IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2009-12-07
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07:23:41 <Forked> please stop doing that.
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08:41:31 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18420 /trunk/ (9 files in 5 dirs): -Codechange: split YAPF's track follower from the actual YAPF code
08:47:22 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18421 /trunk/src/pathfinder/ (npf/npf.cpp yapf/yapf_costrail.hpp):
08:47:22 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Fix [FS#3244]: pathfinders wouldn't consider the 'other' reachable waypoint
08:47:22 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: tile if the closest one is free but there is no safe waiting point directly
08:47:22 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: after it. Now check for a free safe waiting point beyond the waypoint unless
08:47:22 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: there are junctions before the first safe waiting point.
08:51:35 <Xaroth> I think Rubidium managed to confuse planetmaker :P
08:51:36 <planetmaker> a commit message which needs reading two or three times before I grasp what it tells me :-)
08:52:59 <planetmaker> might be due to lack of coffee, though
08:56:30 <Rubidium> hmm... there's one major flaw with the improved DTRSes
08:56:43 <Rubidium> now the roads quickly become the bottleneck
08:57:04 <planetmaker> Well... that needs then some better road building skills
08:57:26 <planetmaker> or in what way do you mean it?
08:57:47 <planetmaker> it's the same with (big) stations: if you don't design good entries and exits, the station size won't help you much
08:58:43 <planetmaker> But it doesn't look like too much different from before - except that the vehicles don't all queue in front of one or two of the stops - just evenly spread out
08:58:45 <Rubidium> and that is at ~30% capacity of the small station
08:59:04 <planetmaker> We really need to setup a road vehicles only game now :-)
09:01:05 <planetmaker> This change really will change that big time and finally allow to play our n:1 cargo scheme also there
09:02:00 <petern> hmm, right, my 150GB backup storage is... full
09:04:15 <Rubidium> for i in /dev/sd* /dev/hd*; do dd if=/dev/zero of=$i bs=1048576 count=16; done ?
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09:16:30 <SineDeviance> hi all... something is seriously wrong with my openttd
09:17:07 <SineDeviance> i'm playing a game with two newgrf's. industrial stations renewal and combined american signals. nothing else. i have the difficulty set on easy
09:17:48 <SineDeviance> however, the problem is none of my trains are making profit because i just upgraded all my engines. the running costs on anything but steam are astronomical. it's like a bug or something
09:18:30 <SineDeviance> the SH'8P on my screen is only $18,000/yr, but the worst diesel is ~$250k a year. and it only goes up from there
09:20:29 <Rubidium> and the game didn't start with some other NewGRFs?
09:20:49 <SineDeviance> oh, wait... actually it might have
09:21:11 <SineDeviance> yes, it started with the 2cc trainset
09:21:16 <SineDeviance> i disabled it as soon as the game started
09:21:22 <SineDeviance> gah so that's what caused it
09:21:31 <Rubidium> then that has set the prices so high
09:22:31 <Xaroth> enabling/disabling newgrfs during a game will mess up things
09:22:44 <SineDeviance> so there's no way i can fix the costs?
09:22:49 <SineDeviance> er, not in this game?
09:23:09 <Rubidium> loading the game in a recent trunk version might do the trick
09:23:29 <SineDeviance> and then i save it and reload in stable, right?
09:23:39 <Rubidium> nope, then you can't load it in stable
09:23:51 <SineDeviance> then it's pointless :(
09:24:10 <SineDeviance> guess i just wasted 10 hours :D
09:36:00 <planetmaker> why is it pointless? You could continue to play recent trunk version?
09:36:09 <planetmaker> Nothing bad about it (on the contrary)
09:37:11 <planetmaker> but I wouldn't be optimistic about it ;-) Once the base costs are screwed... but hey, who knows better than the lead dev? ;-)
09:38:06 <Rubidium> planetmaker: looks like you missed quite a lot of development lately :)
09:38:26 <planetmaker> Well, I know about the "base costs are local, if you define the property".
09:38:36 <planetmaker> But does it also apply to already screwed up games?
