IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2009-06-10
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02:09:47 <kkb110> doesn't anybody here play in !expert goal #2 server?
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02:20:59 <Eddi|zuHause> at this hour? probably not.
02:22:05 <Chicago_Rail_Authority> When coding a station set, "DFLT" (44 46 4C 54) works just fine to add additional options to the normal menu, but I'm having trouble figuring out how to customize a new drop-down title.... Anything other than DFLT adds seems to add a blank drop-down title (while still correctly yielding custom station name choices from this menu)... Anyone still awake who might have some thoughts on this one?
02:26:50 <glx> IIRC you need to define the text somewhere
02:27:56 <Chicago_Rail_Authority> Makes sense... as I'm just trying to use "CSTM" for custom (43 53 54 4D) but haven't really found a spot to define a text string yet
02:28:15 <Chicago_Rail_Authority> hmm... ok, I'll take another look at the wiki -- thanks, glx
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05:37:11 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16548 /trunk/src/gfxinit.cpp: -Fix (r16538): removing of duplicates of base graphics set could behave randomly
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06:50:11 <petern> cos that would be stupid
06:50:59 <dihedral> it's not like other people have not done so :-P
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07:07:08 <SmatZ> petern: it would be boring if there were no bugs in 0.7.1 ;)
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07:20:00 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16549 /trunk/src/clear_cmd.cpp: -Codechange: use bool in TileLoopClearHelper
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08:18:54 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16550 /trunk/src/ (map.cpp map_func.h): -Codechange: move definition of ScaleByMapSize to header file, use shifts instead of mults
08:28:09 * planetmaker awards to SmatZ the title "Chief Performance Officer" ;)
08:28:35 <Rubidium> Noldo: just look at the implementation of multiplication in processors
08:28:45 * planetmaker also fines SmatZ for speeding. Cost: one beer :P
08:29:02 <Noldo> and compilers are unable to do optimizations?
08:29:18 <planetmaker> Noldo, certainly not. But this way you don't rely on a compiler
08:30:13 <Noldo> I don't think there is really any point in trying to be fast if the compiler sucks
08:30:41 <Rubidium> Noldo: knowing SmatZ he looked at the generated asm
08:31:46 <Rubidium> also n * (func() + func()) is arguably slower than n << (var + var)
08:32:14 <Rubidium> and as gcc doesn't do optimisation after linking it's fairly safe to claim it's faster
08:33:01 <Rubidium> and the implementation of func() would be: return 1 << var;
08:33:10 <SmatZ> gcc doesn't know _map_size_x == 1 << _map_log_x
08:33:40 <petern> on p4, shifts are slower
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08:34:14 <SmatZ> (probably no compiler would know, even with lto... but maybe I am underestimating developers of compilers)
08:34:28 <Rubidium> who in his/her right mind would use a P4? ;)
08:34:47 <SmatZ> petern: I will have a look
08:35:54 <Noldo> maybe it's just my untrained mind, but shifts as replacement for multi is quite hard to read
08:36:31 <ddfreyne> doesn't gcc optimize multiplication with powers of two?
08:36:46 <SmatZ> I am not sure if it's better to use mults instead of shifts just because one architecture likes them more
08:36:47 <petern> Noldo, in general yes, but you're assuming the multiplication made sense in the first place
08:37:18 <petern> SmatZ, of course. i was just pointing out that shifts are not necessarily faster, as planetmaker said.
08:38:26 <Rubidium> ddfreyne: if it doesn't know (for certain) it is multiplication by a power of two it still keep multiplying
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08:39:52 <planetmaker> petern, it was my naive ... impression. Why would one use shifts otherwise (if not operating on bit sets)
08:41:11 <Noldo> in those functions the readability isn't that much of an issue as they are nicely documented
08:43:58 <Rubidium> so for shifts < 3 adding is faster, after that shifting is faster
08:44:20 <petern> core 2 is nice, i assume core i7 is not worse
08:44:32 <Rubidium> all shifts are more than 3, so shifting is still faster than adding
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10:57:38 * Aankhen`` wonders what chain of events landed that "UTF-8 please" in the topic.
