IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2009-04-23
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03:05:46 <Belugas> lovely from you to tell us so...
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03:14:29 * Belugas keeps on waiting for the compile to finish
03:15:55 <Belugas> infact... i'll sleep now and check the result tomorrow
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08:48:52 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, I checked WT3 with Safari briefly and found everything like I would have expected.
08:50:06 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: good! Tnx :)
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09:01:07 <planetmaker> he... the "last changed strings" is noticably slower than the other categories.
09:01:30 <TrueBrain> don't use it too much ;)
09:01:37 <TrueBrain> (it is a hell to calculate next/prev
09:01:45 <petern> also, sensible database
09:02:04 <TrueBrain> I think I need to extend my ignore list :p
09:02:26 <TrueBrain> either way, everything is indexes for lineair listing, not time-based listing .. so it is slower :)
09:03:01 <petern> linux > windows, lighttpd > apache, postgresql > mysql, perl > php!
09:03:31 <TrueBrain> perl over php? Haha :) You _are_ insane :p
09:04:21 <petern> for scripts, maybe not web :)
09:04:36 <TrueBrain> for scripts, I agree, but to use php for scripts is like the worst idea :)
09:04:39 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: even the factorial of php ;)
09:05:01 <TrueBrain> WHAT? It is getting insaner by the minute :)
09:05:05 <TrueBrain> ASP with its: on error resume next;
09:05:40 <TrueBrain> mostly because it is created/sold by MicroSoft :)
09:06:05 <TrueBrain> there is still a debate going on if mono is legal :p
09:06:30 <Rubidium> let Microsoft first show that they are capable of implementing a standard...
09:06:56 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: no, you see that wrong; microsoft doesn't have to implement a standard, they ARE the standard
09:06:56 <Rubidium> ... like their own xml-office-document formats
09:07:02 <TrueBrain> so everyone needs to do it THEIR way
09:07:13 <TrueBrain> and if the documentation doesn't agree, the documentation is wrong, not them!
09:09:51 <dihedral> someone today said, people who use java cannot consider it 'programming'... when i asked why, he said java sucks - he likes perl :-P
09:11:10 <SpComb> petern: except lighttpd is stagnating
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09:11:45 <TrueBrain> cherokee is already trying to fill in the place of lighttpd :)
09:12:00 <SHADOW-XIII> dont tell me about java
09:12:22 <SHADOW-XIII> jave to write db app on website with tomcat for tomorrow from scratch ...
09:14:30 <petern> SpComb, "stagnating" means it does what most people want
09:14:45 <petern> so they feel no need to change thing
09:14:49 <TrueBrain> petern: far from it :(
09:14:53 <petern> then people decide it's dead
09:15:00 <petern> and therefore must write a new system from scratcxh
09:15:23 <TrueBrain> lighttpd development is stalled because the main developer start working on other things
09:15:36 <TrueBrain> while there is a bug-log which is longer than OpenTTD's .....
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09:17:33 <Rexxars> well, if he isn't getting paid to keep working on it, and doesn't think it's fun anymore, why should he keep working on it?
09:17:44 <TrueBrain> Rexxars: nobody said he should :)
09:17:51 <SpComb> lighttpd has plenty of users
09:17:51 <TrueBrain> it is just said development stalls because of it :)
09:19:13 <TrueBrain> slowly there starts to be a bit of development ....
09:21:21 <petern> hmm, not quite the link :p
09:21:49 <petern> it goes from r2430 to r2465 in a day :p
09:22:03 <TrueBrain> as I said, slowly there starts to be a bit of development ;)
09:30:48 <SHADOW-XIII> hilarious ... judge in piratebay case is normally lobbing for authoring rights ...
09:31:09 <SHADOW-XIII> case will go down asap, rofl
09:44:22 <SpComb> from a cynical viewpoint, I could well see it not being invalidated
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10:16:01 * Rubidium just wonders when google/microsoft will be sued
10:16:54 <Rubidium> (or apple) as they provide the tools to acquire the tools to download illegal content and provide the tools to search for illegal content
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10:48:09 <Rakin> my openttd's ai always crsh
10:48:25 <Rakin> n my openttd's ai always clash
10:49:03 <Yexo> now what's the problem? That they crash, that they clash, or both?
10:50:30 <Yexo> about clashing, the best you can do is usnig as many different AIs as possible
10:51:43 <TrueBrain> well, you are very welcome :s
10:52:12 <Yexo> after my first reaction he started a pm "my openttd's ai always crash", "plz help"
10:53:31 <planetmaker> no persistance, no effort... :S
11:08:00 <RakinX> where can i get openttd 0.6.3
11:09:57 <Rubidium> openttd.org/download-stable/0.6.3 ?
11:10:28 <TrueBrain> I wonder how many times he will be coming back
11:10:51 * SHADOW-XIII hates tomcat & jsp
11:11:09 <TrueBrain> # Fuck you, Fuck you very much
11:11:12 <Rubidium> SHADOW-XIII: use bobcat & jeta
11:11:14 <SHADOW-XIII> if only I could find somebody to do this instead of me for money :P
11:11:33 *** petern sets mode: +b *!*@220.247.162.34
11:11:44 <TrueBrain> petern: I was considernig that action too ... :p
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11:16:25 <SHADOW-XIII> Rubidium : tell that to my tutor
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11:28:17 <SHADOW-XIII> sic, I knew I got bad connection but 30 sec lag is a bit too much !
11:30:19 <SHADOW-XIII> that's interesting ... american army lost probes with dangerous virus ...
11:30:47 <SHADOW-XIII> and that's real news .... now 100$ question: "which game was starting like that ?"
11:31:13 <TrueBrain> I doubt you will really pay me the 100$, so I refuse to answer
11:36:06 <SHADOW-XIII> there's still small bug in nighties: refit window, text of cost of refitting is trimmed so early it is not visible ... anyone want to submit the bug ?
11:36:43 <TrueBrain> how lazy can you be ..
11:36:49 <TrueBrain> you can write down the bug here, but don't want to submit the bug?
11:40:46 <Yexo> it's already there: FS#2846
11:55:35 <SHADOW-XIII> TrueBrain : I suppose bugtracker needs registration, isnt it ?
11:55:58 <TrueBrain> the fact that you ask makes you one terrible OpenTTD user ;)
11:56:22 <glx> registration is to help communication
11:56:37 <reldred> Wait, what, SHADOW-XIII playing OpenTTD? What the hell happened over the last few months I was away?
11:56:45 <reldred> I'm utterly fucking confused...
11:57:26 <SHADOW-XIII> well, ottd incorporated things that was lacking the most
11:57:42 <reldred> Yeah, everyone turns over to the darkside in the end.