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09:39:51 <Rubidium> base costs aren't stored in the savegame anymore but are (re)calculated at load
09:40:21 <planetmaker> indeed. That's something I missed :-) Thanks for telling me
09:42:47 <petern> developers/peter1138/cargodest.hgunknownunknown15 months ago
09:43:10 <petern> ah well, i was never really happy with the major boost dependency
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09:52:50 <petern> i always wondered if it was possible to use the station pool as the data store
09:52:59 <petern> no caching needed then
09:57:02 <SineDeviance> sorry i went afk for a few
09:57:19 <SineDeviance> <planetmaker> why is it pointless? You could continue to play recent trunk version? <-- no huge reason i guess. i just prefer to stick with 0.7.4
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10:21:04 <petern> mmm, 3.5GB backup files
10:45:11 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18422 /trunk/src/roadstop_base.h: -Fix (r18404): MSVC complaining about struct vs class
10:55:12 <Eddi|zuHause> yay at r18421 ;)
11:02:50 <Eddi|zuHause> <Rubidium> now the roads quickly become the bottleneck <-- i think the biggest problem there is the overtaking code, that can't properly distribute traffic across two lanes in a one-way road setup [with junctions]
11:03:15 <Eddi|zuHause> also a problem with "efficient" road vehicles is the lack of smooth corners
11:08:18 <Rubidium> diagonal new railtypes!
11:08:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i have a problem imagining how diagonal roads fit on a tile, especially within cities, where there should also be diagonal houses along those roads
11:09:12 <Pikka> diagonal rails up slopes hurr
11:09:17 <Eddi|zuHause> i was kinda hoping that the newgrf airports could allow a system like the sim city 4 "puzzle tiles"
11:11:09 <Eddi|zuHause> which would allow stuff like predefined 3x3 areas with one long curve
11:13:31 <Pikka> bendy bridges up diagonal slopes!
11:13:41 <Pikka> with custom bridgeheads and signals
11:13:57 <petern> i'm sure we'll figure out a good way eventually
11:14:05 <Eddi|zuHause> airport bridges!
11:14:50 <Eddi|zuHause> no, the other way round ;)
11:15:08 <Eddi|zuHause> airport (taxiways) over road or rail
11:15:29 <Pikka> should be possible with new airports anyway :P
11:15:57 <Pikka> at least, gaps "under" airports would be possible.
11:17:33 <Pikka> ideas for a certain project... D:
11:18:06 <Eddi|zuHause> Pikka: the Leipzig/Halle airport ;)
11:19:32 <Pikka> a certain other project :P
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11:54:00 * petern wonders if railtypes still works
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11:59:59 <petern> where did i place that grf?
12:01:36 <petern> more work to do, it segfaults on startup now
12:12:40 <Eddi|zuHause> xrandr -s 1680x1050
12:21:59 <petern> hmm, now, what did mart3p do to make tunnels work
12:22:05 <petern> i guess ... the old way
12:30:09 <petern> now, where did i leave the spec?
12:31:01 <Eddi|zuHause> next to the grf ;)
12:33:19 <petern> who did the diagonal level crossings patch?
12:34:22 <Eddi|zuHause> afair it used some map bits that now are reserved for 3rd road type
12:34:38 <Eddi|zuHause> plus, it needed another bit for the second pbs-reservation
12:35:03 <Eddi|zuHause> and the problem with closing adjacent level crossings, where my recent prototype could be a solution
12:36:04 <Eddi|zuHause> and there were a few weird side effects with town growth producing weird unconnected roads
12:36:36 <Eddi|zuHause> and i think there was an issue with allowed slopes underneath
12:37:45 <Eddi|zuHause> and it's like 10k revisions outdated :)
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12:43:08 <Rubidium> I think there should be enough free bits for diagonal level crossings and roadtypes
12:49:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i think we need 3 roadtypes or 2 roadtypes and a railtype per road tile
12:51:58 <petern> i need to do level crossings
12:52:11 <petern> cos mart3p's done it the old way
12:52:31 <petern> (mart3p converted NG to railtypes)
13:03:04 <petern> damn, i misplaced the level crossing layout plan
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13:55:58 <Eddi|zuHause> dihedral: you have no idea how i always got confused by this pavel1269 guy :)
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15:01:03 <peter1138> -rw-r--r-- 1 petern petern 43923 2009-05-11 10:44 railtypes15.diff
15:01:03 <peter1138> -rw-r--r-- 1 petern petern 40930 2009-12-07 15:00 railtypes16.diff
15:01:13 <peter1138> ~ 3KB smaller just by updating :s
15:06:48 <Yexo> you should update it more often :p
15:09:55 <Eddi|zuHause> only about 12 times left ;)
15:12:14 <peter1138> RailTypeGetVariable accounts for tile == INVALID_TILE
15:12:23 <peter1138> now... could that ever actually happen...