11:05:54 <petern> and russians using that koi8 crap
11:15:38 <dihedral> what an idiot in the forums!!
11:25:19 <petern> not ttd related at all
11:25:24 <petern> the signals are not close enough
11:25:36 <petern> and there's no queue of trainss
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11:25:46 <petern> what a waste of time that is, heh
11:27:46 <dihedral> but i like the connection of the image i posted :-P
11:30:00 <planetmaker> dihedral, why do you make so much fun of him? :(
11:30:09 <planetmaker> It may be boring, but others may find it interesting...
11:30:39 <planetmaker> or may take join doing / preparing / watching such stuff.
11:30:51 <dihedral> it's a video of a train!
11:30:57 <planetmaker> yes, I agree with you - it's boring what he did. But so what?
11:31:02 <dihedral> where on earth is that related to openttd?
11:31:09 <planetmaker> you and I find it boring.
11:31:27 <dihedral> boring is not even what i mean - it's not related
11:31:42 <dihedral> there are openttd vids on youtube, they are boring, but at least they are related!
11:31:42 <planetmaker> ah.. c'mon. 50% of the people are somewhat attached to trains.
11:31:50 <dihedral> is there not a forum 'off topic'?
11:32:41 <dihedral> it is totally off topic + i did not make fun of him, i merely displayed how related his vids were with ttd :-P
11:32:42 <Ammler> forrest gump is a nice movie
11:33:08 <planetmaker> then tell him to post it in "General Transport Discussion". But to flame him for his hobby and delight? C'mon
11:33:31 <planetmaker> that's just as poor
11:33:46 <dihedral> actually i thought the picture to be quite funny :-)
11:33:54 <dihedral> as it's even less related as his vids :-D
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11:37:22 <Noldo> dihedral: admit it, you are just evil
11:39:39 <Rubidium> Aankhen``: or for people using U+FF00 - U+FF5E
11:40:08 <dihedral> Noldo, nope i will not admit it :-D
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13:44:49 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16551 /trunk/src/map_func.h: -Codechange: use shift instead of multiplication in TileXY()
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14:07:20 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16552 /trunk/src/map_func.h: -Codechange: make AddTileIndexDiffCWrap() a bit faster
14:09:54 <Eddi|zuHause> YAY, they're reviving Futurama :)
14:15:08 <Rubidium> who cares (except those that care)?
14:15:14 <Ammler> hmm, does banans have a recover password function?
14:18:18 <dihedral> /query TrueBrain :-)
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14:18:35 * dihedral gives Ammler another 'a'
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14:20:23 <Ammler> mäh, don't like bother him for my stupidity
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14:55:05 <Muddy> now also with mysql backend!
14:55:19 <dihedral> now that is nice :-)
14:56:33 <dihedral> you run the servers on a posix system?
14:58:11 <Muddy> my openttd server runs on a ubuntu vps in atlanta, the other server belongs to a dude in trondheim, norway
14:58:29 <dihedral> rephrase: you run the openttd servers on a posix system?
14:58:44 <dihedral> Muddy, have a look at ap+ :-)
14:58:54 <dihedral> and avignon is before it's first beta release too
15:01:37 <dihedral> they are bots and wrap the dedicated server console
15:02:03 <dihedral> automate some stuff, can join an irc channel and relay chat
15:02:21 <petern> dihedral, "mysql" "nice" -- pick one
15:02:22 <dihedral> <petern> except it's mysql <-
15:02:47 <dihedral> eh - i am confuddling myself
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16:02:15 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r16553 /trunk/src/ (saveload/afterload.cpp train_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: don't use TRACK_BIT_WORMHOLE and TRACK_BIT_DEPOT as bitmasks
16:03:16 <TinoDidriksen> Wormhole? OpenTTD In Space?