11:58:07 <reldred> No matter how much OpenTTD lacks a 'soul'
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12:03:18 <SHADOW-XIII> pbs, grfs and more, it still lacks a lof of things should be there, like rail vertical/horizontal up/down the hill
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12:06:16 <reldred> very true, the lack of that pisses me off, but I ended up just getting used to the new rail multi-drag-drop-doodad
12:06:33 <reldred> Autoslope was the major blocker for me for a long time
12:06:50 <reldred> The lack of the programable signals annoys me as well
12:07:16 <Yexo> try a recent nighly and you can drag horizontal/vertical rails too
12:08:55 <planetmaker> oh, that was that :) I wondered whether it was only code cosmetics :)
12:13:42 <Rubidium> no, it was only 'looks' ;)
12:13:53 <pavel1269> Yexo: i thought, that this feature is there since i started to play .... like r8K or sth
12:13:57 <SHADOW-XIII> Yexo: I mean up/down the hill as well
12:14:08 <Yexo> SHADOW-XIII: I know, but reldred did not mean that
12:14:19 <SHADOW-XIII> now you can lay the rail up or down in / or \ directrions, not in | or -
12:14:39 <Yexo> pavel1269: no, only diagonal rails could be dragged. With autorail you could/can drag all directions though
12:15:10 <pavel1269> ahhh this .... I use only autorail so ... shortcup "a" ftw :-P
12:15:43 <SHADOW-XIII> and all setting/options thing is complete mess, grf settings, options, advanced settings, ai settings, transparency options
12:16:14 <Yexo> you forget the difficulty settings :p
12:16:28 <Rubidium> SHADOW-XIII: then come up with something better...
12:16:35 <planetmaker> ^^ SHADOW-XIII exactly.
12:17:10 <planetmaker> I sat over that for quite some time. But getting it grouped such that it meets the several border criteria ... very difficult
12:17:47 <SHADOW-XIII> Rubidium : finish for me that damn apache/tomcat and I might
12:18:18 <SHADOW-XIII> I even cannot make it work :/
12:18:22 <Rubidium> just eject from your tomcat and let it crash
12:18:44 <Rubidium> preferably above the apache preservation
12:18:57 <SHADOW-XIII> however I put my class it gives me The requested resource (/servlet/HelloWorldExample) is not available.
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12:26:31 <SHADOW-XIII> in examples, however if I replace example html with my html and class with my class it says that error
12:26:57 <SHADOW-XIII> what's funny, those are just examples from my tutor that well ... should work
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12:27:18 <Rubidium> never assume that they work
12:29:55 <Rubidium> *especially* at higher education
12:31:13 <XX> which version of openttd have the original ttd ai
12:31:58 <XX> which version of openttd have the original ttd ai
12:32:16 <Rubidium> probably none, though 0.1.1 comes closest I guess
12:32:53 <TrueBrain> weren't you going to download 0.6.3 anyway?
12:33:09 <Rubidium> that's a very broken ai that's somewhat like TTD's ai, but far from it due to it's brokeness
12:33:33 <XX> what are what are you talking about
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12:34:30 <TrueBrain> @mode +b *!*@220.247.162.34
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12:40:06 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, can openttd's compile farm also compile external hg repositories?
12:40:31 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: yup; mostly because it doesn't have any internal hg repos :)
12:40:50 <planetmaker> background: the infrastructure sharing patch is somewhat ready for a beta2 release. And it would be cool to have versions for all OS :)
12:40:51 <TrueBrain> (the CF is in a seperate subnet (network-wise) on our dedicated, and fetches everything remotely, including SVN)
12:41:04 <TrueBrain> I dislike IS, so I don't know if I want to feed it through the CF :p
12:41:28 <TrueBrain> the CF currently only has one limition: it can only compile the 'default' branch inside a hg/git
12:41:30 <planetmaker> the principle or the implementations so far?
12:41:47 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: anyway, if you want it running through CF, you need one of the devs to sign off on that :)
12:42:04 <planetmaker> default branch is no problem, it has its separate hg repository.
12:43:02 <planetmaker> :) I hope that's possible.
12:45:48 <planetmaker> but I guess the latency, and that only TB (maybe Rubidium ) can trigger the compile farm, it might rather then be tomorrow for a compilation.
12:46:10 <planetmaker> hm... wrong channel :P
12:47:03 <planetmaker> well :) There are a few commits to be done anyway - and that might then be too late for today :)
12:47:50 <TrueBrain> oh, and for the record: I can't compile custom projects between 1800 and 2100 CEST :)
12:49:06 <Yexo> why not? I thought the nigtly got priority automatically?
12:49:08 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, exactly that's why I think today might be out of order :)
12:49:32 <TrueBrain> Yexo: exactly my point :)
12:49:46 <petern> problem with running other branches through the CF is then they become 'semi official'
12:49:49 <TrueBrain> means compile-time of 4 hours, if I trigger it at 1800 or so :p
12:50:05 <TrueBrain> petern: maybe .. they come in a map 'custom' ..
12:50:09 <Yexo> petern: I guess that's why TrueBrain wants a dev to sign off
12:50:52 <TrueBrain> I leave that for you guys to fight out, if you want such project run through the CF or not :)
12:51:03 <Yexo> maybe I will, but only after a decent code review, and I don't have time for that
12:51:35 <planetmaker> any chance for that somewhen, Yexo ?
12:51:47 <petern> just review and commit ;)
12:52:11 <Yexo> planetmaker: yes, but not today/tommorow
12:52:38 <Yexo> I didn't way I'll do it, just if I find the motivation later :p
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12:53:15 <planetmaker> you give a small finger, people take your whole arm ;)
12:55:34 <Pikka> planetmaker, why are you going around giving people the finger in the first place?
12:55:54 <planetmaker> :P I'm too naive and friendly.
12:55:54 <TrueBrain> bad habbits die hard
12:59:28 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, can the CF actually compile any revision from a repository or just tip?
13:00:03 <planetmaker> hm... so, if there's a tag called "beta2", it needs to be tip in order for this thing to work, right?
13:00:13 <TrueBrain> with current CF, yes
13:00:23 <TrueBrain> a very simple solution is to make a second clone of the hg with the tag
13:00:29 <TrueBrain> which then becomes the tip of that clone
13:00:43 <TrueBrain> will be fixed if and after WT3 is done :p
13:00:58 <planetmaker> thanks for the tip :)
13:04:46 <TrueBrain> in theory btw, which is something petern might like, the CF can upload to alternative locations (via sftp)
13:05:37 <planetmaker> hm... that would be nicely feasable from my point of view.
13:06:10 <planetmaker> We don't need (semi-)officially endorsed binaries, it just helps testing a lot, if all platforms are supported
13:06:38 <TrueBrain> and that is exactly what the CF is for ;)
13:07:13 <planetmaker> Well, then that's actually, from my POV, the right now preferred solution.
13:07:45 <Yexo> if that's the case I see no reason not to compile some binaries
13:08:36 <planetmaker> yup. TrueBrain is there a public key you can give me?
13:08:46 <planetmaker> Then we can allow that key to access our servers.