15:13:39 <Rubidium> unlikely, unless you do something like RailTypeGetVariable(RandomTile() - TileDiffXY(-2, -2)); instead of if (IsRailishTile(tile)) RailTypeGetVariable(tile))
15:15:43 <Eddi|zuHause> the map edge is guaranteed to be either MP_WATER or MP_VOID?
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15:28:42 <peter1138> hmm, it could happen with a bad newgrf
15:29:26 <peter1138> or, indeed, a valid newgrf
15:29:59 <peter1138> INVALID_TILE is used for gui stuff, including station preview
15:30:32 <peter1138> ... /* Will be removed */
15:30:38 <peter1138> i ought to do that...
15:39:53 <peter1138> ah yes, level crossings need work too
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16:51:05 * Belugas is bored... dong those log analysis is such a boring to death process.... i feel like a skeleton already
16:54:24 * peter1138 has been fighting pci-dss, banks, and software suppliers
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16:56:13 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18423 /trunk/src/os/windows/ottdres.rc.in:
16:56:13 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Fix (r17336): [Windows] incorrect relative path the the icon making the icon not being included in the binary
16:56:13 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Fix: [Windows] mention the version of GPL in the metadata
16:56:30 <Belugas> yeah... same kind shit, although not on pci-dss (thanks god) for now (please... don't)
17:02:25 <peter1138> pci-dss: STORE NOTHING!!!!!
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17:02:42 <peter1138> bank: store this until we say not to
17:02:48 <peter1138> bank: also send this field like this
17:03:02 <peter1138> software supplier: no we send it as that instead
17:04:44 <Rubidium> peter1138: "oh fuck it. bank, meet pci-dss; pci-dss, this is bank; bank meet software supplier, software supplier this is bank. Now you're going to locked up until you come up with something that can be implemented and meets all your requirements/stuff"?
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17:07:43 <peter1138> the banks require pci-dss, but don't have to abide by it themselves
17:13:41 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18424 /trunk/src/os/windows/ (ottdres.rc.in win32.cpp): -Fix [FS#3327]: [Windows] the help window would be too large in some cases
17:21:42 <Belugas> well... PCI-DSS does not say DON'T STORE a thing, they say it's better not to, but it you do, make it so you're more robust than Forth Noxx
17:21:51 <Belugas> which is hell and hell
17:24:08 <peter1138> they would say so if they could get away with it :)
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17:47:37 <peter1138> 10 sprites needed for crossings
17:50:02 <peter1138> damn, i need to draw some graphics to test this :s
17:57:50 <peter1138> hmm, depots missed :s
17:58:53 <Benny> What's up with some of the windows placing and/or size in r18400?
17:59:08 <Benny> Take online server password box for example.
18:02:25 <Belugas> r18400 == translation
18:02:38 <peter1138> any particular reason for complaining about a 3 day old revision?
18:03:01 <Benny> Well, it's just the one running on the #coop public server.
18:03:47 <Belugas> logical step, before saying anythingm, is trying the latest nightly, i'd say
18:04:18 <Belugas> but even then, i don't see a thing breaking anything window-wise
18:07:27 <SmatZ> [18:59:16] <Benny> Or the client list box <== please, don't open just another bugreport about that
18:07:47 <Benny> I never do post bug reports, dont worry.
18:08:37 <peter1138> i don't actually see any problem, but never mind
18:08:52 <peter1138> if you never post bug reports, don't bother mentioning things on channel either
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18:34:43 <Belugas> Wicked Time, when you want to relaz
18:45:34 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: translators * r18425 /trunk/src/lang/ (4 files):
18:45:34 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:34 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: traditional_chinese - 1 changes by josesun
18:45:34 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: greek - 1 changes by fumantsu
18:45:34 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: norwegian_bokmal - 13 changes by 2rB
18:45:35 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: norwegian_nynorsk - 48 changes by 2rB
18:45:35 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: spanish - 3 changes by Terkhen
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19:37:26 <DJNekkid> would \dyyyy-mm-dd work for property 2A for trains?
19:37:53 <DJNekkid> (introyear, longformat)
19:41:09 <peter1138> hmm, was there a sprite alignment tool around?