16:04:08 <planetmaker> TinoDidriksen: bridges and tunnels.
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16:05:05 <TinoDidriksen> I figured as much. Just sounded funny...
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16:17:21 <Eddi|zuHause> who said wormholes may occur only in space?
16:19:16 <dihedral> they exist in the ground too - real ones also
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16:20:43 <totalwormage> hell, i have some on my body ;]
16:21:16 <dihedral> we dont wanna know that much totalwormage
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16:21:33 <SmatZ> appearing and disappearing every picosecond :)
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18:32:33 <Sacro> Brianetta: are you upgrading the server?
18:54:08 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: smatz * r16554 /trunk/src/ (settings.cpp settings_func.h): -Fix (r16433): compilation with disabled network was broken
19:00:45 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: smatz * r16555 /trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): -Feature [FS#570]: ability to enter server and company password via command line when joining a server (based on patch by Progman, Ammler and planetmaker)
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19:23:37 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: smatz * r16556 /trunk/src/ai/ (ai_instance.cpp ai_instance.hpp): -Codechange [NoAI]: use accessor for AIInstance::is_dead
19:26:16 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: smatz * r16557 /trunk/src/ai/ai_gui.cpp: -Feature(tte) [NoAI][FS#2892]: mark dead AIs by red background in the AIDebug window
19:27:33 <planetmaker> SmatZy-PatchY mutated into Feature-SmatZy! :)
19:28:15 <planetmaker> but yes, that proposal made much sense :)
19:33:27 <Rubidium> so now we need a someoney-notdevy mutate into a bigfix-someoney?
19:35:09 <planetmaker> Rubidium: you should announce a vote in the forums "who shall become the next new dev" :P
19:37:09 <Rubidium> electronic votes are unreliable
19:37:22 <Rubidium> so people have to register first and then vote in person
19:37:36 <Rubidium> also the candidates need to formally register in person
19:38:21 <frosch123> who cares about developers? we need a project manager
19:38:32 <fjb> Managers are always good.
19:39:04 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think we wanted to know :p
19:39:05 * Rubidium assigns fjb to Chief Testing Officer
19:39:10 * SmatZ has just average one, but is happy with it L()
19:39:24 <fjb> Ok, testing is always good.
19:40:19 <Alberth> too bad that as chief, you cannot play^H^H^H^Htest yourself
19:41:16 <fjb> No need to test my self. :-P
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19:41:55 <Rubidium> fjb, you should. Your spelling component is broken.
19:42:45 <fjb> Rubidium: That is known, so need for testing it.
19:46:59 <andythenorth> Can I be project manager? I'd like to start by making a full spec.
19:47:09 <andythenorth> So if you could all stop everything for, say a year or two, I'll get back to you :)
19:58:51 <planetmaker> Thanks for your Makefile-diff, Rubidium
19:59:27 <planetmaker> I'm somehow led to the assumption that you don't use bash :P
20:00:56 <Rubidium> actually I do, but when I saw sh I knew it was probable that it wasn't tested with anything else than bash so I tried it
20:01:10 <Rubidium> and debian is working on changing to dash as default shell
20:01:39 <Xaroth> wasn't dash default shell to begin with for debian?
20:01:47 <Xaroth> or was that unubto only
20:06:51 <Noldo> dash is not tagged essential, bash is
20:08:20 <planetmaker> he, so thanks the more then :)
20:09:46 <fjb> bash isn't essential, only sh is.
20:13:35 <Noldo> making dash the /bin/sh does not drop the essential from bash
20:15:06 <Ammler> hmm, suse doesn't have dash in the default repos.
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20:16:58 <Eddi|zuHause> what's the advantage of dash over bash?
20:17:10 <Rubidium> Noldo: whether it's dropped from essential or not doesn't matter. If a script uses /bin/sh you should not use bash only constructs as /bin/sh does not imply it being bash
20:18:55 <Rubidium> basically: faster than bash, less external libraries
20:20:08 <petern> and the web page is small
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20:29:24 <Brianetta> Sacro: Compiling now.