13:09:14 <TrueBrain> $ this->currentJob->hold();
13:09:50 <planetmaker> :) TrueBrain don't interrupt what you're doing now. It's not like an emergency :)
13:11:59 <TrueBrain> those tasks .. if I don't do it now .. I don't do it ever :p
13:13:03 <planetmaker> hehe. Common behaviour, I guess :P
13:14:13 <TrueBrain> schedule 17 define ... 17 schedules already. ... :)
13:15:14 <TrueBrain> $ this->currentJob->resume()
13:15:26 <TrueBrain> current job: waiting for Rubidium
13:15:44 <TrueBrain> my validation routine gives me HINTS! :)
13:15:56 <TrueBrain> HINT: Expected 0 parameters, got 1, for command 'SETX' in string 'STR_882A_END_OF_ORDERS'
13:15:57 <TrueBrain> HINT: Expected 0 parameters, got 2, for command 'P' in string 'STR_9001_ROAD_VEHICLES'
13:19:45 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, you got one "T" too many in the first command :D
13:20:39 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: pervert
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13:28:25 <Belugas> there was a new topic that really made me sick. but i can't find it again.
13:28:38 <TrueBrain> Belugas: maybe for the best :)
13:29:12 <Belugas> well.. that kind of post has to be buried deep hard. the game is not realistic and blablabla... and it should be done this way and that way....
13:29:17 <Belugas> but hey, I lOOOOOOvethe game
13:30:52 <Yexo> Belugas: the one in the gamebalance thread?
13:31:17 <Belugas> dunno... i'll check right noqw
13:32:27 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16122 /trunk/src/strgen/strgen.cpp: -Change: add more misc information about the behaviour of commands to strgen's -export-commands.
13:33:20 <TrueBrain> $ this->currentJob->print()
13:33:25 <TrueBrain> current job: working on WT3
13:33:59 <Belugas> incredibly boring and disconnected. but... on the other hand, i do not feel like blasting him, since he did quite a job at explaining his ideas
13:36:04 <Gekz> he must have done his explaining well then
13:39:50 <Gekz> he explains it very well
13:40:15 <Belugas> it's not a rant. that's the best part of it.
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13:40:28 <Gekz> I thuoght it was about to be a rant
13:41:18 <Gekz> Belugas: I like his loan idea
13:42:52 <Gekz> and his ownership layer idea
13:42:55 <Gekz> I've had that one before too
13:43:15 <Gekz> no, I've just never aired it
13:43:20 <Gekz> because I can get one of two responses:
13:43:39 <Gekz> the open source world doesn't like ideas.
13:44:02 <TrueBrain> a dutch saying is like this: "Never shot is always missed"
13:44:06 <Yexo> no, the open source world has too many idea or not enough coders
13:44:17 <TrueBrain> so now don't start bitching :p
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13:45:26 <Belugas> the open source world is oftenly confronted with ideas and even work that are not requested nor wanted
13:45:50 <Belugas> but the provider is often insisting on the marvelous piece of work that he has provided
13:46:01 <Belugas> and i'm not ONLY talking about Richk here...
13:48:38 <Belugas> and back to quarq's post, i'm very disappointed to the fact that all this good analysis has been done solely on the principle of realism
13:48:38 <Patrick> everyone blows in with "my great idea" that's been dismissed ten times before
13:48:43 <Belugas> welll... that's how i see it
13:49:01 <Patrick> "code it yourself" doesn't always work either
13:49:09 <Patrick> if your idea is Great
13:49:18 <Patrick> then you can win over enough developers to make it happen
13:49:26 <Patrick> give me some examples ... terrain map edges?
13:49:44 <Patrick> that's been dabbled with for years
13:49:55 <Patrick> that's not in trunk, is it?
13:50:05 <Gekz> no-one said it had to be merged
13:50:32 <Belugas> some branches never get merged
13:50:43 <TrueBrain> Open Source is _no_ Demand/Supply market
13:50:44 <Gekz> and cargodest probably wont apparnetly
13:50:46 <Belugas> remember the old map branch
13:50:47 <Gekz> because of the use of Boost
13:50:52 <Gekz> why did he have to use boost
13:51:08 <Gekz> TrueBrain: that's why it will never replace proprietary products
13:51:13 <Belugas> TrueBrain, true, so true
13:51:21 <Gekz> TrueBrain: because some shit is just that boring, that to develop it, you'd need to be paid
13:51:22 <TrueBrain> people tend to forget that tiny fact ;)
13:51:42 <Belugas> it's open... it should accept everything....
13:51:50 <Belugas> that's the normal mentality
13:53:07 <Gekz> what's an easy-to-use tiling window manager?
13:53:24 <Belugas> hello glx :) and yes, you're so right saying it's so wrong
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13:58:31 <fjb> Are there no logs anymore?
13:58:58 <TrueBrain> fjb: try thegrebs.com
13:59:36 <glx> or use your browser's shortcuts
14:07:11 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16123 /trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): -Fix: forgot to add table/strgen.h to the project files + a typo
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14:25:56 <dihedral> hihi - i wrote a little randomizer, which randomly changes configured parts of the config, to a randomly selected value from a configured list of values :-P
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14:31:36 <HackaLittleBit> hello evereybody
14:32:46 <HackaLittleBit> Rubidium, Yexo answered you.
14:33:00 <HackaLittleBit> was not so smart of me
14:34:43 <HackaLittleBit> NOooo I answered
14:35:21 <HackaLittleBit> Anyway thanks and sorry about bothering you
14:36:17 <Yexo> ah, why didn't you say so in the first place :p
14:37:00 <Yexo> no problem, it can happen
14:40:29 <HackaLittleBit> In FS 2823 smatz warned me about "It seems to be using HasVehicleOnPos in a wrong way, possibly causing desyncs"
14:41:01 <HackaLittleBit> is somebody willing to have a look at that
14:41:17 <HackaLittleBit> because I don't understand that
14:42:41 <Rubidium> the order of items in the vehicle has differs between clients
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14:44:48 <Rubidium> as you only 'evaluate' till you found the first and change the first you might end up changing the speed of vehicle 1 on the server and vehicle 2 on the client and vehicle 3 on another
14:45:01 <Rubidium> just because their hash table is ordered differently
14:46:52 <Rubidium> the desyncs caused by this are hard to trigger, but even harder to track down
14:47:56 <petern> 1 day in 2 seconds to 1 day in 1 hour is ... a big jump
14:48:37 <HackaLittleBit> Thanks Rubidium I see I have more work to do
14:51:43 <fjb> petern: 1 year in 15 days, 1 game runs 5,4 years... :-)
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14:52:33 <dihedral> batti5, i dont do dcc chat!
14:52:59 <Forked> wait, thats eggdrops.. nevermind
14:53:43 <dihedral> why on earth would someone (i have nothing to do with by the way) decide to dcc chat me?
14:54:16 <Belugas> why on earth would anyone want to caht with you, in the first place?
15:08:57 * TrueBrain finishes WT3 string validation
15:09:10 <TrueBrain> in a few minutes I know if I should be happy, as then it is finished
15:09:31 <TrueBrain> SVN is a nice test-bed ;) But I will enable the validation on the Save button soon, then you can test :)
15:09:50 <glx> nice, I have a test string already :)
15:10:04 <TrueBrain> that one will fail :p
15:12:36 <TrueBrain> first I think I need to do some shopping ... need food!!
