03 <Bjarni> it's an open question if she was interested in him because she was disturbed (his version) or because of his treatment
23:08:24 <AC6000> no, its not that, he owes me a game of ottd <.<
23:09:03 <SpComb> what can you do to get someone to owe you a game of ottd?
23:09:29 <SmatZ> Sacro's got a treatment?
23:09:35 *** Uberubert has left #openttd
23:09:42 <SmatZ> not that I would wonder...
23:09:58 <SpComb> Sacro sues Bjarni for slander
23:10:01 <AC6000> yea, hold him over a cliff till he says uncle :P
23:10:35 <Bjarni> SpComb: nahh.... if he should have a go at that, then I shouldn't just be telling what he told in the channel
23:10:46 <andythenorth> this channel has gone a bit #tycoon :|
23:10:49 <Bjarni> Sacro: girl+mental hospital
23:11:07 <SpComb> then one requires a link to the logs as evidence
23:11:14 <Sacro> have i been here for 5 years
23:11:19 <Sacro> that's quite depressing
23:11:37 <Bjarni> I'm not sure you told that story when it happened
23:11:59 <Sacro> I was semi-regular on irc back then
23:12:50 <Bjarni> though it's 2010. I started working on this in 2004
23:13:01 <Bjarni> you showed up somewhat early
23:13:08 <peter1138> we've all grown up now
23:13:11 <Bjarni> yeah you could have been here for 5 years
23:13:12 <peter1138> or at least, got older
23:13:31 <Bjarni> grown up.... and we still gather for a game... :p
23:14:04 <SpComb> grown up version of TTD
23:14:18 <Sacro> with single way signals
23:14:18 <Bjarni> didn't know what I got myself into when I "just wanted to try this game" and worked a bit on compiling it
23:15:22 <SpComb> my tt-forums account is older than Bjarni's
23:15:45 <Rubidium> especially when badness with thunks fails compiling OpenTTD
23:16:57 <Rubidium> now I reckon there are about 2, maybe 3, persons in this channel that have any clue what I'm babbling about
23:18:47 <peter1138> long gone are the days of thunking from 32 to 16 bit mode...
23:19:46 <SpComb> everyone's who's read the Old New Thing knows what thunks are
23:21:32 <Yexo> wasn't hard to find, but I still have no idea what a "thunk" is
23:21:46 <Yexo> I do get Rubidium now though ;)
23:21:59 * SmatZ knowns "thunk" as "part of a diff file"
23:22:39 <Yexo> hmm, not a certain gcc lto bug?
23:22:40 <SmatZ> also, my dictionary modifies "thunk" to "thank" and then translates that...
23:23:17 <SmatZ> yeah, I heard "thunk" in that context, too
23:23:26 <Rubidium> yay... Yexo found it :)
23:24:06 <SmatZ> ok, I am broken :) I don't remember bugreports I am watching...
23:24:18 <Yexo> I still don't know what a "thunk" in that case is, but oh well, enough random searching
23:25:12 <SmatZ> hmm OTTD still doesn't link for me with --enable-lto :(
23:25:29 <SmatZ> I hope lto-related bugs will be fixed before release of 1.0.0 and 4.5.0
23:25:38 <SmatZ> or we might receive some bugreports :-/
23:25:56 <Rubidium> oh, we'll close them as duplicates of gcc bugs :)
23:26:46 <Rubidium> but regarding lto and trunk: only PR42451 happens for me; it links fine
23:27:40 <Rubidium> but then I have checking disabled
23:28:20 * SmatZ doesn't even try it with enabled checking :)
23:30:30 <SmatZ> luckily, that code doesn't appear in OTTD code anymore
23:33:13 <SmatZ> C++ <-> C compatibility is also "oficially" broken for lto...
23:34:47 * AC6000 resumes the fore-mentioned glaring <_<
23:42:18 <Phazorx> Rubidium: for that multiple targets issue - is it possible the damn line is just too long?
23:49:47 <Rubidium> hmm, multiple colons on one line... that's not good either I fear
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