20:29:39 <janklopper> quick question, openttd doesn't start on my system (ubuntu 9.04), but does generate a constant 100% cpu load (single thread)
20:29:51 <planetmaker> janklopper: that's bad
20:30:22 <janklopper> if i strace openttd, is it seems to be statting all of my files in the ~/data dir
20:30:23 <planetmaker> what does it tell you?
20:31:04 <planetmaker> I leave that to the pros then :P
20:31:12 <Brianetta> janklopper: Are you running on NFS ro similar?
20:31:26 <janklopper> Brianetta: nope, but the data is a separate mounted raid5
20:31:29 <Rubidium> circular reference (ln)
20:31:51 <Brianetta> I find I get a lengthy hang when reading from NFS over wireless (I am a bit of a masochist for that).
20:32:01 <Brianetta> A fast filesystem should help.
20:32:04 <janklopper> since its a 2tb setup, i guess it would scan trough all the files eventually
20:32:16 <Brianetta> If you have that many files. yes
20:32:23 <janklopper> but im wondering why on earth it would even scan those files
20:32:25 <Brianetta> It's probably generating checksums
20:32:31 <Brianetta> that means reading every byte
20:32:46 <Brianetta> Everything under data
20:32:48 <janklopper> why would it need to do that?
20:32:51 <planetmaker> :O md5 for all files takes ages :)
20:33:05 <planetmaker> janklopper: it doesn't... normally.
20:33:17 <planetmaker> where is your openttd installed?
20:33:28 <Brianetta> Why do you have a 2Tb data directory?
20:33:29 <janklopper> trought the .deb package
20:33:48 <janklopper> Brianetta: backups, media, repositories, code, etc
20:34:04 <janklopper> its a separate disk (raid) mounted under my home
20:34:05 <Brianetta> openttd has *a* data directory
20:34:13 <Brianetta> that really should be its own
20:34:27 <janklopper> is that dir located in ~/data ?
20:34:58 <planetmaker> janklopper: ~/.openttd/data
20:35:18 <planetmaker> if you install / copy it somewhere in your home dir or a subdir thereof
20:35:40 <janklopper> i have the ~/.openttd folder
20:35:46 <janklopper> no dta dir inside there though
20:36:10 <Brianetta> janklopper: It's system-wide
20:36:24 <Brianetta> dpkg -L openttd | grep data
20:36:46 <Brianetta> I'd do it myself but I don't have the package
20:37:32 <janklopper> /usr/share/games/openttd/data
20:37:37 <Eddi|zuHause> janklopper: did you try starting openttd, when you do not have ~ as working directory?
20:37:52 <Brianetta> That should be the datadir in your config
20:37:59 <Brianetta> especially if you wrote your own config file
20:38:20 <janklopper> Eddi|zuHause: hmm, that at least gives me an error
20:38:24 <Brianetta> Hopefully *that* is not 2TB
20:38:33 <janklopper> sample.cat aint there (I need to get the original files)
20:38:45 <planetmaker> janklopper: that's true
20:38:46 <janklopper> Brianetta: nope, /usr/share/games/openttd/data contains just the openttd files
20:39:10 <planetmaker> Or you get OpenGFX
20:39:13 <janklopper> so, if you start openttd from a path which also has a subdir named "data" your screwed? :P
20:39:19 <janklopper> planetmaker: that was the plan :)
20:39:48 <Eddi|zuHause> janklopper: so, try not to have a 2TB directory called "data" in your working dir, then it should be fine ;) ... the missing original files need to be installed separately, though
20:39:59 <janklopper> I've been working on a web based client for a while now, but usually dont need the openttd client itself
20:40:11 <janklopper> Eddi|zuHause: right, sorry aint gonna change :P
20:40:37 <janklopper> maybe add a token in there, designating the "data" dir as a valid openttd path
20:40:41 <Brianetta> janklopper: Try changing your cwd
20:40:46 <Eddi|zuHause> OpenTTD will try to search all directories called "data" it can find
20:41:17 <Brianetta> Eddi: That kind of automatic behaviour is really lame (:
20:41:22 <janklopper> Eddi|zuHause: yup, maybe it better to see if they have a file called .openttd before stating every file and its subdir
20:41:31 <Eddi|zuHause> it might be configurable that it does not check the working directory, but you'll at least have to recompile for that
20:41:34 <janklopper> that would be trivial to implement
20:42:26 <Eddi|zuHause> well, you're the first one to notice that problem ;)
20:42:41 <janklopper> hehe, probably wont be the last :P
20:42:41 <Eddi|zuHause> it can't be that problematic :p
20:43:20 <Brianetta> Sacro: New server is up.