15:13:50 <batti5> <dihedral> batti5, i dont do dcc chat!: I don`t even know what dcc chat is.
15:13:59 <TrueBrain> one general thing: if you ever fail to do a change in WT3, you can always do it via SVN, as that is ALWAYS accepted
15:14:19 <TrueBrain> {1:STRING} {0:TOWN}
15:14:20 <TrueBrain> HINT: STRING at wrong position in string 'STR_INDUSTRY_FORMAT'
15:14:22 <TrueBrain> HINT: TOWN at wrong position in string 'STR_INDUSTRY_FORMAT'
15:14:23 <TrueBrain> HINT: Missing TOWN in translation of string 'STR_INDUSTRY_FORMAT'
15:14:25 <TrueBrain> HINT: Missing STRING in translation of string 'STR_INDUSTRY_FORMAT'
15:14:28 <TrueBrain> either my routine is wrong, or a string was broken in r7787 :p
15:16:49 <glx> does it handle the "x:" ?
15:17:51 <dihedral> his routine or ... :-P
15:19:12 <TrueBrain> grr .. python failed to auto-cast :(
15:20:09 <TrueBrain> (or the other way around ... what ever :p)
15:22:15 <TrueBrain> oh, was going to buy some food .. hmm ..
15:23:44 <glx> better do than before it's closed :)
15:23:57 <TrueBrain> that gives me 5 more hours ... :p
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15:31:21 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Bjarni
15:32:38 <DorpsGek> petern: bjarni was last seen in #openttd 2 weeks, 5 days, 19 hours, 47 minutes, and 41 seconds ago: <Bjarni> and you will never know if there is a joke in it :P
15:35:30 * planetmaker wonders what all the people look for
15:35:45 <batti5> Is thare a way to complie openttd with gcc43 on mandriva 2009?
15:36:06 <planetmaker> yes. but you haven't found it obviously
15:36:46 <batti5> i get the folowing error =
15:36:47 <batti5> the CC environment variable is set, but it doesn't seem to be a gcc binary
15:36:49 <batti5> please redefine the CC/CXX environment to a gcc binary
15:36:57 <planetmaker> fix your system then :)
15:37:13 <planetmaker> ask the mandriva guys
15:37:29 <dihedral> or are you just asking questions without doing anything yourself
15:37:38 <Bjarni> google is only good if you know what to search for ^^
15:38:10 <planetmaker> best shot is: re-install your gcc.
15:38:19 <dihedral> Belugas: "please redefine the CC/CXX environment to a gcc binary"
15:38:52 <glx> CC/CXX not needed if g++ is installed :)
15:38:56 <dihedral> google-ing the error message is often a good try
15:39:10 <Bjarni> searching for the error string is not always a good solution
15:39:10 <batti5> export CC=<gccs location>, but its not in /usr/local/bin/
15:39:19 <dihedral> Bjarni, it's a start
15:39:30 <planetmaker> first hit: bugs.openttd.org
15:39:31 <dihedral> and often enough other people have had a similar issue
15:39:41 <Bjarni> I once searched and it turned out that it was a custom error string so I came up with... one guy having the same problem and no solution.... and nothing else
15:39:42 <glx> first step, type "gcc -v" in a terminal
15:39:57 <Belugas> dihedral, i would not, even if i knew how...
15:40:07 <dihedral> Bjarni, but at least you show that you tried
15:40:33 <dihedral> + if you dont find an answer that way, and have no other idea you can still ask
15:40:37 <dihedral> but not trying is even worse
15:41:37 <Belugas> but then... why would I do somehting that i'm not going to use???
15:45:15 <Belugas> well... let say i have better place to go for having fun...
15:45:44 <Belugas> right now, i'm ahaving "fun" with PINPads, Chip n Pin cards and simulators
15:45:56 <batti5> well, i find the problem g++ is missing.
15:46:30 <planetmaker> I guess an install is in order then. Use your packet manager and install it.
15:46:50 <glx> while you are at installing stuff, don't forget zlib-dev, sdl-dev, freetype-dev, ...
15:48:56 <Belugas> don't try to install openttd-dev, it will fail...
15:53:46 <TrueBrain> Afrikaans Slovenian Latvian Chinese
15:53:51 <TrueBrain> be happy, you guys are my notepad
15:56:43 *** SHADOW_XIII has joined #openttd
15:57:02 <Belugas> so do not move while he write on you
15:57:06 <Bjarni> you use Chinese people for remembering the stuff everybody else use notepad for?
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16:02:39 <batti5> i can`t find SDL-devel for mandriva
16:03:01 <TrueBrain> for $10,000, is this:
16:03:04 <TrueBrain> a) batti5 failure to search
16:03:11 <TrueBrain> b) mandrive's failure to include it
16:03:27 <TrueBrain> c) problem-is-between-keyboard-and-chair
16:03:32 <TrueBrain> your time is running .. what will it be ...
16:04:18 <TrueBrain> oh, this is bad! He had such a good run!
16:04:24 <TrueBrain> and now .. batti5 has to go home with nothing!
16:04:30 <TrueBrain> oh well, better luck next time!
16:08:35 *** Fuchs82 has joined #openttd
16:09:12 <Fuchs82> could someone help me with a metropolitan airport pls? I can't build one
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16:09:48 <el_en> batti5: the correct apostrophe character is ', not `.
16:09:51 <planetmaker> Fuchs82, then you're playing too early or have too little money
16:10:13 <planetmaker> too early in terms of game years.
16:10:20 <Fuchs82> nope, it's 1981 already and i got the money..
16:10:32 <Fuchs82> it's not in the building menu.. not even disabled
16:10:48 <Yexo> can you build other airports? What is the error message you get?
16:11:00 <Fuchs82> no error message. and yes, i got city airports
16:11:21 <TrueBrain> what OpenTTD version are you playing?
16:11:23 <Yexo> then what? Is the button greyed out?
16:11:24 <Belugas> it'snot on the menu? or it's disabled?
16:11:32 <Fuchs82> nope there is no button for it :-P
16:11:35 <Fuchs82> got the latest version
16:11:42 <Yexo> latest isn't a version number
16:12:00 <Fuchs82> hehe, but it's the german version
16:12:02 <TrueBrain> (latest for Gentoo was 0.4.8 for a long time ... while 0.6.3 was out, so .. latest is a tiny bit relative)
16:12:06 <Fuchs82> wait, i'll upload a screenshot
16:12:09 <batti5> now its compliing, after i installed SDL-dev from a other distro, it had downloaded 46 depenecies
16:12:18 <Belugas> just change you lang to english...
16:12:19 <Yexo> Fuchs82: there is no "german version"
16:12:31 <Yexo> you can changes languages to whatever you like
16:12:32 <Fuchs82> ah kk, will change the language
16:12:38 <TrueBrain> and tell us the version you are using!