19:50:18 <frosch123> iirc the last one was from anders
19:54:59 <peter1138> yeah, tried that, it's not much help for ground/building sprites afaics
19:55:35 <DJNekkid> and to awnser my own question: yes it do seem to work
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20:17:44 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18426 /trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): -Fix: sort the names in source.list according to Microsoft's sorting rules
20:18:51 <frosch123> one could call it alphabetically
20:19:45 <Sacro> frosch123: is that aAbBcC
20:20:06 <frosch123> there are no caps in ottd filename
20:20:11 <frosch123> you might only discuss the underscore
20:22:46 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r18427 /trunk/Makefile.src.in: -Fix (r18423): ofcourse that broke the GCC build... not determining 'inclusion' using the relative path from the .rc that has the 'include' but from the include directories... how useful/sensible is that?
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20:46:30 <peter1138> bah, alignment in one direction doesn't work on the other :/
20:58:20 <PeterT> Thank you for r18424 :-)
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20:59:34 <Zuu> hmm, what is the help window?
21:00:07 <Zuu> Ok, I'd call it a dialog.
21:00:38 <Zuu> But it might have become a real Windows window lately.
21:02:32 <Zuu> Hmm, it needs Alt+mouse movement in order to reach the bottom of it. :-)
21:02:56 <Zuu> Too bad I don't have any program installed for that at the moment.
21:05:36 <Zuu> Though, I could reconfigure my screens so that I get a tall workspace instead of a wide one.
21:07:31 <Zuu> I wonder how you fix that without making it a real window and adding a scrollbar which would be a ton of code to make.
21:08:34 <Zuu> Or remove some text from the message.
21:10:08 <Zuu> Hmm, looks like a window with a multiline textedit with scrollbar has been created instead of using a dialog.
21:10:19 <planetmaker> <some help should be here, but it was too long. Try another OS with decent console> maybe? :-D
21:11:52 <PeterT> Yeah, I figured out that I wasn't missing much, I test -h on my linux terminal
21:11:55 <Zuu> I have <another OS with a decent console>, but it does not let me use my Wacom in dual-screen mode in an easy way. [I have spent like 5-10 hours on the matter without finding a solution]
21:13:24 <planetmaker> On linux I need the nvidia driver to run my dual monitor setup
21:14:04 <Zuu> Dual monitor works fine. But I couldn't get my wacom pen tablet to stretch over both screens in absolute addressing mode.
21:15:13 <Zuu> There is some support for it in the linux wacom driver, but I couldn't get it to do it as I wanted it to do. (and works fine on the windows driver)
21:16:50 <Zuu> You don't really want to have a pen tablet, and then run it in relative mode that kind of defeats one of the benefits of it over a traditional mouse.
21:18:55 <Zuu> It has some really cool window managers as well as nice shells.
21:21:08 <chr2> i'm glad someone answered to me
21:21:19 <Zuu> Yes there are lot of "anybody" here. 113 in total.
21:21:40 <Zuu> Though you could question if the bots are "anybody".
21:22:01 <fjb> They are at least somebody.
21:22:47 <chr2> can i talk with u about something that is around me
21:22:51 <DorpsGek> fjb: I have not seen human.
21:22:53 <PeterT> Hello chr2 from Venezuela :)
21:22:55 <chr2> since a long long time ago
21:22:59 <Zuu> Though I need to change batteries sometimes.
21:24:19 <dihedral> looks like PeterT found out how to whois an ip ^^
21:24:54 <PeterT> How did you know that?
21:24:58 <Zuu> dihedral: chr2 told that he/she is from Venezueala just a bit above.
21:26:56 <DorpsGek> Zuu: seen [<channel>] <nick>
21:28:45 <DorpsGek> dihedral: I have not seen anything.
21:29:00 <DorpsGek> Zuu: you was last seen in #openttd 30 weeks, 1 day, 1 hour, 32 minutes, and 24 seconds ago: * You have been kicked.
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21:33:42 <Zuu> I don't listen, but I read
21:34:26 <PeterT> I have one of those too
21:35:15 <PeterT> chr2: It's better to ask your question in whole. Eaiser to read for us, probably get you better answers.
21:36:40 <chr2> i have this ip 190.203.81.27 which is mine and i'm trying to broke down its security
21:37:45 <chr2> and i'm trying to access to
21:38:10 <chr2> that host is phisically with me
21:38:28 <Sacro> chr2: please can you wait till the end of your sentence before hitting enter
21:38:30 <PeterT> You want us to help you hack your IP?
21:39:02 <Zuu> Or do you just want to host an OpenTTD server?
21:39:51 <Zuu> How is that related to OpenTTD?