20:43:20 <Eddi|zuHause> well, you have your workaround
20:43:33 <janklopper> Eddi|zuHause: thx :)
20:43:51 <Brianetta> Thankfully it's not terribly huge
20:43:54 <janklopper> other question, is there a server interface spec somewhere?
20:43:57 <Brianetta> but it's totally unrelated to openttd
20:44:10 <Brianetta> janklopper: Network protocol or what?
20:44:24 <janklopper> Brianetta: i was hoping something plaintext/xml/json
20:44:36 <Brianetta> There's a binary UDP interface for game info
20:45:14 <janklopper> would love to create a server to openttd server interface
20:45:18 <Eddi|zuHause> janklopper: depending on what you actually want to achieve, you might want to check out openttdlib or autopilot
20:45:35 <Brianetta> janklopper: Speaking as the guy who wrote autopilot, no you don't
20:45:53 <Brianetta> The game interfaces are as follows:
20:46:07 <Brianetta> Console output (used by autopilot through Expect): Limited.
20:46:07 <janklopper> Brianetta: hmm, how come? dealing with the browser stuff hasn't been easy either
20:46:18 <Brianetta> UDP: Basic game info only
20:46:54 <Brianetta> TCP: Download saved game using binary protocol, then transmit/receive binary game commands to keep game in lock step with server.
20:47:48 <Brianetta> TCP is the multiplayer protocol. It periodically compares random seed to make sure that the simulation is accurate on both sides, and disconnects clients with the wrong seed. That's a desync error, and is what you get if you try to attach non-openttd software to the server.
20:48:07 <Brianetta> Assuming your non-openttd server actually grabs the game and tries to keep up to date.
20:48:10 <janklopper> hmm, I was hoping the interface would have been more open
20:48:22 <Brianetta> It's open; it's just lame.
20:48:34 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: alberth * r16558 /trunk/src/town_gui.cpp: -Codechange: Switch found-town window to nested widgets.
20:48:46 <Brianetta> Unfortunately it's so entrenched that there's no realistic prospect of change.
20:48:59 <janklopper> The primary idea was to make a webbased vieuwer so anyone can see whats going on inside a hosted game
20:49:08 <janklopper> planetmaker: hehe, safari is a bit broken yes ;)
20:49:16 <Brianetta> janklopper: It would need to be openttd, basically.
20:49:24 <janklopper> hmm, firefox should be better
20:49:28 <janklopper> at least it works fie here
20:49:30 <Brianetta> Firefox is that bad.
20:49:47 <Noldo> didn't someone make such webviewer
20:50:00 <Brianetta> Noldo: I had a webcam on my server'spage
20:50:09 <Brianetta> Basically, the server was saving screenshots
20:50:14 <Brianetta> but that's deprecated
20:50:18 <janklopper> hmm, Should probably upload a new version then
20:50:26 <Brianetta> and unlikely to remain possible on a dedicated server
20:51:14 <Eddi|zuHause> janklopper: the problem is, with openttd's game state being so huge, it cannot transfer the game state regularly over the net. that is why all game state is transferred once, and each client runs the entire simulation
20:51:23 <Brianetta> petern: I ditched the mod I made to autopilot some months back (:
20:51:43 <janklopper> Eddi|zuHause: and there's no incremental update mechanism?