16:13:24 <TrueBrain> batti5: considered searching for 'sdl' and see what hits you get? As I believe it is called libsdl-devel nowedays
16:13:31 <glx> batti5: knowing mandriva I'm quite sure SDL is in
16:13:34 <TrueBrain> (search within your package manager)
16:13:43 <Fuchs82> ah ok, got it! :-D I can build it. The german name for it was a bit strange
16:13:52 * TrueBrain bashes head to wall
16:17:22 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16124 /trunk/src/strings.cpp: -Codechange: unify the three number drawing methods
16:18:22 <Belugas> and bitch planetmaker about the airport name!
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16:18:41 <TrueBrain> [18:18] <Fuchs82> hey there, can u help me with updating the airports? is there a easier way?
16:18:48 <TrueBrain> such questions are, as you might expect, for this channel
16:19:33 <Fuchs82> i always have to send all my planes to another airport. is there an easier way to update an airport?
16:19:48 <SHADOW_XIII> hm .... 50 minuts FF13 gameplay video ... intersting
16:20:01 <Yexo> no, there is a close airports patch in the forums though
16:21:47 * fjb expects the next question to be "how to install a patch?"...
16:21:52 <planetmaker> Fuchs82, what name was the German one which you didn't recognize?
16:22:12 <planetmaker> You have the chance to complain now and I *might* - just *might* fix it.
16:22:29 *** kingj is now known as KingJ
16:23:50 <Rubidium> planetmaker: can you fix an Apfelstruedel for me?
16:24:05 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
16:24:31 <planetmaker> Rubidium, I can :)
16:24:39 <planetmaker> But you have to drop an "e"
16:25:01 <planetmaker> There's only Apfelstrudel :)
16:25:11 <Rubidium> tss... no fancy umlauts :(
16:25:22 <planetmaker> So... let's have Apfelstrudel party when there are new ones around? :)
16:26:18 <planetmaker> or... alternatively: invite me for your birthday. I might bring the cake :)
16:26:27 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: or just invite us to your place
16:26:42 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, that's what I initially thought :)
16:27:05 <planetmaker> but then it's like a dozen duchies going 400km while it could be one person going 400km and all others 50 :)
16:27:20 <TrueBrain> okay, Rubidium's place it is :p
16:27:31 <fjb> planetmaker: What part of germany are you from?
16:27:45 <planetmaker> I'm living in lower saxony's East
16:27:52 <planetmaker> so... central North
16:28:14 <fjb> Oh, not far from me then. I'm voting for the party at your place. :-)
16:28:22 <planetmaker> it's 4,5 hours by car to Eindhoven.
16:28:32 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: Eindhoven is 2 hours away from me
16:28:35 <TrueBrain> so that doesn't mean a lot :p
16:28:41 <planetmaker> or utrecht for that matter
16:28:48 <TrueBrain> that is why I suggest Rubidium
16:28:51 <TrueBrain> should be a bit closer :p
16:29:15 <Rubidium> Enschede, not Eschede (no ICE's crashing here)
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16:30:21 <planetmaker> Eschede isn't far from here. An hour or so.
16:30:28 <planetmaker> Enschede is further :)
16:30:29 <TrueBrain> but we are not going there :p
16:31:16 <TrueBrain> 2 hour ride to Enschede for me
16:31:28 <planetmaker> Eschede is not worth the tour anyway
16:31:41 <planetmaker> hm.. where the heck in the Netherlands do you live, TrueBrain ?
16:31:52 <planetmaker> oh.... beautiful!
16:31:52 <batti5> the complie failed at the and with a long list of errors
16:31:52 <Fuchs82> come to munich, it's spring festival here ;-)
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16:32:30 <TrueBrain> not going to happen Fuchs82
16:32:33 <planetmaker> Though I've been to Leiden only once... nice place :)
16:32:39 <Rubidium> just to visualise it... "all that sperm in the air"
16:32:43 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: it is :) Student city .. I love it :)
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16:32:55 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, yep, exactly. Nice city centre, too
16:33:09 <TrueBrain> you only really need a bike, or go by foot :p
16:33:11 <planetmaker> and actually not too far from potential employers for me... :D
16:33:25 <TrueBrain> but so Enschede it is? When? :p
16:33:28 <planetmaker> guess how I get to work here?
16:33:29 <Rubidium> at least 'we' got a direct train to Germany every half an our or so ;)
16:34:01 <Rubidium> and I'm failing to write some letters
16:34:11 <planetmaker> Rubidium, there are no direct trains to Amsterdam, but you can manage with changing once. Twice to Leiden.
16:34:19 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: a 3 hour ride for you, a 2 hour ride for me
16:34:22 <TrueBrain> seems fair, not? :p
16:34:26 <planetmaker> Dunno other places...
16:34:34 <Rubidium> planetmaker: from where are there no direct trains to Amsterdam?
16:34:44 <planetmaker> from my town, Braunschweig
16:34:50 <planetmaker> I need to change in Hannover
16:35:48 * planetmaker now goes grabbing some food...
16:36:37 <Rubidium> also only one time changing to get to Enschede
16:37:06 <Rubidium> though changing twice might be beneficiary for travel time
16:37:21 <Rubidium> but then, what's 90 minutes off a 5 hour trip by train
16:37:58 * fjb is living about 45km south of planetmaker.
16:40:05 <TrueBrain> fjb: so you can come too :p
16:42:52 <Maarten-> Enschede... waay too far for me :P
16:43:07 <fjb> As long as I don't have to climb some walls...
16:44:27 <Rubidium> Maarten-: where's that American spirit of flying to the other side of the country just to see your family for a few hours? The other side of the ocean is that much further away
16:47:57 <planetmaker> fjb: that must be göttingen?
16:49:33 <fjb> planetmaker: Bad Harzburg
16:49:45 <planetmaker> oh, that's even closer
16:51:09 <TrueBrain> Belugas: nice 'reality' image in your sig
16:51:33 <fjb> GPS? Lets exchange the maps with some TTD maps. :-)
16:52:11 <planetmaker> el_en: nothing is bad about that.
16:52:37 <planetmaker> it's just that developers need the tools in order to get it running - among those is access to the target platform.
16:53:08 <glx> Belugas: don't forget to ask for the latest MSVC pro too (else you can't generate wince code)
16:54:04 <planetmaker> does anyone of you have that?
16:54:11 <TrueBrain> Belugas is trying to steal donation money! :p
16:54:17 <glx> I only have express versions
16:54:38 <Rubidium> the irony is that I have a legal MSVC pro ;)
16:54:41 <TrueBrain> but why do people want to play OpenTTD on handhelds? I don't get it ... it is unplayable!
16:55:05 <planetmaker> he, Rubidium :) I thought you were running some linux...
16:55:11 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: that's something they will only find out when they actually played it on the handheld and they don't believe your word
16:55:21 <glx> my brother has a MSVC 2005 licence, but I don't know if it's the right one for wince
16:55:32 <Rubidium> though virtualbox is nice technology
16:55:39 <Rubidium> together with korean or chinese windows
16:55:54 <glx> silly localized versions ;)
16:55:55 <Rubidium> english windows is soo standard
16:56:11 <Rubidium> with korean/chinese you can be sure things don't work as they work in your windows
16:57:39 <planetmaker> my font selection doesn't crash anymore, but it doesn't do anything useful either... silly non-standard languages
16:57:57 <Bjarni> how is a language a standard?