21:39:53 <PeterT> When someone figures out what the problem is, highlight me and explain it to me... :-)
21:40:01 <chr2> because i used to run windows now since somebody and i dont know how did a DoS
21:40:07 <nonsensical> is it just me, or do helicopters not go their advertised speed?
21:40:18 <chr2> now i'm using linux 24/7
21:40:34 <Zuu> nonsensical: Check your plane speed setting.
21:40:50 <chr2> i'm not new using debian but i'm quite new using metasploit and preventing
21:41:01 <Zuu> set it to 1/1 to get your helicopters and airplanes to travel in advertised speed.
21:41:15 <fjb> PeterT: He wants to talk us into a dos attack against some ip.
21:41:51 <nonsensical> is 1/4th normal then? :)
21:42:06 <nonsensical> yeah, I know that
21:42:07 <Zuu> 1/4 is what it used to be in TTD.
21:42:13 <Sacro> fjb: baby don't hurt me?
21:42:17 <Sacro> or was that what love is...
21:42:18 <PeterT> fjb: Ahh, I was wondering when we were going to start that
21:42:29 <chr2> peter i want u to help me to hack mu computer
21:42:30 <nonsensical> so that's considered the balanced factor
21:43:00 <Sacro> chr2: don't ask for that in here, against oftc policies
21:43:15 <Sacro> go post your IP on 4chan or something
21:43:22 <chr2> but the ip of that computer which is a intel
21:43:30 <fjb> Not only that we have no evidence that that ip is really yours.
21:44:06 <chr2> and now i'm using ethernet connection
21:44:15 <Sacro> [oftc] -!- chr2 [~chr2@190.203.81.153]
21:44:33 <Zuu> Exactly, why did you not join using "your" .27 ip?
21:49:50 <PeterT> I told him that I didn't know how to help him, and apparently he left...
21:50:21 <Zuu> He realized that we were clever enough to not help him with his dos attack.
21:50:53 <Prof_Frink> Aiming for a fairly narrow window there.
21:51:49 <Prof_Frink> Clever enough to know to port scan, but stupid enough to do so.
21:52:23 <Prof_Frink> There's a how missing from that.
21:53:32 <fjb> There are channels where you get an immediate dos attack against the ip you are entering with.
21:54:41 <Zuu> Kecause people are just clicking on the link? Or because they are aware of it but participcate in it.
21:55:54 <fjb> Because that channels and the people there are really strange. But you can use them as a kind of security test.
21:56:04 <Belugas> i'm using mIRC, petert. why doyu want to kow?
21:57:23 <fjb> The Swedish houses are really looking good.
21:57:36 <PeterT> Belugas: Looking for a new client on Linux
21:57:55 <PeterT> Correction: Looking for a _different_
21:58:03 <Zuu> PeterT: Then try a linux users :-)
21:58:06 <PeterT> Konversation is actually very good
21:58:51 <Zuu> Not me, though, you'd get a client that works on Linux at least.
21:59:02 <Belugas> PeterT, you should have known that i'm a Windows guy, not a Linux one ;)
22:00:12 <Zuu> Especially when Belugas is at work, I would be surprised if he would use Linux on the desktop.
22:00:23 <PeterT> Sorry, I haven't memorized what operating systems the people on #openttd have yet, still working my way through the "A"s
22:00:29 * fjb is neither a Windows guy nor a Linux guy.
22:00:36 <Rubidium> Belugas is the oracle guy :)
22:00:50 <Zuu> I though he was a Delphi guy.
22:01:02 <fjb> Didn't they have girls in Delphi?
22:01:03 <Zuu> Though Delphi and databases works quite nice togeather.
22:01:11 <PeterT> Above message is sarcastic
22:01:22 <PeterT> I forgot to add a ":-P" at the end :-)
22:01:31 <Rubidium> I didn't say Oracle...
22:01:40 <Belugas> Rubidium, i think your reference was a bit too complicated for them ;)
22:02:06 <Belugas> an oracle... guys, look in the greek history
22:02:34 <fjb> But they had girls there, not guys.
22:03:13 <PeterT> I have to leave him, I'm getting to distracted from working
22:03:55 <Rubidium> those are the priestesses of the oracle you're speaking about
22:03:59 <Belugas> ho... work... indeed... time to punch out!
22:11:47 <fjb> German rad vehicles are bigger than their bounding box. :-(
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continue to next day ⏵