20:52:01 <Rubidium> janklopper: how much MB/s do you want?
20:52:03 <janklopper> thats how i do udpates, just select the updates for the viewport since your last view
20:52:22 <Brianetta> Unfortunately, using a lossy or corrective multiplayer protocol would involve a rewrite of much of the game's code, since it changes some pretty fundamental assumptions.
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20:55:12 <Eddi|zuHause> janklopper: you can only work on a static savegame. everything else would be futile
20:55:40 <Eddi|zuHause> and savegames can be several MB
20:55:47 <janklopper> ok, il just keep my focus on engine shinies then
20:55:58 <janklopper> and skip my openttd idea for now :P
20:56:10 <Brianetta> unless you use a modified openttd client, connect it as a spectator, and query its state.
20:56:39 <Brianetta> If you're doing that, though, you might as well get it to render your view.
20:57:59 <Brianetta> brb, switching over to laptop
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21:01:50 <Brianetta> We're watching Blakes 7 (-:
21:02:23 <Nite_Owl> I remember that show
21:02:45 <Brianetta> Interestingly, so do I.
21:02:55 <Brianetta> My wife hasn't seen it, though.
21:03:22 <Nite_Owl> It was only on for a season or two I believe
21:04:30 <Brianetta> There were four series
21:04:55 <Nite_Owl> Possibly only the first one or two made it across the pond or they combined them over here
21:05:24 <petern> i don't think i've seen it, maybe an episode here and there
21:12:17 <Eddi|zuHause> i do not remember ever having seen this name
21:16:20 <Brianetta> Eddi, it's a British sci fi series from the seventies. Written by Terry Nation, who invented Daleks.
21:18:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i also learned about the daleks only about two years ago...
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21:18:57 <Eddi|zuHause> probably even less...
21:22:43 <janklopper> hmm, whats the maximum width for openttd to be played on?
21:23:17 <Eddi|zuHause> that limit was lifted recently.
21:23:29 <janklopper> can get it to go to 4960pixels wide
21:23:39 <planetmaker> janklopper: I played it successfully on 2560 x 1024
21:24:20 <Rubidium> that depends on the amount of memory you can allocate and the width your videocard(s) support and the limits of your OS
21:24:49 <janklopper> my desktop is 4960*1600
21:25:06 <janklopper> 8gb ram, 64 bits, but maybe openttd is running in 32b
21:25:28 <janklopper> 786meg ram per gpu, so that should be plenty for the framebuffer
21:25:33 <Eddi|zuHause> janklopper: so what is the actual problem?
21:25:35 <janklopper> hl2 and ut2k4 run fine
21:26:00 <janklopper> I can "only" stretch the window to about half of the third screen
21:26:14 <janklopper> limited the width to about 4100 or so
21:26:23 <janklopper> not a problem, just a question
21:26:55 <Eddi|zuHause> the window size is only limited by your window manager... openttd has no influence on that
21:27:35 <Prof_Frink> A 4096x4096 window on a significantly smaller screen is... interesting
21:27:51 <janklopper> odd, most programs can be stretched to fit the entire desktop
21:28:19 <janklopper> not really a problem though, its not like im planning on playing like that
21:28:33 <Rubidium> openttd itself doesn't imply a limit, so the question is what does cause the limit
21:30:17 <janklopper> hmm, i thought fullscreen didnt work (only used one xinerama screen), but now that i stretched it, it does work, and fullscreen actually does use 4960*1600 pixels :)
21:30:31 <janklopper> looks like it is the gnome window manager then
21:31:54 <janklopper> looks pretty shiny :P
21:32:30 <janklopper> especially if you think back to what the original resolution was my 386 played this on
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21:49:47 <Fogel> hello, is there any way to put a speed limit for some part of railroad?