16:58:00 <planetmaker> all languages should only use standard ASCII
16:58:04 <glx> planetmaker: it's worse you're on OSX
16:58:10 <Bjarni> Apart from standard languages like C and Java, that is
16:58:20 <Belugas> i bet he would not dare sending it :D
16:58:24 <Belugas> from what i heard, glx, you can use the said tool on express.
16:58:50 <Belugas> i'll ask im as soon as he come back
16:58:54 <glx> even 64bits require a pro version
16:58:56 <Bjarni> <planetmaker> my font selection doesn't crash anymore <-- wait a minute. You crashed on OSX by selecting a font?
16:59:11 <planetmaker> Bjarni: with a patch, yes :)
16:59:33 <glx> well crashing openttd on OSX is easy :)
16:59:36 <planetmaker> standard OpenTTD doesn't. But it doesn't show e.g. egypt glyphs either
16:59:41 <Bjarni> I thought we had an issue
16:59:45 <planetmaker> glx: hm... how so?
16:59:49 <el_en> which standard organization standardizes the standard language?
17:00:16 <planetmaker> hm... I'm missing the test platform you know. No user supplied it to me :D
17:01:03 <Rubidium> planetmaker: no one gave me an OSX machine either, so sorry... can't help
17:01:22 * glx has only a virtual 10.3.9
17:02:02 * planetmaker has a virtual win XP :P
17:02:18 * Belugas plays on his virtual guit
17:02:38 <glx> planetmaker: I have 3 virtual XP :)
17:02:47 <planetmaker> he :) I only need one.
17:03:23 <glx> I also have virtual 95 and 98
17:04:08 <planetmaker> only for openttd reasons or also "just because"?
17:04:15 * Rubidium got a virtual debian for ultra-fat OSX binaries
17:04:56 <glx> we noticed a 10.3.9 problem with them
17:05:06 <glx> (it was indeed a trunk problem)
17:07:20 <TrueBrain> it would be nice if someone would donate an OSX Server ...
17:08:03 <planetmaker> they're even on relative terms bloody expensive as opposed to this macbook
17:08:10 <TrueBrain> one of the targets no active dev can debug for/on in a normal way :(
17:08:23 <planetmaker> yeah, I know... :S
17:09:20 <TrueBrain> besides, we can use the exta CPU power for the CF :p
17:09:27 <planetmaker> though any reasonable recent mac is sufficient for testing - but yeah ^^
17:09:40 <glx> TrueBrain: and build "natively"
17:09:46 <TrueBrain> glx: that too, of course
17:09:55 <TrueBrain> although that only seems required for 64bit
17:10:24 <planetmaker> just for curiosity: could it be located anywhere?
17:10:33 <planetmaker> given reasonable internet connectivity?
17:10:35 <TrueBrain> I can get it colocated, no problem
17:10:53 <glx> well Rubidium managed to build 64bit for OSX
17:11:12 <TrueBrain> the latest what I remember was that there was some kind of problem
17:11:17 <TrueBrain> but okay .. is a few weeks ago :p
17:11:25 <TrueBrain> (we had to patch cctools and ld64 ourself!)
17:11:42 <Rubidium> probably OSX 64 bits missing lots of stuff (like quickytime) in 64 bits
17:11:52 <planetmaker> Bjarni: how well are you fit with ATSUI framework?
17:12:04 <planetmaker> yes, Quicktime isn't 64 bit so far afaik
17:12:18 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: I thought you hit some kind of brickwall in the end :)
17:12:22 <TrueBrain> but okay .. good :)
17:12:36 <TrueBrain> we still need to finish up the cctools and ld64, and publish it in some normal way ..
17:17:00 *** DaleStan is now known as Guest1776
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17:17:11 <TrueBrain> we just need 3500 euro to buy an OSX server ourselves ...
17:17:23 <TrueBrain> omg .. I can buy 5 dedicates of that money ..
17:17:29 <TrueBrain> (with better specs!)
17:18:12 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: how about sending a 'want-to-support' mail to Apple, asking for one, in return for a logo on the website? :p
17:19:22 <TrueBrain> 270 euro for a 1 TB disk ... omg ... :s
17:20:29 <glx> TrueBrain: it's a disk with an apple on it
17:20:50 <Belugas> a beatle record, in other words
17:21:39 <frosch123> TrueBrain: do you really want an Apple logo on the website?
17:21:46 <TrueBrain> frosch123: no, I really don't :p
17:22:02 <TrueBrain> I am pretty happy we only have a 'powered by' thingy, which is very small, on the website
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17:22:57 <planetmaker> it really pays off to buy those machines and upgrade the internals yourself. they charge you a royalty of 100% on the equipment costs for upgrading them...
17:23:46 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: even ordering by Dell, we call them to tell them they can keep the disks and memory
17:23:50 <TrueBrain> and we put that in ourselves
17:24:14 <planetmaker> yeah. but apple is really expensive there.
17:24:33 <TrueBrain> Dell too, so that is not a real suprise :)
17:24:39 <TrueBrain> 1TB disk costs 250 euro
17:24:40 <planetmaker> the only thing which I found reasonable are the upgrade prices from 8 to 16GB ram.
17:25:03 <Belugas> from 8 GIG to 16 GIG???
17:25:14 <Belugas> i'm still at 512 meg :(
17:25:19 <planetmaker> those dims ARE that expensive
17:25:26 <TrueBrain> Belugas: the compile-farm would love to have 16 GB :)
17:25:31 <planetmaker> it's not them, it's the manufacturers.
17:25:49 <TrueBrain> although the 4 GB we have now is also nice ;)
17:25:49 <planetmaker> everything beyond 4GB get's a steep price tag
17:26:22 <TrueBrain> get is a steep price tag!
17:27:14 <glx> should I re-enable my 's script ?
17:28:44 <planetmaker> what devilry is that? :P
17:28:57 <glx> planetmaker: thi's 'script
17:29:11 <TrueBrain> putting an ' before ever 's .. it i's pretty fun :)
17:29:19 <TrueBrain> almo'st unreadable ... but neverthele's's
17:29:36 <glx> I could al'so 'strip 'space's
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17:32:50 <goodger> my brain feels like it's imploding
17:33:45 <goodger> too many rhinoviruses, I think
17:34:25 *** [com]buster has joined #openttd
17:34:49 <Belugas> imploding... maybe... because of fluid escaping?
17:35:07 <Belugas> of simply... grey msubstance deserting the place?