21:50:32 <Fogel> if f.ex. train has vmax 160kmh, and i want it to travel with 120 for 50 tiles
21:51:58 <welshdragon> use wagon speed restrictions
21:53:34 <Prof_Frink> Build lots of bridges
21:53:55 <Yexo> build a very steep slope
21:54:10 <Prof_Frink> Use a slower engine
21:54:16 <SmatZ> send it to depot and replace the engine there
21:54:42 <Prof_Frink> Send a slower engine down the track ahead of it
21:55:11 <Fogel> (i use total bridge renewal set)
21:55:41 <Nite_Owl> station, timetables, wait times at station, will accomplish the same thing
21:56:38 <Nite_Owl> if that thing is spacing out your trains of course
21:57:04 <Fogel> i mean - i have 200 tiles long track, i want it to travel first 50 for 120 mph, next 100 with its max speed, last 50 again with 120
21:57:59 <Fogel> to make it more realistic
21:58:35 <Prof_Frink> We don't approve of the R word in here.
21:58:38 <Nite_Owl> good thing Belugas went home already
22:00:09 <Fogel> why? i just wanted to make sth kinda similar to what we call Polish Railways, and there are a lot of speed limits here, i just wanted to simulate them a bit
22:00:46 <Nite_Owl> bottom line - there is no easy way to do that
22:00:54 <Yexo> the problem is that a lot of people are making suggestions "because it's realistic"
22:01:03 <SmatZ> maybe with orders... it would be simple
22:01:16 <SmatZ> and use waypoints to start/end "speed limited" segment
22:01:32 <Fogel> i thought about wapoints and timeytabled travels
22:01:36 <Eddi|zuHause> i support Fogel's request, but the reason is not "realism", but synchronising the flow on a busy main line
22:02:01 <SmatZ> hmm that probably won't work with orders, Eddi|zuHause
22:02:31 <Fogel> but it'll be difficult to find appropriate ticks number
22:02:36 <Eddi|zuHause> orders is only one solution to the problem
22:02:37 <Nite_Owl> mode separation works well for that
22:03:03 <Eddi|zuHause> no, Nite_Owl, it does not. it requires space for at least two parallel lines
22:03:08 <Eddi|zuHause> for each direction
22:04:25 <Nite_Owl> well you did not specify that you wanted a two track mainline
22:05:13 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: smatz * r16559 /trunk/src/ (14 files in 4 dirs): -Codechange: introduce Company::IsValidAiID() and Company::IsValidHumanID(), don't use IsHumanCompany() where possible
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22:11:51 <CIA-6> OpenTTD: smatz * r16560 /trunk/src/strings.cpp: -Fix (r16559): wrong replacement at one place
22:12:48 <SmatZ> why are some bugs visible only from the commit log :-x
22:13:20 <Eddi|zuHause> Nite_Owl: anyone who knows my building style can derive that...
22:13:57 <Eddi|zuHause> SmatZ: next time use a less descriptive commit message, à la "move along, nothing to see here."
22:14:05 <Nite_Owl> please forgive my unfamiliarity
22:14:37 <Eddi|zuHause> Nite_Owl: technically, main lines can also be single tracked
22:15:08 <SmatZ> Eddi|zuHause: most of my commits are of this kind
22:15:15 <SmatZ> it would be boring soon
22:15:18 <Nite_Owl> or is it please forgive my lack of familiarity
22:15:42 <Eddi|zuHause> Nite_Owl: i believe it's "infamiliar"
22:16:01 <Eddi|zuHause> but i have no logical rule to support that
22:16:38 <Nite_Owl> no, spell checker does not like that one
22:17:53 <Nite_Owl> true though - main lines can be any size you like
22:18:13 <Eddi|zuHause> that is even "realistic"
22:18:37 <Eddi|zuHause> especially in east germany, where the russians collected all the second tracks as reparation
22:19:20 <Nite_Owl> just as you prefer dual tracks, I prefer quad tracks when possible
22:19:59 <Eddi|zuHause> SmatZ: what have you done now?
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