17:36:41 <free_kill> belugas, nice sig on forums :-)
17:36:49 *** free_kill is now known as pavel1269
17:37:27 <pavel1269> i am jsut thinking now, why the hell i am even playing the worst game ever :-P
17:37:34 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: translators * r16125 /trunk/src/lang/ (10 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
17:37:34 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2009-04-23 17:35:41
17:37:34 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: bulgarian - 13 fixed by thetitan (13)
17:37:34 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: czech - 25 fixed, 2 changed by Hadez (27)
17:37:34 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: dutch - 14 fixed by habell (14)
17:37:35 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: estonian - 1 fixed by kristjans (1)
17:37:37 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: finnish - 15 fixed by jpx_ (15)
17:40:20 <planetmaker> well... I cannot lose in a 3x3 tic tac toe :)
17:40:31 <planetmaker> 4x4x4 tic-tac-toe - that's interesting :)
17:40:37 <fjb> But you can also not win...
17:40:51 <Belugas> yeah... by not playing :D
17:44:26 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16126 /trunk/src/lang/ (4 files in 2 dirs): -Fix (r16125): WT2 fracked up big time...
17:46:42 <planetmaker> boh... wt2 is evil, eh?
17:46:54 <TrueBrain> evil: no; hard to handle: yes
17:49:48 <Bjarni> <planetmaker> Bjarni: how well are you fit with ATSUI framework? <-- not at all
17:49:51 <Rubidium> Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 536870912 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 2097152 bytes) <- somehow it didn't do the STR_HEXA -> STR_NON_HEX nicely
17:50:05 <TrueBrain> Rubidium: and you said it did! :p
17:50:16 <TrueBrain> 5 GB of memory ..hmm ..
17:50:27 <TrueBrain> was wondering ... ;)
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17:51:59 <Xaroth> maximum memory allocation of 500 meg?
17:54:02 <planetmaker> Bjarni: a pity... I'm stuck currently at converting openttd strings into apple's atsui format, utf-16 and vice versa
17:54:22 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: translators * r16127 /trunk/src/lang/ (spanish.txt turkish.txt unfinished/serbian.txt):
17:54:22 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2009-04-23 17:54:01
17:54:22 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: serbian - 81 fixed by etran (81)
17:54:22 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: spanish - 24 fixed by eusebio (24)
17:54:22 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: turkish - 14 fixed by Emin (14)
17:54:31 <Bjarni> I wouldn't mind knowing it though
17:54:42 <Bjarni> but that will not help you right now :P
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17:58:52 <planetmaker> trying to use properly apple's automatic font substitution system.
17:59:24 <planetmaker> not much really - I'm kinda probing in the fog... And I think the string conversion isn't done properly. That's why it fails 100% to find substitutes.
17:59:38 <Bjarni> your goal is to replace all the text in the game?
17:59:48 <Bjarni> like window names and text on buttons
17:59:57 <planetmaker> no, my goal is that I get a font which might have the glyphs of the selected language.
18:00:16 <glx> like it's done on other OS
18:00:38 <Bjarni> I coded something like that
18:00:55 <Bjarni> I ended up not committing it though
18:01:02 <planetmaker> but in order to do so, I need to supply a string, query whether it can be printed in a font and depending on that try further ones.
18:01:28 <glx> Bjarni: your version was ot fully automatic
18:01:39 <planetmaker> Bjarni: would be nice, yes :)
18:02:21 <Bjarni> isn't planetmaker trying to automatically find a suitable font?
18:03:24 <planetmaker> don't mind that 80% of the diff I linked is debug code :)
18:03:46 <planetmaker> oh, it works with -p1
18:05:08 <Belugas> #Take the skin and pill it back
18:05:14 <Belugas> #Doesn't it make you feel better?
18:05:15 <TrueBrain> #Fuck you, Fuck you very much
18:05:31 <Belugas> #I want to fuck you like an animal
18:05:38 <TrueBrain> (still thinks it is weird that a song with such lyrics hits the Top 40)
18:05:43 <Belugas> #I want to feel yuo from the INSIDE
18:06:05 <Belugas> which? TrueBrain or mine?
18:06:30 <Belugas> Nine Inch nail - Closer
18:06:52 <Xaroth> sounded somewhat familiar
18:07:57 <Belugas> i'll feel strange when my kid will start to sing it at home :S
18:08:19 <Belugas> and try explain to my wife that it is in fact a spiritual experience...
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18:10:51 <frosch123> [20:08] <Belugas> and try explain to my wife that it is in fact a spiritual experience... <- wait until he sings it at school, and the teacher asks :p
18:11:20 <Belugas> i'd better hide my CDs very well :)
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18:13:38 <frosch123> the 4 year old daughter of a friend of a friend was asked what she wants to drink on her first day at the kindergarden. first she demanded coffee, and as she did not get that, she demanded wine. later the parents were asked about that :p
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18:17:19 <frosch123> hmm, will take me some time to place periods in the right places
18:19:11 * frosch123 prefers "because i know alot of you code for OTTD, I don't know much about it as well"
18:20:58 <planetmaker> hehe, Belugas - that doesn't bode well...
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18:23:45 <Belugas> [14:21] * frosch123 prefers "because i know alot of you code for OTTD, I don't know much about it as well" <--- lovely :D
18:24:53 <dihedral> i just read that :-D
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18:42:52 <TrueBrain> pff .. just finished a routine in WT3 which brings sanity to the command/plural/gender structure in case that goes badly wrong ... nasty shit :)
18:43:04 <TrueBrain> also takes for ever to run the routine, but .. at least it does recover from very weird situations :)
18:43:12 <TrueBrain> (which might happen if a developer fucks up :p)
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18:51:27 <Belugas> not me, don't look at me like that!
18:53:21 <Belugas> funny... i've just found out that the chip card reader i'm working on is emetting a signal.
18:53:37 <Belugas> and now i understand the contact less stuff on these cards
18:53:53 <Belugas> i was wondering what the hell was that pulsationi was earing
18:54:15 <Belugas> the reader is on top of my left speaker, where my headphones are attached :)
18:54:46 <petern> ninjam's working for me
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19:03:05 <dihedral> number of towns: custom?
19:03:12 <dihedral> where is the custom value configured then?
19:04:00 <dihedral> no - i have a script that randomizes some config settings for me
19:04:07 <dihedral> and it set number_towns = 4 :-P
19:07:11 <Yexo> dihedral: game_creation.custom_town_number
19:07:59 * Belugas is now VERY impatient to run home...
19:13:55 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16128 /trunk/src/ (ini.cpp settings.cpp): -Change: allow loading (and storing) NULL values for STRQ in openttd.cfg.
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20:29:38 <Belugas> yeah!!! the sun is coming out finally :D
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20:59:15 <Patrick> how long is a recession supposed to last for, and when do you know it's over?
20:59:35 <Patrick> I disabled fluctuating economy during a recession and my production's never gone back up in a year and a half
20:59:38 <Nite_Owl> it is over when you make money
21:00:12 <Patrick> I'm stupidly wealthy and getting more so
21:01:28 <Nite_Owl> then pay your fair share of taxes
21:05:07 <PierreW> hm, i just updated to latest nightly.. since then my buddy can't connect anymore to my multiplayer-game with a fairly large map... are there any reasons known?
21:05:13 <Patrick> I think I've permanently bollocksed it up
21:05:21 <PierreW> (to small maps he still can connect)
21:05:32 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16129 /trunk/src/ (59 files in 6 dirs): -Feature-ish: configurable digit group separator per language with user override.
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21:05:47 <Rubidium> probably because his computer is too slow or so
21:06:06 <Nite_Owl> Ahhhh - in the game recession - I never worry about those
21:06:20 <Belugas> time to go home now! Finally!!!
21:06:41 <Belugas> petern, hang on tigh to your keyboard :D
21:06:41 <Patrick> yes, but I disabled fluctuating economy
21:06:52 <Patrick> it's the kind of bug I can imagine happening
21:07:49 * TrueBrain waves bye to Belugas
21:08:39 <Patrick> I don't have a save I can go back to
21:08:48 <Patrick> and production permanently stays low even when I cheat it back up
21:08:55 <Patrick> I think this is really screwed up!
21:12:55 <Patrick> who actually coded the recession code?
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21:16:36 <Nite_Owl> try to not change grfs or settings in the middle of a game
21:16:53 <Patrick> I didn't change a grf :P
21:17:06 <Patrick> fluctuating/steady economy was a changable thing normally
21:17:21 <Patrick> I've unwound way back and I'm building my network again
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21:39:01 <TrueBrain> forgot to pipe 2> to log ... now I don't know why my script crashed after running for 2 hours :(
21:43:08 <TrueBrain> I rerun the same revisions, and it turns out there was no language-change on those revisions ... lol ..
21:43:19 <TrueBrain> svnserve which kicked me out ... nasty :p
21:49:48 <fjb> I'm having fun partitioning virtual hosts.
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21:50:01 <TrueBrain> you call that fun? :)
21:50:09 <TrueBrain> I am trying to setup a spamfilter gateway which works how I want
21:51:14 <fjb> That will be my next task...
21:51:31 <TrueBrain> well, there are very nice gateways which run before one mailserver
21:51:39 <fjb> My old server disk is constantly loosing blocks.
21:51:42 <TrueBrain> I need one which can relay every domain to an other place ....
21:52:18 <fjb> I'm about it. That's why I'm partitioning an new drive.
21:52:49 <fjb> How about filtering inside the mailserver?
21:53:02 <TrueBrain> my experience so far is that it sucks ass :p
21:53:14 <TrueBrain> not all MTAs allow what you need to do some really powerful filtering :)
21:54:48 <fjb> I'm using postfix. You can use any filter which speaks smtp with it.
21:55:02 <petern> or milter, these days, if you're brave enough
21:55:19 <TrueBrain> check out assp .. too many configurable options, but does all the filtering you can think of :p
21:55:42 <fjb> Yes, but my milter experiences are not that great. Ok, I used milter only with sendmail yet.
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21:56:37 <fjb> Assp? I will have a look at it.
21:56:42 <TrueBrain> I don't have any preference for any MTA .. using exim4 on most servers, mostly because debian has a nice config for it ...
21:56:52 <TrueBrain> ASSP really has too many confiruable options ...
21:56:52 <petern> my system at work consists of, er, 14 postfix instances, heh
21:57:03 <fjb> Postfix puts a much lower load on the machine than sendmail does.
21:57:56 <fjb> A nice config is a good reason. I still prefer postfix. :-)
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22:00:35 <fjb> Oh, ASSP does content checks when the foreign mta is still connected? That is nonoptimal for my server.
22:00:48 <TrueBrain> you can configure almost anything
22:01:01 <TrueBrain> but yes, it keeps the external MTA on as long as possible, to allow it to send back: FUCK YOU SPAMMER :p
22:01:22 <Rubidium> tar pits for the win?
22:01:49 <fjb> Almost every mta will timeout if I run a perl script while it is connected.
22:01:55 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx_
22:05:16 <fjb> My server ist still an old PIII 800MHz. :-(
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22:07:03 <petern> i'm afraid i need to sleep
22:07:13 <petern> so no fun with Belugas :(
22:07:22 <TrueBrain> hmm .. sleep .. good idea
22:07:47 <Nite_Owl> later petern & TrueBrain
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22:42:48 <Patrick> I've actually found a bug in autosignals
22:43:19 <SmatZ> Patrick: what revision are you using?
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22:43:49 <Patrick> when it lays them past an angle, the gap is calculated wrong
22:44:21 <SmatZ> are you sure? maybe depends what you call "wrong" :)
22:45:15 <SmatZ> on horiz / vertical track, the gap looks longer
22:45:29 <Yexo> it not only looks longer, it is a bit longer iirc
22:45:33 <Patrick> No, I tracked down a traffic jam to one of these, and I've measured it
22:45:43 <Patrick> you know you can put signals on both sides of a diagonal track?
22:45:46 <Yexo> but there is no way around that, since the track length is different per tile
22:45:56 <Patrick> when it predict-lays round a corner, it goes 2, 2, 2, 2.5, 2, 2, 2
22:46:11 <Patrick> puts them on the "wrong" set of diagonal tiles and leaves a slightly longer gap
22:46:31 <SmatZ> yeah well, I usually manualy place signals with higher density on horiz/vert tracks
22:46:50 <SmatZ> the gap is 1.5 tiles on horiz/vert track
22:46:59 <SmatZ> when signals are placed every 2 tiles
22:47:08 <SmatZ> or 2.5 when placed every 3 tiles
22:47:19 <fonsinchen> TrueBrain, Ammler told me he'd like the compile farm to compile cargo dist. Could you make it do so?
22:47:33 <Patrick> I'm fairly sure it wasn't designed to leave a solitary gap slightly longer than normal
22:47:48 <Patrick> which as anyone knows completely cocks up train distancing and can cause a self-perpetuating traffic jam
23:04:13 <Patrick> on closer inspection, it still slows down with more liberal signals applied
23:04:54 <SmatZ> now you will find out trains are moving slower on horiz/vert tracks
23:07:27 <Patrick> I have to double the signal density to avoid screwups
23:07:38 <Patrick> this actually explains why I could never push my density above a certain point
23:16:02 <Belugas> too bad petern, i was able (after secind shot) to make it all work
23:16:08 <Belugas> got to send you coffee ;)
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23:30:07 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16130 /trunk/src/core/overflowsafe_type.hpp: -Fix [FS#2855]: the overflowsafe type didn't like dividing by int64 larger than MAX_INT32 causing division by negative numbers and small anomolies when drawing graphs.
23:31:06 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16131 /trunk/src/table/settings.h: -Fix (r16129): some compile warnings on some compilers
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23:47:26 <CIA-9> OpenTTD: rubidium * r16132 /trunk/src/settings.cpp: -Fix (r7232/r16129): crash when saving games; r7232 is the cause of the problem, r16129 just causes it to be triggered.
23:55:52 <SHADOW-XIII> lol, long way, nearly 10k builds
23:57:47 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: Commit by frosch :: r16006 trunk/src/core/random_func.hpp (2009-04-09 22:37:59 UTC)
23:57:49 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: -Fix (r0): Chance16() did not work for b = 1. Also transform the formula to not use divisions.
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